# Mold inhibitor or vinegar?



## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Do you use Mold inhibitor or vinegar in your FF medium? I’ve had some FF issues lately and have switched back to vinegar as I seem to remember a little better production. Just thought I would through up a poll to see what everyone lese prefers.


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## Catfur (Oct 5, 2004)

I use mold inhibitor. Vinegar did absolutely nothing to stop the "black death" mold that was almost instantly taking over my cultures, and those that didn't succumb to mold didn't produce. There is no way I am going back to vinegar again after my experience with it.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Can I ask how much you used? I use 1:1 with the water and never had a mold issue. I sure am having some production issues lately though...


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## Catfur (Oct 5, 2004)

I used 1:1 vinegar:water, even tried a variety of vinegars. Absolutely abysmal results. I only see mold nowdays in completely failed cultures.


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## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

I've tried methyl paraben, and production was lower, and oddly enough, did not work as well for mold prevention as plain white vinegar...never had the nasty black mold to deal with though.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

My batch last week I made half with each and plan to see which does better.


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## booboo (Jan 22, 2005)

What about hydei? I have heard they dont like vinegar, i was thinking of swithcing to methyl paraben for the reason what do you all think?

I have only used vinegar works fine for me


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## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

booboo said:


> What about hydei? I have heard they dont like vinegar, i was thinking of swithcing to methyl paraben for the reason what do you all think?
> 
> I have only used vinegar works fine for me


Been there, done that, same results (the ones with vinegar being better).
FYI...I use the "power mix"


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

For hydei I'm planning to stick with mold inhibitor, but betting I will be switching back for the rest.


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## MartyA (Apr 18, 2006)

I used to get mold from vinager with my cultures but now after I unthaw my cultures I wet the entire top of the culture with vinegar then place a few kernels of bakers yeast and let it sit for 24 hours. I now havent run into mold since, even when I had to use flies from my previous moldy culture (which must have been full of spores) did I not get mold. Im not sure the ratio of vinager to culture media (im using the apple-banana with my own variation) but for a guess it might be 1/4 vinager to media.


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## Scott (Feb 17, 2004)

Both. 

Seriously.

s :?


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## nburns (May 3, 2005)

I've tried both and am now using inhibitor. Never really paid attention to see what the production differences were I just didn't like how the vinegar would dry out the cultures so fast.


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## defaced (May 23, 2005)

I have used vinegar for the past several years with no problems with either them drying out or mold, but for the past few months I've been fighting a mold problem. This last batch of cultures have the same ammount of vinegar as my previous two months of cultures (I make up a few months of wet media at a time and store it in my fridge), but with the addition of ~1.8 tsp of Methyl Paraben Powder. It'll be interesting to see how this goes because this is my first time using this stuff.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Mike,

Its also the time of year here where it gets humid... I know my dehumidifier has been running in the frog room and has not been on since last summer.


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## defaced (May 23, 2005)

I think mine started around Februard because I kept them in a dresser with the drawer closed. I'd been a larger problem with my hydei, but even my melanos have had the problem to some extent. Now that you mention it, it has gotten worse since the humidity has hit the roof; I didn't catch on to that. I've now got my AC on so hopefully that and the mold inhibitor will solve the problems.


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## SLEDDER23 (Mar 17, 2005)

I've had no probs w/mold, unless I keep the culture longer than I should. Sometimes I'll get a little bit of a blue green mold on toilet paper rolls that I put in sometimes instead of coffee filters, but it's minimal and does not seem to prevent production.

Also, I keep mine in the stand of my freshwater show tank that has a sump due to the reliability of the temp created from the sump. It's always humid in there, and I've had no problems. I'm using a 1:1 vinegar to water ration, apple cider vinegar.


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

I opted to use methylparaben from the begining only because I liked the idea of a simple powder to add to the media versus a liquid. I also heard that if the vineagar is heated it can smell pretty bad. (I know......So don't heat it!!) I have yet to have a mold problem. Of course it is very dry in Colorado so I do not have to deal with the humidity problems everyone is refering to, just the fear of the neighbors fields catching fire!!!


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## TonyB (Oct 14, 2005)

I have much better luck with vinegar than methyl paraben. I use the "power mix" with a mixture of 1/3 apple juice, 1/3 distilled water, 1/3 apple cider vinegar. I use nearly double the amount of liquid than the dry mix. The apple juice seems to help a LOT on the longevity of the culture (especially hydei) along with also helping the smell.


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## Catfur (Oct 5, 2004)

Just out of curiosity, has anybody else experienced the black death 'mold?'


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## Scott (Feb 17, 2004)

It's been awhile - but yes, I have. More often than not it was on Hydeii.

s


Catfur said:


> Just out of curiosity, has anybody else experienced the black death 'mold?'


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## Guest (May 31, 2006)

kyle1745 said:


> Do you use Mold inhibitor or vinegar in your FF medium? I’ve had some FF issues lately and have switched back to vinegar as I seem to remember a little better production. Just thought I would through up a poll to see what everyone lese prefers.


seems like there should be the option of bought premix.......


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Well pre bought normally ha recommended directions for use so I would not recommend changing them.


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## racer69 (May 24, 2006)

Vinegar for now. But who knows what the future will bring.


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## jehitch (Jun 8, 2007)

I've had some mold issues this summer with my hydei cultures as well. I've done some test cultures slightly upping the MP amount to see if I can find a level that will do better combatting the mold, but not noticeably decreasing FF production.

Still it seems hit or miss, as there seems to be no direct correlation to the recipe and the occurrence of mold. In a batch of 10 cultures, one or two might get mold, while the rest remain mold free.

This seems to indicate contamination of individual cultures somewhere in the building process, but I haven't tracked it down. All the media is mixed at the same time, in the same mixing bowl (I've even taken to using a flour sifter to make sure the MP and other ingredients are thoroughly mixed), and then added to the cultures. All the cultures are cooled in the same place, covered with paper towel to keep foreign matter (and wild flies) out. All the excelsior is from the same box, and is balled up while waiting for the media to cool. I usually mix flies from several of the best producing cultures in the last batch to seed the new batch, so that shouldn't lead to only partial contamination, either.

Short of buying an autoclave, I'm stumped.

Jim


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

I microwave my cultures and it has helped a lot, both with mold and mites. On the highest setting for about a minute.


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## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

*30-40 cx a week*, I'm not microwaving 

I do use vinegar now, ran out of Methyl Paraben 3 mo ago and too lazy to get more, although it worked better.

and yes, the black death does happen in my conditions also. bad stuff. i cant figure a pattern to when/why.

Scott's cooked mix from flax seed is quite resistent to mold, c/w potato based dry mixes IMO.

Shawn


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## melissa68 (Feb 16, 2004)

Use both...have to make over 100 cultures a week. Used to have the 'black death' more often without the vinigar. Not I get it rarely.


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## edward (Apr 20, 2008)

I have used mold inhibitor for years for my hydei and melanogaster cultures.
Never a problem and get great cultures from both species.


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## sounddrive (Jan 4, 2007)

Ive tried both and had some molding from each till i started using boiling water to make my cultures. i boil my water make my cultures while its still atleast 200 degrees add my excelsior let cool add yeast and flies and good to go. i literally haven't had a single culture crash or mold in over a year.


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## skips (Dec 15, 2008)

I've been into dart frogs for over a year but ive not played around with my cultures much. Where do you buy this methyl paraben stuff? 
I get mold, but I take a scoop of media with larvae in it and put it into new cultures. It's the only thing that usually gets this thin white mold.


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## SMenigoz (Feb 17, 2004)

melissa68 said:


> Use both...have to make over 100 cultures a week. Used to have the 'black death' more often without the vinigar. Not I get it rarely.



I make about as many cultures/week as Melissa and have only used vinegar. Mold does rear its head every so often; never "black death" but rather the "typical" crap.


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## Pirateglow (Jul 29, 2008)

I use Josh's Frogs ff media which has a mold inhibitor but I also add a little vinegar, using these I have no problems with mold, even with 6 or 7 week old cultures.


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## jwthought (Oct 30, 2004)

I use Josh's mix too. How about how much vinegar do you add? Thanks.


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## Trey (Sep 10, 2008)

I didnt read the whole thread but i always used vinegar(about 1:1 ratio with water, sometimes a little more water), and never had any mold, no matter how long i had the culture up. 
I also never tried mold inhibitors (because there was no need) so I cant compare productivity rates between the two.


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## JJuchems (Feb 16, 2004)

I use vinegar. I have used in a house built in 1897 and in my current house built in 1940. I have little problems. I use 60% water and 40% vinegar in the winter and go 50/50 for rest of the year.

Edit: I make my own FF media.


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## Jayson745 (Dec 13, 2006)

I use 50/50 vinegar and orange juice. Thats how I started so thats what I've always done. Looks like everyone else is using water instead of oj. I wonder if I should be doing the same.

the only mold I see is the occasional blue mold, and it seems to make the cultures MORE productive than the ones without. I've even tried adding a little from a moldy culture to new ones in hopes of growing the mold along side the flies. It doesn't take to a new culture even when directly added. Just have to get lucky and have it show up. I've thought about skipping the vinegar and doing oj/water with a little blue mold added to see if it will take, but fear getting not so fly friendly mold that way.


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## Corpus Callosum (Apr 7, 2007)

Corpus Callosum said:


> I microwave my cultures and it has helped a lot, both with mold and mites. On the highest setting for about a minute.


Meant to say I microwave my media before putting it into the cultures, not the entire cultures themselves (at least not anymore)..


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

I'm using a very slightly larger amount that Josh says to use on his bags of methyl paraben in my mix. I also spray the top of the culture lightly with vinegar right after microwaving. This has kept my cultures almost completely mold free except for a small amount in one hydei culture that took a while to develop larvae.

I won't stop using the paraben.

-Nish

P.S. my media recipe based on Sang's recipe (circa 1956) is rocking btw. It does smell, though and I need to find a suitable smell reducer. Feel free to PM me with advice.

P.P.S. I need curly wing flies and an anesthetizer (like flynap) so I can create my ebony curly flies. I also have miniature wing and brown body. I'm looking to make my own strain of curly or miniature darkened flies to rotate with my flightless FFs and hydeis.


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

I've always used vinegar. I started out with about equal amounts of water & vinegar. But I'm finding out you really don't need much vinegar at all. I now use 1/3 cup water to just 1/8 cup vinegar. My FF cultures will hang around for a good 4-6 weeks with no mold problems at all.

I think I read somewhere that the vinegar can tend to dry out the mixture which is why I started cutting back on it. Not sure how true that is.


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## earthfrog (May 18, 2008)

Vinegar is way cheaper and not man-made. My cultures produce for 6 wks---no mite or mold. I altered the Power Mix recipe and it works great for me. Why pay more for parabens?


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

> Why pay more for parabens?


Methyl Paraben is cheaper (even after shipping) than vinegar.


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## colb (Mar 13, 2008)

I use vinegar, and I've been noticing that some cultures mold and other don't... 

As someone mentioned in an earlier post, the ones that mold seem to produce better, but is this mold bad for the ff's, and more importantly, are these ff's going to pose a problem being fed to the frogs?


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## colb (Mar 13, 2008)

No one can answer my question on how mold in FF cultures will effect the FF's as well as the darts if being fed out?!?!?!???


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