# To Noobs & Old Skool Vets ... What Are/Were Your Mental Roadblocks?



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

Hey Everyone!

I was thinking about some things today and I figured maybe we all could discuss/share it here. 

Ive been in this hobby for about 1yr 1/2 now, and not only am I STILL learning things (i feel like sometimes i just started out!), but ive come to the realization that being in the DF Hobby is not only a physical chore, but alot of it is mental too. Ive made mistakes here and there and i had to learn the hard way alot of times, and unfortunately (like most of us i assume), sometimes those mistakes came at the expense of our frogs. 
Ive also come to the realization that I pretty much still know NOTHING except the common sense things. (Hope that makes sense).

My roadblocks were probably some that everyone has had to deal with at some point in time. Ive had to tear down my tank and start over bc of my own stupidity and not sterilizing things before putting them into the tank. Weve ALL had to deal with the unexpected frog deaths. 

For example, I JUST got a pair of 2 yr old frogs in the mail this past weekend. Beautiful Frogs. I was very excited when I got them. Ive had my new, empty tank setup now for almost 3 mo (i think) and it was doing good plantwise, humidity ... etc ... then the very next day after i got them, the female was dead. Such a disappointment to say the least. And for a brief second I thought to myself, "I cant do this. Im in over my head", "What if everything Im doing is wrong" ... etc ... but after I thought about it I knew it was just bad luck. Its just things like this that suck. Yea, the hobby is enjoyable, but sometimes I feel like Im never going to get to that point. Everyone is always talking about, "My tank is awesome, I have this, this and this ... etc ... " ... 

UMMMMM, Can I Have That PLS!?!!? (lol) 
I want beautiful, breeding, long lived frogs. I want that lush overgrown tank you see in all the pictures. I want that perfect viv that maintains humidity and temp and all the wonderful micro fauna ... PLEASE! 

I mean its a catch 22 sometimes ... I have nice, expensive jewel orchids/plants in a glass covered tank BUT they need a fan for good air circulation ... BUT, if i keep the fan on, then itll drop my humidity too low, and if I turn it off, the plants will rot and die ... OK, so I just mist more often ... BUT ... too much moisture will rot my plants, too little will kill my frogs ... ETC ... Does anyone see my point??!!?? Damned if you do, damned if you dont!

Its either the plants or the frogs ... but why cant I have both??? I know some of you have found that perfect equilibrium, and from what ive read, Im not really doing anything differently then any of you, so why isnt it working out for me??? 

THESE are the things that go through my head sometimes, and I think maybe through all of yours too ... 

So my question to everyone is this ...

1. What have been some of YOUR mental/physical roadblocks in this hobby
2. What did you do to overcome these dilemmas/roadblocks?

Thx everyone ... I look forward to hearing your stories & advice (Noobs and Vets alike)

Nick Gamble

(I hope this post made sense to all of you ... lol)


----------



## Tony (Oct 13, 2008)

Gamble said:


> Weve ALL had to deal with the unexpected frog deaths.


That one is never fun. I lost one of my favorite frogs for no apparent reason a few months ago, she just dropped from her leaf and died a few hours later. I have lost my share of frogs over the years, but this was a real kick in the nuts. Nothing you can do except learn from your mistakes and accept the fact that sometimes you lose a frog even when you do everything right.


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

WOW ... that is a gorgeous frog. Great pic! Im sorry for your loss.


----------



## skylsdale (Sep 16, 2007)

> I mean its a catch 22 sometimes ... I have nice, expensive jewel orchids/plants in a glass covered tank BUT they need a fan for good air circulation ... BUT, if i keep the fan on, then itll drop my humidity too low, and if I turn it off, the plants will rot and die ... OK, so I just mist more often ... BUT ... too much moisture will rot my plants, too little will kill my frogs ... ETC ... Does anyone see my point??!!?? Damned if you do, damned if you dont!


Air circulation and air exchange/ventilation aren't the same things. You can have good air circulation within an enclosed system. As long as you're not drawing in air from outside the tank, the humidity shouldn't really drop.


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

skylsdale said:


> Air circulation and air exchange/ventilation aren't the same things. You can have good air circulation within an enclosed system. As long as you're not drawing in air from outside the tank, the humidity shouldn't really drop.


Firstly, No where in my article did i mention AE/Ventilation; so where your comparison comes from im not sure. Second, im not drawing in air from outside the tank but it does indeed drop quicker than it did before the fan was installed. 3rd, your response has nothing to do with the topic of the article/post but i do thank you for sharing. That being said, we would all love to hear any stories you have in reference to the topic if you have any. THX


----------



## skylsdale (Sep 16, 2007)

Sorry. Next time I'll skip over the page and a half of anecdotes, stories, complaints, frustrations and ...etc's... that lead up to the actual questions.


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

skylsdale said:


> Sorry. Next time I'll skip over the page and a half of anecdotes, stories, complaints, frustrations and ...etc's... that lead up to the actual questions.


Obviously u didnt read the post correctly bc the whole point of it was to get stories and anecdotes from people, not my own personal questions answered! Just add your own personal stories/anecdotes! Jeez lol ... someone needs a hug!


----------



## porkchop48 (May 16, 2006)

Fruit flies was my thing - I just could not get into the groove of making fruit flies weekly/ bi weekley.

And spraying tanks. I have no idea why I could not get into the habit of spraying tanks. It was awful


----------



## Boondoggle (Dec 9, 2007)

No real roadblocks to share, but I think a source of those in this hobby is often the fact that so many of us get overzealous and get a lot of tanks going early on. A great way to approach the hobby (in my opinion) is to get a young pair and keep them for a couple years. Get some eggs out of them, raise some tads, sell the babies to fund an eventual purchase of another tank and pair. If you grow slowly then each new addition isn't really a roadblock because you have your system down and you are only adding one more small element.

Conversely, if your collection explodes very quickly then it doesn't take much to upset the apple cart.

That being said, everyone will have feeder crashes and mystery deaths if given enough time.


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

Good Advice!


----------



## angry gary (Dec 9, 2009)

sounds like too much caffeine! 

you sound like i did at first. way over thinking things. i started out with reef tanks and quickly realized it is too easy to get overwhelmed for no particular reason. when i switched over to dart frogs i forgot to bring that mentality with me at first. now i go with the flow and do the best i can.now if i have what i consider a legitimate question i call someone.(at first i pestered him way too often with questions i could have answered myself if i sat back and gave it some common sense rationalizing.) 
i don't like to post questions here too often because you will get several very differing opinions. all work for that person, but may not work for me.
so i have found someone that i pattern myself after and stick to that. i do not worry or try to emulate a lot of what i see here. there are some incredibly talented people here that design masterpieces with their vivs that i simply am not capable of duplicating. 

i recently went way for 5 days and stressed for a while about my frogs. i decide to feed heavy just before i left and misted heavily and made sure all water features were full of water. and i left. came home early monday morning and when the lights came on everyone was fine.

AG


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

I too crossed over from the fish hobby so I know what u mean. I agree, over thinking does happen sometimes but I guess that's to be expected when some of us r spending the kind of $ we spend on our animals. But there too is the coralation: Over Doing it is just as bad as not doing enuff .... you gotta find that happy medium between the two.


----------



## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

Tony said:


> That one is never fun. I lost one of my favorite frogs for no apparent reason a few months ago, she just dropped from her leaf and died a few hours later. I have lost my share of frogs over the years, but this was a real kick in the nuts. Nothing you can do except learn from your mistakes and accept the fact that sometimes you lose a frog even when you do everything right.


Sorry to hear that. She really was a beautiful animal---she appears to be smiling!


----------



## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

My biggest roadblock thus far has been moving eggs too early, ruining them with RO/distilled water and lack of air circulation in the tank causing fungus to proliferate, which reduces egg survival in situ.


----------



## zBrinks (Jul 16, 2006)

One of my biggest roadblocks in this hobby has been the lack of respect from some froggers to others, when they really deserve it. 

We have to remember that this isn't high school - we're dealing with a wide range of ages and backgrounds with users. It never hurts to post with that in mind. Keep the childish slang and crude jokes at home - it's way too easy to be misinterpreted over the internet.


----------



## VenomR00 (Apr 23, 2010)

I agree with you Zbrinks... I just got into Darts (About a year ago) and have come to realize that even at the age of 21 I am one of the younger members (I do know there are others around my age or younger but I am just referring to people that don't pay there bills and such) and sometimes I take the route that means trial and error. I.E. building a tank that is self sufficent, which hasn't happened yet, but I could easily have asked prior to it crashing =P... I also post aggressively sometimes to defined my points when I don't have to.

I think my other road block is finding a freaking way to get moss to actually grow... all it ever seems to do is mold over and die (which I still don't understand). Anyone have issues with this tell me how you solved much would be appricated.


----------



## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

VenomR00 said:


> I agree with you Zbrinks... I just got into Darts (About a year ago) and have come to realize that even at the age of 21 I am one of the younger members (I do know there are others around my age or younger but I am just referring to people that don't pay there bills and such) and sometimes I take the route that means trial and error. I.E. building a tank that is self sufficent, which hasn't happened yet, but I could easily have asked prior to it crashing =P... I also post aggressively sometimes to defined my points when I don't have to.
> 
> I think my other road block is finding a freaking way to get moss to actually grow... all it ever seems to do is mold over and die (which I still don't understand). Anyone have issues with this tell me how you solved much would be appricated.


Is that mold a white hairy fungus? If so, keeping it really dew-laden might do the trick, or just wipe it down when you see it in the tank. Good ventilation helps. 

Vitamin supps. also can kill the mold. If you are getting dusting powder on it, it's doing that. I can get you a contact who has some moss that's resistant to damage from dusting powder if you send me a PM. I don't want to throw his name out here and speak for him or anything.


----------



## alex111683 (Sep 11, 2010)

I think my biggest road block is constant over worrying. I just got my first set of PDFs and every time I dont count all four of them, I start searching the tank wich is probably stressing them out. Even right before I got them, I go the same feeling I did when my daughter was coming home for the first time, "I hope I can do EVERYTHING right!!"


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

Yea I know what u mean! I used to do the same thing!


----------



## tclipse (Sep 19, 2009)

alex111683 said:


> I think my biggest road block is constant over worrying. I just got my first set of PDFs and every time I dont count all four of them, *I start searching the tank wich is probably stressing them out.* Even right before I got them, I go the same feeling I did when my daughter was coming home for the first time, "I hope I can do EVERYTHING right!!"


Every time you get the urge to do that, don't. I think a lot of us had to grow out of that phase at the beginning... eventually you'll notice that the less you mess with the tank, the more they come out in the open.


----------



## SMenigoz (Feb 17, 2004)

I think an answer to your posted question is "BALANCE". 
Start with the tank design--did you overthink every last detail to the point where you can only see the flaws? Did you insist on putting in an intricate water feature with little previous experience? Do you think that your tank will be "different" from many others and control the water instead of accepting that water will find its OWN way?
Plants-- many first tanks I've seen are terriffic...for the first few months. The tanks are planted to accomodate the present size of the plants with little thought given to future growth. Cramming a dozen species of plants into a tank yields instant satisfaction--how many of us have had to do major re-designs a few months into the life of the tank? Balance the plants with their future growth. I've found that my new tanks are somewhat naked...experience has taught me to plant for a year down the road.
Frogs--am I providing all the needs of the frogs while balancing MY needs to see them? Seems like a dilemma--frogs hide. Don't fight it. If they are always hiding, ask yourself why? I've found that frogs hide less in a well planted tank, where they are a short hop from security. How about designing a few visual lanes (don't plant there) where you can 
see the back of the tank?
Best of luck,
Scott


----------



## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

earthfrog said:


> Is that mold a white hairy fungus? If so, keeping it really dew-laden might do the trick, or just wipe it down when you see it in the tank. Good ventilation helps.
> 
> Vitamin supps. also can kill the *MOSS.* If you are getting dusting powder on it, it's doing that. I can get you a contact who has some moss that's resistant to damage from dusting powder if you send me a PM. I don't want to throw his name out here and speak for him or anything.


_correction of my last post in this thread--sorry_


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

BUMP. ... thread bump ... BUMP


----------



## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

zBrinks said:


> One of my biggest roadblocks in this hobby has been the lack of respect from some froggers to others, when they really deserve it.
> 
> We have to remember that this isn't high school - we're dealing with a wide range of ages and backgrounds with users. It never hurts to post with that in mind. Keep the childish slang and crude jokes at home - it's way too easy to be misinterpreted over the internet.


I agree Zach, this isn't high school and so don't need hall monitors policing everyone and making sure everyone is being nice to one another. We also don't need to be providing day care for someone else's kids. Respect is earned not given.

I couldn't help myself.


----------



## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Gamble said:


> 1. What have been some of YOUR mental/physical roadblocks in this hobby
> 2. What did you do to overcome these dilemmas/roadblocks?


 
Regurgitated dogma without any understanding of the ideas underlying the issue. 

Research, deep breaths and the occasional drink. 

Ed


----------



## DJboston (Oct 25, 2008)

I know this is an older thread....

But I wanted to agree with a lot of the posters in that I've been off and on with Dart Frogs for 12 years. I love them and only things that limited me was college and a few other ventures.

Now I'm back after 5 years out and I realize quantity just burns me out too fast. In my head, I've limited myself to 5 species tops over the next couple years...get breeding perfect, sell some frogs, design some tanks, have some fun.

I used to just set up tanks fast, buy tons of frogs, then get burnt out.

This won't happen anymore. I'm simply enjoying my taste of the hobby with my favorite species and that's it.

IF I decide that after my favorite species are here and breeding for a while and I can handle more, than great! I"ll take the plunge for another pair...

I don't know about now, but I remember around 2005, a lot of herp keeper would sell their collection of snakes and lizards to get into Darts exclusively because they are so enthralled with them at first....then keeping up with all the flies and tanks becomes too much and they sell everything for super cheap.

Just depends on the person...but I'd prefer to do it slowly and right the first time rather than make mistakes. I have great peace of mind this time around!

Not to mention I'm 28 years old now, a little more mature. I appreciate life more, have a long term girlfriend, baby on the way, my own house we're buying and a nice apartment for now...I have a better outlook on life and the things I enjoy. I basically have nothing to prove. I like rare and common species.

Recently a frog guy told me that he knows a BIG collector that thinks Azureus are very common and he simply keeps a pair around for his kids. I will never forget why the big common species are common: It's simple, they're gorgeous and awesome! Common or not, a blue frog is still at the top for one of the most colorful frogs in the hobby!


----------



## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

Good Advice. Youre not the 1st person ive heard say that ... take it slow. 

A friend of mine on here told me one day ... "Start slow and work your way up. Everyone that gets into the hobby and goes balls to the wall are the ones who eventually leave the hobby entirely bc they did too much too fast and the ones that take their time and build their collection slowly are the ones you see in the hobby for years and years" ... 

Point being, i hear that from quite a few people so it must not be a coincidence ... so the message to the new people in the hobby is ... 

TAKE YOUR TIME. 

Learn all u can and take the time to enjoy the hobby/your collection bc if u move too fast, before u know it ull be burned out and miss all the enjoyment that brings most of us into the hobby before u even realize that the joy passed u by.


----------

