# albinos auratus



## Guest (Aug 9, 2004)

Hi,

I don't know why but my 'birkhahn bronze' auratus make few albinos tadpoles... :shock:


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## Guest (Aug 9, 2004)

Interesting Eric.
The tads are even more clear than the anry vittatus I get.
Keep us updated how they morph out and if they make it.


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## jbeetle (Feb 8, 2004)

Thats very cool. Have any of them morphed out and survived?


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2004)

not for the moment... but I have one with back legs :shock: 

I am worry I don't want to make "strange frogs"... I do not make something special to obtain them, I don't like playin with species :?


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## jbeetle (Feb 8, 2004)

It is a natural albino, I don't think there is anything wrong with that. They are coming from "normal" parents, right?


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## snmreptiles (Feb 26, 2004)

I am new to the caring for tadpoles thing, but after seeing these pictures I think that one of my leuc tads resembles it. They are my first eggs and first tads ever. The light (or clear) looking one was the first one the break out of it's egg. Now that they all have the first one deffinately looks different. Does this happen a lot? Also is it true that they usually don't make it? I'll let everyone know what happens as it developes.

-Shelley


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2004)

snmreptiles said:


> Does this happen a lot?


After 35 eggs, i haven't any albinos with my leuco


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## jbeetle (Feb 8, 2004)

I came across these pics last night and thought I would post them. They are from this site: http://www.fischkopps-frogs.de


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## mindcrash (Mar 3, 2004)

My girlfriend would crap if i had those, she's always bugging me to get pink ones.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2004)

I can't say I'm ever really drawn to albinos, but after a chuckle when I saw those pictures, the frogs are really pretty neat looking. Thanks for showing us.
j


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## snmreptiles (Feb 26, 2004)

Well my albino looking tad has died. Just kind of wierd, I didn't even notice it until this post. Those albinos are pretty wild. Are they auratus?

-Shelley


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## jbeetle (Feb 8, 2004)

Yes they are auratus.


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## Guest (Aug 13, 2004)

HI,

I sent an email to this breeder few days ago... but these frogs are news in his tanks and he has no information about them 

It seems that the wellknown german breeder Harald Divossen have a breeding pair of albinos bronze auratus


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2004)

great...


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2004)

I like his setups, but he has a bunch of of tree fern in them, wich i think is irresponseable, floors backrounds, side waalls, planters, etc. I understand a mix of tree fern and foam because thats not that much, but he over does it.


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## steelcube (Mar 17, 2004)

Mindcrash said:


> My girlfriend would crap if i had those, she's always bugging me to get pink ones.


You mean she hasn't been able to?? LOL

SB


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## Guest (Aug 17, 2004)

> It seems that the wellknown german breeder Harald Divossen have a breeding pair of albinos bronze auratus


Wonderful. Maybe soon we can start injecting them with neon dye to make them even 'cooler'?


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## Guest (Aug 17, 2004)

How about some genetic altering, add some jellyfish dna so they glow in the dark, now that would be um cool. Has anyone else seen the glow in the dark bunnies/mice and now commercially available fish? I can just see some people getting aneuryisms thinking about this one


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## JoshKaptur (Feb 17, 2004)

I empathise with the sentiments of the last two posts, but am fine with an albino frog. Albinism is as natural as your "regular" frog, just not as common.

Josh


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## mindcrash (Mar 3, 2004)

JoshKaptur said:


> I empathise with the sentiments of the last two posts, but am fine with an albino frog. Albinism is as natural as your "regular" frog, just not as common.
> 
> Josh


I agree, it's not like they were altered in any way.


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## Guest (Aug 17, 2004)

> Albinism is as natural as your "regular" frog, just not as common.


Oh, but they will be. That's my point.



> I agree, it's not like they were altered in any way.


Granted, albinism is a 'natural' genetic trait, but I would disagree with your statement of them being altered. Purposeful and very selective breeding to bring about a desired product which normally would not occur is 'altered,' IMO.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

WOW those are wild looking.


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## Guest (Aug 20, 2004)

Hi,

these are the last picture of the older of my "snow monster"


















We can see front legs under the skin :shock:


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## Arklier (Mar 1, 2004)

skylsdale said:


> > Albinism is as natural as your "regular" frog, just not as common.
> 
> 
> Oh, but they will be. That's my point.
> ...


Granted, albinism is a 'natural' genetic trait, but I would disagree with your statement of them being altered. Purposeful and very selective breeding to bring about a desired product which normally would not occur is 'altered,' IMO.[/quote:16pjmp4l]

Did you REALLY expect it not to happen? After the proliferation of abanism in so many other herps (burmese pythons, leopard geckos, horned frogs, corn snakes, ect.) did you REALLY think that when someone got albino darts they wouldn't try and breed them? I mean come on, be realistic here.


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## Randy (Mar 18, 2004)

I agree that the albinos pictured in this thread are very pretty. I, for one, actually prefer the coloration of the classic green/blacks to the albinos. Once you've seen one albino, you've seen 'em all!


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2004)

I beleive that albinos are amazing and beautiful animals. But part of their beauty is their rarity and the fact that they seldom occur, and we take that away when we selectively breed to get albinos, i for one am against that, but those who get them (legit) should cherish them.


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## Guest (Aug 21, 2004)

I agree with you, I do prefer his bronze parents










but I can't kill my white tadpoles, i'm not a frogkilla :wink: maybe I can catch a big bass with a white frog :lol:


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## Derek Benson (Feb 19, 2004)

I don't see why it's necessary to completely eliminate albinos form the gene pools. If you don't breed them with normals, they won't show up anymore. They would breed in the wild if they lived long enough. That's why they pop up. There's not a guy wondering the forests collected albinos so they don't breeding with normals.


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## Guest (Aug 21, 2004)

All been discussed here: http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2375


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## RSines (Feb 15, 2004)

I doubt we could completely eliminate albinism from our frogs. As we all know albinism is caused by a genetic mutation displayed in a recessive gene. Two pair of these genes must be present to ‘display’ the typical lack of coloration we associate with it. So even if one frog in a breeding group has a single recessive gene it inevitable gets passed along. We would have no idea what frogs have the genes until a true albino shows up. All that being said, it is also possible the mutation can randomly occur causing you to scratch your head and recheck your records. Haha. 

-Richard

I would imagine it would be very rare for an albino auratus to be seen let alone breed in nature. Basically, it is not required for the mutation to 'pop up'


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## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

*Would they really breed in nature?*

Would an albino actually live long enough, or be selected by a mate to actually breed in the wild? I have two thoughts that would, in my mind at least, be stong reason to believe this wouldn't happen.

predator recognition - Its believed that many predators that have not evolved ways around the PDFs' toxicity instinctually avoid these guys and their similar looking harmless mimics. This is the basis behind the theory of how and why _D. imitator _ evolved. As the younger species moved it, it was selected towards looking like the already present toxic species as it would take much longer for the new colors and patterns to reach the instinctive level of the already present species and morph. This implies that species, even brightly colored and toxic ones, that don't look like the already present toxic ones are likely to be preyed on. A green and black/brown frog going pink and yellow would most likely get 'food tested' and even if it had built up toxins and was distastful, it probibly wouldn't survive the experience.

Mate selection - ok, so somehow it didn't get 'taste tested' and lives to be mature. The pumilio research by Summers implies that looks are pretty darn important in mate selection. Would a green and black animal mate with something that looks nothing like its own species? Maybe... but hardly likely with perfectly normal selections close by. In captive settings I'm sure they could be forced into it (the only available mate, or other albinos) but thats not very 'natural' now is it?

I don't mind albinos popping up and people keeping them, and I don't think we should eliminate the gene carriers for it from the breeding pool. I just don't like the use of the albino animals in the breeding pool (for the above reasons) and especially the line breeding of them. As I stated in the other thread pertaining to albinos, I have a thing against them due to my experiences as a reptile breeder, but I try and not be too bitchy about it :?


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## Michael Shrom (May 20, 2004)

Those albino auratus are cool. I suspect they stay in the gene pool in the wild as phenotypically normal frogs. I'd pay a bundle for a trio of albino D. auratus. I'd pay half a bundle for a pair of het for albino D. auratus.


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## Guest (Sep 24, 2004)

Hi,

this is the last picture of the monster:


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## Guest (Oct 5, 2004)




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## Guest (Oct 5, 2004)

That guy just looks weird.... 
Is it changing color, or is the color change do to camera angle and light?


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## Guest (Oct 6, 2004)

*WOW!!!!*

I think that is one of the most beautiful dart frogs I have ever seen! What an incredible beauty of a frog.

I so strongly disagree with all the wannabe purists out there who spout about albinism, and breeding for it. I know for a fact that there are albino ventrimaculatus POPULATIONS in the wild. And they have been photographed.

In an aposematic species, albinos would have a greater chance of making it to adulthood than in a species that is not aposematic. Bright colored frogs in a part of the world where bright colored things are a thing to avoid, make it, and it does not really matter what those colrs may be. They would be more hurt by UV rays I think than some casula predator that has not already learned NOT to eat the brightly colored things hopping around on the ground.

As far as mate selection, looks have nothing to do with it in dart frogs. Every auratus looks different, every azureus, leuc, imitator, and all the others look different from each other. There are similarities, but we all know that what brings the girls running, is the call. The louder and the stronger call gets the girl. 

Someone mentioned someone who "suggests" this or that, and simply because they have some consonants behind their name, they know what they are talking about. I cannot count the number of times and e-mails I have gotten from zoos and other institutions asking me to sex their frogs, or identify a species. At least a dozen. The local zoo here has hobbyists come in and sex their frogs for them. (Woodland Park.)

Albinos are awesome, they are gorgeous, they are different, and I think they should be bred. I want all the albino poison frogs I can get, because I think they are so beautiful.

To date I have seen albino powder blue tinctorius, albino auratus now, albino ventrimaculatus, and albino panguana lamasi. I want all of those in my collection. They are all amazing, and are just as interesting to watch.


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## Guest (Oct 8, 2004)

Hi,

color is different because the light of the picture :? 

For the moment this pinky frog is the king of my juvenile tank. It's less shy and grow quick. Now I have a second albinos froglet :shock:


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