# Any tricks to increase Hydei production?



## TerraFerma (Feb 20, 2011)

I've always had a hydei culture or two going but as I've only had thumbnails I only fed them to the frogs occasionally and never paid much attention to the cultures. However I have noticed they are much more finicky and slow to reproduce than melanogasters. Just got some large (to me) mantellas and will be paying more attention to the hydei cultures going forward. Any tricks to increasing the rate and amount of hydei output?

Got some Turkish gliders today but the ones I got at least don't seem noticeably larger than the standard melanogasters.


----------



## mongo77 (Apr 28, 2008)

They usually take a week or two longer to get going compared to melanos. You can do mix cultures of hydei and melanos if your looking for cultures that provide varied production rates.


----------



## mydumname (Dec 24, 2004)

Turkish gliders are a type of melano so they shouldn't be bigger.


----------



## dendrobates (May 11, 2009)

Start the culture with lots of flies(thirty or more), lots of media and add some excelsior. Once you get maggots take out the adults.


----------



## carola1155 (Sep 10, 2007)

dendrobates said:


> Start the culture with lots of flies(thirty or more), lots of media and add some excelsior. Once you get maggots take out the adults.


Take out the adults? Why? I would think that would subject the culture to one boom and then nothing else.


----------



## Tony83 (Nov 11, 2012)

Because the adults will kill the new flies.


----------



## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

I didn't start having good production until I found a mite "free" source of flies. Before then, it was just lame. Now it's quite productive. This might not be your issue, but you can look into it.


----------



## edwardsatc (Feb 17, 2004)

Tony83 said:


> Because the adults will kill the new flies.


 I think you are misinformed.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

edwardsatc said:


> I think you are misinformed.


Seriously misinformed


----------



## jdooley195 (Oct 19, 2009)

For any good culturing to happen, you'll need to have a good setup.

-Free of mites.
-Good media
-Correct temps/humidity
-Timing (especially for Hydei)

Here's what I do...

mix media as directed
fold (twice) 5-6 coffee filters
add about 30 or so hydei
put on a brand new vented lid
line a sterilite tub with mite paper
place the culture(s) in the tub and place the lid on off-set (permits air movement)
set tub in an area in frog room between 70-75 degrees
wait 3-4 weeks

...and that produces all the hydei I can handle!


----------



## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

I have not had good production with coffee filters with these guys, they collapse so easily.


----------



## JeremyHuff (Apr 22, 2008)

I use coffee filters exclusively and haven't had any real issues but have noticed the black form doesn't do as well in the winter, but the gold form does. I'm thinking of just doing the golds exclusively. But th blacks tend to do better in the summer. 

I know Ed has mentioned that males hatch first and if you make cultures from fresh hatches, you may not be getting many females. Also, I use 100-150 flies to start cultures. After a week I'll feed those flies off once I am confident there are eggs or maggots. I also always toss cultures at one month even if they will produce more for fear of mites.


----------



## JeremyHuff (Apr 22, 2008)

Tony83 said:


> Because the adults will kill the new flies.


Yeah, those deadly carnivorous FRUIT flies are a real problem. Lol


----------



## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

I also use filters, per cup I use about 7 then folded over as 1, and stuck in the medium. Mine only fall over if they are too full of pupae.


----------



## jdooley195 (Oct 19, 2009)

Yea, I agree about the filters falling ...it does happen occasionally, but I've been able to add new filters to the culture with no negative side-effects. It usually happens before they 'hatch' so nothing really escapes. 

Good point about which flies to use. (I think the following is correct...) If you use the first bunch of flies from a hydei culture to start a new one, your production will at least be delayed if not horrible...(this is the part I may be right on) because those flies are usually of the same sex and take a very long time to mature and then thus reproduce.


----------



## Peter Keane (Jun 11, 2005)

Also be sure to wait a week or so to start new cultures after new flies start hatching as most, if not all, hatching flies are all males. I think that is what I remember. Another trick is to start with more flies as more eggs will be laid and many more maggots will 'churn' up the medium getting a big jump on mites taking hold, as mites are basically inevitable. 

Peter Keane


----------



## JeremyHuff (Apr 22, 2008)

Regarding coffee filters, I have found the non bleached brown ones to be the best. Especially for buzzatti and hydei which will eat the filters. In the case of buzzatti sometimes entirely.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

I use pieces of fiberglass window screen folded accordion style in lieu of coffee filters


----------



## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

frogparty said:


> I use pieces of fiberglass window screen folded accordion style in lieu of coffee filters


I have a piece of fiberglass window screen in one of mine. I used it to replace the coffee filter that had collapsed into the media. Anyway, I'm finding that the flies can hold on to it a little too well. It takes a lot of shaking and thumping to get them off the screen. Do you have the same problem or maybe a trick?


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

No trick. There's usually plenty that drop off to fulfill my modest needs, so I don worry about it


----------



## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I've been using window screen mesh for a long time. Plus, it's absolutely free! (for me )


----------



## TerraFerma (Feb 20, 2011)

Pumilo said:


> I've been using window screen mesh for a long time. Plus, it's absolutely free! (for me )


How much window screen are you putting in there?


----------



## JeremyHuff (Apr 22, 2008)

I have used fiberglass and aluminum screening. But I found the cultures dried out too much.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Not for lids.... For pupating surface area.


----------



## JeremyHuff (Apr 22, 2008)

frogparty said:


> Not for lids.... For pupating surface area.


I know, but excelsior and filters absorb moisture that screen does not. This seems to maintain the humidity within the culture better than screen.


----------



## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Ah. I use 0.2 micron filter disks for lids.... My cultures stay moist. Plus, I tend to mix superfly a bit moister for hydei to begin with


----------



## papafrogger (Oct 21, 2012)

The first hydei culture i made took over a month to produce, yet has yielded lots of flies. Could that be due to low temps or dry culture? It molded pretty heavily but still produced very well

Not sure if it makes a difference but i am using joshs melano media.


----------



## dendrobates (May 11, 2009)

carola1155 said:


> Take out the adults? Why? I would think that would subject the culture to one boom and then nothing else.


I take them out because the maggots turn over the media so much that the adults drown in the media basically.


----------



## carola1155 (Sep 10, 2007)

Have you ever actually witnessed this? 

If not, I'd bet that you are just seeing the flies that are at the end of their life cycle that die and end up getting mixed up in the media once they fall.


----------



## joneill809 (Feb 25, 2012)

Blue_Pumilio said:


> I didn't start having good production until I found a mite "free" source of flies. Before then, it was just lame. Now it's quite productive. This might not be your issue, but you can look into it.


This has been my experience as well. I did not get stable hydei and golden hydei production until I got mites under control - my original founder cultures were contaminated, it took new flies from a clean source. I've also stuck with a regiment of dusting and sifting the seed flies for each culture to try to reduce the chance of any mites making it in from outside.

I also use coffee filters. I've been able to extend their use a bit by using slivers of plastic solo dishes that form a cone - then I stick the coffee filters inside. That keeps them above the media and extends their use a bit, but I like the fiberglass screen idea - I may give that a go.


----------



## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

Couple of comments and suggestions from my experiences over the years...

- Temperatures as mentioned
- Use the best producing cultures to make new cultures, careful they are not flyers
- I have had better experience with Excelsoir than coffee filters
- I have had better experience with Hydei formulated medium than standard medium or home made medium
- Hydei seem to fizzle out or turn to fliers quicker than melanogasters. For example I have had some of the same strains of melanogasters for years and years but I normally order some new Hydei yearly.


----------



## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

This care sheet has some good information See http://www.cowlitzreptilerescuelab.org/app/download/199266104/Fruit+Fly+Culturing.pdf 

I should note that I successfully cocultured (in the same culture) hydei and melanogaster for a number of years (until I stopped culturing hydei). Hydei emerge in a staggered sex ratio and it takes about ten days for the newly emerged males to produce sperm so depending on when you pull the flies for the new cultures can cause a significant lag time until the next generation emerges (if you do everything right at around 80 F it should be somewhere close to 20-25 days. 

Some comments 

Ed


----------



## bradleyfreefall (Dec 21, 2012)

I'm curious............what is mite paper.....and where can you get it?


----------



## mydumname (Dec 24, 2004)

New England Herpetoculture LLC - Meds & Chemicals

Scroll down a little....it's $7.99 here.


----------



## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

It's also available at Black Jungle Anti Mite Shelf Paper 
I'd post the price but then that would look like I was endorsing them... possible vendor feedback... 

Also Carolina Biological Supply Carolina Biological Supply Company - Anti-Mite Paper, 18 in x 10 ft Roll customer reviews - product reviews - read top consumer ratings 

Some comments 

Ed


----------



## mydumname (Dec 24, 2004)

Ehh its publicly posted on their website. Not like there is an opinion involved.


----------



## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

mydumname said:


> Ehh its publicly posted on their website. Not like there is an opinion involved.


Greg, if you only suggest one source, then you are endorsing that source over others.... 

hijack over as this isn't the place to discuss this..... 

Ed


----------



## mydumname (Dec 24, 2004)

Feel free to pm if you prefer....I do not see a definition of feedback or something indicating saying you can't state a price of a product. If you have a link, I wouldn't mind checking it out.


----------

