# Help I may have accidentally used GE silicone 1 with 7 year mold protection



## TurquoiseJungle (Mar 16, 2021)

Help I may have accidentally used GE silicone 1 with 7 year mold protection do I have to tear it down because I was going to put frogs in there 😬 is there any ways to fix it without tearing it down or. . PLEASE HELP


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

I'm not sure how you "may have accidentally used ge silicone ii" .

Either you used it, or you didn't.

Either way, typically people avoid using ge silicone ii for terrarium building. I always use aquarium silicone to avoid this potential issue.

Personally, I would start over and tear it out.


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## bulbophyllum (Feb 6, 2012)

Well, it might help if the wrote how you used it. Did you smear it all over the background? Did you silicone a branch to the glass. Did you use a lot? Did you use a little?


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Someone's going to post here about how GE Silicone 1 is safe, and GE Silicone 2 is not. Here's a not-too-dated discussion, with manufacturer input and some info on additives that I hadn't seen mentioned elsewhere, that might help:









GE silicone 1 or 2? Info from GE


For everyones info... I contacted GE about their silicones because so many argue over the safety of GE1 and GE2. Tom Kneisley (Information Center Specialist from ge's website) replied to my email stating ALL of their silicones contain mold/mildew inhibitors. So for me, from now on, I'll...




www.dendroboard.com


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## TurquoiseJungle (Mar 16, 2021)

bulbophyllum said:


> Well, it might help if the wrote how you used it. Did you smear it all over the background? Did you silicone a branch to the glass. Did you use a lot? Did you use a little?


I used in the background and smeared it all over 😬 I used a good amount on the background and put coco fiber on top


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## TurquoiseJungle (Mar 16, 2021)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Someone's going to post here about how GE Silicone 1 is safe, and GE Silicone 2 is not. Here's a not-too-dated discussion, with manufacturer input and some info on additives that I hadn't seen mentioned elsewhere, that might help:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I used silicone GE silicone S1 and it has 7 year mold protection Garuntee


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## bulbophyllum (Feb 6, 2012)

TurquoiseJungle said:


> I used in the background and smeared it all over 😬 I used a good amount on the background and put coco fiber on top


I would tear it out. 

I used GE II once thinking it was one of the safe ones. I didn't realize my mistake until long after the frogs were in there. They were fine and 10 years later are still fine. But, I would never do it again. I only use aquarium silicon. It's not like the old days when you had to chase stuff like that down. Amazon brings it to the house.


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## NateDawg (Oct 16, 2020)

I'm not sure if you (the OP) ment to write GE silicone *II *But the original post states that you used GE silicone I. Silicone I has always said, for as long as I can remember, that it is 7 years mold free. GE silicone I doesn't have anti-mold chemicals added to it, if it did, usually, from the experiance that I've had, they will state that the silicone will have a 10 plus year mold free guarantee


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## NateDawg (Oct 16, 2020)

Is this the bottle that you used? If you did, I've built large saltwater aquariums with this stuff and have never had any adverse effects from the chemistry of the silicone. Just make sure to allow it to fully cure.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

NateDawg said:


> GE silicone I doesn't have anti-mold chemicals added to it,


Read the thread I linked.


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## TurquoiseJungle (Mar 16, 2021)

NateDawg said:


> Is this the bottle that you used? If you did, I've built large saltwater aquariums with this stuff and have never had any adverse effects from the chemistry of the silicone. Just make sure to allow it to fully cure.
> View attachment 299865


yes that is the bottle I used


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## NateDawg (Oct 16, 2020)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Read the thread I linked.


Hmm interesting, I wonder why they dont include the anti-mold chemical in there msds.


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## TurquoiseJungle (Mar 16, 2021)

NateDawg said:


> Hmm interesting, I wonder why they dont include the anti-mold chemical in there msds.


Not really sure why but what should I do if I used that silicone?


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## NateDawg (Oct 16, 2020)

TurquoiseJungle said:


> yes that is the bottle I used


From the article that Socratic Monologue posted, it seems that all of GE's silicones have anti-mold chemicals. To what the actual chemicals are and whether or not they are harmful to animal life, I cant say. I can say that I've used it for many projects from aquariums to terrariums and haven't had any I'll effects. I always get ICP tests done on the water after I set up a new tank as well and have never had anything dangerous compounds show up.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

NateDawg said:


> Hmm interesting, I wonder why they dont include the anti-mold chemical in there msds.


From the linked thread:



Ed said:


> The MSDS isn't always going to provide that kind of information as they are able to not list proprietary ingredients on the MSDS. See for example The MSDS HyperGlossary: Trade Secret, if the chemical does not have exposure restrictions or toxicity known then they might be able to simply leave it off.
> 
> some comments
> 
> Ed


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## bulbophyllum (Feb 6, 2012)

TurquoiseJungle said:


> Not really sure why but what should I do if I used that silicone?


Before you get too worried wasn't GE I the silicone most people used in frog tanks before we knew better?


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

I've used the exact silicone for every single job I have ever done, in both marine, freshwater and frog applications.

You are fine.


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## bulbophyllum (Feb 6, 2012)

Chris S said:


> You are fine.


I thought so as well. But, I could not remember what GE product was safe. There has been a lot of talk about it over the years. So, I just use aquarium silicone and forget about it. 

Just because it says mold free for 7 years does not guarantee that it has added mold inhibitors. It may very well have them. Also it may be advertising and silicone is naturally mold resistsnt for that amount of time.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

bulbophyllum said:


> I thought so as well. But, I could not remember what GE product was safe. There has been a lot of talk about it over the years. So, I just use aquarium silicone and forget about it.
> 
> Just because it says mold free for 7 years does not guarantee that it has added mold inhibitors. It may very well have them. Also it may be advertising and silicone is naturally mold resistsnt for that amount of time.


It certainly can't hurt using the aquarium ones, but I bet if you ask what is in those ones too, you will find they have the exact same things...it is the level of toxicity that makes it "safe" or not.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Chris S said:


> It certainly can't hurt using the aquarium ones, but I bet if you ask what is in those ones too, you will find they have the exact same things...it is the level of toxicity that makes it "safe" or not.


The silicone from Pentair (aquarium filtration parts manufacturer), for example,

"_Contains no mildew/mold inhibitors "_

From: https://pentairaes.com/silicone-aquarium-sealant.html

TL,DR: GE Silicone 1 and GE Silicone 2 do in fact both contain mold inhibitors, per the manufacturer's claim. At least one brand of "Aquarium Safe" silicone does not contain mold inhibitors, per the manufacturer's claim.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

Socratic Monologue said:


> The silicone from Pentair (aquarium filtration parts manufacturer), for example,
> 
> "_Contains no mildew/mold inhibitors "_
> 
> ...


That is their general answer to the question though - it is also the reason they always say it is not for aquarium use. Phone them up and ask, they will say the same thing. They just don't care, and haven't bothered to do the research to feel safe making the claims, and I don't blame them. The aquarium industry is probably .0005% of their sales, so why take on any liability there?

Where do you think some of these aquarium silicones are manufactured? Same production plants, in a lot of cases - different label. In this scenario, Pentair is just relabeling Star Brite Marine purpose silicones under their own brand. Star Brite makes no reference to their silicones being aquarium, or amphibian, safe anywhere on their site or in their MSDS sheets.

If GE can leave out some toxic mold inhibitor on their MSDS, then why can't Pentair? What is the requirement for saying "aquarium safe"? Why would you not advertise that your product has mold inhibitors if it does? They are expensive to add, and carry a claim for a longer lasting mold free silicone. The Pentair claim is nowhere on their MSDS or on the Star Brite site - I would consider it just as safe as GE I from the information available to us.

For reference, here is GE 1 / Star Brite listed ingredients:

Methyltriacetoxysilane
Ethyltriacetoxysilane (Octamethylcyclotetrasiloxane in GE I)

Ed is right though - if there is an ingredient that is proprietary and is not deemed toxic, it does not need to be listed. The US MSDS sheets are usually more informative, as they typically have special sections for provisions of sharing ingredients for Califorinia, Rhode Island and New Jersey for example.

Just my two cents...hard to know what is truly safe I guess. The reality is probably that the all carry some risk, but I think most of that risk is generally gassed off during the curing process.

From my experience, GE1 is readily available and has never caused any apparent issues in hundreds of builds I have done. I'm comfortable using it and recommending it.


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## bulbophyllum (Feb 6, 2012)

The big silicone debate. Funny thing is I have used the complete wrong one with all the mold inhibitors smeared all over the back ground and realized what I did long after frogs were in the tank. They are still fine 10 years later. 

But, I am not suggesting there were not affects I don't realize or anyone else use any old kind of silicon. But, we might be splitting hairs on this one.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

The mold inhibition aspect has always been confusing to me, so I can't really comment either way. What is (was? this stuff changes all the time, seemingly) the case is that at one point there was a difference between the catalyst used in the curing process between Silicone I and Silicone II, the latter using an organotin compound that is a known enzyme inhibitor. That's why I have always been down on Silicone II. Both might have ingredients used as mold inhibitors that are not listed on the MSDS, at which point I can't see how we can can even make a valid decision. I have used aquarium silicone for years and will continue to do so. I used to think that Silicone I was a valid option, but GE, and maybe other manufacturers, seem to be deliberately omitting information about what is in their silicone so I no longer think it's worth rolling the dice. Also, it sometimes takes multiple generations before problems caused by some of these chemicals will manifest so it doesn't matter much what visible problems people have or have not seen in their frogs. Problems may just not have shown themselves yet. So, I have written in the past that Silicone I is ok, but I am not sure about that anymore and I don't think it's worth the risk. I will just continue to plan to order aquarium safe silicone before I start any of my builds.

Mark


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

I currently only use silicone for attaching treefern panel. I've been happy with black Aquascape Pro silicone. Is it "expensive" at around $20 - $22.00 CAD for a 10.1 oz tube ... maybe ...? I haven't price-checked it against anything else, but I've been happy with it. Easy to work with, cures without too much of an odour and I don't wonder too much about it given it's made for the trade.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

Fahad said:


> I currently only use silicone for attaching treefern panel. I've been happy with black Aquascape Pro silicone. Is it "expensive" at around $20 - $22.00 CAD for a 10.1 oz tube ... maybe ...? I haven't price-checked it against anything else, but I've been happy with it. Easy to work with, cures without too much of an odour and I don't wonder too much about it given it's made for the trade.


Very complete MSDS for yours...including this statement:

"Ecotoxicity - Octamethylcyclotetrasiloxane: May cause long lasting harmful effects to aquatic life. "

and these (which I think these are very high levels needed to be honest):

"Fish LC50 Mummichog (Fundulus Heteroclitus) > 1000 mg/l, 96 hours " - ie. they tested it against fish, and at greater than 1000mg/l it caused 50% of them to die within 96 hours (Titanium Oxide)

"Fish LC50 Bluegill (Leponis Macrochirus) 75mg/l, 96 hours" - ie. they tested it against fish, and at 75mg/l it caused 50% of them to die within 96 hours (Acetic Acid)

Confusing as to what is safe or not, isn't it?


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

Chris S said:


> [...]
> Confusing as to what is safe or not, isn't it?


I'm used to the confusion at this point. We like cut and dry answers when so many of the scenarios are "It depends..."


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

Fahad said:


> I'm used to the confusion at this point. We like cut and dry answers when so many of the scenarios are "It depends..."


And to be clear, I would safely recommend yours to anyone as well!


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