# potting soil in terrarium!



## DARTFROG420

is miracle gro's organic potting soil fine just for potting plants in planters in a terrarium.


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## Jerm

I would say no to the potting soil, atleast for long term. It will pretty much turn to sludge and stink after awhile. You probably want to do some research on setting up vivariums for good info on keeping a long term healthy tank.


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## DARTFROG420

it will just be going in the pots and the pots will be dropped into the substrate.. the rest of the tank will be gravel and moss


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## Jerm

You probably don't want to use something with fertilizer in it. I try to keep all chemicals out of my tanks, it causes health problems. I assume you are using this tank for darts?


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## eos

You can use organic potting soil... with NO ferts whatsoever


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## DARTFROG420

thats what i thought.. i got some but just wanted to make sure.. thanks alot


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## Marinarawr

I haven't seen proof anywhere that organic potting soil (fertilized with some type of animal manure) is harmful to PDFs, but I never felt comfortable putting composted animal excrement in my vivs... That's just my 2cents.


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## jeffr

For my non terrarium plants I use Fox Farm Ocean Forest blend organic potting soil. It contains worm castings, and bat guano


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## Groundhog

The answer is NO. 

It took me al ong time to understandwhy, but Rex Lee Searcy in REPTILES put it in print. Potting soil decomposes after a wshile in enclosed environ ments. Even if you intend to take the pots out, there are better alternatives:

2 parts coir
2 parts seedling orchid bark or coconut husks
1 part composted leaves or tree fern fiber

This is similar to the proven ABG (Atlanta Botanical Garden) recipe:

2 parts fine fir bark
2 parts fine tree fern fiber
2 parts milled sphagnum moss
1 part fine charcoal
1 part peat moss

Personally, I don't use charcoal--after a while, it accomplishes nothing. But whatever you do, you must always avoid perlite!!

The above mixes not only last longer--they drain better in moist environments, and plants sunk in pots will have limited drainage. Please feel free to consult others on this site about substrate mixes. 

Peace


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## markbudde

The organic miracle grow potting soil comes with free snails and slugs. I would stay away from it.
-Mark


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## jackxc925

markbudde said:


> The organic miracle grow potting soil comes with free snails and slugs. I would stay away from it.
> -Mark


and tiny worms that eventually get big and take over a viv


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## jdogfunk99

jeffr said:


> For my non terrarium plants I use Fox Farm Ocean Forest blend organic potting soil. It contains worm castings, and bat guano


After massive research on "soil", I also ended up with Fox Farm Ocean Forest blend. It's hard to find though.


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## Frogtofall

I just use equal parts peat/bark/perlite to start with and then augment from there. Just make sure to use a good amount of leaf litter to keep any risks of larger species ingesting perlite (eventhough they spit it out the second it gets in their mouth) to be extra precautious. Also, keep tree fern fiber OUT of your soil mixes (sorry Groundhog!). Especially if using bark. That stuff breaks down super fast and consumes huge amouts of nitrogen. No one uses that anymore to my knowledge. Same goes for coco husk. Breaks down too rapidly. If you can't find pine bark shavings, orchid bark works just as well. 

Good luck.


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## Dragas

orchid bark being douglas fir bark ? 

I was under the impression that coco husk chips lasted longer than the douglas fir bark (and a much more renewable source.) ?











Use of Coconut Husk Chips


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## Frogtofall

Hi Jason. I've never actually seen that graph before. My info on the coco husk came from an orchid book (which I will try to dig up when I get home) and from personal correspondence. I admit, I never even thought about the renewable resource side of it. 

None of the growers I've visited (that grow tropical plants) use coco husk in their mixes. Its fine pine bark usually. There must be a good reason for it. I'll do some more digging and post more info when I can. 

Thanks for your post.


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## Dragas

The only other source I have was the Roberts Flower Supply which was referenced in the link. They too said the coco chips last longer. (they also reference it in the website.)

I have seen pine bark before but always presumed because it was a soft wood that it was not good for our vivariums ?


I am very new to this and still just reading/researching/testing everything out. I also don't have much experience with the tropical side of planting. 
*
*


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## Dragas

after a little more research it looks as though the coco option's arent the best from a pure planting perspective ... 


From a garden web post:



> After being pressed by a dear friend to try/evaluate CHC's, I performed a little experiment. Below, is a copy/paste job from a post I left somewhere, earlier this year. Though it starts out talking about coir, it ends with some commentary about CHCs.
> _Sphagnum peat and coir have nearly identical water retention curves. They both retain about 90-95% of their volume in water at saturation and release it over approximately the same curve until they both lock water up so tightly it's unavailable for plant uptake at about 30-33% saturation. Coir actually has less loft than sphagnum peat, and therefore, less aeration. Because of this propensity, coir should be used in mixes at lower %s than peat. Because of the tendency to compact, in the greenhouse industry, coir is primarily used in containers in sub-irrigation (bottom-watering) situations. Many sources produce coir that is high in soluble salts, so this can also be an issue.
> Using coir or CHCs as the primary component of soils virtually eliminates lime or dolomitic lime as a Ca source because of their high pH (6+). Gypsum should be used as a Ca source, which helps correct coir and CHC's low S content. All coconut products are very high in K, very low in Ca, and have a potentially high Mn content, which can interfere with the uptake of Fe. _
> _I haven't tested coir, but I have done some testing of CHCs (coconut husk chips) with some loose controls in place. After very thoroughly leaching and rinsing the chips several times, I made a 5:1:1 soil of pine barkeaterlite (which I know to be very productive) and a 5:1:1 mix of CHCseaterlite. I planted 6 cuttings of snapdragon and 6 cuttings of Coleus (each from the same plant to help reduce genetic influences) in containers (same size/shape) of the different soils. I added dolomitic lime to the bark soil and gypsum to the CHC soil. After the cuttings struck, I eliminated all but the three strongest in each of the 4 containers. I watered each container with a weak solution of MG 12-4-8 with STEM added at each watering, and watered on an 'as needed basis', not on a schedule. The only difference in the fertilizer regimen was the fact that I included a small amount of MgSO4 (Epsom salts) to provide MG (the dolomitic lime in the bark soil contained the MG, while the gypsum (CaSO4) in the CHC soil did not. This difference was necessary because of the high pH of CHCs and coir.) for the CHC soil. _
> _The results were startling. In both cases, the cuttings grown in the CHC's exhibited only about 1/2 the biomass at summer's end as the plants in the bark mix. _
> _I just find it very difficult for a solid case to be made (aside from "It works for me") for the use of coir or CHC's. They're more expensive and more difficult to use effectively. The fact that some believe peat is in short supply (no where near true, btw) is easily offset by the effect of the carbon footprint of coir in its trek to the US from Sri Lanka or other exotic locales. _
> _That's the view from here._


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## markbudde

Awesome find. Thanks!


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