# DIY LED Lights



## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all.

Over the last years I was vey doubtfull about LEDs and if they could replace normal light bulbs. Also the prices I see for "good equipment" is wallet abuse. Yet the electric engineer I am got keen to know more. Of course the LED system had to be affordable and homebuild. So here is my personal LED building sheet and LED - neon tube comparision.

6W Led light recipe for the test run:

55cm standard aquarium reflector : 12€
20 High power LEDs 25000 mCd (will be good for 6W electrical power): 0,98€/LED or 19.60€
20 Resistors: 4€
Power supply 12VDC 1,5A : 14€

Drilling the reflector









LEDs and resistors









Power supply









Inserted LEDs









Wired and soldered









LEDs shining









My standard system 2x18W on an electric ballast. Provides enough light for plants to grow and enough heat in the winter to keep the vivs warm.

1 standard electronic ballast 2x18W: 21€
2 18W tubes : 2€ - 15€/piece depending on brand and type










The light meter for measuring:









Here we go:

2x 18W direct contact of the meter on the tubes, reading 198Lux x 100 scale =19800Lux









2x 18W at a distance of 35cm, reading 1460Lux









2x 18W at a distance of 50cm, reading 971Lux









1x 18W at a distance of 35cm, reading 787Lux









1x 18W at a distance of 50cm, reading 496Lux









Homegrown 6W LED light direct contact, reading 1130Lux x 10 scale = 11300Lux









Homegrown 6W LED light at a distance of 35cm, reading 779Lux









Homegrown 6W LED light at a distance of 50cm, reading 330Lux









Conclusion: 2 tubes of 18W are far too much for a 6W LED light, but for a single tube of 18W the 6W LED light comes damn close. I have found same sized LEDs on the Internet with 40.000 mCd, I will order 20 of these soon, they will have a power output of 9W and should do the trick. The LED light is very directional as the neon scatters in a 360° area. LED light is cold, but can " be warmed up " with red and yellow high power LEDs. LEDs can last 
50000hours, with a 12h lightning period, that's about 11.5years!
More to come...

Have a nice day 

gluedl


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## nawth21 (Apr 17, 2008)

My husband just had a custom LED fixture made for his salt water reef tank, might have a few made up for me they're pretty slick.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Some theory for those that now want to give LEDs a try.

All LEDs must have a current limiter, otherwise they will light up only once and very briefly. The simplest current limiter is the good old resistor. You may find LED drivers, but these are normally standards and not suited for all types of LEDs. Using the right resistor with a LED will make a LED work in a range where it does NOT heat up and have the longest life possible.

And LEDs have a polarity, meaning they only let electrical current pass in one way.










You can see that the symbol for a LED is an arrow with a bar on top, the arrow shows the current direction. LEDs are not completely round, they have some kind of square bit showing of on one side, this is the same side as the bar on the arrow or the current OUTPUT of the LED. The legs of a LED have different lenghts too, current INPUT is the longest, current OUTPUT the shortest.

One Leg of the current limiter aka resistor gets attached/soldered to the the round side of the LED or the current INPUT leg. The current OUTPUT leg (square side) goes directly on the (-) pole of the DC power supply, the free leg of the resistor goes to the (+) pole of the DC power supply, and there is light.

Symbolic draw:










If you want to add more LEDs like I did above, do it like this:










So how find the right resistor? 

First:

You have to take a look at the technical sheet (I actually first wrote care sheet ) of the LED you are using. Here you will find a value called "If" or "Iv" in mA (milli ampere) (values between 10 and 100mA) and "Uf" or "Uv" in Volt (values between 2,7 and 3,7V). These are the optimal electrical working parameters of the LED.

Second:

You must choose a DC power supply voltage. Let's go for 12V for example. Here you must make sure the power in Watts (W) of the power supply is HIGHER then the power needs of the LEDs AND the resistors. Later about that.
Let's assume our LED has the following data:

If/Iv: 30mA = 0.030A
Uf/Uv: 3.5V

1st simple calculation is the voltage loss over the resistor that we want:

12V-3,5V = 8.5V​
For a 8,5V drop we will need the following resistor:

8.5V/0.030A = 283.3333 (Ohm)​
You will have to choose the next best resistor you can find with a value above 283 Ohm, for example a 290 Ohm.

Power consumption LED:

0.030 A x 3.5 V = 0.105 W​
Power consumption resistor:

0.030 A x 8,5 V = 0.255 W​
Total: 0.105 + 0.255 = 0.360 W/LED and resistor.

Iy you want 20 LEDs on the 12VDC power supply, this will have to have more then 20 x 0.360 = 7,2W of power or a current higher then 20 x 0.030 = 0.6A.

Take care when working with electricity and have fun experimenting 

gluedl


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## GSXR_MURRHEE (Sep 16, 2006)

Very nice gluedl. I'm about to start my 1st LED project, but it's going to be for something I'm building outside, not for my tanks. 

In case anyone else wants to try building something with LEDs but you're afraid of the math for the resistors, there are online calculators just for doing this. The one I've been using is here- Current limiting Resistor calculator for leds


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

nice project, what is the wattage on each LED bulb!


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Julio, on the test light above every LED draws about 0.0925W, every resistor about 0.2125W, so total consumption for 1 LED is about 0.3W. The LED itself barely produces heat, the resistors can be touched but they are hot. 20 LEDS about 6W. 

Thanks for the comments guys!


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## OH23 (Sep 19, 2008)

Very nice gluedl and thank you for the detailed posts.
I have one question though. since i dont have the sufficient knowledge and to be honnest, the time for a DIY led project i'd like to know if there is a led fixture in the market that will produce adequate amount of light for plant growth ( especially for ground cover like riccia and Hemiantus cuba HC ) for a 18x18x18 viv.

and if ayone of the other forum members have some good results with leds in their vivs i'd like to hear.

sorry for the mini hijack but didnt want to open another LED LIGHTS thread


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

@OH23:

No hijacking here ...

I have done extensive research lately and from a technical point of view, US based CREE seem to have the best LEDs on the market. Prices for a single LED and the adequate power supply are fine from my point of view. They sell complete downlights with 6" diameter that should do the trick at 1000lumens for 12,5W. I would take 2 of these for an 18" EXO. As for the price, see for yourself if you want to spend that much for 2 fixtures. BUT, if you take about 1 hour time for work (basicly just wiring the LEDs to the power supply in this case and glueing a heat absorber on the LED) to build them yourself (minus the design housing) you can have them for a quarter of the price 

And as an update for the thread:

my next batch of LEDs are waiting for me at the post office. We will know in a few days what 10mm standard high power LEDs can put out compared to the 5 mm above. 

After those it will be the turn of the CREE ones.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## GSXR_MURRHEE (Sep 16, 2006)

I was wondering what size you were using for this, but I guess you answered that lol. Just curious, what kind of viewing angle/focus do the LEDs you're using have? Do think a more focused or slightly wider beam would be better?


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## BlueRidge (Jun 12, 2010)

OMG the LED's have really gone throught he roof. Have you seen the ones used for reef tanks now? The prices have dropped dramatically also. I saw a fixture that rivaled a 400w metal halide, color was adjustable and built in sunrise/sunset. LEDs' are definitely moving quickly.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

@JaredJ: time is right to switch to them if you have the bucks


@GSXR_MURRHEE: the 5mm Leds I used have a lightning angle of about 75°, the 10mm will have some 120°.

In my opinion, as LEDs are very directional, the bigger the angle the better. I will provide you with some calculations after work.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

As promised, some calculations, but with some theory first.

Why do we want LEDs? To save energy and maybe heat and to improve lightning. At the moment I doubt you will save more then 2/3 of the energy you consume now, with LEDs. My goal is to save at least 50%. As I said, at the moment I use two 18W tubes/viv. That comes around 40W with the losses of the ballast. If I get the same light output with 20W of LEDs I would be happy. These 20W MUST then be enough to cover the whole ground in light. Imagine now you have a 18" square viv and LED modules of 5W each with 20°, 75° or 120° lightning angle. Applying Pythagores  will show you the following:

- 20° LEDs will light a spot with a diameter of 6.5" at a distance of 18" -> you will need 9 to cover the whole ground and dang you hit 45W -> not interesting
- 75° LEDs -> spot of 25.2" at 18" distance, you will take 3-4 to cover the whole ground-> 15-20W hmm it get's interesting
-120° Leds -> spot of 62" -> you take 2 and consume only 10W

Now the Lumens become important, if our 120° LEDs have enough of these, we are on the good side. I've found modules of 4.9W with 1400(!) Lumens and 10.000K at 1A of current and an angle of 120°, 2 of these will have a higher ouput as any tube on the market! If they don't we have to take more again to match the tube. This is how I will choose future buys.

The prices are astounding too (even in €)

the LED module: 25€
the power supply: 15€

I don't work for the LED industry  but I hope I got you at least thinking about a change...

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## OH23 (Sep 19, 2008)

Hi gluedl,
Dont forget to update your post as soon as you try out the new LEDS
im eagerly watching your post for updates.
one more thing... can you please add some links of an online retailer to buy the talked-about LEDS. the exact name/number of the module would be very helpful as well, to google and learn about( like i said, i have almost no knowledge in LEDS ).
Im Very interested in the 120° ( most of my tanks are 18" ) and this would be perfect. im pretty sure the electric savings due to using this kind of lights, for the long run, would be greater than the high price of the modules and the power supply. oh, and not to mention the long life span of the modules. corrcet me if im wrong


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

here's the second try with 10mm LEDs, 80,000mCd 10,000K output, If = 34mA (0.034A), Uf= 3.7V, focus of 120°. I used the same reflector as on the first LED light in this thread.

Power consumption LEDs: 20x3.7Vx0.034A = 2,516W
Power consumption resistors: 20x8.1Vx0.034A = 5.508W
Power consumption total:8.024W
Price LEDs: 1,23€/piece
Price resistors: 2€/20
Price soldering plate: 2€
2 hours working time

Components:









soldering plate front with LEDs:









soldering plate back with resistors (so they won't put any shade to the output)









glued to the reflector:









ON









Outputs:

At direct contact:









reading: 1205 scale 10 = 12,050LUX

At 30cm:









reading: 1923LUX

At 50cm:









reading: 1212LUX

So... better then a 2x18W tube setup then? Yes, when you only consider the outputs. Yet when you consider the small spot the new LED light produces:

about only 60x20cm at 50 cm heigh

I have trouble accepting the 120° focus these should have. There is still light on the outside of the main spot, but very little. The first LED light did not produce anything of interest outside the main spot, so a little improvement on that point from LED light 1 to LED light 2.

To cover am 18" square viv you would need 3 of these. Again your power gain would be "only" about 50% over a 2x18W bulb setup AND MORE light.

Next up: the high power US LEDs and an EXCEL data sheet for custom calculations.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## GSXR_MURRHEE (Sep 16, 2006)

Gluedl- thanks for writing all this stuff up, very interesting. 

"There is still light on the outside of the main spot, but very little."

I've heard of guys using 600 grit sandpaper on the LED bulbs to expand the area of light. Do you think that would help at all?


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## devin mac (Oct 4, 2004)

if you were to use higher powered LEDs, this project becomes much more feasible from a perspective of intensity and efficiency, etc... financially, it's tough to justify, however, as we typically just don't need intense lighting like, say, the reef hobby does.

a friend and I have done a LOT of research and design on some circuitry and power supplies for a modular LED lighting system, i'll see if we get off our collective butt this fall and have some prototypes to show off over my tanks and over his reef. 

in the meantime, there's a LOT of discussion about this type of stuff over on nano-reef: Ultimate LED guide - Nano-Reef.com Forums


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

The high power LEDs have arrived. But first some theory:
These also have values for Uf and If but I would not handle those as I did with the 10mm LEDs, but you can if you want to. The current through high power LEDs is so important, you would need a 1W and more resistor to cope with the heat and losses would be unbearable. The solution is a constant current power supply (CCPS).
When you choose your LED you will find that high power LEDs can take current values from 350 to 2800mA. This value will set the brightness of your LED and you will choose your CCPS for this value. What might be a bit confusing is that you will not need any resistors anymore, you just wire your LEDs like this:










To choose the right CCPS you will need to check the following:
-	What Uf does my LED have
-	How many LEDs will I need

Let’s say you will need 6 LEDs and UF = 4 V, then your CCPS will have to have an output of at least 6X4V = 24V. So choose a CCPS with an output voltage range of 12-30V for example. Most manufacturers also write on the data sheet how many LEDs you can use.
So here is what arrived yesterday:

15 High Power LEDs, type XP G Q5 97Lm at 350mA(If), Uf=3,5V at 350mA (1,05W power consumption at these values), 120° 5,99€/piece
15 lenses at 26°, 2,99€/piece
15 heat sinks 0,99€/piece
1 CCPS for 10-18 1W high power LEDs 350mA 13€/piece
1 double sided heat leading tape 16€/sheet
Total about 180€











Close up of the LEDs:










Glued the LEDs with the heat tape to the heat sinks:










Wired:










On:










Measures:
-	Direct contact, reading 1849Lux scale 100 = 184,900Lux 










-	At 30cm, reading 305Lux scale 10 = 3,050Lux










-	At 50cm, reading 1,960Lux










And to show you how vicious these high power LEDs are, here are 2 of my 18”square vivs, both have 2x18W tubes, so both consume about 80W together:
-	Top:










-	Front:










With the LEDs (15W):
-	Top:










-	Front:










Economies/year: 65€ Needless to say I am in love...

Attached you will find an EXCEL sheet, based on what I found out through this thread. Yellow fields have to be completed, the blue fields are calculated.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

The .xls sheet in a .zip as I could not upload it the first time....


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## nicolerc (Jul 13, 2009)

I think I'm sold. Does anyone know of a good US supplier for the components?


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

Some of the ones i know from the saltwater hobby (Just use all whites and eliminate the blues) rapidled.com, heatsink usa (for the heatsink), ledsupply.com, stevesleds.com

The ledsupply has Cree leds that have 6500k color temp.

Thats just a few, hope this helps.


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## karag (May 12, 2005)

All Electronics | Electronic and Electro-Mechanical Parts and Supplies at Discount Prices

They have LED but didn't see power supply specifically for LEDs. They have store at Encino, CA. Used to go there alot.


check out this 24 LED strip all you need to do is solder a power supply... 
http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/LBR-24P/24-WHITE-LED-LIGHT-STRIP-24VDC/1.html


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## bobzarry (Mar 2, 2005)

I found these at Amazon.
Amazon.com: ALL WHITE LED Aquarium and Grow Light Panel 225 LED 110 Volt&#133;


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## karag (May 12, 2005)

that's a bargain bobzarry........


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## bobzarry (Mar 2, 2005)

This one looks to me like the same thing only cheaper. I may pick up a couple of these to try on my exo's.

Amazon.com: New 225 White LED Aquarium Grow Light Panel Hydropronic Lamp: Home &&#133;


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

I just took a look at these and yes they are cheap, but don't expect the same output as high power LEDs as the bargain ones have just standard LEDs...(expect more something similar to the 5mm LEDs in this thread). So before buying a few, maybe you just want to buy 1 for a test.


Have a nice day

gluedl


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## davecalk (Dec 17, 2008)

gluedl said:


> I just took a look at these and yes they are cheap, but don't expect the same output as high power LEDs as the bargain ones have just standard LEDs...(expect more something similar to the 5mm LEDs in this thread). So before buying a few, maybe you just want to buy 1 for a test.
> 
> 
> Have a nice day
> ...


That is good advice. These typically use a much lower output LED.


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## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

I have heard the same about those 225 Led squares...not so great.


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## CrazyAirborne (Jul 8, 2010)

looking at the ones listed on Amazon, the reviews state that the LED's are very weak, and the one I looked at only got 2 out of 5 stars. "When its too good to be true, it usually is"


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## Brotherly Monkey (Jul 20, 2010)

I think the quality of LED grow lights is generally based on the output per buld. With 1 watt per bulb being the standard for effective output


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## bobzarry (Mar 2, 2005)

I ordered 2 of these but after reading here and some reviews I guess I wont even open these and send them back. I was hoping to use them as supplements to these Amazon.com: Lights of America 9266 Outdoor Fixture: Home Improvement


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## rain- (Jul 28, 2006)

gluedl: Do you have an updated photo of the tanks where you are using the Cree XP-G LEDs or did you just try them out on those tanks? Would be interesting to watch the plants grow under the LEDs. 

I'm in progress of building LED light fixtures for my orchids and all my tanks, including a planted aquarium, a nano reef and a PDF tank. I'm using Cree XR-E Q5 LEDs I already have for these first ones, but for later projects I will surely get those XP-G LEDs because of their better output. 

And for anyone interested in their own DIY LED build, I too encourage to read the already mentioned Ultimate LED guide - Nano-Reef.com Forums. Nano reefs with SPS corals require tons of light and that light intensity will definitely be enough for our needs too. Here's a link not mentioned here before, they have components for DIY people and finished fixtures for others (like the Evil's PAR38 Lamp) (I think they can customize the fixtures if you need warmer color temperature or such): Nanotuners.com - Nanotuners.com. I got my LEDs from there.

About the LED grow panels and other stuff using those old LEDs in them. I used one of those 225 led squares too and it really was bad. I didn't expect much of it after reading more about it (when I already had the panel, stupid me), but it still surprised me how fast the light intensity dwindled. For the first month it was nice, but after half a year it sucked bad. But it's not the LEDs fault, those LEDs just are the weak grandfathers of the new high power ones which are indeed awesome. 

If someone wants to try the old cheap LEDs for some not so light hungry stuff, these are fine (220V version), but they shouldn't be compared to the new high power LEDs in any way. It's easier to keep them cool than some of those built to look like regular incandescent light bulbs, and thanks to the placement of the LEDs all the light goes to the right direction.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Here you go:

first day with LEDs:










tonight:










I am totally positive about these LEDs and more tanks will get them soon.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## 2010tony (Oct 27, 2010)

It would be better if they can be customized to be dimmable, plus led controllers.


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## 2010tony (Oct 27, 2010)

Very Nice jOB,haha. Pls upload more pics when you install them for tank lighting, tks.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi Tony,

thanks for the feedback, actually they have been installed as "tank lightning" from the beginning on... I will post some more picture tonight of the tank when I come home from work, but the plants have been trimmed often, so you won't see that much growth. All I can say, is that I am very pleased with my system as most plants do very well with these LEDs.

Concerning the LED controller, what exactly would you like to control?

The dimming can be done with most LED power supllies, yet you need a 0-10V voltage ramp to do so, and that is rather complicated business to achieve properly and even more so without programming a chip. I for myself wanted to keep it simple, yet I am as fascinated as everybody when I see a tank with dimmable lightning.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## dwizum (Oct 28, 2010)

Nice progress! Interesting to see LEDs in use in this hobby. They are a subject near and dear to my heart.

The only advice I would give anyone thinking about such a rig would be to know for darn sure what you're getting when you pick a specific LED and a method to power it. LEDs can provide all sorts of benefits in terms of efficiency, control, and so on - but it's VERY VERY important to recognize that performance from one LED to another, even if they look the same, can be HUGE - like, several hundreds of percent. No other type of lighting has this much variation. If you use a certain color of 24" T8 florescent lamp, you can be sure it'll be _relatively_ close in performance to any other 24" T8 lamp of the same color. But, compare the specs from a bargain-basement HP LED run at 3w to a high-end HP LED run at 3w, and the output of the latter might be 4 or 5 times as much.

So, if you're DIY'ing, make sure you understand the relevant specifications and get the right stuff. If you're buying a commercial fixture, make sure you understand the EXACT components used and how they impact the end product.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Here are the pics as requested.

Top front right is a pup I cut from the brom under it:










some more brom pups:



















and papa rio guaramo watching my moves closely:










Have a nice day

gluedl


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## 2010tony (Oct 27, 2010)

Hi gluedl, thank you very much for your images, it is soooo fancy, good job. I like them. Acctually I've just purchased my Led Strip package, plus Led Controllers from the Hero Led, where you can find a link to their products. I am now just waiting for their arrive. I purchased both Blue and Cool White ultra bright led strip tape for grow lights that are cuttable. The led dimmers plus led transformers 12v dc output can make all leds dim down just in order to make a good growing environment when necessary. I hope to upload photos when finished 








Keen to see a new job, waaaha. They will deliver to my door.

tOny


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## 2010tony (Oct 27, 2010)

by the way gluedl, I like your signature. Happiness need to be shared and passed on and on....


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## tclipse (Sep 19, 2009)

gluedl said:


> Concerning the LED controller, what exactly would you like to control?
> 
> The dimming can be done with most LED power supllies, yet you need a 0-10V voltage ramp to do so, and that is rather complicated business to achieve properly and even more so without programming a chip. I for myself wanted to keep it simple, yet I am as fascinated as everybody when I see a tank with dimmable lightning.
> 
> gluedl


Reading this made me imagine a tank with automated dimming that fluctuates randomly during the day to simulate cloud & canopy cover, and have the misters go on as the lights dim, etc... I certainly don't have the technological know-how to pull it off, but one can always dream, right?


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

just a quick update:



> Reading this made me imagine a tank with automated dimming that fluctuates randomly during the day to simulate cloud & canopy cover, and have the misters go on as the lights dim, etc... I certainly don't have the technological know-how to pull it off, but one can always dream, right?


The "hype" about environmental control has got me too. And this is what Santa put in my shoe last night:










These have proven to be tough in some facilities I work in, so it should do fine for the frogs. It has 6 relais outputs, 10 analogue inputs (0-10V) and 1 0-10V output. There are several extensions with more 0-10V outputs available.

The plan is to have a central HVAC unit (ventilation unit that can humidify, heat and cool) for all the vivs. A combined humidity/temperature sensor will be connected to 2 analogue inputs, temperature gets too hot -> relais n°1 activates cooling, too cold -> relay n°2 for heating, too dry -> relay n°3 for humidifier. 0-10V to dim the LEDs (morning and evening). Relay n°4 for the misting system over an internal clock with LED intensity fluctuations. Next step will be to add analogue outputs and a motor controller for the main fan. That way you could dim the LEDs (clouds), give more air flow for stormlike conditions, activate the misting, give some flashes over relay n°5 (lightning via flash-LEDs) and some lightning noises via MP3 player (relais n°6) and come back to normal (eventually ).

This brand of regulators can be purchased all over the world.... The price is about 220€/regulator

You will have to be patient as this project will just mean that I have to rebuild everything concerning the frogs, so consider a timeline of 6 months to achieve the whole project. Yet LED dimming should be doable pretty quickly. I could share the programming if you ask nicely 

More plans and ideas will follow and every input will be appreciated.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## Crimsonrazac (Nov 16, 2010)

Would it work with these? 
10W 10000K High Power 800LM LED Lamp Blub for Aquarium - eBay (item 220673806349 end time Dec-23-10 05:31:52 PST)

I don't know much about leds, but these seem to put out a lot of light


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

Crimsonrazac said:


> Would it work with these?
> 10W 10000K High Power 800LM LED Lamp Blub for Aquarium - eBay (item 220673806349 end time Dec-23-10 05:31:52 PST)
> 
> I don't know much about leds, but these seem to put out a lot of light


Dang that is a beast of an LED, why the heck aren't they putting those in commercial fixtures for our vivs?!?!


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## Crimsonrazac (Nov 16, 2010)

Dendro Dave said:


> Dang that is a beast of an LED, why the heck aren't they putting those in commercial fixtures for our vivs?!?!


They looked a bit too good to be true, so I was hoping someone with more experience would get my hopes down, or test them out. 

(video I found testing a similar one I saw on ebay) 




This site also seems to have decent leds, I guess people use these ones for reef tanks...
Results for LEDs


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## SNES (Oct 17, 2010)

gluedl - this is amazing i cant wait to see it up and running in your vivs.

thank you for the pics and details !

crimsonrazac - what a monster led 

gluedl, do you think that this led would be good enough for the exo -terra 
18" x 18" x 18" viv? ( most of my vivs are that size )
if so, would it be to rude to ask what kind of power source it needs and how do i connect it to the led? sorry, i have zero technological knowledge 
and you seem to have so much...
bottom line, i ask for step by step guide for a led fixture that fits this 10w led ( if its enough for my vivs ). 

thanks


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

Blinding light for the frogs!


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## Gumby (May 27, 2010)

Wow, if you get the environmental aspects like lightning, and dimming of the lights all programmed throughout the day that would be so amazing! I can't wait to see what you will do with it. Please post a video of the system up and running when you can. Can't wait to see a thunderstorm in a viv!


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

anyone know what the PAR readings on that bulb is is?


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

Julio said:


> anyone know what the PAR readings on that bulb is is?


I don't, but any bulb in the 5500k-7500k range should have adequate par values overall for plants. For reef tanks especially deeper ones you may want some 10k-14k to get par spikes in certain ranges that penetrate the water column better.


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

are there are ny fixtures with 10 watt LEDs out yet?


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## xsputnikx (May 11, 2010)

Just to chime in have any of you seen the 30w led chips?

It is a single led bulb boasting 30w are only about 19.00 to 30.00 depending on source and you would need 1 maybe 2 bulbs at the most depending on tank size. 

I also wanted to chime in that I run ecoxotic led modules on my reef tank and the bulbs used in these are similar to the cree xre bulbs but a little different I am getting great results and growth from my saltwater corals.


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

do you have any links to 30 watters?


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## karag (May 12, 2005)

That's great LED's are getting cheaper. That could be my next project next spring...
I'm using two 4 watts LED bulbs better than my 24W compact flourescent lamp, can touch it like no heat at all.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

I had a look at that monster LED on ebay and here is my verdict:

nice light but much too bright for frogs in an 18" cube. You want to distribute LED light as it does not scatter like bulbs or tubes. For a very tall viv they could do the trick. Just use the rule: if your eyes find it too bright your frogs will too.

For those that still want to play with it, use a 12VDC power suplly and a 2Ohm resistor of 5Watts and do as shown on page 1. Be warned, the resistor will get very hot dissipating 2Watts at that rating with this LED.

As an update, I finished programming the humidity and temperature control

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## xsputnikx (May 11, 2010)

gluedl said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I had a look at that monster LED on ebay and here is my verdict:
> 
> ...


actually your eyes and your frogs eyes will adjust to the brighter light. My lights seemed too bright the first week I had them because I was not used to the brightness. Funny thing is I went back to my t-5 bulb over my dart tank (that I used to boast was bright) seemed dull after getting used to the brighter led lights. 

Its kind of like walking out of a movie theater during the daylight. 

IF you were doing a hanging pendant the light would spread out further. but after further research you get a lot more lumens per watt from the smaller 3w cree xre led's. 

In all honesty your better off going with meanwell drivers for the leds instead of using resistors and all that


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

xsputnikx said:


> actually your eyes and your frogs eyes will adjust to the brighter light. My lights seemed too bright the first week I had them because I was not used to the brightness. Funny thing is I went back to my t-5 bulb over my dart tank (that I used to boast was bright) seemed dull after getting used to the brighter led lights.
> 
> Its kind of like walking out of a movie theater during the daylight.
> 
> ...


They'll adjust to a point, and temporary occasional adjustment is a lower stress level then long term adjustment. These are understory animals that are generally found in shaded spots, sure they can handle some full sun for awhile, but how do you feel when you have to squint all day?...gets stressful, now imagine spending all day every day squinting, with no sunglasses, very stressful. Might not kill them immediately but stress weakens the immune system and the frogs overall lifespan and likely its natural behavior patterns will be effected, both negatively.


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## crank68516 (Aug 30, 2010)

I went out looking for lights today for my 10g vert and found this:

LED Task Light

what are your thoughts on it? 

The packaging is just as vague as the website in terms of color temp and output and it was hard to tell how much it really put out on the display since it was there with 20 other lights.


Thanks
Chris


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

crank68516 said:


> I went out looking for lights today for my 10g vert and found this:
> 
> LED Task Light
> 
> ...


If color temp was around 6000k that would be good, and if the price wasn't to high so you could get several it might be a viable option, but I couldn't find an order area. ....OK did some digging. Found a cuadata.org post where someone used the strip lights and mentioned where they got them. 
Rennisance Holdings zilotek Brand LED Strip Lights - Caudata.org Newt and Salamander Forum
The place also has the task lights...
LED Task Accent Light at Menards

Looks like with only 30LEDs each you'd need at least 2 for a 10, probably more which could get kinda pricey at around $25 each. The screw in LED type bulbs to replace standards and cfl's might be cheaper if you already have the fixtures on hand.


BTW I stumbled on these screw in led bulbs the other day. Much higher wattage then many other screw in bulbs and look like they'd throw enough light off the sides to be usable in a horizontal position like in typical incandescent strip lights if the bulbs aren't to wide to fit them. Can probably remove the heat sheild/reflectors to get them to fit. Might be worth painting the inside of the fixture flat white though to make up for some of the lost reflection by removing the metal reflectors. Kinda expensive but you'd probably only have to buy them once....
LED Light Bulb, EvoLux, 100 Watt LED Replacement, LED Replacement Bulb, CFL Light, LED Lamp, LED Bulb, 13 Watt LED, EvoLux LED Product Information

evolux - Google Search


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## crank68516 (Aug 30, 2010)

I found them at Menards for about $25. The thing I really liked about them was the form factor, at about 4inx5inx1in I thought it would look good on a 10g vert. The other options I was looking at was a 6in, 4 watt fluorescent which I don't think would be enough or a daylight CFL.


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## Bananaslug (Feb 18, 2010)

I picked up a few 16w LED panels off eBay last week and was blown away with the brightness and distribution of the light. The panel has 229 6500K LED's in a 9.5" x 9.5" x 0.75" square. Comes with the power supply and with shipping are only $45. I'm using them in 12" x 12" x 16" tanks and they are just right as far as I can tell!


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## crank68516 (Aug 30, 2010)

I've done some some searching around and have found tons of regular household screw in led bulbs that I'm kind of interested in. Does anyone have any idea of what kind of light output in lumens I would need for a 10g vert?


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

crank68516 said:


> I've done some some searching around and have found tons of regular household screw in led bulbs that I'm kind of interested in. Does anyone have any idea of what kind of light output in lumens I would need for a 10g vert?


Anywhere from around 800-1200ish is usually fine for most plants, but may be to much for really low light plants. The frogs probably just need a couple hundred lumens or even less its mostly about what you need for your plant choices to do well, and plant placement can also be important.

When dealing with CFL's though it is easier for me usually to go by watts per gallon when dealing with anything except very tall tanks. I generally like around 2-3 watts per gallon. I probably run 2 13-15watt bulbs in most of my 10's but 2 10watt bulbs are usually fine also. 

But for LEDs its a little harder to say, since the lumen output per watt average is often different from CFL's. It is usually more I think, or at least more focused so you can probably get away with fewer watts of LED lighting then you'll need using CFL. For most of the LED's I've seen 1-2 watts of LED lighting per gallon looks like it will work, but I haven't actually used any yet so I can't be sure.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

> Does anyone have any idea of what kind of light output in lumens I would need for a 10g vert?


I have never thought about a general rule like that, I can just tell you what I have successfully used over the last few months on 2 20 gallon tanks:

7 Cree XPG Q5 / tank at 350mA, lumen output at 350mA: 107lm

equals about:

0.5W/gallon and about 40 lumen/gallon

I guess it also depends what kind of plants you want to use...


Have a nice day

gluedl


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

crank68516 said:


> I've done some some searching around and have found tons of regular household screw in led bulbs that I'm kind of interested in. Does anyone have any idea of what kind of light output in lumens I would need for a 10g vert?


Oh I just noticed it said 10 VERT.....I was thinking horizontal...cut those numbers by 1/3rd to half probably for a vert. The nice thing about LED's is they tend to be more focused, so you can probably get away with lower wattage and still get as much light down to the plants vs CFL


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## DFason (Dec 14, 2010)

My first post on this forum. A member on here forwarded me to this site. I am Working on a saltwater paludarium with black mangroves and seagrass. I also make a large array of LED builds for reef tanks. I've made anywhere from 300-12 led builds with either XP-G or Rebel ES LEDs. I also have a controller that would be perfect for you guys! 

I call this the Ryujin led controller. This is completely controllable through a PC and has an on board OLED screen. You can dim, make storms and even clouds. I'll post more once I'm out of jury duty!  














Hope you enjoy! 

-Dave.


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## the_deeb (Apr 21, 2008)

Glad you made it over here Dave. I'm sure that the folks here will be really excited about this product. It follows pretty well from the topic that was started here: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/56417-automation-your-vivarium.html

I've been considering running some LED accent lights with this awesome-looking controller in my paludarium. Stay tuned for updates


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

@ DFason:

Welcome man! Just had a look at the vids and some forums about that controller. Nice piece of technology, did you develop that on your own????


Have a nice day

gluedl


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,


when I came home yesterday the LEDs were out, and that's why:










So make sure you don't place them on the ventilated areas of your vivs, or you may end up replacing like me . Humidity is not a good thing for electric stuff...


Have a nice day


gluedl


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## carbonetc (Oct 13, 2008)

A while back I ordered some LEDs from eBay: 

- 1 watt 
- 40° viewing angle (less wasted light)
- 380,000 mcd
- 300 mA

They were cheap enough that I think a light comparable to fluorescents could be built with them. I just haven't gotten around to trying it yet. They're available in cool and warm white at about the same specs, so they could easily be mixed to get something that would look natural.

I wish I had a fancy light meter to run some tests.

A suitable adapter was harder to find than the LEDs, but I think I found a way to run 6 off of it with virtually no resistance. One adapter per 6 LEDs gets expensive, though. Maybe there's a better way.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

try the following driver (use google for search):

PS-CC18-ELP18X1LS


costs about 10€, suitable for 10-18 1W Leds at 350mA, it's the one I have been using for some months now, it's got very protection against overload and short circuits -> I am very pleased with it.

I know that LEDs are expensive, but think over the long run and the savings you can make with them...

Have a nice day 


gluedl


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## jacc1234 (Feb 19, 2011)

I have been looking into LED lighting for quite some time. I think it as a ton of potential especially to the DIY'er. 

I would love some more detail on your setup gluedl. 

I am in the planning stages of a 38G paludarium and think i will go with LED. I can do all of the diy work myself and now just need to identify the best emitters and how people are using them. I figure the color would be different then whats used in aquariums. 

I have a whole bunch of old research on LED's for plant growth and a handful of nice 1W and 2W smd emitters to mess with. I am very impressed with the Nanocustoms Duo 700 LED Driver. It seems like a real killer product that would be perfect for my imagined design. Once I figure out the best new emitter brands and a nice placement design I should be good to go. 

Anyone with info about any of this please post it here or PM. Its especially hard to find good LED component vedors in the US. So please keep them coming.


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi jacc1234,

my setups at the moment consist of 2 20 gallon cubes, each cube has 7 1W LEDs from the CREE brand, type XP-G Q5 (warm white) running at 350mA because I think 700mA would only blend my frogs, for plants only I would go up to 1000mA. My cubes are 20inch high and as you can see through this thread, they are doing fine and even better then with 40W of neon tubes. Only disadvantage I had during the winter is the lack of heat produced by LEDs, I had to add a heat pad to reach the values I wanted, yet in summer I will not have to care about overheating vivs...

Due to high demand about wiring and so on, I am willing to produce a video of the creation of a whole setup, but I am no Spielberg and have very little time left atm, so this might take a while...

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## deadmeat30 (Oct 18, 2009)

Hi Gluedl, is there any updates to this?

thanks,

Alan


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## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

I would love to see updates on this too. Does anyone have a supply spot here in the US for these materials?


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

give me a few days for the video...


Have a nice day

gluedl


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## Vagabond324 (Jan 13, 2011)

MPJA - Power Supply, Power Supplies, Security Cameras, LCD, Fans, Etc.
Here's a good place to get many eletrical parts. I always start my search here as they offer quite a bit of stuff, Like power supplies, fans, circuit boards, leds, etc, much of it surplus. I've bought from them twice and they were easy to deal with. Jon


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

below is the long awaited video. Hope it helps and that you can get some inspiration out of it.













During the WE I built 3 more vivs with LEDs, the setup of the LEDs is the same as shown in the video, they are just placed in a different way. The first 2 will be about the plants, how they develop, loose or enhance colors, while the last is purely for moss growth. And no, they don't house any frogs.




























Any comments, questions, or critics are welcome!

Have a nice day!

gluedl


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## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

Looks really good! My couple comments would be to leave the text up longer and you can probably get rid of some of the redundancy (drilling multiple holes, attaching the LEDs using tape, etc) to cut the time down a little bit.

It might be good at the beginning to include a list of all of the stuff you will need.


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## littlefrog (Sep 13, 2005)

I watched them both... Inspired. An estimate of how much that setup costs? Euros is ok, I can do math.

Thanks!

Rob


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

I tried to keep it as simple and cheap as possible. What I used was:

- 1 alu U profile, 25x10mm, 2,5m in length: about 10€
- 16 CREE XPG Q5 LEDs warm white, 4,50€ a piece
- a DINA 4 sheet of double sided heat tape is about 17€
whereas the glue was about only 9€ and both work good
- 1 driver suited for the amount of LEDs you want to connect, the one in the video was 35€ but is dimmable, one without dimming would be 9€. The driver was a 350mA type 2x(LEDs, 700mA would be much too bright IMO and the heatsink would need to be much larger/LED
- some wire 0,75mm2, costs less then 1€/m
- the lenses, I only use those to make the setup water proof, you could use something different, like a profile with a cover, just make sure to seal it as condensation or humidity will kill the LEDs pretty fast. I used PU glue to seal, as the one I used cures within a minute, silicone would do well too. The lenses cost about 3€ a piece

The tools you would need:

- a metal saw
- a soldering iron of about 25W and solder
- drilling machine and a drill
- a screw driver
- wire cutter
- pliers

Concerning the heat sink: when Phillips first came up with the lumileds, they made some extensive research, how much surface a horizontal and a vertical heatsink would need for proper cooling of 1W LEDs. Their conclusion was about 6 square inchs for LEDs without a lens or reflector and 9 square inchs with a reflector or a lens. Keep that in mind when you choose your heatsink, it doesn't always have to be the expensive commercial ones...

When I measured the temps after 8hours of lightning, the room temps had been around 16°C, the LEDs did not heat up more then 25°C, now add 10 to 15° to the room temp, the LED temp should increase about the same and still be in a range where the longetivity of the LEDs are guaranteed.

Another tip: in the video I worked with the XPG Q5 warm white type or 3500K, these do not get vey hot, as shown. The 2nd viv of the 3 uses XPG R5 type LEDs, these have 6000K and 33% more Lumen. They heat up much more, but the Phillips rules can still be applied.

@MonarchzMan: I'll keep your tips in mind if I ever make another video 

Have a nice day!

gluedl


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## SNES (Oct 17, 2010)

This is awesome, gluedl 
Thank you for the vids, its exactly what i need to start my own DIY LED project.


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## Sigaw (Apr 3, 2010)

Any updates on this project?
I didn't see in any of the posts if you made a hood for the lights, how did you attach them on top of the vivs? Just placed them right on top of the glass?


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

> Any updates on this project?
> I didn't see in any of the posts if you made a hood for the lights, how did you attach them on top of the vivs? Just placed them right on top of the glass?


Hoods are not necessary IMO, the LEDs are placed on top of the glass as are the power supllies, the lenses are glued to the heat sink over the LEDs so that no humidity can reach the electric components. The heat sink is best left in air contact for free cooling. As for updates, my car broke down last week and is getting fixed right now, the camera is in the trunk... I will post some images as soon as I can.

Have a nice day.

gluedl


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi all,

first update with pics.

- disposition of the LEDs on the top glass plate:










- the 3 vivs:




























As you can see:

- the moss is growing nicely
- there is no color loss until now except for a neoreglia "red waif" in the middle viv (back left end) that got a bit greener unfortunately
- the broms start to produce their "roots"
- the ferns are growing well too

Hope you enjoy...

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## Sigaw (Apr 3, 2010)

Are all the tanks the same size, or is the first bigger than the others?


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

the first tank on the last uploaded pics is a 80x50x50cm or 32x20x20in viv

the last 3 are 20in cubes

I am currently replacing all my tubes with LEDs. Power consumption is going down from about a total of 700W to 200W/h for 16 vivs. With a lightening period of 12hours, this will make some difference by the end of the year for the wallet. Current cost/kwh where I live: 23€cents...

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## toksyn (Mar 5, 2011)

Nice results! How much time has elapsed between the grow-in shots?

A while back I was experimenting with a design for a capacitive touch controlled LED dimmer (for a desk lamp). I was using a 5W LED from Bridgelux with a PWM dimmed regulator capable of driving several of them in series. Interesting that the design can be applied to something a little more useful than a blinding desk lamp. The particular LED had a typical color temperature of ~5k, but I'm sure that the same control system can be implemented for other LEDs. In fact, maybe with an ethernet enabled microcontroller one could slave the control system to automatically mimic daylight cycles from weather information online . . .


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

> How much time has elapsed between the grow-in shots?


about 28 days, if you look at the posts dates.



> but I'm sure that the same control system can be implemented for other LEDs. In fact, maybe with an ethernet enabled microcontroller one could slave the control system to automatically mimic daylight cycles from weather information online . . .


this can be achieved for sure. I have had trouble finding a good and cheap dimmable driver, lately. The ones I have state a dimming range from 0-90%, but from the tests I ran, it was more about only 30% in a non linear way .

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

Here's an update after 166 days of two tanks, the third has been torn down due a nasty snail infestation:

overview:










the lower 3 "cheers" broms have lost their red dots 

but the highest one has been doing well:










and here's what grew out of the fern panels:



















and the second tank:










Have a nice day!

gluedl


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## BethInAK (Jul 12, 2011)

those big red broms are keeping their color, really nice!! looks great!


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## parkanz2 (Sep 25, 2008)

Have you guys looked at the newish Cree XM-L LEDs? Super high power and pretty good wattage 

According to Cree's product comparison tool you only need 2 of the U2 series LEDs to hit about 1200 lumens at 1.6 amps which totals just over 10 watts. That seems pretty awesome to me.

Here's a link to the spec sheet
http://goo.gl/aQkDw


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## gluedl (Oct 8, 2008)

@ BethInAK: the red "brom" is actually an achmea hybrid 

@ parkanz2: I had a look at them, technically they are top notch, 30% more light output than an XP-G type, 30% less power consumption. Yet they cost nearly double where I get my LEDs and I decided that XP-Gs are far enough for me at the moment.

Have a nice day

gluedl


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## Hornet (Sep 29, 2010)

gluedl said:


> Hi all.
> 
> Over the last years I was vey doubtfull about LEDs and if they could replace normal light bulbs. Also the prices I see for "good equipment" is wallet abuse. Yet the electric engineer I am got keen to know more. Of course the LED system had to be affordable and homebuild. So here is my personal LED building sheet and LED - neon tube comparision.
> 
> ...




Sent from my HUAWEI G510-0200 using Tapatalk


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## josh_r (Feb 4, 2005)

I know this is an old thread, but it has sparked a question..... Back in the history of this post, it states you can use a driver that is rated for the maximum voltage output of the amount of LEDs you want to use. I have been looking at LEDs and drivers... I am wanting to use 10 
5w LEDS which use 7 too 7.5 volts per LED. The total consumption of all 10 LEDs is 70 to 75 volts. The driver I am wanting to use is rated DC 36 to 75 volts. So it fits the mark for the 10 LEDs at 5w each. The thing I am curious about is the driver states it is made for 12 to 18 3w LEDs. Does it really matter what wattage of LEDs are used on the driver as long as it doesn't exceed the maximum voltage the driver can handle? Here are some links at what I am looking at...

Constant Current Driver for 18 Pcs 3W High Power LED 12 18x 3W Driver Waterproof | eBay

10pcs 5W White High Power LED Light Emitter 6000 6500K with 20mm Star Heatsink | eBay

I just want to make sure the 5w LEDs will be safe to use on this driver before I buy. Thanks.

Josh


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