# Polygem-zoopoxy



## Azurel

JoshH posted a link to this product and looking to see if there is any experience working with it.

I am looking to possibly try the EZ-sculpt modeling/sculpting putty,#307 FR Lite Flex, or the Vine Maker 60. I am really interested in upping my background making and interested in others experiences using this product.

Any info would be great.....


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## Judy S

I think if you browse through the construction threads, you will find a couple of posts about those products...from maybe a year or so ago...I don't know whether the search function would be that specific, but worth a try first.


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## Azurel

Judy S said:


> I think if you browse through the construction threads, you will find a couple of posts about those products...from maybe a year or so ago...I don't know whether the search function would be that specific, but worth a try first.


I did search it....Nothing describing the process of using it or tips or anything.

Was one by Dane but it was just pictures of a rock wall he made....

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## hydrophyte

Try looking through the posts by Duff. She made a feature or two with the clear coat epoxy.


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## Judy S

Gees...I'm new to the whole concept of "Google"--but just one inquiry for "Polygem" brought up a bunch of DB references to check out...thought I'd let you do the investigating...good luck. I've read that zoos use it...expensive, but can be made to look very realistic...


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## Azurel

Judy S said:


> Gees...I'm new to the whole concept of "Google"--but just one inquiry for "Polygem" brought up a bunch of DB references to check out...thought I'd let you do the investigating...good luck. I've read that zoos use it...expensive, but can be made to look very realistic...


Do you honestly think I haven't done that? I'm not stupid....But the info isn't specific to what I am looking for thus I wanted to ask for specifics....Thanks though.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Colin C

I've been using #307 for creating rocks/trees/backgrounds etc. for years now and would never use any other brand. I have not used any of the other products in the 'zoopoxy' line but would love to experiment with them. Hope this helps, I can go into more detail about its use/application if you'd like.


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## dartsanddragons

I have used this product many times, easy to work with, no nasty smell, 1000% safe non toxic, decent pot life, can be tinted/colored with pigment, a little goes a long way, dries rock hard, can be sanded, can be painted and I am sure I have missed something else this is a great product but I think the price scares people off but if you were to buy the 2 gallon kit " 1 gal A 1 gal B you could make a great deal of backgrounds, rocks or whatever. Buy it use it you will not be disappointed with it. I am going to get another kit soon to do a 36 x 36 x 72 and when I do I'll try to get some pictures. I think they still make smaller kits, this stuff is awesome but not cheap.


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## Azurel

Colin C said:


> I've been using #307 for creating rocks/trees/backgrounds etc. for years now and would never use any other brand. I have not used any of the other products in the 'zoopoxy' line but would love to experiment with them. Hope this helps, I can go into more detail about its use/application if you'd like.


Thanks Colin....I would appreciate more detail...

I am not sure which I want to work with yet but was leaning towards the sculpting putty and vine maker as I can create detail as I apply it. But was also looking at the 307 too....

When making branches do you apply to the whole surface at the same time or do it by sides? From what I have read the 307 is more fluid then the sculpting putty which I think would be hard to do all sides of a branch. As well I am sure you tinted it first but did you paint it afterwards? I have painted Drylok rocks but the acrylic paint over time seemed to wear off from misting.

When you make the rocks, I assume out of foam do you carve the intricate details first or leave that for after the application? It looked like it was quite plyable for awhile to do fine work.

Do you have any threads? I searched here and other sites not much specific info alot of the threads showed what they made but notbthe process during creation or how they applied....I just want to get an idea before I drop $400 on this stuff....So once I get it I am hitting the ground running not wasting or making big mistakes and have to tear out the viv...

Do you make everything outside of the viv and then glue it in? The rock walls or rocks I have done in the past was GS foam applied in viv then carved and coated with Drylok all in viv.

They turned out great but not sure if this product is applicable for that type of application... most of the builds on other sites were done outside the tanks(fish) then glued down.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## dartsanddragons

You can use the sculpting putty, apply by hand, shape it to the desired look, let it dry paint it afterwards or tint it as you go. I have used Sacrete concrete tints from lowe's works great, you can even apply the putty overhead with no issues


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> I have used this product many times, easy to work with, no nasty smell, 1000% safe non toxic, decent pot life, can be tinted/colored with pigment, a little goes a long way, dries rock hard, can be sanded, can be painted and I am sure I have missed something else this is a great product but I think the price scares people off but if you were to buy the 2 gallon kit " 1 gal A 1 gal B you could make a great deal of backgrounds, rocks or whatever. Buy it use it you will not be disappointed with it. I am going to get another kit soon to do a 36 x 36 x 72 and when I do I'll try to get some pictures. I think they still make smaller kits, this stuff is awesome but not cheap.


Thanks DandD....

I am looking to do a couple 18x18x24s rockwalls/rock piles and maybe a fake tree or branches....If I go with anything it will be the 2g kits...The 2qt prices are nice but would hate to get in the middle of a build and not have enough..

Have you used the sculpting putty?

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## dartsanddragons

I have used the putty, you really only need about 1/8" thick over great stuff, wads of newspaper with plaster cloth for surface and shape let it dry and sculpt away. I used to have many pictures in my album years ago but were all deleted at some point when the site was purged. You will love this product!


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## dartsanddragons

You could also coat the putty with a little coconut fiber so that moss could grow on it, the only real downside is when it dries it is rock hard and plants have a hard time growing on it


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> I have used the putty, you really only need about 1/8" thick over great stuff, wads of newspaper with plaster cloth for surface and shape let it dry and sculpt away. I used to have many pictures in my album years ago but were all deleted at some point when the site was purged. You will love this product!


Awesome... Thank you.....

I am used to sculpting with clay and getting detail that you can make out of it or in it. The putty seemed to be simular and what I was leaning towards....

If I was to carve a rockwall( applied in viv GS foam) and wanted to apply the putty over the top will it adhear to the glass or should I still use something like Gorilla glue along the edge of where it meets the glass?

Thanks for all the replys guys and gal....I appreciate it.


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## dartsanddragons

It will adhere to the glass with no problem, It's kind of like spreading peanut butter, but I don't think it tastes as good


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> It will adhere to the glass with no problem, It's kind of like spreading peanut butter, but I don't think it tastes as good


Is the sculpting putty that soft or you talking the 307?

In the picture on the site it shows a hand with like a ball of the product. Or could that be with applying the thicking agent?

Thanks for all of your replies DandD.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Dane

I have only used the regular 307 formula, but I will echo what others have said; fantastic. It requires a little more tooling than I had expected, but this gives more opportunity for fine-tuning your textures. I've used zinc oxide pigments for tinting, and Krylon fusion paints for coloring after application, both work well. 
I plan on experimenting with some natural additives (sand of varying particle sizes, coconut mulch & charcoal) next time I use it to hopefully emulate a little more natural surface with less work.


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## dartsanddragons

It is that soft, like peanut butter, you can add other stuff to the surface such as sand, soil, tree fern as long as it is still wet. Polygem also sells pigments for coloring as well or at least used to


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## Azurel

Dane said:


> I have only used the regular 307 formula, but I will echo what others have said; fantastic. It requires a little more tooling than I had expected, but this gives more opportunity for fine-tuning your textures. I've used zinc oxide pigments for tinting, and Krylon fusion paints for coloring after application, both work well.
> I plan on experimenting with some natural additives (sand of varying particle sizes, coconut mulch & charcoal) next time I use it to hopefully emulate a little more natural surface with less work.










dartsanddragons said:


> It is that soft, like peanut butter, you can add other stuff to the surface such as sand, soil, tree fern as long as it is still wet. Polygem also sells pigments for coloring as well or at least used to


Thanks guys ..gonna order a 2g kit this week....Can't wait to try something new...Kick my background building up a notch.

James

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Judy S

I never assume anyone is stupid...my apologies...but we know that there ARE people who post that don't do any searching...since I was short of time, just pointed out that posts were listed and if you tried them, the posters here on DB might be the members who have made vivs using those products--as I had seen them some time ago. Obviously by the number of posts you've made, you may have seen the same vivs...apologies again...


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## Azurel

Judy S said:


> I never assume anyone is stupid...my apologies...but we know that there ARE people who post that don't do any searching...since I was short of time, just pointed out that posts were listed and if you tried them, the posters here on DB might be the members who have made vivs using those products--as I had seen them some time ago. Obviously by the number of posts you've made, you may have seen the same vivs...apologies again...


No problem Judy....no need to apologize.......Thank you though for trying.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## pa.walt

judy was only trying to help. in your original post you never mentioned you did a search. you just asked for information. she might not imply you are stupid but I will.


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## Judy S

Hopefully you will keep a visual record of each step...if the build looks do-able for interested people who love making the backgrounds...it would be worth the expense...I haven't noticed anyone else using these high end products lately so would really enjoy the show...


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## Azurel

Judy S said:


> Hopefully you will keep a visual record of each step...if the build looks do-able for interested people who love making the backgrounds...it would be worth the expense...I haven't noticed anyone else using these high end products lately so would really enjoy the show...


That is my plan.....Hopefully atleast enought detail to help answer some questions....

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Azurel

Azurel said:


> I did search it....Nothing describing the process of using it or tips or anything.
> 
> Was one by Dane but it was just pictures of a rock wall he made....
> 
> sent from my Galaxy S lll










pa.walt said:


> judy was only trying to help. in your original post you never mentioned you did a search. you just asked for information. she might not imply you are stupid but I will.


Take a look at the first quote there pa.walt....That's me saying I searched it....so I guess you know what you can do with your opinion....Thanks though for your insight...

Once I get the the product I will start a build thread....

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Colin C

Building rocks with this product is very similar to other methods. I like to use pink or blue sheets of insulation foam siliconed together. I prefer this foam over great stuff because of how dense and solid it is, allowing for a much greater level of carving detail, which will be reflected in the final product, also you can apply the epoxy in thinner layers and still achieve total coverage. I then add zinc oxide pigments and a couple handfuls of play sand (for rocky texture) to the mixed epoxy and apply it to the foam structure in about a 1/8" thick layer and let it sit for about half an hour. At this point the epoxy has become stiffer and more putty like and I can go back in and add more details with various tools or stamps. After about 24 hours or whenever the piece has fully cured I paint it with several coats of watered down acrylic paint. Here are some pictures of a build I did a couple years ago featuring epoxy rocks attached to a tree fern background. This is one of my favorite background combinations.








years (and several re-plants) later:









Here is a background that is totally epoxy. I made the rocks individually, put them in position in the back of the tank and filled in around them with great stuff. I them carved down the great stuff and covered it with a layer of epoxy I had tinted a tan color, as it cured I added sand and gravel to give it the appearance of an eroded rocky bank. 








Grown in:








As you can see plants and moss do grow on this stuff depending on what textures you have created with it, but growth will never be as fast/lush as with organic backgrounds. I have also created tree buttresses with #307 that have turned out ok but that I have never been fully satisfied with, I feel the E-Z sculpt would be a much better product for trees/roots/branches etc. I am about to begin building a large plywood tank that will a fully epoxy background, rock work with great stuff in between that will be covered in #307 tinted dark brown/black with tree fern fiber on top. I also plan on creating some large liana vines out of pvc pipes and either #307 or E-Z sculpt, I have yet to decide.


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## Azurel

Colin C said:


> Building rocks with this product is very similar to other methods. I like to use pink or blue sheets of insulation foam siliconed together. I prefer this foam over great stuff because of how dense and solid it is, allowing for a much greater level of carving detail, which will be reflected in the final product, also you can apply the epoxy in thinner layers and still achieve total coverage. I then add zinc oxide pigments and a couple handfuls of play sand (for rocky texture) to the mixed epoxy and apply it to the foam structure in about a 1/8" thick layer and let it sit for about half an hour. At this point the epoxy has become stiffer and more putty like and I can go back in and add more details with various tools or stamps. After about 24 hours or whenever the piece has fully cured I paint it with several coats of watered down acrylic paint. Here are some pictures of a build I did a couple years ago featuring epoxy rocks attached to a tree fern background. This is one of my favorite background combinations.
> 
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> years (and several re-plants) later:
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> 
> Here is a background that is totally epoxy. I made the rocks individually, put them in position in the back of the tank and filled in around them with great stuff. I them carved down the great stuff and covered it with a layer of epoxy I had tinted a tan color, as it cured I added sand and gravel to give it the appearance of an eroded rocky bank.
> 
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> Grown in:
> 
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> As you can see plants and moss do grow on this stuff depending on what textures you have created with it, but growth will never be as fast/lush as with organic backgrounds. I have also created tree buttresses with #307 that have turned out ok but that I have never been fully satisfied with, I feel the E-Z sculpt would be a much better product for trees/roots/branches etc. I am about to begin building a large plywood tank that will a fully epoxy background, rock work with great stuff in between that will be covered in #307 tinted dark brown/black with tree fern fiber on top. I also plan on creating some large liana vines out of pvc pipes and either #307 or E-Z sculpt, I have yet to decide.


Awesome man....Thank you for sharing...I had already planned on it but that cements it...

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## VivariumWorks

Azruel:

Once you've had some hands on time with the Polygem stuff, pm me. I've got something I've been working on for a while now that you'd be in the non-biased position to compare/contrast for me that I'd send your way. Need some independent thoughts on it.


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## Azurel

VivariumWorks said:


> Azruel:
> 
> Once you've had some hands on time with the Polygem stuff, pm me. I've got something I've been working on for a while now that you'd be in the non-biased position to compare/contrast for me that I'd send your way. Need some independent thoughts on it.


No doubt...I will do that for sure...I have 5 builds in my near future that need to be done....Will contact you once I get my hand on this stuff and working it.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Azurel

Got my zoopoxy ordered.... Good thing is they are out of Chicago so hopefully it can get here by friday or so....If it does I can start a build thread or just use this one.....Which might be a good idea since if someone searches polygem or zoopoxy it will come up....

Excited to get started.... Will post a picture of what I have gotten done so far...


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## Azurel

Here is the start of my build...


















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## Azurel

So the zoopoxy will be here tomorrow....Lucky for me they are less then 3 hrs away....So by tomorrow evening I will have hopefully laid down my first coat....

Here is the wall finished with a rough detail.


















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## Azurel

Got the zoopoxy today and started applying. Much thicker then I had imagined....Pretty cool stuff...

Will have to say a standard plactic spreader was a little awkward to get between the rocks with out kinda pulling putty from the rock on the otherside....But all in all I can't see me using anything else....This stuff is cool....









I think it looks decent but getting an understanding of how the putty is able to be worked and spread will be key....understand though it needs to be sanded and painted....Have a three day weekend so plenty enough time to really get at it.

If there is any other advice or comments please post...

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## dartsanddragons

If you wear latex gloves, wet your fingers with water and you can smooth it out, while it's wet of course. I had very little sanding doing that plus you can push the putty where you want it to go. And how about being able to work in your frog room with no nasty smell


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> If you wear latex gloves, wet your fingers with water and you can smooth it out, while it's wet of course. I had very little sanding doing that plus you can push the putty where you want it to go. And how about being able to work in your frog room with no nasty smell



Thanks....You know I thought about that after I started looked for my gloves which the package was empty...gonna go get some tomorrow....Great idea will come out much better....

Yeah the lack of fumes and smell is a huge plus...one reason I got away from silicone....Thanks bro for the heads up on that....

James

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Dane

It can be tooled while wet, as mentioned. I keep a spray bottle handy during application for smoothing, and you can lightly press in damp cardstock or crumpled cardboard to give a fractured rock texture.


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## Azurel

Dane said:


> It can be tooled while wet, as mentioned. I keep a spray bottle handy during application for smoothing, and you can lightly press in damp cardstock or crumpled cardboard to give a fractured rock texture.


Awesome that will for sure help tomorrow....Will have to sand a bit that I have now but tomorrow will do it that way instead and willing to bet a weeks pay check it will turn out more finished from the start....

Thanks guys for sharing...

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## dartsanddragons

you can also use the dry color pigment used for concrete, just use a damp paint brush lightly drag the brush with pigment across your work to create streaks in rocks or vertically to create tree bark look. What was the cost for the kit you purchased? did you get the 2 gallon kit? like I said you really don't have to put it on heavy a little goes a long way, you will have a lot of fun with this stuff


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> you can also use the dry color pigment used for concrete, just use a damp paint brush lightly drag the brush with pigment across your work to create streaks in rocks or vertically to create tree bark look. What was the cost for the kit you purchased? did you get the 2 gallon kit? like I said you really don't have to put it on heavy a little goes a long way, you will have a lot of fun with this stuff



Thanks...Yeah I can see this going far....It was $138 shipped for the 2 gallon kit....I almost got the 2qt but opted for the big kit...well worth it in the end...I have 5-6 builds that need to be built....so the 2 gallon was the best option long term.

I appreciate all the advice and tips. Hopefully this thread will help some one else that might or want to use zoopoxy...I will be taking more pictures tomorrow as I work it.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## dartsanddragons

I think I built nearly 20 backgrounds using that kit, when you do the math it's cheaper than silicone. I really don't know why more people don't use it, I guess the price seems high until you do the math. I have only seen it even mentioned a dozen or so times in the last 10 years.


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> I think I built nearly 20 backgrounds using that kit, when you do the math it's cheaper than silicone. I really don't know why more people don't use it, I guess the price seems high until you do the math. I have only seen it even mentioned a dozen or so times in the last 10 years.




Yeah I hadn't heard of it till it was mentioned the other day in the other epoxy thread....Once I looked it up and what you are capable of doing with it and talking to you guys, it was a no brainer.

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## VivariumWorks

I think a large part of it is that a lot of people aren't comfortable with their carving/sculpting abilities. I know mine are pretty bad. I couldn't get to even the point you are at. (Which looks great!) So I think that's a part of it, but it's also that people are wary of using anything "new". Everyone wants to err on the side of caution when it comes to chemicals around their frogs and I can see people sticking with silicone due to its ease of access (Lowes/HD) and history/ubiquitous use. BUT, you can get infinitely better results with epoxy when used properly and take the time. (Or coax an artistic girlfriend to sculpt it for you, as I use to. LoL) 

Zoopoxy has some cool stuff, just make sure you use their products that don't contain nonylphenol. Check the B side of the MSDS. They have some that do. It's a nasty chemical used as an epoxy filler and catalyst. It's quite toxic to marine life and as a true catalyst it remains unbound (chemically) in the epoxy matrix and can leach out into your build. Nonylphenol has been banned the UK for years, but the US still uses it by the tons and as a result very few US based epoxy products don't contain it. And is one of the reasons why I decided to formulate my own without it.


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## dartsanddragons

The only product that I have eve used was the sculpting putty which is safe for our a applications. I can't speak as to the safety of the other products they sell, I can't wait to see what you come up with. I am sure in the right size packaging your product or Zoopoxy would be more appealing to a lot of users that don't want to spend that kind of money on a product not knowing that it will work for the application.


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## Azurel

Ok so I got to work today and laid it down....Using gloves and wetting them with water is/was far better method then using a spreader...

Here it is as it sits curing. And the second rock is sanded down from yesterdays work.









The sanded rock...










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## Dane

The sanded stone looks very natural. Are you going to add any paint?


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## Colin C

VivariumWorks said:


> So I think that's a part of it, but it's also that people are wary of using anything "new". Everyone wants to err on the side of caution when it comes to chemicals around their frogs and I can see people sticking with silicone due to its ease of access (Lowes/HD) and history/ubiquitous use. BUT, you can get infinitely better results with epoxy when used properly and take the time. (Or coax an artistic girlfriend to sculpt it for you, as I use to. LoL)


The Zoopoxy line of products have been around for many years but they only made online ordering available recently. I feel this is because most of their business is with zoological institutions that would be ordering very large quantities.


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## Azurel

Dane said:


> The sanded stone looks very natural. Are you going to add any paint?


Thank you...I thought so too...Honestly better then I thought it would.

Yeah that is my plan....I seen a video on youtube on how this guy makes model train backgrounds. What he would do is take acrylic paint and thin it out in a spray bottle. Then spray the rocks down and let how the paint water naturally ran down them. 

The groves of the rocks would get highlighted and be darker then the other parts of the rock. Then come back with different colors...They looked great and really natural...Might do that first then dry brush some detail...

One thing I did to is the first rocks I dis were just straight 307... then I tinted most of the rest with black which made it a darker gray...I took some of that and smeared a little on the brown rocks...Will look pretty cool I think.

I am using a belt sanding belt to sand it down and some drywall sanding mesh. They are really doing a good job on it....I am really happy with this stuff and the future possibilites for future bulids...

I will try and remember to take pictures of what sand paper and mesh I am using so others can use it as something to look at if they use it.



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## Azurel

More updates coming along with pictures....

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## Azurel

Ok first coat of paint sprayed on the rocks...










Once the waterbis dry it wont look shiny...



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## Azurel

Here is some of the stuff I used...

New prograde 60 grit sandpaper..This has a sticky rubber backing.










Prograde course sponge









Gen. purpose 60 grit sandpaper..I had known I about the prograde paper I would have used the regular stuff.









Med. Grade sponge the sponges are good for sanding the first layers of epoxy.











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## Azurel

Then I also used some drywall mesh. It worked but was used up quickly..










Out of all the sanding products the 2 prograde were by far the best...The sand paper hardly lost any grit even under heavy sanding...The sticky back was nice that your fingers didn't slip and you could fold it without any slipping...

I applied the paint as I suggested in a prevous post.

More to come...

sent from my Galaxy S lll


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## Azurel

Rocks are finished....now on to the second stage.









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## Azurel

Brushed on the gorilla glue and adding the sphagnum peat...will give the vining plants something to grab on to...



















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## CJW

Looks great. I love this stuff, so easy to mold and it holds textures and even large items like driftwood or rocks extremely well. Latex molds dipped in water are really fun tool for this too. And brushes that were already used and hardened. Oh and wet paper towell... This material is used very frequently and in large amounts in zoos and aquariums.
Only complaint: stick to, but does not seal onto glass at all. Water will just slide right through the cracks unless you're really clean on your edges and good with silicone.


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## Azurel

CJW said:


> Looks great. I love this stuff, so easy to mold and it holds textures and even large items like driftwood or rocks extremely well. Latex molds dipped in water are really fun tool for this too. And brushes that were already used and hardened. Oh and wet paper towell... This material is used very frequently and in large amounts in zoos and aquariums.
> Only complaint: stick to, but does not seal onto glass at all. Water will just slide right through the cracks unless you're really clean on your edges and good with silicone.



Thank you...and thanks for sharing.

I quit using silicone awhile ago since all of my builds are done in the center of my frog room I can't deal with the fumes. I have switched over to using gorilla glue if I have glue anything down or cover a background.

A latex rock mold might be nice...might have to make or find one of those.....

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Azurel

Here is the rockwall finished....now moving on to the cork mosaic.










Some detail of a few of the rocks..


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## Azurel

From the side....


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## frogparty

The cork mosaic is really going to set this off!


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## Azurel

frogparty said:


> The cork mosaic is really going to set this off!


Yeah I though so too....wasn't sure what I was going to do but put a couple pieces up there and was like that is it.....


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## Dendro Dave

Yay! ...cork mosaic, so easy.... so nice.

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/pa...-mosaic-living-drip-wall-pond-method-how.html


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## rigel10

I apologize for my ignorance, but I do not know this stuff. What is the difference between Polygem Zoopoxy and GS or other foams?


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## pa.walt

the gs and foams are used for insulating your home and people use it for their vivs.
zoopoxy looks like cement/concrete. did this explanation help you any.


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## Azurel

rigel10 said:


> I apologize for my ignorance, but I do not know this stuff. What is the difference between Polygem Zoopoxy and GS or other foams?


The polygem zoopoxy along with the other lines of products used for exhibits and animal in closures are a 2- part plastic epoxy. It hardens almost rock hard....Great Stuff is an expanding foam in a can....as pa.walt explained.


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## Azurel

Partial cork mosaic added and made some root structures...Just need to add sphagnum.


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## rigel10

Thanks all. Unfortunately we do not have this stuff here.


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## Azurel

All roots have been added ....now just the cork mosaic and sphagnum.


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## Azurel

Sphagnum has been added to the mosaic....other side will be done tomorrow. Then planting will be done.


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## frogparty

What are you going to use for plants?


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## Azurel

frogparty said:


> What are you going to use for plants?


A bunch of vines, shinglers, some philodendrons....couple Neoregelia Harpo....will post names later once I make my final choices.


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## Azurel

Ok tank background is finished...just need to plant....


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## kitcolebay

Looks great James! Love the detail! Awesome work on the rocks!

-Chris


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## Azurel

Here it is planted.....











If there is any question or comments about the polygem zoopoxy use don't hesitate to ask.


----------



## Azurel

Test..... My post are not showing up...


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## frogparty

Test: I see your post


----------



## Azurel

frogparty said:


> Test: I see your post


They are on my phone but not on my PC....its like its stuck at page 7.....cool...Thanks for letting me know.


----------



## Dane

Azurel said:


> They are on my phone but not on my PC....its like its stuck at page 7.....cool...Thanks for letting me know.


Had the same problem with this thread earlier, looks to be cleared up now. Great looking finished product!


----------



## Azurel

Dane said:


> Had the same problem with this thread earlier, looks to be cleared up now. Great looking finished product!


Thanks Dane

thank you for the help and advice using this stuff....It is much appreciated.


----------



## Medic1

Not meaning to bring up an old thread, but I really want to use this stuff in my new build. I plan on doing the rock face look. One question I have is, when sanding, do you let it fully cure before sanding? Or do you leave a little tack in it when sanding? Also, I plan on using diluted acrylic paint to give the "cracked" look. Is there any need to seal it afterward or would it be good to go?


----------



## Azurel

Medic1 said:


> Not meaning to bring up an old thread, but I really want to use this stuff in my new build. I plan on doing the rock face look. One question I have is, when sanding, do you let it fully cure before sanding? Or do you leave a little tack in it when sanding? Also, I plan on using diluted acrylic paint to give the "cracked" look. Is there any need to seal it afterward or would it be good to go?


Yes I let it fully cure other wise its tacky and won't sand. I sprayed mine with a hand sprayer with diluted acrylic and let it run down and off the rocks which gave it a more natural look. I did many coats to get it colored. I didn't seal it and the color has stayed put. I have a new build that I did another poly-gem zoopoxy rock wall.....The new build I did not sand. If you use water and keep the polygem wet it almost works like modeling clay.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Azurel

Here is a couple new ones I did yesterday.

















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## edaxflamma

I was wondering if applying the epoxy to individual non-attached pieces like this would be a good option! I have been putting together some GS foam blobs to carve into rocks which I would then cover with the zoopoxy. I still haven't gotten the shapes that I want though.

Do you hit your GS with a heat gun prior to applying the epoxy?


----------



## Azurel

edaxflamma said:


> I was wondering if applying the epoxy to individual non-attached pieces like this would be a good option! I have been putting together some GS foam blobs to carve into rocks which I would then cover with the zoopoxy. I still haven't gotten the shapes that I want though.
> 
> Do you hit your GS with a heat gun prior to applying the epoxy?


Nope dont hit it with anything....

Here is another










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## Azurel

Different angle









Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Azurel

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Medic1

Those rocks are killer. I definitely need to get my hands on some of that stuff. Thanks!!!


----------



## Azurel

New poreject...

Free standing rocks and a rock wall back ground.



















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## Azurel

Got some work done on the new project...





















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## mirageknight

This work looks fantastic. I'm a complete newb with regards to this type of craft, but pretty excited about it. I've taken a long look at the different options and I think I like the look of this - I'm sketching out a mix of GS / cork bark / hygrolon plus rock work hardscaping with this Zoopoxy. This is a rather monumental jump from my previous straight up stock or treefern background. 

I'm getting going on a 36 x18 x18, and just ordered some of the #307. Two questions -


Pigments - any specific brand / type to recommend? There's a lot out there and I see mostly gel epoxy pigments. (oh, I see a reference to Sacrete concrete tints - I'll check that out too) (OR... do you not, and strictly prefer acrylic washes, sealant, etc)
Texturing pointers? I see a reference to crumpled paper/cardboard; any other go-to techniques for rock or bark specific to this product?

Looking forward to experimenting, and I appreciate any input!


----------



## Azurel

mirageknight said:


> This work looks fantastic. I'm a complete newb with regards to this type of craft, but pretty excited about it. I've taken a long look at the different options and I think I like the look of this - I'm sketching out a mix of GS / cork bark / hygrolon plus rock work hardscaping with this Zoopoxy. This is a rather monumental jump from my previous straight up stock or treefern background.
> 
> I'm getting going on a 36 x18 x18, and just ordered some of the #307. Two questions -
> 
> 
> Pigments - any specific brand / type to recommend? There's a lot out there and I see mostly gel epoxy pigments. (oh, I see a reference to Sacrete concrete tints - I'll check that out too) (OR... do you not, and strictly prefer acrylic washes, sealant, etc)
> Texturing pointers? I see a reference to crumpled paper/cardboard; any other go-to techniques for rock or bark specific to this product?
> 
> Looking forward to experimenting, and I appreciate any input!


I haven't tried any tints yet...But looking to try them out....So far only dark color acrylic paints have worked in tinting the zoopoxy. I tried a sandstone color and it didn't color it up much...The actual tints will work probably work better.

So far I have done acrylic washes and sprayed them down multiple times to get them tinted. Then I do some fine detail work. I have found you do not have to seal them. Atleast from my experience so far.

As far as texturing I have been using a couple small pieces of scrap GS that I liked the texturing it has made..I don't know of any stamps or anything that can be used.....but I have just found stuff around that I like...

I have not tried bark yet...

Hope that helps a little...

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Azurel

Here is the new project made...painting soon to come.


















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## Azurel

Started adding the paint wash









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## Medic1

All of these done with a two gallon kit?? That's nuts! Looks really, really awesome!


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## Azurel

Medic1 said:


> All of these done with a two gallon kit?? That's nuts! Looks really, really awesome!


Yup everything I have made in either this thread and or the build threads were out of a 2g kit.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## hydrophyte

These rocks have turned out really good!


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## Azurel

hydrophyte said:


> These rocks have turned out really good!


Thanks Devin

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## hydrophyte

What do you think about using the Polygem clear coat to seal up a log or stump to use as a feature in a viv?


----------



## Azurel

hydrophyte said:


> What do you think about using the Polygem clear coat to seal up a log or stump to use as a feature in a viv?


Im not 100% sure to be honest Devin. I don't see why it wouldn't work. It would seal it up and reduce or completely stop any rot....The thing I would wonder is if it dried real shiny....

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## mirageknight

Received the putty today; just mixed in some cement color (black) for a dark base layer (no problem, though sticky!) and laid down a first layer over some foam for a test go.

Here it is mixed for a darker grey. (can see the original colour a bit on the mixing popsicle stick)










Appreciate all the input on this thread, really helpful as I go along here knowing some approaches, timing of set, etc. I'm going to need some gloves to smooth things out, I can see.


----------



## Azurel

mirageknight said:


> Received the putty today; just mixed in some cement color (black) for a dark base layer (no problem, though sticky!) and laid down a first layer over some foam for a test go.
> 
> Here it is mixed for a darker grey. (can see the original colour a bit on the mixing popsicle stick)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Appreciate all the input on this thread, really helpful as I go along here knowing some approaches, timing of set, etc. I'm going to need some gloves to smooth things out, I can see.


Awesome....yeah dont forget to use water....water will give you the ability to smooth out the epoxy with out it sticking.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


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## Azurel

Here is a river rock water feature I made.....









I added some folius moss mix to get some moss growth between the rocks.


----------



## Azurel

Another project underway...

Will be using two different 2 part epoxy products on this one....

Here is the zoopoxy rocks I have made.


----------



## jakesfarm

Incredible details! They look just like honest to god rocks. After reading thru this thread I am seriously considering investing in some for a 75 gal peninsula style build for my leucs. Any experimentation with making logs or root structures with the epoxy? 

Great work again, very inspiring.


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## Azurel

jakesfarm said:


> Incredible details! They look just like honest to god rocks. After reading thru this thread I am seriously considering investing in some for a 75 gal peninsula style build for my leucs. Any experimentation with making logs or root structures with the epoxy?
> 
> Great work again, very inspiring.


Thanks ....I detail these all by hand. I have not tried to do a log or any type of wood yet....I just got some tools this past weekend that has upped my game in laying texture....I plan to try something out though.

It is worth every penny spent....

Here is one other one I did tonight..


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## jakesfarm

You've been prolific! I went and checked out the polygem site after seeing this thread, I'm seriously considering getting a kit. Did you get the regular or the lite 307?


----------



## Azurel

jakesfarm said:


> You've been prolific! I went and checked out the polygem site after seeing this thread, I'm seriously considering getting a kit. Did you get the regular or the lite 307?


I use the 307 lite.....


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## Azurel

First rock panel is near done....Just a few final details to do....But here it is.

The last 2 rocks were made with Vivarium Works 2 part epoxy...


----------



## myersboy6

How do you like vivarium works epoxy? I was going to order some from him for my current build.


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## Azurel

I like it.....it is very user friendly and is easy to use....it cures much faster then the other stuff I have used. So it is best to mix small batches as you go....One thing that is also nice about it is it can be worked on after it cures.....well worth getting.


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## myersboy6

Awesome that's good to know. So do you think it would be harder to apply in large applications then.


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## Azurel

No just that it cures so fast....I first made a baseball size batch to use....by the time I came back to get more there was a golf ball size portion in the center that started to cure and get hard....so now I make smaller batches as I go...I use a little water as well to help smooth it out and it seems to slow it down a tiny bit


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## myersboy6

Cool, I'm planning on building a root type background so it'll be interesting to see how it works when I try to apply it to an entire background at once.


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## wak4863

Hot damn I wish I would have seen this stuff a couple of weeks ago. I would have loved to use it in my builds. Oh well maybe next time.


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## myersboy6

I know right! ^^ I don't really like the silicone coco fiber method and it's cool that there is finally some last
Epoxy methods out there now.


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## VivariumWorks

Yea I'm working with professional artist right now to see about making a pamphlet to include with the epoxy that talks about how to use it best for the various applications. What techniques work well, what doesn't, and why.

Biggest issue for sculpting purposes is that it likes to set up fast. The sculpting was more a secondary application for the epoxy as it was primarily designed to be used for pressing into silicone molds in thin sections, pressed into crevices between rocks to glue them together, and as a thin laminate over foam (like how we use silicone). Thin sections require a faster/stronger set time to make sure that the epoxy is capable of generating enough heat to make it cure within a reasonable time. The backdraw is that it makes sculpting a little more challenging as small batches are needed. So it's a bit of a trade off. I'm hoping that with the techniques my artist friend comes up with and the things you guys all come up with, we'll be able to have a good set of resources to help newbies with this advanced technique.

One thing you can try is to put it into the fridge, not freezer, and see if that helps. Just don't let anybody confuse it for food. The lower starting temp might help give a longer workable sculpting time.


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## Azurel

VivariumWorks said:


> Yea I'm working with professional artist right now to see about making a pamphlet to include with the epoxy that talks about how to use it best for the various applications. What techniques work well, what doesn't, and why.
> 
> Biggest issue for sculpting purposes is that it likes to set up fast. The sculpting was more a secondary application for the epoxy as it was primarily designed to be used for pressing into silicone molds in thin sections, pressed into crevices between rocks to glue them together, and as a thin laminate over foam (like how we use silicone). Thin sections require a faster/stronger set time to make sure that the epoxy is capable of generating enough heat to make it cure within a reasonable time. The backdraw is that it makes sculpting a little more challenging as small batches are needed. So it's a bit of a trade off. I'm hoping that with the techniques my artist friend comes up with and the things you guys all come up with, we'll be able to have a good set of resources to help newbies with this advanced technique.
> 
> One thing you can try is to put it into the fridge, not freezer, and see if that helps. Just don't let anybody confuse it for food. The lower starting temp might help give a longer workable sculpting time.


Thanks Scott for sharing the info....

Once I figured out some of the nuances of it I haven't had any issues with it setting up to fast. I also now, instead of mixing and keeping it in a round ball as I use it, I now keep it in a more patty form which has seemed to help as well.

But every rock I make and sculpt I have an Idea going into sculpting so that has helped as well.

Its good stuff I will be using it in future projects......Here is another rock I have made with it for this next build...


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## JoshuaB

I'm totally going to try this for one of my next builds.


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## Azurel

Next one is done....


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## Azurel

Second to last rock done.....Added a little red to this one....This is made out of the vivarium works epoxy.


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## Azurel

Here is a simple mock up of the two panels I just made.


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## myersboy6

Looks good! I like the way the red rock turned out.


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## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> Looks good! I like the way the red rock turned out.


Thanks....I still need to sand it down a little bit and then paint wash it. But it turned out like what I had imagined....Which is hit or miss sometimes.


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## myersboy6

Did you use multiple colors or just one color


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## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> Did you use multiple colors or just one color


The polygem is the gray color the vivarium works is the colored stuff...


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## Azurel

Here is the first panel before and after


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## myersboy6

Dude that looks sweet. Throw some moss I'm the cracks and a few other plants and the background will look great!


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## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> Dude that looks sweet. Throw some moss I'm the cracks and a few other plants and the background will look great!


Thanks bro....that is the plan still a bit more work to do...

Here is a simple mock up of what will be the left hand corner of the build.


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## Azurel

Here is all the rocks colored up.....


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## myersboy6

That's awesome dude. Tons of ledges for all the frogs to climb on and everything. That's going to look great in a viv!


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## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> That's awesome dude. Tons of ledges for all the frogs to climb on and everything. That's going to look great in a viv!


Thanks bro....I appreciate the compliment


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## Azurel

Update....

Rock panels are done


----------



## Azurel

Well here is what I did this past week while on vacation....

Panels were siliconed in...I don't use silicone in my builds but in this case it was the best only real option....










Then I sprayed the rest of the background and covered with gorilla glue and peat.









Then I started to mock up the root structures...I used real skinny cork tubes.









I then finished those up and glued in....it was ready to be put in place...









Substrate and planting began









Here it is planted up....









After a couple days my paru trio was added....


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## myersboy6

Dude that looks rad! Well done!


----------



## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> Dude that looks rad! Well done!


Thanks bro....was a long 2 months.....I have had this tank as a fish tank or vivarium for 14 years or so....was kinda weird not having a tank in the living room for so long


----------



## myersboy6

Haha I know what you mean. I've been working on my viv for 4 months now! But that's cause I don't have as much time to do it anymore so I'm just doing a little bit here and there. 
What kind of frogs are those? Yellow terribilis?


----------



## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> Haha I know what you mean. I've been working on my viv for 4 months now! But that's cause I don't have as much time to do it anymore so I'm just doing a little bit here and there.
> What kind of frogs are those? Yellow terribilis?


No they are sylvatica "Paru"....


----------



## myersboy6

Right on. Those guys are cool


----------



## dart345

Thinking of picking up Zoopoxy, how is the clean up? I am concerned about any residue, by acccident, on glass and if it easy to clean up?

Also, are folks placing black silicone to cover the aesthetics of the back side? For a cleaner look?


----------



## Azurel

dart345 said:


> Thinking of picking up Zoopoxy, how is the clean up? I am concerned about any residue, by acccident, on glass and if it easy to clean up?
> 
> Also, are folks placing black silicone to cover the aesthetics of the back side? For a cleaner look?


Clean up is easy once it dries any residue can be cleaned up with a razor.....

I do not use silicone in my tanks if I don't have to....I use gorilla glue to glue the rocks to the glass.....I personally would rather use black contact paper on the outside of the tank.

Not many using it.....I read a bunch well as much as out there.....which didn't answer most of the questions....So I started this thread... in hopes to have more info in one spot with I hope more detail....


----------



## dart345

I have been on the fence about contact paper, I need to look more into, at first glance it looks tacky, but if it goes on smooth and stays on, I may just go with that. Saves me hassle anyways of using silicone


----------



## Azurel

dart345 said:


> I have been on the fence about contact paper, I need to look more into, at first glance it looks tacky, but if it goes on smooth and stays on, I may just go with that. Saves me hassle anyways of using silicone


There are different versions out there....The ones I have used when applied with care goes on smooth and no air bubbles..

It looks clean and covers equally...

The nice thing is it can be cleaned with a little soap and water or a little dust spray......

Plus its easily removed.


----------



## dart345

Curious if anyone used the vine maker, I can not find any links of folks who have tried and used that particular product.


----------



## dart345

#307 Lite - 2 Gallon Kit - Sculpting Epoxy Putty | Polygem Epoxy

i just purchased this one, I hope this is the right one, I did not purchase the Flame retardant one, I did not see it necessary.

Hopefully this will work for Rocks and background, I like to know if anyone used vinemaker though


----------



## Azurel

dart345 said:


> #307 Lite - 2 Gallon Kit - Sculpting Epoxy Putty | Polygem Epoxy
> 
> i just purchased this one, I hope this is the right one, I did not purchase the Flame retardant one, I did not see it necessary.
> 
> Hopefully this will work for Rocks and background, I like to know if anyone used vinemaker though


Yes that is the one I use....

I have thought about using the vine maker just havent pulled the trigger.


----------



## Bunsincunsin

Does anyone have a rough estimate on how far the two-quart kit of Zoopoxy would get me? I'm looking to do a small set of rocks and a branch/tree stump or two to fit in an area that's roughly 18" in diameter and 26" tall.

Would it be recommended to tint the base layer of epoxy, or will multiple layers of acrylic paint be enough to fully color a piece? I suppose it depends on the intended final color of the piece… I have seen several suggestions for tinting the epoxy base - such as zinc oxides and concrete tints - does anyone have a link to these? Once the acrylic paint has fully cured, is it quite durable or will it wear down and fade after a while in humid conditions?

Has anyone tried applying the Zoopoxy to polycarbonate or acrylic? Does it bond well?


----------



## Azurel

Bunsincunsin said:


> Does anyone have a rough estimate on how far the two-quart kit of Zoopoxy would get me? I'm looking to do a small set of rocks and a branch/tree stump or two to fit in an area that's roughly 18" in diameter and 26" tall.
> 
> Would it be recommended to tint the base layer of epoxy, or will multiple layers of acrylic paint be enough to fully color a piece? I suppose it depends on the intended final color of the piece… I have seen several suggestions for tinting the epoxy base - such as zinc oxides and concrete tints - does anyone have a link to these? Once the acrylic paint has fully cured, is it quite durable or will it wear down and fade after a while in humid conditions?
> 
> Has anyone tried applying the Zoopoxy to polycarbonate or acrylic? Does it bond well?


I cannot say exactly how far it will go due to how thick you put it on. I have only used the gallon kits.

In all the rocks I have made and posted in a few threads I have used two kits total. I am about to use a 2 quart kit of EZ Sculpt so I will have a better idea in the next few days...I would say not as far as the amount of work you want to do.

It should adhere to the acrylic....I have not had any issues with the acrylic paint washing off or flaking, peeling.


----------



## scooter7728

I'm a big fan of the black contact paper either covering the bottom of tank so you don't see the false bottom or on the back of the glass gives it a cleaner look, if you get any air bubbles take a pin to it and the air bubble is gone.


dart345 said:


> Thinking of picking up Zoopoxy, how is the clean up? I am concerned about any residue, by acccident, on glass and if it easy to clean up?
> 
> Also, are folks placing black silicone to cover the aesthetics of the back side? For a cleaner look?


----------



## Medic1

Azurel is still killing it with this stuff!!! How do you get ahold of Vivarium Works epoxy though? I must have issues... lol but really, this looks awesome!


----------



## VivariumWorks

I sent some out to him to test along side the zoopoxy as he was directly working with it at the time. I wanted some feedback with a 3rd party who was working with multiple mediums for the same goal.

The new website is up now. I haven't advertised much about it, but it's 95% done. If you want to order the Exhibit:Cast, it can be now off the website.

Vivarium Works


----------



## hydrophyte

VivariumWorks said:


> I sent some out to him to test along side the zoopoxy as he was directly working with it at the time. I wanted some feedback with a 3rd party who was working with multiple mediums for the same goal.
> 
> The new website is up now. I haven't advertised much about it, but it's 95% done. If you want to order the Exhibit:Cast, it can be now off the website.
> 
> Vivarium Works


Nice!

......


----------



## Azurel

VivariumWorks said:


> I sent some out to him to test along side the zoopoxy as he was directly working with it at the time. I wanted some feedback with a 3rd party who was working with multiple mediums for the same goal.
> 
> The new website is up now. I haven't advertised much about it, but it's 95% done. If you want to order the Exhibit:Cast, it can be now off the website.
> 
> Vivarium Works


Its an awesome product.....might have to check out the cast product.


----------



## Azurel

Azurel said:


> Its an awesome product.....might have to check out the cast product.


Guess the cast is the stuff I used.....Scott are you planning on selling any of the stuff you can mold with like pictured on the site?...The green stuff in the pictures?


----------



## VivariumWorks

Yes that is the Exhibit:Mold. Those pages and the DIY kit that incorporates both the molding/casting materials, I'm still working on getting organized. I've got my graphics designer friend helping me but she sometimes takes a bit of time.

But yea the molding material is designed to be used in the field at 75F+. Idea being you can just mix it up by hand and apply it onto something cool you find while visiting someplace or hiking around. It's not going to let you make hundreds of reproductions in most cases, but you use it properly and are delicate with it, you should be able to get a few good casts made from it. You can see all the stuff I made with it in the gallery pages of the site.


----------



## Azurel

VivariumWorks said:


> Yes that is the Exhibit:Mold. Those pages and the DIY kit that incorporates both the molding/casting materials, I'm still working on getting organized. I've got my graphics designer friend helping me but she sometimes takes a bit of time.
> 
> But yea the molding material is designed to be used in the field at 75F+. Idea being you can just mix it up by hand and apply it onto something cool you find while visiting someplace or hiking around. It's not going to let you make hundreds of reproductions in most cases, but you use it properly and are delicate with it, you should be able to get a few good casts made from it. You can see all the stuff I made with it in the gallery pages of the site.


Awesome.....Will be hitting you up on that.....That looks to be by far the most user friendly product to make molds I have seen yet.

Thanks for all your research and work...


----------



## FroggyKnight

Oooo, I might have to try some of that Exhibit Cast stuff in the future. It looks like a really cool idea and I love to sculpt stuff (not very practiced at it but super fun). After Christmas, I will probably put in an order for some. The Exhibit Mold could be very interesting too. I have lots of cool rocks I might try molding...

I always forget about you guys at Vivarium Works! You need to post more often on DB. 

John


----------



## VivariumWorks

Thanks for kind words guys. All of this has been a long time coming.

It's just a one dude operation, which is why everything takes far longer than it otherwise would if I had like 3 of me. Maybe I should mold myself... wait... never-mind... they already have those kits at the xxx store. LOL.

Yea I've got some new designs I'll post up here in a bit. A cool 40 breeder I made for a GFP axolotl and I'm working a few molds I made while in Africa a few months ago.


----------



## Bob Hall

Great thread! I enjoyed watching the process so much I posted it in the sticky section. I may use this process in building my background...could be a little overzealous for my first build, but I have done a little sculpting/carving in the past and it looks like a lot of fun. 

A couple of questions...CJW mentioned that water will leach between the 'rocks' and the glass unless it's caulked with silicone. Have you had an issue with this? Let's say, it leaked at the top of the attachment but nowhere else, allowing water to build up (to a certain degree) behind the rock(s). This would be a perfect environment for yuckies to grow, and could potentially break the seal between the rocks and the glass. Am I over-thinking it? 

Thanks for sharing this, as well as your other builds!


----------



## Azurel

Bob Hall said:


> Great thread! I enjoyed watching the process so much I posted it in the sticky section. I may use this process in building my background...could be a little overzealous for my first build, but I have done a little sculpting/carving in the past and it looks like a lot of fun.
> 
> A couple of questions...CJW mentioned that water will leach between the 'rocks' and the glass unless it's caulked with silicone. Have you had an issue with this? Let's say, it leaked at the top of the attachment but nowhere else, allowing water to build up (to a certain degree) behind the rock(s). This would be a perfect environment for yuckies to grow, and could potentially break the seal between the rocks and the glass. Am I over-thinking it?
> 
> Thanks for sharing this, as well as your other builds!


I have had no issues with water leaking between the Zoopoxy and the glass...The rocks that I make where the foam is attached to the glass I make sure that there is no gaps or holes not just to seal in the foam but I don't want any gap big enough for either the frogs or froglets can squeeze in.

I have not noticed and issues with water pooling....in rocks that are made singly I glue them to the glass with gorilla glue. 

I can get you pictures of how they fit against the glass and the zoopoxy is sealed against the glass....something I haven't showed in this thread actually....

I have a new build going so tomorrow when the lights in frog room are on I will snap a picture...



Bob Hall said:


> Great thread! I enjoyed watching the process so much I posted it in the sticky section. I may use this process in building my background...could be a little overzealous for my first build, but I have done a little sculpting/carving in the past and it looks like a lot of fun.
> 
> A couple of questions...CJW mentioned that water will leach between the 'rocks' and the glass unless it's caulked with silicone. Have you had an issue with this? Let's say, it leaked at the top of the attachment but nowhere else, allowing water to build up (to a certain degree) behind the rock(s). This would be a perfect environment for yuckies to grow, and could potentially break the seal between the rocks and the glass. Am I over-thinking it?
> 
> Thanks for sharing this, as well as your other builds!


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## Bob Hall

Azurel said:


> I have had no issues with water leaking between the Zoopoxy and the glass...The rocks that I make where the foam is attached to the glass I make sure that there is no gaps or holes not just to seal in the foam but I don't want any gap big enough for either the frogs or froglets can squeeze in.
> 
> I have not noticed and issues with water pooling....in rocks that are made singly I glue them to the glass with gorilla glue.
> 
> I can get you pictures of how they fit against the glass and the zoopoxy is sealed against the glass....something I haven't showed in this thread actually....
> 
> I have a new build going so tomorrow when the lights in frog room are on I will snap a picture...


I'm looking forward to seeing that! Did you ever "pull the trigger" on the vine maker product?


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## Azurel

Bob Hall said:


> I'm looking forward to seeing that! Did you ever "pull the trigger" on the vine maker product?


No I didn't.....I did pick up some EZ sculpt though....So far I like it a lot...Much thicker has a stiffer consistency....

I have some other stuff I am going to pick up here after the holidays from a posted sponsor that I am really excited to tryout.


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## Azurel

Here is the new build with the EZ Sculpt and what or how I seal it to the glass....This rock pile was sprayed with Great Stuff and was intended to be permanently in place.









Here is the seal...


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## Bob Hall

Azurel said:


> Here is the new build with the EZ Sculpt and what or how I seal it to the glass....This rock pile was sprayed with Great Stuff and was intended to be permanently in place...


Thanks for sharing that. Did you find EZ Sculpt easier to work with than the 307? I've done a _little_ modeling before, and some wood carving. I am thinking EZ Sculpt may feel a little more familiar to me.


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## Azurel

Bob Hall said:


> Thanks for sharing that. Did you find EZ Sculpt easier to work with than the 307? I've done a _little_ modeling before, and some wood carving. I am thinking EZ Sculpt may feel a little more familiar to me.


In some ways yes....It doesnt blend as easy since its much stiffer....Where the 307 is a lot more ply able....As far as doing detail both were similar....

I will use both....One of the things I like about the EZ is it takes impressions much easier due to the stiffness....The 307 does but if you come back an hour later it takes impressions better then when first applied....In this way the sculpt is like 307 but an hour or two into curing....

307 took awhile to figure out....Each time I used it I figured something out....The sculpt I think would shorten the learning curve.

In the same way Vivarium works Cast is similar to the sculpt in that the learning curve is much shorter....especially if you are familiar with modeling clay.


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## Azurel

I have come to really like the zoopoxy EZ Sculpt.....

Here is the new project I'm working on....Trying something I haven't done yet...Root structure....




























Some details......



















Still a bunch of work to do....


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## Bob Hall

Those roots are looking great. I'm anxious to get going on my project...I plan to order from polygem this week. Thanks for all the inspiration. Can't wait to see how it turns out.

Do you make your own impressions (the 'stamp' you use)?


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## Azurel

Bob Hall said:


> Those roots are looking great. I'm anxious to get going on my project...I plan to order from polygem this week. Thanks for all the inspiration. Can't wait to see how it turns out.
> 
> Do you make your own impressions (the 'stamp' you use)?


Yeah I do.....I have a couple....for the roots I ended up using a couple small pieces of cork bark that I though looked interesting...

Here is updated pics


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## Azurel

I will get a picture of the stamps


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## Azurel

Still need to get pictures of the stamps....

But here is the finished build


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## FroggyKnight

Hey, that looks pretty good! I like it. What broms are you using in there?

John


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## Azurel

FroggyKnight said:


> Hey, that looks pretty good! I like it. What broms are you using in there?
> 
> John


Thanks John

They are a cluster Neo. Palmares and Neo. MoonDust.

The light was a little bright....not quite as bright as the picture makes it look.


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## dartsanddragons

I should have warned you that this stuff has a very addictive component glad to see you are enjoying this product I think I may have to start another large tank just so I can play with this stuff again. I have not found anything even close to its simplicity to work with.

Scott


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## Bob Hall

Azurel said:


> Still need to get pictures of the stamps....
> 
> But here is the finished build


Looks good! Can't wait for mine to arrive so I can try it out. I got the small package of vine maker too so that be fun to try as well.



> I should have warned you that this stuff has a very addictive component glad to see you are enjoying this product I think I may have to start another large tank just so I can play with this stuff again. I have not found anything even close to its simplicity to work with.


I hope you're right! I have visions of making a huge mess...lol.


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## Azurel

dartsanddragons said:


> I should have warned you that this stuff has a very addictive component glad to see you are enjoying this product I think I may have to start another large tank just so I can play with this stuff again. I have not found anything even close to its simplicity to work with.
> 
> Scott


Yeah you should have.....I can't stop incorporating it in some how....Adds some much extra dimension to a build.


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## edaxflamma

Out of curiosity have you tried to remove any of it from glass yet? I ended up ordering some a while back but am tentative to give it a shot as it seems rather permanent.

Also, you made some stones with horizontal cuts mimicking shale, would you mind sharing your secrets for that effect?


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## Azurel

edaxflamma said:


> Out of curiosity have you tried to remove any of it from glass yet? I ended up ordering some a while back but am tentative to give it a shot as it seems rather permanent.
> 
> Also, you made some stones with horizontal cuts mimicking shale, would you mind sharing your secrets for that effect?


I have removed it from glass...I have used a razor blade to remove residue and thin epoxy....I have not tried to remove pieces I have intended to be sealed to it.

I used this painting knife like this to do the edge work and the layers...
http://www.dickblick.com/products/blick-blue-comfort-grip-painting-knives/

I would just push the edge into the epoxy over and over as I made the lines....which would leave thinner/wider areas in each line....

I tried to make different thicknesses and weathered look.....once it was cured I came back and used 80 grit sand paper to soften the edges and finish the weathered and eroded look....


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## Azurel

My new build.....


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## athiker04

Just quickly read through this whole thread and am really impressed and fascinated by this method.

I have to admit though that I think it would be frustrating to use this as a background and see all that awesome detailed work just get smothered out by plants. 

It's really tempting to use this method to make a really cool rock or rock stack as a midground accent or in a water feature.


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## Azurel

athiker04 said:


> Just quickly read through this whole thread and am really impressed and fascinated by this method.
> 
> I have to admit though that I think it would be frustrating to use this as a background and see all that awesome detailed work just get smothered out by plants.
> 
> It's really tempting to use this method to make a really cool rock or rock stack as a midground accent or in a water feature.


Thanks....It's really enjoyable....Part of it is how and what plants you use as well.....So far all are still visible even with plant growth....


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## Azurel

Here is another update....

Got an even more detailed build going....

Large rock with tree stump and buttress roots...


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## myersboy6

Dang that looks sweet dude! You are getting pretty good at the rocks!


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## Azurel

myersboy6 said:


> Dang that looks sweet dude! You are getting pretty good at the rocks!


Thanks bro.....Gonna do some more work on the stump tomorrow....


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## SaFFyR

What a great thread, gj on the fake rocks. I was planning to do some fake rocks myself with tilegrout but I wanna switch to epoxy putty now for sure! Too bad I can't find any aquarium grade epoxy putty here in the Netherlands 

Keep up the good work!


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## Azurel

SaFFyR said:


> What a great thread, gj on the fake rocks. I was planning to do some fake rocks myself with tilegrout but I wanna switch to epoxy putty now for sure! Too bad I can't find any aquarium grade epoxy putty here in the Netherlands
> 
> Keep up the good work!


Thanks Saffy....tile grout is still a viable option....Not sure if there are any epoxy products like Zoopoxy over the pond....


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## Azurel

Here is what I have so far...


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## Frog pool13

Awesome job!


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## Nismo95

Don't wanna hijack, but you are the reason I started using this stuff James lol. Here are two rocks, the larger one was first attempt the smaller is the second attempt. Used a bit more material on the second.


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## Azurel

Update.....

Some more partial buttress roots done....Some of these will have to be done in pieces......


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## Dendro Dave

Excellent job carving the tree  (Rocks look good too!)


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## Azurel

Dendro Dave said:


> Excellent job carving the tree  (Rocks look good too!)


Thanks Dave appreciate that.....


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## Azurel

Update.....

More work done.....almost finished with the major stuff..


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## Meefloaf

i hate to ask this, but how much is this setting you back ? ive been tempted to get some in to the uk to check out.

or, if it is working out expensive, can i have a job ? lol


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## Azurel

Meefloaf said:


> i hate to ask this, but how much is this setting you back ? ive been tempted to get some in to the uk to check out.
> 
> or, if it is working out expensive, can i have a job ? lol


The 2 gallon kit is $140 shipped to me....The rest is relatively cheap....The great stuff foam and the open cell foam was may be $20....The pvc tubing that is the core of the stump was $8.

The rest is just my time and thankful talents....luckily my brain and hands seem to be in sync.


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## Azurel

Some roots colored up.....


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## JoshsDragonz

I would like to add to the appreciation for this product. I am really liking the results you can achieve with it. I also want to thank James, seeing him play with the 307 is one of the reasons I decided to give it a try on my newest build myself.

Here are some pics of what I was able to create using both Polybac 307 and the 307 Lite. I also use the thickening agent that Polygem sells to adjust the consistency of the epoxy to almost clay like. 

The fallen tree and the rock work in the foreground are epoxy. 

_DSC6751 by joshsdragonz, on Flickr

Some close ups of the fallen tree. 

_DSC6654 by joshsdragonz, on Flickr

_DSC6653 by joshsdragonz, on Flickr

_DSC6650 by joshsdragonz, on Flickr


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## Azurel

Amazing work bro.... It's hard not to use it once you start....


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## Nismo95

That is just insane work with the tree.. I am super jealous. You do some incredible work


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## Azurel

Here is the latest finished work...


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## S&H

Nice thread, thanks for this!


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