# Cloud Forest Enclosure



## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

I don't keep any Dendrobates, but I have thought about it for years. I have learned a LOT on this forum, but since I don't keep the frogs, my input opportunities are limited. I do however keep some cool growing orchids, and am working on an artificially cooled environment that may interest some folks on here, so I thought I would share what I have learned.

There aren't a lot of high elevation Dendrobates, but something like Ranitomeya daleswansoni may enter the hobby and require an environment that is artificially cooled to replicate a cloud forest.

I will use this thread to show the build.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*Converting a Wine Cooler for Cloud Forest Orchids
*
My main approach will be to convert a Wine Cooler. They are cheap, especially if you look on Craigslist. They have a nice finished look and are well insulated with a dual pane window. Also, they are air tight so humidity and fruit flies shouldn’t be a problem.

My goal was to recreate a cloud forest with a low of 50-55F and a high of 65-70F. I want to be able to maintain 70%+ humidity and good airflow. I want the environment to be fully automated so I can go away for a week or two on vacation without having to get a plant sitter to come water every day. Remember that my goal was only to grow plants not frogs.

Once done, if things work out well, I intend to stand up additional units so I can cover different conditions. I also intend to run it off of an advanced controller so that all of aspects of the environment can be controlled and monitored from my phone. But that will be toward the end of this project.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*Choosing a Cooler*

There are two types of stand-alone wine coolers, Thermoelectric and Compressor. A compressor cooler is just like your refrigerator at home. It has a cooling chemical, a compressor that pressurizes the chemical and radiator cooling on the back of the fridge. It can cool down really well, but makes a lot of noise and is expensive to run. Here is an example of a compressor model:

NewAir 33-Bottle Compressor Wine Cooler-AWC-330E - The Home Depot

A thermoelectric cooler runs using a Peltier chip. When electricity is applied to the chip, one side gets really hot, one side gets really cold. The cold side is in the cooler and the hot side is outside. Fans blow on both the hot side and cold side so that the inside stays cold and the hot air goes out into the room. It doesn’t cool as well as a compressor fridge, but it is much quieter and cheaper to run. Also, there are a no complicated parts so it is much easier and safer to modify. The only concern I had was if it could get and stay cold enough. There is a lot of talk online about Peltier cooling not being sufficient. One thing to keep in mind with thermoelectric coolers is that they can only cool so much below room temperature. If you keep one in a 90 degree F garage, it isn’t going to cool anywhere close to one you keep in a 72 degree house. The compressor coolers don’t have that same limitation.

You can find these used on craigslist or second hand stores pretty easy. I was looking for a large unit 28+ bottle capacity and one where the controls were on the door instead of inside the fridge. I figure with all the humidity and spraying going on, it would be better. I ended up buying two units for $50 each on craigslist. 

NewAir AW-281E: http://www.newair.com/wine-cooler/thermoelectric/aw-281e-28-bottle-wine-fridge/
Vinotemp VT-28TEDS: http://www.vinotemp.com/View.aspx/7373/VT-28TEDS-Wine-Cooler---Scratch-n-Dent

Something was likely wrong with the Vinotemp. It cooled, but I could only get it about 10 degrees F cooler then room temperature. The NewAir worked great and would get down to 53F or almost 20 degrees lower than the room temperature.

If I were to have bought one brand new to covert, I would have probably tried this one:
New 32 Bottles Wine Cooler Fridge Cellar Storage Holder Chiller Bar Rack Cabinet | eBay
It appears to have dual Peltier coolers, and claims to be able to get down to 40 degrees F where most only claim to go down to 50 F or so. It is cheap, simple, and has the controls in the door.

Here is a picture of the New Air unit I will be modifying. The unit is the one on the left. You can see a little blue light that I can turn off or on. My plan is to leave that in place to kind of act as moon light when the bright light goes off. It will likely do nothing for the plants, but I think it will be neat.


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## Phyllobates (Dec 12, 2008)

Curiosity piqued. Looking forward to this...


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## ruairidh_ (Feb 9, 2016)

Following this


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## Carolina Vivariums (Oct 27, 2016)

Interested!


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

Ooops..Here is a picture of the New Air unit I will be modifying. The unit is the one on the left. (try 2)


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*LIGHTING*



















I knew to maximize my low temperatures, that I would want the heat from any lighting to be outside of the box. I knew I would want to cut as small of a hole as possible to minimize the impact to the insulation. I also needed a pretty bright light to punch down over 2 feet to the bottom of the cooler. I decided to go with a single chip, high intensity LED light. This allowed me a 3 inch hole in the top and more than enough light.

I built a 17-164 Watt unit based on the following components:

· Vero 29 chip BXRC-50G10K0-L-24(light bulb): BXRC-50G10K0-L-24 Bridgelux | Optoelectronics | DigiKey

· Meanwell LPF-90D-42 Driver (ballast): LPF-90D-24 Mean Well | Mouser

· SSTX Passive Heatsink: SST X Passive Heatsink

· Cooper Controls 0-10V Dimmer: Cooper Controls SF10P-W Slide 0-10V Dimmer - 120/277V, White: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific

Effectively the same equivalent light can be built with much cheaper components, but I wanted the passive cooling so there is no part to break, and the 0-10v dimming because I wanted to control the intensity of the lights and I need the more expensive dimming when I finally build in the automatic controller.

Other than that I just re-purposed a drip tray from a stove to make a little reflector, and some other wires and stuff I had on hand. Later on I will show how I integrated it all into the cooler box.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*Testing the Light*

I ran tests this weekend to determine the min/max temperatures with the cooler running and the light set to different intensities.

Room temperature was held at 70 degrees Fahrenheit. There was only a single thin layer of glass between the light source and the cooler. With the single pane of glass, and without the light on, it would maintain a low of 54.5 F. With no cooling, and the light at 100% intensity, the Max temperature was 93.9 F. With the cooler running, the max temperature was determined by the intensity of the light going into the cooler. I believe if I add a dual pane glass, or low-e glass, I can lower the max temperatures, but I can’t find a cheap, small, prebuilt dual pane window. Also, I am worried that if I make one it will quickly start fogging.

Here are the Max Temps:









Based on this, somewhere between 85% and 100% would be ideal. A low of 55 and a High of 65 is just what I was hoping for.

Next I tested the light intensity to see where we stood. I used a lux meter and measured different distances from the bottom (25 inches) to the highest point on the wall where I think Plants will sit (5 inches). Here are the Lux readings:









If I use the light scale you typically see for orchids, High, Medium and Low light look like this:









Based on this, I would think that I lucked out, and 85% may be just right for growing orchids. 

However, my experience running under these High intensity LEDs is that it is probably way too much light. For example I run one on my office tank. My Specklinia grobyi is at 6000 Lux, which should be way into the Low range, and it is awfully pink on the top of the leaves. It was a very consistent dark green when I got it.










This has me thinking that 85% will not likely let me grow as many low light plants as I am planning. Ideally I would be able to have low light plants in 2/3rds of the tank and medium in 1/3rd. 

For a frog tank, I am sure you would only want low and maybe a little medium.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*Modifying the Cooler*

I needed to cut a hole in the top of the cooler for the light. To determine how big the hole was, I used the fact that the LED chip has a 120 degree spread, along with the height the chip would be from where I wanted the light to fall on the inside of the tank. I wanted it to fall on the side walls about an inch from the top. I learned that I needed a 3” x 3” hole in the top, tapering out to 8”x8” on the inside ceiling of the tank. I ended up cutting the hole a little wider just in case. I just drilled holes in the corners and used a jig saw to cut out between the holes.









Then I used a razor knife to cut the plastic on the inside of the tank. Turns out the interior blue light was directly in the way of the hole, so I had to make a little cut out to the side and move the light over. 









Here is a picture with the blue night light on:









Also, it appears on both of the tanks, the wires were in the way of a hole cut in the center of top. This is the one thing you will need to rewire once you get in there if you cut through the wires making a hole.









I then covered over the exposed insulation with some white plastic sheeting. I used some clear silicone to hold it in place and seal the seams. I think I could have just left it alone, but I thought it would make it look cleaner, and would help prevent water leaking down inside the walls down the road.

I took off the back cover and cut a hole for the dimmer switch, and the power cords. I just drilled the corners and then used a metal cutting bit on my dremmel to cut between the holes. I have since learned that using a sheet metal nibbler, would be way cleaner, faster, and easier. I will buy one of those next time:
https://www.amazon.com/Nickel-Plated-Nibbling-Tool-1/dp/B0002KRACO/ref=sr_1_2?s=power-hand-tools&ie=UTF8&qid=1484844136&sr=1-2&keywords=nibbler

Finally I installed the dimmer, driver, and cords on the back cover and re connected it.









I could have just left everything on the outside and it would have been easier, but I like the idea of trying to make everything more self-contained.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*Inside the Cooler
*
Now I turned my attention to the interior of the cooler. I knew I would want to create a reservoir and drainage at the bottom of the tank, both to keep humidity levels up, and to prevent spilling outside of the tank. I will be running a misting system and I want the excess spray to be managed.

I made 2” Plexiglas strip and glued it in place at the front of the tank. This would give me about a 1.5” reservoir capacity. I used a Plexiglas glue (Weld-On #16 Thickened Acrylic Glue) after testing whether or not it would seal with the interior plastic of the cooler and it seemed to work great, but the plastic interior for each cooler could be different materials so test it before you trust it. If that glue won’t work, you can use silicone, but it just won’t be a clean looking.

The tank came with its own drip hole. I wanted drainage that would leave up to 1.5 inches of water in the reservoir. I ran 1/8” tubing through the drip hole, then extended the top of it to the level I wanted to maintain the resevoir. It acts like a mini bulkhead. I used silicone to hold the 1/8” tube in the hole both top and bottom and seal it watertight. The tube then goes through the drip hole and then drains into a waste bucket.










To keep the tube from clogging, I drilled a little piece of 3/8” plexiglass with a hole. Then I glued some old aquarium filter stuff I had laying around to form a cap over the tube. I then placed the tube through the hole, and hopefully it will be enough to prevent the tube from clogging.









I used the bottom wine rack because it was obviously a perfect fit for the bottom and would be able to be removed easily in the future for cleaning. I then cut a plastic coated wire shelf to lay directly on top of the wine rack. This allows me to place pots or whatever on the bottom of the tank. It is also easily removable. I also covered the cut metal ends with a little dab of silicone, just to try and prevent rusting.









Finally I bought some green plastic coated wire mesh.
https://www.amazon.com/Origin-Point-272405-Hardware-24-Inch/dp/B000HHSCLA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1485552694&sr=8-1&keywords=Origin+Point+272405+1%2F2-Inch+Mesh+Green+Vinyl+Coated

This chiller had little nubs sticking out both sides near the front to hold the racks in place. These nubs fit perfectly into the holes of the wire mesh. 










I was able to flatten, cut to size, and install the mesh, just using those nubs to hold it in place and it works great (I got lucky), it is really stable, and should hold the weight of what I hang on it. If the back does start to sag, I can easily glue in some Plexiglas supports in the back, but honestly, it was very ridged, I would be surprised if I need to take that step in the future.










Of course for a frog application, you would want to do something natural as the interior instead of the mesh, and the bottom would be a traditional raised floor with some substrate. Finally you would want to put a finer mesh over the fan to prevent frogs getting hurt.


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## skanderson (Aug 25, 2011)

very cool build please keep us updated on how its going.


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## cjkpa1 (Dec 17, 2016)

Very well thought out I'm very interested in final result.


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## Carolina Vivariums (Oct 27, 2016)

Any update?


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## oldlady25715 (Nov 17, 2007)

Ameerga Silverstoni or highland sirensis is would be good inhabitants. Very cool build.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

Adding the fans

The box came with one fan on the back of the unit blowing air toward the glass. This allows the cool air on the heatsink to disperse (so the heatsink won’t turn to a big ice cube). This fan will only run while the unit is actively cooling. I wanted to add additional air circulation, and I wanted it to be variable speed so that I can turn it up or down as necessary.

I decided to assemble a couple of fans and a controller so I can turn the speed of the fans up and down. I bought the following Dimmer:
https://www.amazon.com/uniquegoods-CCMFC-Controller-A

I assembled it and installed it inside the back cover of the cooler along with everything else. Here is a diagram:









You can see it all installed on the opposite side from where I installed the controller for the lighting:









Here is the controller and the on/off switch on the outside of the tank:









Now I can run the fans at any speed and then once it is set how I want it, I can use the switch to turn them off if I am going to mess around inside the tank. I have the fans set up so one is blowing down and toward the front glass to keep it clear from humidity, then a second fan blows down and across so that I get a lot of conflicting currents throughout the tank.


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

This has been a very interesting read so far. Looking forward to more updates.


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## Ravage (Feb 5, 2016)

Really excellent job so far! This could have a lot of applications. I never realized you could get a wine chiller so cheaply on craigslist. Wonders truly never cease.


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## gzollinger (Aug 22, 2016)

*Misting *

I wanted to set it up with a misting unit that is automated to run several times a day. I want to be able to leave it for a week when I am out of town without all the plants dying. I could have purchased a prebuilt unit like: 
MistKing Misting Systems by Jungle Hobbies Ltd

I have heard really good things and I am sure it would work very well, but I wanted to build it myself just because. 

I have made my own adjustable misting heads for other projects and it works really well. When done like this your nozzle can be redirected in any direction. The Mist King nozzles do this as well, but they are also a lot larger. One nice thing about making these yourself is that they are also very small and compact. I make the nozzles using some drip hosing, some elbow connectors and a high pressure mist head like this:
https://www.amazon.com/Dig-Misting-Nozzle-Barb-pack/dp/B01986L8PW/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1490036810&sr=8-3&keywords=Dig+3%2F4+GPH+Misting+Nozzle

Here is a picture showing how they are assembled :









I made an assembly of 6 nozzles that spread out across the top of the tank. Here is a picture before it is installed using some zipties.









I am using a high pressure diaphragm pump (60 psi). The output runs through a reducer into the drip irrigation hose. I just mounted it on the back of the tank.









The pump runs on a timer that can be set to second intervals. Like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/Meeeno-Digital-Programmable-Socket-Switch/dp/B01IQUMJ72/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1490037196&sr=8-1&keywords=Meeeno+Digital+Programmable+Timer+Socket+Plug-in+Switch+-+2+Pack


Over time I will figure out how many times it will run each day and for how long. I can tell you with 6 misting heads, it soaks the box pretty quickly.


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## hek0 (May 21, 2021)

Bro. What happened


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