# Help Please! I need a new method(s) for caring for clutches of eggs???



## asch803 (Nov 10, 2007)

Several of my frogs are breeding and I just don't feel like enough of the eggs are becoming tadpoles. I have the following that are breeding: cb hawaiian auratus, wc hawaiian auratus, t & b auratus, azureiventris, castis, variabilis and most recently azureus. Some lay their eggs on petri dishes and some lay them in film canisters (on occasion the castis lay eggs on leaves- which i cut off and place in a petri dish). What I've been doing is putting the petri dish inside a plastic container w/ a wet paper towel under the petri dish and propping it up so the eggs are on the lower side, and then just adding a very small amount of water (ro/di filtered) to the petri dish. Then i cover the plastic container. When they lay in the canisters i've tried 2 ways, i've tried to remove the eggs and put them in a petri dish then follow the same as above or i've tried leaving them in the canister and adding a little bit of water to keep them moist and then place them in the same kind of plastic container w/ a wet paper towel to keep the humidity up. I've also tried leaving the canisters in the tanks and that hasn't proved to work aside from with the azureiventris which transport the tads to water and then i catch the tads (this work well except i sometimes have a tough time catching a tad or two). The auratus eggs are doing fairly well, but none of the others are giving me real high yields. Please give me some suggestions! I know I shouldn't complain about the fact that i've got about 60 or 70 tadpoles in cups right now, but I feel like that # should really be doubled. 

THANKS!!!

Andy


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## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

quick reply

for most of what you are working with, I usually pull eggs [personally I just slide them off/out with my finger] onto petri dishes. Add a thin layer of water lightly tinted with Meth blue. I rinse and add more water every couple days, and keep all the petri dishes together in a warm [75F] area.

As they hatch I add more water to the dish [no meth blue at that point] and even keep the tads in the dish for a week. 

Transfer to tanks [I use 2.5 and 5 gal tanks, communal] and feed.

Everyone has a different method.

The strong tads survive, the weak die. Just the way it is supposed to work


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## asch803 (Nov 10, 2007)

Shawn,

Thanks for getting back so quickly! When you say you rinse the petri dish after about a week, how do you do that without disturbing the eggs? Also, about how much water do you add (both initially w/ the methylene blue and after you rinse)? I know it's not going to be 100% w/ the eggs becoming tads, but I really think i should be doing better. Once the eggs become tads i've had very good success, so i'll stick to what i've been doing w/ the tads.

Thanks!!!


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## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

Amount of water varies from trace amounts with phyllobates, to drowning them for vents. Most would be a 'thin layer' to cover the base of the petri dish and no more.

Eggs arent that fragile. Really. I just pour out the water, rinse with some fresh 'tad tea' or spring water, pour that out, then add the new [with a turkey baster or dropper] blue water. 

If the eggs are loose/floating just use the dropper to suck out the water, or a paper towel corner.

Hope that helps!

You might try different teas/ water supplies to see if that improves your viability


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Here's what I use to add liquids to my petri dishes:

Browne-Halco - 1102 8 oz Clear Squeeze Bottle


Found at any given restaurant store where they sell all manner of food prep and service related restaurant industry stuff.

A veriable toys R Us for Froggers!

I have 4 different sizes of clear squeeze bottles. One small size for medications. A medium size for Meth Blue and larger sizes for water and tadpole tea.

The squeeze bottle allows for a calibrated, precise GENTLE liquid transfer, IMO...

I like them.....


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## asch803 (Nov 10, 2007)

Shawn and Phil,

Thanks! I'll try your ideas!

Andy


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## GBIII (Mar 20, 2008)

I use regular spring/tapwater (I have well water) for the eggs in the same manner that Sportsdoc does. I believe ro/di water is too pure to add directly to the eggs and may be the cause of some of your losses.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

GBIII said:


> I use regular spring/tapwater (I have well water) for the eggs in the same manner that Sportsdoc does. I believe ro/di water is too pure to add directly to the eggs and may be the cause of some of your losses.


I didn't even see that George....the RO part.....missed it 

yeah....I would NOT use RO or distilled water with egg and tads.

I use aged tap or spring water.


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## asch803 (Nov 10, 2007)

I should clarify...all of my water is ro/di, BUT what i put in with the eggs is water from one of the tadpole cups - which has the tannons (p?) in it. I make the tea and then add a few little pieces of sphagnum moss too. I will try the methylene blue with the eggs and cleaning them as well, but should i also use spring water for the eggs? I could just buy a gallon of that to use just for eggs. 

Thanks!


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## GBIII (Mar 20, 2008)

I personally would not use ro/di water for anything but top off and misting. It is too low in disolved minerals. This causes issues in the egg/tadpole with regard to osmosis and diffusion. The tadpole must use more of it's available energy to keep the pure water out and it's needed minerals in. I'm sure I'm not explaining this exactly but I'm sure someone will chime in with better communication skills and deeper understanding of the processes at work.

George


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## asch803 (Nov 10, 2007)

I just put several new eggs (found eggs in 5 different tanks last night) into the methylene blue. also a few found a couple of days ago. Do i just leave the petry dishes uncovered or do they need to be covered? i'm guessing if i leave them uncovered the water will evaporate in a few days and i'll just need to add more. i've used meth blue w/ fish but never frogs. hopefully i didn't put too much of the methylene blue/water (spring water) mixture into the petry dishes, i did make them pretty wet. is it ok if the eggs get flipped over when i remove them from the canisters? btw, for my tads, i immediately add almond leaves and shpaghnum moss, so no problem w/ lack of nutrients in the ro/di water. I will keep you posted on how this works out, but thanks again for everyones input!

Andy


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## ggazonas (May 11, 2008)

You better get that eggs thing right. I need some more frogs from you.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

You need to cover the petri dish or evaporation will take it's toll.

Easiest way is to buy a plastic sterilite or other showbox size...it has a cover and will help prevent evap...set your dishes inside that.

I have @ 2 inches of standing water in the bottom to provide yet more humidity.

Try for Constant temps of @ 75F...you do not want a big drop or increase.

I dilute my Meth Blue so that you can "see through it".....light to medium blue and not so strong as to appear as a "stain" or thin paint......think weak ice tea type dark.....


Good luck.....


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## markbudde (Jan 4, 2008)

Are your eggs developing and then molding over, or are they failing to develop. What vitamins are you using?
-mark


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## ggazonas (May 11, 2008)

Alot of his eggs develop into tads and he has had good success morphing them out once they become tads, but he wants to increase his eggs to tad success


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Sounds like a diet defficency for sure.

If he is getting at least some full term eggs and the tads......that removes a lot of questions. at least.

take a closer look at your FF media composition, supplements, other feeder insects.....


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## herper99 (Mar 21, 2008)

GBIII said:


> I personally would not use ro/di water for anything but top off and misting. It is too low in disolved minerals. This causes issues in the egg/tadpole with regard to osmosis and diffusion. The tadpole must use more of it's available energy to keep the pure water out and it's needed minerals in. I'm sure I'm not explaining this exactly but I'm sure someone will chime in with better communication skills and deeper understanding of the processes at work.
> 
> George


You are doing fine George. With Ro water, like you said, the solute concentrations are ~0, which causes osmotic imbalance. One of two things can happen. The eggs can absorb too much water to try to reach equilibrium, or the solutes inside the eggs can start to diffuse out into the water from the eggs. Neither scenario is good. 

I like drizzling tadpole tea over the eggs. It generally yields good results.


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## asch803 (Nov 10, 2007)

i think there were a few issues. first i think the ro/di was a problem and then the other issue was that some of the clutches were drying out and molding over. Most of the problems were the ones in canisters (variabilis and castis). I don't think there is any vitamin deficiency issues. The frogs get a varied diet of springtails (in all tanks) and dusted (calcium and herptivore w/ naturose about every 2 weeks) melanos, hydeii and bean beetles. Temps this time of year will be a pretty consistent mid 70's but over the winter it can drop to 66 or 67 at night. I will put them in a sterilite type container, that's not a problem and the meth blue i used today seemed to have the correct dillution.

Will keep you all posted...

Thanks!

Andy


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## stemcellular (Jun 26, 2008)

GBIII said:


> I personally would not use ro/di water for anything but top off and misting. It is too low in disolved minerals. This causes issues in the egg/tadpole with regard to osmosis and diffusion. The tadpole must use more of it's available energy to keep the pure water out and it's needed minerals in. I'm sure I'm not explaining this exactly but I'm sure someone will chime in with better communication skills and deeper understanding of the processes at work.
> 
> George


If using RO/DI water make sure you add RO right which adds the requisite minerals.


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## bruce (Feb 23, 2007)

Just a thought,
I get a little behind in my tincs and generally will find multiple clutches layed on the same petri dish. As this is the case for pairs that I have a problem with their eggs going bad, I generally will let the parents tend to the eggs and then pull when they become tads. They seem to lay the "batches" away from each other so tad pulling is not a problem.
It seems what ever is in parent "secretions", always seems to do a better job then I.
Their average in eggs to tads always is better then mine and multiple spawns do not seem to stop the pairs from laying so far.


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