# 12x12x18 vs. 18x18x18 for Ranitomeya imitator



## whiteblaze11 (May 23, 2010)

Wanting to start a tank for these fellas and just had a few questions after weeks of researching but just need a few more questions answered

1. How many can you keep in either a 12x12x18 or 18x18x18? 

2. Also what species is more bold than others because i heard they can be quite shy?


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## heatfreakk3 (Oct 15, 2008)

I have a 2.1 trio of varadero imis in a 18x18x24 zoomed that breed like crazy. I also have a group of 4 juvenile banded imis in a 18x18x18 zoomed. Both these species are very bold in my opinion. Out of my group of varadero I always see at least 1-2 every time I look, and with my bandeds I always see 2-3 every time I look. They are always out. Also, they have a pretty nice call. It's not too loud, but loud enough to hear them nicely when your in the room.


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## frog dude (Nov 11, 2011)

whiteblaze11 said:


> Wanting to start a tank for these fellas and just had a few questions after weeks of researching but just need a few more questions answered
> 
> 1. How many can you keep in either a 12x12x18 or 18x18x18?
> 
> 2. Also what species is more bold than others because i heard they can be quite shy?


A pair would be fine in a 12x12x18, although It might be a little to small. A better tank would be a 20g high flipped up on it's side and turned into a vertical conversion. But if you have this one, it would work Decently. An 18x18x18, in my opinion, doesn't have enough vertical space for imis. 

Also, male imitators can be aggressive so it is always recommended to start with a 1.1 (1 male 1 female) pair to avoid the aggression, even though in the 12x12x18 I wouldn't do more then a pair anyway. People have done it before successfully, but beginners aren't recommended to do so.


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## whiteblaze11 (May 23, 2010)

Ok thanks for the help guys!
I am looking at getting the starter kit from Joshs frogs since its seem like a reasonable price for everything including the tank.
Do you know of anywhere i would be able to find sexed individuals?


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## frog dude (Nov 11, 2011)

Just check here often. People do post proven/sexed pairs and individuals for sale fairly consistently. You can also post a wanted ad in the wanted forum.


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

frog dude said:


> A pair would be fine in a 12x12x18, although It might be a little to small. A better tank would be a 20g high flipped up on it's side and turned into a vertical conversion. But if you have this one, it would work Decently. An 18x18x18, in my opinion, doesn't have enough vertical space for imis.
> 
> Also, male imitators can be aggressive so it is always recommended to start with a 1.1 (1 male 1 female) pair to avoid the aggression, even though in the 12x12x18 I wouldn't do more then a pair anyway. People have done it before successfully, but beginners aren't recommended to do so.


I don't understand how you can say that an 18x18x18 doesn't have enough vertical area for imis while a 12x12x18 has the exact same amount of height just less floor space. Because of this I would reccomend the 18x18x18 just because it gives the micro fauna more space and its easier to work with to make a nice vivarium. Just my 2 cents.
Buddy


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## Boboluke (Apr 12, 2013)

It sounds backwards. The 12x12 just seems like a very small footprint to work with to me. Then again, I don't have any thumbs... yet.


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## frog dude (Nov 11, 2011)

Buddysfrogs said:


> I don't understand how you can say that an 18x18x18 doesn't have enough vertical area for imis while a 12x12x18 has the exact same amount of height just less floor space. Because of this I would reccomend the 18x18x18 just because it gives the micro fauna more space and its easier to work with to make a nice vivarium. Just my 2 cents.
> Buddy



Whoops, yeah. That's not embarrassing I was tired, and sunburned, and most of my face was blistering (Including my lips!), so I wasn't thinking straight. Yeah, since they both have the same amount of vertical space both would be fine. I just assume use the 12x12x18 for thumbs and the 18x18x18 for larger frogs, in case the OP would want some, since larger frogs won't work as well in the 12x12x18 then thumbnails. I'm not saying they won't work, just not as well.


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## Nismo95 (Jul 30, 2011)

Also Frog Dude, you mention that male on male aggression. I should also point out that does not mean go for 1 male and 2 females as the females are more likely to show aggression IMO. I have moved to keeping a 2.1 trio of my imitators because when we got our Veradero we got 4 juvi's.. which turned out to be a 1.3 group... Didnt take long before Queen Veradero demanded the other 2 females left her man alone.. The Aggression with her was off the charts. However! the man who sold me the Veradero had a 2.1 trio.. and after his first year of breeding the males started to fight. So long story short.. Pairs are best like Frog Dude mentioned.. but sometimes we just get plain ol' lucky with having a trio that works well together.

Brandon


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## frog dude (Nov 11, 2011)

Groups have worked for imis successfully, but if anybody does they should have a large tank with many natural barriers and dividers, and should also be prepared to separate frogs, so a handy backup grow-out tank is also nice to have. 

Thanks Brandon! I didn't know that. I guess I was thinking pumilio male-to-male aggression.


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## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

Either size is fine. 12x12x18 is roughly 12 gallons or so. I kept my breeding pairs in a 10g vert. Its all dependant on if you want to use the bigger tank or not. 
Also, keeping thumbs in a vert is not necessary either. In the wild, these frogs are 10s of feet off the ground, so the difference of _inches_ between a vert or horizontal makes no difference whatsoever ... its all aestitics & Ive had thumbs breed in both.

In regards to numbers, based off my own personal experiences, I would recommend a pair. Ive had some that didnt fight ... but majorily when kept in groups, I've eventually had to break them up.


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