# Surprise Eggs.



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

I'm new to the forum and the breeding dart frogs thing.
I just found 5 dart frog eggs this morning. Below are the pics of the eggs and the parents (I don't know the gender or species of either; if you know the answers to both that would help alot). I was reading in the forum about how to tell if the eggs are fertile, but the pics were of a different species. I'm pretty sure these are infertile, but I'm still unsure. Could someone please confirm?
If you need more info on the frogs/eggs let me know.
1st pic is on egg that ended up in the cocofiber on the tank floor.
2nd pic is the main group of eggs on a bromeliad leaf. They look a little purple but that is actually black.
3rd pic is of the two only frogs that live in the viv.


----------



## Redhead87xc (Jan 27, 2010)

The eggs don't look good. They are probably infertile. Are these the first eggs that you have found? The species is Azureus. They are a pretty common dart frog that lot of people work with. The frog on the left side of the picture looks to be female based on its size. Maybe she is gravid which is why she laid eggs. Do you have any egg laying sites like a cocohut with a petri dish under it?


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

This is the first time that she has laid. No, there are not any egg laying sites. I was just contemplating on wether or not to breed them last night (thought I was working with two males instead of a pair). Do the Azureus' have to breed before they can lay eggs or are they like chickens were the male has to fertilize them once the female has laid


----------



## PeanutbuttER (Jan 1, 2011)

Elliot said:


> ... are they like chickens were the male has to fertilize them once the female has laid...


that's not how it works in chickens...


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Sorry, I wasn't saying that that was how chickens work. My bad, I was talking about the frogs


----------



## PeanutbuttER (Jan 1, 2011)

You're fine. From what I understand the male frog fertilizes the egg after the female lays.


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

thats what I was meaning to say.


----------



## RentaPig311 (Jul 6, 2009)

azureus laying eggs on a brom? now that's odd. I agree that the frog on the left looks to be female just based on the size comparison. An overhead shot would help. The male fertilizes the eggs after they are laid. How long have you had them? I've had a par the became a trio for 3 years and still no eggs out of them. Frogs, we just think we have them captive but they do what they want


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

just over one year. Maybe even close two years.


----------



## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

my azureus have laid eggs on every leaf in the tank stiff enough to support them both at the same time. And by the way chicken sex is teribbly violent


----------



## Dendroguy (Dec 4, 2010)

Erikb3113 said:


> my azureus have laid eggs on every leaf in the tank stiff enough to support them both at the same time. And by the way chicken sex is teribbly violent


yes,yes it is


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Alright back on subject  Even though the eggs may be infertile I think it may be a good idea if I incubated them any way, just for practice and getting comfortable with the feel of things. So how would you incubate a couple of Azureus eggs?


----------



## PeanutbuttER (Jan 1, 2011)

Erikb3113 said:


> And by the way chicken sex is teribbly violent


LMAO. Thanks for that nugget of wisdom...


----------



## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

i use a petri dish with a little water in it with the lid on inside of a tupperware with a couple holes in the lid and some water in the bottom.


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

What about heat?


----------



## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

please use the search function......it has everything you need, and it sounds like you need to research some more, and find out more about frogs and their care. since you have azureus and they are already laying eggs, there's no need to "practice" with bad eggs. They will give you more soon enough......

Who did you get the frogs from? Did they not know the species either? That part confuses me....


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Used the search function. I searched "Incubating Eggs" in the search engine and I could not find anything on Azureus eggs. Am I searching the wrong term? Somebody just take the time and tell me how it is done, please.


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

lincolnrailers said:


> please use the search function......it has everything you need, and it sounds like you need to research some more, and find out more about frogs and their care. since you have azureus and they are already laying eggs, there's no need to "practice" with bad eggs. They will give you more soon enough......
> 
> Who did you get the frogs from? Did they not know the species either? That part confuses me....


They are not already laying eggs; they laid a infertile batch. I want to practice with the bad ones so I get it right when they lay the good ones. 

I can't remember the name of the people that I got them from. I got them from a show in Omaha. I'm sure the guy selling them knew the name; I'm just bad with names and remembering things.


----------



## pnwpdf (Nov 9, 2010)

Egg Care Sheet - This is good basic information to get your started. You could probably just use general tinc information for your azureus.


----------



## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

I like joshsfrogs method for raising tadpoles. All you need to do is get a couple petri dishes or margarine lids covered with coco huts, and the azureus will most likely begin laying in there. The reason I say you don't need "practice" is because they will continue laying (most likely), probably 2 clutches a week, and it won't be long before they are getting it right and giving you fertile eggs. So I'd wait for that.......in the meantime, get the supplies you need to raise tads.

In the video, he says remove all bromeliads from your tank, but really, with azureus, if you provide alternate sites they will usually lay them in an artificial site.


----------



## pnwpdf (Nov 9, 2010)

As far as heat is concerned, I think it would suffice to just keep them the same temperature as the viv they came from. If I am wrong, someone please correct me.


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

The female just laid a clutch of 5 on a leaf again. They look a lot better than the last batch even though I have not seen the male one them yet. I put a coconut half and a petri dish substitute in the tank. The male has been in the coco half a lot lately. Could I transfer the eggs to the dish for a larger percentage of them getting fertilized?


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Well I take that back. The male is on them right now! He seems to be looking for food rather than focusing on the eggs, but that judgement is compared to how the female focused on them. He keeps rotating around so I guess that's a good sign?


----------



## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

you could actually remove that bromeliad if you want them to lay in the petri dish.......although they will probably start using the coco hut eventually anyway.....do you have multiple coco huts?


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

lincolnrailers said:


> you could actually remove that bromeliad if you want them to lay in the petri dish.......although they will probably start using the coco hut eventually anyway.....do you have multiple coco huts?


Just one so far, but I was thinking it might be good to get one more.

For incubating the eggs, would it be a good idea to leave the eggs on the leaf, in the tank in a petri dish or move them out of the tank to a real incubating setup?


----------



## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

Elliot said:


> Just one so far, but I was thinking it might be good to get one more.
> 
> For incubating the eggs, would it be a good idea to leave the eggs on the leaf, in the tank in a petri dish or move them out of the tank to a real incubating setup?


You can leave them and let dad transport tads to a water dish, then remove the tads, or you can remove the eggs.

I personally remove the eggs, (easy to do if they are in a petri dish). I put the dish in a plastic ziploc container. I have water in the bottom, along with gravel or marbles (just so the dish isn't floating around on the water), and put the lid on the container. I also put more water in the petri dish so that the eggs are just touching the water. After about 2 weeks, they will begin hatching, and you remove them to individual cups like in the video I posted. I don't add any extra heat or anything. If they are kept inside your house, that should be enough, unless your house is colder than the upper 60s, or warmer than the upper 70s......

Since yours are on a leaf, you could leave them to see if they survive, or get a pair of scissors and cut off that section of leaf and put it in a container as described above. If you keep them in a sealed container, they will be at nearly 100% humidity, which is what you want......


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Well since the last clutch they laid 8 eggs in the petri dish. Only one formed. How do I know when the tad has hatched?


----------



## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

Elliot said:


> Well since the last clutch they laid 8 eggs in the petri dish. Only one formed. How do I know when the tad has hatched?


when you check it, it will one day be completely straight, instead of curled. This means it has broken out of its egg


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

What about the round part that the tad is attached to? The yoke I think? Should it be used up before the tad hatches or will the tad still have it attached after it hatched?


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Alright, looking into the future when I get a good batch of eggs and the tads grow into froglets. I've got access to pexiglass cages that measure 24x18x18 (LxWxH) would these be to big or to small for a froglet. Or should I put the whole clutch in there together?


----------



## Baltimore Bryan (Sep 6, 2006)

Elliot said:


> Alright, looking into the future when I get a good batch of eggs and the tads grow into froglets. I've got access to pexiglass cages that measure 24x18x18 (LxWxH) would these be to big or to small for a froglet. Or should I put the whole clutch in there together?



The yolk will be absorbed/gone by the time the tadpole hatches. It is the source of nourishment while the embryo is developing. Typically most Dendrobates eggs hatch in about 2-3 weeks. 
As far as that tank, that is 34 gallons. It's quite large for froglets, I would be concerned about getting the density high enough so that they all have enough food available. This is how I do it: for froglets first out of the water, try a morph out tank that is small and simple (2.5-5 gallons, glass or plastic), then once they are eating fruit flies I move them together in a 5-10 gallon grow out tank and make sure they are all eating fine, if there are any problems separate and give special attention to the weaker ones. Then they go in the larger grow out until they are sold or kept.


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Would the 34 gallon pexiglass tanks be about the right size for a grow out tank?


----------



## Baltimore Bryan (Sep 6, 2006)

I don't see why not, it is large compared to what many of us use unless you will be growing out quite a few in there, but as long as the froglets can actively hunt and find food easily, it should be just fine. The more space the better, so I don't see why it wouldn't work to grow out several frogs.
Bryan


----------



## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

I was reading up in the care sheets section and I read that the pexiglass will actually get warped the lighting is to hot. My question: do the froglets need live plants? I know I would rather have live plants personally, so is there a way I can work around the heat? (suspend the light, etc.) I was thinking I would use four, 4 foot shop lights (one over two cages) with 2, 17-20 watt florescent tubes.


----------



## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

flourescent lighting should not be very hot.....but plexiglass does warp on its own, heat or no heat.....you definitely need a glass top on that tank...


----------

