# Philo micans Eaten by Isopods



## Smashtoad (Apr 27, 2007)

Just a quick FYI to everyone regarding P. micans, and micans only. 

I have a 5.5 gallon grow-out viv with a pair of mint terrors in it. The other day I realized (to my horror) that the Isopods and dubias I am feeding to the frogs are eating the micans in the tank. I believe it is mainly the Isopods. This has most likely been happening for three months minimium. As many of you know, Philodendrons are considered / known toxic to humans and dogs.

The frogs are growing, fat, and happy, and I regularly see them hunting the Isopods. I plan to add a "feeding station" for the feeder bugs to minimize this. But so far, the ingestion of bugs that have been eating micans seems to have no I'll effects on these frogs.

There are other organics in the tank for the Isos to eat if they wished, but they seem quite content to munch on Philodendron micans. I'm assuming their digestion is rendering the oxylates (sp) harmless.

Input and opining is welcome. But please, no breathless warnings to scare the children about the imminent demise of my frogs. I'm way past the stage of acute poisoning.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

I'm assuming...questionable I know...that you are nicknaming your terriblis as "terrors"...if correct, I'm asking about them eating dubias. I've been reluctant to give my group the nymphs...but would love to vary their diet if they will eat them...looking forward to your response...and advice as to just HOW large they can be to feed them out.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Judy S said:


> I'm assuming...questionable I know...that you are nicknaming your terriblis as "terrors"...if correct, I'm asking about them eating dubias. I've been reluctant to give my group the nymphs...but would love to vary their diet if they will eat them...looking forward to your response...and advice as to just HOW large they can be to feed them out.


If it will fit in the space between their eyes then any phyllobates will eat it.
They always attempt larger prey than any other pdf.


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## oddlot (Jun 28, 2010)

Do you have food in the tank for the isos,veggie scraps,bug burger,yeast.If not when they get hungry enough they will eat the next best thing of their choice.



Roaches store uric acid and should be fed in moderation.I used to give my mints roaches once in a while,but with them being nocturnal the mints rarely ate them unless it was when I first put them in.I then found full grown adult dubias scurrying around at lights out and had to pull them out (which was fun).


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

No wonder I can't even give you free dubias...they sorta creep me out too...have to use latex gloves when I have to handle the adults...I worry about them hiding and growing...and growing...yuck.
sorry for any hijack...


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## Pubfiction (Feb 3, 2013)

I think a lot of people have philodendron micans and I have not heard of any others complaining about isopods eating it. Seems more likely the roaches are eating it and the damaged portion of the leaves it providing fungus or something for the isopods.


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## mfsidore (Oct 10, 2012)

What's a Mican? Are they always in tanks? Do they make frogs toxic?


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## Jeremy M (Oct 19, 2012)

What's led you to believe that it's mainly the isos that are doing the damage? have you directly observed them eating from a fresh, undamaged leaf? What does the damage look like?
I would think that if either of these two are the culprit, the roaches would be more inclined to eat a live philodendron than isos. The most apparent reason is that isopods are generally quite fossorial or subterranean creatures and prefer decomposing litter over live plants, let alone a plant whose leaves are in the air (or are they, in your case?) while I consider dubias to be more generalists and roamers. From my dubia colony I know that they're quite content devouring pretty much everything organic and plant-like I offer and are not shy about climbing onto precarious places to get to it- eg., if I place a leaf of lettuce in the tank upright, i'll often find several roaches feeding from the very top of the leaf after they've climbed up the stalk. They're the ones to prefer fresh food over older food and will abandon an old food source if a fresher one is added to the tank. (the old food piece then goes to feed my isos  )

Also quite important- you didn't mention which species of isopods you have in the tank. There are great behavioral differences between different species of isopods, and some may be more inclined or not capable of what you have mentioned (ie, the difference between costa rican purples to dwarf whites to mexican oranges).


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## Michael Shrom (May 20, 2004)

I've raised lots of different kinds of isopods and put them in planted tanks. I haven't observed any of the isopods eating live plants.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Seconding the request for more info. What type of isopod(s) do you have in the viv?
I've done a bit of work with some of the isopods in the hobby. I'm firmly of the belief that dwarf white, dwarf purple, and dwarf gray/striped isopods are harmless to plants. On the other hand, I have observed giant orange isopods eating live leaves off of live plants, on multiple occasions. There are also many other reports, here on Dendroboard, of giant oranges feeding on live plants. Generally, this is in tanks where:
1) There is no leaf litter, or not enough leaf litter, and the hobbyist is not feeding anything to the microfauna. If you are starving your bugs to death, they will try to feed on live plants rather than succumb to a forced death sentence. 
2) The population of giant oranges is getting out of control. Time to trap and drown some of the adults. Put a small, 2 or 4 oz deli cup nestled down into the substrate. Fill it only 1/2 way up with water. Put a healthy pinch of fish food in. Make sure they can climb in easily. In a few days, empty out the dead, stinky mess and reset the trap. Repeat a few times until the population of adults is knocked down. This does seem to attract MOSTLY giant oranges but may kill a few whites and purples. Dwarf gray/striped seem to be attracted to water traps, too. Springtails will remain completely unaffected as they float.

I cannot comment on roaches. My wife is pretty understanding of all my creepy-crawlies, but the first roach that I brought through the door, would probably have me going out that same door!


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## Michael Shrom (May 20, 2004)

I only see the term "giant orange isopod" on dart frog sites. Is it just a new name for "Spanish orange isopod"?


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Michael Shrom said:


> I only see the term "giant orange isopod" on dart frog sites. Is it just a new name for "Spanish orange isopod"?


I believe they are the same.


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