# Marcgravia Chances



## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

So I got a pretty good size shipment of plants last week and everything came in looking really good for the most part. The only exception was a cutting of marcgravia"red umbellata" which lost a bunch of leaves in transport. The cutting is about four inches long, and has about 4 small leaves left. What do you think it's chances are?

I have it laid on top of moist sphagnum moss, pinned down very gently to maximize contact with the substrate. I've not had a problem with getting marcgravia going before, but I have never had to start with such a small piece.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Chances are good. Give it lots of humidity and a little extra praise and I bet it recovers.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Chances are good. Give it lots of humidity and a little extra praise and I bet it recovers.


Hope you are right! It was not cheap and hate to have to order another, or find someone to trade for another.


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## RobJersey (Apr 23, 2019)

I’ve found that umbrulatta loves to drop leaves when it’s angry. As long as there are some left it will recover. Put it in a place that stays somewhat moist / humid and don’t touch it.. sometimes it will settle in within a few weeks, sometimes months. I’ve even had some with no leafs send runners after assuming they where lost.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Chances are good. Give it lots of humidity and a little extra praise and I bet it recovers.


I believe there was an episode of Mythbusters where they found that metal music improved the growth of some plants. Maybe try playing some Megadeth


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

RobJersey said:


> I’ve found that umbrulatta loves to drop leaves when it’s angry. As long as there are some left it will recover. Put it in a place that stays somewhat moist / humid and don’t touch it.. sometimes it will settle in within a few weeks, sometimes months. I’ve even had some with no leafs send runners after assuming they where lost.


Appreciate the insight and you sharing your experience with me. Hope that is the case with mine. We will see.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

hypostatic said:


> I believe there was an episode of Mythbusters where they found that metal music improved the growth of some plants. Maybe try playing some Megadeth


Yeah I'm not going to try that, but my GF likes metal so the cutting may overhear her music while I'm gone and make a full recovery. Why can't plants like sports radio or NPR. If they did I'd have the ultimate green thumb.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

varanoid said:


> Why can't plants like sports radio or NPR.


I guess NPR is even too boring for plants haha


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

My plants all like NPR. If they don't, they're afraid to say so. 

Speaking of NPR, it was on a past podcast of either This American Life or Radiolab that they talked about research showing that tree roots find buried water lines not by detecting leaking water but by the sound of the water going through the pipes (I guess the roots were attracted to underground pipes with speakers playing water noises). So plants apparently do hear; possibly different species prefer different genera of music?


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## jgragg (Nov 23, 2009)

> Speaking of NPR, it was on a past podcast of either This American Life or Radiolab that they talked about research showing that tree roots find buried water lines not by detecting leaking water but by the sound of the water going through the pipes (I guess the roots were attracted to underground pipes with speakers playing water noises). So plants apparently do hear; possibly different species prefer different genera of music?


_I totally remember that one_ - it's a Krulwich job, on Radiolab. It was amazing, as usual. Here's a link:

https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/smarty-plants


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

hypostatic said:


> I guess NPR is even too boring for plants haha


Blasphemy!


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## Fahad (Aug 25, 2019)

varanoid said:


> Appreciate the insight and you sharing your experience with me. Hope that is the case with mine. We will see.


I had a cutting of 'White Fringe' that was beat up, almost dried out (that was an accident) and lost all but ... 4 or 5 (?) leaves. It has since tripled in size and looks good. Took it a while, though.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

And then there were 3 leaves. As you can see one more leaf fell of last night, you can see it flipped over next to the paperclip in the photo. Hope it makes a recovery, but have a feeling it will take a long while to do so. Ugh.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Seems like my Marcgravia cuttings almost always do that. They drop their leaves and start over. It almost always comes back, though, if conditions are right.

Mark


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

And then there were two leaves...with one of the two looking like it is going to wilt and die soon. No sign of roots at all on the cutting that I can see. 

Interestingly one of the leaves that fell off and flipped upside down is looking green and healthy, though nothing is going on. Any chance that leaf may make another plant? I've noticed on a couple of my other marcgravias that the leaves look like they want to put out roots. Do they do this?


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Here are the suspected "leaf roots" of another species/cultivar of marcgravia that I am talking about. The cutting with the bigger leaves is clearer. the smaller leaved cutting is the same cultivar and is a little less obvious, but still there none the less. I have observed similar with 'small round' as well. The suspected roots are the white fuzzy points on the outer leaves. Thoughts and or experience?


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

varanoid said:


> And then there were two leaves...with one of the two looking like it is going to wilt and die soon. No sign of roots at all on the cutting that I can see.
> 
> 
> 
> Interestingly one of the leaves that fell off and flipped upside down is looking green and healthy, though nothing is going on. Any chance that leaf may make another plant? I've noticed on a couple of my other marcgravias that the leaves look like they want to put out roots. Do they do this?


I'm having a similar problem with a cutting of sintenisii that I got last month. No growth and leaves are falling off. 
I have mine in a similar setup as you but with a lid on top to keep the humidity in. I'll see how it goes


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Probably not a helpful comment at this point, but I tend not to start cuttings in plain sphagnum. I've used regular old 'potting soil' (Fafard, though I bet most are the same) with good results, and also a small pot lined with sphagnum with a well of ABG in the center. I always bury the cut end, and of course keep humidity near 100%.

I've also rooted most vining plants in water, though I've not tried this with Marcgravia.


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## markpulawski (Nov 19, 2004)

I put and end under the sphagnum so it can pull the moisture, that sphag should be on the verge of wet, needs to be much more damp for that one to recover.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Probably not a helpful comment at this point, but I tend not to start cuttings in plain sphagnum. I've used regular old 'potting soil' (Fafard, though I bet most are the same) with good results, and also a small pot lined with sphagnum with a well of ABG in the center. I always bury the cut end, and of course keep humidity near 100%.
> 
> I've also rooted most vining plants in water, though I've not tried this with Marcgravia.


This is actually what I had done with my sintenisii but it didn't seem to be effective for me. In my case the piece might have gotten too dry/warm in shipping (took 4 days to get to me)


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Probably not a helpful comment at this point, but I tend not to start cuttings in plain sphagnum. I've used regular old 'potting soil' (Fafard, though I bet most are the same) with good results, and also a small pot lined with sphagnum with a well of ABG in the center. I always bury the cut end, and of course keep humidity near 100%.
> 
> I've also rooted most vining plants in water, though I've not tried this with Marcgravia.


Interesting. I have done it both ways, but was converted to sphagnum after much better success and faster growth with more sensitive plants. Haven't gone back to soil or abg mix as a starter medium, but who knows, I may give it a shot if this cutting doesn't make it and I order another umbellata.

I have also started many of my vines in the water method. If I get a sufficient enough amount of marcgravia, I'll do an experiment and report back.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

markpulawski said:


> I put and end under the sphagnum so it can pull the moisture, that sphag should be on the verge of wet, needs to be much more damp for that one to recover.


You may be right, though the last time I misted is when that leaf died. It is already pretty moist. Now that the back leaf is dead, I'll bury it in some sphagnum and hope for the best.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

fishingguy12345 said:


> This is actually what I had done with my sintenisii but it didn't seem to be effective for me. In my case the piece might have gotten too dry/warm in shipping (took 4 days to get to me)


I doubt shipping was the problem. Everything else made it just fine and has rooted and is starting to show signs of good growth. Still hoping for the best but I am resigned to the fact it may not make it.


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## Bravo (Nov 11, 2017)

varanoid said:


> fishingguy12345 said:
> 
> 
> > This is actually what I had done with my sintenisii but it didn't seem to be effective for me. In my case the piece might have gotten too dry/warm in shipping (took 4 days to get to me)
> ...


Any update? I have some El Coca that is looking pretty depressing currently.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Bravo said:


> Any update? I have some El Coca that is looking pretty depressing currently.


I've been meaning to give an update here (and in several other threads) for a while, just haven't got to it with how busy I have been at the brewery. The cutting has not had any leaves for quite a while, like over a month. Although there are no leaves, the stem is still quite green and hasn't started desiccating at this point so I still am holding out a chance of winning the lottery amount of hope. No signs of new growth points. No buds. Nothing but a green twig in sphagnum. I haven't inspected it for any signs of roots, just don't want to disturb it in its very vulnerable looking state. The stem does look healthier than it did a couple of months ago when there was visible signs of dieback. It's slightly thicker and firmer looking. I'll get a picture of it on here tonight.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

fishingguy12345 said:


> I'm having a similar problem with a cutting of sintenisii that I got last month. No growth and leaves are falling off.
> I have mine in a similar setup as you but with a lid on top to keep the humidity in. I'll see how it goes


Did your sintenisii make a recovery? I had mine in a humidome for plant propagation with a small layer of water on the bottom and with the vents closed so the humidity has always been high. Maybe not as high as a sealed deli container though.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

varanoid said:


> Did your sintenisii make a recovery? I had mine in a humidome for plant propagation with a small layer of water on the bottom and with the vents closed so the humidity has always been high. Maybe not as high as a sealed deli container though.


Yes! I put it in a super humid growing tank and it had started rooting and has a new set of leaves  I'm hoping it keeps growing so I can take cuttings for tanks.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

fishingguy12345 said:


> Yes! I put it in a super humid growing tank and it had started rooting and has a new set of leaves  I'm hoping it keeps growing so I can take cuttings for tanks.


Thanks for the hope! That is great news! Do you happen to have any pictures of what it looked like in it's darkest days and then now?


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

varanoid said:


> Thanks for the hope! That is great news! Do you happen to have any pictures of what it looked like in it's darkest days and then now?


I don't have any from when it was looking rough but he's a current shot. (That's a separate Marcgravia growing beside it)
It has grown roots that are buried in the soil


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

fishingguy12345 said:


> I don't have any from when it was looking rough but he's a current shot. (That's a separate Marcgravia growing beside it)
> It has grown roots that are buried in the soil


That cutting looks like it's on the track to establishing some vigor and appears to me like it has turned that corner long ago. Nice job! I'd be happy with even evidence of a new leaf haha.


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## vivlover10 (Oct 10, 2010)

I unfortunately find myself in the same situation. Bought a clipping of suriname and a 3 rooted portions of rectiflora. The suriname started to grow new leaves in the temp tank, but once added to the viv it dropped most of its leaves and turned brown quick. The rectiflora was thriving in the temp tank with two new leaves in just a week, but once added to the viv it turned brown as well. I was careful in not spraying the leaves directly, but with my luck a lot of my clippings that were once thriving are now looking very rough. Im chalking it up to the acclimation period, but I strongly regret throwing those guys in the tank when I should have just grown them out and took clippings for the main viv. I took what was left of the suriname out and placed it in a sealed container in front of my window with hope that it will one day survive.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Here is what it looks like this evening. A twig. A green twig still with no signs of decay or desiccation. I'll hold out hope though, you never know. If it hasn't decayed yet and still is green it's got to be a sign it's not going to get worse right? We shall see.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

vivlover10 said:


> I unfortunately find myself in the same situation. Bought a clipping of suriname and a 3 rooted portions of rectiflora. The suriname started to grow new leaves in the temp tank, but once added to the viv it dropped most of its leaves and turned brown quick. The rectiflora was thriving in the temp tank with two new leaves in just a week, but once added to the viv it turned brown as well. I was careful in not spraying the leaves directly, but with my luck a lot of my clippings that were once thriving are now looking very rough. Im chalking it up to the acclimation period, but I strongly regret throwing those guys in the tank when I should have just grown them out and took clippings for the main viv. I took what was left of the suriname out and placed it in a sealed container in front of my window with hope that it will one day survive.


I'd be interested in seeing a pic of the suriname's condition right now as it currently looks. And follow ups on it's progress, good or bad, I think it would be good to document and share.


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## Schledog (Apr 28, 2020)

I'm having an issue with a sintenisii. It was doing good for the first couple days and then a lot of the leaves fell off and the growth point turned brown. It's in sphagnum and the umbellata I have in the same bin is doing great, and I have a ton of rectiflora that's all doing good. Should I keep the sintenisii in the bin but put it in a pot with ABG or coco fiber?


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## Hudson (Apr 16, 2020)

The sintenisii i just received dropped its new leaves too. The older leaves still look healthy though so I'm hoping for the best.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Here to close out some threads that I had started a while ago. Been gone a while busy ensuring my business survives the pandemic. Clipping didn't make it. It stayed in it's leafless condition for months before eventually yellowing, and then turned brown, and dissolved into the sphagnum. Will be getting a few more marcgravias soon including giving this kind, hopefully I have better luck next time.


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