# drylok on styrofoam for reptiles/warmer frog species?



## jezzaherps (Feb 22, 2018)

Does anyone know how the drylok on styrofoam method (no cement/grout) of background rock wall making works for use with reptiles?

The set up will be for tree monitors so I need to know the following :

1. How durable is the finish when using drylok? Tree monitors are very active so will walk and climb all over the walls daily. They have small but quite sharp claws for climbing.

2.How does it do under heat? The required basking temperature (hot spot) for these monitors is around 50-60c, with ambient temperatures being at least 26c. Would this have an effect on the drylok and possibly penetrate to the foam?

3. If the above two problems are concerning - would doing extra coats of drylok solve this issue? 

For example the basking site temperatures obviously do not cover all the rock work, only select spots. I am thinking a minimum of 4 coats overall and even more just for the basking sites.

The drylok only method appeals to me as this set up is going to be very large and if this method works it would be much more practical then for me to go with a cement wall which will be far heavier and also be needing the curing time. I have never used drylok so am not familiar with how the finish looks/feels.


I understand that this is primarily a dart frog forum but I hope you do not mind me asking these questions, it was the best place I could find in regard to the making of rock wall backgrounds (and drylok use!). 

Thanks in advance!


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## Cakers (Sep 10, 2017)

I used Drylok for the first time on a vivarium but have not put new dart frogs in it yet. It's only been about 2 weeks. I used the pink foam board and carved it then covered painted with Drylok. It they grey colored stuff in the pic.


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## jgragg (Nov 23, 2009)

I have used straight drylok-on-foam some, with small, low-activity arboreal snakes. It worked alright for them - fine, truly. It was always the formulation with the chunky silica crystals - not the smooth stuff which I believe has some mold inhibitors (I wouldn't use that stuff for any animals; and/but, the crystally stuff could be hard on frog bellies!). I have also done the grout thing plenty, and now like epoxy the best. I totally understand not wanting to run straight at the grout method, if you've done it before - it's not a trivial job. It can look simply amazing, but oh man, it takes some work!

I'm sorry, I do not believe drylok alone will work for your application. Maybe with high-density foam, coated with gorilla glue which then has quite a few coats of drylok. And maybe also a top coat of gorilla glue. But for active sharp-clawed animals...I'd go with either grout or epoxy, if you want to use foam.

Epoxy costs more in materials, but way less in time. There are fewer "entries" or "crafting events" needed, each "event" requires less time, and you don't need all the time spent curing between coats or after the last one. You also have no alkalinity worries with epoxy. Finally, you have more options in terms of the finish sheen - typically it's matte, you can add plenty of texture with e.g. crumpled aluminum foil, or you can smooth it into a bit of a shine. Grout always looks kind of like sandstone.

I have been using polygem's zoopoxy for years. Works awesome but is sort of a pain to use. Nothing like grout, but still, a sticky mess until you get the technique figured out (water is the key - keep your tools or gloved fingers wet). I'm just about out of what - hopefully! - might be my last 2-gallon kit. There's something new, a brushable "fish safe" product - that's what I'm trying next. I recommend anyone try it. https://www.smooth-on.com/products/habitat-cast-coat/

After looking at their videos I think one could do a high-detail foam carve, and retain a lot of that detail under the brushed-on epoxy. It's hard to do with epoxy putty, and not easy with grout unless you really thin it down. Then you have to manage cracking, and put on multiple layers. PITA.

I've never kept any _Varanus_. They seem really, really special. And I'm not a frogger either, I just come here for inspiration and education. And to share with other squamate-heads like you. Good luck!

cheers


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## AOA (Jan 19, 2017)

I too think that epoxy and concrete are great ways of making BGs. However, I have been using drylock now for over 6 years and think it too is great for our applications. I have done several planted aquariums and had years worth of success under water. I have also done high humidity tanks with no problems and desert vivs too. The stuff is great.I did get salmon eggs and other tropical fish to breed with drylock BGs. I am not a breeder however and dont want to sound like an expert on the topic. For general husbandry, I have had good luck with this product under the conditions you are talking about. Three layers with plenty of dry time between coats and you should be good to go. I have had leopard geckos and adult bearded dragons on the hardscape and is has shown no signs of major wear at all. Granted I havent had any of those critters who really scratch at the faux rocks but i think it will hold up great. The temperature levels your talking about are almost exactly the same as two of my tanks and they have been up and running for over 3 years. The desert viv in the pic below is a 140 gal and the tropical viv is 150 gal, both have complete hardscape rock made of polystyrene and dry lock. Good luck

JD


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## jezzaherps (Feb 22, 2018)

Thanks for responding, mixed responses so far though!

How is the finished feel of drylok? I am reading that it does have sand/texture in it so am wondering if the feel is similar to that of grout/rock? How hard does it feel (does it flex when pushed gently?) 

From what I have seen and read I am thinking that with enough coats the drylok will be strong enough for this application. 

What I am most concerned with is for the Basking sites I want to have. These would be flat faced ledges where the basking lamps (HID / MVB) are directly beaming onto the rocks. This will result in temperatures around 60 celcius (140f). If this kind of heat does soften/effect the drylok then it will not work for me.

I am considering buying the drylok and doing a test run with a lamp on a small piece but obviously it would be better for me to get first hand advice from someone who has tried it before as not to waste money/time.


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## Cakers (Sep 10, 2017)

The finish did have a rougher texture which I was going for. I added sand as well to some spots mixed in with paint. It dries hard.


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## jezzaherps (Feb 22, 2018)

That was the impression I got from what I have been reading, always good to throw some sand on as painting etc for texture so should be fine. 

Just really want to know how it performs under direct heat from a lamp, this is the only issue i'm having with deciding to go with this method or not. 

Does this method work for use with a waterfall as well or must an epoxy or extra sealant be used for this purpose on top of the drylok?


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## chin_monster (Mar 12, 2006)

jezzaherps said:


> That was the impression I got from what I have been reading, always good to throw some sand on as painting etc for texture so should be fine.
> 
> Just really want to know how it performs under direct heat from a lamp, this is the only issue i'm having with deciding to go with this method or not.
> 
> Does this method work for use with a waterfall as well or must an epoxy or extra sealant be used for this purpose on top of the drylok?


There's a fair amount of sand / particulate already in drylok but it doesn't exactly apply "grainy" or dry as such, but it gives the paint a good amount of heft / body -it gap fills seams waaaaay better than a latex house paint or such.

As to how it holds up to heat, the dried shell of paint will remain perfectly intact but the base layer of styro (white, pebbly variety in my case) will melt into nothingness leaving an unsupported egg shell of dried paint. It is actually really surprising just how much "air" is in stryo and how little actual substance. But these instances are hot soldering iron and/ or blowtorch applied to dried face of "rocks" not exactly sure how a heat lamp would interact with a fake rock with a slow radiant heat build and distance in between -and of course different / other types of foam behave differently

Once the stuff is dry and cured it's pretty much inert and impervious to water so any additional coatings are not required




As to the previous points enquired about, in my experience drylok painted styro rocks have proven to be surprising durable but once the paint layers are compromised there's some issues. There's a fair amount give to the dried paint layers before they crack and fracture.

I make "rocks" that are a minimum of 5-7 full coverage layers of drylok (alternating layers of light and dark tinted paint) and then the tinted color layers to make them "realistic"

I just do not know how well the "rocks" that I make would withstand large, active animals with pointy feet -I'd probably be leaning more towards they'd survive than not, but it could go either way.

Were I to be playing it safe I'd probably be making a background for large, active animals out of Polygem 307 epoxy "clay" over foam and trying for something like an 1/8" of coating thickness


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## Cakers (Sep 10, 2017)

Im going to try making another viv painting with Drylok and sealing with Krylon uv resistant spray. Want to make it look like volcanic rock. Last time I did this i ended up with grey color looked like sidewalk concrete. This time I want to paint over with black and seal with Krylon.


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## chin_monster (Mar 12, 2006)

Cakers said:


> Im going to try making another viv painting with Drylok and sealing with Krylon uv resistant spray. Want to make it look like volcanic rock. Last time I did this i ended up with grey color looked like sidewalk concrete. This time I want to paint over with black and seal with Krylon.


Be careful about getting complete drylok coverage if you are planning to use solvent (krylon) spray paint over the top of it . . . the solvent in the paint does a number on the raw styro leaving an empty shell of drylok, it's surprising sometimes just how energetic / destructive solvents can be to foam. 

The best results I have are to mix small amounts of acrylic craft paints into small amounts / containers of Drylok to create a darker colored paint layer (which is alternated with lighter and darker tinted layers until a sufficient number of layers is reached) and then the final layers of lighter acrylic colors are dry brushed of a final dark tinted layer of Drylok to add the shading and highlights that make the "rock" realistic. No final sealing coat is required and will most likely just add an unnatural gloss to the background anyway


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## jezzaherps (Feb 22, 2018)

For the build I will be using XPS styrofoam (blue in colour) which is quite dense, inert and heat/water resistant. 

I am thinking a lot of layers (5-6 minimum) should be ok for what I have in mind. Over this I will use low voc (non toxic) acrylic/latex paint to get the colours I want and maybe throw some sand etc for added texture (I think this could make it a bit more robust as well to wear from the animals).

Is this method ok or should I mix these paints with the drylok for the painting (aesthetic only not the sealing coats) ?


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## Cakers (Sep 10, 2017)

Yes. I decided not to use Krylon spray since I'm working on the background in the viv. I like the dry brush technique and will try that.


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## reptileink76 (Feb 7, 2018)

I'm currently in the process of stuffing a 55 gallon (vert orientated), with pink styro and plan on covering it with Drylok only. While I won't have hot basking spots, I'll update here once I get to that process. Shouldn't be too much longer.


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## Cakers (Sep 10, 2017)

Let me know how that works with dry environment and basking light. Sounds like something I woild try.


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## Cakers (Sep 10, 2017)

Nearly finished hourglass tree frog viv. Used Drylok for background with some coco/silicone added for effect.


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## Madison_1226 (11 mo ago)

jezzaherps said:


> Does anyone know how the drylok on styrofoam method (no cement/grout) of background rock wall making works for use with reptiles?
> 
> The set up will be for tree monitors so I need to know the following :
> 
> ...


I am extremely worried. I painted my tank with drylok and waited 7 days. My reptile is in it now. Is this bad? Should I just be buying a whole new tank?


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