# Is Calcium supp. necessary when using Reptivite?



## jejton (Sep 3, 2006)

I know that most people recommend using a multivitamin and calcium supplment but the label on Reptivite states that it contains 21.2% calcium. Is calcium supplementation still necessary ?


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## rickmcdole (Oct 1, 2006)

I'm new to df's, so I can only weigh in on this from the experience of a long-time reptile keeper:

My experience in general has been that Herpti-vite has plenty of calcium for most species, with the exception of turtles and tortoises (which have horrendous calcium requirements due to shell-building, expecially in juveniles). I've also supplemented with Rep-Cal in species with very high growth rates, as it can't hurt to feed more calcium to a rapidly growing skeletal structure.

So far in my limited experience with PDF's, I've used Herpti-Vite alone. I'll be interested to hear that the experts in this area have to say!


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

The real question starts with the question as to what is the ratio of Ca to P in the supplement. If the supplent has a ratio of less than 1:1 Ca to P then there will be insufficient Ca to support growth in the frog or other herp. Ideally the ratio should be close to 1.5 or 2:1 Ca to P. 

I can't remember off the top of my head what the maximal Ca in the diet should be as it has a narrow rage of tolerance but I probably posted it in another thread here.. (the search forum should pick it up). 

I would recommend the Nutrition Chapter in Mader's first book for a hobbyists friendly primer on it. 

Ed


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## slaytonp (Nov 14, 2004)

Correct me if I'm wrong, Ed, but I believe the main reason for combining the Herptivite multivitamins with Rep-Cal (Ca/D3 without phosphorus) is that the Rep Cal contains D3, which is essential for the utilization of calcium, and the Herptivite doesn't. It is necessary to provide the D3, especially in darts, where it is difficult to provide a source of UV light for them to "manufacture their own," as our enclosures are almost totally glassed in to preserve humidity, so filter out any UV from the outside. Without a source of D3, they can't utilize the calcium.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Hi Patty,

Yes without sufficient D3 (either via photoconversion or dietary) the frog cannot metabolize the calcium however the two supplements do not necessarily have to be mixed as long as both A, D3 and E are all offered in sufficient quantity in the diet (as these are fat soluable the excess can be stored). 
But as I mentioned above the ratio of Ca to P is also important. 

Ed


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## jejton (Sep 3, 2006)

What is Mader's book ?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Reptile Medicine and Surgery


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## forestexotics (Nov 14, 2006)

From what Ive heard, yes, you do need calcium supplement as well as the multivitamins. It has something to do with the phospherous binding to the calcium and not letting the frogs absorb enough of it. I have had no calcium defficiency deaths since I started using both....sara


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## zBrinks (Jul 16, 2006)

Ed's recommendation of Mader's book is great. That book really kicks butt, for the hobbyist and future herp vet. Well worth the price!


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