# Help me ID this cricket



## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

I recently went to my first herp expo post-COVID19 (to the extent COVID19 is actually over anyway). I found the whole excursion sort of depressing - hundreds of leopard geckos that will probably end up as CL rescues in six months, a handful of chameleons that will be lucky to live that long at all, and barely any amphibians. There was an ackie that might have been the most obese reptile I have personally seen. If I had thought to bring my DSLR I would have asked to photograph it for future use as training/husbandry aide. But I digress...

I did buy some feeders, and picked up some weird crickets just because they weren't the banded crickets I am used to and I try to feed my chameleon novel feeders whenever I see some available. I'm looking at them now and wondering "what are these things?" I think they're a Gryllus species. I didn't know any of the cricket drama post-cricket paralysis virus until I started doing some googling - of the Gryllus species people keep, it looks like Gryllus assimilis are legal to buy/sell/own and G. bimaculatus and G. locorojo are not (though I can't actually find any primary USDA references to these supposed regulations, and I'm unclear if they are illegal to own or just to ship to another state). I contacted the seller afterwards who clarified they are "black mediterranean crickets", which would probably mean bimaculatus, but I'm not sure he actually knows, and they don't look like bimaculatus to me. They seem to be staying alive a bit better than the banded crickets all the local pet shops sell, but my lizards aren't that excited by them. I'll either feed them off if they're innocuous or cull them if they're some known aggressive/invasive species. 

Any thoughts? I have a picture below. None of the ones I bought have their wings yet. I know this isn't an insect forum and PDF keepers don't use crickets as much, but I know folks on here keep a lot of non PDFs too. Also, does anyone know where I might find USDA regs as they pertain to this stuff?


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

connorology said:


> of the Gryllus species people keep, it looks like Gryllus assimilis are legal to buy/sell/own and G. bimaculatus and G. locorojo are not (though I can't actually find any primary USDA references to these supposed regulations, and I'm unclear if they are illegal to own or just to ship to another state).


Not your primary question, but the folks at APHIS are more responsive to questions like this than a person might think. If you ask, and hear back, let us know what you learn. 






USDA APHIS | Plant Protection and Quarantine Contacts







www.aphis.usda.gov


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Im very interested in knowing exactly what they are. 

There were 2 species of these meaty big boys that they substituted when the cricket problems started. Vague and changey with species names which was frustrating

I would like to get these again.


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## LexisaurusRex (Aug 8, 2013)

I don't have an ID but they look like the wild black crickets we have here (Utah). I've always been told never to feed the wild black ones to my animals but I'm not sure why. I'm not sure if it's the crickets themselves or possible toxins they could have been exposed to. Hopefully this is somewhat helpful but probably not haha


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## LovePDF (Aug 5, 2020)

LexisaurusRex said:


> I don't have an ID but they look like the wild black crickets we have here (Utah). I've always been told never to feed the wild black ones to my animals but I'm not sure why. I'm not sure if it's the crickets themselves or possible toxins they could have been exposed to. Hopefully this is somewhat helpful but probably not haha


I believe that's due to the diseases and parasites that the crickets may carry.


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## LexisaurusRex (Aug 8, 2013)

LovePDF said:


> I believe that's due to the diseases and parasites that the crickets may carry.


That definitely makes sense!


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Some species of crickets have a tendency to fight back (or harass sleeping animals) to a degree that makes them inappropriate prey for certain captives, also.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

A type billed as Jamaican Banana Crickets had a bite, when gripped in a handful, that was _disconcerting. _
I think they could do harm in some situations.

I want some of these silky exuved, big meaty crickets though. I feed thawed and live depending on the lizard.


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Not your primary question, but the folks at APHIS are more responsive to questions like this than a person might think. If you ask, and hear back, let us know what you learn.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I spoke with some bug people (not USDA) who said that you can't really tell to the species level until they are mature and chirping - I have a male set aside in his own jar and will keep feeding the others too, I think they should probably moult soon and start chirping based on their size. If I can get a chirp I'll look into the ID some more and probably email APHIS.


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

Kmc said:


> A type billed as Jamaican Banana Crickets had a bite, when gripped in a handful, that was _disconcerting. _
> I think they could do harm in some situations.
> 
> I want some of these silky exuved, big meaty crickets though. I feed thawed and live depending on the lizard.


These haven't attempted to bite me when handled - they're pretty bold though, they sit out in the open under the light. I've been feeding my chameleon by hand so as to not risk nightime bites (though there's so much in that cage to eat that isn't the chameleon I think it would be unlikely to be an issue).


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Well i cant blame em. They knew on somethin weren't right.

I would like to get some as Im phasing out dubia. Anyone know where to find any of these big species I would sure appreciate it.


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

Kmc said:


> Well i cant blame em. They knew on somethin weren't right.
> 
> I would like to get some as Im phasing out dubia. Anyone know where to find any of these big species I would sure appreciate it.


Do you breed your own or would you be looking for a steady supply?


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

Also, for anyone interested, this is the response I received from BugGuide (the naturalist ID site recommended on the USDA's entomology page) - one of the commenters is from USDA actually. 









Cricket (suspect Gryllus species) - Gryllus


An online resource devoted to North American insects, spiders and their kin, offering identification, images, and information.




bugguide.net


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

I would want to start off with 1000 and play it by ear.


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

As a general update for anyone who locates this thread in the future: 

Rainbow Mealworms currently sells Gryllus bimaculatus by special request to residents of California. It would thus appear they are legal to sell within a state - I have sent an email to an APHIS official to see if that is correct or if he can point me towards another official who might know for sure. 

Also I had previously mentioned my lizards don't like them- I should amend that assertion. My chameleon loves them, and he generally refuses crickets. I have been hand feeding them to him to avoid any risk of bites or escapes.


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

Second update: an email to a specific biologist at APHIS seems to have been ignored, I have a second inquiry bouncing around that's currently with the permit people. 

The nymphs have matured, here's what they look and sound like now. I think these are Gryllus bimaculatus. As feeders they've worked pretty well - they haven't seemed aggressive like the random hobbyist posts would indicate. Just meatier, thriftier, and more active. None of that matters if they're not legal to begin with, though.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Thank you. Appreciated


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## connorology (Oct 6, 2018)

Final update:

My takeaway from my email exchange with APHIS is that there aren't really specific species/genera that are "legal" or "illegal", they're all regulated and allowed/disallowed by permit application. It did not sound like anyone is particularly interested in cracking down on individual pet owners buying feeders, the permits are obtained by sellers. Pertinent snippet from the exchange: Gryllus crickets are legal "if they are sold under a USDA’s P526 permit. That means that we (USDA) and the CDFA reviewed the application and agreed with the conditions, species, etc... Most plant pests are regulated by USDA, including crickets. Crickets reared in the country, or legally imported that are free of diseases, parasitoids and plants and soil are moved and imported for the ‘feeders’ market. Legal vendors/importers have valid P526 permits to do so."

Currently Rainbow Mealworms appears to sell G. bimaculatus by special request to California residents only. APHIS said they are aware of this but declined to say if they had the proper permits, which sounded sort of sketchy. My somewhat cynical read of all this is that the feeder cricket market is not anybody's top priority, and the regulatory level seems to be a few steps above consumers, so it's probably minimally relevant to us as herp keepers not looking to propagate crickets. I've decided to ditch dubias as a feeder because they play dead and my animals don't eat them... but as much as the Gryllus crickets worked well while I had them, I think I am going to go with a different roach species and not get back into crickets.

Maybe I'll order some G. bimaculatus from Rainbow mealworms in the autumn when it's not 111F out. They can be a seasonal treat for my chameleon.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Thanks for spending the energy and time to get this cricket intel and share it.


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