# Other animals in a dart frog habitat



## Guest (Sep 23, 2005)

Are there any other animals that are suitible for a dart frog habitat? Not in addition to dart frogs, just the same habitat.


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## PAULSCHUMANN (Apr 20, 2005)

day geckos
red eye tree frogs
vietnemese mossy frogs
milky cave frogs
other misc. tree frogs
mantellas
dracos
newts
fire belly toads
etc etc etc....


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## Guest (Sep 23, 2005)

which of those (non frogs) will stay small enought for a 10g?


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## OneTwentySix (Nov 11, 2004)

I know newts would not be appropriate for a dart enclosure. Darts typically like it in the mid 70's, whereas this is approaching the lethal limit for most salamanders.


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## asydabass (Jul 12, 2005)

The mossy's probably wouldn't do too well either. They are semi-aquatic. They like to spend alot of time submerged, so I like to set them up with about 1/2 water, 1/2 land.

To answer your orignal question, the day geckos would be a nice alternative to the frogs. The smaller species will do alright in a 10gal. Just a few minor changes to a typical dart frog setup would be benificial. Such as more branches(especially bamboo) to climb on. Just remember reptiles are more prone to get skin problems do to excessive water. Just make sure there is good drainage.


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## B.Auratus (Aug 17, 2005)

I have a gold dust day gecko in my dart tank and he actually loves it. He never bothers with the frogs at all and they are very colorful when kept happy. You can find pictures all over the internet of them. if you have any questions just ask.


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## PAULSCHUMANN (Apr 20, 2005)

????????whats the lethal limit for salamanders? I keep many species in a referigerator, and have had most species well above 80 with no ill effects. anything between 70 and 80 should be perfect. or are we talking "celsius"?


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## PAULSCHUMANN (Apr 20, 2005)

sorry I added the mossy frogs, I keep forgeting I am one of the few people who does dart frogs with larger water features and I keep comparing the term "dart frog tank" with my tanks at home.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

I have to disagree with the no newts in viv post....i have several fire belly newts in a few of my vivs...a couple with frogs (i was sort of a noob at the time didnt know better, atleast as far as Darts go).....but guess what, its the only way i've ever gotten them to survive, the only one that died was killed by another newt. 

The newts leave my frogs alone, and they gotten pretty big for firebelly newts (no they arent paddle tail newts...i had one of those too in a viv till it got killed in a reconstruction and move...couldnt find him to take him out...think he got buried). 

my vivs stay in the mid 70's to low 80s, the newts do fine. In the future i wouldnt reccomend mixin them with frogs, but as both have done fine to this point i've just left everyone where they are....and its been over a year.


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## AJ_Cann (Oct 6, 2004)

http://www.caudata.org/cc/species/Cynop ... alis.shtml


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## Guest (Oct 2, 2005)

oops


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## hkspowers (Aug 23, 2005)

I would have to disagree with the fire bellied toads also. I have four of them and they attack anything that moves including each other during a feeding frenzy. One occasion I put a pretty big green anole in the tank in an attempt to add more life to the tank, the anole was much bigger than the toads and almost instantly a toad leaped onto the anole and ate him head first and some how crammed the whole anole into his stomache. He was so fat after and I did not have to feed him for about a week and a half. After I saw this I never recommend anything in the tank with them except for more fire bellies. They seem to like a community with a few more of their kind.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

My firebellies leave my frogs alone...i also have a fire bellied toad in a viv, and no problems there either with it when i had a dart in there for awhile. In fact it it was a big 47 gal bow front with atleast 2 fire bellied newts, the toad, and the paddle tail newt, day gecko, flying gecko and an anole along with a green auratus, All did fine but i definately would not reccomend this for beginners...and even with experience it is a risk...(and even with my good luck i plan on doing very little of this kind of mixing in the future)..ALSO i will add that every dart that has been in with with one of my newts was nearly full grown or was a juv atleast and the newt was very small and then they grew up together so there was never a major size difference. If you want to breed your darts, i would definately not try this...chances are any froglet will be killed and/or eatin before it can put on enough size.


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2004)

AJ_Cann said:


> http://www.caudata.org/cc/species/Cynops/C_orientalis.shtml


There is also the japanese firebelly newt, two differentones, one can take mid to high 70's.

Ryan


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## hkspowers (Aug 23, 2005)

Dendro Dave said:


> My firebellies leave my frogs alone...i also have a fire bellied toad in a viv, and no problems there either with it when i had a dart in there for awhile. In fact it it was a big 47 gal bow front with atleast 2 fire bellied newts, the toad, and the paddle tail newt, day gecko, flying gecko and an anole along with a green auratus, All did fine but i definately would not reccomend this for beginners...and even with experience it is a risk...(and even with my good luck i plan on doing very little of this kind of mixing in the future)..ALSO i will add that every dart that has been in with with one of my newts was nearly full grown or was a juv atleast and the newt was very small and then they grew up together so there was never a major size difference. If you want to breed your darts, i would definately not try this...chances are any froglet will be killed and/or eatin before it can put on enough size.


I definitely believe you on this one, some people have strange luck with this type of mixing, for instance my whole life everybody told me that my whites treefrogs blue phase would eat my other smaller frogs if they saw them. Well for some reason my Whites 3 of them to be exact never have made a single attempt at one of my other much smaller frogs. They have been in the same tank as my other frogs for a good 7 years now. In fact I can often watch my pair of costa rican auratus climb on top of the whites heads. So as stated above I would not recommend this but sometimes you just get lucky or have anomalies like this. LOL . I am glad to hear you are able to keep so much togather hope your luck continues as mine has with my whites.

James


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## stevendart14 (Feb 21, 2005)

Never know,
Maybe these lucky enclosure setups happen because the frogs is afriad to eat the darts because of their bright color or don't see them as a meal.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

Btw my newts are the chinese fire bellied newts not the japanese and they still do great in the viv. i had one of the japanese firebellied newts which was doing very well in an aquarium i had but escaped. The jap fire bellieds seem more aquatic then the chinese...more like a paddle tailed newt in habits...but they are the higher temp newt. They may be even more suitable in a viv then the chinese but i would make sure you have a large water feature for them and also in my experience they get a bit bigger then the chinese so dont put anything to small in there with em. My jap had an even bigger mouth then my paddle tailed newt and both were the same length, which was almost twice that of the typical chinese firebellied.


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## Ashli (Aug 28, 2005)

Please don't flame me..

But am I the only one who thinks you shouldn't mix any species? Like..you should keep species only tanks? I guess it's just personal preference..


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

I wont flame ya 

Despite usually having good luck mixing...i completely acknowledge that sometimes it is just luck...tank planning and knowing about the species your mixing can help, but like i said in my post i dont think its a good idea with most species in most cases. I did it when i was first getting started, and while i was fairly knowledgeable about the animals i didnt have the practical experience to go along with the raw data. Now i avoid mixing unless an issue arises between 2 animals or something in the environment of one animal has changed due to a having to move a tank or something and its effecting the animal, then i may place it in another tank to see if it does better. Now i have many tanks and working on more so all the newer tanks will be species only tanks. Only my first few tanks have mixed species and while i may leave them like that, im focusing more on breeding darts so no more mixing for me.


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## stevendart14 (Feb 21, 2005)

Ashli said:


> Please don't flame me..
> 
> But am I the only one who thinks you shouldn't mix any species? Like..you should keep species only tanks? I guess it's just personal preference..


On this forum mixing darts with anything thats not a day gecko(or even is) is usually frowned on, especially for begginners. :roll: 
There is alot of variables in mixing like space, stress, toxins, deaths from being eaten etc.


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## Ashli (Aug 28, 2005)

That's what I was referring to..


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

Yep, i did it before i found this board, or before i even got my darts...but i've learned alot since then and will do little if any of it in the future. But as for my current mixed tanks as long as they are doing well im not goin to risk changing their evironment


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