# Moving to the Northeast and taking viv



## T2theG (Jul 6, 2013)

Hello,

I just had a couple of questions pertaining to keeping a dart frog viv in the Northeast, actually Western Massachusetts. Where is the best place to keep the viv year-round? I was thinking the basement because in the winter I can always warm it a bit and in the summer it should stay perfectly cool.

I also had a question about which water is better to use in my misting system. I currently have a RO system that I utilize, but up North I will either have to buy water or is it safe to use water from the faucet? The water source is coming from a natural underground spring, but I'm thinking I will have to just buy distilled water from the grocer. 

Thanks in advance for any help, I really appreciate it. I attached a pic of my viv that I just finished and planted about two weeks ago. 

It's been seeded with hundreds of temperate springtails, which are doing a great job. I am using two jungle dawn 11w led bulbs on a digital timer that comes on at 7am and turns off at 7pm. I also have an Exo terra Monsoon hooked up to a hygrotherm that keeps the humidity at 75% and the temp around 74 or 75 degrees. I'm going to let the plants and the micro-fauna acclimate and cycle for three months before adding my frogs.

I can't wait!


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## ecichlid (Dec 26, 2012)

There are two correct answers - RO or distilled would work well. If you do RO, you should also have a micron cartridge and a carbon block in order to remove larger particles and chemicals. Both RO and distilled are absent of minerals, the process is to get them there is different. Both are similar to rain water in overall hardness.

Although your spring water may be very clean, it is likely to be high in mineral content. Sorry.

I will defer to others on your question about the basement.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Your tank looks great! 

I'm in the SE and we don't have basements around here, or, we'd just call them swimming pools. If I had a basement, I think it would be a great frog room 

eta: Oh! I see you are in south Florida. I'm guessing basements will be new to you too.


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## T2theG (Jul 6, 2013)

frogface said:


> Your tank looks great!
> 
> I'm in the SE and we don't have basements around here, or, we'd just call them swimming pools. If I had a basement, I think it would be a great frog room
> 
> eta: Oh! I see you are in south Florida. I'm guessing basements will be new to you too.


Yes, but I'm moving to the Northeast (Western Massachusetts).


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## mfsidore (Oct 10, 2012)

I used distiller but I had to buy it every week (3 gallons per week) and it was expensive where I bought it from 5 bucks per gallon. So now I used very very aged tap water.


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## the30oz (Aug 27, 2013)

Im in westchester, ny. Weather this years been 90+F for a month or so around july and winter dips down to the 10's. Might wanna think twice about the basement for your first winter up here.


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## Charlie Q (Jul 13, 2013)

If the power goes out, the basement will stay warmer in the winter and cooler in the summer, than the rest of the house.


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## T2theG (Jul 6, 2013)

the30oz said:


> Im in westchester, ny. Weather this years been 90+F for a month or so around july and winter dips down to the 10's. Might wanna think twice about the basement for your first winter up here.


True, but the part of the basement i was going to have the tank in is finished and has insulation plus it's climate controlled in that are. 

Sorry, I probably should have mentioned this before. From what i have been told it stays about 72F year round. I was just seeing if anyone had tips on where they place their tanks in the northeast.


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## Sea-Agg09 (Feb 2, 2013)

I love my RO unit. When misting, RO water won't leave the calcium deposits. It also is better for lots of plats. Get an RO unit that has a bypass line, so you can run just the sediment and carbon filters. This way you can get "spring water equivalent" water when you need it, and "distilled water equivalent" when you need it as well.


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## Sea-Agg09 (Feb 2, 2013)

ecichlid said:


> There are two correct answers - RO or distilled would work well. If you do RO, you should also have a micron cartridge and a carbon block in order to remove larger particles and chemicals. Both RO and distilled are absent of minerals, the process is to get them there is different. Both are similar to rain water in overall hardness.
> 
> Although your spring water may be very clean, it is likely to be high in mineral content. Sorry.


The best way I can describe it is this.
RO and Distilled are the same thing made from different processes. No dissolved solids at all. It is actually bad to drink because it throws off the osmotic balance in our body. "Spring" water is what is commonly called "carbon water". It has has the chlorine/chloramine, heavy metals, and ammonia/phosphate removed. All the hardness (GH and KH) are still in tact. The reason I use RO now is because of all the heavy metal contaminants in the local tap water. We have lead out the crazy (scientific measurement lol), some will say mercury, and all sorts of other stuff that I don't want to drink, and I don't want to expose my animals to either. The one benefit to a natural viv, is that plants tend to sequester heavy metals and other "less than beneficial things" in their tissue. As long as you are feeding the plants out, they actually do a good job of cleaning out the water. 

I will stay out of the basement talk. I have no clue (lived in Texas all my life).

You need to call up the local water authority (or an aquarium store). You need to find out if they use chlorine or chlor-amine as their water sanitizer. In many areas (all of Houston area and lots of the south now), they are using chlor-amine, which is a chlorine attached to an ammonia. The problem is that chlor-amine is MUCH stronger than standard chlorine. In many cases you can't just let water sit out like you could back in the good old days. If you use a simple chlorine remover, you will remove the chlorine, but it releases the ammonia attached to it. That ammonia causes problems.


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## Samtheman (May 10, 2006)

A finished basement might be fine for vivs. How old is the construction? Old New England houses are drafty and not well insulated. Basements stay cooler on average than the rest of the house I've noticed regardless of climate control. It isn't that much different from the rest of the house, usually 5 degrees cooler or so. However if you have lights on the viv it shouldn't be a problem. Ground floor might be best so that you can keep an eye on the tank and how its doing.

I lived in Upstate NY for a time (just a little further West on I-90 from Western Mass ). Water really should be checked township to township. Western Mass is mountainous by the Northeast's standards so there will probably some mineral content in your well water which could clog a mist system. Avg summer temps in general are in the mid-70s to 80s, rarely in the 90s and 100s. Winter time you might be fortunate enough to see some temperatures below zero but that's rare. You will also see a crap ton of snow and may even get a power outage or two depending on your luck. Have you ever been snowshoeing? Northeasterners like to strap unwieldy objects to their feet in the winter time to alleviate boredom. Its like walking only harder and tedious. Skiing is a lot more fun if only because you don't move at a snail's pace and you have the privilege of abject terror as you bomb downhill at 55 mph into some trees. 

You'll be really close to Black Jungle, they're based in Western MA and they've been keeping frogs there for years. Also, they have an awesome greenhouse and retail space. They have some cool species and are a great resource for any troubleshooting you might have down the line.

Hope this helps. 

Source: Life-long Northeasterner.


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## T2theG (Jul 6, 2013)

Samtheman said:


> A finished basement might be fine for vivs. How old is the construction? Old New England houses are drafty and not well insulated. Basements stay cooler on average than the rest of the house I've noticed regardless of climate control. It isn't that much different from the rest of the house, usually 5 degrees cooler or so. However if you have lights on the viv it shouldn't be a problem. Ground floor might be best so that you can keep an eye on the tank and how its doing.
> 
> I lived in Upstate NY for a time (just a little further West on I-90 from Western Mass ). Water really should be checked township to township. Western Mass is mountainous by the Northeast's standards so there will probably some mineral content in your well water which could clog a mist system. Avg summer temps in general are in the mid-70s to 80s, rarely in the 90s and 100s. Winter time you might be fortunate enough to see some temperatures below zero but that's rare. You will also see a crap ton of snow and may even get a power outage or two depending on your luck. Have you ever been snowshoeing? Northeasterners like to strap unwieldy objects to their feet in the winter time to alleviate boredom. Its like walking only harder and tedious. Skiing is a lot more fun if only because you don't move at a snail's pace and you have the privilege of abject terror as you bomb downhill at 55 mph into some trees.
> 
> ...


I guess I will just have to see once I get there which is going to be best the basement or the ground floor level. One good thing is that I do not have in frogs yet because I am letting the viv cycle for at least three months. So it is only plants and micro-fauna at the moment. This way I can make sure that all is well in the tank and the temps are correct before I add my frog pair. 

I have not been snowshoeing yet, but a lot of my family does this and I'm sure I'll be doing it soon enough. Thanks for the info on Black Jungle, I will have to check it out and see how close they are to me. I know that NEHERP is in CT, which is about an hours drive from where I am at, but might be well worth it as well.

Kind Regards


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## Sea-Agg09 (Feb 2, 2013)

Sea-Agg09 said:


> As long as you *are* feeding the plants out, they actually do a good job of cleaning out the water.


Should say "aren't".


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