# Suggestions for euthenizing them?



## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Hey guys, 
I had a fungal infection ridden group of dart frogs I bought. I didn't know at the time but one just died and I decided I am going to euthenize the rest. Any suggestions on how?


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## Azurel (Aug 5, 2010)

Have you talked to a vet about the fungus or infection?

Oralgel dabbed on the head/back is how most do it.


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

So....treating these frogs is out of the question?


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Yes. I've brought them to a vet who gave me a cream and it obviously didn't work. I just dont want them to suffer. You know?


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

I have talked to a vet. He gave me a cream that didn't work out. I was going to use orajel but I wanted to know if anyone knew about any other ways.


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## stevenhman (Feb 19, 2008)

What sort of cream?

You may want to check out : http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-health-disease-treatment/47109-lamasil-treatment.html

some good links in there as well.


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## fieldnstream (Sep 11, 2009)

Caudata Culture Articles - Euthanasia


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Its an anti fungal anti bacterial. I just dont want them to go while suffering. You know?


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## edwardsatc (Feb 17, 2004)

Buddysfrogs said:


> Yes. I've brought them to a vet who gave me a cream and it obviously didn't work. I just dont want them to suffer. You know?


I think euthanasia at this point is irresponsible. Don't you think you should give the treatment some time to work? ... Considering it's only been a week since you discovered the infection? These types of things don't clear up overnight ...


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Honestly I tried it but then I thought. They are missing half there face how are they going to eat after this? I never saw any one of them eat and I don't think it would be possible to eat. One of the frogs died yesterday from the infection after the treatment. 
Buddy


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Just tying these two threads together: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-discussion/81604-cittranela-sleeping.html http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-health-disease-treatment/81661-cittranela-sleeping.html


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Did he give you Sylvadene cream? If so it is effective to treat things like this but it does take time. As long as the tongue is not impaired the frogs can still eat post recovery (since most of the tissues will heal) but may not want to eat during treatment due to stress from the injuries (and being caught up for the treatment). If the frogs are fat, they can go for several days to a week without feeding with little or not problems. 

From what I can see in the pictures in the other thread, it looks to be very similar to conditions found in frogs that were imported from wild caught animals. That tends to be a mechanical injury (and highly likely to be the actual cause since you have reported it from two seperate groups of frogs from the same vendor). The infection could be secondary to the mechanical injury. 

Ed


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Ed, if it's from mechanical injury, would their tanks be contaminated and need sanitizing? I recommended he sanitize, in one of the other threads, but now I'm not certain he would need to.


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

The nose was literally gone and I never saw them eat once since I had so yes I do think their tongue is impaired. So far two have died out of the four one of the Cobalts died now. Yesterday one of the citronellas died now today a cobalt died


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## parkanz2 (Sep 25, 2008)

I would recommend going back to your vet before making any "final" decisions. Have him/her reevaluate. It sounds like the pathogen is very pathogenic, the disease process has had a lot of time to develop before being discovered, or the frogs are immunocompromised. No matter how you spin it, it's at a pretty serious point right now.

If you have the money to shell out for a culture I'd recommend that to figure out what you're dealing with (if the vet really does think it looks bacterial/fungal). And just to play devil's advocate, I don't think euthanasia is out of the question. The number one reason cats are euthanized is because they pee in the house, so euthanizing for a severe medical problem doesn't seem quite so bad. Personally, I would find out a little more about what's going on before jumping to that conclusion though.


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## Bcs TX (Sep 13, 2008)

Here is my .02, whatever you decide to do as far as euthenize or not you need to completely tear down the vivs they were in and sterilize with bleach.
I would throw away the plants, substrate etc. as well after a bleach soak so if there is a contaminate it would not spread to the environment.
My advice is too do a proper QT for any new frogs before introducing them to a planted viv.
If it is a nose rub or secondary infection like Ed said you could treat longer.
That is your call, your frogs and if you believe they are suffering euthenize.
If possible with a vets recommendation I would try to find out what the problem is to safeguard the rest of your collection from cross contamination.

-Beth


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Thanks Beth unfortunately 2 have died so far and I don't think one of the two left will live through the night. I am not sure yet if I should euthenize them or not. 
Thanks 
Buddy


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## Bcs TX (Sep 13, 2008)

Feel bad for you Buddy.
I hope to heck you are ringing the bell of the individual that sold you the frogs.
Perhaps vendor feedback is in order....
Just be sure to bleach everything that was in contact with those frogs.

Beth


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## srrrio (May 12, 2007)

In addition to the threads that Frogface so kindly referenced, there was also this thread, as it is another part of the picture. 

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/frog-classifieds/81871-azureus-leucs-sale.html


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## Bcs TX (Sep 13, 2008)

Holey moley, good catch Sally.

Ok, angry now.....


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

frogface said:


> Ed, if it's from mechanical injury, would their tanks be contaminated and need sanitizing? I recommended he sanitize, in one of the other threads, but now I'm not certain he would need to.


Based on the information in more than one thread, I would suggest discarding all organics that cannot be sanitized and sanitizing everything else... If the frogs are or were housed with wild caught animals, then it is probable that there are more than one potential pathogens. In this case, you have to look at the bigger picture. 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Buddysfrogs said:


> The nose was literally gone and I never saw them eat once since I had so yes I do think their tongue is impaired. So far two have died out of the four one of the Cobalts died now. Yesterday one of the citronellas died now today a cobalt died


Simply because you didn't see them eat doesn't mean that the tongue is involved or damaged. You have frogs that you recently aquired, which you have hauled to at least one swap to be evaluated and are handling to treat. It should be expected for them to not feed since they are stressed and disturbed.... 


Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

parkanz2 said:


> If you have the money to shell out for a culture I'd recommend that to figure out what you're dealing with (if the vet really does think it looks bacterial/fungal). And just to play devil's advocate, I don't think euthanasia is out of the question. The number one reason cats are euthanized is because they pee in the house, so euthanizing for a severe medical problem doesn't seem quite so bad. Personally, I would find out a little more about what's going on before jumping to that conclusion though.


When I worked at the ASPCA in my younger years, the number one reason a cat or kitten ended up on the euthenasia list was "moving" (for cats beyond kitten age) followed closely by allergic... Kittens number one reason was, too many to place..... 

Ed


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Sally they were in the Viv before the citronella were. I had the citronella in a temporary Viv before putting them in there. 
Buddy


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Btw those frogs are not for sale just because they could be sick now that I am informed.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Buddysfrogs said:


> Sally they were in the Viv before the citronella were. I had the citronella in a temporary Viv before putting them in there.
> Buddy


This is a less than ideal husbandry practice since it makes it very easy to exchange pathogens between enclosures and animals. 

Ed


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

None of the sick frogs came in contact or the same Viv as my current ones. The temporary one has been gutted and plants have been sterilized.


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