# First Variabilis eggs!



## Whitneyd88 (Nov 12, 2011)

So I just got this group of Southerns a few weeks ago and was very surprised to find 8 eggs in the bottom of a film canister! I was told they were 3 months old and unsexable, thats why i got 4, then the shipment wasn't for 2 months (understory enterprises), so I figured they were about 5-6 months old upon receiving them. Do they normally lay this young? Or are they probably older than I think? 
Anyways, SO excited!
I haven't dealt with eggs in a canister yet, my Benny's always lay in the leaves. Should I leave the canister in the tank until they are about to hatch? I just don't see any way to remove them without damaging them. 

















They love their brom!


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

Yes, and congrats! As for egg removal, I leave them until I see significant development, then very gently scoop them out with a slurpy straw. Place in a small container and surround with a little water that has had an almond leaf soaking in t. I found that this completely eliminated any of my eggs going bad.

These guys will transport and dad will bust them out sooner than you think. You'll sit there and curse him for carting around $$$$$ on his back. If this happens, don't fret too much though, he'll deposit them somewhere and if you're lucky it is someplace you can suck up the tad or a removable container.

Don't forget our PMs, I'm interested in getting some more froglets to pair with some holdbacks.


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## Nath514 (Jul 8, 2012)

Once they get going, they can really get going so expect more eggs. Mine like to hide tadpoles all over the tank and then taunt me with the male standing right in plain view with tadpoles on his back, then he hides them, quite well I must say!


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## Whitneyd88 (Nov 12, 2011)

ZookeeperDoug said:


> Don't forget our PMs, I'm interested in getting some more froglets to pair with some holdbacks.


I won't forget!


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## Whitneyd88 (Nov 12, 2011)

I'm concerned about supplements. My tank is exploding with springtails. So they're eating those, I still put in flies w/supplements but they go uneaten mostly bc they're so full on springs. Is this going to be a problem? I feel like it is


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

Probably not. I'm sure the frogs were well supplimented by Mark at UE before you got them. Likely the frogs will catch up with the spring population and start taking the FFs. Keep offering them FF is small quantities so your viv isn't overrun with uneaten flies and set up a feeding station where you can see flies congregate and get eaten.

If/when those eggs start developing and you start raising the tads, be sure to get some grow out tanks set up and seeded early with springs. I always have a couple 190oz grow outs seeded with springs going so when new thumbs morph out, I can move them in with plenty to feast on. By the time they are large enough to take FF, they've eaten most of the springs. I have other cultures going at all times to feed if needed.


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## whitethumb (Feb 5, 2011)

i read southerns morph out large enough to take flies from day one. 
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/499400-post2.html


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## Whitneyd88 (Nov 12, 2011)

When I say my tank is exploding with springs, I mean it! It's like the leaf litter is alive lol. I just had a big leaf on one of my plants die off so they have lots to feed on. I can't imagine my 4 frogs catching up with it! I mean maybe in a few months or something hopefully

I'm sure if these eggs develop they will be fine as far as supplements go bc of Mark. I'm just worried about future clutches and the health of the parents.


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## Tincman (Jan 18, 2013)

I love Variabilis! Nice Pics, Congrats on Eggs!!


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

whitethumb said:


> i read southerns morph out large enough to take flies from day one.
> http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/499400-post2.html


Often they are, but still a good idea to have plenty of microfauna available for them. Froglets will spend a great deal of time actively foraging in leaf litter, better to have an abundance of small microfauna for them to eat rather than bursts of food source in the form of FF daily.

I suspect too that there is enough variability in the sizes of the actual melanogasters being fed. A fresh boom of flightless melos for me are pretty good size and might challenge some smaller froglets. An older culture, especially of wingless melos, and they are much smaller(stunted) and that is perfect size.

I've actually found some variability in size of morph outs, some have morphed out HUGE for me, about the size of a full grown retic, easily eating melanos. One the other hand, some have morphed out a bit on the smaller side, closer to Imitator froglets. They're always robust and fast growers though either way.

I suspect some of this is due to temperature flux, smaller tads being those that matured quickly at higher temperatures. Seems like those that morphed out over the winter when my house is consistently cooler are larger but take longer to morph out.


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

Whitneyd88 said:


> When I say my tank is exploding with springs, I mean it! It's like the leaf litter is alive lol. I just had a big leaf on one of my plants die off so they have lots to feed on. I can't imagine my 4 frogs catching up with it! I mean maybe in a few months or something hopefully
> 
> I'm sure if these eggs develop they will be fine as far as supplements go bc of Mark. I'm just worried about future clutches and the health of the parents.


You'll probably be suprised how quickly that tapers of now with frogs in the viv. You've done things right though, getting them WELL established in advance. All of my tanks have been the same way, teeming with microfauna, add frogs and the population drops off rapidly over 3-4 months. Usually I still see enough that I'm comfortable with the microfauna population in the morning around bait stations.

For example, I added 2 Chazuta to a small viv recently, the leaf litter was alive with pinks/whites. Now, you don't see them much on the surface, but if you flip a few leaves there are still plenty.


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## Whitneyd88 (Nov 12, 2011)

This angle is actually flattering for this frog lol, they are soooooo fat!


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## whitethumb (Feb 5, 2011)

that makes sense about the temperature altering the morphing out process. my frogs morph the same pretty much just because the temperture stays 
constant throughout the year.



ZookeeperDoug said:


> Often they are, but still a good idea to have plenty of microfauna available for them. Froglets will spend a great deal of time actively foraging in leaf litter, better to have an abundance of small microfauna for them to eat rather than bursts of food source in the form of FF daily.
> 
> I suspect too that there is enough variability in the sizes of the actual melanogasters being fed. A fresh boom of flightless melos for me are pretty good size and might challenge some smaller froglets. An older culture, especially of wingless melos, and they are much smaller(stunted) and that is perfect size.
> 
> ...


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