# Over planted?



## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

I would like to ask if my tank appears to be over planted. I like the look of it, but figure plants may smother each other, so maybe I'll thin it out. I thought it would give my darts a lot of places to hide, but figure now it may be over done?









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## S2G (Jul 5, 2016)

Anytime you add creeping fig it's overplanted.


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## connorp (Nov 22, 2017)

I would carve out an area in the middle somewhere and add some more wood. Your tank is very flat.


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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

S2G said:


> Anytime you add creeping fig it's overplanted.


Lol. I know creeping fig grows like crazy but I figured I'd let it cover the background and one of the sticks and cut anything that went further. Do you think I should remove it?

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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

connorp said:


> I would carve out an area in the middle somewhere and add some more wood. Your tank is very flat.


Thanks for the advice. I was thinking of putting a cypress knee in the middle and maybe making the substrate level more uneven. Might throw in some coconut huts as accents as well, I'll have to see how it goes.

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## S2G (Jul 5, 2016)

gonzalez said:


> Lol. I know creeping fig grows like crazy but I figured I'd let it cover the background and one of the sticks and cut anything that went further. Do you think I should remove it?
> 
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i find it takes over no matter what. It's just so aggressive. I've seen where it opened up a corner of a metal shed and started growing inside. I didn't listen to people and it ended up ripping the foam background away from the glass over time.


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## serial hobbiest (Mar 5, 2017)

S2G said:


> i find it takes over no matter what. It's just so aggressive. I've seen where it opened up a corner of a metal shed and started growing inside. I didn't listen to people and it ended up ripping the foam background away from the glass over time.


I have creeping fig, and I'm not listening! But then again, tropical plant selection here in Canada is very limited when it comes to things small enough to grow inside 30 gallon glass boxes.

If you allow it to grow all over your background, you will not have any other plants there. If you intend to keep it in spite of all the poo-pooing by all these experienced froggers, I suggest you rip it all out except for a single cutting in the corner somewhere, and then just keep it cut back and confined to that corner. It requires attention- just be prepared to provide it.

I'm over a year into this, and so far I have no real concern with my creeping fig. When it does start ripping apart my foam background, then I'll get to start my second build! Hooray! (I just need the excuse, you see.)


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## Khamul (Jan 16, 2018)

Definitely second putting in some more wood to fill up some of that negative space


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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

Khamul said:


> Definitely second putting in some more wood to fill up some of that negative space


I attached some wood in the background, and tommorow I'll be taking out most of the creeping fig









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## kimcmich (Jan 17, 2016)

@gonzalez,

Your plants look healthy. The viv looks "overplanted" primarily because some of the plants are not in the best spots: The fern in the left front-center would have been better planted against the back of the viv (I would suggest moving it) and the wire vine or pilea in the right-front has likewise started to get taller than some of the plants behind it (give it a trim). "Plants in the way of other plants" is often what people mean by "overplanted" - although some is unavoidable and natural.

Creeping fig is a vigorous viv plant but it is often the posterchild for "too successful" - and it will bully and bury almost anything else. In dryer vivs it can be better behaved.

I also garden in a tiny ~300 sqft front yard with succulents. My biggest hassles over time have been with plants that were great growers that gave me immediate satisfaction. They quickly become a nuisance to all their neighbors because they keep expanding at their expense. 

Finally, I would say that your current plants are all nearly the same maximum height. Adding a bit more topography to your viv - or adding a taller plant or two could help the viv seem more structured and less crowded.


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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

Thanks so much for the advice. I do have a taller plant but it simply outgrew my viv so I'm going to have to find something else. Also, I will move the fern to the back and the begonia to the front. And yes, I'll trim down the wire vine.

The plant with the small leaves is wire vine, and I will be trimming it.

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## Tantu (Sep 4, 2016)

My first vivarium was overrun by a single vine and I vowed to never plant another vine. That being said, I'd either trim the heck out of the fig or just get rid of it.

Am I missing out on not having vines? Probably, but just my 2 cents.


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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

Tantu said:


> My first vivarium was overrun by a single vine and I vowed to never plant another vine. That being said, I'd either trim the heck out of the fig or just get rid of it.
> 
> Am I missing out on not having vines? Probably, but just my 2 cents.


I never ended up removing it and it overrun my background lol. Here's what it looks like now, though it is horrible to trim back with good maintenance it's manigeable.









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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Nicely done. I personally like the look of a slightly overgrown tank.


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## S2G (Jul 5, 2016)

gonzalez said:


> I never ended up removing it and it overrun my background lol. Here's what it looks like now, though it is horrible to trim back with good maintenance it's manigeable.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's nothing. This is what overplanted looks like lol...lets play find the terribilis.


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## varanoid (Jan 21, 2011)

Impressive. Definitely lots of spots to hide, even for a terribilis.


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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

Nice setup. I like the ferns a lot. I've come to like the heavily planted setups more than the sparse ones.

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## S2G (Jul 5, 2016)

varanoid said:


> Impressive. Definitely lots of spots to hide, even for a terribilis.


There's 4 plants in there. How people do these mile long plant lists is beyond me.

Once the roots reach the drainage layer it's game on. I think the op and I have the same fern as well which grows like a weed.


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## jgragg (Nov 23, 2009)

> Once the roots reach the drainage layer it's game on.


*Well said.* Water as a limiting factor? Not any more! Ha ha.

This can inform a strategy to confine aggressive plants. If you _must_ harbor them, stick them up on the background or wood or whatever, and DO NOT let them root into the substrate and access the drainage layer.

I learned this with some variegated pothos. It was so nice and mellow before it hit the water. Then it took off, with triple-sized leaves and about 10x faster shoot growth. Oops. Jekyll and Hyde.


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## Kurk1921 (Aug 13, 2018)

I don't want to hijack the OP but have some questions myself if nobody minds. Since I am a new forum member, I am not able to open a new thread(?) Anyway, I have a vivarium with a Schefflera arboricola as the main piece of the flora. I have extensive root growth both above ground and below (drainage layer). This vivarium was started in early August, so just 2 months ago. Should there be concerns? My drainage layer is just small chunks of lumpwood charcoal (the size of LECA) with mesh as the separator. Should there be concerns about the roots tearing the silicone sealant of the Exo Terra? Also, should I switch to an egg crate drainage layer with weed block instead? Thank you in advance!


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## Okapi (Oct 12, 2007)

Kurk1921 said:


> I don't want to hijack the OP but have some questions myself if nobody minds. Since I am a new forum member, I am not able to open a new thread(?) Anyway, I have a vivarium with a Schefflera arboricola as the main piece of the flora. I have extensive root growth both above ground and below (drainage layer). This vivarium was started in early August, so just 2 months ago. Should there be concerns? My drainage layer is just small chunks of lumpwood charcoal (the size of LECA) with mesh as the separator. Should there be concerns about the roots tearing the silicone sealant of the Exo Terra? Also, should I switch to an egg crate drainage layer with weed block instead? Thank you in advance!



Dwarf Schefflera is a shrub and roots like crazy. It will even grow aerial roots similar to a strangler fig which will root when they touch the soil. If you keep pruning it you can bonsai it but I don't know how well that will work in the high humidity of a dart frog vivarium. I personally wouldn't trust it not to be overzealous with its root system. I don't have any advice for changing the drainage layer. As long as it is keeping the soil from becoming saturated I don't believe it will be a problem. Lump charcoal is used in ABG mix and is great for raising springtails.

Some links
kempercode=b636
https://www.dendroboard.com/forum/plants/341097-schefflera-dwarf-umbrella-tree-warnings.html
https://www.dendroboard.com/forum/plants/174858-schefflera.html
http://www.fukubonsai.com/3a3b.html
Plant Finder

For the OP, this was once nice vivarium with a mix of 7 or 8 plant species. Left alone for a couple of years the creeping fig won out. I have gone in and pulled all of the fig away from the background and cleared out the middle for adding more substrate and leaf litter a few times and it just bounces back with new growth and fills the whole tank again. The tank is empty, I am just using it as a springtail and isopod culture.


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## gonzalez (Mar 28, 2018)

Kurk1921 said:


> I don't want to hijack the OP but have some questions myself if nobody minds. Since I am a new forum member, I am not able to open a new thread(?) Anyway, I have a vivarium with a Schefflera arboricola as the main piece of the flora. I have extensive root growth both above ground and below (drainage layer). This vivarium was started in early August, so just 2 months ago. Should there be concerns? My drainage layer is just small chunks of lumpwood charcoal (the size of LECA) with mesh as the separator. Should there be concerns about the roots tearing the silicone sealant of the Exo Terra? Also, should I switch to an egg crate drainage layer with weed block instead? Thank you in advance!


I prefer the PVC egg crate weed blocker false bottom because it holds a lot of water. I may be wrong but won't the charcoal eventually degradenbecause it is an organic material? Or is there something that prevents that?

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## Lulu7108 (Oct 10, 2018)

It’s a gorgeous enclosure! 


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