# Chytrid rampant in WNY



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Has anyone seen the research on Chytrid around Western NY? I heard it's all over WNY at Tifft nature preserve, Iroquois Natl Wildlife Refuge amongst other places. I'm thinkin of doing some tests around here this spring.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

doesnt suprise me, that shit is everywhere.


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Unfortunately, or fortunately, I was busy and couldn't volunteer to help w/ the swabbing. Last year when out looking for spotted turtles I saw a die off w/ white skinned frogs that didn't look like anything I'd ever seen and made sure I left my boots out in the sun, don't know if it helped, don't think that anything can really. Guess I can't really do anything if it's upstream from me. I'm definitely going to be watching this year though. I'll probably go there and monitor again to see if there's any difference in #'s. I've been going there every spring for a couple years now. I don't think they've done any swabbing that far north though.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Youre at roughly the same lattitude as I am, and we have pockets of chytrid spread throughout our state, and even further north. As a fly fisherman who ventures into water all over, I have started sterilizing all my gear between locations. Not only to minimize my presence as a vector for chytrid, but for the myriad of other diseases/parasites plaguing our native trout


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Wow, that sucks. I was just saying that they didn't survey around here further N. I'm sure Canada has it's own stats. I'm wondering if they got up around the shores of Lake Ontario which is where I was looking for turtles.



frogparty said:


> Youre at roughly the same lattitude as I am, and we have pockets of chytrid spread throughout our state, and even further north. As a fly fisherman who ventures into water all over, I have started sterilizing all my gear between locations. Not only to minimize my presence as a vector for chytrid, but for the myriad of other diseases/parasites plaguing our native trout


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

I hope that there is funding to do more sampling. The way our fish and wildlife budget has been cut, I don't know if we will get much more pertinent data on the subject. Most of our amphibian sampling has to do with the fish and forest plan, and I am not aware of a specific plan to trach chytrid's presence in our state. As private individuals or groups, if we choose to perform tests for it, it might be beneficial to offer that info to your local fish and wildlife dept.


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Agreed.

Putting on some Primus or frog brigade after reading your sig! Beautiful day for it!


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

YEEEEEEEAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!! You have great taste in music sir. And theres a new Primus album in the works now!!


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Kewl!!! I'll be waiting for that one. I'm on the brown album today and I'm restin my bones!! Of course after a camelback cinema ride. 

Yeeeeeehaw!!!!


----------



## Jeff (May 21, 2009)

In my state (North Carolina), chytrid is apparently widespread. Like most states, however, there are no published sampling results for most counties in the state (I would estimate <10% of NC counties have been sampled). So, the coverage is pretty spotty.

Over the entire USA, published chytrid sampling results have about 28% positive. I'm taking this number from Bd Maps:


www.bd-maps.net/maps said:


> United States
> Positive - 2259
> Negative - 8146
> Total - 11593


I would recommend all hobbyists assume that their local amphibian populations host the fungus and act accordingly (cleaning your gear between fishing spots is a great example). 

Also, Pork Soda is the best Primus record.


----------



## zBrinks (Jul 16, 2006)

I'll be participating in swabbing efforts in Michigan this year. 

I do a decent amount of field herping - a quick spray down of equipment (especially boots!) with a 5% bleach solution will go a long way in preventing the spread of chytrid. It's my understanding that it's pretty widespread across North America.


----------



## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

Last weekend I went to my sisters place and could barely hold a conversation outside due to the cacophony of leopard frogs. Hopefully that sound never goes away.


And I'm partial to pork soda.


----------



## Marconis (Jul 11, 2010)

Came on this thread because I had a lecture on the fungus two weeks ago, and because tomorrow I am having a lecture on the deuterostomes and the fungus was mentioned in my text in regards to amphibian declines.

While I have nothing to offer, I noticed the conversation about Primus. I used to be obsessed (and I mean obsessed). Brown Album is my favorite.


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

I don't think I have a favorite but I like the fishing songs the best. I think they're spread out over the albums. How could you not like a band where the bassist started a band called frog brigade?
Well, unfortunately this is probably the point where I find another path. I live in a floodplain downstream from one of the places that had positive tests. I'll be reducing my collection to 3 pairs or less, probably none. I have a pond and oxbow around my place and can't worry about opening my windows during insect hatches or that the ro filter won't get a leak or washing my boots every time before I come in the door. 
Oh well, sometimes external forces make decisions for you.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

fishermans chronicles #4 is on the new album. He dropped it on us at the new years show this year. Pretty bad ass. Frizzle fry will always be my favorite Primus album, brown album and seas of cheese are excellent too.


----------



## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

Aaron you say you are going to stop keeping because chytrid is in your area? It spreads on the wind like that where your collection can become infected through an open window?


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Not that I know of but the bug hatches in the pond 20 yds from my house head strait for the lights downstairs where the frogs are. I wouldn't be able to open my windows in the summer to be completely safe. I have had stray mosquitos lay eggs in my tadpoles containers. Just not the right thing to do for the hobby. It may have always been a possibility but now that I know it's been found around here it's only a matter of time till it gets to my own backyard.


----------



## Jeff (May 21, 2009)

frogfarm said:


> Not that I know of but the bug hatches in the pond 20 yds from my house head strait for the lights downstairs where the frogs are. I wouldn't be able to open my windows in the summer to be completely safe. I have had stray mosquitos lay eggs in my tadpoles containers. Just not the right thing to do for the hobby. It may have always been a possibility but now that I know it's been found around here it's only a matter of time till it gets to my own backyard.


Mosquitoes as vectors for amphibian chytrid is not a totally far-fetched concern. While I don't think there's any evidence to support it, there's at least tentative evidence for arthropods as alternative hosts (citations below). Not to mention the other chytrid species which parasitize arthropods (including insects).

That said, I think feeding wild mosquito larvae is a low-risk activity, at least in terms of introducing wild chytrid to captive amphibians, and provided you don't collect them from water shared by wild amphibians. I feed a lot of mosquito larvae in the summers (collected from jars in my yard) and don't plan to stop because of chytrid in my area. 

Hobbyists who collect driftwood, leaves, arthropods, or other wild materials should be mindful of the potential they have to introduce pathogens. However, preventing the spread of pathogens from captive amphibians to the wild is much more important, in my opinion. The risk is higher and the cost greater. That's where I focus my attention. 



> Rowley JJL, Alford RA, Skerratt LF (2006) The amphibian chytrid Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis occurs on freshwater shrimp in rain forest streams in Northern Queensland, Australia. EcoHealth 3: 49–52.
> 
> Rowley JJL, Hemingway VA, Alford RA, Waycott M, Skerratt LF, et al. (2007) Experimental infection and repeat survey data indicate the amphibian chytrid Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis may not occur on freshwater crustaceans in Northern Queensland, Australia. EcoHealth 4: 31–36.


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Your first article was proven wrong by a second article by the same team. Ed posted both a while back. I'm not worried about what we do know I'm worried about what we don't. I can't think of any studies about frog farms in the middle of chytrid territory other than what I've read about the hotel california for Project golden frog. I've been told they still collect insects to feed the captive frogs. I'm not sure what I believe the chance of transmission to be with the conflicting stories of foot baths and air cleaners coupled w/ they still collect wild insects to feed. Kinda confusing.

Ahh, guess I should've looked for your second source before posting.

Part of my problem is that frogs sometimes fall into my well. Although I have a water softener, pre filter and ro, it still has me concerned something could get thru while changing filters. Although, for the 5th year in a row, I'm supposed to get city water this year.

I've been told by some it's probably always been here.



Jeff said:


> Mosquitoes as vectors for amphibian chytrid is not a totally far-fetched concern. While I don't think there's any evidence to support it, there's at least tentative evidence for arthropods as alternative hosts (citations below). Not to mention the other chytrid species which parasitize arthropods (including insects).
> 
> That said, I think feeding wild mosquito larvae is a low-risk activity, at least in terms of introducing wild chytrid to captive amphibians, and provided you don't collect them from water shared by wild amphibians. I feed a lot of mosquito larvae in the summers (collected from jars in my yard) and don't plan to stop because of chytrid in my area.
> 
> Hobbyists who collect driftwood, leaves, arthropods, or other wild materials should be mindful of the potential they have to introduce pathogens. However, preventing the spread of pathogens from captive amphibians to the wild is much more important, in my opinion. The risk is higher and the cost greater. That's where I focus my attention.


----------



## Jeff (May 21, 2009)

frogfarm said:


> I'm not worried about what we do know I'm worried about what we don't.


Good point. We should probably keep in mind that the risk of introducing chytrid (to wild or captive populations) was just as real 15 years ago. Except back then, most hobbyists weren't considering their potential role in an amphibian pandemic. Likewise, there are plenty of other organisms that could be spread inadvertently by hobbyists (ranavirus?). So, it's hard to fault a cautious approach. 



frogfarm said:


> Part of my problem is that frogs sometimes fall into my well. Although I have a water softener, pre filter and ro, it still has me concerned something could get thru while changing filters. Although, for the 5th year in a row, I'm supposed to get city water this year.


Have you considered a UV sterilizer? Unless your RO filter has a high GPH output, a small (13w) aquarium unit may be worth looking in to.


----------



## Tony (Oct 13, 2008)

Jeff said:


> Have you considered a UV sterilizer? Unless your RO filter has a high GPH output, a small (13w) aquarium unit may be worth looking in to.


UV sterilization has been shown to be ineffective against chytrid.

http://www.jcu.edu.au/school/phtm/PHTM/frogs/papers/johnson-2003b.pdf


----------



## Roadrunner (Mar 6, 2004)

Yup, I've got that too. Since I'm in cow country I have to. My well tested extremely hi for ecoli. Even after a gallon of bleach.



Jeff said:


> Good point. We should probably keep in mind that the risk of introducing chytrid (to wild or captive populations) was just as real 15 years ago. Except back then, most hobbyists weren't considering their potential role in an amphibian pandemic. Likewise, there are plenty of other organisms that could be spread inadvertently by hobbyists (ranavirus?). So, it's hard to fault a cautious approach.
> 
> 
> Have you considered a UV sterilizer? Unless your RO filter has a high GPH output, a small (13w) aquarium unit may be worth looking in to.


----------



## Jeff (May 21, 2009)

Tony said:


> UV sterilization has been shown to be ineffective against chytrid.
> 
> http://www.jcu.edu.au/school/phtm/PHTM/frogs/papers/johnson-2003b.pdf


Thanks for correcting me, Tony. I have read that paper but not closely or recently enough, apparently. Obviously, UVS may still be useful in eliminating other organisms.

And rereading the paper linked above, it seems to me that heating the water before use (100*F for 12 hrs, for instance) may be a good (non-chemical) option.


----------

