# Fat or Pregnant?



## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

I was a tad worried i just got some R. Variabilis Inibico and one has expanded in about four days.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

I would suggest getting some amphibian ringer's solution, a quarantine tank, several fecals run and a trip to the vet... 
See this thread (work backwards from the end of the thread) http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/breeding-eggs-tadpoles/74657-lorenzo-clutch-watch-44.html 

Ed


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## shrum (Dec 1, 2008)

I agree with Ed that is a bloated frog and needs help quick.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Ed said:


> I would suggest getting some amphibian ringer's solution, a quarantine tank, several fecals run and a trip to the vet...
> See this thread (work backwards from the end of the thread) http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/breeding-eggs-tadpoles/74657-lorenzo-clutch-watch-44.html
> 
> Ed


Or start on post 387. All is not lost!


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## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

Maleko said:


> I was a tad worried i just got some R. Variabilis Inibico and one has expanded in about four days.


Only a tad worried?!? Get some ARS an a vet ASAP!

D


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

I was hoping she would have just been loaded with eggs  ...

Where can I get the ARS and I will start searching for a tropical vet.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

You can get it here. Ringer Solution, Amphibian, Laboratory Grade, 1 L - Chemicals P - T - Chemistry - Chemistry & Physics - Carolina Biological Supply Company

You may need to have it shipped to a business address. Seems like someone said they were unable to have it shipped to their home. Not sure. It's a good idea to keep some on hand.


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

Seemed to let me have it shipped to my home I just purchased some I put a shallow dish of water in the tank so she can try and soak for now.


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

On another note her behavior is not any different she is still climbing around the tank and her neck is not as swollen as the picture makes it. It is more around the belly area.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

When it arrives, I'd put her in a small container, like a deli cup w/lid or condiment cup, to force her to soak.

Ed, you got some input on this? Where and for how long?


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## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

My guess is a gastrointestinal problem, gas or fluid build up in the gut, hope he/she gets better soon! 

D


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

Dendroguy said:


> My guess is a gastrointestinal problem, gas or fluid build up in the gut, hope he/she gets better soon!
> 
> D


I hope it clears up on its own! But to be on the safe side I am still going to look into the vet and getting this Ringer Solution!


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## easternversant (Sep 4, 2012)

Sorry you are having trouble with your frogs so soon after getting your first!


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

easternversant said:


> Sorry you are having trouble with your frogs so soon after getting your first!



It sucks but I am hopefull..
I will see how she is doing tomorrow and then put her in a seperate tank if not any better.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

I took a bloated dart frog to the vet last week. Read these posts for her opinion on what causes bloating in a frog:

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/773039-post398.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/773212-post405.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/773275-post408.html


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

frogface said:


> I took a bloated dart frog to the vet last week. Read these posts for her opinion on what causes bloating in a frog:
> 
> http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/773039-post398.html
> 
> ...


Thanks! If it was a parasite from misting why would the other frogs not be affected? And was she active when she was bloated? Mine is crawling around on the glass rightnow.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

YEs she was pretty active until she started doing the weird hiccup thing. Her bloated little self even laid a clutch in this condition. 

It's not necessarily 'parasites', per se. From what I understand, stress can impair the immune system, which allows the bacteria to go unchecked. The same is true for parasites that they may naturally have. It seems the standard course of treatment is ARS soaks with baytril and antiparasitic. 

Here is a link for before and after videos. She's getting a lot better with treatment: 

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/774293-post432.html


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Maleko said:


> Thanks! If it was a parasite from misting why would the other frogs not be affected? And was she active when she was bloated? Mine is crawling around on the glass rightnow.


Point of clarification, if you reread the thread Kris linked, no where did she think that it was due to a parasite from the misting system. She pondered the chance that it was due to inhalation of bacteria suspending in the mist water. 

I would suggest that pneumonia from inhaling bacteria is probably unlikely. The misting system doesn't atomize the water fine enough to be an effective transport for the frogs (particularly since they may not take a breath deep enough to allow for inhalation frequently since most of resting oxygen demand can be met through pulsing of the throat to move air around inside the mouth (see for example Frog Respiration).

In addition, the majority of the bacterial pathogens are virtually always present in not only the enclosures but thier bodies (see for example (not free access) Aeromonas hydrophila in wild-caught frogs and tadpoles (Rana pipiens) in Minnesota. - Abstract - UK PubMed Central ))

I should also note, it is not going to be caused by retained gas in the digestive tract... 

Some comments 

Ed


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

So from what I am understanding there is no known cause for why a frog would expand so large in a couple of days?


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Maleko said:


> So from what I am understanding there is no known cause for why a frog would expand so large in a couple of days?


One thought is that it may be due to stress. Such as stress from shipping, stress from tank mates, some unknown stress from inside the tank. The stress impairs the immune system. The impaired immune system allows the naturally occurring bacteria and parasites to run unchecked, causing the bloating.

Other possibilities are organ failure or cancer.

ETA: I have no real knowledge about dart health. I'm just regurgitating what the exotic animal vet said to me.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Maleko said:


> So from what I am understanding there is no known cause for why a frog would expand so large in a couple of days?


No. There are a number of potential reasons a frog can suddenly begin to retain fluid (which is called ascites). In no particular order, they are 

1) liver failure or damage (examples of potential causes (not all inclusive), bacterial, viral or fungal infection, cancer, parasites, overdose of vitamin D3) 
2) kidney failure or damage (some examples of possible potential causes (not all inclusive) infection, kidney failure (cancer, viral, bacterial infection, genetics, toxins, over supplementation with some vitamins..)
3) problems with the lymphatic system (again not all inclusive), parasites, cancer, bacterial, viral, fungal infection, improper ion imbalance
and the list goes on and on... 

The only ones that can be readily treated are parasitic, bacterial, or fungal... (and in some cases like Mycobacterium ssp infections, it is considered untreatable and depopulation, euthenasia and sterilization are recommended).... the other causes are untreatable. 

Some comments

Ed


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

Alright well for the time being I put her in a temporary tank with some leaves and a small water dish to soak in and some moss.


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

Found a vet that will see Dart Frogs in my area but they are not open Wed so hopefully I can get a app tomorrow.

Sent from my BlackBerry 8520 using Tapatalk


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## Maleko (Sep 14, 2012)

just a update I took the bloated frog to a exotic vet. They gave me saline solution and several drop medicines and nothing they gave me is working. I started ARS soaks and that does not seem to be helping either she just keeps getting bigger.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Oh no. That doesn't sound good


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