# Planting on Spyra. Some questions...



## ulyssis (Aug 12, 2015)

I'm going to use spyra on most of the background in my next build. This stuff wicks water, so does that mean the bottom of the sprya sheet should always be submerged in the standing water underneath the false bottom, to remain moist?

Spreading moss on it seems pretty straight forward. What about plants? Can I only mount epiphytes on this type of background, or will ground plants with roots work on this stuff?

Thanks.


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## hydrophyte (Jun 5, 2009)

Spyra is mainly for epiphytic plants. 

If you keep the base in water Spyra will wick up to about 12" high and stay moist, but it will also retain moisture pretty well with a water wall, especially iif you have it inside of a humid enclosure. If you have lots of plants on it or very much ventilation, it will dry out faster. 

You can use a double or triple thickness for more water retention.


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## folius (Jan 2, 2013)

Looks like Hydrophyte beat me to it.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

I was about to ask the same thing, glad it was answered!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## ulyssis (Aug 12, 2015)

folius said:


> Looks like Hydrophyte beat me to it.




Folius, why does the water only wick up about a foot? What makes it stop from wicking up further? I want to use those stuff about 3 feet high any tricks to ensure the top part of the spyra stays moist?


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## grackle (Sep 18, 2015)

CAUTION: To call my experience with Spyra scant is generous.

Have you considered a reservoir at the top to also feed water to the Spyra? I imagine the width/number of submersed tabs there should let you fine tune the degree of dampness in the wall. 
Modifying the layout of a misting/drip setup with re-circulation pumps should work with enough pondering.


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## ulyssis (Aug 12, 2015)

grackle said:


> CAUTION: To call my experience with Spyra scant is generous.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I'm going to do a test to see how far water wicks up the spyra with the full width of the sheet submerged in water. I believe you guys when you say it won't wick right to the top, but in my head I can't figure why it wouldn't. If that's the case I may need some nozzles dedicated to the back wall.


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## folius (Jan 2, 2013)

Physics . Specifically, the phenomena responsible for the wicking action of Spyra and these kind of materials in general is capillary action. Plants are able to move water around via the same principle, though they are far better able to lift it great distances via active biophysical processes. These processes are absent in fabrics so we can only do things like enhance the hygroscopic properties of the material to push the limits of what's possible passively.

Horizontal spreading of water throughout the fabric is far easier than wicking the water against gravity. Unfortunately, the only trick at that height is to use some sort of active hydration, such as with pumps or misters, at the top of the fabric. 



ulyssis said:


> Folius, why does the water only wick up about a foot? What makes it stop from wicking up further? I want to use those stuff about 3 feet high any tricks to ensure the top part of the spyra stays moist?


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## ulyssis (Aug 12, 2015)

SPYRA WICK TEST

40"H X 26" wide spyra sheet
3" of full width sheet submerged in 2" of water. 

Let's see how high the water reaches.


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## ulyssis (Aug 12, 2015)

Test results in. Everybody was right. Water only went up about 12". It sat there for almost 24hrs.

Ah well, looks like I have to find a way to introduce water at the top and let gravity do its thing. 

If I dedicated 2 misters directly at the spyra, near the top, would that be an ideal setup to keep the spyra wet? Of course I would have to play with the misting schedule, but would water at the top of the spyra work its way down the full length because of gravity?

I'd rather use misters than submersible pumps for my setup because my history with pumps isn't great. They have all died within 2 months of use.


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## folius (Jan 2, 2013)

Misters would work well and have the added benefit of immediately increasing relative humidity. 



ulyssis said:


> Test results in. Everybody was right. Water only went up about 12". It sat there for almost 24hrs.
> 
> Ah well, looks like I have to find a way to introduce water at the top and let gravity do its thing.
> 
> ...


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## oldlady25715 (Nov 17, 2007)

ulyssis said:


> Test results in. Everybody was right. Water only went up about 12". It sat there for almost 24hrs.
> 
> Ah well, looks like I have to find a way to introduce water at the top and let gravity do its thing.
> 
> ...


You should consider sticking a wound-up rope of Spyra into the top of your vertical reservoir so that it wicks down into your tank😀


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## fishman9809 (Dec 8, 2008)

I've found that if you cut holes in the Spyra and fill the holes with sphagnum moss it keeps the Spyra wet for longer by acting as a water reservoir.


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## TJ_Burton (Jul 22, 2015)

My sinkhole hardscape is about 80% Spyra and is has already been planted on about 50% of that coverage.

I do not have it in any pools of water and rely solely on my misting system providing a single 15 second misting once a day. I find that the more moss coverage you have on the Spyra, the more it will retain water. Same goes for plants rooting through it. Spyra alone can only retain and wick so much, but as it is planted, it becomes better and better at retaining moisture.

So depending on what you plan to do with it, and the RH within the enclosure, you do not necessarily need it to be wicking water from a basin/reservoir.


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## oldlady25715 (Nov 17, 2007)

TJ_Burton said:


> Spyra alone can only retain and wick so much, but as it is planted, it becomes better and better at retaining moisture.
> .





hydrophyte said:


> If you have lots of plants on it or very much ventilation, it will dry out faster.


Hmmmm...confused now.


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## folius (Jan 2, 2013)

Perhaps what was meant was the increased cover of Spyra from additional foliage and/or the growth of moss delays the loss of moisture of Spyra.



oldlady25715 said:


> Hmmmm...confused now.


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## hydrophyte (Jun 5, 2009)

I have observed that it will wick a bit higher (to about 15") if you use a double thickness.


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## erikm (Oct 1, 2015)

In my 'limited' experience with spyra, I've successfully kept mosses and a couple of orchids on it without actually having it wick water up from a source below. The area just gets a bit of mist from the misting system.

Both the mosses and orchids have been growing very well like this.


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## ulyssis (Aug 12, 2015)

erikm said:


> In my 'limited' experience with spyra, I've successfully kept mosses and a couple of orchids on it without actually having it wick water up from a source below. The area just gets a bit of mist from the misting system.
> 
> 
> 
> Both the mosses and orchids have been growing very well like this.



Side question:

Do your orchids flower by any chance? If so, what type of lighting do you use?


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## erikm (Oct 1, 2015)

The orchids planted on spyra were divisions and now have new roots and new leaf growth. No flowering for a while still. 

I use jungle dawn led bulbs, the 13 watt version.


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## hydrophyte (Jun 5, 2009)

Here is moss growth along with a few small vascular plants on the Spyra panel in one of my Shadowbox enclosures. These are the tropical mosses that I got from Chuck. They are doing really well with active new growth...


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