# hybrid or not



## jerry b

So I'm frog sitting for a couple buddies and was informed today that this was a hybrid. The frogs were bought by one of my friends from a respected breeder out west last fall. One of the frogs was taken to a Chicago frog gathering yesterday and people there said it was a hybrid solely on its appearance. I dont think it's a hybrid, but would like to immediately end any doubt either way. Thank you in advance for your help.


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## Corpus Callosum

Hi Jerry,

Looks just like all my other Tor line tarapoto imitator.. Since Id'ing based on appearance is unreliable, I would just talk to the respected breeder if you have any doubts and ask him/her.

Here are some pictures of variations I've gotten from my 2 tarapoto pairs (both Tor line):






































A parent from pair 1:










A parent from pair 2 (unrelated to the first pair, but same population.. these seem to give me a less deep orange with larger spotting but overall similar variations, they also sometimes come out on the yellow side like your pic but get more orange with age):











What were your frogs labeled as ?


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## jerry b

Hey Mike!
WOW, Thanks for all the pics and info! I fully agree with what your saying. Not my frogs, I was just traveling between two friends who had a trade going. I'm just stuck in the middle. Honestly, I'm ashamed of the fact that I cant bring anything more intelligent to this forum than this. For that I apologize. Hopfully your informative post puts the topic to rest. Thanks again Mike!
Jerry


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## jerry b

oops, their trade was intermedius for intermedius. I paid no mind till I got home with them and said woah! these are not imi's. I called the two and said these are tarapota and was told no they are not. They look like no tarapota I've ever seen. They were then taken to the chicago gathering for opinions by one of the froggers and all of the froggers there said they were hybrids and agreed that they looked like no known tarapota they had ever seen. So I brought it here. Sorry for the gossip bs and again I hope this settles the matter.
Jerry


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## Jordan77

heres the other one that was with the one jerry posted=)


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## Jordan77

sorry here it is


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## Corpus Callosum

All the adults/parents (two of which are in the last 2 photos) from my 2 pairs came direct from Tor Linbo (but may have passed through a few other hands along the way..) and were labeled from the source as "Tarapoto" imitator.

I'm not saying that I know what yours are because I am not bold enough to try and identify something by appearance, I would just try to find the original source where your frogs came from and talk to them.

Do you know if both the frogs were siblings from the same parents or came from different ones?


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## Jordan77

i mean look at the two frogs now they look completly different im so confused


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## Ziggi

Don't care if they are hybrids or not, those are one of the most beautiful frogs I've seen in a while. But myself I don't think it's a hybrid.


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## UmbraSprite

I have a line of intermedius (I believe Phil Tann but would need to check) which often put out these yellow colored animals. I wouldn't assume a hybrid just because there is morphological variation.

Chris


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## hexentanz

I vote non hybrid.


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## jerry b

Didnt think so but when a group of respected froggers look at a frog and say hybrid I wanted second opinions for sure. Anybody have a pic of one that is similiar to the one Jordan posted? 
Thanks for the input all,
Jerry


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## Corpus Callosum

Jordan's picture "looks" like other intermedius in the hobby, while yours "looks" a bit different (why I was wondering if they came from the same parents or not).. but what are looks worth? Anyway, what we're getting at is that no picture identification is going to give you any guarantee that it is or isn't a hybrid. I only posted my pics to give a frame of reference, not for identification. Let us know if you find anything out from which line the frogs originally came from.


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## Philsuma

You should be able to trace your frog back from the person you got it from........


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## SmackoftheGods

You should do what Corpus Callosum suggests. You need to contact the breeder and ask what line of frogs they are, get generational information if at all possible (probably not, but it's worth a shot). You can ask where the breeder got the parents and from there you can contact _that_ breeder if it's still debatable. 

I don't think they look like hybrids though... just for the record (not to say that I completely trust my ability to identify a frog from its appearance, I think that's one of the worst thing a frogger can try to do, I've seen a few frogs that look to me like another frog)


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## jerry b

Yeah the owner of the frogs is trying to get with the breeder to get the exact line. Agreed standard protical to do so. Just thought it odd that so many at a glance would say hybrid so the owner asked me to throw some pics up to get "eyeball" opinions here until they could get the info again. I'm just the messenger, lol. If the owner spent less on beer and instead payed for an internet connection, I wouldnt even be here.
Jerry


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## Jordan77

It is Tarlon Line Intermedius they throw weird!!! variations 
case closed thanks guys=)


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## jerry b

Ahh, cool. You guys finally have an answer and again my guess was wrong,lol. That'll teach you to keep better track....
Jerry


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## chuckpowell

They look very much like the original R. imitators that Charles N. brought into the country in the 1990's, way before any of this line crap. The yellow to slightly orangish body with nice blue legs - almost a dead ringer. I know Terry Chatterton and I got them and breed hundreds we pass on. Offspring of those are still around I'm sure but what morph they are being called now is anyones guess. 

Best,

Chuck



jerry b said:


> Yeah the owner of the frogs is trying to get with the breeder to get the exact line. Agreed standard protical to do so. Just thought it odd that so many at a glance would say hybrid so the owner asked me to throw some pics up to get "eyeball" opinions here until they could get the info again. I'm just the messenger, lol. If the owner spent less on beer and instead payed for an internet connection, I wouldnt even be here.
> Jerry


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