# tads care....



## jknight (Jun 25, 2009)

So when i finally get some tads from my azureus pair.. how do i care for them? i would really like to hear how each person does it insted of a link to a different thread.. so do you house them individualy ? what do you feed them? do you put almond leaves in the cup? some type of moss? what do you guys do?

Thanks 
Justin


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Justin,

You are not even going to get a link on this, as it is so basic and it has been covered a thousand times and most people here do not want to clutter up the forum by reposting the basic / easy to find stuff over and over.

You know where the info is....the sticky. It is very complete and contains everything you need.

Remember, we are here to help....but in this case.....you can help yourself quite easily.


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## jknight (Jun 25, 2009)

oh okay, sorry dont mean to be a pain!


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

ok...now I officially feel horrible. All I had to do was to think back to one of my first posts on "mites in FF cultures"


*Tadpole Care Sheet*

*Got eggs?*
Make sure to read through the Egg Care Sheet for information on that life stage. Also, please note that this is a general guideline, and species specific information can be found on the individual species care sheets.
Egg Care Sheet

Poison Dart Frogs (Family: Dendrobatidae) are best known for their toxic secretions and aposematic (warning) coloration by the general public, but it's the extreme amount of parental care shown by the family that really sets them developmentally apart from most other anurans. While most keepers commonly remove eggs, this practice is not necessary if tadpole deposition sites are offered, and is actually detrimental to the development of eggfeeder tads. It's recommended to look into experimenting having tadpoles morph in tank, but with most tanks there are not enough tadpole deposition sites, or the deposition sites cannot support the tadpoles produced. In these cases, tadpole care outside the parent's tank is needed.

*In Tank vs. Individual vs. Communal Raising:*
Dendrobatid tadpoles can generally be organized into three general groupings: tadpoles to be left in the parent tanks, tadpoles best raised individually, and tadpoles best raised communally.

Tadpoles to be left in tank belong to two groups - the obligate eggfeeding group and the facultative egg feeding group. These two groups have adapted to niches of small water bodies that do not have enough nutrition for the tadpoles, in which their diet is partially (facultative eggfeeders) to completely (obligate eggfeeders) made up of feeder eggs from the parents. The eggfeeders, species such as D. pumilio and D. histrionicus, MUST have their tadpoles left in the tank and cared for by their parents, they cannot be raised artificially as their are so highly adapted to living off feeder eggs that they cannot be raised on other substances. In this case, water bodies should be provided in the tank by water filled containers such as film canisters, or plants such as bromeliads. Facultative eggfeeders, the Vanzolinii group such as D. imitator, D. fantasticus, etc., have diets only supplemented by feeder eggs, and can be raised artificially as described below.

Many of our most popular species, members of the D. tinctorius and the D.vanzolinii groups, should be raised individually. While the clutches initially contain multiple tadpoles, these animals are mainly deposited individually into bodies of water. The negative influences of keeping these tadpoles together vary from growth inhibiting hormones (mainly in the D. tinctorius group), aggression (both groups), to downright cannabilism (D. vanzonlinii group). The smaller tadpoles of the thumbnail group can be raised in bodies of water as small as shot glasses and film canisters, while the larger D. tinc group tadpoles are best raised in larger bodies of water around a cup or larger.

Communal tadpoles are usually deposited in large puddles to small pools with little water flow and no fish, and usually the whole clutch is deposited in the same water body. Communal tadpoles tend to belong to species with larger clutches, belonging to the genera Allobates, Cryptophyllobates, Colostethus, Epipedobates, and Phyllobates. The tadpoles have very low aggression, and can be raised in large containers such as fish tanks and sweaterboxes. These tadpoles are the most problematic to raise in tank unless the water body they are deposited in is large in size, at least a gallon or more, and are best pulled and raised outside the tank.

*Diet:*
This can be a little bit of a confusing issue with PDFs, and needs to be explored further. In general, the PDFs kept in captivity are mostly omnivorous detritus eaters. There are only a handful of exceptions, such as eggfeeders (which only feed on feeder eggs deposited by the parents), and species such as reticulatus (whose tadpoles seem to be primarily algae eaters - see Tor Linbo's Species Profile). These omnivorous diets should include grazing on bacteria, algae, omnivorous fish/tadpole foods, and detritus such as boiled leaf skeletons from oak and wild almond leaves.

There has been a trend in recent years of using spirulina/chlorella algae mixes as the majority of a tadpoles' diet, and while available from many frog supply retailers, this is not a good tadpole staple and should make up only a minor percentage of the diet for omnivorous species. While not as obvious in more common Dendrobates species, the effect of algae based diets on morphing time and size is more obvious in other genera, especially Epipedobates, and has been shown in some early comparative studies in Dendrobates. HBH Frog & Tadpole bites seems to be the best staple diet currently, and fish flakes, algae mixes, and boiled leaf skeletons should also be included for a varied, and healthy omnivorous tadpole diet.

*Water:*

Water and water quality maybe one of the most debatable aspects of raising tadpoles. In general you want clean spring or aged tap water, and not water without minerals. 

*Bottled Spring Water* - For a small number of tadpoles this maybe the best option as it will provide consistency.
*Aged Tap Water* - Tap water can be used if it is properly treated and in many cases filtered. The chlorine and Chloramine must be removed. Softened water can also cause problems. The main issues with Tap water is consistency between locations and in some area time of year. You can age tap water over night to remove Chlorine, but many cities are now using Chloramine, which can not be removed with this method.
*RO* - Is the best way to remove nearly everything from the water, but it can be too clean for some species and requires remineralization. This can be accomplished with products like "RO Right".
*Tadpole tea:*

As with many aspects of the hobby people have varied success with a number of things one being tadpole tea. Tadpole tea is used to describe a number of different ideas and theories manly around adding tannins to the water. This can be accomplished a number of ways and below I will list some of the common methods. 

*Adding leaves* - adding leaves or parts of leaves to your tadpole containers can release tannins into the water and you will notice over time the water will take on a brownish to reddish color.
*Boiling leaves* - and straining out the water into a storage container. Then adding a tablespoon or so into each tadpole container.
*Boiling Peat Moss* - and straining out the water into a storage container. Then adding a tablespoon or so into each tadpole container.
*Black Water Extract* - is a commercial product that can be used in small amounts.
*Water Changes:*
Water changes are another controversial topic. There are two sides to this debate: some never change the tadpoles water and others change it weekly or more often. Recently it has been suggested that some plastic containers could leech chemicals into the water and cause deformities though many larger breeders use all plastic containers without issue. Water changes could also play a part in the amount of leeching that occurs.

*Water Temperature:*
Over the years there have some discussions on common tadpole issues and a possible link to water temperature. With that said the hobby standard seems to be to keep the tadpoles in water around the low to mid 70s for best results. Recently there have been some innovative ideas on how to keep them at the right temperature. See the link below for an example on the past discussion:
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=25313

*Coming out of the water...*
While the hind leg development is gradual and easily viewed, forelimb development actually occurs in pouches on the body. When the froglet begins metamorphosis, the forelimbs "pop" from these pouches fully developed. At this point the "polliwog" is no longer eating, and should be moved to a morphing container. Depending on the species, tail absorption and movement onto the land will take a few days (Epipedobates) to upwards of a week (D. tinc group). Once the polliwog is actively up and hopping around on land and absorbed its tail, it can be moved into the froglet containers.

Morphing containers vary by keeper, and can be for individual froglets, groups of froglets, or simply a shallow, water-filled depression in the froglet containers. Many species are able to pull themselves out the water with a small land area or sphagnum in the water.

*Spindly Leg Syndrome*
Spindly Leg Syndrome (SLS) is a developmental abnormality observed in some amphibians, including dendrobatids. It is most commonly observed as the deformity of both front limbs, but it can also result in the deformity of a single limb, or even the absence of one or both front limbs. The exact cause of SLS is unknown, but genetics, nutrition and husbandry are all potential contributing factors. SLS is also temporal, in that breeding frogs producing healthy tadpoles can later produce tads with SLS, and frogs producing tads with SLS can later produce healthy tads.

Tadpoles with SLS are generally identified by the characteristic "spindly" nature of the front limbs. The limbs are not as developed as they should be, and may be shorter, skinner, or even "curled". Metamorphs with SLS are unable to support their own weight, and for that reason can also be identified by their "top-heavy" appearance (chin touching the substrate), and their limited capability for movement (propelling themselves forward with their rear limbs only). The prognosis for froglets with SLS is poor, as they have great difficulties with feeding, and if housed with other froglets, are unable to compete for food. Therefore, metamorphs with SLS are generally euthanized. Euthanasia may be performed by administering a drop of benzocaine (Orajel®) to the ventral surface (belly) or the skull. Other humane methods of euthanasia are discussed in the Emergency Supportive Care Sheet. However, some have tried raising froglets with SLS with limited success, as the condition is permanent.

More reading on SLS:
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3459
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18768

*Tadpole Pictures:*
Imitator Tadpole:

Imitator Tadpole with back legs:

Bastimentos Parental care:

Vent tad showing front arms about to pop:

Truncatus Tadpole Morpohing:

Top view of tadpole morphing container:

Side view of a tadpole morphing container:

Example of SLS, look at the front arms which are undersized and unusable:


References:


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

To the person who gave me neg feedback on the above post......do you care to comment on why you think we shouldn't direct him to some posts that contain the EXACT answers to his questions or the sticky that I provided?

If you have something new in terms of husbandry, then by all means, I'd love to hear and it would add to the thread.

But I guess you have nothing to add except your anonymous comment


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## jknight (Jun 25, 2009)

its okay man, i should have done some research before i go posting threads. I could have found it but i was lazy... thanks for the help!! 
Oh and if you were woundering i wasnt the one that posted the neg comment on your thing. I dont even know how to do that lol im pretty new to the board as you can tell!! 

But god news  i found another clutch today !! (azureus)


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## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

I did a thread on plastics, and after reading the above, I want to add this---

Try to avoid polycarbonate or polyvinyl in tad rearing. They can leach BPA or other nasties into the water, esp. at an increased rate when superheated or supercooled. 

I use glass jars for my tads---I save honey, spaghetti and other jars for this...

When the tads are small (about a month old), I keep them in a 16 oz jar of water, remove the droppings w/a turkey baster each day and top off with a few ounces of water. I feed a mixture of Repashy's Gecko Food, spirulina and chlorella algae (I don't use the tadpole bites since I called the company in question and they said "the ash that is in our product is not disclosed to the public"). 

After one month, I pour out nearly all the water except for two/three ounces and add a bit more spirulina/chlorella algea to the water and expose it to morning window light. At that point, the tads are big enough to oxygenate the water, allowing the algae to survive and cleaning the water (which makes the room smell better and they grow faster, IMO). 
I think this approach might approximate what they get in the wild yonders.


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## jknight (Jun 25, 2009)

Thanks for your input susan! So i was goign to put tads in a cup like what people culture ffs in.. would that not be a good cup to use?


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## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

jknight said:


> Thanks for your input susan! So i was goign to put tads in a cup like what people culture ffs in.. would that not be a good cup to use?


That plastic is not part of the group listed above in that it is rated for such uses---it would be your safest bet, IMO---but I just prefer glass.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

This may help with some questions...

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/breeding-eggs-tadpoles/42703-tad-container-size.html


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## jknight (Jun 25, 2009)

Okay good. I just posted some pics of the clutch i found acouple days ago, can you tell if they are good or not?


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

posted on your other thread...


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