# communal tads?



## tarbo96 (Jan 12, 2006)

So what tads do well together? I have seen some people have housed tincs together. What have you found? Which ones tend to be cannibals?


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

I've never housed Dendrobates together. But I do raise Phyllobates and Epipedobates tads communally. No issues, just keep them well fed, do some occasional water changes. I keep them in 20 gallon aquariums with about 6 to 7 gallons of water in them. Standard aquarium gravel on the bottom. Lots of plants including anacharis, water lilies, apontegeton, and java fern and java moss and a bit of duckweek. Plus some other plants I can't remember the name of. I feed the tads a couple of times per week, but there is always lots of algae for the tads to graze on. 
These are some older pictures of one of my communal tanks, not so much duckweed now. BTW, I do filter the water with a small Tetra in tank filter designed for 10 gal tanks. It seems to work well and between that and the plants it does maintain good water quality. I'm looking forward to raising some Ameerega in this set up.


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## tarbo96 (Jan 12, 2006)

I wanted to do something like that as a display and functional piece. I only have intermedius tads at this time though. Hopefully i will have some mints soon and I can try them.

I want to be first in line for the Ameerega.


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## zach77 (Feb 8, 2012)

I raise the same as Jon plus some Ameerega communally with no issues as long as they are well fed.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

I raise my Ameerega communally. Not nearly as fancy as Jon, though. I use a 10 gallon. No gravel on the bottom. I have a pump meant for turtle tanks to keep a little circulation in there. A huge chunk of java moss. I feed whenever I feel like it, and if I don't they just munch on algae. I also don't do any water changes....


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## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

My only concern with communal tad growouts like this, is how do the tads haul themselves out of the water. What do you use for the tads to crawl out on? I've heard cork has been used successfully. Other create a land area with the gravel


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## volsgirl (Mar 29, 2012)

Love that set-up, Jon!
I have a spare 10 gallon I'm going to set up for my P. Terribilis tads. So, it's ok if you mix different clutches together? Somehow I got it in my head to keep clutches separated, but clutch mates can be raised together . Also, does the age of the tads raised communally matter? in other words, can like newly hatched tads be placed in with tads almost ready to morph?


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

pdfCrazy said:


> My only concern with communal tad growouts like this, is how do the tads haul themselves out of the water. What do you use for the tads to crawl out on? I've heard cork has been used successfully. Other create a land area with the gravel


If they are healthy froglets, they will climb straight up glass. I keep some pothos in my communal tanks, and the morph outs will also use the stems & leaves for egress.


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

volsgirl said:


> Also, does the age of the tads raised communally matter? in other words, can like newly hatched tads be placed in with tads almost ready to morph?


I like to give freshly hatched tads a week alone in cups to get them "up to speed", so to speak. I've found that tads fresh out of the egg don't always fare so well against 4-8 week larvae. 
On an anecdotal note, the only time I've seen a larger tad actually devour a smaller one was when I threw an Oyapock clutch that had just hatched in with some tads that were much older. The smallest and least mobile of the little ones got chomped immediately, and the bigger tad involved spent the next few minutes swallowing it whole.


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## Gnarly (Mar 3, 2011)

I raise my Santa Isabel tads communally, except I am less fancy still, I keep them in a deli cup with some almond leaf and a bit of java moss.


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## zach77 (Feb 8, 2012)

pdfCrazy said:


> My only concern with communal tad growouts like this, is how do the tads haul themselves out of the water. What do you use for the tads to crawl out on? I've heard cork has been used successfully. Other create a land area with the gravel


I check on mine daily. If I find one with 2 front legs I scoop it out with a 2 oz. deli cup, and just enough water, and move it to it's grow out tank.


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## aurvrrat (Jul 23, 2011)

I raise my green sip tads in a communal tub about half filled with water, pothos and a good amount of magnolia leaf litter in the bottom to give plenty of hiding spots. I give them about a week or two by themselves in a rearing cup before putting them in the communal tub. I have been doing this for about 9+ months and havent had any issues really. That being said, I do find that more tads go in than morph out, about 2/3 of the number that go in morph out. 
They do seem to take longer to morph out but when they do they are about twice the size of ones i have raised solo in the past. 
Not having 30+ rearing cups was very nice, time and space saving. But if you are looking to have close to 100% survival rate of all tads, I wouldnt recommend it for tincs.


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

aurvrrat said:


> But if you are looking to have close to 100% survival rate of all tads, I wouldnt recommend it for tincs.


Heck, if you are looking for nearly 100% larval survival rate, I wouldn't recommend dart frogs!
The tadpoles that get lost/eaten in these set-ups may not have become strongest froglets to begin with. The ones that make it will have had to compete to survive, and will be all the more robust for it.


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## Gamble (Aug 1, 2010)

I raise my Ameerega tads communally also.
I keep them by clutch in 190oz containers ... doing water changes & feeding both everyother day.


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## aurvrrat (Jul 23, 2011)

Dane said:


> Heck, if you are looking for nearly 100% larval survival rate, I wouldn't recommend dart frogs!
> The tadpoles that get lost/eaten in these set-ups may not have become strongest froglets to begin with. The ones that make it will have had to compete to survive, and will be all the more robust for it.



Quality over quantity

The ones that do morph out just crawl up on the side of the tub (the tub has a lip so they cant get out). Half the time it takes me a few attempts to catch em in a cup before they jump back in the water but seeing as they dont eat for a few days after morphing out anyways I just wait for them to climb back up on the side to try to get them again rather than tryin to sift through the tub for it.


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## tarbo96 (Jan 12, 2006)

Thanks all...so it would probably be a bad idea to house my banded intermedius tads together?


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

A lot of Ranitomeya seem to be a little more cannibalistic than some of the larger frogs, but if you have enough tads, and you aren't worried about a few potential losses, I would go for it. More water volume (and lateral space) means less interaction between tadpoles. If these are potential froglets that you can't gamble with, then raise them individually in the biggest cups possible.


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## tarbo96 (Jan 12, 2006)

Maybe someone should donate some Ameerega tads so I can experiment


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## Ghost vivs (Sep 26, 2010)

Works with tincs also...











Casper




tarbo96 said:


> Maybe someone should donate some Ameerega tads so I can experiment


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## that Frog Guy (May 13, 2012)

Huh?

I mentioned this idea before and was told that it was a definate No No.

Everyone said that the frogs were Cannibalisitc.

I even mentioned raising just single clutches together where they were all the same age and size and was told not to do that.

I have over 100 eggs and tadpoles and it is getting out of hand with a ton more on the way.

In a year I will probably have more Frogs than Josh's Frogs. LOL.

Room taken up by a million deli cups, Buying all these Deli Cups, feeding individual cups, all the water changes.

This idea is a dream come true for me but everyone said no so why do you guys do it?

You are Frog Rebels that must be very frowned upon buy the traditionalist froggers. LOL.


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

that Frog Guy said:


> Huh?
> 
> I mentioned this idea before and was told that it was a definate No No.
> 
> ...





Dane said:


> A lot of Ranitomeya seem to be a little more cannibalistic than some of the larger frogs, but if you have enough tads, and you aren't worried about a few potential losses, I would go for it. More water volume (and lateral space) means less interaction between tadpoles. If these are potential froglets that you can't gamble with, then raise them individually in the biggest cups possible.


There's part of your answer right there. Be prepared for losses. If you put 10 tads in that communal 10 gal. tank, be prepared for 5 or 6 to come out. I'm using 20 gallon tanks, with tads that are not cannibalistic unlike the vents you want to raise communally. It can be done, but considerations have to be given to space, water volume, food, filtration, plants, etc.


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## Ghost vivs (Sep 26, 2010)

It is a big time saver. A little planing and setup and there is no problems. 











Running to an expo at the moment but when I get back I will explain my setup.


Casper


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

volsgirl said:


> Love that set-up, Jon!
> I have a spare 10 gallon I'm going to set up for my P. Terribilis tads. So, it's ok if you mix different clutches together? Somehow I got it in my head to keep clutches separated, but clutch mates can be raised together . Also, does the age of the tads raised communally matter? in other words, can like newly hatched tads be placed in with tads almost ready to morph?


Sorry Kelli, I just saw your post. I've mixed different species together will no ill effects. However you wouldn't for example, want to mix E. anthonyi Santa Isabel, and E. anthonyi Rio Saladillio together, they are just too hard to distinguish as metamorphs. I have mixed Phyllobates with Epipedobates with no problems. As far as age goes, I would just be a little cautious as you don't want the older bigger tads out competing the younger tads for food. I don't see any problem with it as long as you keep them well fed and there is some algae growing for them to graze on. Also another tip would be to contact some aquarium hobbyists and see if you could get a culture of daphnia to seed the tank with. This would be another great built in food source for the tads.


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## bradlyb (Jul 22, 2013)

Ghost vivs said:


> It is a big time saver. A little planing and setup and there is no problems.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Care to share? I find this thread very intriguing.


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