# buying vs breeding flys



## DCreptiles (Jan 26, 2009)

hey just was wondering since im new to the trade, how many of you guys buy your fruit flys and how many of you make your own cultures?. and those of you that do make your own cultures which flys do you breed?


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

I breed mine, I think if you have more than one or two tanks of frogs it is not economically practical to order flies. The 16 oz. ff containers are around 28 cents from Superior Enterprises + half a cup of homemade media + vinegear/water solution=about a buck. And once you get the hang of it and figure out what media and moisture content yeilds the most flies it does not take long at all.

I breed mostly melano's and I've tried hydei in the past but I stopped because my medium wasn't working well with them and I didn't feel like having two separate medias.


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## melas (Oct 24, 2007)

Culturing you own is inexpensive and easy! Get a good culture media from a vendor like Patrick Nabors at Saurian.net and it only takes a few minutes a month to make new cultures. You can reuse the lids if you freeze them. I've heard of folks reusing the cups as well but I'd rather just pitch them than have to touch them. You can culture you own for a 1/8 of the price! Good luck!


edit: oh and I use melanogaster. they are smaller but they are REALLY prolific! i've found they are easier than hydei as well. it's all about the media though!


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## basshummper (Jan 13, 2008)

I’m incredibly thrifty so I used to wash my cups outside when the weather was good, now I have a stack of old CXs layered in a snow drift off of my deck. I’m getting low on cups, come on spring!


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

Oh I also forgot to add that for additional laying sites you can use excelsior or coffee filters. I used to use excelsior but found it very annoying when the little pieces would come out so I switched and really like the filters a lot better, plus they are cheaper (unless you buy excelsior in bulk).


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## DCreptiles (Jan 26, 2009)

ok well the reason for the post was iv been buying cultures from the expos the 32 oz containers for 8 bucks and they normally last me about a month if im lucky i dont exactly have the humidity for the culture it kinda just sits on a shelf close by to the frog vivs. and i also go to my local pet smart which normally has horrible lil tube cultures and by horrible i mean half way dead ones. larva already moving or dead and molded over by 50% i pay 6 to 8 dollars depending where i go. so today i realized i had media just hanging in the reptile box i have of all my supplys and i decided to make a culture. so i mean the media looks good and i used coffee filters got 100 for a buck at the store and added flys i just hope it works out for me. now the catch is.. the media says its for the wingless ones and i used the flightless ones. i carefully re searched it and i find the 2 medias arent much different. also i was told from a guy at a expo that he uses fruit for a media in his cultures. basically just a banana and mist the containner and adds the flys.. is that true? sounds to easy...


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

no don't bother with that, just buy a bag of media and the containers, and use either excelsior or coffee filters in them, it's too easy and when to make a new culture just depends on which breed of flies you use


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## holidayhanson (Apr 25, 2007)

Reuse your culture cups....after a month throw them in the snow of freezer and then a wash cycle in the dishwasher and they are good to go for another culture. I bought 20 cups over a year ago and they are still all good as new. With the media, i buy from josh, it smells so good (sometimes, tempted to eat it for breakfast in a pinch)....I recently switched to 1/3 cup media mixed with a 1/2 cup hot water...seems to make just enough to last 30 days. 

If you want to save pennies make your own recipe....there are a bunch out there which will be far cheaper than petco. Flies breed much more prolific than rabbits....and frogs.

I use wingless D. Melanos.


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## Dragas (Sep 4, 2008)

FF are the easiest thing to reproduce ever.


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## markpulawski (Nov 19, 2004)

I have used the same wide mouth 1 quart Mason jars for my cultures for many years, after they die out I let water sit in them in my stationary tub for 2-3 days then rinse them out and wipe them out with a an old towel/rag to remove old husks. Never had a problem, the only thing new each time is the coffee filters I put on the top of the jar.


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## Ed Holder (Sep 26, 2008)

Being fairly new to the hobby as well, i will tell you it is not that difficult to culture the flies on your own and WAY cheaper. It only costs me about $8 to make 12-14 cultures/month and i use the same media for Hydei and Melanogasters just adding a little more water to the Hydei as they take twice as long. 
I was using the recipe on UE's page and it worked great, although i have tweaked it a bit adding vinegar and sugar.
I always reuse my 32oz deli cups and vented lids (Lids from Josh's Frogs), The lids can be washed a few times before the filter material starts to deteriorate.
When this happens i silicone a piece of "No see um" mesh to the lid and they last me for another 2-3 cultures.

Mind you there are no steady suppliers of FF in my region so i had no choice but to do my own, now find i am supplying others in my area LOL

But yeah....Super easy just to DIY

Ed


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## Marinarawr (Jan 14, 2009)

Not to hijack your thread but... what's in FF media? Powdered fruit and supplements?


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## jehitch (Jun 8, 2007)

Marinarawr said:


> Not to hijack your thread but... what's in FF media? Powdered fruit and supplements?


All the recipes are basically a combination of starch, sugar, and protein, with something added to inhibit mold growth. The most common inhibitors are vinegar and methyl paraben.

I have customers who absolutely refuse to culture their own flies, even though the cost is many times less. But most hobbyists with multiple frog vivs culture their own.
Jim


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## divingne1 (Mar 21, 2008)

I definately prefer to culture my own. One time the emergency culture that I had to order came crushed so when I opened the box (which looked like it went through a trash compactor), ff were everywhere and the cups were all smashed. I didn't get much use out of that emergency batch. Another time I ordered Hydei cultures so I could try my luck at culturing them...the UPS driver dropped my box in my driveway, picked it up (upside down) and when I opened it, the Hydei cultures were upside down with the media running down the cup to the lid. The media had squished all the flies. Needless to say, I don't feel confident with the UPS system so I always prefer to make my own cultures.


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## Ed Holder (Sep 26, 2008)

Marinarawr said:


> Not to hijack your thread but... what's in FF media? Powdered fruit and supplements?


I use equal parts of banana, apple sauce (Sweetened), plain oatmeal
boil it for 5min add 1 tsp bakers yeast for every 2cups of above mix, 1tsp vinegar for every 2cups as well. Mix thoroughly. When i make new cultures i sprinkle a pinch of yeast over the media in each culture.....

Ed


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## DCreptiles (Jan 26, 2009)

well i wonna thank everyone for their input and help on this topic. being new to the trade i went to my local petland, petco, petsmart and exotic pet shops and sad to say none of them carried FF's. so i basically just baught enough at the reptile expos to last to the next one.. now i have more frogs. they just dont produce fast enough for propper feeding. i ordered my flys offline twice and it was very costly.. cost more for shipping then it did for 2 cultures. and that is when i decided to attempt to culture my own flys. i started my culture about 3 days ago it looks very good so far to spite i dont have a place to keep it that has 65% humidity so i mist the inside of the culture every so oftin and the media seems to be soft yet solid ( not soupy ) so im guessing that its holding up well i stuck 2 coffee filters in it and added a culture of flys i got from a friend. now since i started this culture. both my local petsmart and petco and exotic pet shop are all carryin the tiny lil cultures for 8 dollars each.. isnt that ironic or what? lol. so i guess my culture wont start producing for 21 days at least now i have a place to get flys from.


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

What are you using for medium? You probably dont need to mist it, its extremely low humidity in here right now (winter in NY, with heated air) and i dont need to mist mine


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## Dragas (Sep 4, 2008)

Ed Holder said:


> I use equal parts of banana, apple sauce (Sweetened), plain oatmeal
> boil it for 5min add 1 tsp bakers yeast for every 2cups of above mix, 1tsp vinegar for every 2cups as well. Mix thoroughly. When i make new cultures i sprinkle a pinch of yeast over the media in each culture.....
> 
> Ed


I use this basic recipe, I just microwave as oppose to boil. I also make extra (fruit /oatmeal slurry) and freeze it.


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## Ed Holder (Sep 26, 2008)

I've even done it with just bananas and grapes in the blender and recieved a high yield of flies...

Ed


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## DCreptiles (Jan 26, 2009)

i notice alot of ppl use fruit mix's could you just do it with whole fruits? i mean how do the flys do it normally ya know? shouldnt be to hard.. oh and i use a media i got from blackjungle.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

DCreptiles said:


> i notice alot of ppl use fruit mix's could you just do it with whole fruits? i mean how do the flys do it normally ya know? shouldnt be to hard.. oh and i use a media i got from blackjungle.


So just have jar with a whole bananna in it or something?

I suppose that would work in producing flies, but feeding them out with a whole fruit would be difficult. The media just sticks to the bottom so you don't have to worry about maggots or pupae coming out.


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## Jason (Oct 14, 2004)

Anyone that I run across that is looking into getting dart frogs, I tell them to start breeding fruit flies. If you cannot breed fruit flies than you should probably not get dart frogs. Purchasing flies is just fine if you don't want to hassle with breeding a ton of flies, but sometimes they may come in bad/dead or their could be a problem with shipping. It is always a good idea to keep a back-up supply of flies ready in case this happens.

Even if you breed your own flies it is good to have a back-up plan for this as well. Get to know fellow froggers in your area, so you can get an emergency supply of flies if need ASAP. Also become familiar with some of the vendors that sell fruit flies.

A readily supply of food is at the top of the list of importance when it comes to keeping dart frogs.


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

I use Black Jungle's also, as long as you mix it right you dont need to add water to it - too wet and the flies will get stuck or drown anyway, you also need a little patience though (and remember to put a pinch of yeast in before you put the flies in). Check out these clips and the others BJ put on there:
YouTube - How to Culture Fruit Flies : Measuring Media, Water & Yeast for Culturing Fruit Flies
YouTube - How to Culture Fruit Flies : Adding Flies to a Fruit Fly Culture


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## Ed Holder (Sep 26, 2008)

DCreptiles said:


> i notice alot of ppl use fruit mix's could you just do it with whole fruits? i mean how do the flys do it normally ya know? shouldnt be to hard.. oh and i use a media i got from blackjungle.


As i previously mentioned....I have done this with JUST bananas and grapes blended, it was a little soupy but worked great!

Ed


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## Jayson745 (Dec 13, 2006)

DCreptiles said:


> well i wonna thank everyone for their input and help on this topic. being new to the trade i went to my local petland, petco, petsmart and exotic pet shops and sad to say none of them carried FF's. so i basically just baught enough at the reptile expos to last to the next one.. now i have more frogs. they just dont produce fast enough for propper feeding. i ordered my flys offline twice and it was very costly.. cost more for shipping then it did for 2 cultures. and that is when i decided to attempt to culture my own flys. i started my culture about 3 days ago it looks very good so far to spite i dont have a place to keep it that has 65% humidity so i mist the inside of the culture every so oftin and the media seems to be soft yet solid ( not soupy ) so im guessing that its holding up well i stuck 2 coffee filters in it and added a culture of flys i got from a friend. now since i started this culture. both my local petsmart and petco and exotic pet shop are all carryin the tiny lil cultures for 8 dollars each.. isnt that ironic or what? lol. so i guess my culture wont start producing for 21 days at least now i have a place to get flys from.


you might want more than 2 coffee filters in there. I dont know how others do it, but I usually take 2-3 filters and push my finger into the middle of them, then crush them around my finger, so it kind of makes a cone shape. Then I add about 5 of those to one culture so there are cones of filters smooshed in there, but loose enough for flies to get down to the media. the problem I had with using less is that they tend to colaps eventually and cover the media.


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## LME7132 (Feb 5, 2009)

*Re: buying vs breeding flys (Recipees)*

I would recommend buying a culture kit from someone on-line, like Josh's frogs, as well as a couple cultures and starting from there. Then as you get familiar with culturing flies you can decide what works for you and what doesn't without having to start from scratch. (Though I did it the opposite way.)

An easy recipe I've used for a while is potato flakes (instant mash potatoes), yeast, cinnamon, and calcium fortified orange juice. I'm not terribly consistent with the proportions, usually I just dump a box of potato flakes into a bag, add about half a jar of dry yeast and enough cinnamon to see it spread though when I shake the bag up. I heat the orange juice in the microwave, dump it into my cultures containers and add dry mix until I'm happy with the consistency. (In the winter when the house is dry I make it a little runny.) Then add some shredded wood and flies. I get great yields with wingless Drosophila Melanogaster. I used to mix up fruit/potato mixes that worked fine, but I had more issues with mold and it didn't clean up as easy when the culture was finished.


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

ChrisK said:


> What are you using for medium? You probably dont need to mist it, its extremely low humidity in here right now (winter in NY, with heated air) and i dont need to mist mine


Wow, I got negative reputation points from someone for posting that. They said I was "bragging" haha


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## DCreptiles (Jan 26, 2009)

i try not to buy supplys offline to oftin because i see some vendors at the reptile expo's such as black jungle and their media mix and stuff is nice and cheap there so i actually buy alot of stuff in pieces or just all at once from them at the shows. i mean i do know how to breed the fruit flys i just mixed my first culture the day i posted this and it seems to be doing great the media isnt soupy and isnt tried out. the filters i used have not collapsed and the flys are still alive lol.. the holes i made seem to be doing the trick. i mean its not pretty..but it seems to be getting the job done. and i also have cultures i purchased from my local pet smart that are going strong. i have 3 of them since their very tiny. and when i go to the hamburg show in p.a i will be sure to get a 32oz. freshly started culture as my back up but by then my culture should be producing.. but this thread has inspired me to test my own mix's to see if i can put something together that works well and is simple to do.


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## Jayson745 (Dec 13, 2006)

ChrisK said:


> Wow, I got negative reputation points from someone for posting that. They said I was "bragging" haha


Now thats funny. I hate this reputation thing.


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