# 40 gal - Updated Pics 7 25 07



## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

Fire Belly Toad Paludarium Journal - Changed to Leucs instead of FBTs

I decided that I wanted to make an attractive vivarium, so I started to do some research to find out what would be needed for this project. I had also decided that I wanted some kind of animal to be able to run around the greenery. 
For the animal, I decided on Fire Belly Toads. There are multiple reasons for deciding to get FBTs. They are small, they do not each that much, they are cute, they are fairly active, and they are cheap. 
While researching the requirements for FBTs, I found that they enjoy a lot of water, so instead of a vivarium, I will be constructing a paludarium, where more than 50% of the enclosure will be water. My basic plan is to have the right side be water and the left side be land, with a waterfall and stream on the left side that runs into the water on the right hand side. This will make the enclosure about 60% water with the main water and then the waterfall and stream. 
This will be my first venture into anything like this. I will be researching plants, building techniques, FBT needs, available supplies, and doing everything nicely, but cheaply as well. My plan is to build a place that 3 to 4 toads will really enjoy, and will be attractive to the observer as well.
I am going to keep track of the costs of the project along the way, as I think it will help people in the future in determining a budget for their projects. First off I needed to find an aquarium. I will be placing the aquarium on a dresser that is 36” wide by 16” deep. So, naturally I want to find the largest aquarium that I can that will fit in this space. I decided a 29 gallon aquarium would be perfect, as it is 30” across and 12 ½” deep and 17” high. So I set out on September 30th to find such a tank for cheap. Since EBAY was not much help, due to none available at this time in my area, I decided the cheapest thing would be to find one at a garage sale. After almost 2 hours of fruitless searching, the largest I had found was a 10 gallon for $10, I found a 20 gallon tall for $10. I quickly snatched it up and took it home. I had wanted a 29 gallon, but I could not argue with such a good deal on the 20, and the only difference is that it is only 24” across instead of 30”. So this will be my starting point if I don’t find a 29 gallon before construction begins. The great thing is that the 20 gallon came with some stuff. It has a plastic top with light, a net, a Top Fin 10 Filter, which is a Whisper 10 sold by PetSmart, a water heater, an air pump (Whisper 800), a large castle thing (not needed), some fish food, and a bottle of , I think, water conditioner. I need to start working on getting the aquarium and filter cleaned up.
I started looking around at places to purchase FBTs, I have not found many options. I like the enclosure for the FBTs at PetSmart a lot more than the one at Petco. At PetSmart they had them in an aquarium with lots of water and rocks and a filter. At Petco they keep them in a terrarium with a water bowl. Both are overcrowded of course, but the PetSmart set up is much better.
I was able to trade my 20 gallon and $25, for a 39 gallon tank. It is 36” wide X 12 ½” deep and 20” tall, with a wood look veneer. I also gave the air pump, filter, castle, and top from the 20 gallon I purchased to my mother in law, for her to use with her gold fish in a 10 gallon tank. I did not need these things, and her filter happened to quit working last week.
My design plans so far are: The main land area will be on the left hand side and it is 8” deep and 15” across the front. Behind the main land area there will be a waterfall that flows toward the right along the back wall. (This takes up the back 4” of the aquarium, approximately.) The water fall will be about 15” high and have a 4-6” drop into a pool, it will then flow down a stream to drop off into the main water about 13” away. The left back corner will have a 4” pipe for access to the pump and the water fall will flow out of a hole in this pipe. There will be two thin pieces of driftwood running on both sides of the stream.
There will also be a totally separate land area on the right hand side that is 7” X 6”. The land areas will have 1” clay expanded pellets and 2” of coco fiber. There will be about ½” of air between the water and the egg crate. The back will be made with Great Stuff and silicon with coco. It is false bottom setup with a water level of 3 ¾”. It will have high humidity and day time temps of 72-79. Night time temp of 68-73. Water temp 71-74. In total there will be about 7 gallons of water.
I made a trip to the hardware store to pick up some supplies on October 13th. Total expenditure $54.38. I picked up 1 can of Great stuff, 2 tubes of GE II silicone in brown, ½ cubic foot of river rocks (about 40 lbs, I am guessing), 1 egg crate light diffuser, 4” irrigation drain pipe (flexible about 8 feet long), a 6 outlet power surge adapter, 3 plastic pipe adapters that are 4 ¼” tall, and 3 feet of 5/16” tubing for the waterfall.
I have siliconed the sides of the tank and the bottom half of the back. This is to hide the great stuff and the back of the water area. I can tell I will be needing more silicone. I also purchased some cypress driftwood on Ebay from Driftwood Mary. (http://stores.ebay.com/SWAMPS-of-LOUISIANA) It looks great, just as advertised, I am very pleased. Cost $18.11.
I purchased a water pump from Harbor Freight tools. It pumps 66 GPH, has three settings and seems to work very well. I rigged it in a pitcher up to 15”, which is the height of my waterfall, and it was putting out plenty of water. It was on sale for $4.99, $5.48 with tax. I wish now that I would bought 2 so that I had a backup. I was able to stop by a rock yard last night and get some great rocks. They are called Salt Creek, they are smooth and had a large variety of sizes. I picked 4 that had the height and angles that I wanted. I was looking for a height of 3” - 5” so the toads could be partially submerged if they wanted to. They sell for $140/ton. But even with the 25% additional charge for hand picking them the grand total was all of $0.69. I also picked some needle work plastic grid. Cost $1.07. This will be used on the sides of the egg crate to keep things out from under the land areas.
Total cost so far is $114.73. I am trying to keep the cost under $225. This is my Christmas present this year. The main things left to purchase are the plants, coco soil, another tube of silicone or two, fiberglass window screen, glass top, lights, Whisper 10i filter, and maybe a coco hut. I have a friend in the hydroponics business that is donating the clay pellets to me. 
I am up for any suggestions, and I will try to get a picture and a sketch posted next week. I am especially interested in lighting and plant suggestions.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

I will be updating the journal shortly with some pictures of the foaming process and update on costs as well. But I have a question concering lighting. I will be ordering a light kit from AH Supply, but I am not sure which one to get. I have it narrowed down to either the 2X36, for 72 watts or just get the 96 watt kit. I am a little afraid that the 96 watt would be too much. Cost is about equal for the two, I just do not want too little, or too much light.

The plants will be broms, some vines like peperomia japonica and dischidia rustfilia, and Lilaeopsis brasiliensis for the floor of the water portion.

Thank you for any input.


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## Frog10 (Oct 18, 2006)

Sounds good. Btw whats a paladarium? lol


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## defaced (May 23, 2005)

http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=lang_en&safe=off&q=paludarium&btnG=Search


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

I think he was pointing out that I should have spelled it paludarium instead of paladarium. I got a little carried away with my a's.

Anyhow, the lighting issue was solved. They are out of the 36 watt bulbs in 6700K, they are on backorder. So I just decided to get the 96 watt kit in 6700K. It should be more than enough light. 

The top is my last expense and I am still deciding how I want to do it. I am thinking about using a 30" and making vents in the other 6", 3" on each side. Or maybe one 3" vent, and cover the other opening with another piece of glass.

If I went with an all glass top (36") wouldn't that keep the humidity up close 100%? FBT only need humidity around 80%.


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## porkchop (Aug 29, 2005)

I have over 40 PDFs, and 2 firebelly toads.
The toads are my wife's favorites, they actually are very bold w/ alot of character, she likes to sneak up on them and scare em so they duck under water and sit there, like they cant be seen. They are fun to watch and all around great frogs. But mine eat alot, anything they can get in their mouth.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

That's neat to hear Porkchop. I am hoping they will be very active. My 6 year old daugther is really looking forward to them. I think she will have a hard time with the paludarium sitting there with plants and everything for 3-4 weeks before we get the toads. She will probably ask everyday if it is the day we pick them up.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

My updates are very wordy, but it is keeping a log of every purchase, and I hope it is helpful. I will have pictures soon, just not quite yet.

I reread the rules about vendors and I think I am fine. I am posting sources that I use to acquire items, but I am not commenting about service or anything else, so I think I am in line with the rules. If a moderator feels differently please let me know. I always try to obey the rules of a forum.

I have been very slow in my work on the paladarium lately. Some illness and vacation and such. I purchased another can of Great Stuff, window screen, and a Whisper 10i filter from Walmart. So that brings my total expenses to $135.10. 
I drilled some holes in my PVC supports and cut some more egg crate. On Nov 1st I glued together the main false bottom area with gorilla glue. I also ordered a 20 gallon horizontal brom package from Antone (Frogbroms.com) $36. He will ship it on November 8th. At the hardware store I picked up another bottle of GE Silicone II in brown, about $5.
I have finished all of the egg crate cutting, and putting on window screen and mesh to keep things out from under the egg crate. I used silicon to hold the mesh and screen in place. On Nov 2nd I started using the Great Stuff. I used both 12 oz cans that night over the course of about 3 hours, applying water and waiting between applications. On Nov 5th I used part of a 3rd can and I am almost done with it. I just need a little more height on the land portion on the right hand side of the tank.
I placed an order with Tropical Inhabitants (http://www.tropicalinhabitants.com) on Nov 6th. I needed to start ordering plants before it turns too cold. I purchased the 7 cuttings for $10 deal and I picked out:
Dischidia nummularia qty 2 and Dischidia rusifilia. These will hang down from little planters in the background. 
Fittona argyroneura (small red)
Peperomia japonica
Pilea Glauca qty 2.

And 1 aquatic plant.
Lilaeopsis brasiliensis. This will go on the ramp into the water, and hopefully spread out over all of the water portion. I believe this is also called mondo grass.

Total cost for these plants was $20.75 including shipping.

I have been researching and debating myself over lighting for a couple of weeks now. I find it very hard to get really good information about lighting for vivariums. I ended up choosing to go with AH Supply in New York. (http://www.ahsupply.com/) They are well known in the planted tank forums, reef forums, and vivarium forums. They have an extremely solid reputation in all of these places, and they come highly recommended. I really tried looking at other options, but none of them met my needs as well. I tried really hard to find other ways, due to the price, but I could not find anything that came close to the quality for the price. Also, I cannot use 4 foot lights due to location, so that severely limited my options. I ended up getting the 96watt bright kit with a 6700K bulb. Total cost $103.33. I am going to build the enclosure for the lights, as it would have added $55 to the cost to buy one from them, with shipping. The only thing I am still worried about is it being too bright, but there are ways to fix that, so all should be well.

I purchased another can of great stuff, a pvc pipe for the electrical cord of my filter to feed through, some spaghum moss, charcoal, some zeolite for the filter, and bed a beast. Total cost of all of these was about $24.50.

Which brings my total to date at $324.68. 

I have bought a few more things. Stainless screen for ventilation and a ground fault circuit interrupter outlet from McMaster-Carr. (http://www.mcmaster.com)(The GFCI is recommended for use with any power strip when used with an aquarium. This is probably not necessary, but I am trying to do things safely.) With shipping, those were $24.01. 
I received my lights for AH Supply and I bought the wood and supplies to make a light enclosure. I spent about $36 for the wood, nails, stain/polyurethane, and sandpaper. (The thought has crossed my mind that I should have just bought an enclosure from them.) Also 2 more tubes of silicone, some pea gravel, and a lucky bamboo plant costs another $26. From Drs Foster and Smith, I ordered a 36” glass top, amquel water conditioner, and Digital Thermo-Hygrometer to determine temperature and humidity. Cost $52.86. (The 36” glass top was not available locally.)

So total cost is now about $463.55. (I have done some estimating from time to time, but this is pretty accurate.)

I spent a lot of time this last weekend applying silicone and coco bedding to the background of the paludarium. I have taken some pictures and will be posting them shortly, I still need to get them off of my camera.

Just as a note, the pea gravel will be used in front of the false bottom to hide it, it will not be used anywhere that the toads can get to it. I meant to leave more room between the front glass and the false bottom, I was going to use the river rock to fill in, but there is not enough room. Unlike dart frogs, FBTs don’t use their tongue to get food, they lunge at it. This means it is best to avoid moss and anything small enough for them to get into their mouth that they cannot digest, like pea gravel and aquarium gravel. (I am sorry that I do not have any pictures yet.)


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

Finally I have some pictures. I will try one first to make sure it works.










This is the tank on its back with the main false bottom and 4" irrigation pipe for access to the pump for the waterfall.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

Let the Great stuff foaming begin.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

You might have noticed that the ramp is removable. This allow access to the water heater and for cleaning out under the main false bottom if needed.










Then I started with the silicone and coco application process. I just need to touch up some places and this will be done this week.










The next 4 pictures are the plants that I received from Frogbroms.com and Tropicalinhabitants.com. The Broms from Antone, the rest from Kevin. The ramp is complete, and the Lilaeopsis brasiliensis is put directly onto it so that it will move easily when putting it into the paludarium.





































I wanted to point out that I received 7 broms from Antone. One of the "Midget" is hiding in this picture.


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## joeyo90 (Nov 5, 2006)

wow... nice looking plants and a very nice looking tank keep us updated  i love watching construction posts! i should put one of my own up soon...


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## c'est ma (Sep 11, 2004)

Brett,

Just wanted to let you know that I've been following along avidly. Don't ever apologize for all the detail--I think it's fascinating, and educational as well. I am amazed at your organization and that looks like some pretty fancy viv engineering too! Your photo record is just as meticulous and nicely illustrative.

FWIW, I've had FBTs in a tank with aquarium gravel for a couple of years now, with no problems, but that's probably because the water level is maybe 6" deep or so and they never feed off the bottom. Having watched their feeding frenzies (sometimes they clamp down on each other's limbs) I can see how inadvertant ingestion could be a problem!


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

Thanks Diane,

My water level will be between 3.75" and 4". I can understand that at 6" deep it would probably not be a problem. It would probably never be a problem for me either, but I think the river rock will look good also, and it is cheap at Lowe's. I boiled the river rocks, pea gravel, and leca. It ruined a stock pot, so that will be my rock boiling pot from now on. I will have to replace the stock pot for making soup.

I looked outside in my front yard last night and I was able to find a nice colony of isopods, called roly polies around these parts, also known as pill pugs. I will be adding them to the paludarium when it is complete. They are supposed to help in keeping the tank clean, and may provide food for the toads as well. Next I need to find, or buy, some springtails. I didn't see a one last night. I do not know if I have ever seen one.

I am also glad that the posts are not too long and boring. I just had never seen anyone break down the individual costs. It seems to me that the biggest thing that drove my costs was the plants I picked, and the amount of light they need. If I would have gone with plants that like lower lights it would have greatly reduced the costs. Their have been some surprises to me on costs. For example, I expected the egg crate to cost $3 or $4, but it was almost $12. And I bought my first can of Great stuff at Lowe's for $5.47, then I saw a post about having it at Walmart for $3.97, so I bought the second two cans there.


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## jimei126 (Nov 11, 2006)

*great post*

Im preparing to start work on my first viv this weekend and I found your psot to be one of the best tools on this entire forum, which by the wya has some very good psots. Thanks for the info and keep posting.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

Everything is really starting to come together now. The paludarium is getting close to being complete. I have the substrate in and the Whisper 10i filter has been running for about 1 week. I finished wiring and installing the lights, but still need to finish the hooks in the ceiling to mount the lights. I plan to hook up the waterfall pump tonight. The other thing I need to do is put in the vents and access for the cords through the plastic section of the glass top. 

Last night while working on the ceiling hooks I dropped my screwdriver and broke one of my pieces of glass on the glass top. I should have put a towel or something over it so that it would absorb the shock, and maybe not break. Now I have to get a new piece of glass cut to replace the one that broke.

The water heater works great, I set it a bit too high at first and it kept the water at a steady 77 degrees. I am setting it a little cooler now, I would like to keep the water temp around 73 to 74. 

I will have a picture or two within a week. I left my camera at a relative’s house over Thanksgiving, but they are mailing it to me.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

YEAH. I am almost completely done. I replaced the glass that I broke. Cost $9.77, but I would not include that in my total, since it was just my dumb mistake. 
The lights are hanging over the enclosure. I decided to hang them from the ceiling mainly so that I can adjust them easily when needed. For instance, in the summer they may be 2” above, but in winter they may be right on the tank. My house is old and drafty so watching the temperature is a big deal. The hooks for the ceiling were $5/piece, but they can support 40lbs a piece. The chain was about $12, and the hooks on the light enclosure were $7. I had to spend $20 to buy some drill bits that were the right size for the holes I drilled into the wood with the light enclosure. (I will not include that in the total cost, as it is not part of the Paludarium itself.) The light is bright, but it does not reach all of the front areas as much as I would like. This is mainly due to the placement such that the front of the glass top can still be opened with the lights in place. I would assume this is completely normal for all vivariums of this design. If it bugs me enough I will look for ways to add lights, but probably not.

I fully planted the tank last night. It is really nice to see all the plants in their places. I wish I could take a picture, but my camera has not made it back to me yet. I will post pictures as soon as possible.

I have an order for Josh’s frogs that I am waiting on. The only thing that it has directly for the paludarium is a coco hut. It also has some springtails and calcium and vitamins and things. Total cost was just less than $50.

I am seeing a little bit of the white growth that seems to affect all enclosures after they are first set up. I will be adding some isopods tonight and hopefully some springtails to start taking care of janitor duties in the paludarium.

Getting the vents cut and then attached in place in the plastic strip behind the glass panels has been a lot more work than I was anticipating. That plastic is harder to cut than I expected. I ended up having the best success using a dremel and cutting discs that I usually use to cut steel. I used gorilla glue with some success, but it is hard to use because it has to be clamped tightly for 3 to 4 hours. Last night some of the glue stuck more to the wood I had put on top of it to hold it in place than the plastic it was supposed to stick to. In frustration late last night I used some brown silicon to get it to stick. Then I had to rework some areas this morning as well. The only thing left is to cut some small notches for the three electric cords.

So, I believe that brings my total to $542.55. 
Right about double my original budget of $225. 

Final pictures will be added shortly.


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## c'est ma (Sep 11, 2004)

Ah, yes! About double one's budget sounds very familiar!  

I can't wait to see those pictures!


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

I received my camera in the mail yesterday, so now I can post some pictures.

The first one is after the leca was put in before the substrate.









Then a full tank shot.










Then a few of the left side.




































Then the right side














































and a couple of the waterfall/stream.


















and lastly a full tank with the light canopy that I made.


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## c'est ma (Sep 11, 2004)

Brett--

Super job--it looks beautiful! And it will only get moreso as your plants take hold and grow in!

Your stream looks so natural and pleasing! What a great job. I really like the way the filter is screened from view and yet so very accessible in the pond.

The walls of your pond are quite steep, but I expect FBTs will be able to clamber in and out, assuming that all the rockwork on the sides is cemented firmly in place. 

Are you planning on getting your inhabitants soon? I would advise waiting for a while to give your ground plants time to get established. FBTs are real blunderbusses. Besides, I'm sure you've just discovered that even an "unoccupied" viv is mesmerizing. Especially once you start adding the inverts. I had such a teeming population of springs in my pum viv--till a day after I added the frogs... :? 

So, is your entire light canopy hanging? I can't quite picture it...It does sound like a good idea to be able to back off a little on the light proximity for heat regulation.

Is your daughter enjoying this fascinating new little world?


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

Thanks C'est ma,

The walls are a bit steep. I could not really figure out a better way to still have 3" of substrate above the false bottom. The ramp on the left hand side really helps, but the right hand one is pretty steep. On the right hand side I did silicone some of the rocks to help them get up there. They seem to be able to get where ever they want to go though, so I think it will be alright.

The only thing I do not like is that I made the land mass on the right hand side a little too big. I still might redo it sometime in the future. I would only make it about 1/2 as long, left to right, and just a little bit smaller, front to back. The filter is a little crowded back there.

I will be waiting until Christmas, or right after to add the FBTs. This will give it about 4 to 5 weeks to grow in. I know even longer would probably be better, but I told my daughter Christmas, so I can't put it off too long after Christmas.

It is not really a good picture of the lights, as I did not know if anyone would be interested in it. But, if you look at the last picture on the left hand side of the light enclosure you can see the hooks and some chains, the right hand side blends with the background to much. Right now it is just setting on the tank, and the chains are actually slacked. But in warmer times I can shorten the chains to raise it up.

I am really enjoying watching the isopods walking around the paludarium. I put about 7 isopods in, and I can usually find at least one. I have put about a dozen temperate springtails in so far. I have only seen one of them since they were put in, but that is not too surprising, I might add some more springtails tonight. I need to make their culture larger anyway. They are currently in a 52 oz container, but I need to move them to their 5 quart container. Of course, I have to find the lid to the 5 quart container first.

There is another comment I want to make. If you noticed the water (aquarium) thermometer and wondered if it worked well in that position to tell the temperature of the water, the answer is no. It was reading 77 last night, but when I used my digital laser thermometer the water read 82 to 83. I imagine the reason for the difference is that the aquarium thermometer is not completely under water. So, I have unplugged my underwater heater, and tonight I will adjust its thermostat down a bit. I would like my water temp in the 71 to 75 range. The digital Fluker's humidity gauge and temp gauge outside the paludarium is outside for the pictures. I have been moving it around to get a feel for the temps and humidity at different places in the paludarium.


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## brettlt (Oct 5, 2006)

I decided it was time for an update. I originally finished setting this up at Thanksgiving 06. Afterwards I decided to go with PDFs, so some changes were made. Also some of the broms were getting too wet so they were moved away from the waterfall. A large piece of driftwood was added, which turned out to be hollow, and the frogs love it.

Another change is that I added some Philendron. I kind of like the look without the Philendron, but I have found that the frogs really love this plant. They like to climb all over it. For a couple of months 3 to all 4 of them would sleep on the same leaf just under the large driftwood. That leaf finally died and they all went there seperate ways for sleeping quarters. The addition of the large leaved plant really seems to be great for the frogs. It creates a little more crowded jungle than I originally planned, but I think it is important for the frogs.

All of the changes were done before the frogs were added. It has 4 Leucs from Vivarium Concepts. The frogs were added in April of 07. They are all doing great, though a tad bit plump. I have been cutting down how many flies I put in to put them on a bit of a diet. Two cultures every two weeks is more than enough. They also get tropical and temperate springtails and tropical isopods as supplements to the wingless flies.





































And a pic of one of the inhabitants.


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