# Testing fruit flies



## scobro (Jan 4, 2021)

I have wanted some dart frogs for a long time, that being said I have almost a phobia/aversion to fruit flies. There was an incident many years ago and now just the sight of them give me the willies. 

But I decided to say screw it, it's only money. I'm going to buy a culture of fruit flies and try "playing" with them just to see what my response would be. It's something about their movement and their small size that just makes me itch all over. 

If I wanted to test my response to a really "hoppy" one, would you recommend going with a Melanogaster or a Hydei? And then theoretically when I am done "playing" with them, what's the most ethical way to you know, remove them from the house? 

This sounds like a really dumb question, but I don't know any other way of getting over my phobia of them (if I can) than doing it this way. It's something about them jumping onto the skin that wigs me out... with that I mind, I wonder if wearing gloves would help abate the feelings.

Has this sort of thing happened to anyone else? I can't be the only weird one, can I?


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

When you allow the mental movie to play out in your mind all the way, what is it that concludes your fear?

Its important that you identify the core fear. Most fears and misunderstandings can be assuaged with thorough examination of fact, in juxtaposition to fearful imagery with a willing participant


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

When they hop on your skin, then what do you expect?


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Do it outside, the,
as you say - 'playing" part.

Take the: "What happens with them in my house - how do i get them out "
out of the equation.

The hydei compared to mels doesnt seem relevent. The chord they strike will be same.

Ive had to walk thru these types of psych dynamics with clients, spouses of clients, roommates and others. Not with FFs, but pet tarantulas, snakes, feeder crickets, its not an unknown phenomenon but ive not ever dealt with it online


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## scobro (Jan 4, 2021)

Kmc said:


> When you allow the mental movie to play out in your mind all the way, what is it that concludes your fear?
> 
> Its important that you identify the core fear. Most fears and misunderstandings can be assuaged with thorough examination of fact, in juxtoposition to fearful imagery with a willing participant


It's also just looking at them. Watching videos of them being cultured is problematic; though the more I'm watching the easier it's getting. Especially learning they can't climb when they are dusted.

A few years ago I left some wine out (in the summer) and got a really bad infestation. They would always be landing and crawling over me. And crawling over foods, etc. Then at work we seem to get them every summer and I can be typing and just seeing two or three hovering around me. It's their size and being so small.

LOL When they hop on my skin I expect them to DIE!!!! But seriously, it's the tactile experience of them crawling. I have issues with things like that sometimes.

I think maybe some of it is that they fly away, so it's possible flightless wouldn't be as bad because they wouldn't be zipping off. Yeah, maybe it's the flying away part too. I think I just don't like little small things! Small little spiders I cannot abide. Big, hairy nasty looking spiders don't bother me at all.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

I think the flying away fear is connected your lack of control to where they go, or want to go.

Its important to remember that they:

1) Have no sinister agenda

2) Are incredibly fragile

3) Any neural awareness however basal that exists in contact with a larger form it is probably an insect version of terrorized vulnerability. They have 0 defense mechanisms. They are defenseless.

4) When they "get away" cultured FF are morphological cripples. They wander dysmorphically and if a human emotive is to be spent, deserve mercy in a swift demise if found somewhere 'household inappropriate'.
But swift mercy nonetheless.
After all without them, what would we do?


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Try some flightless melanogaster if you want them to hop all over. For feeding frogs, wingless melanogaster are easier to deal with, and don't hop all over. 

If you want to wear gloves, wear gloves. 

You can euthanize them by placing the entire culture in the freezer overnight.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

In my experience with feeder insect fears, albeit larger forms, gloves havent been reported to help. Many people with this issue have already tried that.

A self aware walk thru and absorption of facts to a willing participant has had positive outcomes. IRL.


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## Taran (Dec 21, 2020)

I'm glad you're working to confront your fears, and you're going about it right I think!

I used to be wildly arachnophobic until I spent a year taking care of a pink toed tarantula (long story). At first I could barely even LOOK at him. I'd add water to his little dish by standing as far away as possible and using the plant watering can to pour water through the mesh lid. Poor spider flinched whenever he got splashed but otherwise never moved. I had to really wok on the thought that I was causing the spider to do scary things by scaring HIM. I worked to minimize my impact on the tarantula very incrementally. I eventually got comfortable enough to take off the lid, reach in, grab the dish, and walk to the sink to wash it out (turning my back to the lidless tank) because I came to trust the spider because I knew what to expect. I feel like getting to know the thing so it is no longer unpredictable goes a long way toward banishing fears. I'd probably have lost it if it ever lurched at me, but it never did. It just sat in its little log hut and watched me.

Anyway, this morning I found a jumping spider in my bathroom and was actually pretty happy to see the little guy. I let them stay in places that they won't bother the housemate whose still afraid of them. I can relocate most small spiders bare-handed now, bigger ones I use a cup or piece of paper, and have only had one scare incident in the last decade (apparently a really big one on cardboard so I can HEAR it skitter is too much and brings back the total panic, even if the sight is ok now) and I haven't even been working at it since the tarantula stopped being my responsibility.

I don't think your fear is strange at all. I think you're brave for confronting it and I hope you succeed! I'd love to see more people confronting their fears and trying to understand them.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

I have found that when a person is willing to identify in detail what it is they are afraid of and find out the truth about it, it helps.

But the most triumphant overcoming is when a person identifies with the fragilities and vulnerability of the creature/s they fear and come to realize that that vulnerability and fragility surpasses their own and the fear goes away.


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## scobro (Jan 4, 2021)

Kmc said:


> when a person identifies with the fragilities and vulnerability of the creature/s they fear and come to realize that that vulnerability and fragility surpasses their own and the fear goes away.


For me it's not so much the creatures themselves, but their minute movement on the skin. It's the touching me part. Case in point, my hair is long and last night it was flicking against me just the right way and I couldn't sleep because I kept feeling the hair on my skin. If my hair or my beard gets too long I have to cut it because when I feel my own hair brush against my shoulders, ever so lightly, at night, it just irritates the heck out of me and I'm always pulling it back and scratching.

So it's not so much the bug itself, for me, it's just that light touching of the skin. Makes me very anxious. There are certain types of clothes I simply cannot wear because of how it brushes against and touches the skin. That goes back to the thinking gloves would help.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Right, you identified the specifics. 

Well, gloves are easy to get but they dont cover your whole body so it would be good to do your FF stuff outside.

It would probably be good to work on your tactile startles you have with your own hair first and i would not think you should endeavor to keep anything that feeds on FF until you work this out.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

I like your approach to this, scobro. You already have good answers in this forum, but I would add a couple of things. First, for you it will probably be more important than most to make sure you get a truly fly-proof vivarium. My tanks (granted, there are almost 30 of them) are mostly fly porous to some degree or another. Escapes are a common occurrence and they end up on my skin routinely. This doesn't bother me the way it does you, but it is annoying. Make sure that you have a relatively fly-proof tank for the frogs, and that the area you use to handle the fly cultures (for feeding and for making new cultures) has a way to contain the escapees (there will be some). I have a deep service sink in the laundry room that helps with this.

Second, avoid Turkish Gliders (a type of melanogaster). I like them because they are very mobile and are a bit more of a challenge for the frogs. They also seem to have a shorter generation time and are more prolific for me. However, they live up to their name. They would be tough for you, I think. Just get regular old wingless melanogaster. 

Best of luck in getting over your fear!

Mark


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## jeffkruse (Jun 5, 2018)

Exactly what Mark said. Mels. Hydei are big enough you will feel them crawl on you. It's very rare to feel a mel crawl on you.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Hmm well there seems to be a phantom element to these kinds of fears, which is why doing some 'inside' work can be a more lasting approach, that goes beyond conditional like glove wearing (which doesnt really help a wayward fly on your collarbone no matter what kind) or mobility behaviors of the flies that may diverge from 'type' expectation.


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## jeffkruse (Jun 5, 2018)

LOL, Im at work eating some nuts that my wife packed me. Out popped a Hydei.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Im Fla me and my girlfriend at the time went collecting oysters. Oh they were big, and fresh.

As my GF took a bite of oyster flesh a translucent flattish worm form withdrew into the other portion. About 72 hrs later my GF was in the ER recieving fluids and metronidazole for major diarrhea and general undefined parasitic inf.

It just occurred to me the above post was kidding. I dont really Get kidding sometimes


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Oh you wernt kidding. Yes they are hot wheels. They get around.


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## surfindude686 (Jul 15, 2020)

Sounds like you’ve been given some solid advice here but I’ll add my 2 cents. I was also pretty grossed out by the thought of culturing flys but the desire to keep frogs was stronger. Videos and reading about it all freaked me out but I gave it a shot. I ordered a freshly started culture of wingless Melos online and I would recommend going the freshly started route. The culture looked clean and tidy when I received it and there were only a handful of flys in it. I was surprised at how interesting it was to watch the larvae start to develop. I found myself checking on it daily and instead of being disgusted, I was fascinated and stoked when it started to produce flys. You may find that once you actually have a culture in your hand it’s not as scary as it seems because you have more control over it than anticipated.


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## DPfarr (Nov 24, 2017)

To your point of familiarization lessening the aversion, flightless are much less jumpy etc than your fruit fly that might result in leaving some bananas on your counter and going on vacation.

If you’re interested in working through your experience, you can slow them down in the fridge before you work with them.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Thats a Cool Idea


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## scobro (Jan 4, 2021)

Thanks for all of your advice. 


surfindude686 said:


> I was surprised at how interesting it was to watch the larvae start to develop. I found myself checking on it daily


Was watching a video the other day about just that and I thought that would be really cool. Watching them go from larvae to fly.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

You got sterling *** for posting that here. 

Should be said.


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## geginn64 (Jun 24, 2020)

You are heading in the right direction. Your anxiety is no laughing matter. You may actually be suffering from entomophobia, which, according to the Turkish Journal of Parasitology, is an abnormal and persistent fear of insects. Like all phobias.
What you may have is called Pteronarcophobia which is an abnormal and persistent fear of flies often caused by a negative past experience such as you described.
A phobia is "an ongoing and unreasonable fear of a certain object, animal, activity, or situation that poses little to no actual danger." In other words, individuals suffering from phobias unconsciously or reflexively exaggerate the perceived threat of a particular stimulus (heights, the sight of blood, etc.). I'm not suggesting your phobia is unreasonable. It is what you fear. I think everyone might have a phobia.
I feel the best therapy, in my opinion. Confronting your earliest memories of insects? Once the origins of your phobia are established, the most common behavioral (non-pharmaceutical) prescription for alleviating the symptoms of your phobia is systematic desensitization. Also known as exposure therapy, this process involves introducing the patient to the actual source of their phobia. This introduction is administered carefully and gradually.

You can do this because you are willing to conquer your fear. You might want to implement latex gloves or similar gloves.
Just keep at it and you might, can, & will overcome your phobia.

I hope this helps.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## FroggerFrog (Jan 11, 2021)

GEG64 said:


> You are heading in the right direction. Your anxiety is no laughing matter. You may actually be suffering from entomophobia, which, according to the Turkish Journal of Parasitology, is an abnormal and persistent fear of insects. Like all phobias.
> What you may have is called Pteronarcophobia which is an abnormal and persistent fear of flies often caused by a negative past experience such as you described.
> A phobia is "an ongoing and unreasonable fear of a certain object, animal, activity, or situation that poses little to no actual danger." In other words, individuals suffering from phobias unconsciously or reflexively exaggerate the perceived threat of a particular stimulus (heights, the sight of blood, etc.). I'm not suggesting your phobia is unreasonable. It is what you fear. I think everyone might have a phobia.
> I feel the best therapy, in my opinion. Confronting your earliest memories of insects? Once the origins of your phobia are established, the most common behavioral (non-pharmaceutical) prescription for alleviating the symptoms of your phobia is systematic desensitization. Also known as exposure therapy, this process involves introducing the patient to the actual source of their phobia. This introduction is administered carefully and gradually.
> ...


We all have phobias. I have a phobia of dead animals (mostly mice or rats) which is called Necrophobia. I totally agree with GEG. Sometimes, I just deal with it because it never bothers me too much but if you’re having a hard time dealing with it, GEG had a great explanation.


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