# 48g bowfront construction journal-UPDATED 1/04/07 (p.3)



## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

This is a quick construction journal of my cousins new 48 gallon bowfront viv that I am helping out with. I plan to have a rock waterfall, a foam background, a false bottom, and a pond. 

First I applied silicon to the back and sides where the foam is going. It helps the foam stick to the glass and blocks the white foam from outside view. 










Lots of thought has gone into this setup so far. I have decided where to put the waterfall/pond area and where to keep the land area. So I cut the plastic egg crate to size and cut some pvc pipe to hold the false bottom up above water level about a half inch. I also boxed out a corner with eggcrate and covered it with screen for a spot to access the pumps later if needed. Silicon was used to hold the pipe spacers to the glass bottom.










In this picture you see the false bottom in place and a little beach area I constructed with the eggcrate. I will be siliconing some rocks to this area.
You can also notice some pvc pipe cut on the pond side, this is to support the rock that will be used for the waterfall. It is a quite heavy rock! So the foam alone will not support it. When I set the rock in place it sits on these 2 posts so the foam will just be holding it in place..










Now you see the rock waterfall and the tubing is in the great stuff foam. Now this is just the first layer of foam and I did it with the tank vertical so I can get the rock just how I want it. One can of red Great Stuff used so far. It was a challenge to apply the foam with the tank standing up.










After waiting 24 hours and the first layer of foam is dry, I then laid the tank on its back and added 2nd can of foam with some small peices of drift wood stuck in there. You can see in this picture at the bottom I used silicon to glue some gravel and some bigger river rocks to block the view to under the false bottom. Who wants to see pvc pipes and eggcrate? Well I know your not gonna see much down there, it should always be very dark under the substrate.










Now I have added another can of foam and a few more small pieces of driftwood. I also made a support for the cover of the access to the water pumps. I wrapped it in plastic and stuck it into the foam while it was still tacky. I will be able to remove the cover from the foam after the foam dries (because of the plastic) and the cover will be held in the back corner by the foam










Now this pic shows the tank on its back while im glueing the forest bed to the foam.










And the finished background.










Here I used a razor blade to cut the excess silicone and peel it off the glass. I planned to cover the whole side in foam, but I had a change in design. First I cut along the foam edge, then scraped all the uneeded silicone.










This pic shows the pebbles I glued to the beach area with silicone. It also shows the bigger rocks I glued to the land edge to hold in the substrate.










While applying the foam, I took advantage of this spot behind the rock used for the waterfall. It was just big enough for a 4 inch pot. I foamed around the pot, this will make a good spot for what ever low growing plant we choose to put here. 










This is the first time I added water since the start of construction. The waterfall has a nice flow with the 2 pumps. There is a bit of a splash which keeps the glass wet, also keeps half of the false bottom wet. 










(EDIT: p.2 half way down for more pictures)


So now I am waiting for the substrate(leca) and some broms and a few plants from Black Jungle Terrarium Suply. Were getting close...I can feel it!

Please feel free to comment or ask questions.

-Frank


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2005)

my cousin who helped me build this viv introduced me to the dart frog world; and i must say it is great. i had no idea what kind of care the frogs need. and the type of viv we decided to keep them in took alot of imagination on my cousins part. so far we have put in several plants and moss; we will have a photo soon. we took a picture but it was too blurry. we don't want to put any frogs in yet. mainly because we want to be able to maintain the viv and make sure it is safe for the frogs. i am very new to this hobby and so far i really enjoy it.even though i must say i was too eager when i bought 4 pamilios from a pet store and they all died on me. one died at the pet store while they where trying to get it ; they were even trying to perform a type of CPR on the frog.i had a bad feeling about buying the other 3 but i ingored my instinct because i was anxious to have the frogs.we kept the other three in a temporary viv, but they died within three days.my cousin thought i would get discuraged but i did not.i am now more careful and am starting to do my homework.


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## Paul E. Wog (Jan 2, 2005)

All four died? :shock: I could understand one but four!!!! Sounds like a pretty sketchy petshop to me. I would look for another source for your next frogs.


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## Paul E. Wog (Jan 2, 2005)

Looks really good BTW, looking foreward to seeing it completed. Keep us posted.


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## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

The splashing onto the glass and false bottom is really not wanted, and can be controlled by using some well placed peiced of dried sheet moss. I got really good at this as an NAIB volunteer, fighting the contant battle against splash on the front glass... a good amount of the time the moss came back to life and made those areas look really natural!

You don't want it to keep splashing, it will keep your soil waterlogged not to mention mess up the look of the glass (especially if it leaves deposits)


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2005)

Wow... looks really nice. Are you going to put LECA on the eggcrate? Screen on eggcrate and then LECA on screen... then substrate on screen over the LECA?

Mac


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

ya paul.. It was a horible night. After the first one died,all the store owner said was "ya they're delicate frogs" and offered no warranty or help for that matter. The pums seems to be getting skinnier by the minute. The quarantine cage used had live vine plants and a small pool and hiding places. The frogs never jumped out of their containers used for transporting. They never attempted to eat. Only reaction I got from them was when misting they moved a bit. I could go on and on about how you should NOT buy from a uninformed petstore--but thats a whole nother thread in its own. I know If I bought the frogs from a breeder from the board, they would have been healthier to start with, and IF there was a problem, the breeder would care, and not just shrug his sholders :evil: :evil: 

Mac, Im not sure what to do about the substrate. I do have some leca on its way. Should be here today! WOoot!

Corey, Thanks for the tip of using sheet moss to stop the splashing- Ill have to try it. Sounds like a better alternative to using rocks :shock: 

The glass directly in front of the splashing is constantly wet, and stays clear. The rest of the glass stays condensed with moisture.

Were not set on which frogs to get yet, but I am leaning towards a group of leucs.

Thanks for the comments  

-Frank


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

One observation so far:

I noticed the water has gone through some changes. We started with bottled water. It was nice and clear at first. After a few days it got muggy and cloudy.. And now after a week its clear again. why :?: 
All the splashing makes a lot of bubbles on the surface of the water- I dont know if this is a bad thing. do you :?: 

Thanks - Frank


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## atomic_gnar (May 11, 2005)

hey looks great reminds me of my tank when i was making it. YEa the water will turn goldish due to the minerals and stuff from the substrate.... i feel it gives a more natural/realistic look. :lol:


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## Guest (Dec 28, 2005)

40zDicTator said:


> One observation so far:
> 
> I noticed the water has gone through some changes. We started with bottled water. It was nice and clear at first. After a few days it got muggy and cloudy.. And now after a week its clear again. why :?:
> All the splashing makes a lot of bubbles on the surface of the water- I dont know if this is a bad thing. do you :?:
> ...


The cloudy water was most likely a bacterial bloom and it has subsided wich is why the water is clear now. I wouldnt say the bubbles are a bad thing its the constant water logging of the substrate that should worry you. a small section of plasitc window screen placed at the base of the fall will also help to "break" the water.

Matt


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## Paul E. Wog (Jan 2, 2005)

40zDicTator said:


> ya paul.. It was a horible night. After the first one died,all the store owner said was "ya they're delicate frogs" and offered no warranty or help for that matter.


That's rediculous!!! :evil: I recently went to a store called pets inc. here in the valley for the first time. They litterally have everything imaginable there. anyway, they have a really friendly, knowlegeable DF guy there and he told me that they usually give a 2 day garantee but since I lived so far away (over an hour) that he would extend it to a week. I thought for sure that he was going to say no warenty but was plesently supprised. I will now definatley be a repeat customer. anyhoo, my point is, look for a place like that. Also, DF breeders are the best because they really care about all of their DFs. I got my first frogs (leucs) from AZDR.com. HTH, good luck.


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## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

I wouldn't get PDFs from a petstore period. Get them from people who breed them, they know all the background information on them that you should know, and are also a valuable resource for information. Its hard to beat the knowledge of some of the big breeders in the community, some like AZDR have been at it for 10 years!


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## Paul E. Wog (Jan 2, 2005)

Yeah, most of pets inc.'s stock came from AZDR anyway. the guy at pets inc. new all of the bloodlines that his frogs came from and new a great deal about DFs, so I would have to say that they are definately one of the few stores that actually does care about their animals and are the exception rather than the rule. under most circumstances I would agree that the best place to get your DFs from would be a breeder.


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## Guest (Dec 29, 2005)

8) i decided that i will buy my frog directly from a breeder. that way the frogs aren't moved around so much.


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## Guest (Dec 29, 2005)

there is a reptile convention in san diego in a few months and i might get my frogs there and meanwhile i can keep a close eye on the viv. we have a 48 gallon tank and would like to have between 4 to 6 frogs in there. we are looking for frogs that best get along togeather.


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## Paul E. Wog (Jan 2, 2005)

chicoxlr said:


> we are looking for frogs that best get along togeather.


It's crazy leucs aren't even my favorite DFs but I find myself constantly recomending them. So once again go for the leucs if you want a group. I here terribilis do well together too. Beyond that I am not sure what other types do well in large groups. HTH


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## twisner (Jul 7, 2005)

tricolors and auratus are 2 other species that are good for beginners and do well in groups.
And vents too, if you want to try a thumbnail.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

The leca has arrived :twisted: 










Waterfall pic with moss and a brom.










Full tank shot, planted. There is a plant (Begonia Ragah) in a pot right in the middle of this pic, Im letting it grow a bit before I transplant it to the leca. I have added 3 Guzmania 'Theresa', and 2 Guzmania 'Hannah' broms to the background. (and one unknown brom) 










Thanks Corey, I moved some moss to where the water lands/splashes, and the splash has been tamed somewhat.

Ya guys,, Im thinking leucs.. the boldest, hardiest frog to keep in a group.. 

Thanks for the water bacteria info, Matt.  


HEres a pic of the Selaginella erythropus 
Kinda blury, but I like the plant.










Hope you enjoy  

-Frank


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Junior approves  

-Frank


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## Guest (Dec 30, 2005)

thanks for your suggestions paul and twisner, since this is a new viv and i've lost 3 pamilios my cousin and i are leaning twards adding 4 leucs.we dont plan on adding dfs for a few months so we'll take that time get to know the viv and the dfs we will be adding.mean while we are also looking for the perfect lighting.. :idea:


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## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

Galacs are another good group frog to think about, unfortunately not much seem to be around. They are very awesome frogs tho! They also are pretty active all over the tank like leucs.

The moss and splash will probibly be something you'll always be messing with lol. Add a little moss here, adjust the moss there... if it starts coming back to life that will also help control it. Might want to try java moss or one of the similar plants (Ricca, willow moss) that are aquatic types that can be grown in wet splashy conditions.


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2004)

Nie looking viv, what type oflighting do you have? Mosses need pretty strong light, and I would recommend CF.

Ryan


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Ryan said:


> Nie looking viv, what type oflighting do you have? Mosses need pretty strong light, and I would recommend CF.
> 
> Ryan


 I started a thread to see what people thought about lighting... We are goin to get CF but not sure how many watts or who to buy from. http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=12210

I havnt responded to the thread, Im still thinking lol. Great info though.. I love this place :wink: 

-Frank


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Chico.. Hows the vivarium doing? Plants looking good?

I been working now for 3 hole days and havnt seen your viv since last year! lol

-Frank :wink:


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2006)

there is no moss thats dying and its sprauting alot, the fern looks healthy and ive opened the top yesterday bacause ive notinced a white moss grownig other one part of the moss that is in the corner and always damp, im not got to touch it though. ive sprayed evervthing with the tank water and am watching over it every day. i plan on doing this just every so often. i just am taking so long on geting my camera.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

I really need to go to Chicos house and get a fresh picture of the viv. Its looking really good-growing a bit.. And has 4 D.leucomela frogs running wild in there. They are very active frogs and very bold. 

Oh ya, we we went with a Current Orbit USA 192 watt compact fluorescent light with 1 10,000k and 1 6,700k bulbs--with moonlights.
With the stands/legs that came with the light, it doesnt heat the vivarium much at all. Pictures to come soon, as soon as I get over there with my camera.

Everytime I go to Chicos houes, I stare inside the vivarium for pretty much as long as Im there. The leucs are awesome! and the plant life in there is always changing.. The tricolor tilandsia is turning red toward the tips, and the unknown brom (from wallmart) is shooting pups. The moss is growing some wild weed looking sprouts.. Moss is grown all over the wet rock.... yep.. gotta take pictures.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

I visited with Chico tonight and brought my camera. None of the leucs were out, it was bedtime allready, but got some updated pics of the vivarium-over 5 months of growing.
We have some random sprouties.. must have came from the moss. 
A couple broms are pupping, and one tillandsia is flowering. 
The aquatic plants are doing great, theyre growing high above the water.

So far-A happy vivarium 8) 

Frank


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## Jordan B (Oct 8, 2004)

Very nice!


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## c'est ma (Sep 11, 2004)

Beautiful! Stunning! I could stare at it for hours too.

--Diane


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## Guest (May 18, 2006)

that VIV is amazing. It looks so naturalistic its unbelievable.


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## biocmp (Mar 7, 2006)

That really is a beautiful tank! Where did you get the moss on the ground and on the rocks? It looks like a keeper. (I didn't say creeper)


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## Guest (May 18, 2006)

First post; i am a newbie; awesome viv; thanks for the play by play on construction with pics; it helps out tremendously for us who are new and want to start;


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## Frogtofall (Feb 16, 2006)

The updated shots are very nice. It looks as though your bromeliads are getting too much moisture, at least from the pictures. I thought I saw a few rotting leaves and such. Any idea whats going on there?

Otherwise, the grow-in looks awesome. Nice work.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Thanks to every comment...  

Frogtofall, I too believe its too moist in there. Its not from misting too much, Its just a sealed lid with a lot of water movement makes for a lot of humidity. The Flukers digital humidity guage said 95% all the time before it stopped working.
I am working on another bowfront the same size, and just planted it yesterday(see soo to be viv =oD thread) and I installed fans on the top of the new one. After I see how it works, Ill do the same or similar to Chicos vivarium (its easier to experiment at my house).
biocmp, I picked up the moss from Ebay. I got a huge amount for $30 shipped. I used this stuff in a 48g 37g 29g and a 10g, and had some left. I had a good selection of vendors too, just type in "live moss" in the search and youll find something. 

Thanks again for all the comments!

Frank


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

The Vivarium is 1 year old now....























































I love how the Selaginella erythropus has grown - its such a deep red and dark green. 









and what is this plant? It grew from the moss I think...









Enjoy


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## Dendrobait (May 29, 2005)

Wow lookin good! Did you plant the small leaved plant cascading down from the upper left?


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## Paul E. Wog (Jan 2, 2005)

Very nice, What is the red plant on the bottom in the second to last pic?

*Edit: Nevermind, maybe I should start reading a little more* :roll:


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## joeyo90 (Nov 5, 2006)

very nice


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Today this vivarium was given to me! My cousin Chico has taken great care of these frogs for over a year now and he is now moving away for school and doesnt want to worry about the frogs while hes home visiting. 

Lucky me! This is my favorite vivarium that I have made. And now its mine for free! 

Dendrobait,, that vine coming down from the top left is creeping fig.


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## Curt61 (Jan 16, 2007)

Wow you are lucky, if you can't find a place to put them I'm sure I can find a place  That is a very nice looking viv.


Curt.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

This vivarium is over 2 years old now. I am offering it up for sale, but I cannot come up with a price. Shoot me a PM if your interested, include your offer. Keep in mind it comes with the 2x96w compact fluorescent light fixture, 2 water pumps, 4 leucs, and everything inside the 46 gallon bowfront. Waterfall works flawlesly. I hear calling from at least one of the leucomelas. No stand.

PM if interested.

-Frank


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Please disreguard that last post, I am not selling this thing. The original owner, Chico, passed away one month ago and now this vivarium means even more to me than ever.

Almost 3 years now, Id like to show how its grown. Heres a short video:
YouTube - 46g bowfront leucomelas vivarium

I lost one of the leucs, maybe from agression or somehow escaped when I was feeding, not sure where he went, but there is only 3 now. I never noticed a problem with any of them. 
I have pulled 2 clutches of eggs now, and have 2 tadpoles growing. Wooo HoooO!

-Frank


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## boogsawaste (Jun 28, 2008)

Tank looks awesome. I have a 46g bowfront that I've been waiting for the day to resurrect. They look like they make such nice displays.


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## gretchenellie (Aug 7, 2007)

it has grown in beautifully!

is there a way that you could get a few head on pictures?

sorry about your loss


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## Cohazard (Apr 15, 2008)

this is a gorgeous viv, and this build thread serves as an inspiration for when I build my first one.

It was pretty crazy reading through from the begining, and reading Chico's posts.

Sorry to hear he has passed, I send my condolences.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Thank you very much, Cohazard and gretchenellie. He was an awesome man, and is missed by many.

Heres a couple updated pics:


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## iridebmx (Oct 29, 2008)

hey ive seen this "somewhere" else! you definetly provided me with some good pics.i love the bow front too so i got one myself!i went with a 36 gal though i will get a bigger one maybe 72 gal later .i want something small and easyer to maintain for now. i posted this under ( 36 gal bowfront......my first) check it out tell me what you think


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## S2H5287 (Sep 7, 2006)

like the vines drapping down and around the tank. Looks cool, and i love looking at leucs. so no complaints there. Cool bowfront


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

sweet frogs!!


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## geckoman2 (Oct 30, 2008)

Awesome viv and great construction photos for those who are starting to use the great stuff and driftwood.

Thanks


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

Sweet thanks for the kind comments!


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)




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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

nice looking leucs!


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

I had to do a restart on the plants in this vivarium since I lost the light fixture. Now I have a new fixture/bulb and some new plants.. here are some pictures


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

I reported a few posts back that I had some eggs. That post was in 2008. I believe I only got 2 eggs to go all the way through morphing. And they stopped breeding. 

Well I had unplugged the waterfall pumps towards the end of 2010. They remained unplugged for about 6 months and I recently plugged them back in. The change in moisture must have really set these frogs off! Now I have many many eggs / tadpoles and a couple froglets from this 2.1 trio. Im pulling eggs every week. These frogs are from early 2006 so that makes them over 5 years old.


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