# 20 long rock waterfall construction journal



## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

so the other one you might see was more for question this will acually be the journal.

Now let me start on the design of it and will follow by a picture to see it more clearly.on my left side i want a waterfall that flows into a river rock bed and then a very small pond.I know the land area is more needed(hence the small pond). But on the other side i would like to do a buttress tree with roots goes into the pond, as well have fake rocks to surround the pond. I will created most iof this out of stryofoam and some out of Great stuff foam. For the backing im planing on gs foam agian with peat moss and coco bedding.i will have a falso bottom cover with weed blocker.

Ive been on here day and night since getting back into PDFs months ago.Also learned all i can from this site as well as spending weeks on looking how to create a good water fall and buttress tree. I know these question have been answer but not to my design or desire. As well i want this a habitat to match were P.terribis mints live


today i will start it with construction a false bottom and planning out where to things . I order a 501 canister filter and as well as other supplies.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

So today i order supplies i needed and started working on the false bottom

first i made a box off area to access the pump intake just in case










next i put plastic around it and silicone and hot glue it. My goal is only having water in the pump area and the pond i dont want it all under the false bottom. but the water that go through will be access to drain.










next i added pcv pipe from the pond to the pump area 










then made my false bottom










tomorrow im working on the false rock in the pond. im going to silicone the pipe into the pond area and pump area.


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## ISTHOMS (Jul 29, 2011)

looks nice i like it


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

sorry i havent update it , i been on vacation and had no time to work on it . today i finished putting in the water pipe to the water fall and completly seal off the pump area so no water can leak in to the bottom. i will post picture tomorrow . and ill start working on everything eles once i know the pump cant leak


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

progress 

used gs foam to secure the pipe and then paint over with drylok and then silicone everthing to make sure no leaking i have to wait till tomorrow till i can put water in it










with egg crate on top


and the begin on the river and have alot of work to do such as waterfall, a fake tree,backing,pond area

about 10% complete


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

after alot of thinking on what to do about the pond , i got a great idea for a waterfall hoping someone will step in and help and say what they think about this desgin

vivarium+Waterfall.jpg (image)

sorry about the link


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

My questions and comments:

That waterfall idea pic looks really cool, I like it. I think the waterfall looks a little fake just because of the way it's so "perfectly made" to hold the water in the cascade and the end doesn't blend into the bottom. But the rock surface overall looks real, the pond looks nice, and it's a cool looking viv.

I am wondering why you are so set on keeping the pump and pond separate from the rest of the tank? What is the reason?

There are some issues I see with that idea (just offering opinions/advice, which is what I assume you'd like so hope it's well received)

- the false bottom in the rest of the tank under the substrate will fill up with water anyway (I think you said you have a drain for it, but if it's going to fill up anyway why separate it from the pond?)

- if your waterfall or pond or pump area or a combination of those leaks into the rest of the tank and there's not enough water under the rest of the false bottom, your pond and pump will run dry

- I believe there is a 99.9% chance that the sealing you put around the pump or pond or pipe will leak at some point. This is by no means any negative thing about you or your work, it is just a fact that it's nearly impossible to seal various seams off especially when there are all kinds of shapes going on. Especially I would worry about the plastic you put around the pump column.

- You will not have access to the pipe that goes from the pond to the pump, so if it clogs there is not much you can do (other than forcing a bunch of water down it somehow, which might work)

I don't mean to be negative, I am just pointing out my opinions and suggestions. But I do think things are looking really good in your pics and the example idea looks sweet. I am subscribing to this thread


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

flyingSquirrel said:


> My questions and comments:
> 
> That waterfall idea pic looks really cool, I like it. I think the waterfall looks a little fake just because of the way it's so "perfectly made" to hold the water in the cascade and the end doesn't blend into the bottom. But the rock surface overall looks real, the pond looks nice, and it's a cool looking viv.
> 
> ...


i so determinded to separate the pond from the rest becasue im not sure how to keep the water in the pond and if i dont im not sure how to fill it up and keep it away so its not saturating the soil.Also on the other hand you make a real good point on the pipe clogging up. As well as thinking if i have a pump to keep the water clean i might as well keep the water under the false clean not stagnent. I had a waterfall a year ago and my whole vivarium failed including my frog which died . So now im worry about the waterfall being clean and separating it. you make very good points and your not being negative at all your helping me

Any suggestion on what i should do as well as i understand what you ment with the waterfall can you help me with this and


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## gbeauvin (Aug 3, 2010)

I don't even have PDFs yet, so grab some salt, but...

I think that the idea would be to have the entire basement flooded, but you have a false bottom to keep the substrate above the water level. The pond will dip down below that water level, and rather than sealing up the pond you can just line it with gravel or whatever so that you don't see the eggcrate, but the water can just pass right through it. Now whether your water comes down the waterfall, along the stream, and into the pond... or whether it splashes out and soaks through the substrate, either way it ends up in the basement, ready to be recycled. I'd recommend some sort of prefilter on your pump to prevent it from getting clogged.

I come from an aquaria background, not frogs, so I probably don't know what I'm talking about, but that's how I would do it, if I were wanting to do it...

-GB (who's own long-term plans involve rain, but not a waterfall)


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

something that I've been fooling with is taking a separate container and putting the pump in it along with water, stones, etc....so it really is a self-contained unit. The pump is accessible...and the waterfall just dribbles down gently into the rock filled unit...some emergent plants, like annubias will do well, as well as acorus. The substrate will come near the "top" of the container, but will not allow wicking...that will be an artificial "edge"made of screening with small stones, etc. as a "mat" so that frogs don't drag substrate into the water area, and can "wipe their feet"...it will be filled with various size pebbles so no fear of drowning...at least this is what I'm working toward....


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

gbeauvin said:


> I don't even have PDFs yet, so grab some salt, but...
> 
> I think that the idea would be to have the entire basement flooded, but you have a false bottom to keep the substrate above the water level. The pond will dip down below that water level, and rather than sealing up the pond you can just line it with gravel or whatever so that you don't see the eggcrate, but the water can just pass right through it. Now whether your water comes down the waterfall, along the stream, and into the pond... or whether it splashes out and soaks through the substrate, either way it ends up in the basement, ready to be recycled. I'd recommend some sort of prefilter on your pump to prevent it from getting clogged.
> 
> ...



You make a good point. What should i doo with the pipe i have already in place,?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Judy S said:


> something that I've been fooling with is taking a separate container and putting the pump in it along with water, stones, etc....so it really is a self-contained unit. The pump is accessible...and the waterfall just dribbles down gently into the rock filled unit...some emergent plants, like annubias will do well, as well as acorus. The substrate will come near the "top" of the container, but will not allow wicking...that will be an artificial "edge"made of screening with small stones, etc. as a "mat" so that frogs don't drag substrate into the water area, and can "wipe their feet"...it will be filled with various size pebbles so no fear of drowning...at least this is what I'm working toward....



I got what your saying


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

Youngherp420 said:


> You make a good point. What should i doo with the pipe i have already in place,?


Sorry it took me a while to reply back, I've been dealing with a family emergency. Anyway, Gbeauvin's concept of the false bottom setup is pretty much spot on. If you have decided to go with the standard false bottom setup, personally, I would take out the pipe and at least some of the plastic that you wrapped around the corner column. (at least remove the bottom half of the plastic so the water can flow into corner where the pump is).

Just take out all the extraneous things that are not needed now that you are not going to try to separate things into contained areas. Check out a bunch of other threads on this forum about false bottoms, there are a lot of good ideas and suggestions. BTW I know how much it sucks to do a bunch of work and make something nice and then realize you have to tear it apart  I recently have been working on a paludarium build and I spent a bunch of money and time making a nice divider, then after all that I realized it was going to leak because silicone doesn't adhere permanently to plexiglass. Doh!

Anyway, decide how deep the water/pond area should be filled with water, then make sure the false bottom is TALLER than that by at least an inch or more. That way the substrate on top of the false bottom won't be submerged in the water. Hope all that helps


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

flyingSquirrel said:


> Sorry it took me a while to reply back, I've been dealing with a family emergency. Anyway, Gbeauvin's concept of the false bottom setup is pretty much spot on. If you have decided to go with the standard false bottom setup, personally, I would take out the pipe and at least some of the plastic that you wrapped around the corner column. (at least remove the bottom half of the plastic so the water can flow into corner where the pump is).
> 
> Just take out all the extraneous things that are not needed now that you are not going to try to separate things into contained areas. Check out a bunch of other threads on this forum about false bottoms, there are a lot of good ideas and suggestions. BTW I know how much it sucks to do a bunch of work and make something nice and then realize you have to tear it apart  I recently have been working on a paludarium build and I spent a bunch of money and time making a nice divider, then after all that I realized it was going to leak because silicone doesn't adhere permanently to plexiglass. Doh!
> 
> Anyway, decide how deep the water/pond area should be filled with water, then make sure the false bottom is TALLER than that by at least an inch or more. That way the substrate on top of the false bottom won't be submerged in the water. Hope all that helps


I know how emergences feel. and you are right completly . know what i rather get it right now and not later and wind up tearing everything down.since i dont want to rip out that pipe. ill cut out a piece of the bottom and do it that way.and i put water water in it and saw how much i need so this worked perfect.

All i have to do is start working on the pond and waterfall now.I hope you stay here and help me through to the end.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

stratch that im going to take the pipe out to make it so much easier


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

Youngherp420 said:


> stratch that im going to take the pipe out to make it so much easier


Good choice. Keep posting pics and updates. I'm very busy all the time but I'll help when I can


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

I just got your PM youngherp, haven't been on the forum much in quite awhile. I've just skimmed the thread so far. Anyways to answer your question in the PM... To keep the soil from getting saturated the pond is below the false bottom and never filled above it. If you do that all you need is a dam to keep substrate from falling into the pond. So you can't have a pond any deeper then your false bottom but it keeps an excessive amount of water from wicking into the soil and you don't have to worry about a leak and your substrate getting flooded. 

I do it this way because the substrate just above the false bottom is already pretty wet, and thats good thats how you keep humidity up, and it limits any wicking action from the pond. The area near the pond is just like the area above the false bottom so no more wicking occurs there then anywhere else and what does occur takes place very slowly.

If the pond is at substrate level the condensation at the sides of the pond interact with the drier substrate to produce a wicking action that basically sucks the water out of the pond and right into your drier levels of upper substrate. Basically the water crawls right up the side of the pond and into your soil, sounds weird but that's science


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Dendro Dave said:


> I just got your PM youngherp, haven't been on the forum much in quite awhile. I've just skimmed the thread so far. Anyways to answer your question in the PM... To keep the soil from getting saturated the pond is below the false bottom and never filled above it. If you do that all you need is a dam to keep substrate from falling into the pond. So you can't have a pond any deeper then your false bottom but it keeps an excessive amount of water from wicking into the soil and you don't have to worry about a leak and your substrate getting flooded.
> 
> I do it this way because the substrate just above the false bottom is already pretty wet, and thats good thats how you keep humidity up, and it limits any wicking action from the pond. The area near the pond is just like the area above the false bottom so no more wicking occurs there then anywhere else and what does occur takes place very slowly.
> 
> If the pond is at substrate level the condensation at the sides of the pond interact with the drier substrate to produce a wicking action that basically sucks the water out of the pond and right into your drier levels of upper substrate. Basically the water crawls right up the side of the pond and into your soil, sounds weird but that's science


Science is science no doubt about that

I understand what you are saying and it makes perfect sense to me since you explained it.I have another question maybe you can help,If i seal the pond with foam then paint it , cant i poke holes through the pond area to let water fall througt? If you understand. and How are you able to keep the water in there?
Thankyou for taking your time to help


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

Youngherp420 said:


> Science is science no doubt about that
> 
> I understand what you are saying and it makes perfect sense to me since you explained it.I have another question maybe you can help,If i seal the pond with foam then paint it , cant i poke holes through the pond area to let water fall througt? If you understand. and How are you able to keep the water in there?
> Thankyou for taking your time to help


Hope I can help. If you still have the same question above...I think I understand your question. If you have a false bottom and substrate above it and a pond dipping down, you need to understand that there is a "water table". Basically you need to visualize that the water level in the tank is at the same level throughout the tank, whether it is below the substrate that is above the false bottom, or whether your pond dips down below the water level so that you see the water inside that dip/pond. If you make the pond and then drill holes through it, the water level in the tank will be equalized, so the level of water under the false bottom, and in the pond, will be the same level. The pond that you plan to build out of foam is essentially just preventing the substrate from falling into the water area, but the water is still connected and flowing throughout everything. I hope that helps you understand and I hope that answers your question.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

That helped a lot and made perfect sense to me and what i am planning to do. thankyou for that. 

In the mean time i had no time between school and everything eles to work on this thak. I havent updated due to no progress and you can see. I am planning on working on it this weekend starting to get the structure of the water fall in shape as well as working on a fake butress tree roots. Aslo i plan on using a clay backround because i hate the Gs foam. If there any tips anyone can give me please do.No complety sure on how the clay works. But i have alot of time


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

Search YouTube for user jrgrimm's videos . Here he's known as Grimm. He has a video that shows how he makes the clay bg. Grimm is amazing, he's the master at making sick builds. He doesn't recommend clay however as he thinks it's too finicky


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

I cant find any vidoes and can you please find me the link on here

And this weekend is the weekend im offically working on the tank. Making ethier the fake tree or waterfall.Not sure which one first


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

oops sorry, it was jrgrimmier not jrgrimm..here's the link jgrimmier's Channel - YouTube


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

I did not do much today at all but its a start. I siliconed both sides as you can see 



















Next i use styrofoam to make a wall that will be around the pond area. 










Finally i tinted the drylok green( only color i had) to make sure the coverd all of the silicone.










once its dries ill place it in the tank to you are able to see what i mean



Right now im trying to constructed a cascading waterfalll.IM trying to base it off this picture but having a hard time


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

heres the barrier










now the waterfall construction




























I will go into more detail if you would like to know


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

After constructing the water fall feature, I need to find a way to cover the openings and cracks so water cant get out. I was going to use silicone to fill all the cracks. Than GS foam to add texture and then use drylok.Is this a good way or and easier way of doing this?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Bad day, I bought a Reptofilter 90 GPH


i placed it in my tank and realized that it would not reach the waterfall. So i had to complete start over which sucks


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## BethInAK (Jul 12, 2011)

that is a bummer. i'm not sure i understand how pumps work, so I'm not sure why you have to start over but its still a bummer.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

The intake vaule. Has to be under a certain height of water and the water fall structure was too high. So I would have needed to make the filter up higher so the intake was not submerge under water which doesn't work. So I need to complete restrict the water fall


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## Alegre323 (Sep 2, 2011)

look for a pump thats all the way submerged underwater.
thats the problem youre having correct?
go to lowes and check out the pumps.


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## eos (Dec 6, 2008)

Alegre323 said:


> look for a pump thats all the way submerged underwater.
> thats the problem youre having correct?
> go to lowes and check out the pumps.


Yup... They should have one for around 20-25 bucks... ask them for a small pump used for garden fountains, etc..

Good luck with the build!


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## davidadelp (Sep 29, 2010)

to bad u have to start over i kinda liked how u had that setup. not sure what u had planned for it or where water was going to go but i liked how it looked.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

The problem was that where the water comes out of the pump it would reach because it was too small. So I had yo start over and decrease the height of the water fall so it will. Reach now. Unless I did not have too take the waterfall and just got a bigger pump. 

Any way I learned to built the water fall aroud the pump. 

Also do any off you like my design of it I had


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

davidadelp said:


> to bad u have to start over i kinda liked how u had that setup. not sure what u had planned for it or where water was going to go but i liked how it looked.


I know. But im am going to do the same layout and everything you saw in the picuters above just modified to work around the filter. once it works ill post a vidoes so you can see. thanks for the feedback


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

eos said:


> Yup... They should have one for around 20-25 bucks... ask them for a small pump used for garden fountains, etc..
> 
> Good luck with the build!


thank you. the pump is fine. i just need to modify the waterfall itself


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## Alegre323 (Sep 2, 2011)

Ok i thought you were having a pump issue

Sent from my T959 using Tapatalk


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

I had to redo the waterfall and here it is










also i change the pond area










Can someone hlelp me, because iknow some people on here were long time aquarium keepers but what time water would work in the pond? Brackish? i sign up on an aquarium forum to help find the answer but i cant. Can some one help. Also how does the water fall look


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## Neontra (Aug 16, 2011)

Youngherp420 said:


> I had to redo the waterfall and here it is
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Brackish water + amphibians = BAD
Correct me if i'm wrong, but I think that would irritate the frogs. Also will leave salt deposits on the glass. Just use distilled or RO!


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Neontra said:


> Brackish water + amphibians = BAD
> Correct me if i'm wrong, but I think that would irritate the frogs. Also will leave salt deposits on the glass. Just use distilled or RO!


thats real good to know because i was thinking about it but afriad about the salt content and everything

what fish or anything do you think i could put in


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## freaky_tah (Jan 21, 2009)

how many gallons are you planning on having in the water area? I personally wouldn't want to put any fish in a 20 gallon's water feature since there's so little water and space


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

freaky_tah said:


> how many gallons are you planning on having in the water area? I personally wouldn't want to put any fish in a 20 gallon's water feature since there's so little water and space


I am not sure on how many gallons there are but im hoping to get a fish in there or two just to add life with the plants. I wouldnt want to stress a fish in a small spot, i want it living right. 

Also what substrate could i use to make a natural look


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## freaky_tah (Jan 21, 2009)

I use darker gravel, or aquarium sand in my aquariums. People obviously keep bettas in a gallon or so, but I never liked to do that. I would assume that the total water in the false bottom and the tank would be less than 5 gallons, since it's a 20g tank. With that limited amount of water I can't think of any fish offhand that would live a healthy life in that confined space.


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## Neontra (Aug 16, 2011)

freaky_tah said:


> I use darker gravel, or aquarium sand in my aquariums. People obviously keep bettas in a gallon or so, but I never liked to do that. I would assume that the total water in the false bottom and the tank would be less than 5 gallons, since it's a 20g tank. With that limited amount of water I can't think of any fish offhand that would live a healthy life in that confined space.


Personally i'd never do this, but some one did a 10 gallon with a water feature and had 6 neons and I think some corries.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

freaky_tah said:


> I use darker gravel, or aquarium sand in my aquariums. People obviously keep bettas in a gallon or so, but I never liked to do that. I would assume that the total water in the false bottom and the tank would be less than 5 gallons, since it's a 20g tank. With that limited amount of water I can't think of any fish offhand that would live a healthy life in that confined space.


I was thinking sand to make that natural look I hoping to get. I don't want to put a betta is because im skeptic on them with frogs. I have too do some research just a fish maybe a killis. And some shrimp.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Neontra said:


> Personally i'd never do this, but some one did a 10 gallon with a water feature and had 6 neons and I think some corries.


6 neons seems to mush. I was thinking a killis or some other very small fish. The last thing I want to do is stress the fish


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## freaky_tah (Jan 21, 2009)

Neontra said:


> Personally i'd never do this, but some one did a 10 gallon with a water feature and had 6 neons and I think some corries.


In a 10 gallon water feature? Wow that's nuts! I can't imagine they're all alive anymore. The smaller amount of water the harder it is to keep constant water parameters, and with that many fish I would guess ammonia and nitrite spikes would be happening all the time.


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## Neontra (Aug 16, 2011)




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## freaky_tah (Jan 21, 2009)

Well there's multiple comments saying that's way too small for the fish...especially the platies.. I was picturing a pdf tanks as well, not a fire belly toad tank


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

i agree with that


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Some progress,
I sprayed Gs foam to make that rock landscape look



















tomorrow i am going to sand and cut of some edges and then if Im ready im going to put grout, I condsidering putting grout on the inside of the water fall there the water will be then paint the rest of the foam above water level. Or just cover it complety in grout


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## WeeNe858 (Sep 13, 2010)

A betta is the only fish I would recommend. They do fine in smaller bodies of water. You just have to make sure there isn't too much water flow. Any other tropical would be too big or too sensitive to live long term in a set up like that. 

Check out AquaBid(dot)com in the Anabantoids section. Pick a really nice one, and enjoy it!

I also don't think the betta would have any issues with the frogs since they both stay out of each others way.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

WeeNe858 said:


> A betta is the only fish I would recommend. They do fine in smaller bodies of water. You just have to make sure there isn't too much water flow. Any other tropical would be too big or too sensitive to live long term in a set up like that.
> 
> Check out AquaBid(dot)com in the Anabantoids section. Pick a really nice one, and enjoy it!
> 
> I also don't think the betta would have any issues with the frogs since they both stay out of each others way.


thank you for that insight. You are most likely right with the betta as my only opinion. I just wish i was able to get some type of tropical fish


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Ive been working on the waterfall and coated the styrofoam in grout. So far so good. Next a little revison. I replaced the left hand side water area with land to increase the land. Ill post some pictures tonight.

Also the october 23rd show I pick up 3 mints for a great price. there in a quaritine tank for now until i am ready


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Bad day my tank cracked so i had to go out and buy a new one

but in the mean time i finished the waterfall, all i need to do is paint










the lights 










And these beautiful mints when i first got them


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

the water barrier done


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

So here is my rock water fall after the second coat of grey










Now I am curious if i should paint some brown in it or what. I basing my waterfall off of lizard landscaped rainforest waterfall?

I order leaf litter, abg mix, some moss and other supplies to finish.

during the week or maybe tomorrow i going to start the clay backround. cant wait

Stay tuned


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## MA70Snowman (May 18, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> So here is my rock water fall after the second coat of grey
> 
> Now I am curious if i should paint some brown in it or what. I basing my waterfall off of lizard landscaped rainforest waterfall?
> 
> ...


I did some serious acrylic work, washing, drybrushing, making it all look sick.. looks great when the tank is first setup, but after awhile the biofilm and everything starts building up and it ends up looking more natural anyway, and you can't even tell you painted it to begin with. So honestly up to you, b ut for me in the future, that's time better spent elsewhere.


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## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

Some killifish would be colorful, spawn, and do wonderful in there. You might also look into some of the colorful shrimp now offered. There are all sorts of options. pygmy cory cats, guppies, galaxy rasboras, etc.



Youngherp420 said:


> thank you for that insight. You are most likely right with the betta as my only opinion. I just wish i was able to get some type of tropical fish


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

Live bearer Endlers


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

I am looking to but in some live berriers and shrimp and or killi fish


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Blue_Pumilio said:


> Some killifish would be colorful, spawn, and do wonderful in there. You might also look into some of the colorful shrimp now offered. There are all sorts of options. pygmy cory cats, guppies, galaxy rasboras, etc.


where could i find these


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Final product on the waterfall





































now the mesh pots for the backround 









too many


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> Final product on the waterfall
> 
> 
> 
> ...


did you get this idea from Lizard Landscapes?

too many plant baskets eh? you can send some to me


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Yes i did and i might just have to


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

I've often wondered whether "net" pots could be made from the same plastic needlepoint material that is typically used above the false bottoms...it would allow for better root penetration at the very least, and could be "squeezed" into different configurations. The suggestion of the Endlers is because they are very tolerant of water conditions, including temperatures. The water would not have to be heated as would be the case with some of the other fish that are suggested. The males are as brightly colored as neons...and they can be quite prolific...


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> Yes i did and i might just have to


Yeah I figured you did lol. What did you use to seal your's with tho? 
That Shields All stuff he mentions is expensive 
I need some net pots to build a small hydroponic system for cuttings lol




Judy S said:


> I've often wondered whether "net" pots could be made from the same plastic needlepoint material that is typically used above the false bottoms...it would allow for better root penetration at the very least, and could be "squeezed" into different configurations. The suggestion of the Endlers is because they are very tolerant of water conditions, including temperatures. The water would not have to be heated as would be the case with some of the other fish that are suggested. The males are as brightly colored as neons...and they can be quite prolific...


meh you can use anything but I would think the GS would just expand and crush the needle point thing. They don't have to be net pots.
I used small tomato plant trays and cut the little pots off the tray.
On my next tank I'm just gonna spray my GS and the carve holes where I want them and just slapping some silicone just in the inner rim and making drainage holes and not even use pots. I can still see the green color of the pots sometimes 
When I tried to get the pot where I wanted the GS just moved it and messed the angle I was going for up. So next time I will just carve it in the angle I want. The GS is waterproof so I don't see why the pots are really needed. Plus sometimes you can still see the edges of the posts but if you don't use them and just throw some silicone in there a bit then slap some ecoearth on there you can't tell once you plant


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> Yeah I figured you did lol. What did you use to seal your's with tho?
> That Shields All stuff he mentions is expensive
> I need some net pots to build a small hydroponic system for cuttings lol


 I looked into that stuff, way to expensive. so i bought aquarium safe silicone and covered the area that would have the most water hitting it all the time. The paint i use was water resistant.so as long as that piant in getting with water all the time, i will be okay

I will let you know if i have extra, and i will give you some.I notify you first




DragonSpirit1185 said:


> meh you can use anything but I would think the GS would just expand and crush the needle point thing. They don't have to be net pots.
> I used small tomato plant trays and cut the little pots off the tray.
> On my next tank I'm just gonna spray my GS and the carve holes where I want them and just slapping some silicone just in the inner rim and making drainage holes and not even use pots. I can still see the green color of the pots sometimes
> When I tried to get the pot where I wanted the GS just moved it and messed the angle I was going for up. So next time I will just carve it in the angle I want. The GS is waterproof so I don't see why the pots are really needed. Plus sometimes you can still see the edges of the posts but if you don't use them and just throw some silicone in there a bit then slap some ecoearth on there you can't tell once you plant


I see what your saying but i am doing a kitty litter backround and not Gs. Exactly what ever showing just cover with plants or some moss and good as new


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> I see what your saying but i am doing a kitty litter backround and not Gs. Exactly what ever showing just cover with plants or some moss and good as new


Yeah and you can just put some clay on the rim of the pot and hide it too. That waterfall is gonna blend well with that kitty litter.
Can't wait to see more of the build


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

the mesh pots which will hold plants. 




























now the begin of my first clay backround in the making


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

I love the drain tube idea for your baskets 
How are you gonna keep your substrate from falling into the water tho?
I would make a barrier to hold the substrate back so it doesn't fall into the water


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## flyingSquirrel (Aug 22, 2011)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> I love the drain tube idea for your baskets
> How are you gonna keep your substrate from falling into the water tho?
> I would make a barrier to hold the substrate back so it doesn't fall into the water


If you are talking about keeping substrate inside the mesh pot...what I am doing in my build (I know I know, I need to update it) is using weed-block fabric as a liner for the mesh pots. Lets water through, but not soil.


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

flyingSquirrel said:


> If you are talking about keeping substrate inside the mesh pot...what I am doing in my build (I know I know, I need to update it) is using weed-block fabric as a liner for the mesh pots. Lets water through, but not soil.


nah his kitty litter surrounding the pots will hold the soil.
in your build Squirrel you have your false bottom a little bit below your partition to hold the substrate.
In youngherps case his false bottom is level with his partition and when he goes to put his substrate down it can easy wind up falling into the water.
or maybe I'm not seeing he has it lower than the partition lol these are mostly all overhead shot's it's hard to tell lol.
That's what I was talking about 
and yes my friend you are long overdue for an update 





btw youngherp that plant baskets on the left corner and the one on the far right might no drain right due the the angle and the tube being above the lowest point which means you will have water stay in there and be in constant contact with the clay and it might make it turn to mush. 
I suggest you turn them 180 degrees so that the tube will be there at that bottom and and the water will run down that angle and out the tube.

I hope this makes since lol
and do you have that partition at the same height as the false bottom or is it a bit higher than the false bottom to hold back the sunstrate?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

sorry i have been busy. I finished the clay backround up add the soil and leaf litter. (will post pictures tonight)

I fixed the mesh pots and still have some left over will let you know with that.

My substrates blocker if you want to say is blocking the substrate. Even on the left side were it looks to be higher.If thats what your asking.

Now before i get plants or should i say while im getting the plants what substrate would look more rainforest look for the water area?

Seachem Flourite Plant Substrate - Gravel & Sand - Fish - PetSmart

or

CaribSea® FloraMax™ Planted Aquarium Substrate - Gravel & Sand - Fish - PetSmart


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Well its been awhile since i have been here and i just finished aordering plants as i speak and aquarium substrate. I swear i will post pictures tomorrow of the clay backround


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> Well its been awhile since i have been here and i just finished aordering plants as i speak and aquarium substrate. I swear i will post pictures tomorrow of the clay backround


can't wait


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Finally it is done. No water and plants yet, will post pictures as soon as i get the aqua substrate. As well posting a vidoe of my waterfall

Here it is


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

it looks great and all but I would lower the land a bit and slim down the clay walls but that's just me.

Still looks great like I said, but you took away a lot of space from the frogs IMO.
You have have decreased the space significantly and out of what is left and I would only put thumbnails or just one PDF. I'm not exactly sure if this is big enough for a pair of larger terrestrial PDFs.

I would have only done this water feature in a larger tank like a 40g breeder or a 55g so it wouldn't sacrifice land. 

Not trying to be rude or anything but you have sacrificed a lot of space.

what do you plan on putting in here?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> it looks great and all but I would lower the land a bit and slim down the clay walls but that's just me.
> 
> Still looks great like I said, but you took away a lot of space from the frogs IMO.
> You have have decreased the space significantly and out of what is left and I would only put thumbnails or just one PDF. I'm not exactly sure if this is big enough for a pair of larger terrestrial PDFs.
> ...


the land did get lower after it got wet and yes i understand what your saying and you are right. no thinking of it i did take alot away from the mints i plan on putting in there.It is still a great tank and hey if i cant but them in there im pretty sure other frogs will


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> the land did get lower after it got wet and yes i understand what your saying and you are right. no thinking of it i did take alot away from the mints i plan on putting in there.It is still a great tank and hey if i cant but them in there im pretty sure other frogs will


Yeah it really does still look great 
Try to get a 40 breeder on the next petco sale?
I'm really glad to see someone finally using the LizardLandscapes ideas in their viv.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> Yeah it really does still look great
> Try to get a 40 breeder on the next petco sale?
> I'm really glad to see someone finally using the LizardLandscapes ideas in their viv.


I need a bigger tank haha

I hoping on getting my plants by thrusday


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> I need a bigger tank haha
> 
> I hoping on getting my plants by thrusday


cool cool.....can't wait to see it planted


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Sorry i havent been on here in a long time. Between school and work everyday i have not have time to be on here. But things settled down and I have the final product. sorry about the poor picture quality.

first planted

front:
































































newly planted



























just wanted to throw in my jewel orchid from my other tank blooming


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

the soil is in contact with the water too much and it can't stay soggy like that, it will rot your roots and start smelling and stuff I forgot the term for it lol
The soil needs to be able to drain better and if you used weed block well doesn't drain well. It's not gonna drain good enough for how saturated your soil is. That soil needs to be just damp not soaking wet like that


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> the soil is in contact with the water too much and it can't stay soggy like that, it will rot your roots and start smelling and stuff I forgot the term for it lol
> The soil needs to be able to drain better and if you used weed block well doesn't drain well. It's not gonna drain good enough for how saturated your soil is. That soil needs to be just damp not soaking wet like that


thankyou I will fix it


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> thankyou I will fix it


what are you using for substrate?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> what are you using for substrate?


ABG mix substrate


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## Pawky (Jun 10, 2009)

Thanks for sharing your build, its given me some ideas for a future build.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Pawky said:


> Thanks for sharing your build, its given me some ideas for a future build.


your welcome. if you have any question just ask.

this was not the best of my builds first time making a waterfall and using a clay backround, but i like it

Also i making my last build a 15 gallon column which will be seen from all angles and have a center piece. take a look

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/members-frogs-vivariums/79474-15-gallon-column-desk-display.html


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Youngherp420 said:


> ABG mix substrate


since it is so moist in there you might wanna think about adding extra coco coir and tree fern fiber so it drains better.

Is it staying really wet?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Nope not really , just moist like it should be


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## asid61 (Mar 18, 2012)

You putting fish in? Or maybe you can put tads in there?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Maybe a shrimp or too. I feel bad for the fish, Not enough room.


hopefully tads


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

hello everyone whos been following this thread I have 2 problems with this tank that i spent months and a ton of money on. But frogs come first.

problem 1:
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/beginner-discussion/77818-tank-small-group-mints.html

most likely going to tear it down

problem 2:

Water fall is not working the way i planned and it took to much away from frogs

So yes or no. Anybody suggest with their expert views should I tear it down an start from stratch so i can fit the mints?


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Well im going to take everything out and start over but this time have a smaller waterfeature with just a smalll rock wall that just trickles down .So there will be much more floor space and i dont love fake rock and waterfeature

Stay tuned for pictures of my decontruction and reconstruction of this tank


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Well i broke down the tank and time to start part 2 of the construction. In the end it was a good decsion to do this for the frogs


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

ROUND 2 of the contrusction of the tank and I learned alot from my last mistake. Time to improve.

Phase 1

Supplies





































*Building*




































































































more pictures and work to come


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## J Teezy (Jan 25, 2012)

here's my take on water features, if the frogs don't need it then it's usually more hassle than what its worth.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

J Teezy said:


> here's my take on water features, if the frogs don't need it then it's usually more hassle than what its worth.


 I know the frogs dont neeed it and it takes up space but i enjoy just one in my collection and the water area will not be deep and will also have many fake rocks in that area so the frogs can use that area


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

hey all, I havent been on hear in months due to school.work and personal reason. I just had no time what so ever. But things have settled down and now im ready to finish.

Im going out this week to purchase all the supplies such 

thanks for all that has stay tuned


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

With somuch going on I was unable to get anything done. Between work and personal events im not sure if im going to redo this even though i started. I might sell my small frog collection until I get things to settle down.


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Bad news everyone , went to work on my tank today and I have no idea what happened so I broke the bottom had to throw it away. Sorry no pictures. But after consideration I am going to get $0 gallon breeder for my mints now  excuse to get a bigger tank


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## yellow dart frog man (Mar 8, 2011)

Do you mean a 40 gallon breeder?? Hope you have good luck with the Mints!!! They look like really cool frogs!


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

yellow dart frog man said:


> Do you mean a 40 gallon breeder?? Hope you have good luck with the Mints!!! They look like really cool frogs!


Yes I did mean 40 gallon breeder lol, sorry for the mistake.

Mints are by far my favorite frogs


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## Youngherp420 (May 3, 2011)

Everyone who as been subscribed to this thread please follow it here where you can see the new and improved work and no all the learning mistakes I mmade here


http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/pa...aterfall-construction-journal.html#post761741


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