# Just Getting Started ZooMed 12x12x18



## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

I have been cruising the boards for over a year now looking for ideas and thinking about really doing a vivarium. For my first vivarium I plan on keeping it pretty simple or at least that is the plan for now. It will eventually house one or two thumbnails. I have resisted the water feature for my first vivarium even though I have several small pumps I brought for the job. I will eventually have one on each side of my entertainment center.

Today I has some time and started messing around with how I would layout the vivarium. So far I have done the following and there is still tons of work to be done. I added one about one inch of leca balls. I was not sure how deep I could go with the substrate mixture. I wanted it slant down a little and still be deep enough to drain well. The white styrofoam will look a lot better once its painted. I plan on making them look like rocks. I may add a few vines once its all painted as well. The piece wood is actually hollow and looks pretty cool up lose. I remember seeing something about fly proofing the front so that still needs to be done. I also need to cut a piece of glass for the top. I put down some leaf litter just for the pic and to see how it would look. I will add more for real set up.

Now to some of my questions


If I could only have 4-5 plants what would be a good choice of true miniature plants. I have a few ideas but want some input from the experts.
Is a soil depth of 2 inches enough in the front?
Would I benefit from a fan on a tank this small?
What type of moss could I get to grow on the hollowed out stick? I eventually want it covered in moss or some type of trailing vines.

Front view









Side view










Any ideas and comments will be greatly appreciated.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

1. pothos is always a good beginner plant. so is creeping fig and wandering jew. some terrestrial plants i like are lemon button fern and peperomia obtusifolia. the only thing with peperomia obtusifolia is it will grow to about 22" which is going to be a little big.
2. 2 inches is enough. the only concern i have is that if you only have 1 inch of hydroton that isn't going to be enough unless you have your viv drilled for drainage.
3. internal circulation fans are always good. they improve the health of your plants and frogs. here's a link on how to build one.
DIY Air Circulation | GlassTropics
4. black jungle has some nice tropical terrarium moss (that's what they call it). also pm Manuran. he has some of the nicest moss around
welcome


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> 1. pothos is always a good beginner plant. so is creeping fig and wandering jew. some terrestrial plants i like are lemon button fern and peperomia obtusifolia. the only thing with peperomia obtusifolia is it will grow to about 22" which is going to be a little big.
> 2. 2 inches is enough. the only concern i have is that if you only have 1 inch of hydroton that isn't going to be enough unless you have your viv drilled for drainage.
> 3. internal circulation fans are always good. they improve the health of your plants and frogs. here's a link on how to build one.
> DIY Air Circulation | GlassTropics
> ...


goof901,
Thanks for the quick response. That circulation article was great. I will be picking up the parts for that this weekend. If you would please explain your number 2 for me I am a little unclear on what is not going to be enough. I increased the leca to 1-3/4" - 2" in some areas, but now the vent in the front is right at the level of the substrate? 

I thought about drilling the tank in the back but want to make sure my entertainment center will give me enough space behind the tank. I also looked at Black Jungle today and they have a great selection of plants.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

some extra info regarding the fan, when your looking for the 2” to 2.5” PVC pipe Reducer Fitting, it is called a 1.5 x 2 PVC pipe reducer fitting, NOT a 2 x 2.5. also i never figured out why they have the risers, and they never got used so maybe don't buy those. i'm pretty sure there's nothing wrong with the substrate at the vents. also, if you don't want to drill you viv, i'd get piece of pvc pipe that extends all the way to the bottom, an end cap that fits on that pipe, but isn't super tight, and a tube that will easily fit into the pipe so if the water level in your viv gets too high, you can drain the water out. once you place the pipe in, cover it with the end cap so then your frogs won't go down it, and put some leaves over it to cover it up.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> some extra info regarding the fan, when your looking for the 2” to 2.5” PVC pipe Reducer Fitting, it is called a 1.5 x 2 PVC pipe reducer fitting, NOT a 2 x 2.5. also i never figured out why they have the risers, and they never got used so maybe don't buy those. i'm pretty sure there's nothing wrong with the substrate at the vents. also, if you don't want to drill you viv, i'd get piece of pvc pipe that extends all the way to the bottom, an end cap that fits on that pipe, but isn't super tight, and a tube that will easily fit into the pipe so if the water level in your viv gets too high, you can drain the water out. once you place the pipe in, cover it with the end cap so then your frogs won't go down it, and put some leaves over it to cover it up.


goof901,
Thanks again. This is my second hobby so any extra plumbing parts will more than likely get used on my first hobby (saltwater). I will verify the list the items and see what is not needed. 

I thought the drainage was what you were getting at but not sure. Although it is not pictured I will have a pipe behind the cork that I can put a piece of air line tubing down and suck any excess water out.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

yeah i was getting to the drainage, guess you have that covered. when you buy the parts for your fan, the 2"-2.5" pvc reducer is labeled as 1.5 x 2 pvc reducer fitting fyi, cuz when i was getting my parts, i couldn't find a 2x2.5 so just thought i'd let you know


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> yeah i was getting to the drainage, guess you have that covered. when you buy the parts for your fan, the 2"-2.5" pvc reducer is labeled as 1.5 x 2 pvc reducer fitting fyi, cuz when i was getting my parts, i couldn't find a 2x2.5 so just thought i'd let you know


goof901,
Thanks again. My local Home Depot closest to my house did not have all the parts I needed but I was able to pick up the reducer and some non-sanded grout. They did not have any acrylic polymer so I will have to go to a bigger Home Depot or order on line when I order my fans.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

what's that white stuff under the cork?


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> what's that white stuff under the cork?


 goof901,
The white stuff are my styrofoam rocks I am working on . In the next week or so I hope to get started on that part of the project.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

cover the entire thing in grout because polystyrene (styrofoam) is a known endocrine disruptor


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> cover the entire thing in grout because polystyrene (styrofoam) is a known endocrine disruptor


goof901,
It is my intention to make sure it completely covered . I don't want to anything to kill these little critters.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Stopped by a local nursery today and found a few plants that I liked and I picked up a few. I did a few searches on the boards and seems like people are using some of them already in their vivs. I also picked up a few ferns but they did not have any name tags. They are currently small but I was wondering if anyone could tell me how big they will get and or the names.













I was also able to pick up some other plants as well. I have them in where I think I may put them but not sure until I do a little more research. Being new to the hobby I picked them based on how small they were and the shapes of the leaves. Now that I have them home I have a lot of research to do.


Dwarf Strawberry Begonia - (*Saxifraga Custcutaeformis)*
Bonsai Grass - (*Eleocharis Radrans*)
Blue Creeping Pilea - (*Pilea Glauca*)
Baby Blue Tears - (*Lindernia Grandiflora*)
Unnamed Fern
Golden Spike Moss - (*Selaginella kraussiana)*


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

the 3rd fern with really small leaves is a lemon button fern. it maxes out at 8-10"


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Is it really styrofoam, or is it a spray foam like Great Stuff? As Goof901 said, styrofoam is an endocrine disruptor. You might be better off switching to Great Stuff.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> the 3rd fern with really small leaves is a lemon button fern. it maxes out at 8-10"


goof901, Thanks again. I thought it was but needed some confirmation. I love the little leaves.



Pumilo said:


> Is it really styrofoam, or is it a spray foam like Great Stuff? As Goof901 said, styrofoam is an endocrine disruptor. You might be better off switching to Great Stuff.


Pumilo and goof901,
I will be removing the styrofoam and getting some other type from the craft store this week.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

So I got rid of the Styrofoam and whet with some natural clay. I later found out it would not hold up well in the enclosure so I used it to make a shell that I have coated a few times with a grout mixture. 

I was able to make a little progress and thought I would post some pics.

The top that comes with the enclosure is nice but I wanted to have the mesh replaced with glass so I started a replacement project. I have not completed it yet as I am waiting for my MistKing to arrive so I can see where I will drill the holes for the nozzles. So far I have removed the mesh and cut the glass to fit. 

Standard top










Glass from Lowes









Holes to drill out 









Mesh and retainers removed









I saved the retainers to use when I put the glass in









Glass temporarily in place









Vines...everyone seems to do such a good job at them I figured I would give it a try as well. I used silicone and Eco Earth.









Up Close


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

I stayed up late on Friday night playing in clay. I think I was reliving my childhood days of art class. I added some details to each rock and like I mentioned earlier found out the clay once hardned would not stand up in the enclosure. I will post some pictures of the new grout covered rocks this week. After a few layers of grout the detail is gone though . I will try to make up for it when I paint them. I was able to see how the tank would look with the rock and the vines as well so here are a few picture of that.

With new vines...









Vines and Fake Rock









Fake Rock Up Close


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Made some more progress and here are the pics.

Fake rock









After some sanding and a couple coats of Dylock









Added some green for fake moss look


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

if you could get some moss growing on the grout and the wood (maybe not the cork), that would look great!!! sorry i can't really help with growing moss  all i can say is do NOT throw it in a blender and mix in buttermilk. that won't work in a viv.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> if you could get some moss growing on the grout and the wood (maybe not the cork), that would look great!!! sorry i can't really help with growing moss  all i can say is do NOT throw it in a blender and mix in buttermilk. that won't work in a viv.


Goof901,
I am hoping I can be patient enough. Hopefully with the new MistKing system and the lights you recommended I will see few other surprises pop up as well.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Well today my MistKing package came so I was excited when I arrived home. I unpacked it and it looks like a quality product. I also gave a few of my plants the bleach treatment so now I will QT them for about 6 weeks and see what happens.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

if the nursery doesn't use pesticides then you don't need a 6 week quarantine, maybe just 2 weeks to make sure there aren't any slugs or other nasties. however, if they do use pesticides than a 6 week quarintine is highly recommended to eliminate the pesticides.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> if the nursery doesn't use pesticides then you don't need a 6 week quarantine, maybe just 2 weeks to make sure there aren't any slugs or other nasties. however, if they do use pesticides than a 6 week quarintine is highly recommended to eliminate the pesticides.


Goof901,
That is great news. I replanted them in cups and will monitor over the next few days. When in QT do you just leave them out in the open or in a tank or container? I saw some people used an empty tank, others no tank, some individual containers for each plant.


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## goof901 (Jan 9, 2012)

i used some different sized sterilite containers that were covered with syran wrap to keep the humidity in. the reason i used different sized containers was because i didn't wanna go buy more and i couldn't fit them all into one. the reason why people do a seperate container for each plant is just in case one plant has something, than it doesn't compromise all the other plants. im just laying out the reasons why people do things, the final decision is yours


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

goof901 said:


> i used some different sized sterilite containers that were covered with syran wrap to keep the humidity in. the reason i used different sized containers was because i didn't wanna go buy more and i couldn't fit them all into one. the reason why people do a seperate container for each plant is just in case one plant has something, than it doesn't compromise all the other plants. im just laying out the reasons why people do things, the final decision is yours


goof901,
I will have to look down in my basement and see if I have any spare containers. I think I have a 10 gallon tank I could use for a few weeks.

I received my order from Josh's Frogs. The box scared me by the way the package looked but when I opened the box I could see it was packed pretty well. My lighting options came in and I was able to do some initial testing. I took lighting measurements with my lux meter and I am pretty impressed with the LED light. Goof901 was gracious enough to recommend two bulbs for me so I ordered them. The first was 6500K Spiral Compact Fluorescents - 6500K Spiral Compact Fluorescents | Josh's Frogs and the second was Jungle Dawn LED Vivarium Light (13 Watt Jungle-White) - LED Lighting | Josh's Frogs. I created a 3x3 grid in the tank with just the vine in the enclosure. The CFL bulb box said it puts out about 830 lumens so it is pretty close.

Lux Meter









Below are the results








--------CFL--------
933 834 603

925 721 660

783 679 603









--------LED--------
1563 1732 1120 

1719 1778 1345

1400 1533 1310


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

So tonight I made a little progress on my enclosure. I was able to accomplish the following:


Built air circulation
Put in drainage layer (LECA)
Put in mesh screen
Put in substrate
Put in pvc drain (for removing excess water)
Drilled holes for prototype of glass top (5/8" and two 1")
My air circulation consisted of the following


2"-1-1/2" Clean out adapter X 2
1" 90 Elbow x 2
1" PVC
1-1/2 - 1" Bushing x 2
2" - 1-1/2" Reducer x 2











From these I made this. Fan is inside .














Which now looks like this










If anyone is interested I can give a step by step of it with more pictures. It spans exactly the right amount of space on top of the enclosure. Here it is mounted.















Front shot. In the lower left the dark looking ball is the top to keep frogs and debris from going down the PVC drain. Front center is the mist king nozzle installed.










Tomorrow I will call the glass shop and get a real piece of glass for the top. This was just a proof of concept and I think I will be pleased with top when I am finished.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Almost forgot I ordered two mini broms and they should arrive this week so this will be a busy week.


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## Dale D (Apr 22, 2012)

That's a nice recirculating system.
How is the fan held in place inside the 2 clean out adapters? Friction fit?


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Dale D said:


> That's a nice recirculating system.
> How is the fan held in place inside the 2 clean out adapters? Friction fit?


Dale D,
The two pipes are held together by tape for now. I divided the thickness of the fan between the two so it sits in the middle of the two.I outlined my fan on the reducers. In the picture below you can see where I marked the edges. This one was my prototype when I was orignally trying to do the in tank circulation. I had the fan sitting flush with the top. For my updated model I only went down half the thickness of the fan on each reducer so it would fit like egg shells around an egg yolk. 










From this










To this










This was the new model before dremeling. The purple you see is purple primer. It allowed me to push the reducer into place with ease. 









The bushings I cut since I needed them to fit flush with the adapter. I think about 3/4".


















That then went on the other end of the adaptor









1" PVC cut to fit. About 1-3/4".









Added the 1" elbow and assembled the parts into this









To this . I drilled a hole in the middle of the two and ran the cord through.







​I soaked the Dr. Elsey's Precious Kitty litter last night and tonight applied the clay background. I mixed in some milled sphagnum moss and Eco Earth. Having not done a background before it was super easy. I built a strainer pot in the clay and added a tube to drain the water. It is hidden behind the clay and goes into the substrate. I dropped a few LECA balls in the strainer and then added some substrate.



















I also ordered my glass today from the glass shop. It should arrive sometime next week.


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## Dale D (Apr 22, 2012)

I see what you did. 
I wasn't sure where the 2" to 11/2" bushing went.
Instead of demeling out the bushing to the shape of the fan I left out the inner bushing and rounded off the fan housing to friction fit into the 2" opening of each half.
Are the 2 halves going to be glued flush to each other.
Or are you going to use the tape to hold them together.


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## Dale D (Apr 22, 2012)

Just got it finished.
















Thanks for the great design Nightowl. Hope you don't mind me using it.
Mines slightly different on the inside.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Dale D said:


> Just got it finished.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dale D - Thanks for thinking my version was worthy to be used. The cool thing about this site is people share and we can all benefit . Looks good to me what size tank are you putting that on?
​My mini broms came in today and I am pretty excited about them. 'Chiquita Linda'


















​‘Red Wolf’







​


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## Dale D (Apr 22, 2012)

It's going on a 18"x18"x18" Exo terra.


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Dale D said:


> It's going on a 18"x18"x18" Exo terra.


That is the size of my next tank I have to do except it will be for Crested Geckos.

I am still waiting for the silicone to dry but my top it came out nicely. All that is left is to replace the black liner pieces.

Prototype glass vs my new glass. The prototype glass is on the right.










Nozzle hole...










Circulation hole










Holes drilled









First coat of silicone









Test fit


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

Dale D said:


> Just got it finished.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dale,
Hope you don't mine me borrowing a little bit from your design. I did not originally have anything on the ends of the elbows. Yesterday I was messing with the enclosure and moved the circulation system around and was like it needs some ends on the elbows. I went back and looked at yours and borrowed your ends . I ended up frog proofing them. I made it so the ends sit down in the tank just a tad past the glass.

I took some mesh and covered the hole then forcefully pushed a small piece of pipe it the hole. Found the distance I was shooting for and then cut and removed the pipe and cut to size. Once I was satisfied I cut the excess mesh away. I was left with a recessed mesh that looks pretty clean.

Forced the mesh in the hole









Cut away the excess









The white part now sits in the tank and when messing with the tank the unit does not slide around.


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## SWReptiles (Apr 20, 2012)

Great info. I too am new and learned much. thanks


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Dale D said:


> Just got it finished.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


looks like you are still using the screen. If you are housing PDFs you should replace the screen with glass
Maybe I am just seeing glare from the light idk but it looks like screen lol


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## nightowl (Dec 13, 2010)

SWReptiles said:


> Great info. I too am new and learned much. thanks


SWReptiles- Glad my thread could be of help. You will find the people on this board are very friendly and very helpful!!!!


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