# Almost done setting up my dart frog setup, any last tips?



## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

I have just finished putting in all the plants and substrate to my dart frog setup. I am still waiting on some more leaf litter to come in the mail as well. I also just ordered springtails and isopods to go into it. Is there anything else I need? Can I order the frogs once I get the springtails/isopods in there or do I have to wait a while? Here are some pics for reference! It's the exo terra long 18x18x24. I am planning on getting 3 dendrobates leucomelas for it!


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

Hello, 

On the top view picture it looks like the only top ventilation is a bare strip at the front. Is that correct? 
if so, there are a couple of issues: 1. The frogs can escape through that opening. 2. Front lower vents plus front top vent doesn't promote airflow throughout the tank. The cool air will enter at the front bottom and exit at the front top leaving stagnant air at the back. Typically the top ventilation is at the back to encourage airflow throughout the tank.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

fishingguy12345 said:


> Hello,
> 
> On the top view picture it looks like the only top ventilation is a bare strip at the front. Is that correct?
> if so, there are a couple of issues: 1. The frogs can escape through that opening. 2. Front lower vents plus front top vent doesn't promote airflow throughout the tank. The cool air will enter at the front bottom and exit at the front top leaving stagnant air at the back. Typically the top ventilation is at the back to encourage airflow throughout the tank.


Correct that is the only ventilation, if I put the vent at the back then the background just covers the vent holes. It’s currently siliconed down…


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

froggy_guy said:


> Correct that is the only ventilation, if I put the vent at the back then the background just covers the vent holes. It’s currently siliconed down…


What is the best solution for something like this?


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

fishingguy12345 said:


> Hello,
> 
> On the top view picture it looks like the only top ventilation is a bare strip at the front. Is that correct?
> if so, there are a couple of issues: 1. The frogs can escape through that opening. 2. Front lower vents plus front top vent doesn't promote airflow throughout the tank. The cool air will enter at the front bottom and exit at the front top leaving stagnant air at the back. Typically the top ventilation is at the back to encourage airflow throughout the tank.


And my temp/humidity gauge is mounted via the front:


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

froggy_guy said:


> And my temp/humidity gauge is mounted via the front:
> View attachment 302732


This is an absolute no-go my friend. Your frogs will escape and die within a day. You don't need temp and humidity gauges. An IR temp gun is best. The best thing for air flow is to make screen vents out of screen framing (like for a window) and no-see-um mesh. But this absolutely cannot stay this way.

As far as when to get frogs, you want your isos and springs to get established first. Otherwise those leucs will just decimate your micro-fauna within a couple days. Also, new vivariums should be running at least a month before you add frogs. The longer the better.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

JasonE said:


> This is an absolute no-go my friend. Your frogs will escape and die within a day. You don't need temp and humidity gauges. An IR temp gun is best. The best thing for air flow is to make screen vents out of screen framing (like for a window) and no-see-um mesh. But this absolutely cannot stay this way.
> 
> As far as when to get frogs, you want your isos and springs to get established first. Otherwise those leucs will just decimate your micro-fauna within a couple days. Also, new vivariums should be running at least a month before you add frogs. The longer the better.


Ok, so plan of attack:
Remove the temp and humidity gauges, get temp gun, create screen vents (I have the original top from the exo terra tank which has screen, can I take that and cut/repurpose it?), add clean up crew, wait a month, then add frogs.

can I leave the screen at the front or should I remove the entire top glass panel and shift it so the vent is at the back of the tank.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

froggy_guy said:


> create screen vents (I have the original top from the exo terra tank which has screen, can I take that and cut/repurpose it?)


What I would go is remove the glass pane that's on there now.
Put the original lid on, and then place your glass piece on top of it to restrict the airflow. It's what I do.


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

froggy_guy said:


> Ok, so plan of attack:
> Remove the temp and humidity gauges, get temp gun, create screen vents (I have the original top from the exo terra tank which has screen, can I take that and cut/repurpose it?), add clean up crew, wait a month, then add frogs.
> 
> can I leave the screen at the front or should I remove the entire top glass panel and shift it so the vent is at the back of the tank.


I have vents at the front and back of my exo-terra. I recommend it. The front vent paired with the under door vent helps keep the doors clear. Then the back vent, as mentioned, allows for air flow throughout the tank.

IR temp guns are cheap now. You can get them at Walmart/Target/Amazon and they usually cost $10-20.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

JasonE said:


> I have vents at the front and back of my exo-terra. I recommend it. The front vent paired with the under door vent helps keep the doors clear. Then the back vent, as mentioned, allows for air flow throughout the tank.
> 
> IR temp guns are cheap now. You can get them at Walmart/Target/Amazon and they usually cost $10-20.


Alright sounds good! so piggy backing off the other dudes comment, I can just put the original screen back on, put the glass panel over top and allow a bit of air through the front and back of the top.

since I won’t have a humidity gauge what is the best way to know when it needs more moisture?


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

fishingguy12345 said:


> What I would go is remove the glass pane that's on there now.
> Put the original lid on, and then place your glass piece on top of it to restrict the airflow. It's what I do.


Ok, thanks for the help. Then once I do that… I should add the clean up crew and wait a month for them to populate, then add the dart frogs.

I ordered fruit flies with my cleanup crew, what should I do with them while I wait the month.


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

froggy_guy said:


> I ordered fruit flies with my cleanup crew, what should I do with them while I wait the month.


Make more fly cultures. Use this time to familiarize yourself with the process so you'll know what you're doing when the frogs arrive.



froggy_guy said:


> Alright sounds good! so piggy backing off the other dudes comment, I can just put the original screen back on, put the glass panel over top and allow a bit of air through the front and back of the top.
> 
> since I won’t have a humidity gauge what is the best way to know when it needs more moisture?


You can put the original top back on and go that route. Just understand you're going to have flies escape through that. Some people don't care. Some do. I once had a wife, so now fruit fly proofing is just one of the steps I do without thinking when I build a new viv.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

JasonE said:


> Make more fly cultures. Use this time to familiarize yourself with the process so you'll know what you're doing when the frogs arrive.


This is a good tip. Premade cultures are expensive. You can make your own easily. Make a new culture once a week, and always have a spare extra one going as well in case you have a crash.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

JasonE said:


> Make more fly cultures. Use this time to familiarize yourself with the process so you'll know what you're doing when the frogs arrive.
> 
> 
> 
> You can put the original top back on and go that route. Just understand you're going to have flies escape through that. Some people don't care. Some do. I once had a wife, so now fruit fly proofing is just one of the steps I do without thinking when I build a new viv.


Sounds great. Thanks for all the tips


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

Chris S said:


> This is a good tip. Premade cultures are expensive. You can make your own easily. Make a new culture once a week, and always have a spare extra one going as well in case you have a crash.


I was planning on it!


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

froggy_guy said:


> since I won’t have a humidity gauge what is the best way to know when it needs more moisture?


Search 'humidity' in the search bar. Order results by date. Read enough posts until you get a feel for how to handle moisture balance (along the way, you'll bump into a lot of comments about ventilation, which is the other side of the moisture coin).

After you do that, clear your browser history and try to forget the word "humidity", since it is a troublemaker.


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## HaydenT (Jul 3, 2018)

Make sure you keep the sides moist as it will help with plant growth going up the sides of the tank.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

fishingguy12345 said:


> What I would go is remove the glass pane that's on there now.
> Put the original lid on, and then place your glass piece on top of it to restrict the airflow. It's what I do.


so... I attempted to remove my siliconed down glass and put the orignal screen back on, but the glass panel broke in the process. Thankfully it was just a big crack and it didn't completly break, but I am just going to scrap that piece and buy some plastic from home depot for the top. Taking your thoughts and the other commenters into account, if I create about a 1 1/2 inch airflow vent (which would just be the mesh) along the top and bottom of the lid would that be sufficent for the frogs? Here's a picture of what I mean.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

froggy_guy said:


> so... I attempted to remove my siliconed down glass and put the orignal screen back on, but the glass panel broke in the process. Thankfully it was just a big crack and it didn't completly break, but I am just going to scrap that piece and buy some plastic from home depot for the top. Taking your thoughts and the other commenters into account, if I create about a 1 1/2 inch airflow vent (which would just be the mesh) along the top and bottom of the lid would that be sufficent for the frogs? Here's a picture of what I mean.
> 
> View attachment 302748


Looks good to me! You could get mosquito netting and silicone it on top of the metal mesh to help keep flies in.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

fishingguy12345 said:


> Looks good to me! You could get mosquito netting and silicone it on top of the metal mesh to help keep flies in.


Sounds like a plan. I really appreciate all the tips and assistance. I love this website so far!


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

froggy_guy said:


> so... I attempted to remove my siliconed down glass and put the orignal screen back on, but the glass panel broke in the process. Thankfully it was just a big crack and it didn't completly break, but I am just going to scrap that piece and buy some plastic from home depot for the top. Taking your thoughts and the other commenters into account, if I create about a 1 1/2 inch airflow vent (which would just be the mesh) along the top and bottom of the lid would that be sufficent for the frogs? Here's a picture of what I mean.
> 
> View attachment 302748


Yup! I've got about a 1" vent on the front and back of my tank. But now is the time you need to decide if you're ok with fruit fly escapes. If so, your plan works great. If not, you're going to want to cover it with no-see-um mesh, or create the screen frames yourself and get a new piece of glass.

Some shots of my top.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

JasonE said:


> Yup! I've got about a 1" vent on the front and back of my tank. But now is the time you need to decide if you're ok with fruit fly escapes. If so, your plan works great. If not, you're going to want to use no-see-um mesh, or create the screen frames yourself and get a new piece of glass.


from your experience does it matter if some fruit flies escape? I just dont know what to expect if they do... I don't mind a few little bugs getting out personally. But if you think its worth getting some mesh I'm all for it. If it is worth getting, where's the best place to get that mesh?


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

froggy_guy said:


> from your experience does it matter if some fruit flies escape? I just dont know what to expect if they do... I don't mind a few little bugs getting out personally. But if you think its worth getting some mesh I'm all for it. If it is worth getting, where's the best place to get that mesh?


I edited that post and added some shots of my top.

It's your call. I feed my adults every two - three days and I want flies in there the next day for them to hunt. So having a bunch escape isn't ideal to me. 

As far as where to get it, I would imagine amazon sells it. I bought mine 10 years ago so I have no idea where I got it from. But I have enough for another 10 years. Just search no-see-um mesh or mosquito mesh


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

I put no see um mesh on the front vent (where most escape, I think) of an ExoTerra once and did not like how much it hindered ventilation. I didn't do that again.

FFs are going to get out around the doors, too, which are somewhat harder to seal up.


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

Socratic Monologue said:


> I put no see um mesh on the front vent (where most escape, I think) of an ExoTerra once and did not like how much it hindered ventilation. I didn't do that again.
> 
> FFs are going to get out around the doors, too, which are somewhat harder to seal up.


I do the same thing. I used a single strip of mesh and glued it inside. I'm not sure if it's restricting air flow though. I have leaves covering up most of that vent so, you know, it's one or the other.


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## froggy_guy (Oct 6, 2021)

JasonE said:


> I do the same thing. I used a single strip of mesh and glued it inside. I'm not sure if it's restricting air flow though. I have leaves covering up most of that vent so, you know, it's one or the other.


sounds great, I just bought some mesh and new plexiglass from home depot! Will make a final update post in a day or two once I get it all installed.


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