# Mold in my cultures for the second time. Seriously need some help folks....



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

*No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*

So I have been culturing the same flies I got from a vendor and have had 0 issues. I use a DIY recipe and I add methyl paraben that I got from Josh's frogs. I was using vinegar but the smell was just getting annoying.









So I read up on some posts where Ed mentions (http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/61305-mold-cultures.html#post531237) the mold could have come from other cultures but as I said there is no mold in other cultures. 
Also he mentions (http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/food-feeding/61305-mold-cultures.html#post532221) it could be yeast overgrowth if it's white and slimy but this mold looks like a powder. 
One culture half of the flies have died already. The cultures are only 5 days old.

here is a pic of the moldy ones...









Oddly enough the only culture that had larvae so far is the one that has the dead flies in it 

Here is some cultures I made that will be ready in 2 days. These are not the cultures I used to seed the ones above though. Yet they are from the same flies I seeded the ones above with. So they all came from the same cultures but only the newest ones have mold.










So I have produced like 12 cultures and and none of them had mold until now. 
The only thing that is different is the coffee filters that I picked up from Dollar Tree. I'm switching from excelsior to coffee filters. 

Thanks for the help


----------



## scooter7728 (Sep 1, 2014)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*

I had a mold issue and a friend said it could be I wasn't using boiling water or maybe it was from the excelsior. Once I started using a tbsp of vinegar no more mold issue. I use the meth also in all my mixes.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*



scooter7728 said:


> I had a mold issue and a friend said it could be I wasn't using boiling water or maybe it was from the excelsior. Once I started using a tbsp of vinegar no more mold issue. I use the meth also in all my mixes.


my vinegar days are over and I use boiling hot water right out of a screaming kettle lol


----------



## CronicdenDro (Jun 27, 2015)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*

If you don't like the smell of vinegar add a little cinnamon on top and problem solved. Cinnamon also inhibits mold to some extent but not as well as vinegar.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*



CronicdenDro said:


> If you don't like the smell of vinegar add a little cinnamon on top and problem solved. Cinnamon also inhibits mold to some extent but not as well as vinegar.


Guys the methylparaben is a mold inhibitor. It's what most people use in the commercial medias. 
If the metylparaben didn't stop it then I don't think the vinegar is gonna help. I already have enough cinnamon to where my cultures smell like apple pie.
I just think when I made the cultures not enough methylparaben got in there.
This time when I made some cultures I sprinkled a little extra methylparaaben on top of the powder then put super hot water in and mixed. 
Maybe it was just a fluke we will see.


----------



## Bcs TX (Sep 13, 2008)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*

Brandon how old is your methylparaben? I had the same thing happen a year or so ago bought new methylparaben and no more mold issues.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*



Bcs TX said:


> Brandon how old is your methylparaben? I had the same thing happen a year or so ago bought new methylparaben and no more mold issues.


Like 2 months old


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

I have posted about this before and yes I have done some research about it. 
Idk what to do I'm using methylparaben and the first few cultures were fine. 
I know someone has the knowledge on this but I'm not getting any replies. 
I really don't think this is from the yeast since it's not really that slimy and it has turned yellow in one culture and has turned black in a very small spot in another and in one culture you can see some mold branching out kinda looking like mycelium. Like those fungus things that appear on the glass of vivariums from time to time. 


Can I even still feed from these cultures?
I know I can't feed from the one with the black mold no matter how small the spot is. 

I'm now down to cultures with mold. I really need some help here. 
I don't see why I'm not receiving any help on the matter but yeah my frogs gotta eat...so if you can truly help then please do so. Passing this by doesn't affect me, it affects my frogs. 

Thanks for the help

Please no speculations on adding vinegar and whatnot. It honestly could just be these coffee filters I had 0 issues until I started using them from the Dollar Tree. I have used them in the past but those were some I grabbed from work. So I will be making more with excelsior.
I use methylparaben so it shouldn't be doing this. I really think it might be these filters. 0 issues until I used them.


----------



## aspidites73 (Oct 2, 2012)

If it isn't taking over the culture, just let them mature. As far as the black spot, and again if it isn't expanding, it isn't necessarily black mold. If you want, after you assemble the culture but before adding yeast and flies, stick it in the microwave for 30 seconds or so. That will kill most living things on and above the media and, some below depending on how high the temps get.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

aspidites73 said:


> If it isn't taking over the culture, just let them mature. As far as the black spot, and again if it isn't expanding, it isn't necessarily black mold. If you want, after you assemble the culture but before adding yeast and flies, stick it in the microwave for 30 seconds or so. That will kill most living things on and above the media and, some below depending on how high the temps get.


I'm pretty anti microwave. I have one but I rarely ever use it. As long as it won't have any adverse affects I'll give it a go. 
So if it's ok then I guess I'll feed from it then. 

I just made 3 cultures from these cultures and used excelsior. We'll see if that's what the issue is. 

Will there be mold if you don't use enough water?
That might also be a possiblity that I"m not getting all the media wet so therefor whenever the dry media sucks up stuff there is mold. I just now though of that lol
Though videos and info here says that you wanna have a little bit of dry media so it doesn't get soupy in the long run.


----------



## aspidites73 (Oct 2, 2012)

Absolutely! Methylparaben, I believe, (you can check this on Josh's site, in the instructional videos on fruit fly cultures) needs the be sufficiently moist to work.

I can think of no reason the microwave would cause lasting effects much past 30-60 seconds. Although it isn't scientific proof, i've been doing it for many years thinking it helps with mites. Just don't leave it unguarded. Someone here on the boards wrote that instead of 1 minute he accidently hit 10 minutes and melted the culture pretty badly.

Also, potatoes turn black when they begin to dehydrate. Although, i'm not certain this applies to processed flakes. I know I get an occasional black spot in some of my cultures, As long as it doesn't spread, i usually just ignore it. ~David



DragonSpirit1185 said:


> I'm pretty anti microwave. I have one but I rarely ever use it. As long as it won't have any adverse affects I'll give it a go.
> So if it's ok then I guess I'll feed from it then.
> 
> I just made 3 cultures from these cultures and used excelsior. We'll see if that's what the issue is.
> ...


----------



## aspidites73 (Oct 2, 2012)

Also, I don't mix my cultures. I let the larva do that. I have found this doesn't work too well if you're using flakes instead of potato powder. I simply add a 1/2 cup dry mix (I use Josh's only due to personal preference) and top it off with 3/4 cup of boiling water. I add excelsior, microwave, allow to cool, then add yeast. I do this the night before and add flies the following morning when I feed out. I believe I have thrown out less than 3 or 4 cultures due to mold since turning to Josh's media from my own.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

aspidites73 said:


> Also, I don't mix my cultures. I let the larva do that. I have found this doesn't work too well if you're using flakes instead of potato powder. I simply add a 1/2 cup dry mix (I use Josh's only due to personal preference) and top it off with 3/4 cup of boiling water. I add excelsior, microwave, allow to cool, then add yeast. I do this the night before and add flies the following morning when I feed out. I believe I have thrown out less than 3 or 4 cultures due to mold since turning to Josh's media from my own.


I use an electric spice mill/coffee grinder and turn the flakes into powder. I add the brewers yeast, cinnamon, confectioners sugar, metyl paraben, and I process it in the mill until it's powder. 
I really need to find a larger mill haha I'm using a small one. 
Maybe a blender would work. 

I add my flies as soon as it cools. What's the advantages of waiting the following morning?

Thanks for all the help we will see what happens.


----------



## aspidites73 (Oct 2, 2012)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> I add my flies as soon as it cools. What's the advantages of waiting the following morning?
> 
> Thanks for all the help we will see what happens.


Just the fact that I have gotten into the habit of making cultures Sunday night but don't feed out over the weekends. Since it has been reccomended to use flies from multiple cultures, I first dump in some flies from 3-4 week old cultures into a feeding cup and feed out froglets and juvies. Then I double what's left with a 2 week old culture and populate my new culture with that mixture of flies. Then I use whatever cultures are booming most to feed out the rest of my collection. We are creatures of habit. To that I add OCD


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

I greatly appreciate the help and I will try these methods next time


----------



## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

You want the cultures as soupy as you can get them without the flies drowning in them. Forget the coffee filters. Use 9" unwaxed paper plates folded into quarters and pressed into the media. Although cultures that strike up mold are highly unproductive, not only do I use the flies to start new cultures, but I also feed them to my frogs, and Ive seen no adverse affect. I cannot attest to the microwave.....But my DIY mix gets boiled, and mixed with my handheld blender on the stove, then poured out into glass quart size culture jars. Using a 50/50 vinegar/RO water mix has nearly eliminated any old issues for me. 
The second big thing I've found that will really eliminate mold....Use LOTS of flies to start you cultures. And get those starter flies into those cultures the same day as you make them. The quicker you get little fly feet trampling around on the media, the better. They tend to inhibit the growth of the mold.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

pdfCrazy said:


> You want the cultures as soupy as you can get them without the flies drowning in them. Forget the coffee filters. Use 9" unwaxed paper plates folded into quarters and pressed into the media. Although cultures that strike up mold are highly unproductive, not only do I use the flies to start new cultures, but I also feed them to my frogs, and Ive seen no adverse affect. I cannot attest to the microwave.....But my DIY mix gets boiled, and mixed with my handheld blender on the stove, then poured out into glass quart size culture jars. Using a 50/50 vinegar/RO water mix has nearly eliminated any old issues for me.
> The second big thing I've found that will really eliminate mold....Use LOTS of flies to start you cultures. And get those starter flies into those cultures the same day as you make them. The quicker you get little fly feet trampling around on the media, the better. They tend to inhibit the growth of the mold.


Yeah well these new cultures that I didn't use coffee filters in don't have any mold issues 
I will never go back to vinegar lol well I won't go without a fight 

So you boil everything together and blend it, then pour it into your containers? 

Using one of these?










I did notice that ones the flies got established the mold subsided some.


----------



## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

I use a handheld mixer


----------



## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

but you have to take into account the humidity in your state, here its really low. if your in the south, your cultures need to be a little drier than colorado/wyoming/Utah/Nevada, etc


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

pdfCrazy said:


> I use a handheld mixer


Ah well I have one if those too.
but just to clarify you're saying that you boil everything and mix it all while it's boiling and then pour that into your containers?

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy SIII using tapatalk


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

pdfCrazy said:


> but you have to take into account the humidity in your state, here its really low. if your in the south, your cultures need to be a little drier than colorado/wyoming/Utah/Nevada, etc


I'm in Iowa

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy SIII using tapatalk


----------



## Anthony Jackson (Jul 16, 2004)

How many plates are you using in a culture, also can you post a picture of one to show the curious that may be wondering?


pdfCrazy said:


> You want the cultures as soupy as you can get them without the flies drowning in them. Forget the coffee filters. Use 9" unwaxed paper plates folded into quarters and pressed into the media. Although cultures that strike up mold are highly unproductive, not only do I use the flies to start new cultures, but I also feed them to my frogs, and Ive seen no adverse affect. I cannot attest to the microwave.....But my DIY mix gets boiled, and mixed with my handheld blender on the stove, then poured out into glass quart size culture jars. Using a 50/50 vinegar/RO water mix has nearly eliminated any old issues for me.
> The second big thing I've found that will really eliminate mold....Use LOTS of flies to start you cultures. And get those starter flies into those cultures the same day as you make them. The quicker you get little fly feet trampling around on the media, the better. They tend to inhibit the growth of the mold.


----------



## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

9" generic uncoated paper plates


----------



## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

folded into eighths.


----------



## Woodswalker (Dec 26, 2014)

When I spoke to Zach at Josh's Frogs about a year and a half ago, he said that you can still feed moldy cultures without harming your frogs. Mold is more of a problem for your vivarium. 

However, I've been thinking about this lately, and have wondered if the springtails would benefit from the extra little bit of mold that comes into your viv from moldy flies. That's just a speculation, though. I'm curious to look into that. 

Anyway, I have found that I get mold problems mostly when I have the excelsior too tightly bunched together, coupled with too much humidity in the cultures. Here in southeast Michigan, the humidity varies seasonally, so I have to keep a close eye on how my cultures are doing. When I see the larvae pupating too far up the sides of my jars, and threatening to make their way across the lid (sometimes pupating there), I know it's too moist in there, and I have to ventilate my cultures better. I move the lid to my tote (where I keep my cultures) to a more open position. In summary, when the flies are high up on the sides like that, indicating excessive humidity, I tend to see a lot more black mold shortly thereafter, particularly when the excelsior is too dense. 

In the winter when the heat is on, and the house is drier, I have to keep the tote lid covering a larger portion of the top to hold more humidity in the cultures. Otherwise, the media cracks and dries out, and my cultures suffer. They also build up a funky, white crust in the surface of the media (which may be yeast, I'm not sure). 

Since you're already probably using 50% vinegar and 50% RO water, boiling your water, and using methyl paraben, the only thing I can suggest aside from closer humidity monitoring is adding more cinnamon to your media. I don't know if any of this helps, but I thought I would share some of my thoughts. If you do a little experimental troubleshooting and find something new, please post an update! I hope your cultures perk up! 

[Slightly off topic: I've never tried coffee filters inside the cultures, but I do use them as my jar lids. I stopped using plastic and find that I strongly prefer glass jars. I can shake vigorously without the media falling out, due to the narrower neck.]


----------



## TheCoon (Feb 8, 2011)

Why are you so against vinegar? That would solve 98% of the issue...


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

TheCoon said:


> Why are you so against vinegar? That would solve 98% of the issue...


like I've said the smell. I have very high production rates so all is good


----------



## TheCoon (Feb 8, 2011)

Vinegar is used for its antifungal properties. The smell is easily taken care of by adding more cinnamon. I don't think I've ever seen mold in my cultures when using a significant amount of vinegar, and they barely smell until day 30 or so.


----------



## 55105 (Jan 27, 2015)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*

After having very serious mold and mite problems I can tell you the best remedy so far was moving my cultures to a new location.

Being proactive helps... If you see a problem in one culture quarantine it immediately. You don’t have to get rid of it if you need it, but at the very least move it away from your other cultures.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

*Re: No mold issues in melonagaster cultures until now....help*



port_plz said:


> After having very serious mold and mite problems I can tell you the best remedy so far was moving my cultures to a new location.
> 
> Being proactive helps... If you see a problem in one culture quarantine it immediately. You don’t have to get rid of it if you need it, but at the very least move it away from your other cultures.


Yeah moving them has helped a lot and I'll sprinkle extra methyl paraben in the mix and it contains the mold better


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

TheCoon said:


> Vinegar is used for its antifungal properties. The smell is easily taken care of by adding more cinnamon. I don't think I've ever seen mold in my cultures when using a significant amount of vinegar, and they barely smell until day 30 or so.


I'm autistic and I have heightened senses especially when it comes to smells and I can smell the vinegar through out the entire process. Messing with silicone is bad enough. 
I use methyl paraben for mold control


----------



## TheCoon (Feb 8, 2011)

Well clearly the methylparaben isn't work out for you too well.


----------



## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

TheCoon said:


> Well clearly the methylparaben isn't work out for you too well.


Clearly this is an old-ish thread and I now add a little more MP during each batch and it works better. 

I don't need help with this any further


----------

