# Cheap Chytrid treatment options?



## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

So I've been running around all day trying to find some liquid spray Lamasil AT, but they must have discontinued it or something because none of the pharmacies in my area carry it. Are there any other cheap, easily accessible chytrid treatments? Would miconazol, tolnaftate, or clotrimozol work? How about a Lamasil gel? Any insight would be greatly appreciated!


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

So how do you know they have chytrid?has chytrid been confirmed by a qualified profesional?aka a vet.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Miconazole has been shown to work on treating chytridmycosis but isn't an optimal treatment as some of the tests using it have shown unacceptable levels of mortality. 

Ed


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## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

Im not positive. I have 5 leuc froglets that started getting really weak and skinny the past 2 weeks. At first I thought the reason was that the fruit flies (melanos) were too big for them to handle. I tried springtails but it got to the point that they couldnt get around to hunt so last night I treated them with a Pedialyte solution just as a last resort. While soaking them, I noticed a layer of slimy film coming from off of them which Im guessing is excess skin. Today, all but 1 of them died. Does that sound like Chytrid?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

There are a number of things it could be... that slime could have been just that a mucous and peptide release from the glands of a badly stressed/sick frog... it could have been a skin that was supposed to be shed that day but wasn't due to the frogs being close to death.. Amphibians also typically begin to decompose rapidly and one of the things that can happen if they are in the water is that some of the skin becomes seperated and looks to be "shed"..

1) what supplements were you using, how old and how frequently were you using them 
2) did you ever get fecals done on them? 
3) did you collect or use materials from another frog tank (had exposure to other frogs)? 
4) were the tank temperatures under 75 F? 

If you have a local vet that will help you, you can send the frogs out for a necropsy and histopathology to determine if they were infected with chytrid (or take a swab and send it out for testing)... 

Ed


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## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

1. Ive been using Calcium Plus every feeding. I bought it back in June I believe so they probably should have been replaced by now. Just haven't gotten around to ordering a new package.
2. No. They morphed out about 4 weeks ago and I only began seeing problems in the past 2 weeks. Never really saw a reason to.
3. I think I reused some film canisters that were used previously in another tank. I think I just rinsed them out though, so not sterilized.
4. Yes. My temps usually drop to around 67 at night.


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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

Did you actually see them catch and swallow the flies, or is it possible they spit them out? Also, don't count on them eating springtails just because they are there.To me it sounds as if they never really started strong and gradually became too weak to do anything.Can you post a pic of their enclosure?


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## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

No that was the problem. They would catch and then spit out the flies. That led me to believe that the flies were too big for them to handle so I got springs. All of them morphed out about nickel sized. These were my pairs first clutch and I've had no previous experience breeding frogs, but from what people have told me that's a pretty good size. They were all very strong as tadpoles just to add.

Ill post pics ASAP.


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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

hukilausurfer said:


> No that was the problem. They would catch and then spit out the flies. That led me to believe that the flies were too big for them to handle so I got springs. All of them morphed out about nickel sized. These were my pairs first clutch and I've had no previous experience breeding frogs, but from what people have told me that's a pretty good size. They were all very strong as tadpoles just to add.
> 
> Ill post pics ASAP.


Don't take this the wrong way, I think you may be exaggerating the nickel size for newly morph Leucs. At that size the would have no problem eating melanos or maybe Hydei.I may be wrong about your size estimate, I will wait for your pics of the froglets to tell the story.From your above description it does sound as if my previous scenario was on target.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

I've had adult pumilio (almirante..) eat hydei... so the thought that a leucomelas metamorph is too small just doesn't compute.. 

Ed


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

My lamasi and vanzos love hydei


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## markpulawski (Nov 19, 2004)

Chytrid usually kills within 48 hours of the symptoms showing up, in my experience frogs usually act fairly normal up to that point including eating. Good luck as it a plague on our hobby but thankfully over the last few years has been kept mostly in check.


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## Brotherly Monkey (Jul 20, 2010)

markpulawski said:


> Chytrid usually kills within 48 hours of the symptoms showing up, in my experience frogs usually act fairly normal up to that point including eating. Good luck as it a plague on our hobby but thankfully over the last few years has been kept mostly in check.



How many people on the board do you think have had first hand experience with it?

I know I'm often surprised with how little it shows up in public discussion (making it seem like occurrences are rare), though that could be due to people being concerned about their rep, as well


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Brotherly Monkey said:


> How many people on the board do you think have had first hand experience with it?
> 
> I know I'm often surprised with how little it shows up in public discussion (making it seem like occurrences are rare), though that could be due to people being concerned about their rep, as well


There are a number of reasons why we don't tend to see a lot of mortality from chytrid.. one of the first is that it doesn't kill the frogs unless the temperatures are under 75 F. The second is that if the frogs have access to warmer temperatures they can thermoregulate and keep the chytrid from killing the frog... The third is while the adults are infected, pulling the eggs and incubating them should reduce transmission onto the next generation, particularly since people tend to rear tadpoles singly (it can only infect the mouthparts of tadpoles so it doesn't kill them), and chytrid tend to rapidly kill metamorphs if they are kept under 75 F... This in general could be a reason why we don't see it more frequently in hobbyist reared frogs.. now frogs that are aquired through a importer or reseller or pet store are going to be at greater risk since some of those businesses may not engage in sufficient disinfection between groups of frogs or may group frogs from disparate sources together.... 

Some thoughts,
Ed


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## Brotherly Monkey (Jul 20, 2010)

The only times I have came across it being mentioned (in a confirmed instance) here was in relation to imports, I believe


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## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

This is the size all five of them morphed out at.
Photo-0117.jpg | Flickr - Photo Sharing!


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## markpulawski (Nov 19, 2004)

Brotherly Monkey said:


> The only times I have came across it being mentioned (in a confirmed instance) here was in relation to imports, I believe


My only known instances, and there were several were all related to frogs imported from Europe, most of which died, including the first yellow Fants (now Summersi) to ever hit the states. The yellow Terribilis that is the basis for almost all in the US today were also European imports and tainted with Chytrid, luckily though I was able to spot it right away and with a 10 day Miconozal treatment save 5 out of the 8 frogs.


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## Brotherly Monkey (Jul 20, 2010)

markpulawski said:


> My only known instances, and there were several were all related to frogs imported from Europe, most of which died, including the first yellow Fants (now Summersi) to ever hit the states. The yellow Terribilis that is the basis for almost all in the US today were also European imports and tainted with Chytrid, luckily though I was able to spot it right away and with a 10 day Miconozal treatment save 5 out of the 8 frogs.


One of the instances I read about on here concerned a recently imported red eye (wc, I assume). The other is from one of the sticky's on the subject, and I think that concerned imported leucs (wc)

PS what ever happened to that research project that was collecting swabs from peoples collections, did they ever publish the results?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Brotherly Monkey said:


> One of the instances I read about on here concerned a recently imported red eye (wc, I assume). The other is from one of the sticky's on the subject, and I think that concerned imported leucs (wc)
> 
> PS what ever happened to that research project that was collecting swabs from peoples collections, did they ever publish the results?


If you go to google and type in the search string "Dendroboard, chytrid" it turns up over 2,500 references on it, in threads ranging from how long it can hang around to potential modes of transportation to how it kills going back to at least 2006.


The paper is still in production. 

Ed


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## Brotherly Monkey (Jul 20, 2010)

I'm aware of discussions on the subject, I'm more talking about people actually identifying active infections in their collections. They seem to have been kept to a minimum 

PS did you guys end up getting a good turn around on the swab kits you sent out?


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## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

I think I may have been a bit hasty in my assumptions that it was chytrid. Does anyone have another idea on what the problem was? The lone survivor of the group is actually doing great and eating well now.


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