# ABG PH Correction?



## pl259 (Feb 27, 2006)

So I recently changed from a home brewed substrate to ABG, minus the charcoal. The mix, with all of it's peat is very acidic.

What are you ABG users doing, if anything, to correct the PH?

Thanks.


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## bobberly1 (Jul 16, 2008)

I don't do anything. How much peat did you use? The mix I have, which I think is the standard ratio, doesn't have much peat. Because of that, it isn't out of the ideal pH range. You could always substitute coco coir in the future.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

There are pH variations in batches of peat and sphagnum but outside of that I have yet to see a definite publication showing negative problems with most anurans. Anurans unlike a large number of caudates don't seem to have the same issues when kept on acidic substrates. 

Ed


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## Homer (Feb 15, 2004)

My educated guess is that the forest floor from where most these frogs come from is acidic due to the breakdown of organic matter. Generally, leaf mold (the broken down remains of leaves) is acidic, and my understanding is that many of these frogs live in the leaf litter on the forest floor. Further, I would expect that an acidic substrate is preferable to discourage fungus and bacteria proliferation.


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## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

I've never had a problem with it.


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## Scott (Feb 17, 2004)

I've used ABG now for 10 years - no problems. As mentioned peat is roughly 1 part in 7 or 8 (by volume). Of course there are 2 parts of milled sphagnum moss as well.

s


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

Some hobbyists have used pure peat as a substrate as well with no issues. What's your pH at?


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## pl259 (Feb 27, 2006)

Thanks everyone for the replies.

I don't know the exact PH. The test strips I use only test to a narrow range, and I'm maxed out on the acidic side. I may have to get a wider test kit.

My ABG ratios are more like 2 parts peat, 1 part milled spaq, 1 part fir bark. So I'm heavy on the peat side. I may have to change this.

All the frogs are doing fine. The issues I'm trying to work out are with some plants and tadpoles. Certain plants, and I don't know their names, are not doing as well with this mix. Unfortunately that's one of the reasons I changed to this flavor of ABG.

As some of you know, all of my tadpoles are raised in tank. I pull froglets. The only tank with this mix of ABG, where the frogs are actively transporting tads to the pond, all of the deposited tads have disappeared. I'm assuming they died due to the acidic PH. The tank is fairly new but the pond's water level is mostly established from misting runoff. The tads are Phyllobates Bicolor. 

This setup and water are the same as in my P. Vittatus tank. I have way too many good tads from them and actually need to slow them down. One big difference is the substrate. The substrate in the Vittatus tank is jungle mix(cypress) and coco chunks.

Anyone else raising Phyllobates tads in a tank with a heavy peat substrate?


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

Can't comment on the Phyllobates sp. but I'm raising some Epipedobates sp. in "worse" conditions. I have two tanks with them in in-tank ponds where their is over half of the substrate mix as peat and the pond is in direct contact with it. The last batch of tads from both enclosures got 100% morph rates with no sls issues. I'm not sure of the water pH, but it is very brown in color from the peat.


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## pl259 (Feb 27, 2006)

Well I have good news and....really good news.

Turns out the pH strips I was using were several years out of date. I retested the water with new ones and the pH was a little on the acidic side, but fine.

While testing the water I thought I saw my male imi in the corner of the tank, but he looked a little different. A closer look revealed it was a bicolor froglet! And after some more hunting I found two more for a total of three. I saw them go in the water as tadpoles and didn't see them again until they were froglets hopping around...and I checked twice a day. Never saw them feed. Never saw them surface. It looks like there is a small hole in the pond where they can get into the "false bottom".

Anyway here are a couple pics...



















It been a long time coming with several unfortunate events along the way. Here's hoping they keep it up!!!


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## rollei (Jun 4, 2009)

Haha, that is excellent news. The froglets look well. By the way, what plant is that with the froglets?


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

First pic looks like possibly Rhaphidophora hayi and second looks like either Rhaphidophora cryptantha or a juvenile Monstera dubia (I'm not sure how to tell them apart).


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## pl259 (Feb 27, 2006)

Sorry, don't know the names. Sports_doc gave them to me. One is a type of shingle plant, which changes shape after it latches on to something to climb.


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