# Shy frogs



## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

About 4 or 5 days Go I added to frogs to my terrarium. They are the first two in the tank. I don't see much of them tho. Then tend to hide if there fab hiding spots mos of the time. Is this normal???


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

What type of frogs?


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

A bumblebee and a dendrites auratus


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Denodrobates auratus**


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## boabab95 (Nov 5, 2009)

[edit]beat me haha[edit] temps? humidity? any pics?

They will usually hide for a bit at first until they are used to their surroundings.

also please don't put those 2 together, there is too much risk of hybrids. Please use the search function and search "mixing" or "hybrids"


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

Well in that case, I recommend you do some research on the ill-effects of keeping a mixed tank and you may find some answers.


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## sktdvs (Nov 1, 2010)

again, please do not mix those 2. an easy search will show you how the dart frog community feels on it, and second, the risks involved. 

go to the main page, look for the search function, and type in either mixing or hybrids.


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Temp stays about 75-76 and humidity is around 90- 100% I have a dogger and a waterfall in the tank


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Fogger** (sry I'm on my cell phone and the auto correct takes over)


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

chris31

They might be stressing each other out. I recommend that you get another tank, 10g should be fine for one, and separate them. I think you'll see more of them that way and probably better for them. 

Leucs will be out more than auratus in my experience, anyway.


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## jeffr (May 15, 2009)

Plus a waterfall in a 10 gallon must take away a lot of the floor space


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

It's not a 10g..... it's a 55g


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## jeffr (May 15, 2009)

chris31 said:


> It's not a 10g..... it's a 55g



sorry about that. I thought I read 10 gallon somewhere. I would take the advice of the others if I were you. Especially if these are your first dart frogs


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## frogboy (Sep 25, 2010)

Do you have any pix of the Viv? And did you make sure they can't slip under the ground?


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

No they deff can't get under the ground anywhere I will try and get pics up tomorrow but I mean I came home today looked for them and there both sitting in the same plant right next to each other.... I put a few flys in and the both ate fine and continued to hang out in the same plants tg


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

heres some photos of the tank the water and and the land side.... plant next to the water entrence is diff now and there is another coco hut in there now but other then that everything else is still the same


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

oh and also these pics are before the fogger was installed so the soil might look a little dry in these pick but much more moist now


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## boabab95 (Nov 5, 2009)

Get rid of the red light, they don't bask (assuming it's a heat bulb). Also, I would add A LOT more plants (or a lot of pothos) as there isn't really a lot of cover... oh and add some leaf litter. other than that, make sure You seperate the different species...


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## btcope (Jan 7, 2009)

you mentioned you had a fogger in the viv? i recommend typing fogger into the search bar as well. people have had bad experiences with these being inside the viv in the past. lost some frogs. 

wouldn't be too concerned about them hiding if they're brand new. my frogs used to hide from me until they realized i usually come bearing flies. now they're all in my face every time i walk up to the viv. you've mentioned you've seen them eating so that's a good thing. 

leucomelas should be a little more bold than the auratus from what i've read on here... but like was mentioned earlier, you never really know what the ill effects of mixing these two species could be. you've got one frog that is well suited for large groups and shows little aggression mixed with another larger frog that can show female-female aggression. might be a pretty stressful place to live. be prepared for lots of people on here to tell you that any problems you're having are likely related to species mixing.

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/care-sheets/14619-dendrobates-auratus-novice.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/care-sheets/13015-dendrobates-leucomelas-novice.html

hope it works out dude.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

The ground _does_ look a little dry to me.

You'll find more success using a mister over a fogger. Also, ill effects can occur when using an in-viv fogger, especially if all the potential hazards are not taken into consideration. Depending on how you've got the fogger set up I may recommend removing the fogger and hand misting the tank regularly instead.

Also, as has been mentioned (but I feel should be reemphasized) you should separate your leucomelas from your auratus. This board generally tries to deter mixing species for a variety of reasons (reasons that are discussed ad nauseum if you put the word "mix" in the search function).

You might also find it helpful to put leaf litter in your tank. Large leaves considering the kinds of frogs you're working with. If you don't have leaves to use for leaf litter at your disposal a number of vendors sell large quantities of magnolia leaves for pretty cheap.


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

The red bulb is there for heat it's the only way I can keep the heat where it needs too be I also have a heating pad on the tank but that alone was not doing the trick so I needed to add a heating bulb


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

The frogs will hide if they don't feel there's easy cover to get to and if it's not humid enough. I know you have a waterfall and fogger, but does your glass fog up from time to time (like overnight)?

What temperature was the tank without the red light?


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Without the red light and just the heating pad on was around 63ish


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I would think that your red heat light will make them hide. It must be a very drying, dehydrating light. I have never heard of anyone using a heat lamp like that for dart frogs before.
Doug


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## hukilausurfer (Aug 31, 2009)

That tank could use a good misting. That heat lamp is probably drying it out. One idea to heat the tank is to put an aquarium heater under the false bottom.


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## Woodsman (Jan 3, 2008)

I would just use the heat pad, mist a lot and add some more live plants (live plants transpire and add humidity to the tank). The inexpensive plastic plants carry a number of toxins that could easily kill a frog.

Mist, mist, mist that tank!! Richard.


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Doing many reef tanks as another hobby of mine I am familiar with aquarium heaters but a aquarium heater will not heat the air inside the tank it will heat the water.... Will some of the heat transfer from the water yea I'm sure it will but not enough to heat the tank..... I have a110g reef tank with a completely open top and just because the take is heated with multiple heaters it's does not heat the room it's in


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Also the Probs for my thermometer is directly under the light so that light is not getting the hot where it is a danger to the frogs and it is also over a area that consist of only water and the frogs really don't have any access to


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

chris31 said:


> Doing many reef tanks as another hobby of mine I am familiar with aquarium heaters but a aquarium heater will not heat the air inside the tank it will heat the water.... Will some of the heat transfer from the water yea I'm sure it will but not enough to heat the tank..... I have a110g reef tank with a completely open top and just because the take is heated with multiple heaters it's does not heat the room it's in


More than a few of us have used an aquarium heater under the false bottom to heat a viv. You're not taking into account that the viv is a fairly small, closed in space compared to a room. Of course a reef tank won't heat a room but that's on a huge scale! You've asked why your frogs are hiding and you have received answers from many of us on the board that your viv is too dry. So why ask us for advice if you're just going to tell us we are all wrong?
About that red light being too drying...again, you are not taking into account that the viv is a fairly small, closed in space. That red heat light is not supposed to be used with dart frogs. It *is* drying things out whether it is directly over the frogs or not. It is drying out the air in the viv. All of it! There is no invisible wall that somehow contains the dehumidified air. You have received answers from some very experienced dart frog hobbyists here. The answers have been worded differently but continue to point back to one thing. Your viv is too dry. But you are brushing us off. I find it frustrating...Good Luck 
Doug


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Ok so them tell what devices exactly are going to heat my Vic to where I need???? Your saying a aquarium heater is all I'll need and that will heat it?


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## ryangreenway (Apr 30, 2010)

I only use flourescant bulbs on my tanks, the bulbs don't help to keep them very warm in the winter. Because of this I use a small space heater to keep the whole room about 70 degrees, and in turn all my tanks run around 73 degrees. 

EDIT: I picked up my heater for around 30 bucks, and I'm sure there are cheaper ones.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

ryangreenway said:


> I only use flourescant bulbs on my tanks, the bulbs don't help to keep them very warm in the winter. Because of this I use a small space heater to keep the whole room about 70 degrees, and in turn all my tanks run around 73 degrees.
> 
> EDIT: I picked up my heater for around 30 bucks, and I'm sure there are cheaper ones.


I did this too. Got one of those electric oil radiator heaters from Lowes for 40 bucks. Keeps the frog room a nice, toasty 70 while the heat for the rest of the house is set on 60-65. I can always put on a sweater if I get chilly.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

My first four vivs were heated with an aquarium heater under the false bottom. I kept one inch of standing water to give it something to heat. It worked quite well. I then planned expanding to a huge number of vivs all at once and that no longer became the best option. At that time I switched to an electric oil radiator heater from Lowes.
Other options include attaching a sheet of styrofoam over the windows to insulate them better and possibly moving the viv away from the outer, colder walls of the house.
Doug


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Any other ideas besides space heaters?


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## ryangreenway (Apr 30, 2010)

a heat cable


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

The spaceheaters are a great idea but the viv is in my room and I have very lil tolerance for heat haha to give you idea in NY it's 32 outside and I'm walking around with a thin t shirt on haha


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

chris31 said:


> The spaceheaters are a great idea but the viv is in my room and I have very lil tolerance for heat haha to give you idea in NY it's 32 outside and I'm walking around with a thin t shirt on haha


In this case, I think the aquarium heater will be your best bet.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

frogface said:


> In this case, I think the aquarium heater will be your best bet.


Agreed. You could also tape a reptile heat mat to a side wall or back wall.
Doug


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## chris31 (Aug 6, 2010)

Can I place the heater in the pond area insted of ripping the whole tank apart? I also added more plants yesterday


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Sure, usually it's just under the false bottom to hide it. 
Doug


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## boabab95 (Nov 5, 2009)

Chris31,
not to sound rude or anything, but you still haven't commented on the auratus and leuc together, do you plan on splitting them? trading the leuc for an auratus or the auratus for a leuc?


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