# New frog tank prototype



## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Well to start off I work for an aquarium manufacturing company called DAS (Dutch Aquarium Systems) and we make a style of tank unique to the fish field called the Aquaplantarium







it has windows that slide down from the front and I wanted to see if i could convert it to a frog tank, one more geared to dart frogs. We have had frogs and other creatures live on the terrestrial portion successfully (weve had a whites tree frog in a four footer for 2-3 years now) but for frogs that need smaller meals, and are thus smaller in size, would be a near nightmare to feed and keep inside. My goal is to make one specifically for small frogs that will hold in fruit flies. An endeavor that, to my knowledge, no commercially made tank has achieved successfully.
I took an old 15 gallon AP (aquaplantarium) measuring 14x14x23 inches and tried to seal the edges of the front sliding window. Now this is a rough prototype. I used plastic strips to seal the edges with foam. In the final model I hope to use rubber and more presicion of course. I made this in our main plant room with a paper cutter and hot glue. Warning. Perfectionists beware XD







^ this is showing portion that seals the bottom of the sliding glass. I angled it so it is only visible from up close staring right down on it as more pictures will prove







^this is showing the foam strip that will be replaced by rubber







^ and with the glass placed against it. I wanted something that would flex with the weight of the glass. Foam works but is too ugly for my taste and is harder to be exact with. Using a very soft rubber seems to be a better option for us. 
Now I did setup and decorate slightly before this post which ill put up next post.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

dilljone said:


> Well to start off I work for an aquarium manufacturing company called DAS (Dutch Aquarium Systems) and we make a style of tank unique to the fish field called the Aquaplantarium it has windows that slide down from the front and I wanted to see if i could convert it to a frog tank, one more geared to dart frogs. We have had frogs and other creatures live on the terrestrial portion successfully (weve had a whites tree frog in a four footer for 2-3 years now) but for frogs that need smaller meals, and are thus smaller in size, would be a near nightmare to feed and keep inside. My goal is to make one specifically for small frogs that will hold in fruit flies.


This tank style is not a good match for dart frogs. Dart frogs are mainly terrestrial -- they forage around the leaf litter for food. This type of tank has almost no ground for the dart frogs to move around. So while it might work for a tree frog that doesn't need the ground, I don't think ti would work for most dart frogs.


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

The tank dimensions will be changed naturally. We didnt have any tanks with what I wanted dimension wise laying around. Rough drafts are going to be rough. I plan on getting a younger frog once this is fully setup and ready. Once we know the concept works we will relocate him to a more specially designed tank for long term housing and display. Dont worry. These frogs will be very well taken care of.


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Well for our system and setup I used what we produce and use regularly. For the drainage layer I used our gravel. Extremely bioactive and any plants weve stuck it into shoot off like crazy. And above that is our foam we use on several of our basic filter designs. I know dirt will eventually drain through but that does not concern me right now. This is a proof of concept for the tank not the inside, although I am making pleasing to the eye and the frog. I placed two sticks (perfectly safe for frogs Weve been using them for years) and two of our fake rocks we make in house. They are made of a type of foam and will not leach anything into the environment.







The small stick that appears to be floating is glued on. I am using that as a handle. Usually our tanks do not have one but because weare sealing the edges we must.
I used a peat moss/top soil blend and placed sheet moss completely over that portion. Theres a few plants, a fittonia verschaffeltii, a hypoestes, and a fern that im not familiar with. The background is blank as I dont feel comfortable using our typical rock background. This is a new design so I want a new background. Ive been studying several different rainforest trees and kinda have an idea of what I want. The material will be the same foam as the rocks, but thicker. We've used it for years and tillandsia, bromeliad, and potted plants are easy to plant there and unlike the exoterra foam inserts they'll actually hold and stay. All that is needed is a drill bit, or really anything to make a hole. Once I have the background made ill add it in along with some bromeliads of mine. (Neoregalia Hannibal lector, fireball, mo pepper please, tiger cub, sun fire etc. Etc.) I dont have any leaf litter at the moment but narbc is this weekend I will be getting some.








For larger tanks we're gonna try to make mangrove and the bay fig trees (butress trees to some, picture attached) as backgrounds. Thoughts? And naturally the bay fig trees will not have the spikes as they do in the wild.


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## Pubfiction (Feb 3, 2013)

All images are broken for me.


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## frogmanchu (Feb 18, 2011)

I think the tank looks great. If you guys pull off those background ideas in the pics, that's gonna be awesome. 

Sent from my SCH-R530U using Tapatalk 2


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## tinkgirl77 (Dec 30, 2012)

This is a really cool concept.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Google Lars Osterdahl. He has been making same design for years with full front access


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Scott Richardson said:


> Google Lars Osterdahl. He has been making same design for years with full front access


In what way other than a slanted front? All I find is a drawing for a tank with a slanted front. While ours has that (at the upper portion only anyways), from what I can tell from the pictures his pulls out while ours slides up and under our lighting. Similar in shape yes but not design.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

No offense, but I believe full access will win out over a sliding door anytime. On a tank 18 x 18 x 36, the bottom 18 inches of the front is sealed along with 12 inches or so at the top. 

How does one install a premade 3 dimensional false bottom ? 
This may make an ok design for horizontal vivs, but alot of people use verts


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## Ghost vivs (Sep 26, 2010)

This design allows full access. The glass door slides out of the way on a milled door track, 100% out of the way. 

Casper


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## Ghost vivs (Sep 26, 2010)

How would this design be harder to install a false bottom? Not really following your logic here.

Casper


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## Ghost vivs (Sep 26, 2010)

Mater of fact they already have a 3-D false bottom like bio box designed to fit right in it.

Want to upgrade your false bottom by 1,000%? Buy one from D.A.S.

DAS AquaPlantarium Aquarium

Casper


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

First picture in 12:14 pm post. The front on that tank does not move, nor does the top. The 25% of the front that is slanted is all that moves.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Logic- If one builds a false bottom with a foot high structure for a waterfall and slanted pcs and up rights for back ground, how is it going thru just the slant opening? 
Open top, you set it down in. Front open, you slide it in.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Other than being friends with the OP Casper, what are you basing your rave review of their vivariums on? 
If this is a prototype, you don't have a bunch in use


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## Ghost vivs (Sep 26, 2010)

Just as much access as a fish tank and more than "euros". The prototype is just a mod to an existing tank not a whole new system. See the link I provided...



Casper


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Scott Richardson said:


> Logic- If one builds a false bottom with a foot high structure for a waterfall and slanted pcs and up rights for back ground, how is it going thru just the slant opening?
> Open top, you set it down in. Front open, you slide it in.


 This is actually why I posted on here. While I may see ideas and problems that I wish to fix there are dozens of potential problems that can only be seen from an outside influence. 

Now that being said for a waterfall you would'nt need that much height in the false bottom, at least not for how we would add one. On the Bioboxes that Ghost mentioned earlier we have a pump suck water through the boxes out the top of our premade backgrounds as a waterfall (in our fish tanks the waterfall circulates the surface water) and we would hide the pump with a cutout of the background. Still full access to the pump should something go wrong but the mechanisms are completely hidden. We could do the same thing for the frog tanks. And if you want to put a false bottom down from the top, the tank is also (albeit a little harder) fully acsseble from the top. We have an adjustable vent that meets a pane of glass. These go together and can bend upwards to be removed easily.

Now that Im thinking I think we could make a Bio-Box more geared for these tanks and for frogs terrariums in general. A Box with our bioactive gravel inside and a screen/fine mesh covering that.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

That is why I am bringing this up. Zoomeds have a background, and people rip them out and design their own. They design waterfalls as they want them. You have to make it to allow that freedom. Not use your box. False bottoms too. 
By "Euro" I assume you mean the vivs where the entire front is open side to side, top to bottom until you finish planting and install doors?


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Scott Richardson said:


> That is why I am bringing this up. Zoomeds have a background, and people rip them out and design their own. They design waterfalls as they want them. You have to make it to allow that freedom. Not use your box. False bottoms too.


That's exactly what I try to go for. I was a hobbyist before a designer, and I know for a fact that 90% of the fun is designing the tanks yourself. But I had also worked at a petstore and what I found is that many people would have a very hard time understanding all the mechanisms that go into vivaria design and building, but would want a setup themselves. 
The idea that I want to bring forth is that you can buy the tank all the way from the bare necessities to a "put in dirt and plants and you're done" tank. Like a car. You can have the standard edition or you can add on sat nav, satellite radio, a HAL even, depending on your wants and desires. Some people buy the zoo med or the exoterra tanks and keep the background but make everything else, while some buy a kit from petco and are just as happy. It all depends on the owner of the tank.


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## SDRiding (Jul 31, 2012)

Maybe try to redesign the top so it's relatively easy to remove, would give a tremendous amount of access that way. They make plastic aquarium rims that accept channels. My viv is setup that way, the top slides right off and I can remove the sliding doors. Full top and front access.


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

SDRiding said:


> Maybe try to redesign the top so it's relatively easy to remove, would give a tremendous amount of access that way. They make plastic aquarium rims that accept channels. My viv is setup that way, the top slides right off and I can remove the sliding doors. Full top and front access.


It is pretty easy. I could take pictures if you'd like. Just have to do it once or twice. I meant harder than the sliding front window.


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## SDRiding (Jul 31, 2012)

Oh nice! Cool design man, hope it works out!



dilljone said:


> It is pretty easy. I could take pictures if you'd like. Just have to do it once or twice. I meant harder than the sliding front window.


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## irishanaconda (Nov 12, 2010)

interesting concept!


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Well I had to change lighting (was getting 80.6 degrees in an air conditioned room. Now at 78.4. Probably end up venting the hood) and decided to snap pictures of the removable top while I was waiting for the bulbs to cool. Figured my explanation didnt make much sense for words. 








Regular position. notice adjustable vent. Considering keeping it or replacing with fan.










Lift up both pieces










And then its removed. Just go in reverse to replace. Very very simple


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## ndame88 (Sep 24, 2010)

Very interesting design, I like the idea and this thread to see what modifications are made to fit our hobby.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

hypostatic said:


> This tank style is not a good match for dart frogs. Dart frogs are mainly terrestrial -- they forage around the leaf litter for food. This type of tank has almost no ground for the dart frogs to move around. So while it might work for a tree frog that doesn't need the ground, I don't think ti would work for most dart frogs.


As it is setup in the pic you might be right, but there is nothing that prevents you from making a much more substantial land portion. You could do all terrestrial for that matter. It is basically like a big exo-terra with sliding doors instead of hinges. 

Building a false bottom may be challenging if you can't get the main piece in through the door, but then you can just build a couple of sections and sit them next to each other and proceed from there, or do leca bottom, substrate divider and soil. 

I see no problem using these for darts. In fact there used to be a lot of tanks like this with the slightly slanted front that opened up. I think I even had one as a viv once, till it got dropped


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Update:
Well we cant make the background that I wanted without a mold first. Eventually gonna build a fake one and have our background guy build and color it. But I did happen to run across a piece taken from a fake tree (life size) we did for another customer that was scrap and just happened to fit in the tank almost perfectly. Added it in there with moss to hide the gaps and gnarly bits. Waiting on the silicone to dry. Will post pictures possibly tonight or even tomorrow when I take off the clips.

Adjusted the Plants as well. Took out the hypoestes and added two plants that i'm a bit unfamiliar on, and a cryptanthus 'Black Mystic'. Took out my fern and fittonia out of their pots and planted them straight into the dirt as well.

Actually got into a discussion with our plant manager today about mist systems. We were thinking about creating our own line for our tanks and pet store units with a special type of nozzle if I can work out some details..... Something that I think would be extremely bad ass if I could make it work properly. Details sure to come


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Okay so while installing the background (silicone almost dry) I noticed that my sheet moss was already starting to sprout and grow.









But anyways back to the background. I know it was a scrap from a failed mold that ultimately became this fake tree. The limb is real and the tree is fake. Stood roughly 5 feet








Found it and only had to trim off two or three inches from the top. I siliconed the top in and then used that same sheet moss and siliconed around the edges. It being scrap resulted in a rather ragged shape and made it near impossible to completely silicone the edges. Used the moss almost like a tape and siliconed directly to the glass and to the BG. I expect it will eventually die (any thoughts on that?) but I plan on adding some sort of vining plant to cover it over. Even then it still looks good brown  But enough formalities. Here it is.



















When the silicone is completely dry ill take another picture with some bromeliads and tillandsia added. That and I changed ones of the bulbs to a brighter different spectrum to give it a)more light and b) a more diffused look of warm and cool lighting.


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

Are pics working for anyone? They are not showing for my computers? Will have to repost if neccessary


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## Bcs TX (Sep 13, 2008)

Not working for me either. Using my IPhone.


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## dilljone (Jun 24, 2013)

All righty ill just repost. Any wonder why I cant edit my post? The box down below says I may but It wont let me. Could a mod edit this to make it more streamlined? Anyways.....

Okay so while installing the background (silicone almost dry) I noticed that my sheet moss was already starting to sprout and grow.


But anyways back to the background. I know it was a scrap from a failed mold that ultimately became this fake tree. The limb is real and the tree is fake. Stood roughly 5 feet

Found it and only had to trim off two or three inches from the top. I siliconed the top in and then used that same sheet moss and siliconed around the edges. It being scrap resulted in a rather ragged shape and made it near impossible to completely silicone the edges. Used the moss almost like a tape and siliconed directly to the glass and to the BG. I expect it will eventually die (any thoughts on that?) but I plan on adding some sort of vining plant to cover it over. Even then it still looks good brown  But enough formalities. Here it is.





When the silicone is completely dry ill take another picture with some bromeliads and tillandsia added. That and I changed ones of the bulbs to a brighter different spectrum to give it a)more light and b) a more diffused look of warm and cool lighting.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

I would suggest flickr for storing and posting pics...you get like a terabyte of free space now I think, and I encounter far fewer broken or bandwidth exceeded issues when people or myself post images hosted from flickr rather then photobucket or some other site.

Also there is a time limit on being able to mod a post after it i intitially posted. I thnk you have 30min-1hr or something then it is locked and you have to get special permission to mod it or made a new post about whatever info has changed....keeps people from stealth moding posts and saying "I never said that!, or did that!"...so it is very useful but sometimes annoying when you wanna just update or fix something


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