# DAP Sealant [Alex Ultra 230] Safe?



## craven (Mar 12, 2011)

First of all is it safe for a Great Stuff Background, this stuff, then coco-fiber mushed on top?

Second, if it is safe, does it work just as well as GE Silicone II? I was in hardware store and this stuff was $4/tube. GE Silicone was pushing $7/tube.

DAP® ALEX Ultra® 230 Premium Indoor/Outdoor Sealant with MICROBAN® Antimicrobial Product Protection


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Absolutely not. It's not even silicone.


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## froggymike (Jan 11, 2010)

I agree that you are not able to use that caulk. You must use 100% pure silicone.


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## craven (Mar 12, 2011)

Thank you folks. Returning it tomorrow.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

If you study this thread, http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/35720-bio-seal.html , you may come to the conlusion that GE Silicone 1 is a better choice than GE Silicone 2. This is due to the organotins in the GE 2. Unfortunately, it is very hard to find the GE 1 in colors. I've only seen it in clear.


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## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

Nothing in the realm of man-made chemicals for viv building has been proven entirely safe for dart frogs. Some things are safer than others, but still not totally safe, as it were... (such as neoprene as opposed to latex, 100 percent silicone as opposed to silicone plus mold inibitors/antimicrobial agents, etc). 

Your best bet is generally to make a clay background and avoid these things where possible, including PVC (as noted in the Poison Frogs book by Lotters, Henckel, etc.) It is not always the immediate finished product that is the issue, but what remains and what gets released after that material breaks down over the years that is the issue here.


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## shockingelk (May 14, 2008)

Pumilo said:


> Absolutely not. It's not even silicone.


Old thread but are you asserting the tubes that say 100% silicone REALLY aren't? I've four tubes of this stuff I bought years ago ("AQUARIUM SEALANT 100% SILICONE") I wish to use in a couple days.

I've found threads here where folks disagree, but they are all at least a year old. O', wondering if a consensus has been reached? Product discontinued?


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

shockingelk said:


> Old thread but are you asserting the tubes that say 100% silicone REALLY aren't? I've four tubes of this stuff I bought years ago ("AQUARIUM SEALANT 100% SILICONE") I wish to use in a couple days.
> 
> I've found threads here where folks disagree, but they are all at least a year old. O', wondering if a consensus has been reached? Product discontinued?


Hey Erik, I'm not sure why you think I am saying that tubes that say 100% silicone are NOT silicone. I was not saying that at all. The product in question here, is Alex Ultra 230. It does not contain any silicone at all. It is a "latex sealant". It does not claim to be a silicone and it does not state that it contains any silicone whatsoever. It does have a "cousin" product that is a mixture of "latex sealant" and silicone, but I would NOT use that either.

All brands of *aquarium* silicone are safe for vivs. GE silicone 1 is my silicone of choice. I would NOT recommend GE silicone 2 because of the organotins in it. http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/35720-bio-seal.html
If you are considering using a silicone that is several years old, you may wish to reconsider, or at the very least, test every single tube before use. Silicone DOES expire. Look for an expiration date. If it is past it's expiration, it may NEVER fully cure. That has left a horrible mess for more than a few on DendroBoard over the years. To test it, put a blob on a piece of cardboard or something, and see if it will FULLY cure. To let it fully cure, you will have to do this test at least 24 hours before you plan on using it.

I think the disagreement you see, is about GE 1 or GE 2. Unfortunately, a true consensus will likely never be reached. In a short summary, GE silicone 2 DOES contain organotins. Organotins have been linked to possible spindly leg and egg failure. GE silicone 1 does NOT contain organotins. 
Proponents for GE 2 believe it to be safe because they say their frogs have not died and are doing fine. This is not proof at all. People have no idea if they would have had better breeding without organotins in the viv. They don't know it life span was affected at all. They don't know if problems have risen in the offspring, even years later. Testing would have to be done, with controls, and many duplicate groups of frogs, before you can definitely say that it is safe.
On the other hand, GE silicone 1 does NOT contain organotins, and does NOT have that risk. To me, this choice is painfully obvious. One sentence sums it up.
GE Silicone 2 contains organotins and MAY present a danger to your frogs. GE Silicone 1 does NOT have these risks.


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## shockingelk (May 14, 2008)

Pumilo said:


> All brands of *aquarium* silicone are safe for vivs. GE silicone 1 is my silicone of choice. I would NOT recommend GE silicone 2 because of the organotins in it. http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/35720-bio-seal.html
> If you are considering using a silicone that is several years old, you may wish to reconsider, or at the very least, test every single tube before use. Silicone DOES expire. Look for an expiration date. If it is past it's expiration, it may NEVER fully cure. That has left a horrible mess for more than a few on DendroBoard over the years. To test it, put a blob on a piece of cardboard or something, and see if it will FULLY cure. To let it fully cure, you will have to do this test at least 24 hours before you plan on using it.


Thanks for the details and warning that old silicone may cure slower. Having just moved, my frogs have already been in 196 oz tubs for two weeks and I wish to get them in decent homes ASAP - but also wish to give them tree fern panels as a background.

Thanks!


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