# Jewel Orchid/Macodes petola setup question



## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Hello all,

First, I promise I searched and read a lot on the forum before posting. I just wanted to double check I'm doing everything right. I know this isn't the rarest plant in the world but it's by far the most expensive one I bought for my first viv. Had to mail order it since I couldn't find any in town. So I'd really like to not kill this one.

I found this thread extremely valuable and am trying to follow the advice therein: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/plants/94417-help-macodes-petola-dying.html

So I got my plant priority mail today. Rushed home to pick it up - it was supposed to be 70 degrees all week but the forecast changed - it was 50 when it got delivered, and now it's snowing. The package seemed to be in good shape, the plant was in a 2 in. pot inside a baggie with a bunch of wet sphagnum that had gotten all over everything. It got delivered about noon and only sat on the porch about 30 min.

So I took the plant out, rinsed off the sphagnum with RO water. Then I put it in a 4 in. pot with NE Herp mix (similar to ABG) and a thin layer of sphagnum on the top (as thin as I could make it). It's planted very shallow to try and keep the leaves from touching the wet sphagnum - the roots kind of run horizontal to the leaves so they're just barely in the sphagnum. Then I gave the sphagnum a good misting, gently blotted the leaves dry with a paper towel, and put it in a tray with dome over it, under a CFL lamp.

I did NOT cut the roots off as some suggested because I was afraid of stressing it out. Also, there's not much stem under the leaves, so I'd be somewhat afraid the stem might not have enough length to plant. The roots are substantial though, maybe bigger than the leaves. Sorry I didn't take a picture of the bare-rooted plant.

So here's how the plant looks now:



And here's the tray I have it in, with my other "backup plants" I haven't put in the vivarium yet. All the plants in here have been doing great - I've just been misting them individually every couple days.



My biggest concern at this point (other than whether I should cut the roots off or not), is the bigger leaves have a few sections where it's translucent. I tried to capture that in the pictures below. I considered cutting these off - the smaller leaves underneath appear to be in better shape. I was just worried about stressing the plant out too much all at once, and there's not a whole lot of leaves to begin with, so if I cut off those bigger ones there won't be much left.





Does this look good or did I do anything glaringly wrong? I'd appreciate any feedback or advice anyone cares to provide. My plan going forward at this point is give it a couple days, monitor how these translucent spots on the leaves are doing, remove the leaves and dust the exposed cut with cinnamon if they get much worse, possibly remove the roots if they aren't doing well, then once the thing gets nice and rooted, transport the plant including top sphagnum layer into a part of the viv that doesn't get too much mist.


Thanks,
Thane


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

I've been working with these guys on and off again for a couple of years. They can be pretty easy, but also turn on you quickly.

Those blotches look to me like mechanical damage of some sort -- bruising from transport maybe.


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Thanks - I didn't think it wouldn't be disease - I bought them on ebay and the seller had really good ratings. I doubt they'd risk sending diseased plants out. But who knows what happens in shipping. I kind of wish I had ordered multiple, but I've only got room for 1 in my vivarium.

I'll plan to continue monitoring the leaves for the time being and hope the translucent/brownish areas don't spread. If I can't get this one to thrive I don't know if I'd order another online. I would at least wait until it turns a little warmer or might just have to beg some local nurseries to order some for me.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

Yeah, as long as the leaves aren't constantly wet, and you keep the substrate relatively moist / don't let the roots dry out, you should be fine. I had two small plants that were in my viv with my azureus that were doing really well and actually bloomed. And then they got trampled by the frogs lol. Now I'm trying to grow it on the windowsill.

You'll see two things happen as it grows. 1- As it grows and gets taller it'll sort of fall over; it sort of has a trailing growth pattern so don't be alarmed. 2- the older leaves with discolor, turn tan, and fall off; this seems normal so don't be alarmed lol.


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Thanks - that's a good heads up. That's kind of weird it slumps over after a while, that definitely would have been a head scratcher. 

From my limited plant knowledge most plants like to go the other way and get "leggy." I have a few surprise plants that have sprouted up so far, I left one in but the other I could tell was trying to get all the way to the top of the viv, just one big stalk, so I pulled it out. It turned out to be from a slice of potato I had stuck in there for the springtails.

My vivarium is fairly well ventilated and I am hand misting so I will stick this thing somewhere it can dry off. That's what I am currently doing with the 3 tillandsia I have in there - they all get completely sprayed 2X/day and dry off completely in a couple hours. I wish I could mount it epiphytically on some driftwood I have in there but I read these like to have roots going sideways so I can't just jam it in some crack.

Thanks again for the advice - seems to be a lot of little tips on these plants, I just tried to combine all the different stuff I read into the temporary setup pictured above.


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## BrainBug (Aug 25, 2010)

I agree with hypostatic that it could be mechanical damage, it could also be because it was too wet, especially if it was out in the cold for to long. I've also seen aphids and mites do damage to isolated spots on leaves.

It's one of those rare orchids that will do better planted in the floor of the viv as opposed to mounted. Ventilation also does not seem to be an issue with these guys, they take off in my 10g horizontals with all glass tops. The light does not have to be to bright as they grow on forest floors and would naturally be getting dappled light. Watch out for pests, they all seem to love jewel orchids, especially slugs.

I grow them in vivs and domes like that both covered and uncovered and the ones in the vivs definitely take off faster.

Just curious, are you planning on putting the ferns, mimosa (would definitely not recommend that one), and other plant (pilea?) in the viv too?


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Wetness might have been an issue, it was sent priority mail so 2 days rather than overnight, and was in a tied off plastic bag and the sphagnum moss it was sent in was pretty well waterlogged and had gotten all over the inside of the bag.

I soaked all the other plants in a 5% bleach solution before putting in, so hopefully I won't have any slugs. Reading on the forum those looked like a total nightmare to remove once they got introduced. I was planning on doing the same to the jewel orchid before putting in the viv, I just want to get it healthy first before I go dunking it in bleach.


The other plants in the tray are:

Mimosa/Sensitivity plant - I am not planning on sticking this in the viv. after I found out they grow thorns on them. I got a little excited and got several plants that weren't suitable for vivariums. Returned all but this one because I really wanted to keep it. It's getting really big though and needs to be repotted.

Autumn fern - I have one of these in my viv and really love it. It wasn't doing to great initially, was in a spot where it was getting overwatered, so I moved it and it's doing good now, putting off new growth every day. I got this one for backup though since I could only find a couple of these in town.

Rabbits foot fern - this one's doing find, I got sent this as a substitute for the Korean Rock fern I ordered that was out of sdtock. I didn't put it in because the rhizomes kind of freak me out on this. I like the leaves a lot though. Will stick this in if some other plants die off, otherwise will put in a planter.

Pilea aquamarine (I believe) - this is another one I ordered that ended up being out of stock. Found this at a garden center last week so I'm planning on sticking this in there somewhere.

Here's some pictures of my vivarium if you're interested, planted 3 weeks ago but uploaded some newer photos including plant list last week: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/beginner-discussion/228497-70-gal-display-cube-feedback-appreciated-2.html

Thanks again for the feedback,
Thane


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## JPP (Mar 25, 2015)

thane said:


> I soaked all the other plants in a 5% bleach solution before putting in, so hopefully I won't have any slugs. Reading on the forum those looked like a total nightmare to remove once they got introduced. I was planning on doing the same to the jewel orchid before putting in the viv, I just want to get it healthy first before I go dunking it in bleach.


I haven't used jewel orchids in a viv yet myself, but I've read that orchids are one of the plants that are too sensitive for bleach dipping.


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## rvsur (Dec 13, 2010)

thane said:


> Thanks - I didn't think it wouldn't be disease - I bought them on ebay and the seller had really good ratings. I doubt they'd risk sending diseased plants out. But who knows what happens in shipping. I kind of wish I had ordered multiple, but I've only got room for 1 in my vivarium.
> 
> I'll plan to continue monitoring the leaves for the time being and hope the translucent/brownish areas don't spread. If I can't get this one to thrive I don't know if I'd order another online. I would at least wait until it turns a little warmer or might just have to beg some local nurseries to order some for me.



I ordered mine from what I imagine is the same seller on ebay in freezing temps. It seems like yours had a rougher trip than mine did since I didnt have the same issue with the sphagnum. I thought I had pictures of how they arrived, but it looks as though im mistaken. I got mine on March 5, and some of the leaves when I first got it developed similar discoloration. From what I can tell it was because of the leaves staying too wet. Since putting in a tank fan to circulate the air a little better, the plants appear to have gotten much better. I've included some photos of how they look now.


This first one is planted in ABG mix I purchased from NEHERP. It is located directly beneath the vent in the tank.



This next one is about 3-4 inches further away from the vent. It is sitting directly in the layer of sphagnum that is beneath the leaf litter.


I halfheartedly tried to keep the leaves from touching the substrate when I planted them, but the rambling growth of the plant made that a short lived battle. So far I haven't had any problems with the substrate causing discoloration in the way the dampness did at the beginning.

With that said, this all may be dumb luck because theyre doing significantly better than the other type of Jewel Orchid I put in.

I hope yours bounces back, they're really beautiful.


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Thanks for the info and the pictures. I'm a little jealous yours look nicer, but I still think I can get mine back into shape. Just might take a while.

Like you, I had some issues with the leaves touching the substrate. I think because my plant was shaped a little wonky. So I took it out of the larger pot and put in a 2 inch pot so that the leaves could hang over the edge.

But the bigger leaves had the brown spots on them from the bruising and when I misted them the water would collect in a few places on the leaves. The spots weren't really getting any bigger, but there were healthier leaves underneath so I cut off the 2 bigger leaves with more spots on them. I'm hoping this will promote growth for some of the smaller, healthier-looking leaves. You can see there's a new leave in the center of the stalk emerging also. So I think at this point the plant isn't diseased, I just need to be patient and let these smaller leaves get bigger.

Question - did you cut off the roots before putting it in your tank? I had read some people suggest this to stimulate root growth. The plant I got has a pretty large root system in relation to the plant, but not a lot of space under the bottom leave to cut them off, so I left them on.

Here's some new pictures:

With the big leaf on, showing the smaller leaves hiding underneath:




Closeup on the big leaf:




Current state, after I cut it off (put some cinnamon on the cut portion). Hopefully now that the small leaves are exposed they'll fan out a little bit to get more light. Not a very attractive shape right now:


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## rvsur (Dec 13, 2010)

thane said:


> Question - did you cut off the roots before putting it in your tank? I had read some people suggest this to stimulate root growth. The plant I got has a pretty large root system in relation to the plant, but not a lot of space under the bottom leave to cut them off, so I left them on.


I actually didnt do anything to the roots when I got them. I know someone said people dont wash them in a bleach solution, but I did. Thats about the only prep I did for these guys, I just put them in and hoped they didn't die. 

I assume if you're seeing a new leaf though that the plant still has hope and is doing ok. I guess only time will tell? Keep me updated!


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## lincolnerickson (Oct 7, 2011)

I just wanted to add that these plants are very resilient. I have one eaten down to a 3" stem with no leaves/roots and even slug bites out of the stem come back to life. 

As long as part of the stem looks healthy, don't throw it away. If everything goes wrong you can strip off all remaining leaves, cut of the rotten parts of the stem and try and root what is left. 

I have had surprisingly small parts of jewel orchids come back to life after slug attacks.


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

lincolnerickson said:


> I just wanted to add that these plants are very resilient. I have one eaten down to a 3" stem with no leaves/roots and even slug bites out of the stem come back to life.
> 
> As long as part of the stem looks healthy, don't throw it away. If everything goes wrong you can strip off all remaining leaves, cut of the rotten parts of the stem and try and root what is left.
> 
> I have had surprisingly small parts of jewel orchids come back to life after slug attacks.


Thanks Lincoln - I considered trying to do something with the large leaf I cut off, but there was barely any stem on it and what little was there was kind of brownish. Do you think I could have done anything with that? And with the roots, there's like 3 main branches coming off, about an inch or so long each - do you think I'd be able to get anything out of one of those? Not sure what the minimal amount of plant required would be. Just curious if that's something I could try. Otherwise I'll probably just leave it alone as is.


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## lincolnerickson (Oct 7, 2011)

I don't believe it will root from a leaf cutting. The stem ideally should have three leaf nodes but it is worth trying with any size. Here is a picture from Wild into Suburbia










I don't believe the roots will propagate a new plant. 

Also, just to be clear on terminology. My understanding might be off on this so anybody chime in if I have something wrong. The part of the Jewel orchid that grows along the ground is called the rhizome. The rhizome will send up stems. These stems are what the leaves grow out of. Here is a good image from Aquatic quotient









With all that said, both stems and rhizomes should root easily. Even small portions of them.


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Thanks again - the visual helps. I've never had a great green thumb, so working with cuttings and doing anything other than sticking a plant in some dirt is a little beyond my comfort zone. But I think I'm learning slowly and really enjoying the plant part of this hobby. Which is kind of a problem because you can only stick so many plants in a tank, so now I have an urge to get another tank just so I can buy more plants. But step one is to not kill this jewel orchid.

Thanks again to you and others for your support and advice on this.

Thane


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Update for all of you who have just been on pins and needles.

The jewel orchid is doing well now. It was looking pretty sad, the leaves bruised in shipping kept getting worse, until there was only one healthy leaf (one of the smaller, underneath leaves in the above pictures), and the curled up leaf that hadn't emerged yet. SOOOO I just cut them all off except the one. Put cinnamon on the cut portions to seal them off and prevent disease. Figured I might as well stick it in the big vivarium since it had better lights in it. Cut the large root portion off, leaving only a small root/stem. Put it in some sphagnum at such an angle that the stem/root ran horizontal (saw this recommended in one thread) and that water would not sit on the leaves. Made sure the leaves were not touching the substrate. Been giving it a light misting twice a day, dries off within about an hour. 

The plant appears to be doing great now. I took the larger root portions that I cut off and put them in some sphagnum in a pot with ABG mix underneath, been keeping that moist to see if I can get the roots to generate another plant but haven't seen anything emerge yet.

Here's a picture:



The leave at the top of the photo is the one that hadn't emerged yet, that unfolded last week. So I think it's looking good. Thank you all for all your help. I've been extremely impressed by the amount of plant knowledge on this forum and as a person with very little plant experience, getting this thing back to good health was a big victory for me. Now just need to get my lawn in shape....

Thanks again,
Thane


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## Drewbacca (Apr 5, 2014)

Wow, that is great! Ive been tuned into this thread to see your progression with this plant. About a month and a half ago, I had acquired a small cutting of this as well that has a couple of small leaves that are just folded up. It hasn't shown In anyway to be dying, it just hasn't really gotten any better. What is the rate of growth that you are experiencing?


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## thane (Sep 11, 2014)

Thanks Drew - I'm not sure how you'd measure growth rate in a plant, but I guess you might call this a slow grower? Just looking at the timestamps above, it looks like it took a month for the rolled up leaf to unfurl all the way. The big leaf in the picture from yesterday was about half as big a month ago (it's one of the smallest ones on the bottom of the plant). I don't think I see any sign of another leaf emerging at this point. Also not sure what impact it might have had since I left the roots on for a couple weeks then cut them off. I'm not very knowledgeable on plants but I think they can choose to focus new growth on leaves or roots or both, so there might be some trade-off there, not sure though.


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## Drewbacca (Apr 5, 2014)

Awesome! Yeah, so far I've taken this to be a slower growing plant. I don't have very much knowledge regarding jewel orchids. In the past, I've put other cuttings of this type in abg mix and sphag, inside of a plastic bag greenhouse. They took of that in that type of setting. Didn't really track growth rate at the time. With the new cutting, I just put it in the viv substrate. It is fine it seems, but like you describe, it has been a slow process so far.

-Drew


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