# Vitamin Powder Buildup in Vivarium



## aapuzzo (Apr 20, 2020)

I need some advice on reducing vitamin powder buildup in the vivarium. I have become better at shaking the fruit flies out leaving the powder behind but it is a PITA and just reduces the problem. I watch the flies scatter and shake the powder off all around the vivarium and glass. Now it is starting to build up into little globs. Is their a cleanup crew that will eat the powder? Does one brand powder not buildup as bad as another? This vivarium is only a few months old so I rather get ahead on this now.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

I'm having trouble understanding how this can happen, especially to the degree of 'globs of powder'. I suspect you're quite overfeeding (number of FFs), or have a very small viv.

Could you provide more info? Viv details, number/species of darts, supplement brand, feeding frequency, type of FFs, exactly how you dust and dispense FFs, etc, etc.


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## Woodswalker (Dec 26, 2014)

You could try cutting down on the amount of powder you add to your flies to begin with so you don't have to be so careful not to dump the remains into the tank. You could also set up a feeding station, like a yogurt lid, where you dump your flies, and periodically remove the lid for cleaning, so you don't get so much buildup in the tank. It sounds like you are using a massive amount of powder.

Someone else recently devised a little filter for just this problem. I don't remember the name of the thread, but it was very recent.

It has been floated a few times that a little excess dusting in the tank could be beneficial for the microfauna. I have observed isopods eating my excess powder. I do still try to minimize powder dumping, but I've reserved a place in my tanks for feeding, so I don't have to be disappointed over how that corner looks.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

You definitely want to limit any excess vitamin powder. Isopods absolutely love it. The problem comes over time. There is a form of vitamin E called Tocopherols in most supplements. Isopods do not process tocopherols. Instead, it is sequestered in the isopod, accumulating to levels much higher than found in the wild. If your frog eats enough of these, the vitamin E level in the frog can rise higher than normal. If the vitamin E level in the frog gets high enough, it can block the intake of other vitamins, like vitamins A and D. If levels get high enough to block the Vitamin D completely, then calcium can't be processed properly. If the blood calcium level gets low enough, the frog can go into spasms and die.
This is only one example of how easily vitamins can get out of balance. Other sequestered vitamins may also be blocking other important vitamin utilization. 

Some is going to get in there no matter what you do. Just try to limit it as best you can. Yes, there are clean up crews that will eat it, but first make sure you have done your job in limiting it.


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## cobe (Oct 10, 2015)

I get this now and again. I pour the flies onto a plant point saucer in the tank. I pour the flies straight onto a piece of banana as i find they tend to stay in that spot giving the frogs enough time to eat them...


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Now Calcium power...you WANT that spilled in the viv. The little guys need as much of that as possible.

Just hand-spray any unsightly powder away. I've never met a gob too big to be hand sprayed.


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## Woodswalker (Dec 26, 2014)

I assumed OP meant calcium powder. A lot of people tend to refer to all dusted supplements generically as, "vitamin powder," so I naturally envisioned white powder globs of Repashy Cal+D in my head by default.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Keep in mind that if we are talking about Repashy, Repashy Calcium Plus is not simply calcium. It also contains a full spectrum of vitamins.


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## Organics (Jan 17, 2020)

I’ve recently started adding a calcium supplement(calcium carbonate(whitting)) directly to my microfuana cultures


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## aapuzzo (Apr 20, 2020)

Thanks for all the replies. I guess I didn't mean globs but I have to spray good amount off of leaves and footprints off the glass when the flies scatter. I do rotate between Rapashy Calcium Plus and Zoomed Repticalcium without D3. The Repticalcium is far worst. I would love to make one of those filters. Trying to shake the flies out leaving the small amount of powder behind gets old fast. Now that the weather is warm outside I transfer all the flies into powder outdoors and dump the few extras outside with small amount of excess powder. When it was winter you really didn't want to leave the extras in the transfer cup or they take up residence around your sinks. My main concerns were related to the washing away of the powder over time and the buildup in the substrate and if the cleanup crews helping with that. Ideally I want to just dump the flies in and move on. Not play games shaking them out .


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

aapuzzo said:


> Zoomed Repticalcium without D3.


That is not an acceptable supplement to use for darts without running UVB; neither is it an acceptable supplement to alternate with Calcium Plus.


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## aapuzzo (Apr 20, 2020)

I can use just the calcium plus. I was told too much D3 could be bad. Which calcium powder should I rotate then?


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

aapuzzo said:


> Thanks for all the replies. I guess I didn't mean globs but I have to spray good amount off of leaves and footprints off the glass when the flies scatter. I do rotate between Rapashy Calcium Plus and Zoomed Repticalcium without D3. The Repticalcium is far worst. I would love to make one of those filters. Trying to shake the flies out leaving the small amount of powder behind gets old fast. Now that the weather is warm outside I transfer all the flies into powder outdoors and dump the few extras outside with small amount of excess powder. When it was winter you really didn't want to leave the extras in the transfer cup or they take up residence around your sinks. My main concerns were related to the washing away of the powder over time and the buildup in the substrate and if the cleanup crews helping with that. Ideally I want to just dump the flies in and move on. Not play games shaking them out .


Some times things take practice. Its not hard. Its not "Playing Games" its just a new action for you that takes a little coordination.

Its a basic and very small thing to get down, and actually it can be very pleasant to let interactions with natural things sink in, to be able to time your swirl, not lose any, now thats fun.

In an era where people in the prime of life sit clutching a plastic controller "Playing Games" ...honing "skills" in hyperrealistic cartoon lands, I find slinging bugs fun.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Too much D3 is bad (though overdosing D3 in captive herps is very, very rare, and underdosing it is very common), but Calcium Plus does not have too much D3. Calcium Plus is designed to be used at every feeding, like it states on the label. You don't need to rotate anything, but if you do, that product also has to be a complete supplement (not just plain calcium, which is only useful -- if at all -- for herbivores that receive UVB). 

If you use Calcium Plus only half the time, your frogs will only be getting half as much D3 (and A, and E, and B, and...you get the idea) as they need.


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

I think part of the problem may be the particle size of your ReptiZooCalciJunk. If there are lots of "chunks", or larger spheres of supplement, it will be more difficult to successfully tap out flies without getting supps in the tank, because the size/weight of the two would be similar. With fine powders, the flies tend to "float' on top of the supplement, especially after some judicious tapping/swirling. You will always get some powder in your tank, but it can be reduced to the bare minimum with a little practice, provided that you utilize quality vitamin/mineral blends like Repashy.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Dane said:


> I think part of the problem may be the particle size of your ReptiZooCalciJunk.


Good thing to check into, but this ZooMed product is precipitated CaCO3 -- very fine particle size. I used to use their line back in the 90's, when there wasn't really anything better, and it was good stuff.


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Good thing to check into, but this ZooMed product is precipitated CaCO3 -- very fine particle size. I used to use their line back in the 90's, when there wasn't really anything better, and it was good stuff.


I'm always suspicious of the QC on diet additives made by the larger reptile product manufacturers, at least for use with dart frogs, but if I presumed incorrectly, then I recant. It may still be possible that the product saw excessive humidity at some point, and began to clump.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Dane said:


> I'm always suspicious of the QC on diet additives made by the larger reptile product manufacturers, at least for use with dart frogs, but if I presumed incorrectly, then I recant. It may still be possible that the product saw excessive humidity at some point, and began to clump.


Yeeeeahh. 

I not the most trusting consumer either. It started a human quality quest which I still find attractive for some stuff.

But I gotta say, Im glad Ive given Rapashy a chance. I like what I have learned and what I read smell and see.


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## Wug (Mar 1, 2009)

I used an extra cup and a mesh kitchen strainer. Set the strainer on an empty cup, pour dusted flys onto strainer. Grab the strainer, tap it over the cup, and quickly dump strainer with flys into tank. Boom! no excess supplements in the tank.


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## dartsinmanhattan (Apr 11, 2018)

I use three empty fly culture cups and a small metal strainer. I bought the strainer from Josh's Frogs:

https://www.joshsfrogs.com/rice-flour-beetle-media-sifter.html

Put all your supplements in one cup and mix them around. Add flies and swirl around to coat. Pour everything through the strainer over the second cup. Dump the "clean" flies from the strainer into the third cup. 

If you really want to be safe, put a petri dish with a banana slice in the tank, and pour the flies into the dish. Take it out after feeding. My frogs learned very quickly that petri dish = feeding time.


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