# Dead flies in culture



## Taari (Nov 6, 2012)

I made new FF cultures on november 15th. On the 28th, I used one of those cultures to make 3 more new ones after the initial bloom in the ones made on the 15th. They seemed to be producing alot of flies and I was feeding my frogs daily. Well now I am noicing that almost all the food is eaten, and there are TONS of dead flies all over the sides of at least one of the cups, and many dead flies in the others but not quite as many. These cultures are only 3 weeks old, but there's almost no flies left and the cultures I made on the 28th haven't bloomed yet. I have maggots, but they haven't pupated. What could be causing the flies in my older cultures to be dying and going through their food so quickly? 

I use 32 oz. deli cups with a 3/4" hole punched in the top and some quilt batting stuffed into it. I use Josh's Frog mix and they are Melanogaster flies. I put about 5/8-3/4" of food in the bottom of the cup with excelsior. I haven't seen any mites in the cultures, though I know that mites come with the territory, if I haven't seen any, then the population probably isn't that high. The cultures are not dry, quite the opposite, actually. 

Here you can see all the dead flies glued to the sides with the moisture in the cup










The media is so digested that it now runs side to side when I tilt the cup to feed.


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## Taari (Nov 6, 2012)

After thinking about it a bit, I think I will begin staggering my cultures by only one week instead of two weeks. I think I'll trade my friend one of my cultures that I made a week ago for one that's already bloomed and use it to make 1 or 2 new cultures, and feed my frogs until the cultures I made a week ago bloom.


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## Tony83 (Nov 11, 2012)

They look very wet. Also doesn't seem like a lot of media in the cups. This could be affecting production.


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## Shinosuke (Aug 10, 2011)

I'm not an expert but I'd agree, that looks overly wet.


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## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

Are the lids allowing enough airflow?


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## Taari (Nov 6, 2012)

There's not as much media in the cups as the one picture makes it look like there is. That is because the media slid over to one side while I was feeding the frogs. The only moisture is what I add to the media when I prepare it, which is 1/3 cup water to 1/4 cup powder per culture. I'm not sure why so much of it ended up as humidity on the sides of the cup, unless it's because the cups aren't ventillated well enough. I might swing by walmart today and pick up some fine tulle and scilicone that to the hole instead of using the quilt batting. That will allow more airflow and more evaporation of excess moisture, which would help.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

It reeks of not enough airflow, leading to overly wet media and eventual suffocation, to me. Get a few real, properly vented lids, and learn how to culture with tried and true materials first. After you've mastered that, you can play with alternative lids.


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## Tony83 (Nov 11, 2012)

I think there is too little media in the cups which is why your production has dropped so soon plus too wet and insufficient ventilation. The best producing cultures I've seen use around 3/4" of media when set up and will produce well for a month. By the end of the month almost all of the media is gone which is perfect because you shouldn't keep them for more than 28 days anyway. Also, if you're feeding from the same culture daily, you're depleting the breeding adults too fast which is going to affect production. I feed no more than 2-3 times per week from one culture.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Tony83 said:


> I think there is too little media in the cups which is why your production has dropped so soon plus too wet and insufficient ventilation. The best producing cultures I've seen use around 3/4" of media





Taari said:


> I put about 5/8-3/4" of food in the bottom of the cup with excelsior.


He's already stated that he is using 5/8" to 3/4" of media.


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## Tony83 (Nov 11, 2012)

Yes, but from the photo it doesn't look like that much media. He also stated that he's only using 1/4c of media to make the new culture.


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## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

I just use paper towels and a hot glue gun...just a suggestion. Cut a hole in the deli lid as big as you can get away with while still being able to glue on the paper towel.


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## JPccusa (Mar 10, 2009)

Tony83 said:


> Yes, but from the photo it doesn't look like that much media. He also stated that he's only using 1/4c of media to make the new culture.


Read carefully:



Taari said:


> *There's not as much media in the cups as the one picture makes it look like there is. That is because the media slid over to one side while I was feeding the frogs.* The only moisture is what I add to the media when I prepare it, which is 1/3 cup water to 1/4 cup powder per culture. I'm not sure why so much of it ended up as humidity on the sides of the cup, unless it's because the cups aren't ventillated well enough. I might swing by walmart today and pick up some fine tulle and scilicone that to the hole instead of using the quilt batting. That will allow more airflow and more evaporation of excess moisture, which would help.


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## Tony83 (Nov 11, 2012)

Yes, I understand that the media has slid to one side but it still does not look like enough. Plus the OP said that he is only using 1/4c of media. That's not enough to support a thriving culture for a month. Perhaps the OP could post a photo of the culture on a level surface.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Tony83 said:


> Yes, I understand that the media has slid to one side but it still does not look like enough. Plus the OP said that he is only using 1/4c of media. That's not enough to support a thriving culture for a month. Perhaps the OP could post a photo of the culture on a level surface.


Repashy recommends starting with 1/4 cup of dry media. I have made hundreds (or more) of cultures over the years, using 1/4 cup of dry media and they are still producing after 4 weeks. In fact, they get moved to another room, to isolate mite problems, and some will run for 6 weeks.
The amount of media he is using is NOT responsible for his failures. If the amount of media were the problem, the media would be dried up or gone.


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## Tony83 (Nov 11, 2012)

Roger that.


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## Taari (Nov 6, 2012)

The recipe for Josh's Frogs is 1/2 cup POWDER to 2/3 cup water. That is enough for 2 cultures to be filled 3/4" thick give or take. That beaks down to 1/4 cup POWDERED media with 1/3 c. water per culture, which results in 3/4" of media in each cup. I think my problem is too much moisture due to lack of ventilation. I already own packages of 50 32 oz. deli cups with non-ventilated lids that I got for another purpose, so I may as well use them, I just need to adjust my methods. 

I'm going to use scilicone to attach fine tulle to the lids, which will allow alot more air movement, and possibly enlarge the opening a bit as well.

Also, I'm a girl


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## Taari (Nov 6, 2012)

Blue_Pumilio said:


> I just use paper towels and a hot glue gun...just a suggestion. Cut a hole in the deli lid as big as you can get away with while still being able to glue on the paper towel.


I re-use my cups and lids, and I always scrub them with hot water before starting a new culture. I'd like to use something that is re-usable instead of having to peel off nasty bug-covered hot glue and paper towels off the lids every time I need to clean them.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Taari said:


> The recipe for Josh's Frogs is 1/2 cup POWDER to 2/3 cup water. That is enough for 2 cultures to be filled 3/4" thick give or take. That beaks down to 1/4 cup POWDERED media with 1/3 c. water per culture, which results in 3/4" of media in each cup. I think my problem is too much moisture due to lack of ventilation. I already own packages of 50 32 oz. deli cups with non-ventilated lids that I got for another purpose, so I may as well use them, I just need to adjust my methods.
> 
> I'm going to use scilicone to attach fine tulle to the lids, which will allow alot more air movement, and possibly enlarge the opening a bit as well.
> 
> Also, I'm a girl


Oops! Sorry about that. I understand it's a matter of adjusting your lid design for more or less airflow. That is actually why I suggested getting a couple of the properly vented ones first. Watching how your cultures run with a properly vented lid, will give you a baseline to aim for when you design yours.


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## RobR (Dec 24, 2011)

Definitely get the pre made lids as suggested and it wouldn't hurt to be making cultures every week as you said. I've found that if you don't over seed your cultures the lids stay fairly clean. I spray them with a diluted bleach solution and let them sit for a while before gently rinsing them out and they last a while.


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## Taari (Nov 6, 2012)

I do have one container that came from Josh's with a vented lid. It was the culture I ordered to start all mine. I find it dries out too much. I live in a very dry climate. Also, my containers are slightly different than the ones you can buy already vented lids for. I got them at Cash & Carry. I got some tulle at walmart tonight, I'll use a double layer and scilicone it to the lid over the hole. It should allow plenty of air flow.


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## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

Just use large canning jars and use two sheets of paper towels for the lid while still using the metal twist/seal part. 

If it dries out, use more water next time. I usually add enough water/vinegar mixture to make it like applesauce. If needed you can add glycerine to keep moisture. 




Taari said:


> I re-use my cups and lids, and I always scrub them with hot water before starting a new culture. I'd like to use something that is re-usable instead of having to peel off nasty bug-covered hot glue and paper towels off the lids every time I need to clean them.


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## zBrinks (Jul 16, 2006)

Taari said:


> I do have one container that came from Josh's with a vented lid. It was the culture I ordered to start all mine. I find it dries out too much. I live in a very dry climate. Also, my containers are slightly different than the ones you can buy already vented lids for. I got them at Cash & Carry. I got some tulle at walmart tonight, I'll use a double layer and scilicone it to the lid over the hole. It should allow plenty of air flow.


 Keeping the cultures in a sterilite storage drawer will help maintain humidity. In particularly dry climates (or when the heater is running), it may be necessary to add a bit more water than is recommended.

I find that if you beach lids between uses, you can still easily reuse them. They're only 25 cents.


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