# Old Terrarium soil for Garden?



## lapidsilver (Sep 23, 2009)

My gut tells me no, but I might be too paranoid.

I have 3-4 20H worth of ABG mix that was previously used for frogs. I purchased new soil when those frogs were transported to their new larger homes. I didn't want to use the old ABG with different frogs for fear of disease transfer. What about using it in the garden/ landscape? 

What does anyone else do with old soil? 

Thanks!


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## gturmindright (Mar 15, 2006)

Why not? Flower garden for sure.


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## Froggyplush (Oct 28, 2011)

i use mine for plants im growing


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

You could spread chytrid and other pathogens doing this. Liquids should be bleached before disposal. I believe the accepted practice for solid waste is to double bag it before disposal.


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## thedude (Nov 28, 2007)

What Doug said. You could spread a plethora of things outside.

What about if you baked it first? I would think doing that at 350F would do the trick but I could be wrong.


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## hydrophyte (Jun 5, 2009)

I would just bag it up and throw it in the trash.


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## gturmindright (Mar 15, 2006)

Yes. Bag it up before it goes outside to the landfill where no plant or animal life exists. Everything disappears once you throw it away.


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## thedude (Nov 28, 2007)

gturmindright said:


> Yes. Bag it up before it goes outside to the landfill where no plant or animal life exists. Everything disappears once you throw it away.


That's not really the point. First of all, the soil would technically add a bit of organic matter to the landfill, and however insignificant, will actually help other things break down faster. But the main point is, the pathogens won't survive in a landfill, or come into contact with any amphibians. And you should always double bag.

It's not about less trash, its about keeping native populations of amphibians from getting introduced to any pathogens from your captive frogs.

Also, bacteria and other microscopic life forms exist in landfills, that's how stuff is broken down. It's just really slow.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

gturmindright said:


> Yes. Bag it up before it goes outside to the landfill where no plant or animal life exists. Everything disappears once you throw it away.


Are you saying we shouldn't bother with any precautions, whatsoever?

A quote from Ed.


Ed said:


> Bleach won't work nor will most other disinfectants available to the home user. The problem is that the organics will protect the pathogens preventing the bleach from being able to function well, as an additional issue, the use of bleach in this situation will also increase the amount of chlorinated organic materials which can also be an enviromental problem.
> 
> If you cannot pressure cook the materials safely then the safest thing is to double bag it and discard into an accepted waste stream as the landfill will be lined and managed to prevent loss of materials.
> 
> There are a lot of "home" remedies for soil sterilization but most are not sufficiently stable to ensure that exotic pathogens can be eliminated before adding to the enviroment.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

chytrid aint no joke nor is anything else that can pass on to native species that may come from our exotic species (puts the entire hobby in jeopardy due to negative environmental impacts). In hindsight as a reefer, I'm ashamed of what I carelessly poured down the drain, flushed, or tossed in the trash, without a second thought, when I was a nube reefer. Freeze, double bag, do everything you can to responsibly dispose of "waste".


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## lapidsilver (Sep 23, 2009)

Figured as much, and I'm glad I asked.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

lapidsilver said:


> Figured as much, and I'm glad I asked.


Ask and ye shall recieve. Very good question.


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## parkanz2 (Sep 25, 2008)

Doug mentioned bleaching for liquid wastes. What do other people do for viv waste water? I was thinking that most viv waste water has a significant amount of organic matter in it as well from decaying leaf litter, frog poo, and substrate run off.

I was thinking about using it to water house plants that don't go outside. Thoughts?


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## thedude (Nov 28, 2007)

parkanz2 said:


> Doug mentioned bleaching for liquid wastes. What do other people do for viv waste water? I was thinking that most viv waste water has a significant amount of organic matter in it as well from decaying leaf litter, frog poo, and substrate run off.
> 
> I was thinking about using it to water house plants that don't go outside. Thoughts?


That's actually what I do with mine, all the plants in my frogroom that aren't in tanks.


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## littlefrog (Sep 13, 2005)

If you are on a municipal sewer system, they are designed to clean water and remove pathogens... If your municipal sewer isn't doing that, we all have problems. Think about what you flush every day, if that isn't contaminated with organic wastes, bacteria, and viruses, nothing is. If you are on a septic system, then you are also fine. 

I appreciate the fear of chytrid, but it seems like this might be a bit too much paranoia... Chytrid is a fungal pathogen, and a living organism. It can't survive bleach, and it can't magically transport itself out of a septic tank.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

littlefrog said:


> If you are on a municipal sewer system, they are designed to clean water and remove pathogens... If your municipal sewer isn't doing that, we all have problems. Think about what you flush every day, if that isn't contaminated with organic wastes, bacteria, and viruses, nothing is. If you are on a septic system, then you are also fine.
> 
> *I appreciate the fear of chytrid, but it seems like this might be a bit too much paranoia... Chytrid is a fungal pathogen, and a living organism. It can't survive bleach, and it can't magically transport itself out of a septic tank.*


Except for that time when my pump stopped working and it was spilling out into my yard...

Anyway, what I do is syphon the waste water into gallon jugs, add bleach, and let it sit a while. Then I add a bit of dechlorinator before I dump it down the drain. Hope this is an acceptable way to dispose of it. If it's overkill, that's ok. Would rather do too much than not enough.

Oh wait. Let me know if I don't need to dechlorinate. That stuff isn't cheap


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

I would think there really is no reason to use de-chlor on your waste water. The little bit of bleach you use will quickly be diluted by all the other water in the sewer system.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

littlefrog said:


> If you are on a municipal sewer system, they are designed to clean water and remove pathogens... If your municipal sewer isn't doing that, we all have problems. Think about what you flush every day, if that isn't contaminated with organic wastes, bacteria, and viruses, nothing is. If you are on a septic system, then you are also fine.
> 
> I appreciate the fear of chytrid, but it seems like this might be a bit too much paranoia... Chytrid is a fungal pathogen, and a living organism. It can't survive bleach, and it can't magically transport itself out of a septic tank.


While a normal flow may not present much risk (assuming there are no problems in the line or plant(see below)), the sewage systems are typically (at least in the East and much of the Central part of the country) combined with the storm runoff systems. In these cases it isn't uncommon for a moderate to large storm result in the discharge of untreated sewage. In addition, many older cities have issues with sewage leaking into local waterways (see for example http://www-alt.ifz.tu-graz.ac.at/index_en.php/filemanager/download/321 ) so simply dumping it down the drain does put the local ecosystems at risk as well particularly since the treatment of waste water is one of the simplest things we can do to prevent the risk to local amphibian populations... 

Ed


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## thedude (Nov 28, 2007)

Ed said:


> While a normal flow may not present much risk (assuming there are no problems in the line or plant(see below)), the sewage systems are typically (at least in the East and much of the Central part of the country) combined with the storm runoff systems. In these cases it isn't uncommon for a moderate to large storm result in the discharge of untreated sewage. In addition, many older cities have issues with sewage leaking into local waterways (see for example http://www-alt.ifz.tu-graz.ac.at/index_en.php/filemanager/download/321 ) so simply dumping it down the drain does put the local ecosystems at risk as well particularly since the treatment of waste water is one of the simplest things we can do to prevent the risk to local amphibian populations...
> 
> Ed


I was hoping you would chyme in on that comment.

How about baking the soil in the oven? 400 degrees enough to do the trick?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

thedude said:


> I was hoping you would chyme in on that comment.
> 
> How about baking the soil in the oven? 400 degrees enough to do the trick?


You would have to bake it until it the center was hot enough to sterilize the materials which could take hours (and make your house smell terrible)... it is simplier to double bag and dispose into the correct trash stream. Keep in mind that plant cuttings should also be double bagged and disposed of into the trash stream. 

Ed


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## Scott (Feb 17, 2004)

I'm not sure I saw this elsewhere - but I used to use my old ABG soil in "soilless" mixes for African Violets.

They sell African Violet pots that are self watering - and ABG soil is the perfect consistency for it. And if it's used - it's got a little fertilizer in it to boot.

s


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