# Is my vivarium ready for frogs?



## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

I made a false bottom with LECA and bought two substrate barriers from Josh's Frogs to put on top, on top of that is ABG mix, on top of that is some sphagnum moss and finally on top of that is oak and magnolia leaf litter.

I planted 9 plants and 5 bromeliads. I don't know the brom species.

I created a background with Great Stuff, aquarium sealant, and cocofibre all recommended by Josh's Frogs.

I added a culture of springtails and a culture of dwarf white isopods.

My lighting is a compact top with 2 Josh's Frogs 13 watt LED grow lights. I have a 5. Tropical UVB light and fixture on the way here now.

My humidity stays between 80%-99% and I have a digital temp/hygrometer. The temperature is usually around 70 Fahrenheit 

I have cultures of springtails and isopods in sterilite bins that I have been trying to care for 

I wanted to order some wingless fruit fly cultures from Josh's Frogs that will come with the frogs and I have all of the things needed to make my own cultures when I receive the flies. I plan to use Melanogaster.

I am going to be buying 'Azureus' frogs and my goal is to find a pair out of 5 froglets. After I get a pair I plan to continue caring for the other 3 in separate vivariums which I am creating right now.

I have 3 Repashy vitamins: Calcium Plus, Vitamin A, and Superpig. 

I have a water dechlorinator and only use dechlorinated water.

I hope I remembered everything. 

Can you please let me know if I am missing anything or if I am almost ready to order my froglets?


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## Harpspiel (Jan 18, 2015)

Remove the sphagnum layer under the leaf litter. Also, that's a lot of sphagnum all around the tank - I would remove most of it from around the base of the bromeliads, and if you're mounting a plant with sphagnum you usually just need a few pieces per plant. The bromeliads need to be aiming straight up or close to it, they "drink" by having standing water in the cups between their leaves.

80-99% humidity is probably too high, but it depends on where you have your hygrometer (near the bottom will be much more humid) and other people on here will tell you that hygrometers are notoriously unreliable. Aim for having some wet spots and some dry spots at all times in the tank rather than a specific humidity number.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

The tank is exceedingly bright. The frogs will likely not love how bright it is, and coupled with what looks to be relatively few hiding places you'll have stressed out frogs. 

What is the bright white thing on the right hand side? Is it great stuff that hasn't been covered with anything?

As mentioned, the spaghnum moss on top of the substrate is an outdated and poor husbandry practice. 

This tank also looks very small for 5 froglets, particularly as it is currently setup


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

I removed the spaghnum under the leaves and stood up the broms more, does it look better now? 

For the humidity I can remove the glass on top and slide it back for more ventilation to see if that helps.
What should I be aiming for as far as humidity goes? 

Thank you for your help


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

What would you suggest for more hiding places? Also, it will not be a permanent home for the froglets, I am currently creating more vivariums to keep the others in. This vivarium is being set up to keep one pair, however I have to find a male and a female froglet first.

Do you suggest I just buy a sexed pair to begin with rather than trying to get my own pairs out of 5 froglets?


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

What would you suggest for more hiding places? Also, it will not be a permanent home for the froglets, I am currently creating more vivariums to keep the others in. This vivarium is being set up to keep one pair, however I have to find a male and a female froglet first.

Do you suggest I just buy a sexed pair to begin with rather than trying to get my own pairs out of 5 froglets?

EDIT: The bright white thing is the camera flash and the light catching on a piece of woo

What do you suggest I should do to make the light less obtrusive to the froglets?
.


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## Lincoln B (Jan 29, 2021)

What are the tank dimensions? This tank seems better suited for more willing climbers. Depending on the dimensions you could probably get away with a pair but I think 5 tincs (even juvies) is a bad idea. You could maybe get them all to adult size but I think you're more likely to stunt the growth of all of them. I'd say if you're set on raising a group and splitting them up just go to Petco and get a 75g breeder tank. Not sure if they are on sale but when they are they are like $100


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

Is there a way to find a sexed pair? I definitely don't want to stunt any poor little frogs. I'd much rather just buy a pair to begin with than possibly injure anybody. 

The tank dimensions are 18x18x24 which I read is good for a pair of tincs. If I get a different species for this tank what would you suggest? I'm trying to do everything properly before I get the frogs.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

This is helpful to many folks:









So you've made a vivarium...are you ready for dart...


@eMCRay what direction do you have the fans pointing? Pulling outside air in, or vice versa? Pointing inwards / down. Since there is about a half-inch gap between the fan and the top of the viv, it will recirculate a nice mix of viv and outside air - and I can then also cover up the vent from...




www.dendroboard.com





I'd recommend not using a UVB lamp. For the species and situation at hand, it isn't necessary, and has caused trouble for people in similar situations in the past. If you do use UVB, the viv should be tested with a UVB meter ('Solarmeter 6.5') when set up and periodically afterwards.

Calcium Plus already contains Superpig. Calcium Plus also has Vitamin A in sufficient amounts for non-breeding, healthy frogs.


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## Lincoln B (Jan 29, 2021)

^uvb is pretty unnecessary but if you want to use it make sure you turn it off for them to sleep. If it's a dark room you could have it on for a couple hours to add some extra light say from 7pm to 9pm or something but definitely not an overnight situation (they sell outlets with timed on and off). 

If you're not set on tincs for this enclosure (They would appreciate a longer setup/they are much more interesting to watch if they have more "Forest floor" space) then I'd recommend a bold thumbnail or a Leuc morph of some sort. Dart frogs aren't very interactive (no hand feeding or handling) but it's fun to see them exploring their space and finding favorite spots.


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## Lincoln B (Jan 29, 2021)

If you go the smaller frog route I'd recommend some climbing plants (philodendron or a pothos) and maybe get some slightly larger bromeliads (the middle one is probably big enough for them but the ones in the back might be only for looks). I'd recommend moving the middle one somewhere else and get a bromeliad you love for that center spot because it's kind of the center piece


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

Thank you all SO MUCH for helping me out. I am going to rethink azureus and look into other species. I want to get this right so badly. Would Bakhuis do well if I fix the humidity and lighting being too bright?


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Nepenthesx said:


> Thank you all SO MUCH for helping me out. I am going to rethink azureus and look into other species. I want to get this right so badly. Would Bakhuis do well if I fix the humidity and lighting being too bright?


_D. tinctorius_ 'Azureus' and _D. tinctorius_ 'Bakhuis' are the same species. I have 2 'Bakhuis' in a 18 x 18 x 24 currently, and the viv seems a decent size for them -- although I've provided a lot more area on the ground, and climbing opportunities that aren't so vertical:









18 x 18 x 24 slope bottom 'tree fall gap'


I got some great advice about a feature of this viv recently, so I'd like to document the build in gratitude. I had a few things I wanted to accomplish. 1) Maximize interior space overall. Our vivs are so small, I feel the need to not waste any space. 2) Install a sloped bottom, in support of...




www.dendroboard.com





Moisture and illumination level preferences are going to be more or less the same for pretty much all species you'd be considering, FWIW, though _D. leucomelas_ tolerate more dryness and _D. auratus_ are sometimes said not to.


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

Thats good info to have. Do you have any recommendations on what I could add or move to make the vivarium better for Bakhuis? I am also concerned the light is too bright for them, how would I make it so the lighting is less intense? Thank you


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

To lessen the lighting you could remove one of the lamps, or plant a 'canopy' of shading plants (Neoregelia work well for this) higher up. Personally, I only use dimmable lighting for just this reason. I've used the sort of lamp you're talking about, and 2 x 13w isn't excessive in a viv that size, but providing shaded areas is important.

Leucomelas would likely take advantage of the basically vertical surfaces better than tincs.


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

I am going to look at some plants tonight and play around in the vivarium to try and make it more terrestrial. Thank you for the advice. I am hoping for some bakhuis. I will try really hard to make it perfect for them. 

There is so much conflicting information on the internet. I'm glad I came here before getting my frogs.


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

Socratic Monologue said:


> To lessen the lighting you could remove one of the lamps, or plant a 'canopy' of shading plants (Neoregelia work well for this) higher up. Personally, I only use dimmable lighting for just this reason. I've used the sort of lamp you're talking about, and 2 x 13w isn't excessive in a viv that size, but providing shaded areas is important.
> 
> Leucomelas would likely take advantage of the basically vertical surfaces better than tincs.


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

This is what I ended up doing. I bought a large anthurium to provide shade and moved all the branches around to be more horizontal (and I broke a plant in the process! LOL)


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)




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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

View attachment 300340
View attachment 300341


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

Ok I redid it again and I think its better. There is lots of space in the back for the frogs to be on the ground, I took out some wood, moved wood and plants around. I think this is better?


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## tinc2344 (Jul 23, 2008)

If your lights aren't dimmable you can always place a piece or two of window screen on top to diffuse the light a little. Used to do this for a little when I changed out my MH bulbs on the reef tank.


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## Nepenthesx (Jun 4, 2021)

tinc2344 said:


> If your lights aren't dimmable you can always place a piece or two of window screen on top to diffuse the light a little. Used to do this for a little when I changed out my MH bulbs on the reef tank.


That's a really smart idea!


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## Thekla (Aug 2, 2019)

I think everything concerning the tank has already been said. I would have one additional piece of advice regarding the FFFs: Get them a few weeks in advance and see if you're able to culture them properly, otherwise, you risk being without food for your new frogs if something goes wrong.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

Nepenthesx said:


> That's a really smart idea!


I use a simple paper towel for the same effect. Fold for more impact


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