# Pumilio ID Time!



## UmbraSprite (Mar 2, 2007)

Time to do the impossible and ID a pum!

Well...I can at least get a consensus :? 

I will preface with saying none of these frogs look anything like the isla cristobal's I filmed in Bocas....however I was only at one location for about an hour.

This frog (one of two) was given to me as a isla cristobal....


















This guy...was labeled "cristo" and was given to me as well.










































I have had both sets of frogs for about 6 months now and the "cristo" is all alone. Love to hear what you guys think (other than we will never know for sure...as I already know that!)

Thanks!


----------



## valledelcauca (Apr 13, 2004)

Hi,

seen some looking like yours labled as "Rio la Gloria" on Dendrophoto.com.

I pmed you the link to that post as I don`t know if I`m allowed to do that here.

Greetings
Andreas


----------



## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

They look more like some of the "yellow" rio brancos IMO - which doesn't count for much.


----------



## Jungle_John (Feb 19, 2007)

looks like cristo to me but what i know? :roll:


----------



## UmbraSprite (Mar 2, 2007)

*Geography lessons for Chris?*

I asked this before (and got an answer but can't find the post) but can someone write out the locals?

Rio cristo:

Rio branco:

Guaramo:

Isla cristobal:

I am not clear where each is (I am not up on my Panamanian river geography) and am trying to get a feel. I know several of these are close together but I can post some photo's I took on Isla Cristobal and the pums there were red spotted with black and mostly blue legs with black. Very different from anything I have seen labeled "cristo" in the hobby.

Thanks!


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

Looking at my map, I can't find "Rio Branco" or "Rio Cristo." Rio Guaramo is about 1/3 of the way from the Aguacate peninsula to the Valiente peninsula, past Robalo and Uyama.

As for the Isla San Cristobal, here's one that I found:










I know that they can vary from yellowish to red, but by and large, it seems to me that they have the very fine spotting rather than the larger spots you find on Colons or Western Bastimentos. It'd be that reason why I'm not sure I'd call them Isla San Cristobals...


----------



## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

There is no "Rio Cristo", that's a mislabel from someone confusing rio branco and isla cristobal. The first frog I *might* consider a cristobal because it does seem to have the more defined spotting, but the second has the blotchy not clearly defined markings I associated more with the brancos. Looking at leg markings, I'd probably toss them in the same form together, but I'm not thinking cristo. I've heard of orange to red cristos, but I've never heard of a honestly yellow animal from that locality.

As for Guaramo, yes they are yellow, but I've always thought they had the blotched lines more than spotting, but the second especially could just be a reduced pattern example of these. The Guaramo also seem to have the grey and black leg patterning that both these exhibit.

I am still more personally inclined to say they are yellow brancos which range from blotched lines to spotted, have the grey patterned legs, and seem to actually range from yellow to red - tho I've never seen confirmed locality "branco" from SNDF that were yellow?

This is why I find it incredibly frustrating that only some of the animals are coming in labeled :evil:


----------



## UmbraSprite (Mar 2, 2007)

Ok....

Your photo looks exactly like mine from Cristobal. I am going to go on the assumption then that the others are more likely Branco's and not Cristobal. 

Thanks guys!


----------



## captreedean (Oct 19, 2007)

I have been looking over the pictures from some of the most recent shipments ,and it seems many of these morphs share common characteristics, and except for there label ,could pass for numerous morphs. I have also noticed that many are claimed to be farmed raised. Is it possible that they are being mixed and bred together,as if one morph ,at the site of the breeders, and then being labeled ? Is there any quality control at the site where they are being collected and farmed?


----------



## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

That is a huge can of worms that has been talked about a lot and probably is safer left alone for right now (whether they were collected and held or actually bred and raised on the frog farm).

Basically the issue here is exactly as stated - a lot of frogs which individuals can be mistaken for another population, and only one of the importers seems to be getting labeled frogs. The rest have to guess the identity of what they got. There are known localities for what is being sent in, but when they don't come in labeled...


----------



## UmbraSprite (Mar 2, 2007)

Agreed...

I think the best way to handle it would be to attach the import date to whatever name they assign. At least then you can keep them straight by when they were brought in. Of course...this is assuming you don't have a mixed locale batch arriving together which I think we are seeing now.


----------



## pigface (Apr 28, 2006)

I didn't see this post at first . But the first one looks like what SNDF brought in in 2006 . Some called them Rio bronco and some call them cristobals ? I guess we will never know where they are from . Maybe neither local .

The second ones look like what was recently brought in as Guarumo's , are they a little smaller the the first frog ? The "Guarumo's" I got seem to be smaller and the spotting is dark brown and more irregular compared to the others being black . I guess the "Guarumo" name is a best guess also ???

06 "rio bronco or cristobal" import








07 "Guarumo" import


----------



## Rich Frye (Nov 25, 2007)

Chris, 
None of your pics look like any San Cristobal Island pumilio I have ever seen or seen pics of.
To make it clear. San Cristobal Island pumilio are the only Panama pumilio with any 'Cristobal' in the name. As stated , there is no rio cristobal or any other cristobal. There are no mainland San Cristobal morphs at all. Those putting "cristobal" labels on their pums are looking at pics and guessing that it looks as close to a real San Cristobal Island pumilio as any other morph they know of. Pics without calls, lengths of males, lengths of females, egg info or any other information. 
Funny enough, I can name at least four or five other morphs that I could pass off as San Cristobals in a pic.......

Rich


----------



## UmbraSprite (Mar 2, 2007)

Yah Rich...

When I was on Cristobal....none of the frogs I saw looked anything like any of these animals. Here is what I saw...

(will take a while to load...pic heavy!!)

general-discussion/topic30487.html


Granted ... these were all taken at the same location on the north side of the island as shown on the map


----------



## MonarchzMan (Oct 23, 2006)

UmbraSprite said:


> Yah Rich...
> 
> When I was on Cristobal....none of the frogs I saw looked anything like any of these animals. Here is what I saw...
> 
> ...


How'd I miss that topic?! Awesome photos! Very jealous of the CRARC bit 

As for the Cristobals, I saw some on the north side of the island and on the southwest side, and they all look the same. While there is a bit that I haven't seen, I'm guessing the whole island has the same coloring.


----------



## Marty (Feb 27, 2004)

Few photos of the ones I just picked up. What's the consensus here?


----------



## KeroKero (Jun 13, 2004)

That there is not a consensus  I keep hearing names tossed around but I also know that the names being tossed around are likely not localities the animals even came from :?


----------



## Marty (Feb 27, 2004)

KeroKero said:


> That there is not a consensus  I keep hearing names tossed around but I also know that the names being tossed around are likely not localities the animals even came from :?


I'll just call it the 'Isla del mistking', alternatively we can call them as 'Isla del Kero'


----------



## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

MonarchzMan said:


> Looking at my map, I can't find "Rio Branco" or "Rio Cristo." Rio Guaramo is about 1/3 of the way from the Aguacate peninsula to the Valiente peninsula, past Robalo and Uyama.
> 
> As for the Isla San Cristobal, here's one that I found:
> 
> ...


Don't know what you're frogs are, but I found my new desktop background :mrgreen:


----------

