# Clay background made to look like rock?



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Been looking for a way to make some parts have a rock wall especially around the waterfall. Real rocks will be too heavy and impossible to find the right ones.
heard about habicrete but due to they're reputation I don't wanna get anything from them.

What can be used for a rock effect on clay that will last and be safe? Any kind of grout or anything?


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## kinison (Jul 1, 2010)

I have seen some examples where people press in sand and it gives it a nice rock look. Other than that and using real rock, Usually carved styrofoam and a artistic paint job works.


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## GRIMM (Jan 18, 2010)

Clay is pretty damn heavy also. My clay 20 gallons are at the threshold of me being able to move them by myself. I would go with sculpted foam covered with a mixture of your choice, using sand as the main additive.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

Here are some great threads on clay and clay backgrounds:

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/pa...day-weekend-build-clay-background-method.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/60202-my-10-gallon-clay-background-build.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-discussion/22990-ultimate-clay-based-substrate-thread.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/60455-ok.html


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

Might not be exactly what you are talking about but here is what I did. Clay backgroud everywhere except on the left hand side where you see the slate waterfall. I dug out the clay where the waterfall was going to go, sprayed in a mound of great stuff, after it cured, cut slits where the slate was to go, covered in silicone, inserted slate, covered exposed silicone with coco fiber/peat moss mix. To the left of the slate waterfall are two pieces of cork bark secured in place with GS each with their own drip line, then slapped clay in all the voids.


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## ryangreenway (Apr 30, 2010)

Oh my god, I absolutely love that tank.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

randommind said:


> Might not be exactly what you are talking about but here is what I did. Clay backgroud everywhere except on the left hand side where you see the slate waterfall. I dug out the clay where the waterfall was going to go, sprayed in a mound of great stuff, after it cured, cut slits where the slate was to go, covered in silicone, inserted slate, covered exposed silicone with coco fiber/peat moss mix. To the left of the slate waterfall are two pieces of cork bark secured in place with GS each with their own drip line, then slapped clay in all the voids.
> 
> View attachment 14282


Pretty wicked tank. How is your clay holding up to the high humidity, misting, etc. I noticed your water feature looks a little murky, is that runoff from the clay?


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

SmackoftheGods said:


> Pretty wicked tank. How is your clay holding up to the high humidity, misting, etc. I noticed your water feature looks a little murky, is that runoff from the clay?


Yeah, I used a clay based substrate and around the bottom of the fall it turned to muck and quickly transformed the water into what you see. I let it run like that for about a week or so then did a water change. It looks a little better now but it is far from clear. I plan on changing the water one more time then accept what I have. On the next tank I will not put the clay substrate around where the water will come in direct contact.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

randommind said:


> Yeah, I used a clay based substrate and around the bottom of the fall it turned to muck and quickly transformed the water into what you see. I let it run like that for about a week or so then did a water change. It looks a little better now but it is far from clear. I plan on changing the water one more time then accept what I have. On the next tank I will not put the clay substrate around where the water will come in direct contact.


How long has it been running? You may need to send me a PM with a walkthrough


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

SmackoftheGods said:


> How long has it been running? You may need to send me a PM with a walkthrough


PM sent...


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

randommind said:


> Yeah, I used a clay based substrate and around the bottom of the fall it turned to muck and quickly transformed the water into what you see. I let it run like that for about a week or so then did a water change. It looks a little better now but it is far from clear. I plan on changing the water one more time then accept what I have. On the next tank I will not put the clay substrate around where the water will come in direct contact.


 
You need to let the biofilm grow which stabilizes the clay. Too much too soon results in what you see. This can be reduced by the judicious use of acrylic fortifier which gives it structure until the bacteria can get in and working. As we aren't totally sealing it, a period of about 4 weeks should occur before adding frogs if you use the fortifier as this gives time for any unbonded fortifier to be broken down by the microbes. 

Ed


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## Okapi (Oct 12, 2007)

Ed said:


> You need to let the biofilm grow which stabilizes the clay. Too much too soon results in what you see. This can be reduced by the judicious use of acrylic fortifier which gives it structure until the bacteria can get in and working. As we aren't totally sealing it, a period of about 4 weeks should occur before adding frogs if you use the fortifier as this gives time for any unbonded fortifier to be broken down by the microbes.
> 
> Ed


Dragonspirit, since youve been referencing what Ed said about using a fortifier to seal clay, Im posting here.
The fortifier Ed is talking about is to bond the clay together long enough for a biofilm to form. It doesnt turn the clay into a rock-like substance. It holds the clay particles together in a matrix, as if there was a biological matrix of fungi, bacteria, etc. in place from the start. This quickly breaks down because bacteria in the clay actually feeds on the fortifier, but the bacteria that does this forms the first pieces of the biological matrix that holds the clay together. Based on how you keep talking about wanting to make the clay into essentially an inorganic solid, you would be better off looking into the great stuff or carved Styrofoam methods.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

This dirty talk is making me want to try my hand at a clay tank.

So, from what I understand, get clay, fortify it with acrylic, allow the biofilm to form (and the biofilm will hold the clay together making it keep its shape)? But acrylic doesn't need to be used unless we're running water over it?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Okapi said:


> Dragonspirit, since youve been referencing what Ed said about using a fortifier to seal clay, Im posting here.
> The fortifier Ed is talking about is to bond the clay together long enough for a biofilm to form. It doesnt turn the clay into a rock-like substance. It holds the clay particles together in a matrix, as if there was a biological matrix of fungi, bacteria, etc. in place from the start. This quickly breaks down because bacteria in the clay actually feeds on the fortifier, but the bacteria that does this forms the first pieces of the biological matrix that holds the clay together. Based on how you keep talking about wanting to make the clay into essentially an inorganic solid, you would be better off looking into the great stuff or carved Styrofoam methods.


Using too much fortifier will result in a very plasticy looking hard clay that in my opinion isn't worth the trouble. 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

SmackoftheGods said:


> This dirty talk is making me want to try my hand at a clay tank.
> 
> So, from what I understand, get clay, fortify it with acrylic, allow the biofilm to form (and the biofilm will hold the clay together making it keep its shape)? But acrylic doesn't need to be used unless we're running water over it?


Seek the wisdom in the ultimate clay thread.. acrylic does help it form the structure... it isn't necessary and it can be done without it but it may take more time for the clay to be stable unless you follow Matt's recipe with all of the organics to speed up the formation of structure. 

Ed


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

Ed said:


> Seek the wisdom in the ultimate clay thread.. acrylic does help it form the structure... it isn't necessary and it can be done without it but it may take more time for the clay to be stable unless you follow Matt's recipe with all of the organics to speed up the formation of structure.
> 
> Ed


Ya know? I periodically return to that thread and I glean a little information from it time and time again, but some people are less than eloquent and their posts come across muddled (to me) and I end up getting a little frustrated 'cause I always feel like I'm missing something.... Guess it's time for that period to come around again, and this time I've got new keywords to remember


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## Okapi (Oct 12, 2007)

I like to think that my thread is pretty informative:
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/60747-imitator-viv.html

These are some good threads as well:
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/58175-grimms-twin-build.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/60202-my-10-gallon-clay-background-build-2.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/59651-10g-vert.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/pa...day-weekend-build-clay-background-method.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/54887-i-love-clay.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/59655-15-gallon-tall-future-imitator-vive.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...new-vivarium-construction-pics-imitators.html[/QUOTE]


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

Okapi said:


> I like to think that my thread is pretty informative:
> http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/60747-imitator-viv.html
> 
> These are some good threads as well:
> ...


[/QUOTE]

Thanks, you sould look at post #4 of this thread. I used some of the same thread links you used here


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

SmackoftheGods said:


> Ya know? I periodically return to that thread and I glean a little information from it time and time again, but some people are less than eloquent and their posts come across muddled (to me) and I end up getting a little frustrated 'cause I always feel like I'm missing something.... Guess it's time for that period to come around again, and this time I've got new keywords to remember


 
If you can't find it there shoot me a pm.. 

Ed


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Sorry guys that was a mistake.

I was talking about using fortifier with the Laticrete rock wall.
I'm gonna use Styrofoam and Laticrete with the fortifier for the rock parts.

So much going on I'm mixing things up.

Sorry for my noobiness. Should have done my research

Thanks for the help I appreciate it.


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## Okapi (Oct 12, 2007)

Okay. Heres some links then:
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/38598-4-tall-rock-wall-paludarium.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...281-30gallon-tall-w-artificial-rock-wall.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/22002-60-gallon-construction.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/35697-rock-wall-3-now-modular-10.html
saltwater viv construction log - Page 15 - Aquaria Central
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/lounge/35591-desert-vivariums.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/46988-terrarium-room-build-pic-heavy.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/61117-pics-my-fake-rock-background.html
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/pl...ds/60370-fs-faux-rock-walls-10-gal-verts.html


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