# vent up and died today!



## tahir tareen (Dec 17, 2009)

so i noticed one of my peruvian ventrimaculatus looking dead on bottom of the tank about an hour ago, it didnt move when i poked a stick near it.

I have five vents that i recently moved into a 20g tall, but for the last 1.5 years they were in another tank together. They have all seemed normal since the tank transfer two weeks ago. I started with 7 frogs and lost two a few months after getting them, but the rest have been active since i've had them. I dust FF with calcium supplements usually every other feeding and have been giving them aphids this summer. Out of the five frogs, i have two which are thinner and seem to not gain weight no matter how much food is around, but this frog doesnt seem to be one of those skinny ones. Im reluctant to remove it for another few hours just to make sure its done for. So frustrating!

What are some common reasons for dart frogs up and dying?


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## Tony (Oct 13, 2008)

The first thing that comes to mind is stress from overcrowding.


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## tahir tareen (Dec 17, 2009)

really, their tank is/has been heavily planted with plenty of food. How big a tank would you suggest for the 4 remaining frogs?


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## tclipse (Sep 19, 2009)

Given that it's such a new tank, any chance the tank temps have gone above 80-85 for a few hours?

Are you also dusting w/ a multivitamin supp., or just calcium?

Tony could be right as well, I'd be leery of putting 5 frogs in a 20G... even "good group frogs" like vents. Vittatus and some mantella species are pretty much the only frogs I'd be comfortable doing that with. 

If you're going to keep the last 4 in there, make sure you have at least one brom or comparable hide for each frog.... and extras never hurt. Vents will often share broms, but if they get into a tiff each frog should have somewhere to retreat. 

I guess the most obvious question is, have you had fecals done? With three down out of 7, you've got to wonder if they might have something.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

tclipse said:


> I guess the most obvious question is, have you had fecals done? With three down out of 7, you've got to wonder if they might have something.


If enviromental factors are fine, this is where it should start. Vents are typically fine in groups, (otherwise they couldn't practice social parasitism) but if you are have lost almost 50% of a group and enviromental factors are ruled out, you need to start looking at pathogens and husbandry. 


Ed


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## tahir tareen (Dec 17, 2009)

i am suspecting temperature issues are what caused it, which is lame because i moved them into this tank because i thought it would have better ventilation. 

I give them multivitamin supplement. the tank has four broms with two decent size pups plus lots of other vegetation and hiding spots. I often see two or three in one brom though.

I have never had fecals done, but will look into it. I have a decent microscope at home with 4x,10x and 40x power, is there any point in taking a look at some poo myself?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

I have to admit, I refrained from the joking response of "thier hearts stopped" to the question about most common causes of death.... 

Ed


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