# Now Future Project - basicly done (update 8-05 )



## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

One of my co-workers gave me a free aquarium he had laying around , I've been trying to get time to pick it up for half a year now. But finally I have it in my posession .

Can we say 75 gal vert . This will be an awesome pumlilo tank .










I Can't wait to get started on this baby . A little cleaning and scrubbin' .... 

Now I can finally use the bigger broms and plants that I bought that will not fit my smaller tanks .


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## crb_22601 (Jan 12, 2006)

Pigface, You are always working on a project.  That should make for a very good tank. What are you going to use for lighting, a metal Halide?


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## Peter Keane (Jun 11, 2005)

This is true you can have the freedom and luxury to use larger plants that will usually outgrow the smaller tanks in a matter of weeks.. like the diffenbachias, some aroids that shoot up 2 feet in a few weeks, large leaf pothos, large broms... but what I found out most is that even though the tiny lil ferns or tiny epiphytic orchids etc.. in my larger vivs.. somehow they look better too in the larger ones than the smaller ones.. I think in the smaller vivs these tinys are a must.. in the larger vivs.. they are an accessory.. so even though you wanna get those big broms.. do try and add some little somethings for ultimate detail.. And good luck with that monster.. and keep us posted.. Peter Keane


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## sbreland (May 4, 2006)

Mark,
you sure you want to do a vert with that thing??? You'll lose so much valuable floor space, but gain a bunch of height. I guess it just has to do with what your frogs use the most, but I am slowly swinging to giving as much floor space as vertical space. If you do decide on a vert though, you have one helluva canvas to work with!


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I get board if I'm not doing something and besides building something is half of the fun . 

I have an idea for the lights , I don't know if it will work ok or not ?? I havent seen alot of tall verts like this posted on the board . I was thinking of using a couple CF's on the top and I know not alot of this will reach the bottom though , I was thinking of mounting a couple smaller CF's ' 13 W maybe or something that doesn't put off as much heat alternating side to side mounted on the sides pointing in for the lower portions of the tank ? I'll have to try it and see how hot the side glass gets . I Don't want the frogs burning their little toes . I was thinking of mounting a couple mister nozzles on the sides also . Any comments on those Ideas ??? I don't want too add any more heat to my room if possible , so the metal Halides are probably out . 

I probably will do one whole side as a drip wall too . I'll have to see how high my pump will pump .

Stace , I would love to do a big horizontal for some "big" Darts like some tincs or terribilis but I just don't have the space , verticly it will take up the same space as my sterio rack used to so it will fit my room without taking up any more floor space than before. If I put pumilio's in it there will be enough floor space for a couple of them them . My Escudo's could pump out alot of froglets in something like this :wink: 

Something bright like a couple of the Solartes so they will not get lost in there ! Or maybe a big bunch of Imi's or some other thumbs that will use the height . My Intermedius use every inch of the three foot height of my 90'gal. I made for them . 
I can worry about what frogs to put in it later when it's done .


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

Here are a few updated pictures . progress is a little slow , at least for me as I ran out of foam and silicone . 

Since the sticker says tempered glass don't drill , I decided to run the mister nozzles in through the front top pane of glass .










The bottom bulkheads are as follows , left is the overflow drain , far right is output from the pump to the drip wall and near right is suction to the pump .

I glued alot of big coco fiber pots so I can plant some plants other than broms on the back and sides . To give an idea of size the pots are 8" & 12" diameters , cut about 2/3 size and glued on . Hopefully it will look better when its all foamed in . Gonna need alot of foam here . This is just one can so far ! And half a dozen tubes of silicone , I didn't want anything falling off !










I didn't put the coco panels all the way to the edge because I'm going to try to use some side lighting because it is so tall . I was thinking two 13w cf on the left and one on the right , plus what goes on top .










On the right side there is going to be a drip wall into a waterfall . The center strips of foam ( which will need to be trimmed some ) is to keep the water dripping down the center area so the water will drip down the waterfall and not spread out and be absorbed by the treefern .










I haven't decided yet weather it will drip into a pond or just into some gravel right into the false bottom .


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## dracotaz (May 15, 2007)

Very awsome! 
:shock: 
I cant wait to see your next updates!!


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## defaced (May 23, 2005)

Looks good. But the tempered don't drill sticker is only for the bottom. The other four sides are untempered.


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## Frank H (Nov 3, 2005)

I cant wait to see how you do the doors.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Looks like a good start. Ever thought about using the gallery here? Its a bit faster than photobucket.


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2007)

How are going to run the electric cord from a pump to the outside of the tank? The three mister holes is exactly what I was thinking to do with my 40 gallon breed vertical project (which I will start on today hopefully). I was thinking to myself that the glass with the mister holes could have a notch at the lower left corner for the power cord, and also that the notch is part of separate small square glass that opens and closes like a mini door for the the prongs on the electric cord to pass through. 
Nice work by the way! 
I decided not to do a drip wall but instead go for a waterfall.


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

Mike , I thought that was the case but I did not want to chance it ! 

Frank , I have a couple ideas for the doors , hinged or sliding I just dont know which one I will use yet . I don't want any obstruction of the view so the sliding door idea is probably out . I was thinking side hinged some way .

Cesar , The pump will be outside of the tank with lines leading to the two right hand bulkheads . I have an extra turtle pump left over from one of my big vivs . 
I had a small problem with the top pice of glass with the three holes in it I put my elbow through it while foaming  .
I wanted to devise a internal air circulation system anyways  . 

For the misters , in the outside top holes , Since they are not going to be in the top of the viv , I was going to use the bulkhead part of a misting nozzle in the holes and use some tubing and some fittings and run like a square hose system around the top of the tank and "T" in some nozzles aimed at different parts of the viv . I was going to use the little suction cup things that came with the turtle pumps to hold it to the top .

something like this










I did something similar in my 90's . Since they were already up and had frogs in them and I couldn't drill more holes . I just "T"ed into the existing nozzles and ran some tubing where I wanted it and put a nozzle at the end . So far it works great .

Kyle , I didn't know if there was a size limit or quantity limit and I didn't want to clog up the D.boards space and bandwidth . I have almost a half gig of pics in my photo bucket .


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

No problem... Photobucket can just get slow so it makes the post load very slow. There is a limit here and the pictures are automatically reduced.


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

Removing the plastic frame/brace gives the front such a nice clean look.. this is going to be an awesome tank, keep us updated for sure.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2007)

Ok, here is the BIG question. How are you going to light this one?


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

Well part of my mister design got thrown out since Mike "talked" me into drilling the tank  . And it worked , the sides are not tempered thank be . This also makes doing a ventilation system alot simpler .










The two small holes are for the misters , I might still do a variation of my previous mister design since I'll need more than two nozzles in this one . I didn't want to press my luck with the drill  

The four larger holes are for the ventilation system below .









I borrowed the shape for this from a post here somewere , I hope it wasn't patented . The 2 1/2 " fan will be sealed in the center and glued over the four larger holes and will suck air into the chamber throuhgh two holes on one side and blow it out the other two on the other side . Or at least that's how its supposted to work , I haven't tried it yet . It puts out alot of air on the work bench though .

Almost ten cans of foam . It dosen't look it but its 7" thick in spots and I carved little frog highways in spots in the foam to make it easier for them to climb . I did this in one other viv and they use it all the time . I should have done it in all of my last tanks but I didn't think of it till it was too late .










And ten tubes of silicone and coco later its taking shape . 









I still haven't deciced where the large piece of wood will go .
And I'm Still thinking about the lighting and doors .

I converted a 4' shop light I had given to me to T-8's and I might try side lighting it with that and a couple Cf's up top .


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I'm getting closer to getting this finished , I got the doors figured out and glued on this weekend . I decided on two side opening doors and no obstructions , attached using acrylic hinges . The space between the doors and the top and bottom is as thick as two pieces of duct tape on top of each other . Hopefully it's fly proof . I also ran a bead of silicone along the edge to cushion and seal the doors .



















I'm still working on the latch for the doors and I think I have it the way I want it .










The "T" shaped piece of plexi gets glued to the edge of the door , the "pull" gets glued to the top side of the plexi and the one part of the latch gets glued to the underside of the plexi which hangs over the edge of the door a little . I glued another piece of plexi to the side glass and the other part of the latch gets glued two it , And snaps together holding the door closed .

Here's the air circulation device. Air gets sucked in one side and out the other , through the screen covered holes in the top of the glass .










Here's how I'm going to attach the lights . I've decided for now to use 2-13 Watt lights on each side attached to the frame unit and 2- 36 or 55 W. lights on the top and see how it goes from there . I will be hideing the lights with some oak covers when I get them attached .









I made a glass "dam" below the waterfall that will be filled with "gravel" so the water will filter through to the bottom . There will be no pond area just wet gravel . The dam seporates the gravel from the substrate hopefully keeping it from getting soaked . You can see in one of the door pictures I put a bead of foam along the edge of glass and covered it with coco fiber so I can put the substrate up to the edge of the dam with no sharp edges and hopefully keep water from wicking into the substrate . I checked it for leaks but , I haven't tried the water fall yet , hopefully it works as imagined :shock: 










Almost ready to drag out of the garage !


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I'm almost done . I'm now just waiting on some bulbs and ballasts , some misting nozzles and fittings, little things . But basicly its done ready to plant  . I still haven't tested the waterfall yet hopefully it works as planned ! 

Here's a couple closeups of the latches . I decided not to use the pulls on the doors , they open just as good without them .




























Here's how the side lights are going to be mounted . They are staggered some on each side to light evenly .




























After dragging it up a flight of stairs by my self , with no damage ! 
Here it is with the oak covers attached , I might make a cover for the area around the lower vent also . I'm going to route the pump & hoses around to the back , there's just enough room on the back of the stand for it .


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## roberthvalera (Jun 9, 2006)

you are so productive its crazy. Good job on that tank. Cant wait to see what it looks like lit up with plants.


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## wbeavers (Jun 7, 2007)

I'm kinda curious if you considered phototropism before making your lighting decision? Phototropism


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

Beav , I thought about it a little , but obviously not too much  . I didn't know it had a name though ! Since light will be coming from both sides and the top I don't know if will have much effect ? We already have some light coming in through the front glass on our vivs , not as much as this though . Also I don't plan on planting much on the bottom may be a big billbergia or something that grows tall rather than bushy , and then the rest of the bottom will be mostly leaf litter some rocks and a jumble of sticks and twigs , like a jungle floor . The plants and broms will go in the coco pots on the sides and background . I think I'm going to use mostly "vineing" type plants , and a couple bigger Alocasia's .

My lighting parts are supposedly in the mail .
I recieved my misting parts from Marty today , heres what I came up with . Alot of adjustment here so when I get the plants in I can adjust it if something is getting too much water . 










One thing I didn't take into consideration though is if too much water gets on the glass it will drip down and seep through the cracks at the door gaps and drip on the outside of the glass and down . I guess I'm lucky there is alot of adjustment on the nozzles , I'll have to fine tune the mist .
I'm sure there will be other things that need " fine tuned " before its done .


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

Here are a couple pictures with the lights fitted , 2 - 55w on top and 4 - 13 w 2 on each side and a few plants , a couple H.D. orchids and broms I had around . I have a few more plants and broms coming to finish filling it out .



















And a bad picture of the waterfall . It works as planned but the pump just dosent have enough oomph to push the water up the 3 ft. so its only a trickle at the moment . I'm going to try to mount the pump a little higher if that dosent work I midht have to get a different pump ,Or I might just leav it as is ?


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I thought I would post a little update , Here is new picture of this tank with a few more plants and after a little grow in time . It now houses 0.0.8 red-orange vents that I got as froglets and they are all over the tank from the floor to the very top . And they are growing up real nicely and plump .










And here is a new tank I put together this last weekend , for some bigger frogs , it's a 24"x24"x22" cube . Man, silicone takes alot longer to cure when its cooler , I was scared for a while that it wasn't ever going to dry . :shock: 

I finally decided to get a couple bigger frogs , something I don't have to squint to see .  Haven't decided what yet .


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## Hassan347 (Jan 8, 2006)

Wow, that is amazing, great job, ive got a 75g in my basement i may follow your lead on this one


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## Dendrobait (May 29, 2005)

Wow awesome! If it was me I'd put a few small diagonal branches or vines to allow the pumilio to crawl up to the top in style. Then you can get some National Geographic going in your room.


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## RPN (Mar 25, 2007)

Looks awesome, You have a few nice looking tanks. Did you cut your own glass?


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## terrariumman (Oct 15, 2007)

It looks very nice!!


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## bmasar (Dec 13, 2007)

What did you make the ventilation chamber out of? I'm assuming it's acrylic, so aren't you concerned about warping?


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

It was just made from plexiglass heated and bent to shape . Once it was glued together it is very rigid and its not a big area like a viv door is so there should be little chance of it warping . I used that because it is clear and it wouldn't obstruct the light . And Its glued down to the glass too . At least it hasn't warped yet . I've had somthing similar on my other tanks for almost three years with no problems . And if it warps no big deal , I'll make another one .  There are screens seperating it from the tank so nothing will be able to escape excapt air .


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## froggiefriend (Jan 4, 2008)

any new updates.. this gets me going.. although mine is much smaller a 29 G vert but just gives me tons of ideas!


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I'll try to get some new pics this weekend .


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## gold3nku5h (Jul 24, 2008)

I have a burning question about that lower piece of wood, do you know what type it is, and if you've ever cut into it, or just smelled it clean, Does it have a scent to it, that is very aromatic? Is it grapewood, or grapevine, with a redish tent to the inner heartwood or interior wood? because if so that is the exact kind that i have that originally believed was a cedar, which i hear is harmfull to PDF's and is my hopefully centerpiece, and waterpool/waterfall, where it collects water before falling out into a stream area later to be collected into a pool. If so i will still search as to find the true type of wood i have, but is very similar if not exactly the same kind that i've collected out in local woods.


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

Here is a small update on this tank . 









The two big Broms ended up dying from being planted instead of mounted keeping their roots too wet . But both pupped before doing so and now the one lower pup is actually bigger than the original one that died . I have recently replaced the one lower big brom with a Alocasia Corozon that I wanted to originally plant in here ( In the middle section ). I pulled an off shoot from a tank a while ago and it was finally big enough to put in here . 
The tank looks a little ragged , I have to trim some of the vining plants since they are taking over the upper section of the tank , especially a couple of the Philo's . And the plants in the lower front right need to be constantly trimmed too , they grow big then start to fall over from the weight of the leaves . 
I have taken a couple of the misting nozzles out also , five was tooo many .

Here are a couple of the Orchids and the Oak leaf creeping fig that has gone nuts , it has gone all the way around the back to the other side in spots . 









left side .









top section .



















Oh , and the piece of wood is just a piece of driftwood I got off ebay . I have no Idea what type it is . But it didn't sell like cedar and it is NOT grape wood .


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## Mywebbedtoes (Jul 2, 2007)

So now that you have had this up for awhile, what are your thoughts on this size of a vert and the challenges in building one? Was it worth it to you? It certainly looks really cool. The plants seem to be doing well with your lighting which is great to see.


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I probably wouldn't have bought a tank this size to do a vert now but since I got it free ....... I would have liked to do it horizontally and put a big group of terribilis in it but I just didn't have the room for it that way ! But this way it takes up hardly any room .

But that said It wasn't that much harder doing this than a smaller tank other than the quanity of materials and plants. That and figuring out how to do with the doors . Which have worked out great so far . I also still have to put a fan on the upper screen to keep the front glass clear as it fogs up fairly easy . I've just been too lazy to rig one up . I'm in the process of installing internal air circulation systems in the tanks on my first rack I set up , so I'll probobly do it soon . 

The plants are doing great most are growing like crazy , except the two big broms which I had planted rather than mounted . Even three out of the five orchids are still doing good . 

The lighting is working out pretty good with the exception of hardly any light getting to the background some is the fault of the plants and most is the tree fern on the sides blocking some of the light to the back wall . All I have lighting this now is 2 - 13 w CF bulbs on each side and on the topI have one 13 w CF and a 24" shoplight with 2 t8 17 w (I think) bulbs , all are about 6000-6700 K .

The only thing is the eight R-O Vents I put in here are still real shy and head for cover when I come in the room . No signs of breeding yet and I haven't heard any calling yet either . When I do see them they are huge - fat so they are doing good and eating enough . Too bad there are not alot of bigger frogs that are verticly oriented , at least common ones . :twisted: This would have been great for some bigger frogs .


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## MarcNem (Dec 13, 2008)

Great tank. I am a vert lover4life! I have a question about the lighting. Do you think it was necessary to have the lights along the sides. A pair of ultra compacts on top at 10k would not have done the trick?... and maybe slope the beck a lil to give the lower levels of the tank a lil more light? I have an old Nat Geo magazine where a European hobbiest is looking for pumilio in a rather large/tall tank, and the back was sloped, to allow light into the lower levels of the tank. Just trying to capitolize off of your experience. Again, you are an inspiration. Keep up the good work.


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## Ed Holder (Sep 26, 2008)

Just curious about the chamber on the front bottom, How does it work? I'm getting started on a 90 gal vert and am looking for different methods of keeping the front glass clean.
Tank looks great btw! Kinda gives me hope for mine

Cheers...Ed


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## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

As for the lights on the sides I think they are definatly needed . Once this grew in there is no way the light was going to make it from the top all the way to the bottom . The two plants on the bottom lower right are now only 6" from hitting the top ! I am seriously thinking of replaceing the 4 13w CF side lights with the 17w t8's come spring as the Cf's are too HOT on the side glass . 
As for sloping the background that would work if the tank was deeper but as is at 4' tall there would not be very much slope to make a big difference and it would take up most of the floor space . If you could make a viv this tall and 3' deep that would work great . Or if the tank was twice as wide you could probably get away with just top lighting . 

On the vent chamber on the bottom so far without a fan on top pulling air through its not working that great but better than not having it . I mounted a fan on the top front vent a few weeks ago but have yet to wire it in . I'm going to do that soon when I move my new tanks onto the old rack . But this same system works good on the 20 gal sized tanks I made , like the ones below . So the fan should make a difference on this one . 

A note on the frogs. They are still real shy , but when I do see them they are still all over the tank from top to bottom . But they started breeding recently I found a big clutch of eggs a couple months ago but they all slid into a water filled brom leaf and went bad . But they are finally old enough to try . I dont know the sex ratio but most of them are Huge, fat . I still haven't heard any calling yet . 


These new tanks I've just built , been working on them for a couple months now , are to replace the petco 20 h's on my first rack . Now I can fit four tanks to a shelf . Instead 3 and a filler tank per shelf . And also to finally replace the "temp" tanks that my Eldorado's and Cayo de agua have been for a year ! 
here are some of them . I finally drug a few up into the frog room this week and I'm starting to plant them .


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## clwatkins10 (Nov 15, 2008)

Nice! Great journal! I am surprised at how well the side lighting is working. Those new tanks look great too!


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## Okapi (Oct 12, 2007)

Any updates? The side lighting idea is ingenious


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