# Here we go - cloudy milky eye



## PBM3000 (Oct 4, 2019)

I noticed one of my R. Amazonica Iquitos tonight has a cloudy eye. I observed it for about half an hour and it was very inactive. When it did move, it fell off its 'perch' and landed a few inches down with it's arms splayed out in an awkward, angular position (not like in the pic). Not froggie-like at all. It made no attempt to correct its posture and is now just sat there, listless.

I'm praying that it's an eye cap from shedding and that it's stressed from frustration but the other signs aren't promising. The whitish areas around the eye and on its head may be reflections of the lighting and canopy but I can't tell...

• I've had these in the enclosure for a week now. 
• Misted periodically (Mistking) throughout the day: 10/5/5/5 seconds.
• Eating Springtails okay but no uptake on Mels yet.
• Temps are on the low side, despite a mild winter here, 72F Day to 67F Night.

Any ideas?


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

How long have you had the frogs?


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## PBM3000 (Oct 4, 2019)

One week..


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Go back to whoever sold you the frog. Inquire at the source.


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## PBM3000 (Oct 4, 2019)

Have done so. Alas, the little guy died overnight.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Sorry to hear it. I would definitely check in with the person you bought them from. Keep an eye on the others, too. 

Mark


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## dmb5245 (Feb 7, 2014)

Bummer. I'm sorry, its tough to lose a frog, but unfortunately its part of the game that most of us will experience.

The falling/awkward position could possibly be a seizure brought on by a calcium deficiency. Only relying on springs would make that worse. If you can talk to the seller, ask about the supplements they use. Dusting calcium supplements is NOT optional. 

I have no idea, but the cloudy eye could be totally unrelated to the death. It's not something I'm familiar with. But I would make every attempt to get the remaining frogs to take dusted mels. Stunted mels from older cultures might be easier for the little guys.


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## scrumpydc (Mar 9, 2015)

I have seen eyes like this on other animals and people it usually means they are blind in the eye a quick google of blind frog shows similarities don't know what causes it sorry about your frog its a shame may have been unavoidable.


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## PBM3000 (Oct 4, 2019)

Thanks all. I was expecting a loss but perhaps not so soon. Re calcium deficiency, I’m feeding Repashy dusted mels every other day but as far as I have witnessed they’re not taking them (although they are depleting.


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## Tijl (Feb 28, 2019)

I have seen eyes like this, and it just a piece of skin from "skinshedding" that got stuck on its eye imo.. I'm pretty sure thatyour frog dying has nothing to do with this.
It probably got stuck on its eye, since the frog was already on low energy to take it off.


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## scrumpydc (Mar 9, 2015)

Tijl said:


> I have seen eyes like this, and it just a piece of skin from "skinshedding" that got stuck on its eye imo.. I'm pretty sure thatyour frog dying has nothing to do with this.
> It probably got stuck on its eye, since the frog was already on low energy to take it off.


well you learn something new every day I did not think they shredded good to know in which case you could be right about it not being the cause just a side effect of being too weak


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## dmb5245 (Feb 7, 2014)

PBM3000 said:


> Re calcium deficiency, I’m feeding Repashy dusted mels every other day but as far as I have witnessed they’re not taking them (although they are depleting.


That's good you are using Repashy, but if there is a nutrient problem, it didn't originate with you after only a week. 

If you monitor the remaining frogs and report back details here, you might get some useful advice. Are you seeing them attempt to take the mels and fail (sticky tongue)? Are they ignoring them? Or are they just shy vents and you aren't seeing them at all because they are in hiding?


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## Broseph (Dec 5, 2011)

I can't comment on the cloudy eye, but I've seen your posts wondering if the frogs are actually eating dusted flies, and from your signature line it looks like you have those amazonica in a 55gal? 

I had a group of thumbs in very large viv and they started showing signs of Calcium deficiency in the form of seizure activity. I'm pretty sure the viv was big enough to be "self sustaining" with regards to springtails and frog appetites. I believe the frogs preferentially fed on springtails and avoided dusted flies. 

I treated the seizing frog with Calcium gluconate... I'm pretty sure I logged the details somewhere around here... and moved the rest to a smaller viv where their diets could be better controlled/monitored. No further problems after that, and I had successful breeding. 

Anyway, I'm quick to give my opinion that an enclosure can actually be too big for dart frogs on account of the naturalistic setups and large populations of microfauna. 

Just some thoughts- sorry about your loss.


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## PBM3000 (Oct 4, 2019)

dmb5245 said:


> PBM3000 said:
> 
> 
> > Re calcium deficiency, I’m feeding Repashy dusted mels every other day but as far as I have witnessed they’re not taking them (although they are depleting.
> ...


They seem to just be ignoring them although I’m told when they were first imported to the dealer, they ignored FFs for about a week until they were settled in and were indeed taking them. 

I’ll monitor closely. 

They’re actually quite bold - certainly more active and out of cover than I expected. That said, and while I’m here, I have a ‘dry period’ when I let the enclosure dry out a little (between 2pm and 9pm) and they tend to hide a little towards the end of that. I assume that’s normal behaviour?


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

PBM3000 said:


> They seem to just be ignoring them although I’m told when they were first imported to the dealer, they ignored FFs for about a week until they were settled in and were indeed taking


So these were fresh imports/WC?


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## PBM3000 (Oct 4, 2019)

They were imported from Germany; progeny from a UE line.


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