# Phoenix Worms



## greenmonkey51 (Mar 15, 2006)

Has anyone else used these. I have used them with my crested geckos and they loved them. Would a 50/50 mix of these and FF be a good staple diet.


----------



## wishIwereAnExpert (Jul 18, 2005)

http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=13991

http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewt ... t=hermetia 

http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewt ... oenix+worm 

Seriously, is the search button that hard to click? :roll: :wink: 

-Solly


----------



## Dunner97074 (Sep 19, 2004)

Give him a break! A friendly reminder works.
Karma, think about it...


----------



## greenmonkey51 (Mar 15, 2006)

I've read those already. None answered my questions. I had already used the search function to find them.


----------



## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

I'm guessing 50/50 would be a little too worm heavy, not to mention expensive in the long run.
Just to share my experience, I bought a bunch of the smallest size ones, and my brazillian cobalts wont eat them, they will attack them, but then spit them out, my auratus will eat them, but they don't go after them the way they will a similar sized waxworm.
My terrebillis will eat them, but they would probably eat a rice cake if you wiggle it for them!
I also think they are a little large for most thumbnails too...
Kind of dissappointed all around...maybee if they offered say, 1/8" ones, they would be more attractive...but then again the high calcium readings are from worms almost ready to pupate...hard to say if younger ones would have the same nutrition.
Just my $0.02!


----------



## greenmonkey51 (Mar 15, 2006)

They do have 1/8" ones. Are FF that much superior in nutrition to everything else.


----------



## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

FF's are not necessarily nutritionaly superior, as much as they are cheap and convenient...they are also tried and true...you could raise many frogs from froglet to breeding adults and beyond with just ff's and the proper calcium and vitamin supplement.
Who carries the 1/8" size?


----------



## greenmonkey51 (Mar 15, 2006)

Off the top of my head Black Jungle does. They're the extra smalls. Google phoenix worms and you'll find 3-4 other sellers.


----------



## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

it depends on how you are setting up the enclosure (as in are you providing sufficinet UVB), how often you intend to supplement and with what. 

For example, if you are expecting the phoenix worms to supply all of the needed calcium, you have to remember that the frogs cannot uptake and metabolize the calcium without sufficient D3 (either through photoconversion or supplemented dietarily). In addition the ratios of A to D3 to E need to be in the range of 10:1:0.1 or deficinecies can occur one of which can be disruption of the calcium metabolism. 

Its not an easy question to answer as there are a number of variables to take into consideration. 

Ed


----------



## greenmonkey51 (Mar 15, 2006)

I have talked to many sellers, and many said that yes they can be used for a staple. I would dust them with a D3 supplement when I feed them still. I would though still feed FF just to vary the diet.


----------



## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Okay and how many of the sellers are aware that the total diet shouldn't contain more than 2.5% calcium?

Ed


----------



## greenmonkey51 (Mar 15, 2006)

They told me they talked to a breeder in Atlanta and he said its ok.


----------

