# My first viv, 40g display



## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

So as the topic says this is my first viv and I'm hoping to keep a decent record of it as it progresses. I'm starting with a 40g breeder that will be laying on its side, I don't need the height a vert would give me because I'm hoping to one day have some orange terribilis calling it home. And from everything i have read they dont tend to be active climbers. I've been doing alot of reading the past couple of months and I am hoping to incorprate several ideas and techniques I've picked up.
To start with I wanted a rimless setup so I started to remove the rims, after getting the top rim off I decided against trying the bottom one. The top one was a real PIA although I'm sure a dremel or cutting wheel would have made it alot easier. But since the bottom rim of the tank will be against the wall and will be less noticable with the background installed I decided to leave it. 

























Next step is to start forming my false bottom with egg crate and wait for my glass drill bits to come so i can drill it for wiring for the fan and a future addition of a mist king, can anyone tell me what size holes I need to be able to mount the mist king nozzles?

I'm planning a Sherman vent at the top and bottom of front sliding doors and a fan for circulation. Hopefully that will give me enough ventilation.

I also picked up some ghost wood at the expo last weekend and am trying to figure out a rough lay out.

















I will try to keep this updated as I make progress which I'm hoping happens daily, I'm very eager to get this up and running.

Thanks for looking, J

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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Finished removing the rim and got all the old silicone off, only took 3 hours, lol. Next time ill build a rimless from scratch I think it will be quicker.









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## red91wing (Jun 4, 2011)

Just an FYI, the bottom rim is MUCH easier to remove than the top.


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## JonRich (Oct 19, 2012)

I'd like to see how this progresses. Won't it sit slanted with the back rim on and the front off?


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## JonRich (Oct 19, 2012)

I can't remember the size for the mistking nozzle , but it's in this pack.. Can't beat $12 shipped. Its shipping from the US as well, so it will take about 4-5 business days. 
15 Pcs Diamond Tool Drill Bit Hole Saw Set for Glass Ceramic Marble 6mm 50mm | eBay


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

red91wing said:


> Just an FYI, the bottom rim is MUCH easier to remove than the top.


Ok ill take another look at it tonight, it just seemed like there is much more silicone and contact area on the bottom rim. Any tips or tricks?



JonRich said:


> I'd like to see how this progresses. Won't it sit slanted with the back rim on and the front off?


I figured worst case a strip of self adhesive 1/4" rubber across the front bottom edge would level it off.

Thanks J


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Thanks Red, glad I gave it another go on the bottom rim, only took an hour or so to get the bottom rim off and cleaned up. I tried a different method which I think would have worked great for the top too. I even got it off in 1 piece.









Much cleaner.









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## Keeferd (Mar 20, 2016)

I used a 5/8" diamond bit for the nozzle on my glass top, and a 9/16" regular butterfly bit on the plastic 5 Gal bucket for the reservoir.


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Keeferd said:


> I used a 5/8" diamond bit for the nozzle on my glass top, and a 9/16" regular butterfly bit on the plastic 5 Gal bucket for the reservoir.


Thanks you, my drill bits should be here tomorrow, I hope I'm mistaken but I think the biggest in the set was a 1/2", doh

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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Got a little more done tonight, built my false bottom and got my fan box ready, not very fancy but it should do the trick.

























Just need to drill a few holes in the top when I get my bits and then I can start the background!!!

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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Looks like a very good start to me


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Thank you I'm really hoping it turns out as great as I am imagining. I've kind of stalled out, I'm nervous about drilling the tank. That and I didnt get a 5/8" bit for the mist king nozzles, I might just use the 3/4" and use some nylon washers when I install the nozzles. I'm also having a hard time finding a fan setup, I'm not a huge fan or ordering things online, but i just might need to. I did however get the glass cut for my Sherman vents, just need to pick up some pieces of aluminum for spacers since the glass place wouldn't cut me 1"x1" pieces or I could attempt it myself, never cut glass before though. 

And I'm still contemplating how I want to do the background still playing with my "wood" to get it just right.


























Decisions, decisions, decisions.

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## JonRich (Oct 19, 2012)

Looks good. How do you plan to access the fan (i assume it will be inside the box) when/if it fails?

I'm only saying this because i've been there, done that and i have 2 tanks with fancy fan boxes with broken fans. I just can't bring myself to tare it apart to change the fan .


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

I have actually been trying to figure that part out, I still need to order a fan so I have some time. I was just trying to find one with a very long life expectancy, I don't plan on having the fan running 24/7. I was going to put it on a timer to help with condensation/heat. 

But I am open to other options and or suggestions. An external fan wont work because I'm only going to have vents in the front. Maybe I could find a fan small enough that I could hide it in a corner where It will be accessible but still mostly unnoticeable? I did find some very small 1"x1" fans but they are only about 8cfm.

Thanks, J


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Another problem I am having is that i had my glass professionally cut for the front bottom panel and the sherman vents. The opening measures 35 5/16" so i had them cut it for 35 1/4" figuring the silicone would be enough to fill/seal the 1/32" gap on either end, but they cut it just a little shy of the 35 1/4" and now I am stuck with almost a 3/32" gap on either end, they guy was kind of on edge about cutting it in the first place, so I'm reluctant to try to bring it back to have them cut a new piece. 

Will the silicone be enough to secure this piece of glass with these gaps on either end?

Thanks again, J


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Made a little progress today. Got the tank siliconed and some vines made. I never realized how strong the silicone smell is i thought my eyes, nose and throat were on fire. I was really hoping to find some coco husk for the vines and background, but had to settle for a compressed brick of coco bark. Looked pretty similar in the package but turns out there's alot of larger pieces but with some work I managed to shred it enough to make it usable. It says to soak to expand it but I didnt feel like waiting for it to dry so I just broke it up by hand so I could get the vines done. But I think ill use the water method for the amount I'm going to need to do the background.

I think its a PetCo peoduct









It's probably 50% chips and 50%shredded









A little work and I got this out of a very small bit of the brick. Then mixed that with some coco fiber.









Finished vines, not to bad for a first timer I think.












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## Tivaj (Dec 30, 2015)

Looking forward to seeing progress on this vivarium 

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## JonRich (Oct 19, 2012)

newebb said:


> Another problem I am having is that i had my glass professionally cut for the front bottom panel and the sherman vents. The opening measures 35 5/16" so i had them cut it for 35 1/4" figuring the silicone would be enough to fill/seal the 1/32" gap on either end, but they cut it just a little shy of the 35 1/4" and now I am stuck with almost a 3/32" gap on either end, they guy was kind of on edge about cutting it in the first place, so I'm reluctant to try to bring it back to have them cut a new piece.
> 
> Will the silicone be enough to secure this piece of glass with these gaps on either end?
> 
> Thanks again, J



Damn, that sucks.i'm not sure if i trust silicone alone in a gap that big. I have the same issue. My glass place used to give me sh*t about how anal i was about getting glass cut to my EXACT measurements. I explained to them what i'm doing, what i need it for and that i can't chance a tank leaking (in my case, i can't chance flies escaping). They totally understood and were more careful with my measurements. I helpful reminder of future business helps as well.  "Hey, i'm planning on building 10 more o these, so getting the exact cut/measurements now will streamline the process for other tanks".. All they see is $$ at that point and in the end of the day money talks. 

~Jon


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## JonRich (Oct 19, 2012)

newebb said:


> I have actually been trying to figure that part out, I still need to order a fan so I have some time. I was just trying to find one with a very long life expectancy, I don't plan on having the fan running 24/7. I was going to put it on a timer to help with condensation/heat.
> 
> But I am open to other options and or suggestions. An external fan wont work because I'm only going to have vents in the front. Maybe I could find a fan small enough that I could hide it in a corner where It will be accessible but still mostly unnoticeable? I did find some very small 1"x1" fans but they are only about 8cfm.
> 
> Thanks, J


It's always a delicate battle with aeration and keeping things hidden and natural. How will this tank sit? Will the back of the tank be hidden? I highly recommend an enclosed external fan mounted out of sight. 

Something similar to that i did here, but mounted vertical on the back of the tank. This way the fan-tube is still functional , but the fan is within reach.
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/255354-10g-vert-build-workshop-my-job.html

This is one i did for my desk terrarium at work few years ago. This one is orientated on a vertical glass face as i suggested.. I originally had it venting to atmosphere but it dried the tank out quickly(granted this was a small tank). But i later covered it with a old acrylic watch case i had and it worked perfect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0jGSV0MwNU

Hope this gives you some ideas. 

~Jon


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

JonRich said:


> It's always a delicate battle with aeration and keeping things hidden and natural. How will this tank sit? Will the back of the tank be hidden? I highly recommend an enclosed external fan mounted out of sight.
> 
> Something similar to that i did here, but mounted vertical on the back of the tank. This way the fan-tube is still functional , but the fan is within reach.
> http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/255354-10g-vert-build-workshop-my-job.html
> ...


It's always a delicate battle with aeration and keeping things hidden and natural. How will this tank sit? Will the back of the tank be hidden? I highly recommend an enclosed external fan mounted out of sight. 

Something similar to that i did here, but mounted vertical on the back of the tank. This way the fan-tube is still functional , but the fan is within reach.
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/255354-10g-vert-build-workshop-my-job.html

This is one i did for my desk terrarium at work few years ago. This one is orientated on a vertical glass face as i suggested.. I originally had it venting to atmosphere but it dried the tank out quickly(granted this was a small tank). But i later covered it with a old acrylic watch case i had and it worked perfect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0jGSV0MwNU

Hope this gives you some ideas. 

~Jon[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the idea, I ended up setting it up for an external but enclosed fan to help maintain humidity. I just had to do it on "top" of the enclosure because that back panel is tempered. 
First attempt at drilling glass. 2 holes for a top mounted fan box. And 2 holes for future addition of a mist king.










I found out play dough does a good job of retaining water for cooling.









All 4 holes drilled.









Also got the input and output for the fans made and installed and started working on the GS background, now comes the waiting game.

This being my First viv I should probably lower my expectations of what its going to look like when done. But for now ill try keep my hopes up.










Thanks for looking, J



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## red91wing (Jun 4, 2011)

Any update on this build?


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Still in progress, I've done a little more sculpting and foaming, but not to much, weather has been crappy and I need to do the silicone background outside. Also was waiting for parts from Chris Sherman for my vents and door guide's. But nice weather is here so I should be making some progress this week.

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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Small update finally, I had some time to make some progress and after several mistakes that I'm guessing comes with being a newb I think I finally got this background almost wrapped up. But man the littlest things make it very difficult. I've read about not making any spots to tight but I wasn't really sure what to tight was. I managed to get silicone on just about eveeything, the wood, the vines the background and everything in between. But I cleaned it up the best I could. Next time I will be sure to tape off everything and not try to carve quite so much.

After 3 rounds of foam and carving this is what I ended up with, not exactly what I had pictured but I'm guessing plants and moss will cover most or it up.

















1st round of silicone and background mix.

























I ended up mixing some shredded coco husk, cocofiber, past moss and some ground sphag to get the background mix. I was hoping for it to be a little darker but I didn't use enough peat. I ran out of silicone, so I had to order more so I can finish the left side and do a few touch up spots.

I also got my order from Sherman Tanks so I can start putting the vents together once I get the front bottom panel in. If anyone hasn't dealt with Chris Sherman I highly recommend him, he was a pleasure to work with and I received everything very quickly. His stuff is also top notch, the door guides are very strong and seem like everything will open and close very smoothly. He is also very reasonably priced.









I've realized now though that I'm going to have to make my false bottom slightly smaller because as it sits now I can't get my hand in there to silicone the bottom panel in. And because of the way my branches are placed I have to put the bottom in before I set the glass in place, oh well. Guess I'm going to have to pick up some more river rocks for the front edge and corner draining area. 

I know this build has been dragging on for such a small and simple one, but I'm still far from done. And I'm working on a limited budget so I can only pick up things here and there. But hopefully I will be able to wrap it up shortly. I still have no idea what I'm doing for plants, I don't plan on any broms, but I am hoping to pop an orchid in the 1 canister I set up. Other than that I'm hoping for some begonias, ferns and some climbing/trailing plants and whatever else might catch my eye.

Thanks for reading,
J



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## roundfrog (Jan 27, 2016)

Looking great so far. The method of making a front opening enclosure is pretty cool, and I think I might want to do it bc opening my vittatus tanks from the top is kind of a pain in the rear. Don't worry about getting silicone everywhere, the same thing happened to me too. I also learned not to squeeze the trigger to the silicone gun when the tube is clogged, because the pressure...


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## roundfrog (Jan 27, 2016)

Oh dear! just thought of a very bad pun. In your first post, you said that hopefully some terriblis might call it home. Well, if you had a male, the might literally CALL it home. lol


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Not to much progress but I got the background touched up and finished and put together the vents and started installing them, just need to cut down the false bottom and tomorrow I can install the bottom glass and vent.

Almost time to order some plants and isopods.

















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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Made the false bottom smaller for installation purposes and traded the landscape fabric for fiber glass window screen, I had a feeling the landscape fabric was going to wick the moisture into the substrate and possibly make it difficult for water to even pass through. I'm going to add another piece of screen over the whole bottom once I get the rest of the drainage layer laid down. I'm thnking of using medium sized river stones for the front and some aquarium gravel on the sides and back to conceal the eggcrate. Also got the bottom glass panel installed.









Waited a few hours and installed the bottom vent and all the door tracks









And the finished product, just waiting for everything to get a little more solid before testing out the sliding doors.









Testing out the lighting, unfotunently my dog knocked the fixture on the ground and 1 of the cfls broke so I need to replace that.









Hopefully in the next couple days I'll finish up the drainage layer and get the abg and leaf litter laid down. Going to order some mossy slurry, isopods and springtails from neherp, but unfortunately they're still behind on shipping so it will probably be awhile before I get this thing Going. I want to let the moss grow in with almost 100% humidity before I lower it and start planting anything else, so hopefully I can order plants in a couple weeks.

Thanks for looking,
Jeremy



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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

So not to much of an update, but figured I would post something since it's been awhile. I had a few things come up that halted work on the viv and now it's so hot I'm afraid to order any plants because I doubt anything will survive. But in the mean time I've been on the hunt for a stand for the viv and I stumbled across the perfectly sized chest which already had the perfect touch to it, yes those handles were already on it!!! Now I just need to sand it down and paint it white because the rest of the furniture in the room is white. I'm not usually a fan of painting antiques but got to keep the wife happy. 

























Now that I have a stand I can finally add the rocks, abg and a few other things I was holding off on because I was worried about the weight with what it's currently sitting on. Maybe in another month it will cool off enough so that I can start ordering mosses hand plants.

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## RichardA (Jul 15, 2009)

Looking great! 

FYI I got two shipments of plants in this week on 2 day priority with no ill effects to them.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

newebb said:


> I stumbled across the perfectly sized chest which already had the perfect touch to it, yes those handles were already on it!!!


Oh man what a killer find! So cool!!


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

So it's been quiet some time I see that I've done anything, viv hasnt changed a bit. Had some life changing events and put eveything on hold. But I'm hoping to actually get this thing going. I've actually devided to take a different route for now, going to try to go with just plants in this for now, my current job will make it tough to keep pdfs for now. Maybe once things change i can add some later. I'm going to place an order for some moss slurry from neherp but I had a question before I did. Would a plant only enclosure benefit from isotops and springtails? Or should I skip those until I'm ready to add frogs much later on?

Thanks, J


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