# Best starter darts??



## reptileink (May 1, 2005)

Hello all, my 55 gallon paludarium is weeks away from being inhabited by some dart frogs. I would like to know if azureus are a good starting frog. I really don't want to invest in cheaper frogs just to have to move them to another tank when I am ready to tackle the azureus. Do they climb much?? I hear they are hardy, but then other people say they aren't. I also hear that the leucomelas are easier to deal with too, but I am not so interested in them. Please help with any advice, tips, etc.


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## bobzarry (Mar 2, 2005)

I say as long as your heart is set on azureus you should get them. They are not much different in care and since you will be getting what yoyu realy want from the beginning your more likely to give them the propper care and attention. just make sure you get well started frogs from a reputable breeder.

Bob


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## bgexotics (Feb 24, 2004)

Azureus were my first dart frog and I think they are just as easy as any other dart frog, if not one of the easier ones to keep. They are often not recommended to beginners due to the fact that they are more expensive than species like auratus and leucomelas. Just make sure you start off with good sized froglets and buy from a reputable breeder and you should be fine. My azureus (despite being pudgy) climb quite a bit, as do my tincs, so as long as you have enough land space they should be ok in your tank. Large pices of driftwood over the water areas provide even more space for the frogs.

One thing I would recommend if you can afford it, is to buy a sexed pair, otherwise you have to deal with trading out frogs if you don't get a pair from the babies that you raise out. Once they are adults, they do best housed in pairs, since the females will fight and stress out eachother. Sexed pairs go for around $250, but they are prolific breeders, so your initial investment will pay off if you raise the babies out.


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## mindcrash (Mar 3, 2004)

As the others have said, you won't go wrong with Azureus. They make a great first frog...they are beautiful, bold, and active.


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## Arklier (Mar 1, 2004)

My first darts were azureus, and I've never regretted choosing them. They are very bold and visable, and it doesn't faze them to have my hand right in the tank with them.


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## bgexotics (Feb 24, 2004)

Yup they are definately bold. I have been pruning plants in ym tank and had to shoo them out of my way. My tincs are the same way.


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## DaFrogMan (Oct 8, 2004)

My first darts were also azureus. The care is pretty much the same for most of the dendrobates species. And most have about the same degree of hardiness.

I guess it's just a question of how confident you are that you can provide them with good care. A $75 azureus is going to be just as easy to care for as a $30 auratus. But if you make a mistake with a more expensive frog, it's much more of a loss.


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## reptileink (May 1, 2005)

Well, this would be their home. Has waterfall, brazil nut pod hut, sphagam moss over cocoa fiber, over charcoal, over gravel, over nylon screen, over eggcrate. I also just purchased a hand pumped mister for daily rainshowers. I plan on sealing off a bit of the eggcrate cover to add more humidity.








LEFT








MIDDLE








RIGHT


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## bgexotics (Feb 24, 2004)

Very nice tank, I think you definately need a breeding pair. It would not be hard to get them to breed in a tank like that.


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## TopGunJags01 (Jul 31, 2004)

I can imagen the humidity must be in there...
AWESOME tank keep up the good work.


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## Guest (May 5, 2005)

Is there an easy way for the frogs to climb out of the water there? If I remember correctly, that water is deep enough that you were going to keep some fish in there. From the pic above, it looks like it's got pretty steep sides and may be hard for a frog to climb out of.

Just a thought from a guy who doesn't even have a viv yet, much less any frogs.


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## dmartin72 (Oct 27, 2004)

They don't need much to get out. Heck, they climb on glass and just about anything else with little problems.


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## Guest (May 5, 2005)

Okay. I had read a few comments about them drowning occasionally. I know they can swim so figured the drownings must be when they were unable to climb out of a water feature.


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## dmartin72 (Oct 27, 2004)

I think you have to be more concerned with froglets and aggressive adults that are fighting.


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## aneides (Apr 12, 2005)

*your tank*

Azureus will be a great starter frog. They are big, bold and blue you can't ask for more. 

One thing that I noticed from your tank pics was that there seems to be an area that is pretty narrow and deep along a side. This could be a potential problem area. A frog may to in there, or in a larger area and end up there and have a bit of trouble getting out. This could lead to exhaustion and drowning. Chances are that they would be able to get out but you will have to decide what risk you are willing to take. These frogs can drown so there is a little risk with water at the depth that your are planning on. Spend alot of time watching the first couple of weeks and make appropriate adjustments.

Your concern is an indication that you will be vigilent so I would suspect you will do very well with your azureus. Have fun.

Brian


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## reptileink (May 1, 2005)

Not sure where you mean aneids. The cork bark slopes in under the rock in the middle, and there are plenty of "craggies" for them to pull themselves out. The only area I would be concerned with in where the front right piece juts out, there isn't really a place for them to pull themselves out in that area.


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## aneides (Apr 12, 2005)

The area I was talking about was the left side from the front of the tank(in the picture, right side if you are in the tank looking out, narrow strip visible in the second to last pic). Maybe not a big deal, but when I saw it it seemed to have problematic potential. Also, if the cork bark is sloped in but has nothing to guide the frog safely to the surface if it gets under there you could have another potential area. There is a post currently about a frog that got caught under some stuff and drown. Just trying to think of all possible scenarios here. If some of you other froggers want to add your opinions on this that would be awesome. I have just heard alot of horror stories about drownings. 

Aneides


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## Tony Kim (Apr 26, 2005)

As far as the screening goes, this is what I did. I used an egg crate cut to fit the top and cut that in half. Then I glued gift wrapping clear-cellafane to the egg crate and left 1inch opening for the sides of the 2 halves. With that I glued on nylon mesh cloth so all of it got covered. And the reason I did this was to keep humidity high and not let the fruitflies escape. It works really well. Just thought I would mention it.


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## reptileink (May 1, 2005)

But Tony, where did you put your lights? Won't the heat from the lights melt the celophane? I have 2-25w aquarium bulbs on one side of the top, and I would be afraid that it would melt the celophane. I was thinking of celophaning the whole top except for a strip under the lights, I'm not really worried about fruit fly escape, but maybe I will put some nylon screening under the light strips.


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## reptileink (May 1, 2005)

aneides said:


> The area I was talking about was the left side from the front of the tank(in the picture, right side if you are in the tank looking out, narrow strip visible in the second to last pic).
> Aneides


I honestly haven't heard *MANY* stories of drowning. I have heard that it can, and does happen. That side of the tank is actually more accessible back onto land than the opposite side(last pic). The side you are talking about has plants that come out of the water and reach the "land" Also, there is plenty to grip onto, the cork bark is angled backwards almost sloping.


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## Tony Kim (Apr 26, 2005)

Well I place the celophane facing down in the tank and light sits above it where the gaps will release the heat. But if you dont trust that idea, then I would suggest glueing a cube portion of the leftover eggcrate on each corner of the light fixture. That way it will create a difinite gap for heat to escape. Easy and simple.


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