# Uyama Pumilio



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

OK someone requested to see this particular pair so here they are -
these pics don't really do them justice, especially because of my digital camera that refuses to focus on any frog but also color-wise, so here are some observations:
bright blue on the hands, feet, legs, around the waist area, blending up the back, a little on the belly
peach on the legs
bright-ish green on the back
a little yellow on the belly
a little orange on the belly
orange/brownish spots/pattern on the back and legs

male:



















female:



















pair:

"turn out the lights please!" so you can see a little of the belly, male on the left female on the right:










he was looking at her and calling in this pic (but you can't see the throat sac cuz the pic was from above), she was busy with springtails:


----------



## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

nice frogs! they look like a cross between Uyama and colon


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Yeah that was a part i liked about them because isla colons are another one i like a lot, looking at them for a while in person though doesn't look that much like them. They're not CB though and those areas aren't contiguous just for argument's sake


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

So is anyone else keeping this morph?


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Here are a few shots of site specific Uyama River pumilio. The belly shot (specifically) hints that these are from a different local than the pair above.


Female














































And a male with belly shot.










Rich


----------



## jubjub47 (Sep 9, 2008)

The two sets of pics look much different. That belly shot is pretty sweet as well.


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Thanks Rich, yeah I sent you an email a while back to the address on your website asking your opinion but I guess it got sent to your junk mail. Would you think these are just from a different part of the river or a totally undiscovered morph? They have the characteristics I've only seen on Uyamas so far, like the combo of peach reticulations on the legs along with the bright bluish green on the backs. I just want to be sure on whether they would be OK to mix with other Uyamas since I never saw anyone with the same type of Uyama as each other, each source seems to be different


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Hi Chris, 
Yeh, must have got lost. I answer pretty much every email I get, sooner than later. Comcast bites it hard.
It's hard to say what makes people label pums exactly what they are all labeled. I know some Salt Creek Bastis were being labled "solarte" solely because they could fetch a better buck than the already established bastis at the time. Uyama River pumilio are one of the rarest morphs in the hobby. That may be a reason. If all the "uyamas" coming in look a bit different (and I have never seen ones in the hobby that look like mine) once again it becomes a guessing game. Without pics taken in nature (excepting Dr Urquhart's and Dr Summer's photos, which look exactly like mine) I have only one yardstick to judge what an Uyama River pumilio looks like.

Rich





ChrisK said:


> Thanks Rich, yeah I sent you an email a while back to the address on your website asking your opinion but I guess it got sent to your junk mail. Would you think these are just from a different part of the river or a totally undiscovered morph? They have the characteristics I've only seen on Uyamas so far, like the combo of peach reticulations on the legs along with the bright bluish green on the backs. I just want to be sure on whether they would be OK to mix with other Uyamas since I never saw anyone with the same type of Uyama as each other, each source seems to be different


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Thanks again Rich, I'll definitely keep them or their offspring separate from any site specific Uyamas then (which shouldn't be too hard lol), I saw JP mention he would be studying them down there so hopefully he can get pics/data from different sections/areas


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Hey Chris, 
If you can take a few more shots (very hard at times in-viv, I know...) I will pass along the pics to those who inquire about uyamas. I do get a few emails asking about them. Maybe I can find you a match , not in your collection. It would be good to get some "full" belly shots. The belly is really just as important, if not more so, than dorsal shots .

Rich


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

ChrisK said:


> Thanks again Rich, I'll definitely keep them or their offspring separate from any site specific Uyamas then (which shouldn't be too hard lol), I saw JP mention he would be studying them down there so hopefully he can get pics/data from different sections/areas


I'm basing my opinions off of what I've seen from Dr. Urquhart's, Dr. Summer's, and Rich's Uyama pumilio, but when I saw your pics, I was surprised that they were Uyamas because they had the opposite pattern of Uyamas that I knew of (black background with light spots whereas yours have a light background with dark spots). If I had to guess, I would say that they were odd Bastis, but then again, they don't quite fit that description either. They're certainly odd!

My hope/plan is to basically go from Almirante to Chiriqui Grande and catalog frogs along the way. I definitely want to go to Uyama and Robalo as well as a few of the other riverine morphs and take tons of pictures. It's tiring to see the same 3 or 4 pictures used over and over as the pictures for those morphs (with how variable these frogs are through the rest of their range, I would expect the same from these). I'd like to document the variability of morphs especially (yours, for example, might be from the fringe of the population whereas the rest are from around the river). We'll see. Hopefully I'll get a number of the grants I'm applying to which will help aid that. 

Otherwise, I'm taking donations, lol!


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Rich Frye said:


> Hey Chris,
> If you can take a few more shots (very hard at times in-viv, I know...) I will pass along the pics to those who inquire about uyamas. I do get a few emails asking about them. Maybe I can find you a match , not in your collection. It would be good to get some "full" belly shots. The belly is really just as important, if not more so, than dorsal shots .
> 
> Rich


Yeah definitely, just need to catch them at the right time - the male will usually make his rounds around the glass calling before the lights go on but never at exactly the same times, otherwise it's hit or miss getting a belly shot with them and thanks again - 



MonarchzMan said:


> I'm basing my opinions off of what I've seen from Dr. Urquhart's, Dr. Summer's, and Rich's Uyama pumilio, but when I saw your pics, I was surprised that they were Uyamas because they had the opposite pattern of Uyamas that I knew of (black background with light spots whereas yours have a light background with dark spots). If I had to guess, I would say that they were odd Bastis, but then again, they don't quite fit that description either. They're certainly odd!


I know, the reason I still think they're some type of Uyama or from really close is the combination of the peach on the legs with bright blue-green on the backs, basically the same colors on the same parts of the bodies as other Uyamas but just reticulated differently. I didn't see that type of color combination on those body parts in any other morph - one that looks a little more like the reticulations on mine is the last pic on this page: www.gifkikkers.be/forum2/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=4001


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

Interesting indeed. And it's certainly possible. We just don't know enough at all about that morph (or most of the riverine morphs, for that matter). I wish they showed the belly on that one. As I understand it, they have that belly that is rather variable like what Rich showed. Makes me all the more eager to get down there and document them a bit more, lol.


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

ChrisK said:


> ... one that looks a little more like the reticulations on mine is the last pic on this page: www.gifkikkers.be/forum2/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=4001


One thing we have to remember when it comes to IDing pums (or any dart) is that the lighting used (or available during the shot) has a lot to do with what the pics' coloration looks like. I can take one of my Uyams Rivers and under tha right lighting conditions get them to look like they have a blue body much as that last Uyama River has. The iridescence tend to make different sheens and highlights , even what seems to be an almost predominant body color stand out when those colors may not be a great representation of what the true/natural colors are in-fact.
What may be an even more accurate indicator of whether the ones I work with and the ones you have are closely related would be body size. I know the only way (main way really) to tell the difference between my Darklands and the Caucheros in the hobby now is the fact that every adult Cauchero I have received info on is much larger than any adult Darklands I have. How big are yours Chris?

Rich


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

They're easily noticeably bigger than my Cayo de Aguas, maybe almost Basti size or a little smaller.
Just for timeliness here's a belly shot of the male, if anything their bellies are almost identical and there might be a little more black spotting on the lower belly than upper, I might be able to get more later but I needed to spray and dump ff's in just to get him to squeeze out a little for this one - they're brom-bound today since they seem to sense that I want pics and are determined to thwart my efforts at all costs haha:


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

My understanding for Uyamas (and Robalos for that matter) is that the pattern seen on the dorsal surface is the basically same on the ventral surface. With how much white is on the belly of yours, I would be surprised if they were Uyamas. That much white looks more to me like a Basti. 3 months and I'll get these questions answered, lol.


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Yeah if they were CB then I would actually think they were hybrids but they're imports. There's a little more black spotting on the lower bellies and i thought they were a little like Robalo bellies, but if these are bastis then i got the most outrageous bastis on the board lol!


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

ChrisK said:


> but if these are bastis then i got the most outrageous bastis on the board lol!


No argument there, lol. They don't quite fit anything that I know of which makes them all the more interesting.


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

OK was able to get female belly shot, still can't get the lower belly though!










Here's a bit of a blurry one of her but it shows some of the coloration:


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Well, for the last couple of days the male has cut down his calling 90-95% and they been hanging out next to each other under some leaf litter.....


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

I've seen a lot of robalo's, but this looks like a hybrid. 

Are you shure that they are imported??? and not kept in captivity for a while? and you have now some hybrids from the imported animals with cb animals of a different species?


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

peter said:


> I've seen a lot of robalo's, but this looks like a hybrid.


Hi Peter, 
Just curious where you have seen a lot of Robalos. In Panama or captivity?
Chris is calling these frogs uyamas. Which are different than Robalos.

Rich


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

in captivity


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

if i knew how to post some picture i did but i don't know how.


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

no it does not work


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

peter said:


> no it does not work


upload the photos to a hosting site like photobucket, then below your photos there will be image code choices you can copy. copy the one that has







after completely and paste the code in your post and include the







after


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

There are a few decent Robalo pics around. But, being that it is pretty much the rarest (positively IDed) pumilio morph in captivity the amount of available good reference shots are not that abundant, unless a bunch have been smuggled in of late.


For reference.
An Uyama River;









A Robalo;


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

ChrisK said:


> upload the photos to a hosting site like photobucket, then below your photos there will be image code choices you can copy. copy the one that has
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Or, if the photos are on a site, link them.

Rich


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

peter said:


> I've seen a lot of robalo's, but this looks like a hybrid.
> 
> Are you shure that they are imported??? and not kept in captivity for a while? and you have now some hybrids from the imported animals with cb animals of a different species?


i would think that would be a possibility except that i found others with the same morph from different import years. if they were cb hybrids, that pair producing them would need to be pretty prolific -


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Most likely just some from another area not collect from all the time. The guessing games needed to be played with these.
Good deal finding similar looking ones though.

Rich


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Yeah exactly, probably some rio area close to there that's not really documented. i'm still eager to see peter's captive robalo pics though.........................


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

ChrisK said:


> Yeah exactly, probably some rio area close to there that's not really documented. i'm still eager to see peter's captive robalo pics though.........................


I think Peter is from the EU. And in that case there are a few more pics floating around over there of course. But still the rarest morph I know of. I'm always interested in new pics also.

Rich


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

First,
Yes i'm from the EU (thats why my englisch is not that good  )

For references about robalo's: Kleurvarianten O. pumilio 3
I don't know if this is a good reference because it is not the same as in this topic is stated.









Not my own picture.


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Thanks Peter. I belive those are pics taken in the wild though. Lighting is very important to get a realistic view of what they both actually look like. I see many pics of both Uyams River and Robalos that I have to guess are a little more blue looking than in nature. They both do have blue iridescence, but not really like that striking blue that shows in some pics.
The main difference I have noticed is that Uyama River have a more brownish base and Robalos have a blacker base.
The following pics are representative;

Captive bred Robalo froglets;



















Captive bred Uyama River froglets;



















Adult WC , but now in captivity Robalo female;













































Robalos WC males, in captivity;




































Female Uyama River in C.;































































And, a male Uyama River;










Rich


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Those froglets are f-ing awesome Rich


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

Hi
First, beautiful frogs/pictures.
I see what you mean with the color difference, the robalo's are indeed more black, and de river's have more brownisch legs.

what about these:


















different frogs


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Thanks Peter. They are cool frogs , and fairly bold.
Where you asking ("what about these") about an ID? 

Rich



peter said:


> Hi
> First, beautiful frogs/pictures.
> I see what you mean with the color difference, the robalo's are indeed more black, and de river's have more brownisch legs.
> 
> ...


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

Hi, sorry, i was interested what you upion was about these frogs and the species they are.

robalo of uyama's, i have more pictures but it is not easy to upload them to photobucket and that to here.


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

If you need help loading the Photobucket stuff I'll try to help Peter. I am about as big a computer illiterate as possible and I have no troubles. 
I alway say that there is much more to IDing pumilio than a simple picture. Size is important along with activity and a few other factors. 
That being said, with the top picture, it looks more like a Robalo than Uyama River. Robalos tend to also have more white in the bodies , along with the black vs. brownish of the Uyama river.

Rich




peter said:


> Hi, sorry, i was interested what you upion was about these frogs and the species they are.
> 
> robalo of uyama's, i have more pictures but it is not easy to upload them to photobucket and that to here.


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

You guys are making me crazy!


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

How so?

"The message you have entered is too short" What??


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Rich Frye said:


> How so?


Well, you might as well be parading bikini pics of Salma Hayek and Lucy Liu in front of me haha


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

2 more pictures, not the best quality



















what are these? robalo or uyama


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

I really can't tell. Too many variables.

Rich



peter said:


> 2 more pictures, not the best quality
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

Rich Frye said:


> I really can't tell. Too many variables.
> 
> Rich


Thats why i have problems with naming the species of the frogs i've seen. 
But do you need more info to say what species it is.


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Without getting back into a fifty page rant (other's ranting as well , from both sides) I can only say that if we did not pick the pumilio up off the floor, or know and trust the person who did, there is little way of IDing with certainty "best guess" pumilio. Too many morphs look way too similar to too many other morphs. I can say that the frogs I have labeled , I do so with certainty.
How did these come into your possession? Or are they someone elses?

Rich


----------



## peter (Jul 2, 2008)

these came from other breeders in europe.
i don't know the exact place, because it is really difficult to import pumilio's from the wild into europe, only illigal frogs are imported the last years i think.

so these have to be here a copple of years, and are captive bred.

i bougth them all as O. pumilio robalo


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Well, that is unfortunate on a few levels.
Without the spcific info we just don't know. Case in point. A couple years ago I contacted Dendrobase, a somewhat informative cite based in the EU. I offered site specific pictures of both Uyama River and Robalo pumilio. Thye said they would love to use my pics , but wanted to combine the two morph pics as one species , as , they said, they are one in the same morph. They were , and are quite wrong, and I retracted the offer of usage.

Rich


----------



## Axlz1 (Apr 28, 2009)

Hey Chris, I am a uni student and I am going to do a project about O. pumilio.

May I refer to your article and photos because this morph is very interesting.


And just wondering how many known Uyama variations are there


Thank you very much


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Axlz1 said:


> Hey Chris, I am a uni student and I am going to do a project about O. pumilio.
> 
> May I refer to your article and photos because this morph is very interesting.
> 
> ...


yeah sure, can probably take some better pics soon and you also might want to contact rich frye since he has site specific ones and some great pics - pm me if you want his contact info


----------



## uncle tom (Mar 15, 2007)

Rich Frye said:


> Well, that is unfortunate on a few levels.
> Without the spcific info we just don't know. Case in point. A couple years ago I contacted Dendrobase, a somewhat informative cite based in the EU. I offered site specific pictures of both Uyama River and Robalo pumilio. Thye said they would love to use my pics , but wanted to combine the two morph pics as one species , as , they said, they are one in the same morph. They were , and are quite wrong, and I retracted the offer of usage.
> 
> Rich


Hi Rich,

it is still my opinion that Róbalos and Uyamas are only one morph. I remember the discussion some years ago. But before I explain my point of view another time (probably in vain) maybe two biological definitions to have the same basis to discuss:

1. A morph is a population, subpopulation or part of both that differ „clearly“ in morphological, ecological or even behaviour character from other conspecific animals in a different geografical area. 


2. In biology, a cline is a gradual change of phenotype (trait, character or feature) in a species or subspecies over a geographical area.

In my opinion the Uyama morph is only a cline of the so (first) named Robalo Morph. First some results of our work (Pröhl work-group of the University of Hannover) with O. pumilio over 10 years in Panama. I visited the area between the Río La Gloria and the Quebrada Cascaje (near the Uyama river) more than 20 times for field research for at all more than 4 months. The Population of black colored frogs with white, cream, or light-blue to light-green pattern of points and lines range from the La Gloria westwards to the Quebrada Cascaje. In this range you could not find clearly different colored frogs (like red, yellow, blue or green). All frogs display the above described coloration. But east from the La Gloria and west of the Quebrada Cascaje the coloration change clearly: east the yellow/black Guarumo-morph and west the red Almirante-morph. All frogs between La Gloria and Cascaje are genetically similar and not differ in call parameters than in snout-vent-length (Rich if you have other significally results of research please let me know, we are highly interested). In my opinion they are a group of organisms capable of interbreeding and producing fertile offspring. This one big population (no evident geographical, morphological or behavioral boarders) differ only slightly in coloration. The so called Uyama frogs are referred as frogs with yellow-brown legs with dark brown markings as the Róbalos display black and white patterned legs. Also most people think that Róbalos have more white to cream pattern while Uyamas display light-green or light blue pattern on a dark brown or black underground. But all this colorations could be found at every locality like Río La Gloria, Río Róbalo, Río Uyama, the Quebrada Cascaje and many locations inbetween! The only graduate character change that I agree is the change of coloration of the legs. But it's only a cline. More to the east you find more frogs with black coloration of the legs, more westward in direction of Almirante you find more frogs with brown legs. But like I said there are also frogs colored like at the other end of the geographical range and other way round. At the western end of the range is a small interbreeding zone between the Robalo and the Almirante morph where you could find also Robalos with yellow to orange stripes. But at the eastern boarder of the morph at the Río La Gloria there is a very hard cut of the morph. On the eastern bank lives a population of the Guarumo morph that differs clearly in colouration. There you find seldom rarely frogs with a coloration between both morphs. 

Rich it makes sense to distinguish lines of frogs in terraria by locality if you want disminuish interbreeding of genetically different subpopulations or if you want to breed pure clinal variation. But in this case you need the true locality! You can't decide that by a foto! But in biologcal sense there is no purpose to decide a cline with only little characters as two different morphs. 

That is my opinion and Rich I think much more well-founded as your opinion which says: “they are different because they came from different localities and so they are two morphs”

Here some fotos taken in the Uyama area
http://www.dendrobase.de/fotos/OophagaPumilio/OophagaPumilio090600_to.jpg
http://www.dendrobase.de/fotos/OophagaPumilio/OophagaPumilio106160_cascaje_to.jpg

and from the La Gloria (Róbalo area)
http://www.dendrobase.de/fotos/OophagaPumilio/OophagaPumilio108160_RioLaGloria_to.jpg
http://www.dendrobase.de/fotos/Ooph...gaPumilio/OophagaPumilio114160_cascaje_to.jpg
http://www.dendrobase.de/fotos/OophagaPumilio/OophagaPumilio112800_cascaje_to.jpg


----------



## rjmarchisi (Feb 16, 2004)

Rich is banned so you are talking to yourself.


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

uncle tom, that's correct Rich isn't on here any more so he won't be answering you - did you find any frogs in those areas with the patterns of my frogs which are on the first and second page of this thread?


----------



## uncle tom (Mar 15, 2007)

Hi Chris
no I never found frogs that looks like yours in that area. But I found frogs that looks like yours in the interbreeding zone between Guarumo and Guabo. Your frogs could be Guarumos or also Guabos, or something inbetween. But only by picture it is impossible to clear the precise origin. But I think you could rule out a origin from the Róbalo/Uyama area.

Best Regards from Germany


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Thanks, do you know of a link that shows Guabo frogs? I thought mine had characteristics only found in Uyama type frogs (leg coloration) etc, I know what Guarumos look like but I don't think I saw any Guabos yet, thanks again -


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

uncle tom said:


> it is still my opinion that Róbalos and Uyamas are only one morph. I remember the discussion some years ago. But before I explain my point of view another time (probably in vain) maybe two biological definitions to have the same basis to discuss:


Hey Tom,

I think that I'd disagree on this. I'm doing some GIS work on the Bocas archipelago and there is a significant amount of fragmentation in and around those areas (and that's based on 1999 data; I imagine it's worse now), and the two rivers are a good distance away from one another (~12 km as the toucan flies), and given that we see fairly distinct populations in shorter distances (e.g. Popa North and Popa South, Bastimentos Cemetery and Red Frog Beach, Cerro Brujo and Cauchero, etc), I think that it would be safe to say that the populations are distinct from one another.

Now, that's not to say, though that there is no gradient between them (I'd expect that, just like with Isla Colon or Popa). It certainly is a gray area because I think that we're really dealing with a ring species of sorts as opposed to different distinct populations, so for the mainland, it comes to the point of "at what point and at what distance do we say populations are different?" All of these frogs can interbreed, after all. You could take the Changuinola morph and the Chiriqui Grande morph and still get viable offspring out of it. So at what point would you call a population distinct? Personally, I'd say that based on fragmentation, distance, and barriers like a river, the two would be separate populations.


----------



## alluringeli (Apr 20, 2009)

wow those are some beautiful frogs....


----------



## tangelo (Oct 20, 2007)

I have posted this frog before but this is a frog that everyone I have talked with including Rich agrees it is a true Uyama. Some people think its a robalo but I lean more towards Uyama. Sorry for the blurry pic, very shy frog...


----------



## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

Good discussion

I'll try and snap a pic of the one 'suspected female' ...lone Guaramo/Uyama I have.

S


----------



## bgcabot (Oct 19, 2008)

Indeed, this is an interesting discussion; beautiful frogs! Not to hijack here, but what is the status of the Uyamas and Robalos in the hobby?


----------



## tangelo (Oct 20, 2007)

Rich frye has told me that they are the rarest morphs of pumilio in the hobby, im sure there are others right up there in rarity but they are VERY rare for sure... I know more people in the states have to have them but besides Rich I have not seen anyone else with the morph I have... I would love to see some though


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

tangelo said:


> I have posted this frog before but this is a frog that everyone I have talked with including Rich agrees it is a true Uyama. Some people think its a robalo but I lean more towards Uyama. Sorry for the blurry pic, very shy frog...


I would definitely agree also


----------



## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

my contribution. From Aaron.


----------



## bgcabot (Oct 19, 2008)

sports_doc said:


> my contribution. From Aaron.


Beautiful! I thought they tended to be black with a bluish-greenish coloration, with some brownish in the hind legs. Apparently they have a lot of variation, is that a typical pattern/coloration?


----------



## David M. Frye DVM (Feb 20, 2009)

tangelo said:


> I have posted this frog before but this is a frog that everyone I have talked with including Rich agrees it is a true Uyama. Some people think its a robalo but I lean more towards Uyama. Sorry for the blurry pic, very shy frog...


My brother does not/can not ID pums via pics. Without specific site data there is no possible way of knowing where a pum comes from. He has said so many times. It is impossible to ID a pumilio strictly and accurately via pictures.


Thanks


----------



## snooknfrogs (Sep 25, 2009)

I know this hasn't been brought up in awhile but....

Chris,

Did you ever get a positive ID on your frogs? Any success breeding? 

JP


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Yeah they're Uyamas, that one Shawn posted is now paired up with my male, they're breeding, and looks like Uyamas are the most variable pumilio morph: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...pumilio-detail-pic-heavy.html?highlight=uyama


----------



## snooknfrogs (Sep 25, 2009)

Are they the same morph as the Robalo morph as was the speculation? or are they totally different?

JP


----------



## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

I would definitely say they're different unless I saw definite proof that they were the same morph


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

I would say that they are different. I haven't had a chance to look at the continuum between the two morphs, but they are around 10 miles apart, which I would say is awfully far to consider them the same. Just to give perspective, the Popa North and Popa South populations are much less than 10 miles apart; same with the Bastimentos and Salt Creek morphs.


----------



## snooknfrogs (Sep 25, 2009)

Are they seperated by a river system or some sort of mountainous terrain? I thought that some pumilio morphs are found in ares with ranges greater than 10 miles???

JP


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

The terrain along the coast is rather mountainous. We went from sea level 600 feet in a horizontal length of maybe 200-300 feet. Not only that, but where we found Uyamas and Robalos, there were several sizeable rivers between the two populations.

Some populations are in areas with large ranges (the typical "blue jeans" morph, for example), but there are slight changes in the Uyamas and Robalos (for example, the Uyamas have brown legs, whereas the Robalos don't or have dilute brown).


----------

