# Supplements



## jhbenham9 (Dec 23, 2016)

Hello, I am looking to get some PDFs and have been reading as much as I can on this sub from when I first set up by viv in february. I would like to buy some frogs from the knowledgable people here but I need 25 posts so here is one that I am sure has been answered but I need the posts. I am planning on getting Ranitomeya, and feeding them melanogaster dusted in supplements, I am just not sure what brand and supplements you gave them. Also, how often do you feed/dust your flies? Thanks.


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## pboyer08 (Jun 18, 2017)

I am not an expert, but this is what I do. Dust the flies each feeding with Repashy Calcium Plus, which will expire 6 months after you open it. You may be tempted to keep it longer, but they will not be getting the adequate vitamins and calcium and can get sick if it is open for more than 6 months. So be sure to throw it out after 6 months and get a new jar. I feed my frogs every day. If there are flies in the tank the next morning you are feeding too much. Some people feed only every other day. Too many flies in the tank will stress them out and they will get sick or die.  Hope that helps! And good luck! They are a lot of fun!!

Pam


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## jhbenham9 (Dec 23, 2016)

Thank you! Do you only use that one supplement?


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## tongo (Jul 29, 2007)

I feed 3 times a week. Repashy calcium plus every feeding but also repashy Vitamin A every 3-4 weeks.


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## pboyer08 (Jun 18, 2017)

Yes. It has the calcium in addition to the other vitamins that they need. I used to mix Repcal calcium and Repcal vitamins (1 part to 1 part each and dust) but Repashy is easier all in one. You are supposed to "rotate in" vitamin A if you are breeding the frogs, but I am not sure exactly how that is done.


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## FrogTim (Oct 1, 2015)

I use Repashy Calcium Plus every feeding and Repashy SuperPig bi weekly ish when I remember. Store your supplements in a cool, dry place. Sitting on top of your lights isn't a good spot. Also pay attention to how long you keep supplements, every 6 months you should get new ones (get the small bottles).

I'd also recommend keeping them in a zip lock since the repashy lids can get dusty and not seal right.


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## jhbenham9 (Dec 23, 2016)

pboyer08 said:


> Yes. It has the calcium in addition to the other vitamins that they need. I used to mix Repcal calcium and Repcal vitamins (1 part to 1 part each and dust) but Repashy is easier all in one. You are supposed to "rotate in" vitamin A if you are breeding the frogs, but I am not sure exactly how that is done.


Tongo from above said he rotates vitamin A in monthly and it looks (atleast from his profile pic) like it is working, thanks


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Lots and lots of threads on this subject. I do: Repashy Calcium Plus every feeding (every other day) except Vitamin A every 2-4 weeks. Some people add Super Pig at roughly the same frequency as Vitamin A. Store OPENED supplements in the fridge. Discard after 6 months once opened. 

Mark


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## jhbenham9 (Dec 23, 2016)

I realize, thanks for the fridge tip Mark


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Encyclia said:


> Lots and lots of threads on this subject. I do: Repashy Calcium Plus every feeding (every other day) except Vitamin A every 2-4 weeks. Some people add Super Pig at roughly the same frequency as Vitamin A. Store OPENED supplements in the fridge. Discard after 6 months once opened.
> 
> Mark


since the supplements aren't sealed with a neutral atmosphere, storing the unopen ones in the refrigerator (not the freezer) isn't necessarily a bad idea. 

some comments 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Technically the best practice is to get new supplements every six months (or sooner) post manufacturing date but none of the manufacturers follow the practice of including a born on/manufactured date. As a result, the next best thing is to get your supplements from the manufacturer if possible or a reseller whose stock turns over frequently and who purchases directly fro the manufacturer as opposed to some middle man (chains often require the use of a designated wholeseller which is the middle man...). Then store it in the refrigerator as they are not vacuum sealed or sealed with a neutral atmosphere. 

some comments 

Ed


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Ed said:


> since the supplements aren't sealed with a neutral atmosphere, storing the unopen ones in the refrigerator (not the freezer) isn't necessarily a bad idea.
> 
> some comments
> 
> Ed


I suppose it's too much to ask for them to pack in a vacuum or noble gas or something ;-) I agree, it can't hurt to keep the unopened stuff in the fridge, too. Someone above was saying to keep them in a cool, dry place, and I don't think that is adequate, especially once they are open, unless that cool, dry place is the refrigerator 

Mark


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## 55105 (Jan 27, 2015)

I spend about $60 on supplements a year which in reality isn't much but I always end up throwing out a lot of Vit A and superpig every 6 months.

Would it be possible to use a home vacuum sealer and seal up half the bottle as soon as I open it? What would be the shelf life on that? Or does opening the bottle automatically degrade them to a point that it's too risky?

Or what about quartering the bottles? Would that be pushing it?

I'm really not cheap  but I don't like to waste. If it is too risky for my frogs I'd rather just buy new every 6 months.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

port_plz said:


> Would it be possible to use a home vacuum sealer and seal up half the bottle as soon as I open it? What would be the shelf life on that? Or does opening the bottle automatically degrade them to a point that it's too risky?.


In theory you could do this but we don't have any clues as to the stability of the product over that time and conditions. You'd need to have samples set aside and tested over time to determine the amount of degradation. This isn't cheap as you have multiple vitamins and carotenoids to check for breakdown. 

We have prior recommendations on the useful span of carotenoids and those are what we follow at this time (until someone shells out the cash and does the research). 

some comments 

Ed


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## mayanjungledog (Jun 5, 2017)

Would vacuum sealing an unused portion with a Foodsaver extend its shelf life? For example, if you purchased the 6 oz. bottle of supplement and upon opening the bottle split it into 1 oz. aliquot and vacuum sealed each one? Anyone do this?


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## mayanjungledog (Jun 5, 2017)

mayanjungledog said:


> Would vacuum sealing an unused portion with a Foodsaver extend its shelf life? For example, if you purchased the 6 oz. bottle of supplement and upon opening the bottle split it into 1 oz. aliquot and vacuum sealed each one? Anyone do this?




Oops missed that very last post. Sorry about that.


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## FrogTim (Oct 1, 2015)

Is there a "safe" temperature to store supplements? Is there a heating and freezing point at which the vitamins begin to degrade? I know the tried and true 'keep it in the fridge' works, but is there a 'goldilocks' range of temperatures? 

My gf says, ''no-no'', to frog things in the freezer or fridge so I keep my supplements in a ziplock in the closet. It says a pretty constant 62-64F and my tadpoles have been morphing just fine.


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## kiltboy1675 (Feb 28, 2007)

What if when you buy a bottle of whatever. Pull out what you need and sell the rest..... like a full film canister amount for a few bucks in the classifieds. It should in theory have the same six month lifespan as the bottle and we could all save a few bucks on vitamins and also recoup our money on what we spend on them. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

FrogTim said:


> Is there a "safe" temperature to store supplements? Is there a heating and freezing point at which the vitamins begin to degrade? I know the tried and true 'keep it in the fridge' works, but is there a 'goldilocks' range of temperatures?
> 
> My gf says, ''no-no'', to frog things in the freezer or fridge so I keep my supplements in a ziplock in the closet. It says a pretty constant 62-64F and my tadpoles have been morphing just fine.


I got your back, FrogTim.

https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.jZZRmCZRuk8Yv7ulkHp0cAEsDw&pid=15.1&P=0&w=250&h=201


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## 55105 (Jan 27, 2015)

kiltboy1675 said:


> What if when you buy a bottle of whatever. Pull out what you need and sell the rest..... like a full film canister amount for a few bucks in the classifieds. It should in theory have the same six month lifespan as the bottle and we could all save a few bucks on vitamins and also recoup our money on what we spend on them.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've done this with a DB member who bought too much. Since I was buying other items it worked out well for me and I saved a few bucks.

You could also just team up with someone since it's a scheduled thing. Take turns every six months buying. One person buys, divides the bottles and ships to the other. This would almost cut your cost in half and eliminate a lot of waste.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

FrogTim said:


> Is there a "safe" temperature to store supplements? Is there a heating and freezing point at which the vitamins begin to degrade? I know the tried and true 'keep it in the fridge' works, but is there a 'goldilocks' range of temperatures?
> 
> My gf says, ''no-no'', to frog things in the freezer or fridge so I keep my supplements in a ziplock in the closet. It says a pretty constant 62-64F and my tadpoles have been morphing just fine.


To some extent it depends on the formulation but freezing many of the supplements breaks up the particles allowing oxygen to penetrate which speeds oxidation. As a result, the lowest temperature they should be shelf stable is the recommended range for the refrigerator portion of a refrigerator/freezer. Off the cuff, I would avoid temperatures above 75 F (as a purely subjective guess). 

some comments 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

port_plz said:


> I've done this with a DB member who bought too much. Since I was buying other items it worked out well for me and I saved a few bucks.
> 
> You could also just team up with someone since it's a scheduled thing. Take turns every six months buying. One person buys, divides the bottles and ships to the other. This would almost cut your cost in half and eliminate a lot of waste.


Keep in mind that this can ruin any advantage of purchasing the freshest supplement particularly if the temperatures and humidity outside are vary high. Time sitting in a box in transit or a mail box is not necessarily good for the supplements. 

some comments 

Ed


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## 55105 (Jan 27, 2015)

Ed said:


> Keep in mind that this can ruin any advantage of purchasing the freshest supplement particularly if the temperatures and humidity outside are vary high. Time sitting in a box in transit or a mail box is not necessarily good for the supplements.
> 
> some comments
> 
> Ed


That's a good point Ed meh, it all seems like too much hassle. I've experienced firsthand how important these supplements are esp during breeding. Might not be worth the risks just to save a little money.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I did the math on this over 5 years ago. It has changed very little.



Pumilo said:


> 4 oz Repashy Calcium Plus -- $8
> Shipping -- $6
> Total -- $14 for a 6 month supply.
> That's less than 8 cents per day. Not a bad price to pay to make sure your frogs are nice and healthy.
> A smaller size might seem better to you, but remember, there is a price point that Allen has to break. A smaller size might still cost $8 after packaging, manufacturing, advertising, product testing, and most importantly, research, so he can continue to bring us quality products.


Allen Repashy can have my, what's it up to? 8.5 cents per day? I think he's earned it.


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## FrogTim (Oct 1, 2015)

Encyclia said:


> FrogTim said:
> 
> 
> > Is there a "safe" temperature to store supplements? Is there a heating and freezing point at which the vitamins begin to degrade? I know the tried and true 'keep it in the fridge' works, but is there a 'goldilocks' range of temperatures?
> ...


Lol. "I swear officer. The white powder in the hidden stash can is really vitamins for my frogs."


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## FrogTim (Oct 1, 2015)

Ed i appreciate the comments on temperature. I remembered that generally a cool, constant temperature and humidity are ideal. Avoid excessive heat, cold, moisture, sunlight etc. But everyone seems to be championing the fridge as the only way.


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## mayanjungledog (Jun 5, 2017)

Is there any concern about the humidity level in the fridge?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

mayanjungledog said:


> Is there any concern about the humidity level in the fridge?


If your fridge is operating properly, then outside of the drawers it should actually have a decently low humidity since as the temperature of the air decreases the amount of water it can hold also decreases. 

some comments 

Ed


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## mayanjungledog (Jun 5, 2017)

What about the condensation that starts to form on the bottle when taken out of the fridge? Could that contribute to increased moisture inside the bottle every time the bottle is opened?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

mayanjungledog said:


> What about the condensation that starts to form on the bottle when taken out of the fridge? Could that contribute to increased moisture inside the bottle every time the bottle is opened?


There shouldn't be significant amounts inside the bottle unless your leaving it sitting out in the open for extended periods with the cap off. The best method is to have a second light proof container and remove a 1-2 week supply into the second container, that container can be kept in a cool dry area (away from the cages) as the short-term supply. This reduces the effect that your concerned with while allowing an easy supply of supplement that isn't going to significantly degrade as your using it up quickly. 

some comments 

Ed


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## mayanjungledog (Jun 5, 2017)

Makes sense. Thank.


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