# shiping feeders/ permits/usda and other things



## joshua_delancey69 (Mar 1, 2004)

To ship most insects you must have a USDA Permit. just FYI


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

> To ship most insects you must have a USDA Permit. just FYI


Do you have a source for this info? According to the USDA, US Fish and Wildlife, and the USPS, no permits are required to ship fruit flies or springtails unless they are coming from another country.


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## joshua_delancey69 (Mar 1, 2004)

http://www.aphis.usda.gov/ppq/permits/p ... index.html


I am not a scientific person but when i read this on this site I Assumed it was any insect. If not I miss read all the information. I do know that Ed's Fly Meat uses USDA permits When I searched for the site agian their site poped up "USDA permit on file to ship insects" Dave and Erin might be able to better answer this question.


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## Michael Shrom (May 20, 2004)

I think that application is for pest insects. From what I read on the Indiana University site on shipping fruit flies you don't need a usda permit in the U.S. This is a confusing area and I choose to err on the side of caution. I think the thing that could get one in the most trouble is shipping termites.
Shipping insects is a pain in the cold weather. I prefer to sell them locally.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

From the APHIS website regarding FF's 

snip "Do species of Drosophila need Federal import or interstate movement permits? 

A. All shipments of Drosophila fruit flies into the United States (including Territories) from foreign sources must now be pre-authorized with a Plant Pest Permit (PPQ Form 526). Interstate shipments among States in continental North America (including Alaska) do not require Plant Pest Permits, but interstate shipments to and from Hawaii and the Territories do require permits. Although Drosophila fruit flies present minimal plant pest risk (e.g., feeding on overripe fruit in storage), shipments manifested as “fruit flies” have recently raised agricultural and environmental concerns because this common name also refers to notoriously significant plant pests like the Mediterranean and oriental fruit flies. As a result, plant pest permits are now required so that shipments are appropriately routed to PPQ inspection stations for confirmation of the identities of the enclosed organisms. Permits and the appropriate use of shipping labels will facilitate movement through Customs and Border Protection inspection processes with minimal delays in PPQ inspection stations."

It does not cover any insect or arthropod. For example springtails as detrivores are not covered under this regulation. However if you wanted to ship aphids, then a permit would be required. And if you read the language, depending on the species, the shipper may not need the permit but the reciever does

snip ". Who should apply for the permit? The person who will send the organism or the person who will receive it?

A. In general, the receiver should apply for the permit since it is his or her responsibility to handle or contain the shipped organism. " endsnip. 

For example as they are not plant pests there are no regulations covering the interstate sale and transport of tarantulas and mantids at this time. 


Ed


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## JERRY (Dec 14, 2004)

*on the subject of Permits*

To answer the question about permits. First of all, they come from the USDA and no one else. Secondly, you do need a permit , and as a matter of fact you need one from each state ! Their is no single application that covers all of the states. You have to apply for approval on an individual basis. 

Each state has their respective Dept of Ag. and they may have their own rules regarding fruitflies or other pests. For example, Fla. , Ca. N.M., Az , are considered "hot states" because their climate is condusive for anything to grow. The agriculture people have the right to know what is going into their state. They may insist on requiring additional information as well as seeing larva, pupae or the actual fly before they will allow YOU to ship into their states. Other states are not as concerned, and yet other states want to monitor who the recipient is of these flies.

Several years ago, we were in the process of providing Flukers in La. with Hydei, and the dept of ag. would not allow us to ship that fly in the state of Louisiana. After providing the necessary information, our permit application (which was originally DECLINED) was re submitted and APPROVED. In this case Flukers had some influence with them. But rest assured permits are required even though the information seem a bit vague and seem to concern themselves with imported flies moreso than flies that are indegnious to the states already.

Rest assured we have permits (for each state) with their requirements, and although the govt has not pursued non permit shippers, the penalty is severe for the both the shipper and receiver. Anyone who thinks that shipping pests into another state without the knowledge of the states Agriculture dept, is immune from getting into big trouble, is in for a big surprise. In the state of Fla. you get arrested even if you are at a show without the proper permits (and you dont have to be a resident) 

So the question is a bit more complicated than just quoting a page from the DOA website. JERRY


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## JERRY (Dec 14, 2004)

*What a permit looks like*

Here is a federal permit from the state of Fl. http://www.dendroboard.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10793/normal_USDA PERMIT FROM FL.jpg

Once a permit application from the state is approved, you receive a permit approval from the federal people. This is what allows you to ship inter and intra state without being in violation. 

So when we say we are USDA approved, it means we have the necessary permits and this not only protects us but the receiver as well. I must add that their are several so called fly operations that disregard the permit requirements and put everyone at risk for tighter permit approvals. Wherever their is a quick buck to me made, why not try the fly business! We are constantly in touch with the USDA because certain states have more stringent concerns than other states. We are a known shipper with the USDA, and after almost 15 years of permit applications, we try our best to exemplify a company that believes in following the rules and regulations of the US govt. Others however, dont care, and just make it bad for everyone else. Dont think for a second that the USDA is unaware of these basement buggers. They monitor allot of sites, and although they have not taken any steps to shut down these operations who claim they are USDA approved, .........I would prefer not to be on the receiving end of their wrath.


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## JERRY (Dec 14, 2004)

*One other note*

Some of the toughest states which have major concerns about what is entering their state in Mn, Del. NJ, Hawaii. even our own state of Fl. asked us to provide the flies that we were breeding to be sent to Tallahassee in a variety of different stages. Even though it may appear that pests can be shipped without any control, and even though it may appear on the website of the USDA that the wording is a bit ambiguous, the respective USDA offices in each state provides the policy, and either accepts or declines the permit to the federal level. 

Here is a link to show that we were REQUIRED to provide to the state of Fl. the flies we were breeding in different stages . Their are several states that have the same requirements. 
Whether you at a show or in your home, and are selling, breeding , or feeding and you fall within the peramiters of the USDA, you may receive a knock one day on your door or someone may step in front of your booth, and ask the magic words "Can I see your permit!" I have seen it in Orlando several years ago, and the people who had flies were escorted outside of the viewing public, arrested.Their merchandize was confiscated. That included their PDF's. If you feel the risk is warranted, and you dont mind the forfeture, at least you have been advised
http://www.jtresser.com/USDA.html These papers were given as a receipt several years ago. Since then we are only required to provide samples on a 4 year basis if necessary.


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## joshua_delancey69 (Mar 1, 2004)

Can we get the mods to move this into a Advanced Topic so Mike Can get his ad back I did not mean for this to go that far in this ad..............Please mods move this topic Name it Fruit Flies / USDA Permit?


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## JERRY (Dec 14, 2004)

*flies and such*

Joshua, your absolutely correct , this does not belong here. Sorry. JERRY


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