# Help ID species



## Daywalker (Nov 7, 2019)

Bought them as D. auratus chocolate and i want to confirm that.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Welcome to the board! 

There is no way to get an accurate ID on morph. You would need to check in with the breeder and get line information to know for sure. This is why we have to be careful who we buy from. I assume you are new to the hobby, but it would be a good idea to ask these kinds of questions before purchasing. Pretty frog, though!

Mark


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## Daywalker (Nov 7, 2019)

Thanks for the welcoming 

I've been keeping 2 D. auratus green since last December and bought these 4 and 4 E. tricolor this June at a reptile show in Spain.

Wasnt aware there are morphs (except albinism) regarding dart frogs and had the idea that there was only diferent species/sub species/locality.

This is that tank i build for the E. tricolor


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Great tank! Sorry, my use of the term morph is probably sloppy  There is not much talk of sub-species in dart frogs. Locale is a much better word but only applies if you know where the frogs were collected. This may not describe all of the different options for kinds of frogs out there, especially some frogs that have been in the hobby for a long time and never had good locale information associated with them. This is the same situation for frogs produced by artificial selection (fine-spot leucomelas? chocolate leucomelas?). I just use "morph" to cover any grouping that occurs below species. Again, it's probably a sloppy practice, but it is better than having to write "species/locale/line/whatever" each time I write  Maybe I should use a different word or go with "species/locale/line/whatever" instead! 

Regardless, it is notoriously difficult to tell based on appearance what some kind of frog it is. There are lots of different genetic (and even environmental or husbandry) situations that can give rise to frogs of extremely similar appearance. Without knowing the origins of a frog, you don't have enough information to assign a frog to any particular grouping. That's what I meant to say 

Mark


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## Daywalker (Nov 7, 2019)

Yes, i completly understood now what you meant.

The same way Morelia viridis were being told apart regarding their locality and were classified all as the same species.

I'll try to get ahold of the breeder and see if he can explain it to me how they are classified 

Thanks for your input


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## Raven Woodshaunter (Feb 21, 2017)

Looks a lot like my Ancon Hill Auratus. But, as Encyclia says, no way to tell for sure.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Encyclia said:


> Great tank! Sorry, my use of the term morph is probably sloppy  There is not much talk of sub-species in dart frogs. Locale is a much better word but only applies if you know where the frogs were collected.


I'm under the impression that 'morph' as it refers to darts is short for 'morphologically distinct naturally occurring* population'. If this is true, then 'locale' is a different concept, and both terms are useful. 

Interestingly, in the larger herp hobby, 'morph' means 'a visually distinct animal in which that distinction is _either_ the function of a single gene _or_ is a heritable and relatively stable line-bred trait. What we call 'morph' here would usually be called 'phase' (e.g. 'blairs phase gray band kingsnake') by the rest of the herp hobby. 



Encyclia said:


> frogs produced by artificial selection (fine-spot leucomelas? chocolate leucomelas?).


Yes on the chocolate; fine spot leucs, though, are a naturally occurring morph from Venezuela. (*We call chocolate leucs a 'morph', I guess, but I'm going to make sure I qualify that by saying 'selectively bred morph' or something)


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## Daywalker (Nov 7, 2019)

Raven, do you happend to have any photo of them?
Would love to see and compare them to mine


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