# Im New Here. I have a few Questions?



## Orlandoflor (Sep 27, 2013)

hi well i recently got hooked on frogs and now im looking for the perfect one for me. but i got a few questions. i am planning to get at least a pair of either blue Caucheros, Cristobals, Siquerres pumilio. or blue esperanzas 

question 1. in your opinion which kind will you get? lol

#2 what size enclosure will you get? im planning to get a exo terra the ones with glass doors but i don't know what size i will need.

#3 where is the best place to order supplies like plants, leaf litter, soil and stuff like that. 

i already have the stuff to make the back wall just need a tank to make it in.

i hope you guys can help

Thanks


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## oldlady25715 (Nov 17, 2007)

Welcome! While pumilio are not really difficult to keep, I'd recommend starting with a more affordable frog in case something goes wrong your first time. Like a leuc of azureus. If you really study up and know the ins and outs for stuff like the questions you asked, then maybe it would be ok to risk starting with pumilio, Try to get captive bred as the wild caught, even if treated, often come with all sorts of nasty parasites. Plus its better for hobby and the frogs getting CB. 

If you have your heart set on pumilio, the blue ones aren't as bright in the tank, so I'd go with one of the other two. You probably only want a sexed pair or a trio. Males can kill each other quickly. 

They also require large tanks for their size. I think a 18' x18'x 24' size exo would work for 2 or 3.

There are plenty of reputable vendors of the items you seek on this website. I mix my own substrate because I just can't stand to pay to ship dirt.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

Welcome! Prepare yourself for addiction and financial ruin! 

I can't really recommend starting with pumilio either, but if you are dead set on it at least go with a Captive bred pair or trio. Many of the ones you listed have been coming in WC the last couple years or even recently, and I would not recommend starting with Wild caught frogs.

So...

1. Not any pumilio. I'd rather see you start with azureus, tincs, truncatus, aurotainia, terriblis, luec, auratus, galacts, or if you want a thumbnail maybe Imitators but I'm not really a fan of people starting with thumbnail frogs either, just their small size makes them challenging in ways other frogs aren't... or aren't as much.

2. I would start with one of the sizes below... 
Natural Terrarium Small/Wide
45 x 45 x 45 cm / 18” x 18” x 18” (WxDxH)

Natural Terrarium Small/Tall
45 x 45 x 60 cm / 18” x 18” x 24” (WxDxH)

Natural Terrarium Medium/Low
60 x 45 x 30 cm / 24” x 18” x 12” (WxDxH)

Natural Terrarium Medium/Wide
60 x 45 x 45 cm / 24” x 18” x 18” (WxDxH)

Natural Terrarium Medium/Tall
60 x 45 x 60 cm / 24” x 18” x 24” (WxDxH)

*This one is a bit large for a first viv, but if your ambitious you could go for it*
Natural Terrarium Medium/X-Tall
60 x 45 x 90 cm / 24” x 18” x 36” (WxDxH)

They all fall in the small-medium range of the exoterra line, and are big enough (20 gallons or more) to give a pair or trio or a group some breathing room and help insure there will be enough good habitat if your viv build isn't the greatest and also support a large enough micro fauna popluation the frogs will usually have something to feed on if your cultures collapse or you aren't feeding enough or something. Basically more room generally means a little more margin for error. (And depending on what frogs you get, some are not really best in trios or groups. Like azureus and tincs are best in pairs)

I would also recommend starting a 2nd viv relatively soon after you first one, because if you end up having to pull frogs that are fighting, sick, or just not thriving due to competition, well you need some place to put them. 

Also you should quarantine new frogs or at least be mentally prepared to tear down your viv if frogs start getting sick and/or dying. And again you'll need some place to put any survivors or offspring so a 2nd or 3rd viv and/or maybe a couple of larger sterilite containers made up as make shift quarantine vivs, plant grow out tanks, offspring raising tanks, are good to have around and if you progress at all in this hobby you'll be very glad you had those things ready weeks or months in advance.

Sterilite containers (big tupperware type things, that are around the 10gal size or larger) are cheap, and a drainage layer of leca or gravel, and a bed of sphagnum moss over that is relatively cheap and sufficient as a quarantine tank or temporary viv. You don't even really have to light or plant them, just make sure you at least throw some wood, cork slabs or something in there for the frogs to have plenty of cover.


3. The forum sponsors are a good place to start for buying supplies. Black jungle, josh's frogs, New England Herpetoculture LLC, etc..etc..etc... 

*Anyways I hope I didn't scare you. This stuff really isn't that hard but there are lots of little things you can do at the beginning to make it much easier on yourself later,and that is what some of my above advice is about *

I would also go through these threads if you haven't already, may save yourself from a lot of newbie mistakes/headaches...

*(Go through most of the threads listed in the first post of this one (many more good ones are listed throughout the thread though...)*
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/beginner-discussion/11865-good-threads-read-beginners.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/beginner-discussion/17993-my-top-10-beginner-mistakes.html

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/ge...oper-due-diligence-online-frog-purchases.html


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## tarbo96 (Jan 12, 2006)

I third their thoughts!!! Start with tincs or luecs.


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

I agree with everything that has been said so far. 
I also want to add it's helpful to list your location so that maybe one of the more experienced board members in your area can help mentor you and help you develop good husbandry skills.


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## tarbo96 (Jan 12, 2006)

Rusty_Shackleford said:


> I agree with everything that has been said so far.
> I also want to add it's helpful to list your location so that maybe one of the more experienced board members in your area can help mentor you and help you develop good husbandry skills.


I invited them to Dustin's if they are in Florida.


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## IEatBugs (May 15, 2012)

Rusty_Shackleford said:


> I agree with everything that has been said so far.
> I also want to add it's helpful to list your location so that maybe one of the more experienced board members in your area can help mentor you and help you develop good husbandry skills.


Great info from everyone. Definitely agree with finding a local frogger to befriend. Someone you can talk to directly is an invaluable asset in this hobby!



tarbo96 said:


> I invited them to Dustin's if they are in Florida.


Thanks Bill. I would assume the OP is in FL considering their username but who knows.

If you indeed are in Orlando, I am just about 2.5 hrs south and would welcome you to attend the meet at my place at the end of next month.


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## Orlandoflor (Sep 27, 2013)

hi sorry for the confusion. im am in Bakersfield CA. sorry my user name is my name lol my name is Orlando Flores so i just shortened it.

well anyways about 5 years ago i have some azureus and some luecs i had them for a few years but i got out of them when i got into snakes.

i really dont mind getting some pumilios they are by far one of the nicest frogs i have seen lol. either that or some terribilis. 

and whatever i get i would most likely get a pair.


and i can use all the help lol. when i did have them 5 years ago i was 16 going on 17 so i tried my best. 

so now that i can afford the best for them i decided to get something i really like and if that works out then i will get more lol.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

California is good. Got some froggers out there. I'll go find a link for you.

Ok sorry, I don't know much about California. Is this near to you? If so, definitely try to get there: 
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/west/122985-scads-bringing-wanted.html 
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/west/120130-scads-october.html


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## IEatBugs (May 15, 2012)

haha well, see what happens when one assumes

Either way, all of the info still applies, and your still more than welcome to make a trip to FL


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## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

Orlandoflor said:


> i really dont mind getting some pumilios they are by far one of the nicest frogs i have seen lol. either that or some terribilis.


This may change your mind...









D


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## Orlandoflor (Sep 27, 2013)

wow what kind of frog is that?


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## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

Orlandoflor said:


> wow what kind of frog is that?


Oophaga sylvatica 'El Pangan'.

D


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## VenomR00 (Apr 23, 2010)

Dendro, that isn't fair. Technically they are in the Oophaga family so they are related to pumilo. Show him some that aren't Oophaga.


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## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

VenomR00 said:


> Dendro, that isn't fair. Technically they are in the Oophaga family so they are related to pumilo. Show him some that aren't Oophaga.


Ok 

Andinobates fulguritus









Andinobates dorrsiswansonae









Ameerega yoshina









Ranitomeya sirensis









Excidobates captivus









Ranitomeya cyanovittata









Photo Credits: Mark Pepper, Jason Brown, Evan Twomey.

D


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## Orlandoflor (Sep 27, 2013)

well out of those the ones i like are Ameerega yoshina and Ranitomeya sirensis


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## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

Orlandoflor said:


> well out of those the ones i like are Ameerega yoshina and Ranitomeya sirensis


Then you may like Oophaga granulifera. They come in everything from purple to gold.


























Photo Credits: Richard Frye & UC Berkeley.


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## Orlandoflor (Sep 27, 2013)

yeah those are nice.!!

i have another question. i put this on another thread but i will put it here too. well i have been looking at the lights to get. and i was wondering what should i get for a 18x18x24 exoterra.

plus would those lights work or would they need a uvb light too.


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