# Taller Insitu Vivarium (Alto)



## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Hello folks,

Not affiliated with the company but I know at least a couple of folks in the last few months have been interested in taller vivs. I just saw that Insitu released their 'Alto' tank.










Essentially it is a 36" tall version of their regular vivarium. So same footprint but 36" tall. Its also pretty darn expensive at 600 dollars for the tank which includes a light and fan system. Shipping is another 100 dollars and they have an additional 45 dollar deposit because they need to crate this critter and they want their crate back. So you get back the 45 dollars if you send the crate back to them. 

Bottom line is 700 dollars (assuming you send back their crate) plus tax but you get a 36" tall viv that is mostly fruit fly proof with light and fan system. 

For my own part I will be building my own vivs going forward but for those that don't want to go that route and can part with the cash this is a solid option.


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## JPP (Mar 25, 2015)

I had an Exo Terra display viv set up once that had almost those same dimensions, though I tore it down and sold it recently. The Alto looks like it would be a nice display viv as well, though I didn't know it involved all of that shipping crate crap to get one. Makes sense though I guess for safe shipping transit, but it seems like a headache waiting to happen. I've considered buying an Insitu or two, but I would just get the Selva. I don't need all of the extras that come with the other models.


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

Okay so i've been debating on which new tank to go with i want something close to a 18x18x24. 


The exo terra equivalent by me is 139.99$ 18x18x24in

The Zoo Med Paludarium is 79.99$ 12x12x24in 

The inStitu amazonia is 375.00 22x18x24in Comes with light and fans... (way overpriced but nice complete package.)

The equivalent but bigger height wise Zoo Med Paludarium 18x18x36 is 159.99$-180$ 

The new Insitu is 600$!!! 22x18x37in WTF> 

I know the zoo meds aren't as popular, but why?!?! this tank is awesome. if you like the exo terras these are just better! why?

Some of the reasons i came up with are:
1 piece of glass, not 2 pieces for the front window the viewing is better in my opinion. (not even close). 
PRICE! 
In my short lived experience with the zoo med is way easier to fruit fly proof than exo terras. Bottom air vents are a little higher up making it tougher for flys to escape. 
You can actually see the bottom of your tanks from eye level. (eco terras brace/vent is right at soil level! Helping flys escape easier and blocking view of the leaves and soil when looked at from eye level.)

Again one last thing not to over look THE PRICE!!!


Just been doing a lot of thinking and research about what tanks will be in my next rack. I WANT InSitu, but its looking like a pipe dream.... if it was a all glass sexy Euro style tank i think the price would be justified. But currently.... unless you were floating in money i just don't get why you would spend the money. 


Just saw the zoo med sky scrapper for 170$ its 18x18x36 with a very similar look to the exo terra, but i think this one has 1 front glass panel not 2 hinging ones. 

All prices are local pet shops or lowest online price for Insitu tanks.


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

ShrimpsRus said:


> The new Insitu is 600$!!! 22x18x37in WTF>
> 
> I know the zoo meds aren't as popular, but why?!?! this tank is awesome. if you like the exo terras these are just better! why?


This tank is just darn expensive there is no way around it. Its the exact same as an amazonia model just taller. I don't see the extra height of glass and plastic (the back panel is plastic with aluminum sheets I believe) costing an additional 220 dollars.. But that is what they are charging for it.

I bought the Selva Plus model from insitu. I did this because I wasn't sure if I was going to want their fan system (I did end up wanting it) and I wanted to have the ability add it. The cost of the selva plus with shipping is 300 dollars which is probably the fair comparison to the other tanks you mentioned since the others don't come with lights and fans (I believe?). 

Anyway the reason they are charging so much AND getting away with it is that theirs is the only tank that comes fruit fly proof (I found they can still escape through their doors but maybe I just got a bum door). No one else advertises as much and the others require you to do some DIY work to replicate same. So they are basically marketing towards people that don't want to put in that DIY effort. /shrug


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Another difference: the Zoo Med is made in the USA, unlike the Exo Terra.

On one or two doors: I never, ever, look at my vivs and think "I don't like the two door look". I never see it; the line down the middle disappears, visually.

But, every single time I go to feed, though (and I mean every time) I am happy my vivs have two doors. It is *so* much easier to keep frogs in. I would never buy a single door viv if a double door version were available in the size I want.


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## Pubfiction (Feb 3, 2013)

If you guys are looking for some alternative tanks there are alot of new ones that are showing up. I saw something imported from china that looked like its designed to be shipped in a much smaller box and assembled. You also have ones from pet smart. The hobbies are definitely growing when we are starting to get this many options.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

I am right there with you, ShrimpsRus. I buy Zoo Med for anything up to the size of the Skyscraper. That's the biggest one that they make, to the best of my knowledge. I have a couple of the Exos for larger tanks (36x18x36 and 36x18x24) but I prefer the Zoo Meds in general. The price is the main reason, but there are others, most importantly the single glass door with no seam in the middle. Fly proofing any of them has been a pipe dream, so I don't even factor that in my decision-making. I have 3 of the 18x18x36s from Zoo Med and the only thing I don't like about them is the difficulty in 'scaping them properly.

$700 seems ludicrous for the same basic volume/shape as the Exo/Zoo Med options. I can put whatever light on there that I want and still come out WAY below what the Alto costs. I also still think there is too much black plastic on those tanks. I guess there are other bells and whistles I am missing but nothing I need. This is a head-scratcher for me. Well, to each his or her own, I guess. 

Mark


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Another difference: the Zoo Med is made in the USA, unlike the Exo Terra.
> 
> On one or two doors: I never, ever, look at my vivs and think "I don't like the two door look". I never see it; the line down the middle disappears, visually.
> 
> But, every single time I go to feed, though (and I mean every time) I am happy my vivs have two doors. It is *so* much easier to keep frogs in. I would never buy a single door viv if a double door version were available in the size I want.


While i agree with the feeding! It is nice only opening one side to feed or mist and it is safer frog wise (jumping out)

I just simply disagree with the double door vs 1 door panel. I have both tanks next to each other. You are right the double doors are barely noticeable on there own! BUT when i look over and look at my other tank the single glass panel just looks better. i've done some major starring here lol


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Pubfiction said:


> If you guys are looking for some alternative tanks there are alot of new ones that are showing up. I saw something imported from china that looked like its designed to be shipped in a much smaller box and assembled. You also have ones from pet smart. The hobbies are definitely growing when we are starting to get this many options.


I've seen the Thrive ones from petsmart but haven't heard good things thus far. Do you have any links or pictures of the chinese tanks? I haven't heard of these. 

I know a fellow named Trey is bringing out a new euro style viv in the fall. I saw this posted on facebook: 










Supposed to be priced at around 150 (presumably before shipping). I am guessing this is a knockdown viv that will require assembly but that is just my guess.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

minorhero said:


> This tank is just darn expensive there is no way around it. Its the exact same as an amazonia model just taller. I don't see the extra height of glass and plastic (the back panel is plastic with aluminum sheets I believe) costing an additional 220 dollars.. But that is what they are charging for it.


Amazonia $375 + Alumilite back $58 = $433

Alto with Alum back = $595

$162 difference

Amazonia = 24 lbs
Alto = 42 lbs

A 58% increase in overall weight for a 50% increase in the height (and no change in the footprint) suggests that the glass is thicker in the Alto.


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

minorhero said:


> This tank is just darn expensive there is no way around it. Its the exact same as an amazonia model just taller. I don't see the extra height of glass and plastic (the back panel is plastic with aluminum sheets I believe) costing an additional 220 dollars.. But that is what they are charging for it.
> 
> 
> The plastic/aluminum black back panel is EXTRA!!! like 60$ for something that should be standard.
> ...


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

Pubfiction said:


> If you guys are looking for some alternative tanks there are alot of new ones that are showing up. I saw something imported from china that looked like its designed to be shipped in a much smaller box and assembled. You also have ones from pet smart. The hobbies are definitely growing when we are starting to get this many options.


If these are the Atasuki "knockdown" tanks, be aware that you won't be able to drill the tank for drainage. I received one in error (had ordered a regular Atasuki terrarium and was given the knockdown version), and I took it back because I couldn't drill it for drainage add there's a double pane of glass art the bottom. 



Socratic Monologue said:


> Another difference: the Zoo Med is made in the USA, unlike the Exo Terra.
> 
> On one or two doors: I never, ever, look at my vivs and think "I don't like the two door look". I never see it; the line down the middle disappears, visually.
> 
> But, every single time I go to feed, though (and I mean every time) I am happy my vivs have two doors. It is *so* much easier to keep frogs in. I would never buy a single door viv if a double door version were available in the size I want.


Agreed! I have a single door 18x18x24" zoo med terrarium, and it's a pain to open for the frogs, too much space for them to escape unnoticed while I'm dumping flies in. Double doors all the way for me!


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

minorhero said:


> I've seen the Thrive ones from petsmart but haven't heard good things thus far. Do you have any links or pictures of the chinese tanks? I haven't heard of these.
> 
> I know a fellow named Trey is bringing out a new euro style viv in the fall. I saw this posted on facebook:
> 
> ...




I saw this on Fb i like. more options the better right! Personally i don't have a big frog wall setup yet so i don't fully cover the sides of my glass so that's a negative for this tank and me. The venting and everything looks right though. Cant wait for some reviews. I like the breakdown ness of it all. Shipping will be much cheaper.


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Amazonia $375 + Alumilite back $58 = $433
> 
> Alto with Alum back = $595
> 
> ...


Ah your right! I forgot the amazonia didn't come with the plastic back panel by default. 

Even with thicker glass there must be a larger profit margin on this tank. I mean I can get glass cheaper then this at retail, so I am just assuming they can bulk order and get it cheaper still.


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## JPP (Mar 25, 2015)

ShrimpsRus said:


> Okay so i've been debating on which new tank to go with i want something close to a 18x18x24.
> 
> 
> The exo terra equivalent by me is 139.99$ 18x18x24in
> ...


The 24x18x24 and 24x18x36 Exo Terras are closer equivalents to the Insitu vivs than the sizes you mentioned.


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## JPP (Mar 25, 2015)

Encyclia said:


> I am right there with you, ShrimpsRus. I buy Zoo Med for anything up to the size of the Skyscraper. That's the biggest one that they make, to the best of my knowledge. I have a couple of the Exos for larger tanks (36x18x36 and 36x18x24) but I prefer the Zoo Meds in general. The price is the main reason, but there are others, most importantly the single glass door with no seam in the middle. Fly proofing any of them has been a pipe dream, so I don't even factor that in my decision-making. I have 3 of the 18x18x36s from Zoo Med and the only thing I don't like about them is the difficulty in 'scaping them properly.
> 
> $700 seems ludicrous for the same basic volume/shape as the Exo/Zoo Med options. I can put whatever light on there that I want and still come out WAY below what the Alto costs. I also still think there is too much black plastic on those tanks. I guess there are other bells and whistles I am missing but nothing I need. This is a head-scratcher for me. Well, to each his or her own, I guess.
> 
> Mark


Hey Mark, 
Zoo Med now makes a 36x18x36 and a 36x18x18. They are both double door, and both "paludarium" style with the taller substrate glass wall below the vent though.


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

JPP said:


> The 24x18x24 and 24x18x36 Exo Terras are closer equivalents to the Insitu vivs than the sizes you mentioned.


Interesting fact to consider. ive been looking for arboreal species, so i guess i wasn't looking for bigger options.


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## bssknox (Apr 24, 2017)

minorhero said:


> I've seen the Thrive ones from petsmart but haven't heard good things thus far. Do you have any links or pictures of the chinese tanks? I haven't heard of these.
> 
> I know a fellow named Trey is bringing out a new euro style viv in the fall. I saw this posted on facebook:
> 
> ...


I will likely try out Trey's tank. I'm told it's going to be shipped flat in order to cut down on shipping costs and risks of being damaged in transit. I've seen the video of them putting one together and it looks very easy, yet sturdy once complete. In another video he mentioned a deal with an unnamed vendor that was likely to be offering his tanks (crossing my fingers for a physical store versus online vendor).


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

JPP said:


> Hey Mark,
> Zoo Med now makes a 36x18x36 and a 36x18x18. They are both double door, and both "paludarium" style with the taller substrate glass wall below the vent though.


Good to know, JPP. Thanks for the info. That must be relatively recent. Double doors are a must on tanks that size, so that doesn't surprise me. I don't much like the paludarium depth, though. I had heard rumor they were going that direction on a lot of their larger tanks. That is a problem because it puts the bottom of the doors and black plastic right in line with viewing the frogs on the floor. Are they cheaper than the Exo Terras of equivalent size? I don't get out much anymore and have not been in the market for a tank in quite a while 

Mark


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

ShrimpsRus said:


> minorhero said:
> 
> 
> > This tank is just darn expensive there is no way around it. Its the exact same as an amazonia model just taller. I don't see the extra height of glass and plastic (the back panel is plastic with aluminum sheets I believe) costing an additional 220 dollars.. But that is what they are charging for it.
> ...


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Fahad said:


> This isnt meant to be an attack on you, minorhero --


To be clear the part you made bold as well as some of the other text I did not write, someone else had some odd formatting issues which you should probably look at.


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## JPP (Mar 25, 2015)

Encyclia said:


> Good to know, JPP. Thanks for the info. That must be relatively recent. Double doors are a must on tanks that size, so that doesn't surprise me. I don't much like the paludarium depth, though. I had heard rumor they were going that direction on a lot of their larger tanks. That is a problem because it puts the bottom of the doors and black plastic right in line with viewing the frogs on the floor. Are they cheaper than the Exo Terras of equivalent size? I don't get out much anymore and have not been in the market for a tank in quite a while
> 
> Mark


I've only seen the 36x18x36 at a reptile expo (and online of course), and they do seem to be a little cheaper than the Exos:
https://zoomed.com/paludarium-double-door/

The 36x18x18 I've seen for sale recently at my local Petco. I forgot, this one actually has a normal sized substrate wall, not the paludarium taller glass wall:
https://zoomed.com/naturalistic-terrarium-double-door/

They also have a smaller 25 gallon one with the footprint of a 20 gallon long, that is 16 inches high (also with 2 front opening doors). I've only seen these at Petco in the past few weeks.
https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/product/zoo-med-double-door-naturalistic-terrarium


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

minorhero said:


> To be clear the part you made bold as well as some of the other text I did not write, someone else had some odd formatting issues which you should probably look at.



Ah. I’ll check it out when I’m back on my laptop. Cheers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

Well, apparently we can't edit posts on this forum so I'll quote myself re-worked for clarity without the misattribution:


Everyone would love to see specialty products but many balk at the price, the companies fail and the hobby remains DIY to whatever degree.

In a very broad sense, sometimes I think that if hobbyists bought fewer animals and more gear we'd eventually see much cooler stuff brought to market.


A lot of hobbyists clearly have the money, but would rather spend it on frogs instead of enclosures. It's their prerogative but maybe this is why we can't have nice things.

I get that people place value on different things and some people prefer DIY, but I can't see anything this niche ever being 'cheap', one way or the other.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Fahad said:


> Well, apparently we can't edit posts on this forum


We can, but not after others (one; more?) have commented after them. Allowing editing of older posts, to which replies have been posted, might make some of these threads completely incomprehensible.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

I'm doing a test on the Atasuki tanks to see how I like them compared to the "standard" Exo terras. I have two similarly sized tanks set up: a 36x18x18" exo terra and a 36x18x24" Atasuki. 

My initial thoughts are that the Atasuki is a far superior build quality: The doors and front panel are nice and sturdy, the lid is an actual lid that doesn't look like it's going to buckle with nothing but a light on it.(as has happened to my exo terra lids in the past) 

I also found the Atasuki easier to fly proof: the sliding doors come with a barrier strip to keep the flies in, the front vent panel is easy to silicone a piece of fly mesh onto, the lid is sturdy and easy to silicone fly mesh onto as well. Add some plexiglass on-top and you're golden. Way easier than fidgetting with an exo terra to try to fly proof


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Well for the record I never said it's price gauging, someone else said that and then it was incorrectly attributed to me, and then a post was written directed at me in how wrong I was for calling it price gauging.....

I don't think it is price gauging just expensive and certainly insitu is making more money on this tank then their old one. I don't begrudge them that, was just pointing it out. 

Personally I really like that insitu are making dart frog ready tanks. They are the only reliable vendor in the USA doing this and I want them to stay in business for many years to come. I also believe that unless you make your own Viv, insitu are the best available in the USA right now in their size range.


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

Fahad said:


> ShrimpsRus said:
> 
> 
> > This isnt meant to be an attack on you, minorhero -- everyone's entitled to their opinion, it's just that I'm not sure about that and notice this a lot in the hobby. In Situ doesn't look to be a large company, so don't have massive volume and the purchasing power that comes with that.
> ...


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

ShrimpsRus said:


> I just feel a "premium" level tank would be a rimless glass tank. Similar to a Euro Style. They look incredible to me. Coming from a fish background i know most higher end setups are going rimless.


Hmm. My new 36 x 18 rimless 'premium' aquarium was $750. Off the shelf plastic trim tank that size is $150.


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## ShrimpsRus (Apr 14, 2020)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Hmm. My new 36 x 18 rimless 'premium' aquarium was $750. Off the shelf plastic trim tank that size is $150.


Sounds Premium premium. You got saffire in that, i hope!? In my experience a big premium in those rimless tanks are the cool dimensions or just custom dimensions you'd never find on off the shelf tanks.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

ShrimpsRus said:


> Sounds Premium premium. You got saffire in that, i hope!? In my experience a big premium in those rimless tanks are the cool dimensions or just custom dimensions you'd never find on off the shelf tanks.


No Starfire, standard dimensions (36 x 18 x 24), no drilling. Simply a quality tank -- it was made by Custom Aquariums. The difference in quality -- silicone work, alignment, glass finishing, overall design strength -- between it and an off the shelf rimless (I own a smaller Marineland rimless cube also) is _staggering_. 

If a person simply wanted a watertight glass box, off the shelf tanks are great (though I won't put water in that Marineland that I use for a terrarium -- it is wildly underbuilt, and I don't care for water damage in my house). I use Exos for my vivs, and I think they work fine (I don't care about FF escapes). But I think if someone wants a high quality hand produced thoughtfully designed niche market product, expecting that to come at a 10% or even 50% premium over factory built imports isn't fair to folks who do this kind of work for us. 

It is like this for all sorts of products. I can buy a jar of Smuckers jam at the store for two bucks, but since I grow and wild harvest berries and make jam, I know that the eight dollar jars of homemade at the farmers market are underpriced. The ubiquitousness of assembly-line products (and to go off on a tangent: assembly line services like public schooling) really can warp people's notions of value.


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## FrogLove1961 (Jul 4, 2018)

I bought the Rio a few months ago, they had a 10% off week so I pulled the trigger. It is pricey but I wanted plug and play, they also have a few items I wanted for other builds also 10% off feather light stone cut to attach to background. I got caught up with Bio pod also opened box never set it up,luckily I sold it but took a beating. I just wanted an enclosure that was complete no getting lights, fans, misters etc. We will see how this works out


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## wlrodman (Nov 3, 2015)

Hi Everyone - Its nice to see everyone weighing the options on the Alto... Here at In Situ, we are very concerned about it's price, i.e., where does this money go? How does the Alto earn its place in the market? I thought it would be good to give everyone some information so you can all understand it.

The reality with the Alto is that it has to be crated to be shipped. Our site asks for $100 for shipping, and a $45 deposit on the isolators. The isolators protect it from shock damage when it is dropped... Our shipping history suggests the Amazonia gets thrown or dropped from 6 to 10 foot heights routinely. If we don't put the isolators on, the vivarium would certainly break. The same is true for the composite back panel. A glass back panel would certainly break, regardless of the isolators. So, we have to use the composite in this design. If you return the isolators, you get your deposit back. 

We have been really, really, fortunate with our pricing from Fedex on shipping... I think everyone can agree that a flat $50 shipping cost is amazing considering the size of the Amazonia box.... However, the shipping Gods have decided that putting a label on the Alto crate costs $150, pretty much no matter where we are shipping it, whether it is through Fedex or a freight company, or sent to Seattle (very close) or New York (across the country). We did not think people would stomach $150 in shipping costs, plus an isolator deposit (a total of $195). So, we put $50 of the shipping cost into the price of the Alto. We hate this kind of "shell game" where the costs aren't completely transparent. But, sometimes you have to do this kind of marketing. We hope everyone understands. 

Compared to a box with expanded polystyrene foam, constructing a shipping crate that can withstand the journey and protect the vivarium doubles both the weight, labor, and material costs, compared to the Amazonia. Obviously, we cannot charge twice the price of the Amazonia. So, we knocked it down as far as we possibly could. 

We have really appreciated everyone who has taken the time to explain how the costs really are comparable to the "other" vivariums, i.e., by the time you add lights and circulation, drilling holes, making tops, adding drainage schemes, etc., we offer a very competitively priced product. But, the very most important thing to us is that it works well, because that is where the true value really is. We are always working to improve our design, and are anticipating some fun projects that will emerge in 2021 that will solve even more "age old" problems.

A curious fact for people that are curious: The box and polystyrene foam on the Amazonia costs about $50. Pet shop products do not require this level of packaging. So, when you wonder why an ExoTerra is cheaper, this is one major reason. We think you value home delivery of products that work, as opposed to availability of products that have to be severely modified, but have local availability. So, that's why we package it to the level that we do.

Lastly, I know everyone works hard for their money, and this forum is the lifeline of the hobby. So, in addition to a new (secret) initiative being announced on the 17th, I want to let everyone know we are going to have a one day "Rack" sale on Labor Day to celebrate our first anniversary. It will be a buy 3 get one free offer for any combination of Amazonia and Alto vivariums. We haven't worked out the mechanics of how the sale will work, but we expect that announcement to be made the week of August 31st. If a 25% price drop brings one of our vivariums into focus for you, that week would be the time to act because it will only be one day. Teaming up with your friends is OK. We can print separate shipping labels for you all. Just make it all on one order, with one purchaser, and you will get the discount.

Thank you all again for all of the critique... We really appreciate the positive nature of the discussions.. 

Bill/ In Situ


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

wlrodman said:


> Hi Everyone -
> 
> Thank you all again for all of the critique... We really appreciate the positive nature of the discussions..
> 
> Bill/ In Situ


Thanks for weighing in, it’s always cool to have the makers display engagement and transparency.

I don’t remember if it was you I spoke to briefly before I bailed on Facebook, but hello.

Even though I’ve yet to pull the trigger because I’m mostly working with larger species right now, I think it’s a killer move that you’re willing to take on shipping.

We don’t have a lot of choices in Canada and having UE as a distributor is a nice option.

I wish you all continued success.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mille981 (Sep 9, 2008)

When exos first came out, no one would consider wasting so much money on one. Rows of 10 or 15 gallon tanks, 10$ shop lights, and 2x4 stands were the norm. I could build a whole breeding rack for the price of one exo terra. Couldn't see in, had top entry, fruit flies everywhere in the house, bromeliads and orchids rotted but frogs did great. The hobby grew. Ventilation fans, misting systems, high output lighting, waterfalls, Dwarf orchids, false bottoms and the word paludarium were all added. In Situ offers an out of the box solution for all these things exos lack. Also I think people are underestimating the true cost of one.

Exo that size- 250$
Small circulation fans with home made housing- 30-60$
High quality multispectrum LED light that can color broms and penetrate 3 feet 150$
Custom lid with vents and slots for recirc fan - 70$
Glass pieces cut and smoothed for slanted false bottom- 40$
Each hole drilled 10$ times 3 or 4 - 40$
Bulkheads for drain- 10$
Silicone- 7$
No fruit flies crawling on visitors in the bar- priceless


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

Just a quick addition to this thread. I'm still working on a couple of X-Tall Exo Terras so haven't had a chance to dive in to setting up yet, but I finally bought an Alto in anticipation of getting some R. imitator in the future.

...aaaannnd I promptly bought a second one.

My only point of comparison is Exo Terra (I use the largest model exclusively) so that's going to come up a lot.

Some of the InSitu tanks are made to order and have a couple days of lead time, but my first Alto was in stock -- FedEx to Toronto, Canada took only a week. I ordered my 2nd one today and it's shipping out today, so that's as good as it gets.

I uncrated a pristine tank with very strategic, solid packing. I'm not a big guy but keep fit (amateur athlete) -- I'm used to wrestling with heavy and dangerous Exo Terras. Granted this is a slightly smaller tank but it was stupidly easy for me to uncrate and carry down a flight of stairs to the frog room on my own, with no risk of grievous injury and shattered glass (I'm looking at you, Exo Terra). 

This is an important design feature that some people may overlook, but as a designer myself I really appreciate this aspect of the user experience. If you're even just moderately strong you can handle this tank with _zero_ problems.

These were obviously designed to fit perfectly on wire-frame utility shelves. Mine are black and match the InSitu beautifully. You can get a very clean, industrial look with these. I'll be looking for a steel or aluminum reservoir to have out in the open, similar to some of the exposed industrial look of some Aquascaping set-ups.

The tanks are very light and the materials have some flex; for some people this feels 'cheap' but it's a direct consequence of saving on weight, and you're not going to notice any of this one way or the other on the shelf. Tolerances on mine are very good, smooth action on the doors, I like the venting a lot. The handles are actually different than the photo on the website, they're a little nicer.

I really like the high visibility in the front window because of the vent design and placement, they beat the hell out of Exo Terra and Atasuki on this front.

I just wish they were bigger but I get why they're not. I would love the equivalent of 2 Altos side by side, even with the murderous awful shipping that would probably entail.

I do prefer hinged doors over sliding, but obviously not a deal-breaker.
The silicone strip between the sliding doors stands out to me right now, but I haven't set it up yet so it may 'disappear' visually. And at any rate it's less obstrusive than an Exo vent and serves a purpose.
So as I suspected, for the money I think this is the best out-of-the-box solution available, at least in North America.

The only Exo Terra I personally like is the 36" x 18" x 36" model, because I find their plastic venting too obtrusive on smaller models. An InSitu is signifcantly more expensive but way better looking than an Exo in its weight class, and requires zero modification so there's no contest, in my opinion -- but this is based on the very heavy modifications I make to Exo Terra, swapping out to a machined custom lid, building in Matala false bottoms with engineered foam...that all gets expensive quickly.

I opted to use my own gear so I ordered my Altos stripped down, without lights or fans, so I can't comment on those directly, although many here are quite familiar with Spectral Designs lighting anyway.

I have about 18,000 things on backlog to post about here, but when I start setting these up I'll create a thread for it. 

I just hope InSitu sticks around a long time because we really don't have enough cool specialty products available to us in North America, although I see that starting to change.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

Happy to hear you got yours safely! Mine all had little bits of damage, broken glass and the like and were a little bit warped. Bill did whatever needed to be done to fix me up though - even sending replacement doors three times because the first two replacements were broken...lol!

Let me know when you are looking for some imitators...I have some hold backs I'd love to see go to a good home


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

Chris S said:


> Happy to hear you got yours safely! Mine all had little bits of damage, broken glass and the like and were a little bit warped.


Great, here comes another week of fear. 

_prays to the FedEx gods_



Chris S said:


> Bill did whatever needed to be done to fix me up though - even sending replacement doors three times because the first two replacements were broken...lol!


Poor Bill...he's great to deal with though.



Chris S said:


> Let me know when you are looking for some imitators...I have some hold backs I'd love to see go to a good home


It'll be a little while yet, ya enabler! 

Errr...feel free to DM me what you're working with though. 😬


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

Fahad said:


> It'll be a little while yet, ya enabler!
> 
> Errr...feel free to DM me what you're working with though. 😬


haha. Sure


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## InSitu (May 3, 2021)

Hi Everyone - 

It seems we missed this thread, and, maybe we should have weighed in. You might recognize the below message from another post ... We hope it helps explain some of the costs and why the Alto is priced like it is...

Bill/In Situ

*****'

Hi Everyone - 

Its nice to see everyone weighing the options on the Alto... Here at In Situ, we are very concerned about it's price, i.e., where does this money go? How does the Alto earn its place in the market? I thought it would be good to give everyone some information so you can all understand it.

The reality with the Alto is that it has to be crated to be shipped. Our site asks for $100 for shipping, and a $45 deposit on the isolators. The isolators protect it from shock damage when it is dropped... Our shipping history suggests the Amazonia gets thrown or dropped from 6 to 10 foot heights routinely. If we don't put the isolators on, the vivarium would certainly break. The same is true for the composite back panel. A glass back panel would certainly break, regardless of the isolators. So, we have to use the composite in this design. If you return the isolators, you get your deposit back.

We have been really, really, fortunate with our pricing from Fedex on shipping... I think everyone can agree that a flat $50 shipping cost is amazing considering the size of the Amazonia box.... However, the shipping Gods have decided that putting a label on the Alto crate costs $150, pretty much no matter where we are shipping it, whether it is through Fedex or a freight company, or sent to Seattle (very close) or New York (across the country). We did not think people would stomach $150 in shipping costs, plus an isolator deposit (a total of $195). So, we put $50 of the shipping cost into the price of the Alto. We hate this kind of "shell game" where the costs aren't completely transparent. But, sometimes you have to do this kind of marketing. We hope everyone understands.

Compared to a box with expanded polystyrene foam, constructing a shipping crate that can withstand the journey and protect the vivarium quadruples both the weight, labor, and material costs, compared to the Amazonia. Obviously, we cannot charge twice the price of the Amazonia. So, we knocked it down as far as we possibly could.

We have really appreciated everyone who has taken the time to explain how the costs really are comparable to the "other" vivariums, i.e., by the time you add lights and circulation, drilling holes, making tops, adding drainage schemes, etc., we offer a very competitively priced product. But, the very most important thing to us is that it works well, because that is where the true value really is. We are always working to improve our design, and are anticipating some fun projects that will emerge in 2021 that will solve even more "age old" problems.

A curious fact for people that are curious: The box and polystyrene foam on the Amazonia costs about $50. Pet shop products do not require this level of packaging. So, when you wonder why an ExoTerra is cheaper, this is one major reason. We think you value home delivery of products that work, as opposed to availability of products that have to be severely modified, but have local availability. So, that's why we package it to the level that we do.

Lastly, I know everyone works hard for their money, and this forum is the lifeline of the hobby. So, in addition to a new (secret) initiative being announced on the 17th, I want to let everyone know we are going to have a one day "Rack" sale on Labor Day to celebrate our first anniversary. It will be a buy 3 get one free offer for any combination of Amazonia and Alto vivariums. We haven't worked out the mechanics of how the sale will work, but we expect that announcement to be made the week of August 31st. If a 25% price drop brings one of our vivariums into focus for you, that week would be the time to act because it will only be one day. Teaming up with your friends is OK. We can print separate shipping labels for you all. Just make it all on one order, with one purchaser, and you will get the discount.

Thank you all again for all of the critique... We really appreciate the positive nature of the discussions..

Bill/ In Situ


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Hey Bill, I've sent you a PM.


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