# My New Histrionicus



## Mworks

Hi,

picked these three stunners up yesterday and I'm totally blown away with them! I'm hoping for a male and two females (fingers crossed!!) Def got a male - he was quacking away within ten mins of being put in the viv. 
They are genuine 09 CB's from a European breeder - I waited 11 months for these so I'm over the moon with how good they are.
I agree with a few others who keep them that it's nearly impossible to 'catch' them on camera if you know what I mean.
Anyway here's a couple of quick shots - I'll get some more during the week when I have more time.

Enjoy!



















Regards
Marcus


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## hexentanz

These are truly stunning, makes me want them more and more each time I see them.


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## ChrisK

Cool you finally got them, they look just like mine! How old are they?


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## Mworks

Hi Chris,
they're about 8 months. 
Thanks for sharing info and advice on yours!

Regards
Marcus


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## BBoyette

hexentanz said:


> These are truly stunning, makes me want them more and more each time I see them.


Ain't that the truth! 
They look great Marcus, nice job on snapping those pics.


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## frogandtoad

Those are absolute beauties!  Thanks for posting!


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## R1ch13

Contrary to the norm, I have never really been to keen on histos, but these are stunning mate.

This is one Histo morph I wouldn't mind keeping 

Richie


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## Tony

Congrats, they're beautiful.


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## Arizona Tropicals

Very Very nice! They are beautiful!


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## spottedcircus

Those are stunning!! I'm assuming those are an expensive frog though.. I hardly ever see histos


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## kingnicky101

spottedcircus said:


> Those are stunning!! I'm assuming those are an expensive frog though.. I hardly ever see histos


Across the ocean they earent nearly as expensive as over here. Sweet frogs by the way, wish they could be cheaper and more common where I live.


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## Mworks

kingnicky101 said:


> Across the ocean they earent nearly as expensive as over here. Sweet frogs by the way, wish they could be cheaper and more common where I live.


Over the ocean they are just as expensive as over your way! Even more so for captive bred frogs.

But it isn't the rarity or the exclusivity that make histrionicus so special to me - it's a number of things, their personalities, apparent intelligence (anyone who keeps them will understand what I mean!) the way they walk - something like spiderman - the list goes on and on!

Thanks for all the comments - like I say more photos to follow during the week - I've not managed to get a decent shot of the male yet and he has some killer markings!

Regards
Marcus


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## Roadrunner

How can histos be more over there when the ones we get are from over there? It seems the price would go up in transit.



Mworks said:


> Over the ocean they are just as expensive as over your way! Even more so for captive bred frogs.
> 
> But it isn't the rarity or the exclusivity that make histrionicus so special to me - it's a number of things, their personalities, apparent intelligence (anyone who keeps them will understand what I mean!) the way they walk - something like spiderman - the list goes on and on!
> 
> Thanks for all the comments - like I say more photos to follow during the week - I've not managed to get a decent shot of the male yet and he has some killer markings!
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


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## Julio

beautiful frogs!!


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## Mworks

frogfarm said:


> How can histos be more over there when the ones we get are from over there? It seems the price would go up in transit.


I know the trio of Red heads I bought were more expensive than some WC's that were recently imported into the USA. Depends on what species and where the frogs are sourced - usually wc are not as expensive as cb - as you would expect as they are not the fastest of breeders or the most productive hence premium prices for cb juv's.
The frogs originated from Germany so there is a carriage cost probably similar as shipping to the USA. 

Regards
Marcus


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## hukilausurfer

Wow stunning frogs! So I was wondering, approximately how big are histos compared to other frogs? Are they like pumilio big or more like leucs?


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## kingnicky101

Mworks said:


> I know the trio of Red heads I bought were more expensive than some WC's that were recently imported into the USA. Depends on what species and where the frogs are sourced - usually wc are not as expensive as cb - as you would expect as they are not the fastest of breeders or the most productive hence premium prices for cb juv's.
> The frogs originated from Germany so there is a carriage cost probably similar as shipping to the USA.
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


Hasn't there not been an import of WC histos within the last decade? I didn't even know we get imports of CB's from Europe, obviously not that many at all.


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## james67

i dont think there have been any "imports" to the US in a LONG time. any "imports" have come in through EU or are definitely illegal. (although the legality of WC EU histos could be questioned as well since the countries of origin prohibit their capture and export)

james


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## kingnicky101

Well said, I agree with you 100% on that. Definately something illegal if there have been any histo imports to the U.S. I honestly doubt there's any imports from Europe or else they would be just a bit less expensive and readily available here.


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## highfyre

http://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww277/TheGworks/Histrionicus/DSCF2458.jpg


WOW!!!! How awesome is that!


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## eos

Wow.. they look amazing! They look real good. More pics!!


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## Mworks

james67 said:


> i dont think there have been any "imports" to the US in a LONG time. any "imports" have come in through EU or are definitely illegal. (although the legality of WC EU histos could be questioned as well since the countries of origin prohibit their capture and export)
> 
> james


Just a couple of months ago there were a number of red heads imported from a German dealer - Ben's Jungle - into the USA. Some of the frogs arrived DOA and others loaded with parasites. I know for a fact that a couple of members on Dendroboard recieved some.

But this thread wasn't about the legal status of Histrionicus in the USA it was to show my genuine CB redheads - there is a whole can of worms to open if we are to discuss 'legal' frogs! But not in this thread.

Regards
Marcus


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## ChrisK

Yeah really back on track - so are they siblings or are they from a combo of different pairs?


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## Mworks

Hi Chris,

The breeder has several adult pairs which these are a mixture from.
Pity the pond is between us or we could swap some bloodlines. 

I'm on the look out for a pair of Lita's - getting them may take a while! 
I stripped a viv and have started again with Lita's in mind - I'll post some photos when I get it something like.

Any signs of breeding with yours yet?

Regards
Marcus


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## ChrisK

I didn't pair the litas up yet but hopefully soon, one of the males has been squawking his brains out lately probably from the weather change.

Yeah if noone there or here winds up breeding theirs and we need to trade redhead froglets it really shouldn't be as hard as it seems, just a matter of getting the people with the permits to ship them to each other - maybe we should work on starting that type of network of faster and easier shipping between the EU and US? (maybe a new thread?)


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## Mworks

That's an option well worth thinking about Chris! There are enough people here and over your way with the right papres to make it 'do-able'!

Regards
Marcus


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## Mworks

Hi,
here's a quick shot of the viv the redheads are in.
They seem to have settled down well in it.

What do you think?










Regards
Marcus


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## ChrisK

Yeah looks good and they can probably hide in there really well (especially when you're in their sight), but after about 2-3 months all of a sudden they're going to become a lot bolder


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## Julio

pretty sweet viv Marcus!!


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## 1210

hey Marcus!

Whats the dimensions of your viv?


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## Mworks

ChrisK said:


> Yeah looks good and they can probably hide in there really well (especially when you're in their sight), but after about 2-3 months all of a sudden they're going to become a lot bolder


Considering their size and colour they are pretty amazing at vanishing! But they are really bold already and will come to the viv doors and stare at me!

I'm finding them the most accurate feeders - even distant springtails are noticed, aimed at and I haven't seen them miss yet! Not like my terribs which sort of just 'throw' their tongues in the general direction of anything that moves.

Have you tried yours with bean weevils?

Regards
Marcus


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## ChrisK

Mworks said:


> Considering their size and colour they are pretty amazing at vanishing! But they are really bold already and will come to the viv doors and stare at me!
> 
> I'm finding them the most accurate feeders - even distant springtails are noticed, aimed at and I haven't seen them miss yet! Not like my terribs which sort of just 'throw' their tongues in the general direction of anything that moves.
> 
> Have you tried yours with bean weevils?
> 
> Regards
> Marcus



OK that's probably cuz they're CB. No I was going to try the bean beetles but they're way too much of a pain to deal with so I got rid of all my cultures, they don't produce enough, they're hard to feed out, and basically just walk out of a tank after you put them in, they escape worse than ff's. They would probably like them though if they could catch them before they go up and out. One they do go crazy for though is termites, my old histos used to love them and all my present ones do too, they really go nuts when you throw them in there.


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## Mworks

Can't get termites over here but the wingless fruit flies look just like ants and they hammer them down. 

I find BW's really easy to culture and feed out. Cardboard tube in each culture - lift out gently - quick tap and dozens of bean weevils drop in the viv. 
All my viv's are FF escape proof so the weevils have no chance of getting out.

I'll try them with weevils this weekend and see how they do. I want to feed them with a diverse a diet as I can.

Regards
Marcus


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## gluedl

Hi,

really beautiful and rare frogs Sir! Feeling pretty jealous right now...

Maybe you could PM me a link to the original breeder.


Wish you and the frogs all the best!


gluedl


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## PumilioTurkey

Mworks said:


> Can't get termites over here but the wingless fruit flies look just like ants and they hammer them down.
> 
> I find BW's really easy to culture and feed out. Cardboard tube in each culture - lift out gently - quick tap and dozens of bean weevils drop in the viv.
> All my viv's are FF escape proof so the weevils have no chance of getting out.
> 
> I'll try them with weevils this weekend and see how they do. I want to feed them with a diverse a diet as I can.
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


are those those black bugs with a hard carapace?

because I know a lot of gruesome stories with frogs getting anal prolapses because of their hard shells.


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## Mworks

PumilioTurkey said:


> are those those black bugs with a hard carapace?
> 
> because I know a lot of gruesome stories with frogs getting anal prolapses because of their hard shells.


Are we talking the same species here? I'm refering to the bean weevil (Callosobruchus maculatus). I've fed these to my terribs for years without any problems and I've never heard of any horror stories about them and they are a very common feeder species here in the UK.

Anyone else heard anything bad about them?

Regards
Marcus


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## PumilioTurkey

Terribils yes.

I am talking the likes of Tinctorius.

So far I've heard from several keepers whose frogs had a prolapse when eating these little guys.

Evenmy terribilis have a hard time swallowing them.


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## stemcellular

PumilioTurkey said:


> Terribils yes.
> 
> I am talking the likes of Tinctorius.
> 
> So far I've heard from several keepers whose frogs had a prolapse when eating these little guys.
> 
> Evenmy terribilis have a hard time swallowing them.


That sounds somewhat specious. Was a necrospy done to substantiate that claim? I've been feeding bbs (bean beetles over here) to mantella, tincs, phyllobates, auratus, luecs, tricolors, etc. for nearly two years without incident. 

Chris, I just use a pasta strainer to feed them out. Dump cultures, sift bugs, feed. They are masters of escape though!


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## Mworks

As promised here are a few shots of the male - handsome beast that he is!










Mr Happy?


Enjoy

Regards
Marcus


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## R1ch13

Anybody else see the smiley face haha :]

Lovely pics mate and lovely frogs.

Richie


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## stemcellular

that's awesome


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## R1ch13

stemcellular said:


> that's awesome


It is isn't it...

Your a lucky boy Marcus, I want a frog with an Instant Messenger originated image on its butt.

Richie


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## Mworks

Thanks guys!

I am really getting into histrionicus - they are an incredible frog to have in a viv.

I can feel an expensive obsession coming on :] 

Watch this space!!!

Regards
Marcus


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## yumpster

Such an insane amount of jealousy!


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## TExeter

wicked shot of the smiley.


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## Mworks

Sorry, you guys must be getting sick of the sight of Redheads but I just couldn't resist sharing this shot.
It really shows off her pattern and colouring. These frogs are so photogenic it's near on impossible not to sit in front of the viv camera in hand!

see what you think...............











Is she gorgeous or what!!

Regards
Marcus


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## afterdark

> Is she gorgeous or what!!


 Holy smokes - nice frog.

No need to apologize for posting pics - keep 'em coming!


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## Julio

keep on posting we are not getting sick of them at all.


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## Peter Keane

Your vivarium is perfect set-up for these, they love to climb and yours is very nicely planned out. They are very bold and if lucky enough to get them to breed. Their red face seems to fade from the parent frog. (I'm sure now with the nutritional supplements out now this can be rectified somewhat). I haven't had or seen these for a while a long while. I received mine from a friend in Holland and he actually had captive bred frogs, although he sold me well established young wild caught. I also have an article somewhere on breeding these... Great looking frogs, Great looking vivarium and best of luck... Wild caughts are most likely shipped thru a non-CITES country (Kazikhstan, Lebanon and or Vietnam, I think has been noted recently.. I have a friend in Iraq that works the airport and he has seen many animals come through there also).. to the destination country .. I gotta try and find my article to read it again, to bring me back in time, LOL.. Peter Keane


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## Mworks

Thanks guys!

Peter if you could find the article on breeding and let me have a copy - either by snail mail (and I'd pay the postage of course) if it's not in electronic form or by email that would be fantastic!

Your are right about the climbing too - in fact I've just added more branches into the viv and they are all over them. I'll add a photo of the extras when I have a minute.

Regards
Marcus


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## Mworks

Myself & ChrisK were discussing the benefits of low iron glass as I have just replaced my Histri's viv doors with Optiwhite Glass (the UK's low iron content glass). To help with keeping my Redheads in good condition I am going to use a UVB lamp through the front doors of my viv so the UV light is aimed at just 50% of the viv. The frogs can sunbathe if they want or get in the shade if they need to 'chill'!

I contacted Pilkington Glass R&D with a request for info on UVB pass through.

This is the info I got back from them and I thought it may be of interest to other members

Thank you for your enquiry.

Detailed below is the amount of UV passing through the glass:

4mm Optifloat™ 59%

6mm Optifloat™ 53%

4mm Optiwhite™ 83%

6mm Optiwhite™ 81%

Optifloat™ is our trade name for standard clear glass. Optiwhite™ is our trade name for low iron glass.

As you can see, the best product for your application, allowing the maximum amount of UV through, will be 4mm Optiwhite™. UV is measured in the range 280 - 380 nm in accordance with British Standards.

Hopefully this is of use to you.


Kind regards.

Pilkington Technical Advisory Service

Building Products UK

Tel:+44 (0)1744 692000

Fax+44 (0)1744 692880

E [email protected]

Pilkington United Kingdom and Ireland


Hope this is of interest if anyone was cosidering using low iron glass in any future viv construction.

Regards
Marcus


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## Morgan Freeman

Fantastic viv and beautiful frogs!

Interesting info on the UV aswell, very useful.


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## Mworks

Well I def have a pair of Redheads - just found eggs in the viv!!! 
Don't expect them to come to much but now I know I have a pair I'm over the moon!! My gut feeling is I've got 1.2 as the male is quacking like crazy at the mo and not a peep from the other two - they just follow him around!

Regards
Marcus


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## ChrisK

Mworks said:


> Well I def have a pair of Redheads - just found eggs in the viv!!!
> Don't expect them to come to much but now I know I have a pair I'm over the moon!! My gut feeling is I've got 1.2 as the male is quacking like crazy at the mo and not a peep from the other two - they just follow him around!
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


Awesome, yeah they probably won't be good but just supplement them well (look into human grade vit A once or twice a month) with lots of different food items and wait and see what happens.............


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## billschwinn

Congratulations! I wish you much sucess with the rearing, definately keep us updated, Bill


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## Bob Fraser

Congrats Marcus ~ Keep the pictures coming, never get tired of looking at those stunning frogs.


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## alfredjourgen

Congratulations  You might have a long wait for good clutches if these are 09 animals as histrionicus in my experience take up to 18 - 36 months to mature and give good eggs.


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## Mworks

Good job I'm a patient guy then!!!!!
To be honest I'm not fussed how long it takes them to breed as they are so fascinating to watch. They really are so unique in the way they act, I especially love the way they 'run down' their prey - sort of the cheetah of the dartfrog world!

Regards
Marcus


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## alfredjourgen

I could watch them all day long man! Some of the locales have an almost mythical ora about them


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## Mworks

Alf, when ever you're passing my way - you are more than welcome for a shufti!

Regards
Marcus


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## ChrisK

Yeah it's like they get low to the ground and do the Spiderman walk (or fast alligator crawl) after the flies


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## alfredjourgen

Nice one mate  same goes for you!


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## 013

Peter Keane said:


> I received mine from a friend in Holland and he actually had captive bred frogs, although he sold me well established young wild caught.


Interesting...seeing that these frogs are ILLEGAL in Holland. Thanks for admitting you care nothing about whether a species is CITES or not. Very responsible and a great example for fellow hobbyists. Sigh.


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## ChrisK

013 said:


> Interesting...seeing that these frogs are ILLEGAL in Holland. Thanks for admitting you care nothing about whether a species is CITES or not. Very responsible and a great example for fellow hobbyists. Sigh.


Do you know what year these became illegal in Holland (or were they always), and do you know what year Peter got his frogs?


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## Peter Keane

013 said:


> Interesting...seeing that these frogs are ILLEGAL in Holland. Thanks for admitting you care nothing about whether a species is CITES or not. Very responsible and a great example for fellow hobbyists. Sigh.


WOW 013, This is the very first time I've been verbally attacked .. If you read my entire statement I explain that I haven't seen or had these in a very long time.. It was actually 1984-85ish (I think when I got these from a trip into Holland and Germany.. I have to look thru my old photos for a more accurate date), that was prior to ALL dendrobatids being placed on CITES Appendix II, that occured in 1987-88 or late 80's.. The article I speak of is actually written in the first "ENGLISH" version of Dendrobatidae Nederland magazine (at that time was spiral-bound) If you've been around that long you may have read it, if you are a member of that group. I had other red-heads prior to that and traded away my frogs to a fellow ISSD member after having no success using German tactics in raising tads. While living in NYC (Bronx), I actually assisted in giving descriptions to the USFWS on some dendrobatid and other tropical frogs for seizures of illegal dendrobatids coming in with tropical fish shipments. So, to say as you state, That I care nothing about whether a specie is CITES or not. I state you are DEAD wrong. 

here's my original statement.. 

"Your vivarium is perfect set-up for these, they love to climb and yours is very nicely planned out. They are very bold and if lucky enough to get them to breed. Their red face seems to fade from the parent frog. (I'm sure now with the nutritional supplements out now this can be rectified somewhat). [red]I haven't had or seen these for a while a long while.[red] I received mine from a friend in Holland and he actually had captive bred frogs, although he sold me well established young wild caught. I also have an article somewhere on breeding these... Great looking frogs, Great looking vivarium and best of luck... Wild caughts are most likely shipped thru a non-CITES country (Kazikhstan, Lebanon and or Vietnam, I think has been noted recently.. I have a friend in Iraq that works the airport and he has seen many animals come through there also).. to the destination country .. I gotta try and find my article to read it again, to bring me back in time, LOL.. Peter Keane" 

By taking a portion of my statement, not sure if that's all you read, you got the VERY wrong idea.

As you can see I make several references in there that this was back in time.. Also, I put my FULL name on every response I make.. If I was doing something illegal, do you really think I would place any part of my name on the replies?.. I've been in this hobby a Loooong time, not knowing how old you are or even your name, I may have been in this hobby longer than you've been alive.. I did make the mistake of not adding in the years and for that I learned a VERY valuable lesson. I will also send you a PM advising that I replied to your accusation. 

Yours Truly, 

Peter Brian Keane


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## Mworks

Eventually the male has done his 'bit' and obviously got it right!

One of several that have now been deposited in brom axils. 




























Enjoy

Marcus


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## mongo77

That's awesome. Hopefully we'll see more of these!


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## botanyboy03

Very Cool. Congrats on the transport ( congrats to dad as well)


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## fleshfrombone

Wow, awesome frogs. Next time I'm in the UK we should meet up.


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## Mworks

fleshfrombone said:


> Wow, awesome frogs. Next time I'm in the UK we should meet up.


Let me know when you are over and we can make a plan.

Regards
Marcus


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## bronz

Are these the same ones you showed me or new since then? Good luck with 'em anyway, just in case I didn't mention I'm in the market! Terribs say hello by the way.


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## Mitch

Wow! These are some beautiful Pumilio, nice work on getting them to breed. What species of plant is that to the left of the frog in the third picture?


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## Mworks

bronz said:


> Are these the same ones you showed me or new since then? Good luck with 'em anyway, just in case I didn't mention I'm in the market! Terribs say hello by the way.


Yup the same - growing nicely!

Regards
Marcus


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## Mworks

Mitch said:


> Wow! These are some beautiful Pumilio, nice work on getting them to breed. What species of plant is that to the left of the frog in the third picture?


They are Oophaga histrionica not pumilio - the plant is Pilea depressa - grows well trailing in vivs.

Regards
Marcus


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## Mitch

Thanks for the plant ID! I never knew these weren't Pumilio, thanks for letting me know. Always learning something new...


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## fleshfrombone

What do you think of that big display at the Manchester Museum?


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## Mworks

fleshfrombone said:


> What do you think of that big display at the Manchester Museum?


It's BIG but I'm not that impressed with it. Think the planting could have been so much more reflective of a rain forest than it is. The PDF species mix concerns me too.
Andrew usually gets it spot on but in my opinion he missed the bullseye with this one.

Your views?

Regards
Marcus


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## fleshfrombone

I agree. I think they could have done a better job with the planting but we have to remember he works with what he has. I have no idea what kind of budget he was working with. I'm trying to get him access to more bromeliads and mini orchids from here. So far it's slow going. Those giant toads are a trip hahahaha. Andrew is a great guy. He was gracious enough to take me behind the scenes.


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## tclipse

Nothing short of gorgeous.


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## Frogman8

Prob the coolest frogs I've seen !anyone see these in the new York area ever! Would love to get hands on a pair of these jewels


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## housevibe7

Beautiful. Congrats on getting a viable tad. Be interesting to see if they feed it.


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## Mworks

Those shots were taken a few weeks ago now - she is feeding at least three - the one I can see is growing well and just starting to show some colour.

Regards
Marcus


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## housevibe7

Very nice... Makes me wonder if once you get past the WC Histos, if the F1's and F2's aren't more prone to being better parents.


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## nburns

All I can say is wow!


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## Mworks

This is a really poor photo of one of the tads but it gives you the idea- it's developing well and has got its back legs now. It's incredibly quick and vanishes deep into the axil at the slightest movement near the viv. I can just see some red comming in so hopefully it wont be too long before it's OOTW.
The female is very attentive and checks the broms first thing every morning. 

Hopefully better photos will follow!!









Regards
Marcus


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## Mworks

Look what finally decided to leave one of the broms! 
Not much of a 'red head' yet but I think that will develop. The other one in the last photo is still in the axil but getting bolder and coming more and more to the waterline so it shouldn't be long now.











More photos to follow as the little guy gets less camera shy!

Regards
Marcus


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## mcadoo

congrats! great photo


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## Vermfly

Congrats Marcus. Beautiful froglet!


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## Frogtofall

Excellent work!!


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## Mworks

I've been in discussion on a couple of other forums regarding using UVb lighting through the Optiwhite Glass doors to my vivs and how the histrionicus and sylvatica react to it. I took this photo today as I gave them their 1 hour session for the week. Literally within seconds of switching the lamp on both females came dashing out and 'chilled' for exactly 40 mins before deciding they'd had enough. The male was busy so didn't appear for 10 mins (I think he was doing his bit with some new eggs) but he left too when the females left. 

They obviously know that it is beneficial as on three seperate occasions I tried a non UV bulb and got no reaction from them what so ever - changing immediately to the UVb bulb - all of them appear and start their sunbed session!










Regards
Marcus


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## tclipse

Very cool.. beautiful viv by the way.


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## BlueRidge

Mworks said:


> I've been in discussion on a couple of other forums regarding using UVb lighting through the Optiwhite Glass doors to my vivs and how the histrionicus and sylvatica react to it. I took this photo today as I gave them their 1 hour session for the week. Literally within seconds of switching the lamp on both females came dashing out and 'chilled' for exactly 40 mins before deciding they'd had enough. The male was busy so didn't appear for 10 mins (I think he was doing his bit with some new eggs) but he left too when the females left.
> 
> They obviously know that it is beneficial as on three seperate occasions I tried a non UV bulb and got no reaction from them what so ever - changing immediately to the UVb bulb - all of them appear and start their sunbed session!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


Thats an awesome finding! The frogs are looking great btw.


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## ritersofly

any update on the froglets?


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## Mworks

They are doing well, I've seen three out and about and they are hammmering springtails and wingless melos. Found more eggs in the viv the other day and I'm sure the male is guarding tadpoles in one of the larger broms!

Regards
Marcus


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## PumilioTurkey

Good luck with them

All the histrionicus and sylvatica froglets I've seen/heard about died when reaching the "magical" seven months.


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## Frogtofall

I may have missed it but does the Optiwhite glass allow the UVB to get through unlike typical glass?? The bit of info I found didn't exactly say.


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## Tuckinrim8

Thank you for sharing Marcus! Very cool!


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## Mworks

Mworks said:


> Myself & ChrisK were discussing the benefits of low iron glass as I have just replaced my Histri's viv doors with Optiwhite Glass (the UK's low iron content glass). To help with keeping my Redheads in good condition I am going to use a UVB lamp through the front doors of my viv so the UV light is aimed at just 50% of the viv. The frogs can sunbathe if they want or get in the shade if they need to 'chill'!
> 
> I contacted Pilkington Glass R&D with a request for info on UVB pass through.
> 
> This is the info I got back from them and I thought it may be of interest to other members
> 
> Thank you for your enquiry.
> 
> Detailed below is the amount of UV passing through the glass:
> 
> 4mm Optifloat™ 59%
> 
> 6mm Optifloat™ 53%
> 
> 4mm Optiwhite™ 83%
> 
> 6mm Optiwhite™ 81%
> 
> Optifloat™ is our trade name for standard clear glass. Optiwhite™ is our trade name for low iron glass.
> 
> As you can see, the best product for your application, allowing the maximum amount of UV through, will be 4mm Optiwhite™. UV is measured in the range 280 - 380 nm in accordance with British Standards.
> 
> Hopefully this is of use to you.
> 
> 
> Kind regards.
> 
> Pilkington Technical Advisory Service
> 
> Building Products UK
> 
> Tel:+44 (0)1744 692000
> 
> Fax+44 (0)1744 692880
> 
> E [email protected]
> 
> Pilkington United Kingdom and Ireland
> 
> 
> Hope this is of interest if anyone was cosidering using low iron glass in any future viv construction.
> 
> Regards
> Marcus





Frogtofall said:


> I may have missed it but does the Optiwhite glass allow the UVB to get through unlike typical glass?? The bit of info I found didn't exactly say.


Details that were provided above.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## Frogtofall

Thanks Marcus. Thats great news. Will have to see if that kind of glass is available to us here.

Edit: Dang, it WAS on page 6. I skimmed right over it... Doah...


----------



## ChrisK

Frogtofall said:


> Thanks Marcus. Thats great news. Will have to see if that kind of glass is available to us here.
> 
> Edit: Dang, it WAS on page 6. I skimmed right over it... Doah...


Antone look into Borofloat, it's pretty much the same thing. 

People talk about Starphire but it doesn't really transmit.


----------



## Morgan Freeman

Where did you purchase the glass? The only time I've seen optiwhite used is in aquariums and it's expensive. I may have to try this out.


----------



## Mworks

My local glass merchant (HW Glass: Leading UK Glass Manufacturer | Frosted Glass | Glass Cut) stocks it and I think they deliver nationwide. Most glass merchants use Pilkingtons Glass so should be able to get it for you. It is a bit more expensive but the benefits far outweigh the additional cost.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## chesney

Beautiful frogs! Keep the pics coming!


----------



## HunterB

Mworks said:


> They are doing well, I've seen three out and about and they are hammmering springtails and wingless melos. Found more eggs in the viv the other day and I'm sure the male is guarding tadpoles in one of the larger broms!
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


This is very good to hear Marcus, it'll be interesting to see these guys mature and become adults


----------



## ghettopieninja

great info on the glass. I have been looking around for UV penetrate glass for years without much luck. Pretty much every major institution engaged in frog breeding/conservation I have ever worked at or visited uses track lights as UV basking lights for all of their amphibians. If you remove the UV filtering glass cover of most commercially available track lights they produce quite substantial UV and would be put on for about an hr a day, through a screen lid of course.


----------



## Morgan Freeman

Mworks said:


> My local glass merchant (HW Glass: Leading UK Glass Manufacturer | Frosted Glass | Glass Cut) stocks it and I think they deliver nationwide. Most glass merchants use Pilkingtons Glass so should be able to get it for you. It is a bit more expensive but the benefits far outweigh the additional cost.
> 
> Regards
> Marcus



Thanks. I have two near me so will try there first.


----------



## ritersofly

pics!! of the froglets!!! please!


----------



## Mworks

Got a couple more shots of the youngsters today
This one keeps high up in the viv within the structure of the branches.










This one was out learning from one of the adult females how to hunt springtails!!


















Regards
Marcus


----------



## billschwinn

That is awesome! Makes me miss mine I had in the 70's more! Produce a bunch so I can get a pair.


----------



## stu&shaz

Ha ha mate,thats the second time I have latched on to one of your threads and HAD to read absolutly every word, THANKYOU kiddo.This is so inspiring to us especially now well going through the mill as it were,trying to get to a stage where we think we are worthy to keep just the run of the mill, let alone our one-day dream frogs. Absolutely fascinating(just wish there was twice as much there mate). Mate thankyou for going out of your way to help us in our endevors,totally notworthy, wish you all the luck in the world with them bro, can't really say more,best ALWAYS Stu


----------



## Mworks

Hi Stu - good to see you here! 
Don't worry you are doing everything right - taking your time and making sure that the vivs are spot on for the frogs - too many just rush into it and then fail.
You'll soon be a great frogger and a benefit to the PDF community.

Bill, the redheads do seem to be prolific breeders once they get started and it wont be too long before they are more available.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## rcteem

Mworks said:


> Got a couple more shots of the youngsters today
> This one keeps high up in the viv within the structure of the branches.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This one was out learning from one of the adult females how to hunt springtails!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Regards
> Marcus



Great photos man...really jealous


----------



## ChrisK

Marcus are those colors true or being washed a little by the camera? The patterns break up as they grow but mine seem to be coming out with more of the orange/red on them - one actually is more orange/red than yellow!


----------



## Mworks

The photos are a pretty accurate representation of their actual colours. The bacground is dark brown/black with yellow patterning - there are subtle areas of red just starting to show through. The parents as you can see are a vivid mix so I'm thinking the youngsters will follow suit as they age.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## ChrisK

Yeah I'm wondering how that comes out - yours look like there is some spread around the back instead of the head, I never saw any adults that had that kind of pattern


----------



## JJuchems

billschwinn said:


> Produce a bunch so I can get a pair.


Add me to the list as well. Great work. They look gorgeous.


----------



## tclipse

Mworks said:


> The photos are a pretty accurate representation of their actual colours. The bacground is dark brown/black with yellow patterning - there are subtle areas of red just starting to show through. The parents as you can see are a vivid mix so I'm thinking the youngsters will follow suit as they age.
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


I wonder if there's an equivalent of Repashy SuperPig or Naturose overseas for carotenoid supplementation? That could definitely help.. the Santa Isabel anthonyi I have raised with those supplements ended up being much redder than the ones without.


----------



## Mworks

I use Repashy and Naturose on all my frogs. I am convinced that these will colour up as they age. Something I wasn't expecting was that when the adults were having their 'UV sunbed session' this week two of the youngsters came out and joined the three adults basking for 30 mins. They obviously know what's good for them!

Regards
Marcus


----------



## ChrisK

Mworks said:


> I use Repashy and Naturose on all my frogs. I am convinced that these will colour up as they age. Something I wasn't expecting was that when the adults were having their 'UV sunbed session' this week two of the youngsters came out and joined the three adults basking for 30 mins. They obviously know what's good for them!
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


Haha that's awesome, you need to record a clip of that


----------



## rmelancon

I remember seeing Silverstone's in the ABG greenhouse that had really intense red coloration that you normally don't see on long term CB red colored frogs. They were not supplemented with any enhancer and they attributed it to the natural sunlight exposure, ie UV exposure.

What I find interesting is that my frogs with high reds that are older have long since lost the red and are a subdued orange color. Their young however start out with really intense red coloration and lose it after a couple of years. So if the adults don't have whatever "ingredient" is needed for the intense red, where do the offspring get it from? A bit of a hijack but food for thought.


----------



## ChrisK

rmelancon said:


> What I find interesting is that my frogs with high reds that are older have long since lost the red and are a subdued orange color. Their young however start out with really intense red coloration and lose it after a couple of years. So if the adults don't have whatever "ingredient" is needed for the intense red, where do the offspring get it from? A bit of a hijack but food for thought.



That is kind of interesting, the froglet I posted in this post: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/br...cus-transporting-depositing-3.html#post525651
is mostly bright orange/red as opposed to any yellow on him (maybe 3:1), I'd be shocked if it kept that much or that bright. On the flip side I'd also be shocked if Marcus' didn't get some.


----------



## Frogtofall

Reading this thread is like reading a good book. Just can't wait to get to the next sentence. Great work Marcus!!


----------



## Mworks

rmelancon said:


> What I find interesting is that my frogs with high reds that are older have long since lost the red and are a subdued orange color. Their young however start out with really intense red coloration and lose it after a couple of years.


I wonder if it could be some type of hormonal process? A sort of 'greying' as occurs in humans as they age.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## Mworks

Thanks Antone.

Hopefully the info in the thread will help others, especially with histrionicus. The more we can share the more successful we can be in both keeping and breeding these little jewels.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## stu&shaz

Hiya mate, thanks for the inspiring words couple of Q's sir, firstly repashy and naturlose? former is a vit suppliment? whats the latter and why use a combination(where do i get these?) . Secondly I have read that it is best to keep histrionica froglets with their parents for sometime :what seems to be the optimum time for separating them . Is it a characteristic of all morphs of this species for the parents to feed with the young and "teach" as it were. Fantasic pics of this mate, so cool to see that.


----------



## Mworks

Hi Stu,
yes Repashy (I get this from the USA) is a vit supplement and Naturose a colour enhancer which is high in carotenoids. It does appear that both histrionicus and sylvatica froglets do better when left with the parent frogs in the viv in which they were bred for at least six months. It could well be that it is a viv thing just as much as a parental issue. I don't think the froglets 'learn' from the adults (but I could be completely wrong here) what I have observed from hours of viewing them is the froglet 'uses' the adults as prey movers. By following the adults it picks up the tiny springtails and other microfauna that gets 'flushed' by the adults and is just too small for the adults to strike at. 
A Dutch keeper had really good success with breeding Sylvatica Lita then everytime he moved the froglets to a different viv they died within days. This happened several times before he kept them in the viv for 6 months - moved them out then and no problems.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## Nick

Marcus,
I may have missed this, but what are the dimensions of your (histo) viv?
Thanks,
Nick


----------



## markpulawski

Chris i think there is a lot of variability to this morph but I do remember getting 3 CB animals back in the late 90's, all were missing the orange spots...and it was as if they were just missing the orange with lots of yellow with a few brown voids between, where it looked as if there should have been orange. Those were all spotted where as these have quite a bit of striping. I would love to know if the UV has something to do with their ability to retain certain colors.


----------



## Mworks

I would definitely say that the adult colours have been more intense and vibrant since I started the UV regime.
Coincidental? I don't think so - their actions when I put the lamp on convinces me that the frogs realise that the UV is beneficial.

Regards
Marcus


----------



## markpulawski

Coupled with Antone's comments it certanly makes sense to draw that conclusion, I would suggest the UV exposure also likely adds more benefit than just color enhancement.


----------



## dmartin72

Very interesting read and an interesting frog for sure. I especially like the bit on the use of UV.


----------



## fishr

Oh wow! The photo of the little one learning how to eat the springtails is very cool. Those frogs are way cool.

*wants*


----------



## Nick

Something to consider, the amount of UVB produced by the bulb quickly degrades the further you get from it. Obtain a good UVB meter and check the reading around where the frogs are sitting. I would bet that the reading will be next to nothing or zero. Only the larger mercury vapor bulbs (much larger wattage and heat production) have the push to get UVB any distance greater than 6 inches away from the bulb. I have done readings on pretty much all of the common UVB producing bulbs with a digital UV meter (Solarmeter.com) and was pretty amazed at the lack of UVB produced by most of these bulbs once you got more than 6 inches from them.
Nick


----------



## Mworks

Well the frogs seem to think there's 'something' in it! I have done quite a bit of research myself and sorry I don't agree with your 'I would bet that the reading will be next to nothing or zero.'

Information on the website below disagrees with your findings too. I'll continue with providing a weekly dose of UVb for my frogs - as far as I'm concerned it is beneficial.

UV Guide UK - Ultraviolet Light for Reptiles - UVB reptile lighting on test

Marcus


----------



## Nick

Marcus,
I'm sorry I probably came off wrong in that post. All I was trying to convey was that up close most of the bulbs on the market do what they claim to provide, but as you get even as short as 6 inches away the amount drastically deminishes. 

I'm not sure where in the link you provide that it "disputes" my findings.
A lot of the site was unavailable for some reason. 
Nick


----------



## Mworks

The great thing about forums like this is the sharing of opinions and there is no need to apologise for voicing yours - I have a differing opinion that's all. It's through debate that useful facts and findings emerge for the benefit of other members. 

Looks like the part of the site I was reffering to is being re written. I went off the bulb with the best results and as I use a 'lamp' that fits up close to the viv doors the frogs actually come to where they feel comfortable which incidently is usually about 6" - 10" away from the bulb.

If you have readings on the bulb I use I'd be interested to read them - 
it's a Reptisun CFL and also does well in these tests 

UV-lamps for terrariums: Their spectral characteristics and efficiency in promoting vitamin D3 synthesis by UVB irradiation

Marcus


----------



## Nick

No worries Marcus. The bulb results were exactly what I was looking for to see what products they tested and how it compared with what I have been finding. I've got good results/readings with the MR16 halogen bulbs, but the only down side is that they produce a lot of heat, not really good for frog applications.
I have not tested the bulb you are using and will check it out. Your distance is spot on.

Congrats on your success with them by the way. 
Even though I have not provided any UV to my pair of histos, I have found that they will come out to "sun bath" where the light reaches the bottom of the enclosure during the late morning. Maybe they are trying to tell me something!
Nick


----------



## Nick

Interesting read Marcus, although this is posted by one of the researchers from your previous link so you may have already seen. 
This group is a good one to belong to....

Yahoo! Groups

Forgot to ask, are you using the 10.0 or 5.0?
Nick


----------



## Mworks

I use 10.0

Forgot to ask which histrionicus do you keep?

Regards
Marcus


----------



## Nick

Redheads. Have only had them a short time (< 2 months), but recently started getting courting and egg laying.
Nick


----------



## Mworks

Doing the viv jobs this morning guess what was peeping out of the brom - didn't even know it was in that axil - for quite large froglets they sure can thrive in the smallest spaces!










Don't you just love suprises like that!

Regards
Marcus


----------



## Mitch

Lucky!!! Nice job


----------



## stu&shaz

Mworks said:


> Doing the viv jobs this morning guess what was peeping out of the brom - didn't even know it was in that axil - for quite large froglets they sure can thrive in the smallest spaces!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't you just love suprises like that!
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


ha one day mate congrats mate great pic too,just special!!


----------



## Mworks

The viv was getting somewhat crowded with all the youngsters and quite a few tads developing in the broms so I decided it was time for some of them to pack up and leave home!

It gave me an opportunity to build a much bigger polycarb viv to be their new home - it's 80cm long, 35cm deep and 50cm high (no idea what that is in US gallons) - so plenty of room for them. I let it grow in for a couple of weeks and then in they went. I just cant believe how easy polycarb is to work with!










and here's two of the three youngsters 'exploring'. There will be a lot more detailed photos of the interior of the viv on our website later this week.










Regards
Marcus


----------



## frogparty

NICELY DONE SIR!! 
Great looking froglets, and a super clean viv


----------



## froggies3

oh oh oh-oh oh oh my gosh


----------



## bkelley02

Great looking froglet and incredible looking adults. Nice job on the Viv.


----------



## Mitch

Very nice viv. That'd be awesome if you could get another breeding pair going!


----------



## BYHGAB

any updates?


----------



## Mworks

The three sub adults settled into their new viv very well and all three are now calling continually! Three more froglets emerged from the broms late June and are now 'free ranging' along with their parents in their viv. I may try moving one soon to see if the 'info' on them not surviving a move if they are under 7 months is correct as I cant think of any reason for this.
Two of my sub adult males will be heading to France soon to diversify the bloodlines of a small breeding group where the male isnt doing his job - lots of eggs being laid but no tads from them. 
As I've said before once you have their environmental conditions right in their viv these are not difficult frogs to breed.


----------



## markpulawski

Mworks said:


> The three sub adults settled into their new viv very well and all three are now calling continually! Three more froglets emerged from the broms late June and are now 'free ranging' along with their parents in their viv. I may try moving one soon to see if the 'info' on them not surviving a move if they are under 7 months is correct as I cant think of any reason for this.
> Two of my sub adult males will be heading to France soon to diversify the bloodlines of a small breeding group where the male isnt doing his job - lots of eggs being laid but no tads from them.
> As I've said before once you have their environmental conditions right in their viv these are not difficult frogs to breed.


I would be interested in knowing how that would work out, my 3 are growing at an amazing rate and at 2 months the biggest is half the size of the parents. I really do believe the success of these guys has a lot to do with the size of the tank and how it is set up, and of course healthy animals to start out with.


----------



## Mworks

the youngest I have moved out from the parents viv so far was three months old and that one is fine - no problems what so ever and that was nearly three months ago. I may try moving one this weekend to see how it goes.


----------



## RNKot

Marcus, we definitely need pictures or even videos!


----------



## jbherpin

What is it that makes them a challenge to breed? Or is it fragility of eggs/tads/metamorphs, etc? Sorry if this is a stupid/obvious question...

Thanks!

JBear


----------



## Mworks

I don't find them a challenge at all. Like I've said, providing their environmental conditions and diet are right they are pretty easy to breed - basically just leave them to it. I think this is reflected in the success that quite a few keepers are now having. The most important factor I find is having suitable broms for tad deposition and providing a diverse diet of wild caught food.


----------



## Mworks

Here's the viv now after a couple of months growth and there'll be another three Redhead froglets joining the three subadults in it very soon.










I think nows a good time to introduce myself too as Marcus has decided to take a sabatical from frogs for a while and is overseas at the moment experiencing life!

My name is Graham (the father of Marcus) and myself and Marcus have been involved with darts for quite a while - I've been involved with UK amphibs and reptiles for over thirty years. I have been mentoring Marcus on husbandry and viv construction and helping him answer the more complex questions on dart care etc on the forums for a number of years. 

So for the forseeable future it's all down to me. I think that eventually he will be drawn back to darts - how could he not! So I will keep posting under the Mworks name so as to keep some continuity with threads etc.

A quick CV - I'm a consultant ecologist here in the UK running my own company specialising in native amphibian conservation. After a full and very rewarding career I am now in a position to 'put something back' and as well as funding a few conservation projects here in the UK I'm involved in developing a major conservation project in South America (a bit hush hush at the moment but I'll soon be announcing our website, mission statement and objectives). 

Hopefully I can help and give an 'across the water' spin on the hobby which may be of use or interest to some.

Kind Regards
Graham


----------



## james67

what is the arrow shaped vine in there/it looks like cissus but seems too small.

james


----------



## Frogtofall

james67 said:


> what is the arrow shaped vine in there/it looks like cissus but seems too small.
> 
> james


If you're talking about the one just right of center, it looks like C. amazonica to me.


----------



## james67

but if i remember correctly those arent very big tanks( so therefore they have to be pretty small leaves, as compared to the 3+in ones ove seen c amazonica produce). i got something similar in a plant trade awhile back (leaves similar to c. amizonica but juvenile ones had a slight serration and all were under 1.5inches in length) unfortunately it didnt make it, but ive been looking for a similar replacement since.

james


----------



## Frogtofall

You gotta remember... Size of foliage has little to do with ID. Cultural influence really plays a huge role in how the foliage looks. From small to large, thick to thin and even colorful or not. It's most likely Cissus amazonica.


----------



## Spaff

I've got what looks to be that same vine. Mine has leaves 1" or less and looks like what's been called Cissus amazonica to me.


----------



## Mworks

Yup, it's Cissus Amazonica. 
On the left hand side I've mixed it with Ficus sagitata and in the middle it mixes with a Vanilla planifolia - the viv is 80cm long, 35cm deep and 50cm high so not small. I find the leaves are quite small on the new shoots but slowly fill out to become pretty big. It's a real 'weed' once it becomes established but is robust enough to take some 'ruthless' pruning and stand up to very active frogs like the redheads who are continually on the go.

Regards
Graham


----------



## james67

thanks. 

james


----------



## bakaichi

Mworks said:


> Doing the viv jobs this morning guess what was peeping out of the brom - didn't even know it was in that axil - for quite large froglets they sure can thrive in the smallest spaces!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't you just love suprises like that!
> 
> Regards
> Marcus


what kind of feeder is that in front of the frog ?


----------



## Mworks

Springtails

Regards
Graham


----------



## bakaichi

Thx for the reply Graham

what Spp of spring tail are they ?

thx jason


----------



## Mworks

They are a Seira species from Brazil - easy to culture, really prolific and get to a max size of around 4mm.

Regards
Graham


----------



## R1ch13

Hello Graham.

Nice to see you taking over from Marcus for the time being.

The Viv has grown in wonderfully, the left hand corner is a touch of class.

I'm wondering if you could tell me what kind of leaf litter that is?

Looks like Live/Holm oak?

Cheers mate,

Regards,
Richie


----------



## R1ch13

Also, if possible an ID on the left hand side brom wouldn't go a miss.

Looks like a cracking tad raising brom.

Cheers,
Richie


----------



## Mworks

Hi Richie,
Good spot - the leaf litter is a mixture of magnolia, holm oak and a few other 'tropical looking' leaves which all grow in the walled garden on the estate - I owe you for the springs so I'll send you a good selection if you'd like some. 

The brom is just a guzmania sp - the ones that B&Q, Homebase and Sainsburys sell - cut the flower spike off, knock all the soil off and trim the roots back, give it a real good washing, and your sorted. I have them in all my histos and sylvatica vivs after the Redheads started using them for tad deposition. They have loads of wide and deep axils, stand up well to viv conditions and as you say perfect for tads.

Regards
Graham


----------



## R1ch13

Hiya Graham.

Cheers for getting back to me. The leaves really look brilliant.

No payback expected mate, Marcus has sent me things in the past.
I would however very much appreciate a wee mix of leaf litter whenever you get the time, no rush though. 

Hope the Springs are doing okay, they were only a few weeks old when I sent them. 
If you need anymore let me know as I have some nicely matured cultures just now.

Its also nice to know that if broms are needed in a hurry, vivarium suitable varieties can be picked up locally.

Regards,
Richie


----------



## Mworks

I'll sort some leaves over the weekend and get them in the post on Monday.

Regards
Graham


----------



## R1ch13

Mworks said:


> I'll sort some leaves over the weekend and get them in the post on Monday.
> 
> Regards
> Graham


That's brilliant thanks Graham.

But seriously, no rush mate.

Cheers,
Richie


----------



## stu&shaz

Hi Graham, just wanted to say a public thanks for all the help wisdom science and encouragement both of you have thrown at Shaz and I,hugely greatful.
Ah mate whom would have thought that the humble guzmania would be the brom of choice,for such special frogs,ha i guess i'll have to set to work propergating the 2 i have had for ages, almost since i started reserching this dart thing,they are full of pups and sadly a bit neglected,although flowering well. Massive thankyou and wish Marcus all the best in his endevours,
huge regards
Stu


----------



## Mworks

Thanks Stu,

it makes the dart hobby so much more worthwhile when you can share your success with others and more importantly pass on any lessons learned along the way so that others can share the success. The thread of yours is a brilliant example of this. Lessons we learn through sharing experiences ensure that our frogs benefit and we begin to understand their needs and better understand how we can reflect this into their husbandry. 

Regards
Graham


----------



## stu&shaz

Too kind mate,but what you have said is so true,although i fumble with this internet thing its also wonderful to be able to access all this knowledge.This was so lacking for me as a child when i started to keep non native amphibians,say er 30 plus years ago. I was very fortunate to be able to read at the Hubert Whitly trust libary ie paignton zoo,but its not the same as being able to talk to guys whom are doing the same as you are and ask about specific points.Although there has been a huge layoff for me,all those other life experiances are slowly comming into play now,and those relevent to our obsession can be shared tis great to be able to put a little bit in even as a novice to darts,and not just steal other peoples knowledge...eventhough i am abit partial to this,still smiling over the guzmania,i had pretty much written them off
regards
Stu


----------



## Mworks

Here's a photo of the latest three froglets that emerged just a couple of weeks ago - otherwise known as the Three Amigos at home in their in their Guz! They usually emerge over a week or so but still keep in and very close to the 'home' brom.










After a couple of weeks they start to 'free range' a bit more and here's the three investigating their world this afternoon.





























Enjoy

Regards
Graham


----------



## james67

awesome shots, and great looking frogs graham!

keep em coming
james


----------



## Mworks

Cheers James

Regards
Graham


----------



## Alex M

Stunning vivarium and froglets, Graham - it's great to see another 'phibber promoting the use of (or at least access to) UVB with amphibians also. So many species VASTLY benefit from it. Good luck with breeding many more histrionica in future.

Cheers
Al


----------



## ChrisK

Yeah that's true, they seem to hang in the brom for a couple of days just peeking out or maybe changing their "leaf" and then once they're out they're out - are yours seeming to cycle their breeding? Mine kick out like 10 froglets over a couple of months then seem to stop for a while -


----------



## Mworks

This trio seems to manage three at a time. I'm just sorting out another trio - this time I'm going to try a 2.1 instead of a 1.2.

Regards
Graham


----------



## Mworks

Alex M said:


> Stunning vivarium and froglets, Graham - it's great to see another 'phibber promoting the use of (or at least access to) UVB with amphibians also. So many species VASTLY benefit from it. Good luck with breeding many more histrionica in future.
> 
> Cheers
> Al


Hi Al,

these three youngsters all come to the front of the viv and sunbathe when I give the adults their weekly session. All my darts get UVb and all of them come out to sunbathe - even the 'shy' Benedicta. They obviously know it's doing/giving something beneficial.

Regards
Graham


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## Mworks

I have been questioning myself for quite a while for a reason that young histos would suddenly die if moved from the parental environment before reaching the alledged safe age of several months. 
I honestly can't think of any good reason and providing that the froglets were going into a well established vivarium complete with a functioning micro/macrofauna I can't see any risks. Well that was my take on it and unless there is something in the froglets physcological make up where they would miss mom and dad and pine away I though it was well worth trying.

So three weeks ago the three youngest froglets (all around four weeks out of the broms) were transferred from the adult viv to the large viv with the subadults in. Well they started feeding immediately and I've had no problems what so ever.

I have a couple of empty vivs that have good micro/macrofauna and with a number of tads growing in the broms I think this will be the next experiment to see if moving histos on emergence from the broms proves fatal. I can't see any reason it should - I move my BriBri froglets into grow on vivs as soon as I see them 'free ranging' in the viv and they are Oophaga too so fingers crossed.

Regards
Graham


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## james67

i think we have to remember that most of the available info on the successes and failures with histrionica are quite dated. now we can see the need to move froglets into "seeded" and established tanks/ containers, but the idea of microfauna culture and "seeding" are (i believe) much newer ideas. 

that being said i doubt many people would argue that its not possible to raise virtually any oophaga outside the parents viv. the vast majority of pumilio from my pairs were raised outside the permanent viv, and i know people are working with F2s from my MC group, so, from my experience, i see no evidence to support the idea that oophaga young must be raised with adults.

its amazing how far we (as a hobby) have come with these guys, to think that in the beginning, pulling eggs was commonplace, and attempting to feed chicken egg, or other egg substitutes was not only common for those attempting to produce them, it was cutting edge in the search for success.

james


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## Mworks

We have a period of low pressure and storms here in the UK lately which has had a good effect on the female histrionicus and prompted...........










Fourteen eggs plus a male standing guard most of the time is a very good sign - here's a close up shot. They also have a good number of tads ready for leaving their brom axils too. They really are prolific breeders once they are established. I have noticed that both females feed each others tads in the broms - good job really with so many on the go!










Two of the sub adult males are now in their new home in the South of France adding some much needed 'new blood' to a breeding group that had become 'stale'. Hopefully the breeding successes with Red Heads here in the UK and in Europe and the US will make the species much more available in the near future.

Regards
Graham


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## Mworks

Here's one of the Red Head polycarb vivs after a few months of good T5 HO lighting and lots of humidity. Amazing how quickly colonisation and then species domination occurs.











Regards
Graham


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## markpulawski

I moved all 3 of my CB babies at 3 months in June, they are still doing great.


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## motydesign

is that a 2.1 trio Mworks?


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## Mworks

no, in this viv there are 4, one sub adult male (from a previous clutch)and three unsexed youngsters.

Regards
Graham


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## Mitch

That viv is awesome! A perfect group of frogs to go with it too.


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## stu&shaz

Mworks said:


> Here's one of the Red Head polycarb vivs after a few months of good T5 HO lighting and lots of humidity. Amazing how quickly colonisation and then species domination occurs.
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> Graham


stunning viv again Graham the pics look better every time i see them
not to mention the frogs ,congrats sir
regards
Stu


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## Mworks

One of the females from my original breeding trio (1.2) she's feeding at least four tads at the moment - hence her full bodied look! She really is a head turner!



















Enjoy

Regards
Graham


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## Julio

absolutely gorgeous!


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## FrogBoyMike

Mworks said:


> Here's one of the Red Head polycarb vivs after a few months of good T5 HO lighting and lots of humidity. Amazing how quickly colonisation and then species domination occurs.
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> Graham


By far one of the best natural looking tanks i've seen on here!
And gorgeous frogs! I'm sooo jealous!  lol


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