# Large New Vivarium Build



## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Hi all, I'm new to the site and I hope I'm doing this right. I'm planning a large build for this winter and I'm hoping to get some advice and feedback on my ideas. As of now, I want to go 6'L by 2'D by 4'T. I'm planning to build the stand and the viv together as one unit. I want to use plywood for the floor, the side walls and the back wall. In order to waterproof this I was thinking of coating all of the interior of the wood with Drylok and sealing the joints with silicone. I haven't been able to find any info on how Drylok and silicone work together, will they bond well if I silicone all of the joints then Drylok everything? Does anyone have any advice on waterproofing for a wooden build?


Jon

Auratus | Ranitomeya


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

JoshsDragonz has built at least 2 plywood vivariums, about 450 gallons each, maybe he'll jump in?


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

That'd be awesome, his work is incredible! Anyone have any advice on waterproofing a plywood viv???


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

I really barely know anything about sealing wood vivs, but I do believe most people use two-part epoxy.


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## jpm995 (Sep 15, 2013)

I would think the dryloc may be toxic, i would think epoxy might be better. I would wait until someone with experience with this type of build chimes in before sealing the viv.


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## timmygreener (Aug 22, 2011)

I used drylock on mine, and bondo fiberglass for the lowest part for the false bottom


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

I've used drylok before as well in small applications, it's not toxic, and can be tinted with non-toxic acrylic tank. It's especially good for moving water as it won't wash away like coco fiber will. The only drawback is that it can take weeks to apply several layers to an entire background allowing for full curing time between applications.


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Thanks guys, I'm definitely going to read further into it before waterproofing. Still in the planning stages. Nice viv Timmy! How many coats of drylok did you use?
I've also thought about just spreading a thin coating of silicone over the entire inside surface of the plywood, any thoughts on that?


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## timmygreener (Aug 22, 2011)

Don't smear silicone, it will eventually peel and come up like a latex mask.

I did 2 coats of drylock, the first coat I did I could still see the wood grain after it dried and I think it would have worked...but I had more drylock so I said helll with it and did another coat. I'm in the planning stages of re working that big Viv and probably tearing it down to make an in wall unit to make it a little more cleaned up in my den. I'll be making 3- 4x4 foot cube vivs instead of the 8x4x3 one. It's still a toss up until I get the funds to pull the trigger.


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Thanks for the advice guys, I think I'm going to use an epoxy. I'll post pics once I get the time to start building.


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Still at the drawing board for this build, been too busy with work to get started. I plan to pick up lumber and start building the stand next week. I just got back from a camping trip in Maine. There's a beautiful brook right by the site where I found some wood I really like. Here are a few pics of the stream and the wood I pulled out of it. It's incredible how a place that's covered in snow so much of the year has such vibrant colors! The streams have an almost amazonian feel to them, very inspiring


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

I found these fully submerged in fresh cold mountain water, too large to bake, any thoughts on sterilization?


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

You can submerge them in a small plastic pool or garbage can (depending on how long they are) for 2 weeks.

For an aquarium I once bought a huge pot from a restaurant supply company and boiled one side for a while then turned it around and boiled the other. 

If I had that to do again I would have done that outside


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## Rushthezeppelin (Oct 6, 2015)

cam1941 said:


> You can submerge them in a small plastic pool or garbage can (depending on how long they are) for 2 weeks.
> 
> For an aquarium I once bought a huge pot from a restaurant supply company and boiled one side for a while then turned it around and boiled the other.
> 
> If I had that to do again I would have done that outside


Big pot and turkey fryer would be perfect for this.


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## jpm995 (Sep 15, 2013)

I would think a diluted bleach wash an then rinse many times with water in the bathtub would be ok. Would one of those moss covered rocks fit in viv?


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Thanks jpm, the general consensus on here is that there is no 100% foolproof to sterilize large pieces of wood. This build's going to be a huge amount of work for me and I'm not going to take the risk of introducing nemerteans or other nasty microfauna. I've got the wood drying in my closet now, I'll have there for a couple months to hopefully get the inner parts of the wood dry. If I'm not confident in sterility at that point in the build, I'll probably cut it so that it'll fit in my oven.

As for the moss covered rocks, they're in northern Maine, where it is much colder than any viv for most of the year and freezing for most of the winter. I think it looks incredible in the wild, but it probably wouldn't do well in the consistent climate of a vivarium. I really like NEHERP moss, it's reasonably priced, comes sterile, and it has grown in nicely in my other tanks.


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## Rushthezeppelin (Oct 6, 2015)

jonjoyce346 said:


> As for the moss covered rocks, they're in northern Maine, where it is much colder than any viv for most of the year and freezing for most of the winter. I think it looks incredible in the wild, but it probably wouldn't do well in the consistent climate of a vivarium. I really like NEHERP moss, it's reasonably priced, comes sterile, and it has grown in nicely in my other tanks.


Not much of a point in using temperate mosses. They need that winter dormancy period or they will die off eventually. Even in a temperate viv they won't work unless you have the means to brumate the whole viv. Tropical mosses are the def the way to go.


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

I have heard this theory both ways so many times I wonder which is true. I have had some experience with temp mosses and so far so good but its only been like 4 months.

I wonder if it depends on the species, which would explain why there are so many different versions of this story.

Anybody have an answer to this once and for all?



Rushthezeppelin said:


> Not much of a point in using temperate mosses. They need that winter dormancy period or they will die off eventually. Even in a temperate viv they won't work unless you have the means to brumate the whole viv. Tropical mosses are the def the way to go.


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

cam1941 said:


> I have heard this theory both ways so many times I wonder which is true. I have had some experience with temp mosses and so far so good but its only been like 4 months.
> 
> I wonder if it depends on the species, which would explain why there are so many different versions of this story.
> 
> Anybody have an answer to this once and for all?


In my case it is not theory: although I live in a rather hot climate, local mosses work a few months in viv. I refer to Hypnum spp., especially cupressiforme.
I use these mosses as a substratum for the plants take root, then ficus or pilea cover them... But for the rest, better aquatic mosses.


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

So mosses from your area don't go through a winter dormancy period with snow? You said you live in a hot climate...







rigel10 said:


> In my case it is not theory: although I live in a rather hot climate, local mosses work a few months in viv. I refer to Hypnum spp., especially cupressiforme.
> I use these mosses as a substratum for the plants take root, then ficus or pilea cover them... But for the rest, better aquatic mosses.


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## zerelli (Sep 14, 2009)

cam1941 said:


> I have heard this theory both ways so many times I wonder which is true. I have had some experience with temp mosses and so far so good but its only been like 4 months.
> 
> I wonder if it depends on the species, which would explain why there are so many different versions of this story.
> 
> Anybody have an answer to this once and for all?


I think that it is all anectdotal at this point. I do not know of any distribution maps that would tell you which species might be thriving in a warmer area. I often see some really strange advice given on temperate flora and fauna. I just moments ago saw someone saying that a temperate species should not get over 65 degrees. The person writing that must not be from teh Ohio Valley region. Average temps are higher than 65 for a big chunk of the year. THe real key is going to be if the life history of the species in question requires some cooling phase. Many organisms that live in a temperate climate can survive in warmer climates, but again I do not think anyone is going to have a scientific answer for you on this one.


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

I mean its not that I'm looking for the answer as of now since I just jumped in but the OP would probably appreciate it.

I would just love to hear what the truth is because I def know that a lot of people repeat both sides of this without the experience themselves.

In my case I'm using a number of beautiful temperate mosses (about 4) and they all have been doing great, growing like crazy and even popping up in places I didn't put them. The only thing is that I've had them for only 4 months so I guess I'm going to find out if they are going to die without a cool dormant period. If so I'll just cover their spots with something more tropical, but I really believe that most of them will survive.




zerelli said:


> I think that it is all anectdotal at this point. I do not know of any distribution maps that would tell you which species might be thriving in a warmer area. I often see some really strange advice given on temperate flora and fauna. I just moments ago saw someone saying that a temperate species should not get over 65 degrees. The person writing that must not be from teh Ohio Valley region. Average temps are higher than 65 for a big chunk of the year. THe real key is going to be if the life history of the species in question requires some cooling phase. Many organisms that live in a temperate climate can survive in warmer climates, but again I do not think anyone is going to have a scientific answer for you on this one.


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

My work season is coming to an end and I'm finally getting this project underway! I started building a frame this morning, here are a couple pics, I made two identical pieces, of these for the front and one for the back. Will move to a more sanitary work space once I'm further along


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

I'm ready to order some epoxy, I'm going with Polygem 1319. It's getting cold here and I'm probably going to be applying in my living room. My house is small and I don't have a basement. Does anyone with epoxy experience on here have anything to say about this? Will opening my windows provide sufficient ventilation? Will I want to wear a respirator during application?


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Put up the walls today


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## jonjoyce346 (Oct 15, 2014)

Rain day today. Couldn't work on the structure because I have to make my cuts outside.

Still wanted to do something for the build, so I tried making up some fake liana. I used sisal rope, silicone, and ecoearth, here's a pic


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