# Low quality culturing cups



## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

Has anyone else had trouble with the FF culturing cups (32 oz.) lately?

I just ordered a large quantity (200) from an online source (not a sponsor, but a very well known supplier here on DB) and the quality really sucks!!

I know the company I bought them from has nothing to do with it, because I assume that the majority of these cups are made by one company, whichever one that is; maybe Solo?

Anyway, the thickness of the cup seems to be much thinner than in the past and the lids are too small, so when you go to try and put the lid on, you almost smash the cup. Very frustrating to say the least.


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## Raymond (Aug 26, 2006)

I had no idea that you could order those in such large numbers (like 200) through the internet, I assume the pricing is good? Maybe it's just a bad batch? 

I've been buying my cups from a local co-op. I think it's around $7 something for 25 and they're pretty thick. I usually reuse the containers several times too, so I get several months out of a pack of these. $7-8 dollars every 3-4 months isn't too bad, but it might just be cheaper to order them online and then I wouldn't have to wash them every time...a task I despise.


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

Online they run about $0.30 each with lids. Which is about what you are paying.
PM me if you want to know where.


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## sbreland (May 4, 2006)

I am sure I bought mine from the same place as you and I have to say I agree in some respects. Instead of thinner cups though, I actually think mine are thicker, but that makes them harder to work with. I don't have any of the old ones left so I am not sure, but they seem thicker to me. The lid thing drives me crazy too... one solution I have found is to put the lid on the cup for about 10 minutes or so before you make the cultures (I usually do this while I am folding what feels like 1000000 coffee filters) and then when you take it off and try to put it back on it fits a bit better. For whatever reason, they need to be "stretched out", but once the lids have been on for awhile (like once you open to feed out the first time) they come on and off easily.


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## elmoisfive (Dec 31, 2004)

Steve,

I have made the same observation. I do (did) have some of the older cups so I could make a direct comparison and the new ones are thinner and more flimsy. I have also observed the lid fitting (stretching) behavior mentioned by Stace.

Bill


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## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

I noticed that with a relatively recent batch as well (I don't use them for flies, but for a number of other feeder bugs). It's pissing me off a bit! But luckily, a frogger that got out of the hobby for the most part a while ago, hooked me up with a box (200+) of the older cups  bwhahahahaha...

The quality of the toss away cups has generally ticked me off to the point that I don't use them anymore... plus I hate making that much trash that won't degrade, and they take up so much room in the trash unless I open them up and dump them... but at that point, why don't I just wash them?


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

Could someone point out the numbers on the bottom of the "good" cups and the "bad" cups. There is a lot of variety in the deli cups and I would like to work with the cups people like. So, give me the letters/names/numbers on the bottom of the cups and let me know whether they are "good" or "bad". I can match the numbers with the maker of the cups.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

I recently threw out all my old mason jars trying to clean some things out. I do agree the latest batch of cups and lids are the worst yet. I still prefer the ones from about 2-3 years ago that were clear, and the lids seemed to snap on the inside. 

Last week I broke 4-5 cups trying to put the lids on. Ugg...


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Also would urge everyone with a problem to take the time to send a e-mail to the company with the concerns.


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

> Could someone point out the numbers on the bottom of the "good" cups and the "bad" cups. There is a lot of variety in the deli cups and I would like to work with the cups people like. So, give me the letters/names/numbers on the bottom of the cups and let me know whether they are "good" or "bad". I can match the numbers with the maker of the cups.


Josh, the good cups that I still have left are as follows:

RD 32
Placon Products
( 5 inside a triangle)
Placon.com

And the ones that suck are:

PWP
PWPIndustries.com
M-04-32
636
(5 inside a triangle)

I hope this helps. And by the way, I think if I remember right, I bought the goods ones off of you when I first started over 18 months ago and they are still good. The new ones, unfortunately, I bought from another online service. I guess that will teach me!!


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

Steve,

That will teach you to go elsewhere! :lol: 

I still use (and have always used Placon's RD 32). Another person PMed me that they thought the best cup was the Fabri-Kal version. I contacted my cup supplier and they have this cup in stock, but won't be ordering more because companies aren't buying this cup for some reason. They are clearancing these cases out (for less than what I get the placon cups for), so I may pick up the last 12 cases.

Anybody else care to chime in on what the best cup is?


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## Grassypeak (Jun 14, 2005)

Josh, I THINK I got my last batch from you and they are the thin ones. Previously I have ordered from Cindy and those were thicker. I’ll check the numbers tomorrow when I go out to the frog room.


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## bellerophon (Sep 18, 2006)

placons from josh here too. very pleased with em.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

The old cups with the lids from 2-3 years ago where the best combo. The white lids that seemed to connect on the inside of the cup as well. Easy to put on and stayed on well.


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## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

kyle1745 said:


> The old cups with the lids from 2-3 years ago where the best combo. The white lids that seemed to connect on the inside of the cup as well. Easy to put on and stayed on well.


'
agreed.

Havent seen them lately though I occassionally come across one of those older lids and a tear swells up...  

S


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

I too like the "old" style of lid, so that is the lid that I carry now. Here are some pics:


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## Grassypeak (Jun 14, 2005)

So cool to have a vendor interested in this thread. Thanks Josh.


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## sbreland (May 4, 2006)

For me, the Placons seem to be the old ones I liked. The new ones I checked and they are Solo's. I don't think these are the same as everyone else is talking about because these are actually really thick and sturdy, so I am wondering if it might be the lids that are the weak link for me. perhaps they are just missized as it takes a lot of effort to get them on without making the cup look like Japanese oragami.


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## EDs Fly Meat (Apr 29, 2004)

I can't stand the disposables. That's why we use our old reliable. It may look ugly but it works, is machine and dishwasher safe, and best of re-usable. 10 years ago we were offered the disposables, and tried em. The mesh tears, the lids crack. I hated em.


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

> It may look ugly but it works, is machine and dishwasher safe, and best of re-usable.


The less expensive cups are also dishwasher safe, microwavable, re-usable and they most importantly they are pretty. :wink: 



> The mesh tears, the lids crack.


While there was a problem a year or so ago with the mesh separating from the lids, that has been corrected (well, an apology was given anyways). I don't have (and have never had a customer complain) about the mesh tearing or the lids cracking on the newer style snap over the cups lids. I have just started using the "old style" lids again, but haven't had any problems as of yet.


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## bellerophon (Sep 18, 2006)

I got one of your cups from IAD Ed and I couldn't wait till the culture burnt out. by the time I wrestled the lid back on I had a dozen escapee's. Probably my fault though as I just refused to use the foam plug as its meant to be used. I suppose they both have their pros and cons but I'm a fan of the clear one if not just to be able to quickly asses the cultures health from across the room.


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## Jason DeSantis (Feb 2, 2006)

I wrote Josh and told him about the fabri-kal cups. They are hands down the best I have ever used. I carry The R32 like Josh. If anyone is interested and wouldnt mind spending the extra 5 cents each I will stock both types. I will even send out some freebies to see how people like them.
Jason


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## _Enix_ (Jul 31, 2005)

I have used whatever cups/lids Ed's has used since I started frogging.

I am very pleased with them. They're extremely durable and the lids fit perfectly. I have never had issue.

I don't put them in the dishwasher (all the fly "stuff" in the dishwasher? yuck!) I do find they're very easy to clean out by hand with hot water.


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

> I don't put them in the dishwasher (all the fly "stuff" in the dishwasher? yuck!)


Not only that but they are so light they end up all over the inside of the dishwasher and usually upside down with water and fly muck still inside. I wash by hand. But with these new cups I got they do not wash too well the third time around. I will definitely not be getting as much use out of them as I did the ones from Josh.

I emailed the supplier I got the bad cups from and told them if that was the quality cup they were going to be offering, I would not be back for more. I just got an email back saying there is something coming in the regular mail tomorrow (2 pounds worth!!). I have no idea what it is. But I will let you know. Probably 2 pounds of horse....!! for my trouble!!


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

I think the type of cup used can depend on ones collection and the time they have to dedicate to culturing. I personally use the disposable cups and can't see going back to washing jars or cups again. I don't make nearly as many as other people but for me its simple and fast.


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

Well, I got my mail yesterday and they sent me 50 of the Pro-Kal cups. So when I do cultures this weekend I will try these and see how they work.



> I personally use the disposable cups and can't see going back to washing jars or cups again.


Kyle, I wish I could do that too. But I am sure I speak for a lot of us here on the board when I say that that can get to be rather expensive. Now if I was selling a lot for frogs, then yes, I could see that as an investment in keeping the business going. But until I see these little guys paying for their own keep, I have to wash dishes!!!!


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## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

Yeah I couldn't really afford to keep doing the disposable... of course I say that with two boxes of toss away cups in my closet at the moement :roll: People keep giving them to me...

I have used Ed's cups for years, and have both hand washed them and tossed them in the dishwasher - rinsed out of all fly ickiness, I wouldn't use the dishwasher if they still had fly stuff in them! EW - and they have handled it great. I think I picked up an extra couple sets 2 IADs ago and still use them. Of course, now I need to get more with my expanding frog collection, and foam plugs, all of which I could have picked up at IAD if I had remembered :roll: Note: the Ed's lables will not come off. I've tried. The cups look like crap with half rubbed off lables LOL. Ah, well...

Ed's cups with foam plugs work great... the lids are very secure and harder to get off than the cheapo stuff, but at the same time, i've dropped cheapo cultures and had the lid fly off and flies go everywhere... I regularly drop ED's cultures with no ill affects (yes, I'm a clutz). Using the same culture cups with the mesh SUCKS and I nearly tossed all the cultures for the cheap stuff until I tried the foam plugs... you just can't get the patch of mesh and the lid to get along! Maybe I should just cut enough to cover the hole and glue gun it on for the ones I can't use plugs for? Hmmmmm...

Another problem with cheapo cups... in regards to culturing other bugs - they will chew thru them. My shorelinites make short work of the cups, drilling little holes in the bottoms.


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## Alan (Jan 12, 2005)

I order lots of 240 cups from Superior and have noticed the change in the cups thickness and the fit of the lid. Although I have been disappointed with the thinner material - I am especially disappointed in the fit between the lid and the cup. In many cases the lid does not seperate cleanly from the cup when tapping out flies - which causes escapees and some pretty clumsy situations. The former cups/lids did not do this.

I have twice written notes to Superior Enterprises about these issues over the past 6 months have received no response from them.

If anyone has a good source for 240+ lots of cups/lids of better quality - please PM me. It appears Superior Enterprises has little interest in correcting this quality issue.


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## mascencerro (Jan 17, 2007)

joshsfrogs said:


> > It may look ugly but it works, is machine and dishwasher safe, and best of re-usable.
> 
> 
> The less expensive cups are also dishwasher safe, microwavable, re-usable and they most importantly they are pretty. :wink:


nothing like a "pretty" cup of maggots.


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

So what are the differences between the Placon cups/lids and the Fabri-Kal ?


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

Placon cups are clear whereas the Fabri-Kal cups are translucent. The Fabri-Kal cups don't taper towards the bottom, so technically there is more media surface area with the Fabri-Kal cups. The lid fits "snug" on the placon (it is not hard to get off like "over the edges" lid design) whereas the lid is a lot easier to get off the fabri-Kal cups (some looking at the cups would say the lid come off too easily).


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## Patrick Nabors (Feb 22, 2004)

*A tip for using the cheap thin ones!*

I had the same problem with Superior Alan, but when I called them and told them I couldnt use the cups they had sent, They sent me the Fabri Kal cups I have been using to replace the cheap ones they had sent me. 
But I figured out how to keep the cheap ones from crushing when you put the lids on- Take the cup you are putting the lid on, and put it into an empty cup before trying to put the lid on, the second cup will support the first cups walls. 
Check out our selection of fruit fly supplies, we do carry the Fabri Kal cups
http://www.saurian.net/htm05/terrariums ... flies.html
Thanks, Patrick


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

I can see why some would think the Fabri-Kal lid fit is a bit too loose, but I think I'd still prefer it over the tigher/snug Placon.


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

> but I think I'd still prefer it over the tigher/snug Placon.


I do not find it to be that way with the Placons. I think the lids are just a bit too large and are very difficult to get onto the cup, they bunch up in one spot of the lid and form a ripple that eventually pops the lid off completely, sometimes, other times they come loose just enough for the flies to get out two days after you make the culture.


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## elmoisfive (Dec 31, 2004)

I notice that Superior has apparently switched to supplying the Fabri-Kal cups. I got some in last week and immediately noticed the increased strength compared to PWP cups that were causing issues.

Bill


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## godsgurl377 (Dec 18, 2006)

Personally, I think the Fabri-Kal lids come off way too easily. They are very loose. Whatever you do, don't accidentally tip them over! :shock: Whenever I look at the cup there is always a fly or two crawling up around the ring (between the lid and the cup), then they get stuck there and die, that is without me touching the lid or opening it at all. So I have a nice ring of dead flies around the top. :roll: From what I hear, people either love them or hate them... I guess I am one of the later.

Oh well, I guess I will just get the placon cups next time.


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