# non functioning Tongue



## Guest (Feb 8, 2007)

Hi all,

I have a Tinc Im caring for. The owner got them from black jungle in good health, and has been eating healthy for the last 3 months. But recently when I went to visit I noticed one was getting skinnier.
I was given them to care for them until they get a nice vivarium. I mist daily, gave them some leaf little to hide under. They have a water petri dish which I keep clean and filled, and am feeding dusted fruit flies. TOday I noticed that this Tinc has trouble getting the fruitflies to either stick to the tongue, or the tongue isn't reaching. It did get one fruit fly, maybe two at the very beggining, and its appetite is fine as it was very interested in food. As the minutes passed, the Tinc was only making the body movements of flicking the tongue, but I saw and did not hear any flicking. I pressume the tongue just stopped working. 
How can I make this situation better? And what can I tell the owner to keep this from happening again?? THanks.
I know this has been discussed before but I can't find it in the search option.

P.S., there is hope, right?


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## Arklier (Mar 1, 2004)

All the frogs that I have had that developed this problem have died, unfortunately. It gets progressively worse until the frog starves to death. I don't think anyone knows the real cause, but it's been speculated that it's either due to an illness or some kind of nutritional deficency. Do a search for the terms short tongue. Either way, you should isolate him from the others, both to keep it from spreading (in case it is an illness) and to make sure that the others don't eat all the food.


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## Guest (Feb 8, 2007)

Good suggestion. Thanks!


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## lacerta (Aug 27, 2004)

If I may offer a suggestion. I am no veterinarian but your problems strikes a familiar chord with a recent experience I had with a tinc (alanis). Necropsy revealed swollen toungue and internal organs. This frog slowly wasted away for several weeks. It was heartbreaking to watch his futile attempts at feeding. It really appears like his toungue was too short. He never lost a feeding response till the very end. At the time he died his tongue was so swollen he could not completely close his mouth. I found extensive necrosis in the mucosal layer of the intestines and in the lungs and liver. I then recalled that a week earlier when I had him quarantined on paper towels he would leave little orange stains on the paper. I know now it was blood. 
Histopathic examination of tissue and blood revealed a severe case of bacterial septicemia. I initially suspected parasites may have been a contributing factor but was surprised to find nothing (Do you know how rare that is in a frog?). 
So in hindsight I believe metronidazole (flagyl) administered topically may have saved this frogs life. Please read the following link to a thread about a week ago. Something Aaron (Frogfarm) said really sounded like a replay of what I had gone through except he had a much better outcome. 
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=24388 
Good luck with your frog.
George


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## Guest (Feb 9, 2007)

Thank you for the info!!!!


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## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

another possibility previously offered was calcium deficiency.

Ca gluconate drops on its back daily, pedialyte or better yet amphibian ringers soln baths (Ed .....suggestions?)

Replace the vitamins and feed the younger frogs (my opinion here) with DAILY dusting.

Best of luck.

Shawn


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## Guest (Feb 16, 2007)

I know someone gave me the formula for amphibian ringers. But I can't find the post :evil: 
Do you happen to know it? I make earthworm ringers solution every year. I know the ingredient are the same, but the concentrations are different. Or if someone can tell me how to make calcium gluconate?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

The tongue of the frog can lose the ability to adhere to the flies (thus giving the appearence that the tongue is too short) due to several different reasons but in a number of anurans (but most commonly documented to date in bufonids) hypovitaminosis of vitamin A (commonly referred to as “short-tongue syndrome,”). This is caused by squamous metaplasia (loss of mucous glands) due to insufficient vitamin A. The lack of vitamin A will also cause immunosuppression... This can be caused by using vitamins that are expired or do not contain sufficient levels of vitamin A or a precursor (although some bufonids appear to poorly convert beta carotene to retinol or they may have a higher metabolic requirement for vitamin A as retinol). This has been treated when noticed through the either oral retinol supplementation or drops of retinol on the back of the anuran (I do not have dosing at this time but I would suggest contact Dr. Kevin Wright in Arizona for dosages). 

for amphibian ringers the recipe is as follows 
*Amphibian Ringer's Solution 
Amphibian Ringer's is made by thoroughly mixing the following in one liter of distilled/reverse osmosis or deionized water: 
Sodium chloride (NaCl) 6.6 grams
Potassium chloride (KCl) 0.15 grams
Calcium chloride (CaCl2) 0.15 grams
Sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3) 0.2 grams 
The salts will need to be thoroughly stirred to ensure that all salts are well dissolved. 

Calcium gluconate certainly won't hurt and may provide some energy to help deal with the issue but if the frog cannot catch prey items simply changing the supplement won't help if the cannot capture the prey it cannot use the supplement. 

Ed


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## Guest (Feb 16, 2007)

Thank you Ed! You are a big help. I'll try to make the ringers tomorrow. That is, if it will help the little guy, right?
The frog I know was not given any vitamins since the Reptile show in August, and I don't know how Black Jungle cares for its frogs.
As of now, he is able to catch a few fruit flies, and I have been dusting them all with my vitamins and calcium that I have recently bought and opened. 
I use rep-cal herptivite and rep-cal calcium with D3. Hope Im using the right one.

This may be a stupid question, but if there is a fine myst of vitamin/calcium powder in the air surrounding the frog, will they be able to take up the supplements through the skin?? 
When I feed dusted fruit flies into my front opening pumilio tank, I blow them into the tank from my hand, often creating a cloud of supplement dust. Was wondering if even that helped a bit.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

The lack of a vitamin-mineral supplement since August ( 7 months...).. may have caused the problem... I would also be concerned about calcium deficiencies with the frog.. 

I have my doubts (opinion piece here) that the dry supplement would be as readily absorbed via the skin as a liquid supplement.. I would also be concerned that the dry powder would irritate the skin. 

If you search the forum, you should be able to find some links where you can get the calcium gluconate. It has to be diluted to about 2.3% and stored in the refrigerator. I would suggest inspecting the bottle regularly for cloudiness and discard it if you see any (as it indicates bacterial growth). 

Ed


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## Guest (Feb 16, 2007)

Hmm irritation. Good point. I'll stop blowing in the flies. 
Thank you again Ed. I was just doing the search for gluconate on dendroboard.


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## Guest (Feb 16, 2007)

Ahhh, found it in the Care sheets section. Very good indeed!


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