# Frogs dead overnight despite being healthy, any causes?



## Pro_Aqua (Jan 4, 2021)

So this is my 2nd time keeping Dart Frogs (The first time I had a pair of Auratus, but had to give them away due to moving) and this time I've been keeping a trio of Tinc. "Boulanger". Well, unfortunately I'm down to 1 now and have no idea why. 

The tank (29gal) was cycled for 2 months before adding frogs, seeded with springtails and isopods. There are live plants (Ferns, melon vine, bromeliads, begonias) and over the past 5 months I've lost 2 of them so how. The first was 9 days after I got them, I assumed it was due to packaging since it was packed a weird way. But this next one just happened overnight. Both we're healthy and eating, always active and ate like pigs, but somehow (death 1 and 2 are 5 months apart) they somehow pass overnight and have no idea why. I don't believe it could've been aggression since they're only 7 months old and no signs of aggression. Could It be a disease I don't know about? At first I thought the first death was just it not acclimating well but I feel like these 2 are connected for some reason. Any idea why a healthy frog would just pass overnight?


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

Could you provide more information on the shipping/packaging that you considered "weird"? Please also include as many details about your enclosure and husbandry provisions as possible.


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## Pro_Aqua (Jan 4, 2021)

Sure thing, the thing I considered weird was how it was packed super tightly. The other 2 had some space to move around but this one was just cramped with moss in the cup which I think stressed it out during shipping. (Cramped as in it literally couldn't move and it's legs we're bunched up) 

Care wise, I feed everyday since they're still quite young, some times I'll skip a day if I added too many but for the most part everyday. They're on Drosophila melanogaster. I mist about twice a day, and Humidity is at a constant 90% with temp being at 73F*. Theres about 2 inches of leaf litter and plants include:
*Begonia "Little Darling"
*Black Rabbits foot fern
*Melon Vine
*Lemon Button Fern
*Neoregelia Fireball (2) and Large Form (1) 
Random mushrooms pop up from time to time (There's 2 right now actually) 

the background is a DIY. It's made of GreatStuff Spray Foam, GE Silicone 1, and Cocofiber. (Pretty much your normal DIY background). Soil is ABG Mix, Sphagnum moss, Live Oak Leaflitter, and the false bottom is ZooMed Hydro Balls. Hope this helps!


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

What does the viv have for ventilation? FIsh tank vivs are challenging to vent properly, and constant high RH isn't ideal.

Could you post pics of the viv from a few angles and distances? And clear pics of the remaining frog?


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

What supplements are you using? Do you dust the fruit flies at every feeding? 

Can you share pictures of the frogs when you got them and any more recent pictures you have?


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

The bunched up frog really bothers me. When frogs are morbidly stressed they excrete skin alkaloids and are flooded with cortisol. This is a great expense to the frogs electrolyte balance.

This is why when treating them utmost delicacy + expedience is required as if administration can be accomplished without inciting stress to that point they are more likely to survive. In fact it makes an enormous difference in outcomes.

I am stunned dumb that a person would pack a frog that way that deals with frogs.

They - in effect - recreated a prolonged predation event from the frogs perceptual in packing a frog like that and sending it off in the mail.

Im really sad and mad for you and they should be called on it.

Frogs should be packed cozily but able to turn around in confines.


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