# How long to see maggots?



## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

I received my Hydei cultures this past Friday and made two new cultures shortly after getting them. Today being Wednesday I don't see any maggots in the new cultures or in the old cultures. Any idea? How long does it normally take for a new culture to have maggots?


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

On the last culture I made, I'm just starting to see larva on day 8. Temp is kept at around 77 daytime 72 night.

-Nish


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## Axl (Dec 9, 2006)

The higher the temp, the earlier you'll see maggots. Hydei like higher temp than melanogaster! (80 or over!)


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## MattySF (May 25, 2005)

I start seeing the tiniest ones around day 5.


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Yeah, the cultures are under my viv in the stand but I guess it may be a bit cooler so I'll move them to a room that tends to stay warmer to see if that helps. I was just making sure they weren't sterile from shipping last week. One day of during shipping got pretty hot (90 degrees).


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## herper99 (Mar 21, 2008)

My hydei cultures always take quite a bit longer than my melanogaster. 

Chris


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

First week or so of Hydei production is mostly if not all one sex (forget which). If you don't wait till the second week or so, you might not get larva.

-Nish


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

i usually can see their little mouths on day 5, but i have to squint, during the first week you should start to see a lot more.


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## flyangler18 (Oct 26, 2007)

Set the cultures on top of your lights, and this will boost the production schedule. Remember, hydei take longer than melanogaster to get going.


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## MattySF (May 25, 2005)

I keep mine in rubbermaid tubs on top of the racks. I looked last night and had first maggots from cultures I made on the morning of the 9th. So now I'm seeing as soon as 4 days.


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## dom (Sep 23, 2007)

nish07 said:


> First week or so of Hydei production is mostly if not all one sex (forget which). If you don't wait till the second week or so, you might not get larva.
> 
> -Nish



i believe its the females first then males


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Well, the cultures when they arrived according to Josh at Josh's Frogs were already two weeks old and there were larva present when they arrived. So I made two new cultures buy dumping about 50-75 flies out of the two original cultures in to two newly made ones. So in that case I shouldn't have to worry about all the flies being a single sex, right? I also moved the cultures to under the bathroom sink since our bathroom is always warm and humid so hopefully that will get them jump started again. It has only been 7 days since I made the new cultures so I guess I will give it several more days to see what happens. How long is long enough to consider the cultures a fail? And what would some possible causes be for the failure? The mix is pre-made, the consistency seems the same as what is in the original, and the flies are all very active and appear healthy. Is it possible that the hot day during the transit could have made the flies sterile? Am I just being impatient and jumping to negative conclusions?... :lol:


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## dom (Sep 23, 2007)

give em some time, mayeb just late bloomers


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## flyangler18 (Oct 26, 2007)

> It has only been 7 days since I made the new cultures so I guess I will give it several more days to see what happens


It's not unusual for hydei to take 21 days for the first bloom.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

yeah, hydei take way longer and like warmer temps. they also don't like yeast so if you used that they will not lay. who know why.


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Not sure about yeast being in the culture mix but it was labeled specifically as being hydei mix. I know I did not add anything other than hot water to make the culture. It came from Josh's Frogs and his starter culture was producing so I am sure it is ok. I'll just give it time. I knew hydei were a slower producing FF but I wasn't sure if larva showed quickly and the pupa just took a while to hatch out or if even the larva took a while to show.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

If you bought it from Josh and it was labeled Hydei mix then you have nothing to worry about, I forgot you ordered it.


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

Just to reiterate, if you didn't wait till both sexes were producing, you're not going to get production.

-Nish


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Like I said, the original two cultures that came from Josh's were already producing. So that should mean that male and female flies were in there, correct? How can you tell the difference between and male and female FF anyways?


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

You can't tell the difference and sometimes they're producing but just started. Production needs to occur for a week or so which could mean a ton of flies. Either way, just because it's producing doesn't mean that it was producing both sexes yet. Start new cultures now just incase (as long as you have the cups for it). It can't hurt.

-Nish


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

I doubt the problem is that you didn't have both sexes. Flies are semi-sexable though, the females have larger buts and their butts tend to be lighter for some reason. And you can also tell by their behavoir, the males will constantly chase the females, but the females rarely go after males.


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## herper99 (Mar 21, 2008)

nish07 said:


> You can't tell the difference and sometimes they're producing but just started.


Actually you can, but you need a bit of a trained eye. There are differences in the abdomen, and males have larger clasps on their legs. There are guides on the net if you search.


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Well, the original cultures are now three weeks old so they are probably about due to be thrown out as they are getting pretty nasty so I will just make a couple more fresh ones to be safe since after that much time there has to be both sexes I would think. Thanks everyone for all the discussion so far. It has been really helpful.


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

You got the cultures on the 8th. They could have just started producing then. You made a fresh culture which could have been mostly one sex. They don't start producing for 21-30 days. Your culture is probably 4 weeks old and only 1 week into production. I wouldn't throw it away.

-Nish


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Yeah, I'll hang on to them for a bit longer at least. I am going to make a couple new cultures as well with the flies from the oldest cultures and hang on to all of them to see what happens. I know I am being impatient. I was just worried that I was doing something wrong or there was a problem with the cultures and I really really want to get my frogs next month but I know that I shouldn't until I have the FF thing down and have good cultures going so I have plenty of food for all my little mouths.


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

You could always start melano cultures. They start producing a lot faster. The Hydeis I've found really make it easy for big frogs. I'm sure you'll get the Hydeis going just give it time and you'll figure out a good schedule.

-Nish


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Just an update for anyone that is following, after moving the cultures to the new warmer more humid location, one of the old cultures has exploded with larva, the other old one looks dead. Really nasty media and lots of dead flies. I really thing this one is lost. The two newer cultures not showing anything yet but I think I need to give them more time. I am going to make another culture or two with the flies from the first old culture since it has ALOT of new larva. Just wanted to update.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

Ok, we'll see what happens then, thanks for the update. It takes a little getting used to. Do you have your frogs yet? it's always a good idea to start culturing before hand and get the hang of it. But if not at least there are plenty of reputable places to get the flies if you allready have the frogs.


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

No, no frogs yet. I am really hoping to get them by the end of next month and I knew I needed to get the culturing down before I get them so that is maybe why I was stressing a little. I was afraid that if I was not able to get the FF thing down then I would have to put the frogs off. But everything that everyone has been saying has me at ease so thanks for that.


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## adrian72 (Mar 5, 2008)

I had also bought FF Hydie from JF and got them in when it was warm but that didn't seem to bother them. They were a bunch of flies and pupa in the cups and I made extra cutures a few days after. I also was wondreing how long to wait before calling them a no show. I did sprinkle yeast in the cup not noing that Hydie didn't like it. Does it kill them or slow their production down?


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Not sure about the yeast but just to update again, I have larva in both the new cultures I made the same day that I received the kit from JF. One of his cultures died and I threw it out (there was no doubt about it being dead) and the other had another bloom of larva after moving them to the new location. So I emptied the flies in to a third new culture to get it started since there weren't that many left alive, that way when the new larva start hatching I can move them out too in to new cultures since the media in that culture is about done. So, by the way it looks, I have 3 active culture and the forth should be good, just too soon to tell. Now that I know that I can make them, I just need to get the scheduling down so I don't ever run out. I figure a group of 5 terribilis can probably go through a lot of flies in a short amount of time.

Also, to answer your other question, I had larva maybe 10-12 days after starting my new cultures.


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

A group of 5 adult terribilus will go through through hydeis very fast. You need to remember not to make new cultures until a week after they start hatching from pupae. They will be all one sex and will not mate.

-Nish


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Will do. So far all cultures are made from the originals so I am good. No new flies yet, just all larva in the new cultures so far.


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## adrian72 (Mar 5, 2008)

Checked my culture 8/04 and the larva are begining to hatch, but like you Nubster one of my cultures from JF didn't make it, even though they looked good after shipping. 
I think with 5 Terribillis I would look for other food. I have a pair of bi-colors and even at a young age they will eat anything that will fit in their mouth. 5 terribillis = ton of hydei. I would guess that you would go thought them faster than you could culture them, if that is all you are going to feed them. My 2c


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

Well, I will probably also feed crickets and wax worms and whatever else I can get that they will eat. I guess I will probably try culturing the crickets myself as well as the FF's.


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

I'm trying the two new cultures every 10 days method for my 6 Leucs. I'm thinking it'll work out fairly well depending on how much media you put in a cup (to continue production). I might switch that to 3 per 10 days for safety purposes.


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## Nubster (Jun 16, 2008)

I might end up going with leucs. They were my original choice of frogs but after reading more about the terribilis, the trouble of feeding them larger food might be a bit of a hassle. I am not sure I want to culture crickets and I can't afford to buy them weekly/bi-weekly. 

Your schedule sounds like it might work. Once I get my last made culture going with larva I will start with an actual schedule so that I have plenty of flies for whatever frogs I do end up with.


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