# Planting Ferns onto backgrounds?



## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

I am planning to make a titebond 3 method background for my Insitu vivarium. For those not familiar, this is a background made up of (in my case) tree fern fiber, peat moss, and wood glue. As part of planting I wanted to know if anyone has had success planting a background with ferns. I have a couple rabbits foot ferns, some lemon button ferns, and some fluffy ruffle ferns. I was thinking of taking the ryzome and wrapping it in a bit of dried long fiber sphagnum and then pinning the whole thing to the background. I am planning to mist daily (maybe more?) Could it work?


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## gjcarew (Feb 20, 2020)

minorhero said:


> I am planning to make a titebond 3 method background for my Insitu vivarium. For those not familiar, this is a background made up of (in my case) tree fern fiber, peat moss, and wood glue. As part of planting I wanted to know if anyone has had success planting a background with ferns. I have a couple rabbits foot ferns, some lemon button ferns, and some fluffy ruffle ferns. I was thinking of taking the ryzome and wrapping it in a bit of dried long fiber sphagnum and then pinning the whole thing to the background. I am planning to mist daily (maybe more?) Could it work?


Hey, I didn't know you post here as well! I've seen you on the Planted Tank forums. 

Rabbits foot fern is epiphytic and pretty bulletproof, but I've had trouble with any non-epiphytes. I also haven't been able to get good moss growth on a titebond background. You might run in to trouble with the Boston fern and the lemon button fern as without moist substrate they can dry out pretty quickly and they don't like that. The titebond just doesn't hold on to moisture well, even if you mist frequently. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

gjcarew said:


> Hey, I didn't know you post here as well! I've seen you on the Planted Tank forums.
> 
> Rabbits foot fern is epiphytic and pretty bulletproof, but I've had trouble with any non-epiphytes. I also haven't been able to get good moss growth on a titebond background. You might run in to trouble with the Boston fern and the lemon button fern as without moist substrate they can dry out pretty quickly and they don't like that. The titebond just doesn't hold on to moisture well, even if you mist frequently.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Thank you! Much appreciated! I am just starting a vivarium so I am pretty new to this forum.

Is there another type of background that looks good and is better for planting/moss growth?


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## Tijl (Feb 28, 2019)

In my experience the best is fernroot. Hygrolon comes in 2nd.


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Tijl said:


> In my experience the best is fernroot. Hygrolon comes in 2nd.


Do you mean treefern or tree fern fiber? I did a google search for fernroot and looked at some vivarium suppliers but couldn't find anything called fernroot.

If you mean tree fern, do you use it shredded or in panels?


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## jgragg (Nov 23, 2009)

Cracked cork mosaic works well for me with several species of _Microsorum_. The rhizome can "choose" from different moisture levels on the cork and the LFS. If it's too dry it stops expanding in that direction, if its too wet it sort of floats over it and doesn't grab on. If it's just right it grabs hold and sends out more runners.

The same background works well with some volunteer ferns that just come with commercial moss mixes.

I've never done a Titebond BG but back in the day I tried different variants of the Flevopol method (using concrete additives based on acrylic copolymers). Wood glue looks sort of like that to me. Mine all came out super droughty. No moisture retention at all, pretty much. Plus they really didn't stand up long-term to humid conditions. Titebond might do better with water but...it might still be better for drier vivs due to the crap water retention. Try the cracked cork, I say.

Good luck!


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

jgragg said:


> Cracked cork mosaic works well for me with several species of _Microsorum_. The rhizome can "choose" from different moisture levels on the cork and the LFS. If it's too dry it stops expanding in that direction, if its too wet it sort of floats over it and doesn't grab on. If it's just right it grabs hold and sends out more runners.
> 
> The same background works well with some volunteer ferns that just come with commercial moss mixes.
> 
> ...


I hadn't heard of cracked cork mosiac but I am planning something sorta kinda of like it anyway. Instead of using silicone or greatstuff to hold the cork in place I am going to use the titebond media (in my case a 50/50 mix of sphagnum peat moss and tree fern fiber). It looks like I might be able to achieve my desired result by then stuffing/pinning/attaching by some means dried sphagnum inbetween the cork bark to create a wet place for plants to grow. I'm going to give it a go and see how it turns out. Either way it looks like cork bark is pretty important. Glad I still have some left.


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## stevenacres (Jan 20, 2020)

Also depends on the plant. I don't think a lemon button fern will quite work. There are ferns that need straight up substrate (maidenhair, lemon button, button), and some that are fine to grow on surfaces/epiphytically (rock ferns, rabbit's foot, microgramma.)


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

stevenacres said:


> Also depends on the plant. I don't think a lemon button fern will quite work. There are ferns that need straight up substrate (maidenhair, lemon button, button), and some that are fine to grow on surfaces/epiphytically (rock ferns, rabbit's foot, microgramma.)


Thank you this will be helpful when picking new plants! Any favorites for backgrounds that don't get too big? I have 2 rabbits foot, thinking I might end up with more, but open to other suggestions. The rock ferns look big? the microgramma, couldn't find something that looked like a fern but I didn't dig super deep either.


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## gjcarew (Feb 20, 2020)

What I do for the terrestrial ferns is wrap the root ball in PET fabric then wedge it in to gaps. I've gotten maidenhair and lemon button ferns to grow well like that.

Bolbitis and microsorum (java fern) can also do well as long as your humidity is high. It's a tossup whether or not they will make it through the transition, this can be avoided if you buy tissue cultures. One of my favorites is the bolbitis heteroclita difformis, which has a lovely delicate fern leaf shape and doesn't grow too fast. Kangaroo paw ferns are nice epiphytes but can get kind of big. As long as you can keep it moist, selaginella species (I have uncinata) should also do alright. 

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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

gjcarew said:


> What I do for the terrestrial ferns is wrap the root ball in PET fabric then wedge it in to gaps. I've gotten maidenhair and lemon button ferns to grow well like that.
> 
> Bolbitis and microsorum (java fern) can also do well as long as your humidity is high. It's a tossup whether or not they will make it through the transition, this can be avoided if you buy tissue cultures. One of my favorites is the bolbitis heteroclita difformis, which has a lovely delicate fern leaf shape and doesn't grow too fast. Kangaroo paw ferns are nice epiphytes but can get kind of big. As long as you can keep it moist, selaginella species (I have uncinata) should also do alright.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Making fabric pouches sounds like a good idea! I was thinking I could taking handfuls dried long fiber sphagnum, wet it, then tie it up around the root ball with cotton string. Then attach live moss to one side of the outside and kind of just jam it/pin it in place. I think I will do a combination of planting ferns and attaching them to the background and seeing what works for me.


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## jgragg (Nov 23, 2009)

> Instead of using silicone or greatstuff to hold the cork in place I am going to use the titebond media (in my case a 50/50 mix of sphagnum peat moss and tree fern fiber).


I may not be understanding this yet. What are you adhering the cork to? Something that a greatly weakened Titebond will still strongly adhere the cork to?

The reason I ask is, there will be some weight to this background. You'll be impressed with just how much moss you can pack in the cracks - its water-holding capacity is substantial, and is maxed out after every good soaking. Also, as plants fill in they add their own static weight. Finally, if you use some partial (1/4 to 1/2) cork rounds, you can (and should!) fill the voids behind them with a more terrestrial-suitable media (ABG-type or whatever) if you want the ability to plant something that needs a little "dirt", like some of the trailing begonias (e.g., _B. foliosa_) or whatever.

_You don't want your background sloughing off your hull_. Use a reliable chemical fastener, is my point. For the vast majority of applications, I suggest silicone.



> Kangaroo paw ferns are nice epiphytes but can get kind of big. As long as you can keep it moist, selaginella species (I have uncinata) should also do alright.


Agreed, on both points. I keep that _Microsorum_ in four very large vivs. It's truly a delight to let it do its thing, but its stature limits it to vivs no smaller than maybe 30" wide and tall. I've also got it in a couple 24" cubes but I keep its wooly runners pruned back to support only about 5 leaves at a time. It's not too fast a grower so that's easy to do. _Selaginella_ needs to not dry out, especially in the establishment phase. It goes crispy real fast if you miss some watering. (I also have _S. uncinata_.) It can also get up on you if you make it happy - can require some regular haircuts. Or maybe you will find you're one of those folks (there are many) who just can't get it to work. Kind of a weird plant, but worth getting to know and trying your luck.

Good luck!


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

jgragg said:


> I may not be understanding this yet. What are you adhering the cork to? Something that a greatly weakened Titebond will still strongly adhere the cork to?
> 
> The reason I ask is, there will be some weight to this background. You'll be impressed with just how much moss you can pack in the cracks - its water-holding capacity is substantial, and is maxed out after every good soaking. Also, as plants fill in they add their own static weight. Finally, if you use some partial (1/4 to 1/2) cork rounds, you can (and should!) fill the voids behind them with a more terrestrial-suitable media (ABG-type or whatever) if you want the ability to plant something that needs a little "dirt", like some of the trailing begonias (e.g., _B. foliosa_) or whatever.
> 
> _You don't want your background sloughing off your hull_. Use a reliable chemical fastener, is my point. For the vast majority of applications, I suggest silicone.


If you look up titebond method background you will see some folks talking about the type of background I am doing. Mine is 50% tree fern fiber, 40% peat moss, and 10% orchid bark. Hydrate the whole thing and then add titebond 3 wood glue. Mix it up good and put it down. I clearly have not had one for years but from reading threads from those that have made them, they hold up very well. I combined the crack corked method and the titebond method for this background. Meaning I added a LOT more cork then I was planning to so I can stuff plants between the cracks and grow moss on the cork. It is drying on it's back right now. Here is how it looked last night:


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I'm with jgragg on this. I don't see how a vastly diluted and weakened Titebond will permanently bond your cork to your walls. That is a job for silicone. 
If you still decide to go that route, You should consider skipping the sphagnum moss. When you stuff sphagnum moss into cork bark mosaic cracks, you need to really stuff it in there. You are relying on nothing more the sphagnum being _forcibly_ squeezed in there. I think that act alone may well pop much of your cork bark loose.
I think it's likely that pieces will fall off when you are trying to attach plants to them.

Here is another way of mounting epiphytes on walls. I made the video for orchids, but it works great on most smaller epiphytes.


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## minorhero (Apr 24, 2020)

Pumilo said:


> I'm with jgragg on this. I don't see how a vastly diluted and weakened Titebond will permanently bond your cork to your walls. That is a job for silicone.
> If you still decide to go that route, You should consider skipping the sphagnum moss. When you stuff sphagnum moss into cork bark mosaic cracks, you need to really stuff it in there. You are relying on nothing more the sphagnum being _forcibly_ squeezed in there. I think that act alone may well pop much of your cork bark loose.
> I think it's likely that pieces will fall off when you are trying to attach plants to them.
> 
> ...


Great video! I have used super glue with moss and epiphytes in aquariums so this makes a lot of sense to me. 

Anyway I am not breaking any new ground with this background. Its a method that has been around for years. I have no first hand experience with planting one but the folks that have seem pretty pleased with theirs.


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## Dr. Manhattan (Oct 28, 2016)

minorhero said:


> Pumilo said:
> 
> 
> > I'm with jgragg on this. I don't see how a vastly diluted and weakened Titebond will permanently bond your cork to your walls. That is a job for silicone.
> ...


Hi. I've used the Titebond 3 BG method many times. Mostly as drip walls or waterfalls in paludariums. My mix is coconut fiber, TB3, and Drylok tinted with concrete dye. I have a thread on here somewhere in which I made my own 300 gallon paludarium. I carved pink insulation foam and Loctite Titefoam. The background was indestructible. The bond between my underwater portion of glass and the liquid rubber waterproofing agent was not. This definitely not a good method for a moisture retaining BG, that's why I've only used it with some water flow streaming down it in one form or another. It works fine in a desert viv as well.


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