# Bromeliads vs. film canisters.



## JeremyHuff

I love bromeliads, always have. However, I find myself needing to replace bromeliads far too much for my liking. Either because they die, outgrow a tank or won't hold enough water because of leakage. I am also concerned that I do not get the production I would expect from pumilio or even thumbs when using bromeliads. On two occasions I have seen nearly fully developed pumilio dead in the broms as well as a constant disappearance of tadpoles I have watched being placed and fed. I would hate to not have bromeliads in my tanks, but at the same time I want to maximize the number of healthy offspring I can get from pumilio and thumbs. 

What sort of luck have people had using artificial tad deposit sites? 
Anyone else given up on bromeliads? 
Any good looking fake broms available that can be retrofitted with plastic or glass vials for holding water?


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## gary1218

I've been thinking about this same thing Jeremy. At $10 a pop for a nice medium size brom it can get expensive depending on the number of tanks.

I've been thinking about trying a large potted vining/bushy type plant like the different varieties of pathos. Something bushy enough to take up most of the back half of the tank to give the frogs lots of hiding places to feel safe and protected. Then place a lot of film cannister stuck to the glass in the back half of the tank to lay eggs in. And a bunch more upright on the floor on the tank to drop tads into. The front half of the tank is a thick layer of leaf litter for bugs to grow in and for the frogs to hunt in.

I've been growing out a good size pathos that I'm about ready to try in one of my thumb tanks to see how the frogs like it.


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## frogmanroth

Flimcans all the way. I quit using broms about five years ago and haven't looked back. I don't care what my tanks look like as long as the frogs are breeding. 

Pumilio, rare egg feeders, thumbs, vents, luecs galacts, tincs, auratus they all lay in filmcans for me. 

in thumbs and pums production was greatly increased right after the switch with almost 100% every time. 

flimcans don't require the bright lights either!! I use a lot of cans though also. 1-3 per gallon in almost every tank. a mix of colors also. 

and like gary i use mainly pothos smaller leaf types.


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## Jungleboy

frogmanroth said:


> Flimcans all the way. I quit using broms about five years ago and haven't looked back. I don't care what my tanks look like as long as the frogs are breeding.
> 
> Pumilio, rare egg feeders, thumbs, vents, luecs galacts, tincs, auratus they all lay in filmcans for me.
> 
> in thumbs and pums production was greatly increased right after the switch with almost 100% every time.
> 
> flimcans don't require the bright lights either!! I use a lot of cans though also. 1-3 per gallon in almost every tank. a mix of colors also.
> 
> and like gary i use mainly pothos smaller leaf types.


Can you post pics?


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## RobR

I'm using a pothos in a 5 gallon growout vert strung about with suction cups, that and a wandering Jew. I think it works well and I plan on doing the same in my 44 pentagon with no background other than a few small cork bark peices with small broms. I'm going to try using magnets this time around.


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## frogmanroth

here is a pic you can see a lot of the cans but theres just as many on the side and floor and background. i will take more pics tomorrow when the lights re on. or look through my gallery.

that first tank on the left has 10 cans on the one side, 4 in the back ground, and 4 on the floor, and 5 on the other side, that pair produces about 25-30 froglets a year, tarapotos.

And I just pulled 10 tads from my yuri tank, 7 which came from the same clutch and they just started breeding. So at this rate they will pay for themselves in no time.

I use bait stations to help keep the flies out. And my misting nozzle sprays into them and keeps them circulating. I dump my thumb tads out when putting them into cups. Obligates seem to far well with any thing for some reason. Thats why having places to choose from. Them frogs know whats up.


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## ChrisK

Yeah I would rather use film cans and condiment cups too but the water in mine always turns into fruitfly mud, how do you guys keep them out?


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## cairo11

Ive started trying a clear v-straw method and was blown away earlier today to see 3 colons poking out of them... It actually works very well.


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## Jungleboy

cairo11 said:


> Ive started trying a clear v-straw method and was blown away earlier today to see 3 colons poking out of them... It actually works very well.


So basicily what jp lawerence did in panama?


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## JeremyHuff

cairo11 said:


> Ive started trying a clear v-straw method and was blown away earlier today to see 3 colons poking out of them... It actually works very well.


Now to find a source for olive green straws. What is the diameter of the straws?


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## gary1218

What's that v-straw method???


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## oddlot

I still have alot of broms but I'm thinking of getting more film canisters for the same reasons.I think Roman tried the exoterra plastic broms when they came out and the frogs wouldn't go near it.What kind of straws are used in that method?


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## randommind

I too have recently been experimenting with using "boba tea" straws in my pumilio tanks. These are the same straws that JP used in panama. They are sold at the Asian food markets, for $1 you get 100 straws. 

I have been folding them in half, zip tying them to 2 square wide piece of egg crate, and then attaching the entire thing to the backside of a cork tube that has been cut in half.

Might be tough to visualize so I will post a pic when I get home this afternoon.


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## JeremyHuff

I was just doing searches for centrifuge tubes. I kind of like the cone bottom. Found these, and might give it a shot.

12mL Centrifuge Tube - PP - #112040 12mL Urine Centrifuge Tubes from Globe Scientific Inc. [112040] - $37.10 : Globe Scientific Inc.: Laboratory Plasticware, Laboratory Glassware and Laboratory Equipment Specialists

I am thinking I could glue a small rare earth magnet from Harbor Freight (10 for $1) and then have another magnet on the other side of the glass. Another option might be velcro, either the self adhesive or silicone it on.

The centrifuge tube can be painted of have coco glued to them to camouflage them a bit.


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## JeremyHuff

gary1218 said:


> What's that v-straw method???


Folding a straw, creating two reservoirs and rubber banding or zip tying to branches


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## mordoria

In a straw? Wow. I would think that that was not large enough. 

What about floral savers? The things they put on the bottom of roses to perserve them.
3-1/2" Green Water Picks with Anchor 50 Pieces $7.99
You can also stick them into the ground or into a GS background


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## gary1218

Did a Google search for boba tea straw and came across these on Amazon. Nice 1/2" diameter.


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## frogface

OMG...

So, I was in the frog room (strange I know) and noticed that one of the film cans, in my pumilio tank, was loose and balanced on a brom. I rescued that one (with a nice healthy tad inside  ). Then the others came off in an avalanche of canisters! One of them landed upside down, in the back of the tank where it is dark and difficult to reach. I pulled the leaf litter, as best I could, from back there but didn't find a tad. Don't know if there was one in that can. I'm hoping not 

Now, I'm rethinking the whole 'film canister' thing and will probably try some of the straw ideas. 

I feel sick


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## dfrmav

ah man, i have an explosion of almirante eggs in my tank and broms everywhere, and this thread is definitely making me consider lining the 3 glass walls with nothing but film canisters. 

but how the hell do you keep the flies out of the film canisters?


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## goof901

frogmanroth said:


> I use bait stations to help keep the flies out. And my misting nozzle sprays into them and keeps them circulating. I dump my thumb tads out when putting them into cups. Obligates seem to far well with any thing for some reason. Thats why having places to choose from. Them frogs know whats up.[/quote]
> 
> that's how he keeps flies out.
> 
> [QUOTE="frogface, post: 721349, member: 10227"]OMG...
> 
> So, I was in the frog room (strange I know) and noticed that one of the film cans, in my pumilio tank, was loose and balanced on a brom. I rescued that one (with a nice healthy tad inside :D ). Then the others came off in an avalanche of canisters! One of them landed upside down, in the back of the tank where it is dark and difficult to reach. I pulled the leaf litter, as best I could, from back there but didn't find a tad. Don't know if there was one in that can. I'm hoping not :(
> 
> Now, I'm rethinking the whole 'film canister' thing and will probably try some of the straw ideas.
> 
> I feel sick :eek:[/quote]
> maybe you should velcro the film cans to the sides?


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## randommind

Construction:








In viv from different angles:
















Brom included, that's 24 deposition sites on piece of cork tube.....


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## mattolsen

I like to give options until I can hone in on what works best for which group. To start off a group I use bromeliads, film canisters(in different positions/alignments some with lids with holes cut in them, some with water,etc.), prescription bottles, water bottles, etc. 

You'll find each group, sometimes even of the same species, prefers different sites. My vanzo's for instance, like prescription bottles placed in cork bark tubes. My intermedius only lay eggs on brom leaves but transport to both canisters and brom axils. 

It's a pain to try and find tads/eggs with broms and such but I find keeping them happiest works best. So give them options at first, don't constantly switch orientation(give each orientation roughly a month or more), and keep the frogs fed and watered. Including changing the water in the canisters and broms. Hope that helps a little.


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## frogmanroth

heres 10 verts with cans and one 10 horizontal with cans on the floor


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## frogmanroth

dfrmav said:


> ah man, i have an explosion of almirante eggs in my tank and broms everywhere, and this thread is definitely making me consider lining the 3 glass walls with nothing but film canisters.
> 
> but how the hell do you keep the flies out of the film canisters?


bait stations


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## frogmanroth

frogface said:


> OMG...
> 
> So, I was in the frog room (strange I know) and noticed that one of the film cans, in my pumilio tank, was loose and balanced on a brom. I rescued that one (with a nice healthy tad inside  ). Then the others came off in an avalanche of canisters! One of them landed upside down, in the back of the tank where it is dark and difficult to reach. I pulled the leaf litter, as best I could, from back there but didn't find a tad. Don't know if there was one in that can. I'm hoping not
> 
> Now, I'm rethinking the whole 'film canister' thing and will probably try some of the straw ideas.
> 
> I feel sick


or i have started using wire to wrap around them and place them at heights i want.

also make sure the glass is clean when you stick the cans, also make sure to wet the suction cup prior to sticking, i have never had issues with cans unless i was messing with them, and in pun tanks you shouldn't mess with them anyways.


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## JeremyHuff

Took visits to two different Asian grocery stores, but scored big with solid color straws. 250 for under $6!!!


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## goof901

the only thing about those that im worried about is the plastic leaching toxins because those straws are only supposed to be used once. have any of guys had any problems with tads morphing out with issues?


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## JeremyHuff

My first two "bromeliads". Each has 16 straws, so 32 deposition sites!


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## JeremyHuff

This is fun...but... I MAY have a problem starting to develop...

This one has 37 straws = 74 deposition sites. Used a plastic net basket for the frame.


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## frogface

Ooh net basket! Great idea.


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## Gamble

Wow. Some of the things u guys think of is just crazy! 

I assume this only works for thumbs? (The straws)

How many of u have had success using this method?


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## goof901

JeremyHuff said:


> This is fun...but... I MAY have a problem starting to develop...
> 
> 
> 
> is that problem having to much fun making broms out of straws or a serious problem?
Click to expand...


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## gary1218

JeremyHuff said:


> My first two "bromeliads". Each has 16 straws, so 32 deposition sites!


I can't believe you worked in a red center to those "broms". You are definitely over the edge Jeremy 

I can't wait to get mine!!!


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## ChrisK

JeremyHuff said:


> This is fun...but... I MAY have a problem starting to develop...
> 
> This one has 37 straws = 74 deposition sites. Used a plastic net basket for the frame.


Looking at this from my phone so can't really tell, no sharp points on those right?


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## goof901

there are sharp points on them, but considering some of the broms i've seen pics of frogs on, sharp points shouldn't be a problem.


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## oddlot

Looks like I may have to see if I can find an asian market down here.Those broms won't die

Lou


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## ChrisK

goof901 said:


> there are sharp points on them, but considering some of the broms i've seen pics of frogs on, sharp points shouldn't be a problem.


Depending on the sharpness of edges, flexibility, texture, etc of the plastic and angles, I'm not no sure I'd put them in the same category.


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## frogmanroth

JeremyHuff said:


> This is fun...but... I MAY have a problem starting to develop...
> 
> This one has 37 straws = 74 deposition sites. Used a plastic net basket for the frame.


Ok now how much water do they hold? And they all won't hold water will they?


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## JeremyHuff

ChrisK said:


> Looking at this from my phone so can't really tell, no sharp points on those right?


I could spend more time rounding out the tips. I'll try to remember to bring one to the show Sunday so you can see it up close.


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## JeremyHuff

frogmanroth said:


> Ok now how much water do they hold? And they all won't hold water will they?


They will hold a decent amount. The straws are about 1/2" in diameter and each "leaf is about 4" long. I'll try to fill it and then drain it to give a full volume. Unlike bromeliads, these won't be loosing water other than evaporation.


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## jacobi

Those straws are sold on Amazon. In case people don't want to traipse around Chinatown 

Jake


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## Devo

Interesting discussion here.

Unfortunately Dart Frogs cannot be kept here in New Zealand  so I can’t comment on them, but for the last 10 years I have kept & hybridized thousands of bromeliads.

One thing I’ve found is that bromeliads do need very good air circulation, otherwise they will rot. The typical environment inside an average terrarium would not be conducive for long term survival of broms. The best scenario to keep broms looking good in the terrarium is to have say 2 - 3 plants of a type you wish to use. Place one in the terrarium, & the other 2 in the garden, or glasshouse. Then every 4 – 6 weeks rotate the plants.

Reading thru’ this thread it seems that film canisters are the way to go for breeding set ups, but for aesthetics in a nice display terrarium, you can’t go past broms!

Another thing I would like to add to the discussion is a comment on the water found in the cups of bromeliads. I’ve never actually had the cup water analyzed, however pups cut off other broms will root much faster if dropped into the cup of other bromeliads, rather than just potted up. The cup water is said to contain anti-bacterial and hormonal secretions which prevents the offset rotting, stimulates growth, and encourages root development…so it’s good stuff!

Now what if Darts Frogs can sense when the bromeliad cup water is “right” for their eggs? In other words, can Dart Frogs sense the difference between bromeliad cup water, & normal water in film canisters?

If so the ideal situation could be to grow a few of the larger bromeliads, like vriesea or alcantarea, in the garden, or a glasshouse. Then their cup water can be syphoned out & used to fill up, and refresh the film canisters in the breeding set ups? Has anyone tried this? I'd be interested in any comments.

Cheers, Andrew.


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## Bcs TX

> Used a plastic net basket for the frame


Hey Jeremy, I have the straws upstairs need to get them in my pum viv's, what is a net basket?

Are you holding the straws in the V formation with rubber bands?


-Beth


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## mordoria

A net basket is mainly used in hydroponics. Amazon.com: 3" Inch Net Pots - Net Cups for Hydroponics: Patio, Lawn & Garden
Some have larger openings on the sides that will accomodate the larger straws. Then you jus bend em and slide em through


Bcs TX said:


> Hey Jeremy, I have the straws upstairs need to get them in my pum viv's, what is a net basket?
> 
> Are you holding the straws in the V formation with rubber bands?
> 
> 
> -Beth


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## Bcs TX

> A net basket is mainly used in hydroponics.
> Amazon.com: 3" Inch Net Pots - Net Cups for Hydroponics: Patio, Lawn & Garden
> Amazon.com: 3" Inch Net Pots - Net Cups for Hydroponics: Patio, Lawn & Garden Some have larger openings on the sides that will accomodate the larger straws. Then you jus bend em and slide em through


Awesome!

Thanks David.


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## JeremyHuff

Bcs TX said:


> Hey Jeremy, I have the straws upstairs need to get them in my pum viv's, what is a net basket?
> 
> Are you holding the straws in the V formation with rubber bands?
> 
> 
> -Beth


I go the net baskets from BJ years ago. I assume they still sell them. For a few of the holes it was a tight fit, but I just forced them through. Worked quite well I think. One modification I am going to make is to cut down the straw a little further to give a bigger platform for a frog to sit on. It wot take too much volume away. I also wonder if I should but a tiny piece of almond leaf in each for the tannins.


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## mattolsen

I started using a new idea that's been working fairly well.

Try inserting a pill bottle into a cork round or even pvc. I put a leaf over/around it and put some water in. My vanzo's immediately laid some eggs in one.


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## gary1218

gary1218 said:


> I've been thinking about this same thing Jeremy. At $10 a pop for a nice medium size brom it can get expensive depending on the number of tanks.
> 
> I've been thinking about trying a large potted vining/bushy type plant like the different varieties of pathos. Something bushy enough to take up most of the back half of the tank to give the frogs lots of hiding places to feel safe and protected. Then place a lot of film cannister stuck to the glass in the back half of the tank to lay eggs in. And a bunch more upright on the floor on the tank to drop tads into. The front half of the tank is a thick layer of leaf litter for bugs to grow in and for the frogs to hunt in.
> 
> I've been growing out a good size pathos that I'm about ready to try in one of my thumb tanks to see how the frogs like it.


Here's a picture of what I meant.









Not what I would call a "pretty" tank but hopefully it will be functional. A lot of places for the frogs to hide amongst all the pathos leaves. Keeping with my KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) concept 

Now I need to load up on the film cannisters around the sides and floor of the tank. Need to hit the photo department at my local Rite Aid


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## Edhurl

Just ordered some, been trying to find alternative to film canisters as they are becoming hard to find...


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## oneshot

A couple of things:

I thought I was smart using self-adhesive velcro, one on the glass, one on the film canister. However, over time, the weight of the film canister/water in it started to pull the velcro off the glass. I have them in a tank that happens to have little snails in it. The snails got stuck in the adhesive part and died. I wouldn't want a frog to get a toe stuck in there...

Also, a couple times in this thread, people mentioned how they keep flies out of the water in the film canisters. Is there a reason you don't want them in there (slows breeding?) or just because it's flies that could have been eaten by the frogs?

And this is one of the best threads I've seen in a while (learned some new things...)

Brian


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## Edhurl

So, got my straws in. im guessing these are more for smaller thumbs lol, my female c. Valley imi will not fit in there. Good news though, im goin to frog day


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## frogface

Had a tad emergency in my El Dorado tank. 

I was watching mom picking up tads and saw that their favorite brom was covered in scale. So, I tossed a few film canisters back up and ripped out the brom (checked for tads). Then I tried finding those straws, locally. Not much luck, without a long drive to an Asian food market. Then I remembered the floral water tubes. Ran down to a florist, just a couple miles away and told them my sob story about the frogs and the tads. 

Anyway, back home now, with 20 floral tubes, no charge. This is a frog friendly florist  . Put 7 up in my El Dorado tank. I hope they can squeeze their fat butts in there. Here are some pics:


















edit: Hah! You can see a froglet face looking out from the brom leaf in the top left (second pic). I love these frogs 

edit2: They are stuck into the clay background. This is well established clay, in a tank that's been up for over a year. I'm not expecting them to sag out, but, I'll keep an eye on it.


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## Buddysfrogs

Jeremy good luck with my new broms you bought.


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## frogface

If anyone was interested in trying those water tube things, I found them at Michael's, yesterday. They have them labeled as 'water picks.'


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## JeremyHuff

Buddysfrogs said:


> Jeremy good luck with my new broms you bought.
> 
> Need Viv supplies? Contact me 973 255 7572 for great prices


Yeah, thanks. I can't quite go all fake just yet.


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## parkanz2

Also, you can get clear or black vinyl tubing at your typical hardware store at varying diameters and lengths. You can use it very much the same way!


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## thedude

Man this is a great thread! Anyone tried test tubes? I'm thinking of putting some in the soil hiddin amongst some leaf litter and philodendron.


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## Ghost vivs

thedude said:


> Man this is a great thread! Anyone tried test tubes? I'm thinking of putting some in the soil hiddin amongst some leaf litter and philodendron.


Testing out the test tubes right now. Picked some up at hobby lobby to test before I order a bunch. 

If they work, their CHEEP! 1,000 for about 40.00 (-shipping)

Casper


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## Ghost vivs

Add some tree fern and poof...










Casper


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## goof901

might wanna get a test tube with a wider diameter depending on what frogs you're working with.


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## Ghost vivs

It's big enough for pums, they also make plastic ones that are 30 millimeters wide.

Casper


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## JeremyHuff

Ghost vivs said:


> Add some tree fern and poof...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Casper


I like it. I have a garbage bag full of bamboo that would work for various diameter vials/tubes.


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## Ghost vivs

Here are the tubes I'm going to order.

12.75mm Pyrex Glass Test Tubes

Check out the centrifuge vials for up to 50 mm wide.

Casper


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## Ghost vivs

I plan on putting 8 or more in some tree fern totem polls at different angles and heights, then put some stick mount orchids on it.

Casper


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## oneshot

Ghost vivs said:


> Here are the tubes I'm going to order.
> 
> 12.75mm Pyrex Glass Test Tubes
> 
> Check out the centrifuge vials for up to 50 mm wide.
> 
> Casper


I'm fascinated by this thread! I'm looking at anything that will hold water and is cheap. I looked at those glass test tubes, and noticed they also had plastic ones. With plastic ones, you could still drill them and pop in a suction cup.


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## Ghost vivs

oneshot said:


> I'm fascinated by this thread! I'm looking at anything that will hold water and is cheap. I looked at those glass test tubes, and noticed they also had plastic ones. With plastic ones, you could still drill them and pop in a suction cup.


Yip, those plastic ones would work great with suction cups. Or a little silicon and you could camouflage them with tree fern and moss. 

I also think those big 50mm ones would work great for shipping.

Casper


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## frogparty

Lol if you guys like those I have thousands of 15ml and 50 ml screw cap conical vials at the lab that would be perfect


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## thedude

frogparty said:


> Lol if you guys like those I have thousands of 15ml and 50 ml screw cap conical vials at the lab that would be perfect


Pictures or it didn't happen  

I was kind of thinking the same thing though. I could get tons of the glass ones from school. I'll have to try a couple out with my fants, pums, and imis.


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## frogparty

The tubes are a bit long, and only come in clear, but it would be easier for me to procure them than film cans


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## johnachilli

frogparty said:


> Lol if you guys like those I have thousands of 15ml and 50 ml screw cap conical vials at the lab that would be perfect


How do you feel about the 15 ml size ones? the 50 ml I am familiar with and seem a bit large but not sure about the 15 ml ones


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## Ghost vivs

johnachilli said:


> How do you feel about the 15 ml size ones? the 50 ml I am familiar with and seem a bit large but not sure about the 15 ml ones



That's just a hair over a 1/2 inch. I think it would be fine.


Casper


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## thedude

Ghost vivs said:


> That's just a hair over a 1/2 inch. I think it would be fine.
> 
> 
> Casper


I think you read that wrong, they are 15mL not 15mm.

If they are anything like the 10mL graduated cylinders, than they should be ideal. They would be about as wide as a lot of our brom axils.


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## Ghost vivs

Oops, got to read better next time... thought he was talking about the width ... but the width with the 15ml tubes just so happens to still be just over a 1/2 inch.

Casper


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## frogparty

I think the 15ml ones are coming home with me tonight to beta test.... I have a feeling the frogs will like them. The 50s are pretty wide. They are both the same length, so only width varies.


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## frogparty

I have both in flip cap, and screw cap. Flip cap would make affixing a suction cup super simple


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## frogface

I just found another El Dorado clutch. Looks a few days old. I'm hoping they'll try the new 'water picks' to deposit. I'll grab pics if they do.


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## Sherman

All right this seems like the right time and place for this.
A couple of years ago I wanted an everlasting bromeliad. I also knew that frogs in the wild will rear their young in trash (bottles, plastic bags w/ water, etc.), so I built a bromeliad out of trash.
I used two 2 liter bottles, two 1 liter bottles, one 20 oz. bottle, some condiment cups, and a nylon bolt and nut from the hardware store, combined them with a little ingenuity and ta-da, created this.
I have had it set up with a pair of Bastis for a couple of years now, and although they tend to choose condiment cups placed elsewhere, I know that they have reared in the "axils" of this "bromeliad".
It isn't as pretty as the real thing, but when disguised in a planted viv. it does blend better than dozens of film cannisters, and it never dies like real bromeliads. 
I'm not claiming that this is the way to go, or that this is more effective than the other ways, or even safe for that matter, I am simply putting it out there for the masses.


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## frogparty

That's pretty ingenious. I don't understand how people kill brims though. I've never lost one in a viv once it's established, they just pup like mad. I think too many people overwater.


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## johnachilli

frogparty said:


> I think the 15ml ones are coming home with me tonight to beta test.... I have a feeling the frogs will like them. The 50s are pretty wide. They are both the same length, so only width varies.


They seem to be a good size to me I just order a bunch of them to try also. I was thinking of some plastic container I could suction cup to the side of the tank and place a few of these into. I could then easily pull them out to see the contents inside them as well.


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## thedude

frogparty said:


> That's pretty ingenious. I don't understand how people kill brims though. I've never lost one in a viv once it's established, they just pup like mad. I think too many people overwater.


Either that or not enough air flow. That's my issue, although I don't really ever lose any broms. I just get sick of them not holding water.


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## frogparty

Yeah, but Im the king of no air flow. I just have passive ventilation, no fans


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## thedude

Some of my tanks don't have any airflow except when I open them.

Check mate


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## spawn

Where do you get film canisters with the suction cups? I've seen the suction cups on joshsfrogs.com but no film canister to accompany them?


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## jeeperrs

spawn said:


> Where do you get film canisters with the suction cups? I've seen the suction cups on joshsfrogs.com but no film canister to accompany them?


They happen to be out at the moment but I am sure they will get more in. Or, maybe they took them all to frog day. Here is the link.

White Film Cannister w/ suction cup - Film Cannisters & Suction Cups | Josh's Frogs


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## Ed

spawn said:


> Where do you get film canisters with the suction cups? I've seen the suction cups on joshsfrogs.com but no film canister to accompany them?


 
Or use a hole punch to make the hole and insert a suction cup that you purchased seperately... 

Ed


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## oneshot

Couldn't get a good picture, but I've only had those flower water picks in one of my tanks for about a week, and there was a tiny tad in there today!!!


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## frogface

I saw a tad in one of my water picks. Going to try to take a pic tomorrow. Maybe if I shine a flashlight behind it I'll at least get it's shadow.


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## oneshot

frogface said:


> I saw a tad in one of my water picks. Going to try to take a pic tomorrow. Maybe if I shine a flashlight behind it I'll at least get it's shadow.


Not to try to upstage you, but I found a second tad in the same water pick today!


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## SWReptiles

I found boba straws and water picks both on ebay at good prices if anyone cannot find them local


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## johnachilli

I had this idea a while ago and finally got around to doing it. I used 15ml centrifuge tube (got a box of 50 for $15 shipped off ebay) and plastic toothbrush holders that I got from the container store for $1 each. Each toothbrush hold opens in the middle to make two holder for the centrifuge tubes. The tubes are just placed in the holders so that they can be pulled out and inspected and then easily inserted back in place. 

I just got them in place so I don't have any results as of yet...


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## suztor

Has anyone considered 'enhancing' a brom by adding a test tube or something comparable to the center to ensure it holds water?


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## Zach Valois

Devo said:


> Interesting discussion here.
> 
> Unfortunately Dart Frogs cannot be kept here in New Zealand  so I can’t comment on them, but for the last 10 years I have kept & hybridized thousands of bromeliads.
> 
> One thing I’ve found is that bromeliads do need very good air circulation, otherwise they will rot. The typical environment inside an average terrarium would not be conducive for long term survival of broms. The best scenario to keep broms looking good in the terrarium is to have say 2 - 3 plants of a type you wish to use. Place one in the terrarium, & the other 2 in the garden, or glasshouse. Then every 4 – 6 weeks rotate the plants.
> 
> Reading thru’ this thread it seems that film canisters are the way to go for breeding set ups, but for aesthetics in a nice display terrarium, you can’t go past broms!
> 
> Another thing I would like to add to the discussion is a comment on the water found in the cups of bromeliads. I’ve never actually had the cup water analyzed, however pups cut off other broms will root much faster if dropped into the cup of other bromeliads, rather than just potted up. The cup water is said to contain anti-bacterial and hormonal secretions which prevents the offset rotting, stimulates growth, and encourages root development…so it’s good stuff!
> 
> Now what if Darts Frogs can sense when the bromeliad cup water is “right” for their eggs? In other words, can Dart Frogs sense the difference between bromeliad cup water, & normal water in film canisters?
> 
> If so the ideal situation could be to grow a few of the larger bromeliads, like vriesea or alcantarea, in the garden, or a glasshouse. Then their cup water can be syphoned out & used to fill up, and refresh the film canisters in the breeding set ups? Has anyone tried this? I'd be interested in any comments.
> 
> Cheers, Andrew.


 Very interesting addition to this discussion. Has there been any published work on this topic? Thank you for adding this.


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## baita83

just an idea I have not done this and they may not hold enough water but has anyone tried pvc end caps turned upright the only reason I mention these is they are small cheap available everywhere and I was thinking would be easy to mount in a great stuff foam background so as to not loose the natural look

I personally do everything with live broms and just make sure to flush the water weekly so they stay full. I always figured the plant would leach some of the toxins from the water helping to keep them in a cleaner environment. But after reading through this thread I am leaning towards artificial.


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## fishguyturnedfrog

How about baby food, cocktail sauce or other small glass jars on a slight angle on the bottom of the tank? Seems like it should fit the purpose we're all looking for.


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## Ed

If you don't mind replacing them as they rot out, bamboo can use used since each space between the internodes are hollow..... 

Ed


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## JeremyHuff

Ed said:


> If you don't mind replacing them as they rot out, bamboo can use used since each space between the internodes are hollow.....
> 
> Ed


They take a while to rot. Plus I have thought about taking a dollar store paint brush and 'painting the inside with aquarium safe silicone.


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## Ed

JeremyHuff said:


> They take a while to rot. Plus I have thought about taking a dollar store paint brush and 'painting the inside with aquarium safe silicone.


Why not simply paint them with water based polyurethane? If you don't mind them being shiny, you could dip and hang them.... 

Ed


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## Ed

I should add that a wide number of dendrobatids have been reported using bamboo as tadpole deposition sites in the wild...


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## marylanddartfrog

I am currently makeing bamboo egg deposit sites I cut the bamboo right below where the joints are.and then cut off around a 3 to 4 inch tube containing the natural bottom of the joint.i then lightly with my finger apply a small coating of silicon inside the tube mainly on the bottom and the allow to dry overnight.so far only made 5 because limited source of bamboo.but so far all of them are holding water.i will test them in the tank soon to see how the frogs take to it.


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## Ed

marylanddartfrog said:


> I am currently makeing bamboo egg deposit sites I cut the bamboo right below where the joints are.and then cut off around a 3 to 4 inch tube containing the natural bottom of the joint.i then lightly with my finger apply a small coating of silicon inside the tube mainly on the bottom and the allow to dry overnight.so far only made 5 because limited source of bamboo.but so far all of them are holding water.i will test them in the tank soon to see how the frogs take to it.


 
They would hold water without the silicone. Keep in mind that people in more than one part of the world used them as a way to transport and store water. 

Ed


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## Steverd

mordoria said:


> A net basket is mainly used in hydroponics. Amazon.com: 3" Inch Net Pots - Net Cups for Hydroponics: Patio, Lawn & Garden
> Some have larger openings on the sides that will accomodate the larger straws. Then you jus bend em and slide em through


I have 3" net pots you kind of like these anyone can have for *FREE*, if you pay the $6.00 for Priority Mail.

Steve


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## crested

Very interesting read below:

Similarly, I've found the best way to start cuttings is to place them inside a brom cup/leaf. They grow quickly yet don't seem to latch onto the brom too much. certainly seem to take much better than any other method I've tried...

Give them a couple weeks to start growing out and adjusting to tank conditions and trim or move... Has been working wonders for me



Zach Valois said:


> Very interesting addition to this discussion. Has there been any published work on this topic? Thank you for adding this.


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