# Lost 2 Patricias Suddenly



## chinoanoah (Mar 9, 2009)

This morning I found my two patricias dead in their QT set up. Tub with wet paper towels, + creeping fig + a petri dish with a portobello mushroom + spring tails.

Any ideas as to why they would have died?

They were eating and hoppin around yesterday.


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## JL-Exotics (Nov 10, 2005)

if your mushroom was rotting it could displace the O2 in a small tightly sealed space. 

Sorry for your loss.


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## chinoanoah (Mar 9, 2009)

The seller and I have been pointing to the mushroom as well. Are they unsafe to use in QT?


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## alex111683 (Sep 11, 2010)

Very sorry for your loss. I do mushrooms in my QT too but I make small holes around the bottom with a hot paper clip so the heavier gas can escape and along with a few holes on the top for fresh air.

What were your temperatures last night?


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## chinoanoah (Mar 9, 2009)

Stable. 70-74. Rain storm, so it didn't get cold by any means.


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## JL-Exotics (Nov 10, 2005)

without adequate ventilation, any piece of rotting fruit or mushroom can cause a build-up of decomposition gas. A little ventilation is a good thing.


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## Boondoggle (Dec 9, 2007)

Had the container been thoroughly rinsed after disinfection? How long had they been in there? Was there any ventilation? How large were the frogs? How big was the mushroom? How big was the QT tank?


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## chinoanoah (Mar 9, 2009)

Boondoggle said:


> Had the container been thoroughly rinsed after disinfection? How long had they been in there? Was there any ventilation? How large were the frogs? How big was the mushroom? How big was the QT tank?


It was a brand new Zip loc brand 10 cup container










Been in there for about a month.

Small holes poked in it. But I also opened and fed every day.

The piece of mushroom was a chunk about the size of the lid of a coke can.

Frogs are about 1" each.

QT container was 2.3L (10 cups)


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## JL-Exotics (Nov 10, 2005)

I'm betting on the mushroom. Especially with a chunk that big. We thinly slice our mushroom when feeding springtail cultures to prevent gassing them. Bigger chunks will start to rot and quickly displace the oxygen.

luckily for us, we learned that lesson with springtails and not frogs... sorry again. 

I would suggest that for a QT container that small a feeding station wouldn't be necessary.


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## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

chinoanoah said:


> It was a brand new Zip loc brand 10 cup container
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My minimum standard size that I think is more humane for a three-month period is a 5-gallon tank. 
I also agree that the mushroom likely did it. My springs can pass out when they are breaking down similar objects like that, even within hours of putting it in. Also, was the container getting light? Apparently, plants give off CO2 when they have no light, not oxygen, which would further encourage asphixation. 
In the future, you could try putting ventilation holes in the bottom as well to encourage airflow.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

sounds like if you are feeding your spring cultures mushrooms, you need to ensure their is some ventilation. Good to know.


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## JL-Exotics (Nov 10, 2005)

varanoid said:


> sounds like if you are feeding your spring cultures mushrooms, you need to ensure their is some ventilation. Good to know.


If you thinly slice/chop your mushrooms and take care not to put too much in at a time there is no need for ventilation in the cultures (and thereby access for mites to invade...). Just add enough that the spings can eat it all in less then a week and you should be fine.


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## Boondoggle (Dec 9, 2007)

Yeah, I have had springs "konk out" in a container that size because of oxygen depletion from rotting vegetation. Sorry to say that was probably the culprit. Do yourself a favor and grab a 10 gallon tank next time Petco has the dollar sale, and make that your new QT tank. A ziploc container that size is pretty tight for two sub-adult frogs for very long. The smaller a container is, the easier it is for any one care element to become unbalanced (humidity, temp, O2 balance, parasite concentration, etc).

Sorry you lost them.


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## cheezus_2007 (Aug 20, 2009)

dang dude thats a drag... i've def used mushrooms in my growouts and havent had any losses yet so this is good to know.... Sorry for ur froggy loss man


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