# Imitator 'nominat' egg issue



## Immemorial (Apr 15, 2009)

Hello,

Firstly I've been browsing this forum for several months now, and haven't had the chance to make a post until now and I'd like to appologize before hand if this too long!. 

With that said I'd like to ask for some help regarding a problem I've encountered and all input is welcome; I have a small 30 x 30 x 45 cm (12" x 12" x 18") vivarium that I keep my pair of ranitomeya imitators in, it is well planted and has plenty of places for them to hide/deposit eggs in. Temperature and humidity is kept at a steady level and no sudden changes are made. They are fed on a diet of Drosophila melanogaster and hydei, dusting of supplements are made at every feeding. 

Now, at the start of this year I received my first batch of eggs, as expected all 3 of them were infertile (That is after the 5th day no sign of spliting of the nuclei was witnessed). The second batch was fertile however, and development was clear at this stage and at this point I removed the eggs from the tank and placed them in a petri dish with a small amount of water. After around 2 weeks the small tadpoles had developed the heart and digestive tract (Seeing the heart beating was a joy itself!) and, from what I expected, they would be hatching soon. This was not the case, all 3 of the eggs had went cloudy and the hearts had stopped beating. Naturally, I was worried and had wondered at what could have went wrong. The next batch of eggs were left in the tank with the parents to see what would happen though the same thing happened. They have been producing eggs every week for about a month now and none of the eggs hatch. It's also good to note that the eggs have not been disturbed at all by myself appart from the initial batch.

Today I had checked another batch that had been laided last week, all of tadpoles had blood all over their bodies, as if a vessel had burst and caused them to die off. I've done my research on breeding and I'm pretty much stumped on what could be causing this!

Again, I'd like to appologize for any information that might be trivial in regards to the question, and any help on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!


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## ESweet (Apr 13, 2009)

Welcome to the board. The first thing I would try is mixing up your dusting - I would make sure they are getting enough Vit A as it seems a Vit A deficiency can lead to death before hatching. Also, if you decide to pull them, use a methylene blue solution - there are lots of posts on here about this where you can find precise details about how much and how to use it.


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## Immemorial (Apr 15, 2009)

Hi ESweet,

Thanks for the response. I will try the suggested items as soon as possible. Also, would it be worth giving them a break from egg laying a while? It seems that they are not producing as much jelly around the embro as they did on the first batches of eggs

Thanks again!


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Rotating supplements, and feeding them insects other than only fruitflies may help - try adding springtails, woodlice and maybe termites to their diet


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

Seconding the vitamin A and the supplement and feeder variety.

Also, I've found over the years, that Ranitomeya take way better care of their eggs than I can after I remove them. I poke around my tanks once a week looking for eggs, note where I find them and how developed they are and then pull the them when the tads are nearly fully developed- about 14 days or so.

Rarely if ever lose eggs anymore.


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## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

Be sure you're getting some airflow to the eggs to help reduce the incidence of fungus. Wipe down the tank to reduce fungal growth on surfaces. 

Also, if there is less jelly around the eggs, they are more susceptible to damage from external things---it is speculated but not proven that white worms can get to developing young. It may be good to fatten up the female a bit in this case. Try Repashy foods for this purpose.


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## Malaki33 (Dec 21, 2007)

I have two groups of Imi's that have been producing for me for about 7 months now so I understand your frustration, so if I may here are some ideas.

1) If you pull your eggs, wait a couple of days after you see the clutch before you pull them. That will give the male some extra time to do what he needs to.

2) Just like in the vivarium itself humidity is key to keeping the eggs viable. Pull the film canisters and place them in a 190 QT on top of sphagum moss and keep the moss moist just like in the viv, every so often GENTLY mist the eggs.

3) Once the eggs start to form tads watch carefully as they develop paying close attention to the gel sack, if you start seeing wrinkles the gel is drying out, mist lightly.


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

Malaki33 said:


> 1) If you pull your eggs, wait a couple of days after you see the clutch before you pull them. That will give the male some extra time to do what he needs to.


I was under the impression that male Ranitomeya deposit their sperm in an area they've 'cleaned' before the female lays the eggs. It is then up to her to have good aim. I will look for the journal article to reference this.


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## Malaki33 (Dec 21, 2007)

Please do, because I had no freeking idea that that was the way it worked (LOL)!! OZ, ED, any input?!


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

Malaki33 said:


> Please do, because I had no freeking idea that that was the way it worked (LOL)!! OZ, ED, any input?!


Okay, almost positive it's Lotters. Brief mention here in a paper on _Cryptophyllobates_ 

Will keep looking...


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## Immemorial (Apr 15, 2009)

Thanks for the responses guys, I've purchased some vitamin A supplement powder and will see how this works out. 

I'll definitely be trying that Malaki33, thanks for the pointer 

Thanks again for the input!


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Immemorial said:


> Thanks for the responses guys, I've purchased some vitamin A supplement powder and will see how this works out.
> 
> I'll definitely be trying that Malaki33, thanks for the pointer
> 
> Thanks again for the input!


Make sure you look into the correct frequency of pure vit A supplementation, too much is fatal


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## Immemorial (Apr 15, 2009)

I'd like to thank everyone for the help, the most recent batch have hatched out successfully 

Thanks again!


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## Arrynia (Dec 27, 2009)

Immemorial said:


> I'd like to thank everyone for the help, the most recent batch have hatched out successfully
> 
> Thanks again!


Awesome! 
As stated above, make sure that you don't overdo the Vit A. I personally use Repashy ICB but will also be picking up other brands of supplements that provide Vit A in the form of retinol and carotinoids, as Repashy ICB does.


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