# Moss poles for Aroids



## BonnieLorraine (Jan 23, 2011)

I've been meaning to test this out for a while now to save space in the greenhouse, vines sprawling and rooting into other pots isn't the most efficient thing ever. Here are my first test subjects, the 5 gallon contains a 4' tall moss pole with 2 Syngonium macrophyllums, the two 2 gallons are 3 Epipremnum Cebu Blues and an Anthurium polychistum, and the 1 gallon is a Monstera siltepecana. My goal is to mount all of my climbing aroids and shinglers. I'm not sure if anyone here would be interested in building one, but if so I can take some step by step photos on one of the next ones.


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## nonliteral (Mar 26, 2012)

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'd love to see a step-by-step on how to build those -- that looks like a great idea!


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## ICS523 (Mar 10, 2012)

Cool! I wonder if a miniature version of this could work in a grow out tank?


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## BonnieLorraine (Jan 23, 2011)

ICS523 said:


> Cool! I wonder if a miniature version of this could work in a grow out tank?


That's what I was thinking


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

*Guys:* You are aware that allowing aroids to climb encourages the mature form?!?

Bonnie: have you tried coir poles or tree fern poles as well?


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## briley5 (Sep 27, 2012)

Groundhog said:


> *Guys:* You are aware that allowing aroids to climb encourages the mature form?!?
> 
> Bonnie: have you tried coir poles or tree fern poles as well?


At the risk of sounding like a complete noob (but I am where most terrarium plants are concerned), what dose that mean. I'm guessing not a good thing?


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## BonnieLorraine (Jan 23, 2011)

Groundhog said:


> *Guys:* You are aware that allowing aroids to climb encourages the mature form?!?
> 
> Bonnie: have you tried coir poles or tree fern poles as well?


It takes allowing a plant to climb at least 20 feet usually and many years for most Philo's to obtain mature foliage, it's incredibly challenging for most species. I don't think a plant growing two feet would be able to achieve that in a grow out tank. What I do know is that climbing plants have a shorter internode distance since they're not stretching looking for something to grab on to, which is much more useful for propagation. 

I have used tree fern poles before, I didn't like having to rip off the roots if I wanted to take a cutting >.<


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

briley5 said:


> At the risk of sounding like a complete noob (but I am where most terrarium plants are concerned), what dose that mean. I'm guessing not a good thing?



O--kay.... Seriously, yours is actually this an important question! You know how ya goes to Home Depot, or a Herp show, and get a Scindapsus pictus or Philodendron 'micans' in a 3" pot? That is the plant's baby form. Wnen aroids are young, they are not necessarily photoptropic--instead they grow sideways in search of the nearest tree (and this the form that can grow in the shady conditions of our homes). They climb their tree and as they emerge into the upper branches, they start to develop bigger leaves. In botanical terms, these are known as big-ass leaves:

Epipremnum aureum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Philodendron hederaceum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Monstera deliciosa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Syngonium - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now:
--see the difference in form of the Pothos' immature and mature leaves?
--The size of the Monstera leaves on the tree?
--the size and shape of the syngonium leaves on the tree?

As the mature, aroid leaves not only get much bigger, but they change form. (In some species, like _Monstera seltipecana_,_ Syngonium rayi_, _Epipremnum_ 'Cebu Blue' they also lose any nice bright color). As they climb, many aroids eventually lose their terrestrial roots and grow as big epiphytes! (Plants that begin life as terrestrials and eventually become epiphytes are known as *hemiepiphytes*.)

Now, of course, it takes quite a while for aroids to do this. But they all will do it if they like the conditions--and Bonnie's greenhouse seems like a pretty appealing place!

But go ahead, let 'em climb... Please, if you want leaves you can wear, even if you're a healthy chick, go ahead, let 'em climb...

But--watch these first:

FEED ME SEYMORE - LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS - YouTube

Voodoo Vore - YouTube


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## briley5 (Sep 27, 2012)

Wow that was informative. Thanks for all the links, I never new they got that big. Ive had some of my pothos for 10 years or more and they get big and need to be divided I never new that was there potential. Thank you.


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

I have seeds of a Rhaphidiophora on the way that aren't currently in circulation much here. I might have to germinate them in a set up like this


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

BonnieLorraine said:


> It takes allowing a plant to climb at least 20 feet usually and many years for most Philo's to obtain mature foliage, it's incredibly challenging for most species. I don't think a plant growing two feet would be able to achieve that in a grow out tank. What I do know is that climbing plants have a shorter internode distance since they're not stretching looking for something to grab on to, which is much more useful for propagation.
> 
> I have used tree fern poles before, I didn't like having to rip off the roots if I wanted to take a cutting >.<


Well, was not aware that your poles are only 2'. However, I have seen many aroids start mature form way shorter than 20', including _Syngonium podophyllum, S. wendlandii, Epipremnum aureum, Monstera deliciosa, M. seltipecana_, and yes, _Philodendron hederaceum_. It is true that most vivaria never accommodate this kind of growth, but greenhouses and conservatories can--and do:

http://www.exoticrainforest.com/atrium combined2 feb 12.jpg

How high are your greenhouse ceilings? Any interest in doing the above? I believe that if you planted any of the aforementioned plants in big pots with long poles, you would see mature growth in a couple of years.

Okay, maybe not like this:

http://reafforestation.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/scindapsus.jpg

But I've seen a few Epipremnum with leaves bigger than this laptop, and I assure you that they were not 20' long!

Q: So you think shorter internode distance is a result of substrate contact, rather than light intensity?
*
Full disclosure*: This is actually a sore subject with me. I have had #@!% aroids start mature form in one summer on our southeast porch; maybe NYC summers are that hot and humid! Can't even enjoy it: See, my big sister is a cat rescuer (we have 22 of the #@!* little $#@!&, and they're so incredibly #@!$ dumb, they do not stop chewing--ergo, no safe place to put em in the winter :-(). So any aroids I grow now are in a vivarium (Anubias, Alocasia) or in our Community garden (Colocasia, two Xanthosoma--the last two from the supermarket for .75c a tuber!). 

Which is another way of saying, if I had your greenhouse, why ever leave home?


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

Addendum to a previous post: A plant that begins life terrestrially and becomes an epiphyte is a _secondary_ hemiepiphyte (many aroids); a plant that starts in trees and grows roots to the ground is a _primary_ hemiepiphyte (classic example is the strangler fig). In these definitions, primary and secondary refer to life stages.


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## BonnieLorraine (Jan 23, 2011)

Nah, I plan on keeping mine small. My Sygonium at the grower's has been kept on a 3 foot pole for over 10 years in a very nice greenhouse with no problems, they just keep trimming it for propagation. I did however see that Brian's Tropicals had that Syngonium in the adult form, it's growing something like 30 feet up a tree to achieve it though (and I happen to think the juvenile form is much prettier >.>). I could easily see it happening in a conservatory, especially if you had them growing up trees, would have to be a really large greenhouse though, mine has an 8 foot ceiling, though the one at school is a 20 foot ceiling, 40' x 50' footprint. As for the internode length, I've noticed with shinglers especially they're incredibly leggy without support. I've grown Rhaphidophora hayi, pachyphylla, and celatocaulis in hanging baskets, and you wouldn't even recognize them as the same plant compared to ones with something to grow up. For example, my celatocaulis had around 8"-10" between nodes grown in a basket, compared to 2"-4" for one climbing something, so if I wanted to give someone a cutting with 2-3 nodes it was usually over 2' in length.


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## mordoria (Jan 28, 2011)

Hey! We never got the Step by Step on how to make these!!! Hook us up!!!


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## BonnieLorraine (Jan 23, 2011)

I've got two shows this weekend I'm vending at, I'll get pics and details for you guys next week when I get a chance to make some more


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## bobrez (Sep 10, 2011)

I like this idea Bonnie, looks like great way too grow  Thought id mention thou if youd like to use this in a viv with pets, should use something else in place of galvanized cloth. Which could leach toxics! Could maybe use alum screen or try "fibreglass mesh" like from craft store. I have loads of and could send ya some to try, its only 1/8 mesh thou


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

heavy gauge plastic mesh


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## mordoria (Jan 28, 2011)

Whats the post made from? PVC? Wood? Shouldent it be something that can hold humidity too?


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## BonnieLorraine (Jan 23, 2011)

It's a hollow cage filled completely with long fibered sphagnum moss, it's very humid


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## mordoria (Jan 28, 2011)

BonnieLorraine said:


> hollow cage


Awesome I get it all now!!


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## SteveG (Nov 29, 2013)

I'm thinking of trying something like this for my cham viv so I don't have to shove a small tree in it that'll over grow in no time. I'll just be able to take cuttings to control the growth instead.


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