# black mold & moldy smell



## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

Am I doomed to have to smell mold every time my fan kicks in? 

My viv has been planted for ~6-8 weeks now, and went through its mold phase already or maybe it's just not quite finished. There were at least four different molds going on in there, including a cobweb mold that draped all over my poor fern which all but killed it, or perhaps it was the black mold (same stuff that grows on my sweaty windowsills, I imagine) that seems to have made a permanent home in my hardwood.

If you have single pane windows like me, then you're well aware that black mold never goes away on its own. I can't tell if the springtails are eating this stuff or not. I also can't tell if it has spread throughout the substrate or not because of all the charcoal. My little piece of hardwood juts out of the background, and dries a bit between mistings. Springtails won't hang out there for long, so I suppose it's doomed to be forever black.

Anyways, whenever the fan blows, it smells like a damp crawlspace anywhere near the viv. Is there anything I can do about this? Mosses perhaps? How about competing fungi? I've cultured mushrooms before, so if any of you know of a species that will happily spread through ABG, I'd be willing to give it a shot. I'd like to have mushrooms popping up in there anyhow.


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## Serafim (Mar 29, 2017)

Not an expert on this subject.. My vivs molded up for about a week to 10 days after I initially set them up. is your substrate really wet?


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## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

Serafim said:


> Not an expert on this subject.. My vivs molded up for about a week to 10 days after I initially set them up. is your substrate really wet?


It was initially. I started out over misting, and no fans. I think I've got that aspect down now. It's an Exoterra 18x18x24, & the substrate (ABG) near the front vent is not very deep at all, and dries across the surface between mistings. It slopes upward toward the back, and remains damp back there. My Peperomia caperata has been telling me it's still too wet back there (well at least for that plant), because it's still growing all tall & leggy with pale, pinkish, yellowish, brownish leaves on tall stems, and is constantly shooting tall flower spikes. At least it's not melting anymore, and actually growing... It would definitely be happier towards the front, however.

I don't think I can allow it to dry out any further, though. The background dries completely between mistings, and when I checked shortly before the mister kicked in, the mid-tank humidity had dipped to 65%-70%. My water layer is not getting any deeper either. I seem to have a pretty good balance of mist & evaporation, in that regard. I'm using screen door mesh to separate my substrate from the false bottom.


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## Serafim (Mar 29, 2017)

when my tank was initially cycling any mold that formed was a white webby looking growth and the springtails could be seen on the walls in the clusters. It didnt last long. I still have a wet woodsy smell in all my vivs


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## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

Serafim said:


> when my tank was initially cycling any mold that formed was a white webby looking growth and the springtails could be seen on the walls in the clusters. It didnt last long. I still have a wet woodsy smell in all my vivs


Must be nice. I don't imagine you have black mold growing on your window frames either . 
I'm surprised no one else with black mold in a vivarium has chimed in here, yet. I mean it's a perfect environment for it, after all, so I can't believe I'm having a rare problem here. I'll admit I'm getting a little concerned about introducing my frogs to this 4 days from now, despite all the threads proselytizing "mold's nothing to worry about." While I believe that this is most often the case, I'm skeptical that it's _always_ the case. Even if I'm stuck with this crap permanently thriving in my substrate, it would be nice to have some definite closure that the frogs will be fine.

Anyone?


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## Scott Lantz (Dec 11, 2016)

I'm not very experienced in mold but haven't seen any besides the white in my terrariums. We have black mold on windows, but never in the tanks. I keep my humidity between 75 and 90. I definitely don't get the damp moldy smells but some of my early waterlogged tanks got that smell.


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## Tay0001 (Jun 14, 2017)

Is it the substrate or the wood you noticed mildew on causing the smell? If it's the piece of wood you may just need to get rid of it as I imagine the constant humidity is only going to help the mildew along.

If it's the substrate that smells it's possible your substrate is too wet lower down even if the surface dries out. Maybe try picking up a handful from a deeper area and giving it a squeeze. You should only get a small amount of water coming out. If you get more water coming out you may need to improve drainage/reduce water holding capacity by adding more orchid bark or charcoal.

Temperature might also be playing a role perhaps. I associate mildew with cool damp.


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## Serafim (Mar 29, 2017)

serial hobbiest said:


> Must be nice. I don't imagine you have black mold growing on your window frames either .
> I'm surprised no one else with black mold in a vivarium has chimed in here, yet. I mean it's a perfect environment for it, after all, so I can't believe I'm having a rare problem here. I'll admit I'm getting a little concerned about introducing my frogs to this 4 days from now, despite all the threads proselytizing "mold's nothing to worry about." While I believe that this is most often the case, I'm skeptical that it's _always_ the case. Even if I'm stuck with this crap permanently thriving in my substrate, it would be nice to have some definite closure that the frogs will be fine.
> 
> Anyone?


No black mold on the window frames. i have noticed with the A/C on The tanks get dry pretty quick had to increase the misting. How much air circulation do you have? I know you mentioned a fan but are you truly getting a good air exchange?


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## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

Serafim said:


> No black mold on the window frames. i have noticed with the A/C on The tanks get dry pretty quick had to increase the misting. How much air circulation do you have? I know you mentioned a fan but are you truly getting a good air exchange?


I've got a 1.5" no-see-um mesh vent running the width of the viv, above the background, with a 4" muffin fan (2000 rpm I think) blowing air in through it in half hour intervals, 8 times each day. The broms are happy, flowering & producing pups, and all the other plants are doing good as well, with the exception of the poor maidenhair fern, but it was still really weak from its bleach dip when I planted, then the cobwebby mold attacked from above pretty much destroying it. It's got a few tiny new shoots sprouting now, at least.

When the fan & mist run together, you can see the obvious swirl of the mist being blown around. I wouldn't say it's windy, mind you. Not even enough to move the leaves on the leggy Peperomia caperata, but it's certainly enough to dry out my background and keep the glass nice & clear.


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## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

Tay0001 said:


> Is it the substrate or the wood you noticed mildew on causing the smell? If it's the piece of wood you may just need to get rid of it as I imagine the constant humidity is only going to help the mildew along.
> 
> If it's the substrate that smells it's possible your substrate is too wet lower down even if the surface dries out. Maybe try picking up a handful from a deeper area and giving it a squeeze. You should only get a small amount of water coming out. If you get more water coming out you may need to improve drainage/reduce water holding capacity by adding more orchid bark or charcoal.
> 
> Temperature might also be playing a role perhaps. I associate mildew with cool damp.


The substrate is damp, but I could not wring out a single drop of water. I took a whiff of it, and couldn't smell much of anything, or maybe just faintly. Although I have no frogs yet, I've been keeping the viv at suitable temperatures for them.

I can't toss the wood, as it is foamed into my background. I gave it a wipe with some diluted hydrogen peroxide a couple days ago (akin to merely just disinfecting a small area of your toilet, I know). Maybe I just need to open it up for a day or two, stop misting, and dry things out in there??


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## Tay0001 (Jun 14, 2017)

Sounds like the substrate is fine then.

Letting things air out might help, but then the smell might just come back when you start misting again. 

I think the general consensus is that mold usually isn't a problem. I've read elsewhere on the forum that poor ventilation and very high humidity could lead to respiratory problems with the frogs. It doesn't sound like you have those condition, so you're probably fine?


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## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

Tay0001 said:


> Sounds like the substrate is fine then.
> 
> Letting things air out might help, but then the smell might just come back when you start misting again.
> 
> I think the general consensus is that mold usually isn't a problem. I've read elsewhere on the forum that poor ventilation and very high humidity could lead to respiratory problems with the frogs. It doesn't sound like you have those condition, so you're probably fine?


Yeah, I hope so. I'm having seconds thoughts on my substrate dampness, though. I think the fact that when I pick up handful of the stuff, I simply can't squeeze out water because of the chunks of charcoal and bark in there, like if you had a handful of marbles and tiny pieces of water-drenched sponge mixed with them, you're not going be able to wring the water out by squeezing it.

I think it's about as wet as can be, now that I consider it, actually. The plants and background do stand in the way of good airflow at the floor level. Suddenly, an internal circulation fan is making more sense to me. I guess I can try my fan/ vent in the front in the meantime...


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## Tay0001 (Jun 14, 2017)

If there's enough chunky bits to keep you from being able to squeeze out water then your drainage is probably fine. 

If it smelled more like rotten eggs or vinegar then you know you have a problem as those are signs that anaerobic bacteria are starting to set up shop.


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