# Basic Exo Terra 18"x18"x24" Build Journal



## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Supplies have begun arriving for the new build; so far just the Exo Terra (18"x18"x24") and glass cover. I'm planning on keeping this one pretty simple, as it will be my first planted terrarium, so don't expect anything too ground breaking. (I've done simple snake terrariums and planted bins + an outdoor garden for tortoises, but this is quite different.) This journal is mostly an opportunity for me to share my progress and solicit feedback.

As items arrive and I'm able to work, I'll try to provide updates. I'm not great at remembering to do "in progress" pictures, so development will probably just be visible in stages. (There are much more competent people providing step-by-step tutorials out there anyway.)

Unfortunately the glass I had cut was an imperfect fit, but after taking the Dremel to the underside of the included lid (and removing the mesh) I got it in there pretty good. Sealant is curing now. (I've included a couple pictures.)

I probably could have just removed the included lid completely, but I think it looks more "put together" this way. I'm also anticipating the need to drill for ventilation in the future, but I'll also be drilling for 2 MistKing nozzles and a drainage bulkhead, so that can wait.

Once I have a lighting hood, I may move the existing overhead lighting to cover only the other half of the closet. (For the time being, this terrarium will exist in my office closet. In the summer I'll also be collecting/keeping a few local ant species here and my two snakes are in 48"x24"x24" PVC cages just outside in my office.)

*Current Status: Not Much To See*









*Glass Top from Inside*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Playing with the idea of using Matala as both a false bottom and a (hopefully very well draining) support structure for the background. I'm very happy with it as a false bottom and my initial impression as a background is positive as well. It does take up a fair amount of floor space, but I think if I work the planters, ghostwood, and cork into it a bit before adding any foam I can make up for that while maintaining the structural and drainage benefits.

I'll obviously use silicone/foam to hold it into place, but I almost don't even need to. (I'll also be covering the bottom piece with a substrate barrier and cutting a small piece out to allow for installation of a drainage bulkhead.)

Probably no more progress until Tuesday at the earliest, but hoping for a big update by the end of the week.

If you have any suggestions or critiques, I more than open to them. (I can't promise I'll change anything, but I promise I'll listen. )

*(Very) Preliminary Layout*


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## J_w35 (Mar 19, 2017)

Looks awesome! cant wait for the updates!


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Just minor updates today.

Over the weekend I received my order of ghostwood and I'm pretty excited. I went the "sight unseen" route and hoped for the best, but I've already got some good ideas for the pieces I received. (Included in the pictures below.)

Unfortunately, it looks like shipping delays are going to push a lot of things I was hoping to do this week until next week. Oh well.

I did however take my first attempt at drilling the glass and I'm pretty happy w/ the results. I installed 3 2" ventilation holes in the top of the terrarium. I covered the holes w/ 20/20 screen and "finished" them w/ a rubber gasket. Other than a very minor mishap resulting in a small scratch to the glass, I'm pretty happy with how they turned out. (Pictures below.)

If I get lucky, I might have some more updates this week, but right now it looks like early next week before much more gets done.

Patience. Patience. Patience.

*Newly Installed Vents*









*Vents from Inside*









*Ghostwood Selection*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Good news! Looks like my big order should get here tomorrow. Might have some more significant updates over the weekend.

Right now, I'm thinking that a group of Ranitomeya variabilis  would be a good fit for the terrarium I'm putting together. The Southern "morph" is my initial preference, but I'm pretty partial to all of them that I've seen. Feel free to try and change my mind or just keep that in mind while you watch the build come together.

Only real progress at this point is taping/marking to prepare for some more glass drilling tomorrow. Installing a bulkhead and two MistKing nozzles. (Picture below.)

I'm a little torn on the bulkhead placement, but I want it as low as possible and as far towards the front as possible. The squares on the picture represent option #1 and #2; #1 is my preference, but #2 seems like the better option. At least w/ #2 I have reasonable distance from the edge on all but the bottom. Probably just gonna make a "game time" decision on that one.

A quick question however: I'm planning on covering the bottom 5" of the terrarium in black contact paper. It seems like the bulkhead should be pretty reliable, but do you think I should leave a portion uncovered so that I can monitor the water level?

*MistKing Nozzles in each Front Corner*









*Bulkhead Placement*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Quite a few updates now. Everything looks like a mess and my work area is a disaster zone; all signs that I'm making progress.

Got the holes drilled for the drain and the MistKing nozzles; the drain is installed and MistKing should arrive next week. I also got a nice layer of spray paint on the outside to hide the Matala false bottom and lower substrate layers. Took three attempts, but I'm happy with the final result.

On the inside, the Matala false bottom is "permanently" installed and the substrate divider is sealed on all sides w/ silicone. It seems to be very solid, so I'm happy with that.

I've also covered the back and portions of the sides/top with black aquarium silicone. I may end up regretting the top, but if so I'll just have to do a lot of scraping... right now I think it looks pretty good. Once all of the ghostwood/cork is installed, I'll do a lighting test and make a final decision.

I've also installed my largest piece of ghostwood (actually two pieces glued together) and I'm waiting on that to dry. Then I'll turn the enclosure onto it's back and begin installing the remaining wood on the back wall.

On a down note, the cold weather in the Midwest seems to have taken it's toll on my plant order. (There were signs that one or two actually froze and defrosted at some point during the journey...) Some of them might make it, but they're sad sight at the moment. Lucky for me though, we've got a reptile convention coming to town in a couple weeks that should give me an opportunity to pick up some new, healthier plants. (Sadly still too early for the frogs though.)

A few pictures below.

*Current Status: Messy*









*(Possibly) Regrettable Silicone on the Top*









*False Bottom Well Hidden*









*MistKing Nozzle Hole (1 of 2)*









*Drainage Bulkhead*


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## andrewdingemans (Jan 15, 2019)

Very nicely done. I am following along with this one. I wish the matalla was easier to get a hold of here in Toronto as it would have been my go to. I also like how you painted the outside to hide the false bottom. I assume you decided against a "viewing" are to be able to check it for water level?

I think the silicone in the back may allow you a nice shadowed area to maybe try and creep in some lower light plants. Fingers crossed most of your plant order pulls through!

______
Andrew


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## I'mNew2Frogs! (Jan 23, 2019)

Nice, I didn't think about replacing the screen with glass, I completely removed that screen top, put it in storage and fit a piece of glass to the viv.

I had problems though, there are two "nubs" inside of the lip in the front of the tank so the glass would not lay down flat. I took a Dremel to the plastic and made it that work but there is a slight gap in the back to allow for the cord from the temp/hydrometer, I need a good solution for that.

Hindsight, I think your way is better, the screen top has those tiny sliding bits in the back to close off the slots for cords.

I only paid $12 for "window" glass, maybe I'll have another one cut and do the same thing you did.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

andrewdingemans said:


> I assume you decided against a "viewing" are to be able to check it for water level?


I decided not to leave a viewing area on the side, however I did not spray paint the back so I'll still have a (less accessible) option for checking the false bottom, if needed.



andrewdingemans said:


> I think the silicone in the back may allow you a nice shadowed area to maybe try and creep in some lower light plants.


That was my original thought. Once all of the foam is fully cured I'll probably do a lighting test and make a final decision.



andrewdingemans said:


> Fingers crossed most of your plant order pulls through!


You and me both...


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

I'mNew2Frogs! said:


> Nice, I didn't think about replacing the screen with glass, I completely removed that screen top, put it in storage and fit a piece of glass to the viv.
> 
> I had problems though, there are two "nubs" inside of the lip in the front of the tank so the glass would not lay down flat. I took a Dremel to the plastic and made it that work but there is a slight gap in the back to allow for the cord from the temp/hydrometer, I need a good solution for that.
> 
> ...


The Dremel is pretty necessary for my method, as well. The nubs didn't give me a problem, but to get the underside of the plastic top to sit flush on the glass I had to grind down quite a few spots. It was pretty forgiving though, since the portion being cut isn't visible on the final project. I'd probably do it the same way again, but I think either way provides a good final product if done correctly.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Got the general design solidified and installed. Still working on trimming the Great Stuff before applying the silicone and background mix.

I'm pretty happy w/ the dimension I've been able to create, but I don't think I'll know if I'm happy until the background is complete and planted.

I created a "cave" on the upper level to provide some hiding space, but this created a bit of a problem. While peeling off the outer layers of the foam, I found a pretty significant gap inside the cave that probably would've amounted to a dart frog death trap (or at least an area that would be impossible for me to access). Because of this, I've added a good amount of Great Stuff to the cavity and I'll have to redo it tomorrow. I think this should solve the issue.

I'm going to be out of town this weekend, so I'm hoping to get the background fully completed by then to give the silicone plenty of time to cure before I begin planting.

Sadly, the plants are looking even worse. I think one of the ferns and the sheet moss will make it, but everything is probably a loss. Going to place a new plant order this week; I wanted a few additions anyway, so I'll just order a bit more than intended. (Keeping everything planted though; I've seen some miraculous recoveries in the past, so who knows...)

*Overall Layout*









*"Cave" Structure* Additional foam still needs to cure...


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Ultra-brief update today. Got the silicone/background mixture applied! Tank is currently laying on its back while the silicone cures. Might do some minor patching tomorrow with Gorilla Glue/background mixture, but probably nothing else to give it plenty of time to cure.

On a separate note, saw a group of four Variabilis "Southern" available locally... Hard not to pull the trigger, but this tank is probably at least 2-3 months away from "frog ready" and - barring an issue - I don't want the frogs to spend any longer in my bare-bones quarantine enclosure(s) than they have to.

Patience. Patience. Patience.

*Current Status: Still A Mess*


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## andrewdingemans (Jan 15, 2019)

Did you do the gorilla glue spray with water, apply fibre? am at the point where I am baking my coco fibre to dry it out and contemplating the application. I was initially going with TB3 but heard it dries super hard and needs a month to cure. Then I was going to go with silicone, but I have been hearing more about using gorilla glue which essentiallly foams up itself and gives a decent hold. Did you have anyone elses thread to reference for it?


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

andrewdingemans said:


> Did you do the gorilla glue spray with water, apply fibre? am at the point where I am baking my coco fibre to dry it out and contemplating the application. I was initially going with TB3 but heard it dries super hard and needs a month to cure. Then I was going to go with silicone, but I have been hearing more about using gorilla glue which essentiallly foams up itself and gives a decent hold. Did you have anyone elses thread to reference for it?


I actually went w/ silicone (ASI Aquarium - Black) for the majority and then pressed the background mix (Coconut Fiber/Husks + Peat) into that. I'm using the Gorilla Glue to touch up any areas that were missed. Based on my very brief experience, you could probably use Gorilla Glue instead of the silicone and get a very nice result (but maybe an even bigger mess).

I don't think there was a particular thread I referenced, but I definitely looked at a lot of builds before deciding to go this route.

EDIT: Forgot to mention; if you decide to use Gorilla Glue the coco fiber doesn't need to be nearly as dry as with silicone. Water actually helps the adhesion/cure with Gorilla Glue; one of the benefits to going that route.


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## andrewdingemans (Jan 15, 2019)

I think I will do a few test pieces this week. I have some time before my glass lids get here to test on some scrap foam in a spare bin or something. Thanks for the advice!


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## SoloSK71 (Dec 25, 2018)

Very nice!

Solo


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Ok. Background is in. MistKing is hooked up. Lights are in place. And the enclosure has been moved to its final position.

I added Turface as a substrate and leaf litter should get here sometime next week. My substrate layer may be a little excessive, but I'll re-evaluate and maybe pull some out once I have plants. (Bad news: everything but the moss is a total loss, as suspected.)

I have a new order of plants, along w/ Temperate Springtails and Dwarf White Isopods, in to GlassBoxTropicals which I'm pretty excited about. Unfortunately between the weather there (Michigan) and here (Colorado), it may be a while until I actually receive it.

Until then I'm just going to let the enclosure settle in as-is, so there might not be much to update for a while. But when there is, it should be pretty substantial.

*Current Status: In Position!*









*Just Another Angle*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Just a minor update, but progress is coming! Finally got some leaf litter into the tank (live oak base w/ some larger sea grape above). Also put in the surviving moss from my first plant order.

So far I'm ecstatic with the performance of the MistKing and my drainage system. Has worked flawlessly from the first test run and the automation is very nice. I'm definitely running it more often now that I will once the terrarium is more settled and I have frogs moved in; I'll probably cut back by 50% or more. (Maybe ramp down steadily as the plants acclimate.)

I also added a cork bark tube on the floor of the terrarium. Each end is stuffed w/ sphagnum and the interior contains an ABG/leaf litter mix that I hope will provide additional refuge for microfauna. Additionally the cork tube should provide a visual break on the floor of the terrarium. It's not set in place, so I can remove/adjust if needed.

Microfauna should be introduced very shortly and initial plants will be here by Thursday. (Plus I'll probably pick up a few extras in two weeks at the Reptilian Nation Expo in Denver.)

*Leaf Litter, Cork Tube, & Moss Added*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

So the plants are in!

Now time to play the waiting game. I'll keep on eye on plant growth and see if anything needs to be relocated or removed.

It's going to be interesting to watch in grow in.

If I do any significant adjustments, I'll update; otherwise I'll probably just update every month or so as it grows in. (And obviously when I get some frogs!)

*Status: Planted!*









EDIT: Link to full photo gallery: Basic Exo Terra 18"x18"x24" Build Journal (Imgur)


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Not much has changed, but the plants and microfauna seem to be flourishing. I don't see the isopods often, but the springtails have gone insane. (I'm guessing there will be a "die off" in the near future to normalize the numbers, because the current population seems unsustainable.)

So far I'm very happy. Might start looking for frogs in the next month or so. Right now I'm leaning strongly towards Ranitomeya variabilis, probably of the Southern morph.

I'll update again in a month or so (or if anything of note is changed).

*One Month Progress Update*


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## CrimsonRaine (Sep 13, 2018)

ra94131 said:


> Not much has changed, but the plants and microfauna seem to be flourishing. I don't see the isopods often, but the springtails have gone insane. (I'm guessing there will be a "die off" in the near future to normalize the numbers, because the current population seems unsustainable.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks fantastic! I love your attention to detail: the glass modification on the lid, the black painted finish outside, and the rubber gaskets to make the vents look neat.....

Excited for you finding some Ranitomeya Variabilis, they are beautiful frogs. If I were to get more, I'd most likely be looking at them too, just not sure if I'd go for the southern or highland morph......I like it when they're more of a greeny colour on the body, rather than the yellow.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Not much excitement this month. The springtails are still flourishing, though their numbers seem to be at a more reasonable level now. Haven't seen my isopods of late; not sure if they're just a little deeper in the substrate or dying off, regardless I will probably supplement their numbers soon.

I've been having a bit of a "problem" with flies in the enclosure for the past 3 weeks or so. I put "problem" in quotes since they really haven't spread outside of the enclosure (I basically kill one by my computer monitors a day) and I haven't seen any outside of my office, so they're not much of a problem. I've got some simple fly traps and vinegar/dish soap ready to go if they start to get out of hand. (This system used to work amazingly well for controlling flies around my hatchling sulcata tortoise enclosure.)

I also had a bromeliad bloom, which was quite nice to look at. Sadly when I was putting together this update I realized that I never snagged a good picture. It was quite a brilliant purple, but now all that's left is the withered remains... (Picture included below.)

I'm definitely starting my search for some frogs now and I've settled on _Ranitomeya variabilis_ "Southern" as my ideal candidate. I'll be keeping an eye out for availability, but I'm not in a rush at all. I don't keep many animals, so I try to be picky when selecting the source.

I'll update again in a month or so (or if anything of note is changed).

*Two Month Progress Update*









*Bromeliad Bloom (Past Its Prime)*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Not much to update three months in, but I like the idea of monthly updates.

Plants are growing very well and I might even trim some in the near future, though I'm liking the "overgrown" look. I do hope that the crawling plants continue to grow upwards to give some more green coverage to the upper portion of the background; might take a few more months.

The springtail population is doing great, but I'm pretty sure the isopods didn't make it. I'm going to look into re-seeding their population.

As far as frogs go, I'm definitely ready to move some in. Once I find a good source of _Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"_ I'll probably jump on it, but no luck so far.

*Three Month Progress Update*


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## jc_hammy (Apr 22, 2018)

Great looking tank so far. Thanks for sharing.


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## Mmkco (Dec 3, 2018)

Thanks for posting your Build. That looks amazing! Also from CO and getting ready to start on my second tank. This is a very addictive hobby!


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## RogueFish (Jun 22, 2019)

Looks like you're using the small exo terra fixture... ? What bulbs are you using? Just fluorescent or LEDs? Plant's look like they're doing great.


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## Kinstrome (Oct 6, 2017)

It looks beautiful! The half-concealed cork pieces really work.

Which plants do you have rooted in Turface? I'm interested in knowing which sorts of plants are able to prosper in that substrate. Yours look like they're doing well.



RogueFish said:


> Looks like you're using the small exo terra fixture... ? What bulbs are you using? Just fluorescent or LEDs? Plant's look like they're doing great.


I'm interested in knowing this also.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

I've done very little this month, but the terrarium still looks great. Plants are continuing to fill in and the water/lighting combo seems to be just about right. (I do have a "dry" spot on the upper middle, but I'm waiting to see what continued plant growth might do to resolve this.)

The springtail population is still doing great. My courageous decision to do nothing to help the isopods seems to have paid off as well, since I can now find them very reliably just below the surface of the leaf litter.

I'm still on the lookout for a good source of _Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"_, but no luck so far. Not in a hurry at all.

*Four Month Progress Update*


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

RogueFish said:


> Looks like you're using the small exo terra fixture... ? What bulbs are you using? Just fluorescent or LEDs? Plant's look like they're doing great.


I'm using the Small Exo Terra Compact Top w/ Jungle Dawn LEDs from NEHerp. I'm very happy w/ their performance so far.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Kinstrome said:


> It looks beautiful! The half-concealed cork pieces really work.
> 
> Which plants do you have rooted in Turface? I'm interested in knowing which sorts of plants are able to prosper in that substrate. Yours look like they're doing well.


I honestly don't remember off the top of my head. Sorry. If I have time later this week I'll pull my order sheet.

That said, I think that most non-epiphytic plants commonly found in terrariums would do well in the Turface. I did not select any of my plants w/ a particular substrate in mind and I haven't had any casualties so far.


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## Philio (Apr 16, 2019)

Outstanding job on this build. Looks fantastic!


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## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

Also from Colorado here. Nice build


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## ds51 (Oct 13, 2017)

wow every time I see this vivarium 
the more I like it a great build you done


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## Philio (Apr 16, 2019)

Very nice job!


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Looks like I should have some frogs in the very near future. They'll be in quarantine for the 5 month update, but I'll include some pictures. The six month update should (hopefully) also be the "moving in" update.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

ra94131 said:


> Looks like I should have some frogs in the very near future. They'll be in quarantine for the 5 month update, but I'll include some pictures. The six month update should (hopefully) also be the "moving in" update.


I can't wait, and they're not even my frogs lol!


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Continuing to monitor plant growth. I haven't done *any* trimming or manual spraying to this point, but I may need to in the coming months. Overall I'm happy w/ how things are growing in, but there's a couple plants that might be growing a little _too_ well.

The springtail and isopod populations are thriving, but stable. Seem to be relatively self-sustaining inside the vivarium, but I threw in some food this month to draw them up and get a better look. (Mediocre quality picture below.)



ra94131 said:


> Looks like I should have some frogs in the very near future. They'll be in quarantine for the 5 month update, but I'll include some pictures. The six month update should (hopefully) also be the "moving in" update.


Bad news on this front. Due to unfortunate circumstances outside of my control, it looks like I'll need to continue being patient. Still planning on _Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"_, but it'll probably be a few more months.

*Five Month Progress Update*









*Put some food in to attract the clean up crew. Looking healthy w/ most life stages visible.*


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## sparrow (Nov 14, 2015)

I have to say that big old dried leaf is so gorgeous!! What kind of leaf it that? I dunno why but dried leafs in ter/vivs are such nice additions!! Anyway, great setup!!


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

sparrow said:


> I have to say that big old dried leaf is so gorgeous!! What kind of leaf it that? I dunno why but dried leafs in ter/vivs are such nice additions!! Anyway, great setup!!


It is a Sea Grape leaf. I got a bag of them from Glass Box Tropicals and I love the look, as well. I think they create a nice flat surface, too, while looking very natural.

I replace the top layer with a new leaf as they decay to maintain the look. (I also supplement with more common Live Oak leaves.) With only one terrarium, a single bag will probably last well over a year.


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## RogueFish (Jun 22, 2019)

Vivs looking great!

Any chance you could go in depth a little more on the drainage?

1) What size hole did you cut?
2) What size bulkhead did you use?
3) What kind of drainage line do you plan on using?

And any other information you feel would be pertinent. Sorry to be a bother. I'm building the same size viv currently and I can't really find too much info on the parts.


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## Dendrusernm (Jul 27, 2019)

Looks great to think I limit myself to silicone cork and pond foam


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

RogueFish said:


> Vivs looking great!
> 
> Any chance you could go in depth a little more on the drainage?
> 
> ...


Sorry, I missed this when you originally asked. Answers below in case you are still interested.

1) 1 1/8" hole saw
2) 1/2" bulkhead
3) 5/8" interior diameter hose

With my setup (as documented in this post), this has been more than sufficient to keep up w/ the water cycle. I have it dump into a 5 gal. opaque, black storage tote for disposal. I also have a simple ball valve inserted in the drain hose, so that I don't have significant leakage while emptying the tote or moving things around.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Great news! I finally have four _Ranitomeya variabilis "Southern"_ occupying my terrarium. Sadly I don't have any very good pictures of them at the moment, but I'll keep any eye out for good opportunities and try to update this post.

I received them a few months ago and - after one month of quarantine - they've lived very happily in this space. Given then plethora of hiding spaces, I'd guess I only see each of them every other day or so. They are most active in the early morning or directly after I feed them.

I still haven't done any trimming or manual spraying to this point and am very happy w/ how things are growing. It's a little "out of control", but I think it provides more security for the inhabitants and so far hasn't caused me any problems.

The springtail and isopod populations remain steady inside the vivarium, but I'm continuing to monitor them. I've witnessed the frogs eating the springtails occasionally, but fruit flies are definitely the preferred food item - even for the smaller frogs.

In the photo below you may be able to spot one frog if you have strong "Where's Waldo?" skills, but I'll try to get some better photos of the inhabitants for my next update.

*Ten Month Progress Update*


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## amfshovelhead1 (Feb 15, 2020)

wow … This looks amazing


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## Alphonsus (Apr 10, 2015)

Not sure if you mentioned, but what plants do you have?


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

It's been a while since I've updated this - mostly because things were running so smoothly. That said, I've got some good news and bad news to report - both of which have been great learning experiences. I thought I'd go ahead and provide an update today and hopefully at least one more next month at 2 years.

We'll start with the bad news: I let the tank get a bit too overgrown - resulting in too many of the quick growing plants and the die off of some others (the bromeliads in particular). I don't have a picture of the overgrown state, but just imagine a glass cube full of green foliage. I think I'm going to pick up a few more bromeliads and try to stay on top of trimming; hopefully before the 2 year update.

You'll notice in the update picture that I just did a major trimming, so the tank isn't looking it's best. Past experience says it will bounce back appearance-wise very quickly though.

Now the good news: the tank and its inhabitants are all happy and healthy - except the bromeliads, I guess.

Springtail and isopod populations have maintained good ratios since the original introduction(s). I do occasionally put a small feeding pellet under the leaf litter, but I use it primarily as a way to check on my populations - I don't think the supplemental feeding is really necessary.

The plants grow incredibly well (maybe too well?) and require almost no maintenance other than limited trimming. Though I learned the hard way though that if I don't stay on top of that there is a "snowball effect" that can be a real problem. I did find one upside to allowing the tank to get a bit overgrown on a couple of occasions - the roots of the plants have draped over the branches/cork structure of the original design to create some very naturalistic hiding "caves" that the frogs utilize very regularly. I think this tighter knit foliage in some places has also helped delineate "zones" of the terrarium to prevent territorial aggression. Though regular trimming is needed to maintain an aesthetic appearance and protect the slower growing, epiphytic bromeliads, I do think there is some upside to allowing occasional phases of "overgrowth".

And the frogs! They have been doing great - this is my first experience with dart frogs and it has been very rewarding. All four frogs are healthy and active - I _believe_ I have a 2.2 group w/ one female seeming to be a bit more "dominant" than the others. I'm not practiced when it comes to sexing frogs though, so who knows. (I don't have great pictures for this purpose either - maybe I'll post some in the future.) There's definitely a mix however, because I regularly hear the males calling - sometimes two simultaneously - and my most recent trimming discovered 4 eggs and one male transporting a tadpole.

Prior to populating the tank I was concerned with the idea of multiple individuals in a single environment, since any animals I've kept previously were (and still are) solitary. Additionally, I purchased my frogs very shortly out of the water, so I had no idea what the sexual dynamics of my group would be. All this to say that it has been very interesting to watch, but overall any interactions between the frogs have been the good kind of boring. I do believe one of the females to be more dominant in that "she" seems to have a bit wider range than the others, is visible most often, and seems to be the first to feed every time I drop in fruit flies. She's also a bit bigger than the others, which are all very similar in size. The one I believe to be the less dominant female is the one I see the least often - "she" also spends the most time higher in the terrarium. ("She" is also the one I am most likely to have improperly sexed.) The two males have very similar patterns and vocalize regularly in the early AM - but also occasionally throughout the day. Their respective territories seem to be roughly the right/left sides of the terrarium, but they're both prone to wandering.

In regards to breeding, I'm not really sure what my plan is here. I'm certainly not actively _trying_ to breed, but also don't want to be neglectful/cruel to any potential offspring. My current plan is to let nature take its course and only remove eggs/tadpoles when absolutely necessary or when disturbed by my trimming activities. If _in situ_ breeding and egg laying because more frequent - and I anticipate it might, I'll adjust my plans/strategy accordingly. If at any point I notice froglets, I will certainly be removing them to their own environment to avoid "bullying" which I think could be cruel.

I do have one small clutch (4 eggs) that I removed to a separate container after my trimming session today and I also just spotted a male carrying a tadpole on its back. (Consequently I added a few shallow water dishes throughout the terrarium, since I may have reduced the number of plant-based water sources during my most recent trimming. I don't plan to leave these permanently.)

Hope you enjoy the update and photos! I'll try to snap a few extra pictures throughout the next month for the 2 year update.

*23 Month Progress Update*









*Eggs Discovered During Trimming*









*Spotted A Tadpole!*


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

I'd suspect the Neos succumbed to being planted terrestrially and not having enough ventilation where they were located.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

Socratic Monologue said:


> I'd suspect the Neos succumbed to being planted terrestrially and not having enough ventilation where they were located.


None were actually planted terrestrially - the one that appears that way is planted in a hollow cork. They thrived for at least 18 months as planted.

That said, I completely agree on the ventilation; the excess plant matter from the other plants completely blocked most avenues of airflow. This - combined with the faster growing plants blocking out much of the direct light - was a death sentence.

When I replant the bromeliads, I'm thinking I'll limit to only three so that I can still let the other plants "go wild" a bit but also allow plenty of clearance.


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## CharlieN (Mar 5, 2019)

I enjoyed reading this thread on your build and the pictures of the transformation were great, hard lesson on the plants but a good of you to include it in this thread you taught us something with it. I did a small build that is almost 2 years old now. It houses 2 big scaled least geckos in a bio active vivarium now i will be starting a 24x18x18 bio active viv for dart frogs. Looking forward to the next update.


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## ra94131 (Jan 21, 2019)

This will be my final update to this thread - look for a future thread in the Member's Frogs & Vivariums forum. (I think it's well past time for the transition.)

I've made a number of updates to the foliage over the past month+ - including further trimming of the overgrowth to make room for some new bromeliads. The new setup is very similar to the original, but I have a better idea of how to properly prune/manage my plantings now. I'm optimistic for the future.

The frogs continue to thrive. The film canisters are probably just temporary until the bromeliads get a bit larger. I currently have 8 tadpoles developing outside of the enclosure - in the future I'd like to leave them in place, but I'm enjoying being able to watch the process more closely in the short-term. Thus far the frogs seem to prefer laying eggs on the leafy vegetation and then transporting the tadpoles when they've developed - rather than laying directly in/near the film canisters or bromeliads. I'll be interested to see if this continues.

*24 Month+ Progress Update*


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## Fishymcfish (Jan 22, 2021)

Looks great so far!


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