# I need an easy straight forward idiot proof FF recipe



## SushiRice (Jan 3, 2013)

Ok I been attempting to make FF cultures for weeks now and they always crash before producing any larva. I'm just very confused when it comes to how much to mix because for example, most recipes are usually laid out like this:

1/2 cup of this
1/4 cup of that
1/2 cup of these

and then they say "50/50 mix of water vinegar." OK? So I mix them up and I have no idea how much water to use so I just do 1/2 cup of water and vinegar and mix it up and when I throw in FF they never reproduce. I even tried changing up the amount of water and vinegar

Or even worse, 6 parts this, 2 parts that, 1 part of this and that. I can never understand what they're talking about. All I need is someone tell tell me a simple recipe in exact measurements of ingredients including the water and vinegar. If possible I'd like to use less 4 forms of dry ingredients or less. I already feel dumb as it is for asking how to do this.


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## Sticky Fingers (Sep 28, 2011)

I use Flymeat.com media and it works great. Its super simple 1/3 cup media, 1/2 cup hot water, let it cool, add yeast then flies and your good.


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## JPccusa (Mar 10, 2009)

I use Repashy Superfly. It may cost more than homemade recipes (does it?) but I like the peace of mind. Here is a long read about the product: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/67766-repashy-superfly.html

If you still want to do a homemade media, check this sticky: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/157354-popular-helpful-food-feeding-threads.html


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## oddlot (Jun 28, 2010)

Don't feel dumb,that is how you learn.Here is a link for the sticky in the feeder section.There are recipes and all kinds of good info.Different things work differently for different people.Variables include,temps and humidity in your house.I personally don't use vinegar.It stinks and doesn't smell better as the culture ages.

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/157354-popular-helpful-food-feeding-threads.html

Edit: Beat me to the link JP


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Sticky Fingers said:


> I use Flymeat.com media and it works great. Its super simple 1/3 cup media, 1/2 cup hot water, let it cool, add yeast then flies and your good.


That's not a recipe. OP wants to start from scratch.
OP, "part" means ANY MEASUREMENT YOU WANT IT TO. The key is, they must all the same. If "one part" is going to be a cup, then it must always be a cup throughout the recipe this time. If you decide that "part" is going to be a teaspoon, you will make a successful, though extremely tiny culture. If you decide that "part" means one gallon, they you will make a successful, though extremely large culture.
People use "part" so that you can easily adjust the recipe to however much you need.
I like variations of Carolina recipe. I find this thread to be very helpful in starting beginners from scratch. http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/62277-guide-making-ff-cultures.html
There are a lot of recipes out there. You want to start with a Carolina formula for guaranteed success. You can play with other formulas from there.
You should try SOMEBODY'S premix dry first, so you have something to compare your results to.
Hope it helps.


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## Jeremy M (Oct 19, 2012)

I can't use a specific recipe as I just go by intuition (potato flakes, warm water, a dash of vinegar and honey) but I can give you a couple of tips:
1) in my experience, anywhere near half vinegar is way too much. Others may have had different results, but I find it unnecessary, and some flies seem deterred by the vinegar. A little bit goes a long way, it's pretty potent stuff. Personally, I go by taste, and if it tastes just like vinegar I've used too much. I like to have just a hint of sweetness from the honey. All strictly un-scientific, I know, but it works for me.
2) The "two parts x, three parts b" is actually very simple and doesn't require any measuring, only counting. It means just what it sounds like. Pick one sized measuring implement and don't switch this out for any of your ingredients. Actual size is irrelevant except in finding the total volume of your finished recipe by adding them up (if your measuring device was one cup and the recipe was "two parts water, one part sugar" the total would be three cups.) A tablespoon would probably be good for your use. Just scoop however many scoops of what the given number is, mix those all together and you're good.


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## Sticky Fingers (Sep 28, 2011)

My bad Doug. I didnt even pay attention to that. 

Its just super easy...


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## Reef_Haven (Jan 19, 2011)

SushiRice,
It would be helpful it you provide the recipe you were using. Maybe someone can point out your problem. Most recipes call for brewers yeast, and many people are confused about the difference between brewers yeast and active bakers yeast.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Jeremy M said:


> I can't use a specific recipe as I just go by intuition (potato flakes, warm water, a dash of vinegar and honey) but I can give you a couple of tips:
> 1) in my experience, anywhere near half vinegar is way too much. Others may have had different results, but I find it unnecessary, and some flies seem deterred by the vinegar. A little bit goes a long way, it's pretty potent stuff. Personally, I go by taste, and if it tastes just like vinegar I've used too much. I like to have just a hint of sweetness from the honey. All strictly un-scientific, I know, but it works for me.
> 2) The "two parts x, three parts b" is actually very simple and doesn't require any measuring, only counting. It means just what it sounds like. Pick one sized measuring implement and don't switch this out for any of your ingredients. Actual size is irrelevant except in finding the total volume of your finished recipe by adding them up (if your measuring device was one cup and the recipe was "two parts water, one part sugar" the total would be three cups.) A tablespoon would probably be good for your use. Just scoop however many scoops of what the given number is, mix those all together and you're good.


You are missing a good protein. Potato by itself is a pretty poor protein. Brewer's yeast is generally added for this. Your production would go up quite a bit with the addition of some protein. Depending on what your "dash" of honey is, it's probably not nearly enough to really boost production. It's also more expensive than you really need. Powdered sugar is a much cheaper substitution.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Sticky Fingers said:


> My bad Doug. I didnt even pay attention to that.
> 
> Its just super easy...


Actually, I agree. Everyone should start with one of the prepackaged dry mixes. 
Experiment with your own recipe while you still have some of the store bought mix. Run them side by side for a bit. Then you have something to compare your production to. Plus, if you really mess up your recipe, you have good cultures on the side, to feed your frogs with.
Love the Repashy. I used to use the Ed's Fly Meat many years ago and found it good, too, but the Repashy products seem to put more thought into nutrition. Both of them run upper end as far as price goes. If I'm going to pay an upper end price, I'm going all out and using the Repashy. Even any of the less expensive premixes would be good to start with.


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## Boondoggle (Dec 9, 2007)

SushiRice said:


> ...All I need is someone tell tell me a simple recipe in exact measurements of ingredients including the water and vinegar....


The problem with that request is even if you get a recipe like that its quite likely you will have to tweak it. The dry to wet mix ratio is very very specific to your conditions. Media, how you store your cultures, powder vs. flakes, temperature, humidity, choice of fly substrate, even the flies themselves can effect the necessary ratio. That ratio can also greatly effect production. Remember you will be using a fly culture for around a month and, while there's some room for error, it's easy to end up with a dried out culture (which is more likely to get moldy) or a soupy culture (which can destroy whatever substrate you use and drown flies) by the end of a few weeks. It takes some trial and error and you only know your results after a month.

It sounds like you are trying to save some money but If possible I say bite the bullet and order some mix from a sponsor. I know others have had success but I have yet to have a homemade culture produce better than Repashy or Josh's. Even when I've split homemade and purchased media 50/50 I got better results than homemade alone. I currently use Repashy.


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## rizacks (Jan 16, 2014)

I've been eyeballing mine with good results, the bulk of it is potato flakes, i then throw in a bunch of brewers yeast (maybe 10-30% of the potato flake amount)

dump in a bunch of sugar, a big splash of vinegar, some fruit juice and then water until i get an applesauce consistancy.

If i remember, I usually sprinkle a few pinches of baking yeast on top.


Aside from most of it being potato flake, i dont really measure anything. 


I think one of the biggest problems is people assuming fly substrate is some type of wizard brew that is tricky to make.


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## SushiRice (Jan 3, 2013)

First I want to say how much I love how supportive this forum is.
Ok I think I am understanding a lot more. I usually buy the premixed media, but there are times where I can't keep constantly buying or waiting for it. That is why I'm asking for help haha. It seems like the only way for me to get a successful culture is if I get lucky. 

Here's what I use:
-Potato flakes
-Honey
-Sugar
-Vinegar
-Water
-Pinch of brewer's yeast

I just can never get the measurements right. I actually had better results putting a slice of mango in a jar and tossing in some D. hydei for an emergency culture. It exploded with flies. I'm going to try another recipe from that link since I have a better understanding. Wish me luck. I will post my measurements on here before I start mixing it up you guys can tell me if it's good or not and I'll stick to it if it creates and flies.


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## Jeremy M (Oct 19, 2012)

Pumilo said:


> You are missing a good protein. Potato by itself is a pretty poor protein. Brewer's yeast is generally added for this. Your production would go up quite a bit with the addition of some protein. Depending on what your "dash" of honey is, it's probably not nearly enough to really boost production. It's also more expensive than you really need. Powdered sugar is a much cheaper substitution.


thanks for that, though I should mention that I don't use this recipe for frogs, and those things that I do feed FFs to (geckos, fish etc), I don't use as a staple or a large portion of the diet. I'm not sure why, but whenever I have used yeast in the past, production is very, very low. My best guess is maybe I don't have enough ventilation and they get affected by a simple co2 buildup. I know it probably won't do much of anything and that the sugar content would likely reverse this, but I stand by honey's antibacterial properties (ever since it kept me from getting an infection on that cut while backpacking  ) and since I don't want a ton of media, cultures or flies a couple teaspoons doesn't hurt the wallet (especially when buying it raw & locally-sourced in huge metal cans from the farmer's market).
I know that my cultures could be producing a lot better (faster) than they do, but since I don't go through huge numbers and it's actually easier to manage with a lower yield, it works for me. It's just how I do it, and I probably wouldn't suggest others do it the same way.


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## Reef_Haven (Jan 19, 2011)

SushiRice said:


> Here's what I use:
> -Potato flakes
> -Honey
> -Sugar
> ...


A pinch of brewer's yeast won't do. Start with the basic recipe and then experiment from there.
Doug already covered "parts" with you, so I won't go thru that again.

6 parts potato flakes
1 part powdered sugar (confectioners sugar)
1 part brewer's yeast

You don't need 50% vinegar, 10% should be fine, many people don't use any at all. Use very hot water or microwave the mixture.
You'll probably have better results if you can mix in a little banana as well. They are fruit flies after all, but again not required.
You'll have faster fly production if you sprinkle some active bakers yeast on top of the culture before adding your excelsior or coffee filters. Again it is important you understand the difference between baker's yeast and brewer's yeast. Baker's yeast is usually tiny granules, brewer's yeast is usually a powder. I add about 100 tiny granuals of baker's yeast on top of each culture.
Your mixture should be thick enough you can turn the culture upside down without any food sliding down, a little stiffer than mashed potatoes.


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## Dart_Man (Mar 23, 2013)

Whatever direction you go with (either homemade media or buying a bag of mix) I would always experiment with the variables. In my case, I use repashy or neherp media, and have had varying results with cultures being successful or crashing before production. I found the main variable that would effect my success rate was the amount of water I added. So now every time I make cultures (every 7-14 days) I always make 2 or 3 cultures labeling them wet, mid, dry....thus getting a good handle on how the wetness of the media will effect your results. Once you have a better handle on how this effects your cultures, you can start leaning on your new findings. Everyone has a slightly different outcome with their cultures, so mess around with all the variables, and make more than enough cultures knowing you may lose a few here and there. 

Just for reference, here is my very simple yet effective recipe:

1/2 cup water
1/3 cup media
- mix until consistency is like apple sauce (I like that comparison!) with 1 being less watery, and 1 being slightly more wet. Add water or media as necessary to help reach proper consistency. This will take a few minutes as the media takes a while to absorb the water fully. Set one cultures down, mix the next, and the next, come back to culture 1 and mix all again to check consistency. Repeat as necessary until consistency seems stable.

2 large pinches of bakers yeast (also from neherp)
- do not mix yeast in, leave on surface. 

Add a baseball sized ball of excelsior and pull apart once inside the culture to create more surface area. Slightly push into media.

Flies.....I always use a fresh producing culture! This is important. Do NOT use an old crusty culture to get flies from.....or one that isnt producing yet. 14-21 days is a perfect time to take from them as long as you can tell it has 'popped' already and looks healthy. I use about 50-100 flies when pouring them in. 

Throw the lid on, label it for dates and different variables that may differ (wetness , yeast etc) and leave it on a shelf for about 2 weeks. Mine are on a shelf that does get light, I hear darkness is ok too, just havent tried it myself.

Major thing to look out for....Mites!! Mites gave me an issue and I needed to get rid of all my cultures and start fresh. This will also lead to cultures to not produce. Make sure your cultures are mite free, ESPECIALLY the culture you are taking flies from. A good mite paper or mite spray is something I recommend having on hand. If you look close, you can see mites if they are present. Old cultures are mite magnets, so throw away ones that have been around too long. Do NOT ever stack cultures either...in fact, I dont even let my cultures contact each other......just had to make sure I mentioned that as it could be an easy fix and will stop cultures from being successful without question. 

This has worked very well for me for over a year. I would get the media mixed , instead of making your own. At least for now until you are having less fly production issues. Just go to nerherp, or something similar, and get one of the fly culture kits (25 is a good amount). It has everything you need. They are not too expensive at all. 

Hope this helps, questions welcomed of course! Good luck


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Personally, I hate vinegar cultures, and found them troublesome in the past. I prefer to include methyl paraben in my dry mix, and skip the vinegar.


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## Dendrobait (May 29, 2005)

Here is the recipe I use. I think this is pretty near idiot proof.

potato flakes

brewers yeast(add in maybe 1/5 or so the amt of the potato flakes)

Mix these dry...dump into culture jar. http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/95672-sphagetti-sauce-jars-ffs-newbies-formula.html


fruit juice(I use Kerns Nectar with great results-minute maid works well...anything with lots of sugar and fruit concentrate). Add enough of this to liquify media. Swirl around until you see everything getting fairly saturated. You actually want about 1/2 an inch additional of fruit juice on top of the media at this point since the flakes near the bottom frequently take their sweet time absorbing liquid. I have used 50/50 fruit juice and vinegar, straight fruitjuice works great-most contain citric acid and similar to drop the ph to increase shelf life. 



Pop in microwave for about a minute(it goes without saying, skip this step if you are using a plastic culture container!). Remove and check consistency. You want it like applesauce(which is a nice addition to the recipe, btw!) or [porridge, not really runny but not super firm. If it is still runny either add a spoon more dry mix or stick in microwave for another 40 seconds. If too dry add more fruit juice.

Add your excelsior. Let cool(or stick in freezer for a couple minutes) add fruitflies.


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