# Water quality in film canisters



## Fishinfl321 (Aug 10, 2006)

I did some searching and found some good info, but not quite what I was looking for. I have an imitator tad currently inside the viv in a film canister. I plan on leaving the tad inside the enclosure for the parents to raise. My question is about the water inside the film canister. I mist every other day or so and add water that way. The water seems ok, but the waste material from the tad and substrate from the parents tracking in is satrting to build up in the bottom of the canister. Is there a way to clean the canister with the tad inside it or is it even an issue? Thanks for anyones help.

Troy


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## cschub13 (Apr 27, 2011)

I have wondered about this as well, so I hope you get some helpful info on this. I suppose I was under the impression that tads can be raised in very small volume of water, many times even smaller than a film canister. In such a small space the water would be sure to build up in waste and other organic material, but I wonder if it has some sort of nutritional additive from the organic breakdown.


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## Steverd (Sep 4, 2011)

Yes, this is a GREAT question. Some of mine have some algae growth and I think almost all have dead fruit flies in them. Do I remove and clean?
Or just tilt and dumb? What are peoples thoughts on this?

Steve


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## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

I've never really had an issue with them once they had been deposited. The parents get picky sometimes about putting them in dirty water though. I think any attempt to clean by dumping or overflowing would have the potential to do more harm than good (dumping baby into leaf litter  ). I have toyed with small holes in my film canisters so that I do not have to fill to the top to overflow, but this limits the future use of said container. I think a spray of fresh water to discourage algae or fuzzy fungus growth should suffice. Nature has a tendency not to be clean. If they are in a brom, a good flushing is ok, just not hard enough to blow them out of the water.


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## Wyoming frogger (Dec 18, 2009)

The parents seem to have a super success rate in my vivs. I think the dead fruit flies become tad food. The only time I know I've had water quality issues is when I pulled the tads and fed them fish food.


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## kthehun89 (Jul 23, 2009)

I leave my intermedius in canisters and they graze on the algae all day. I add a small piece of magnolia leaf which usually releases some tannins coloring the water brown too. Haven't lost a tad yet!


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## heckler (Dec 28, 2011)

worst case scenario is you could get a small pipette to suck up any nasties at the bottom that bother you. That way you get rid of the bad stuff without sucking up too much water


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## Dzo (Oct 26, 2012)

This is a nice topic I can help with!
So as I said I am into aquariums for over 20 years and in that time I learned some things about water chemistry.

The main thing You should be worried about is not algae, or dirt by it self.
It is nitrogen cycle and the bad trio Ammonia ( NH3/NH4+), Nitrites (NO2-) and Nitrates (NO3).

I can take a wild guess that tads are more robust than fish and can withstand much worse conditions concerning nitrogen compounds. But still they excrete Ammonia directly like fish do...
And Ammonia is quite poisonous in very small concentrations. Lethal concentration in exposure for 4 days is just around 1ppm in water, and it increases with higher temperature and higher PH, similar for Nitrites. 
And You should watch the water not to exceed 50 ppm Nitrate since it is growth inhibitor and can be lethal to some sensitive organisms in much smaller concentrations... 

How does this bad trio works... As I wrote, fish and amphibians excrete Ammonia directly trough gills. Then some good bacteria converts it to the Nitrite and other bacteria convert Nitrite to Nitrate. This all happens in aerobic conditions with help of nitrifying bacteria ... 
In Anaerobic conditions (lacking oxygen) Nitrate is converted to Nitrogen gas by denitrifying bacteria... 

For newly constructed water systems, there is a minimum time of two weeks in which bacteria establishes. During that time there may be lethal spikes in Ammonia and Nitrate concentrations in water.
This can all be shortened by adding some filter medium with bacteria in it.

I wouldn't be much worried about tad safety, especially if they grow in bromeliad, since plants absorb the nitro compounds for nutrition.
If You are using plastic containers like film canisters and You are worried about nitrogen compounds harming Your tad or fish this is what You could do.

- Add some algae or aquatic moss, they will absorb nitro compounds and may even serve as food.

- Arrange the container to be filed with water for at least two weeks before the tads are put in.

- Use tannin enriched water, among many beneficial factors they make the water PH go down and thus make Ammonia less toxic. (Ammonia has two forms, ionized (NH4+) and unionized (NH3). In lower PH there is more percentage of ionized Ammonia which is less toxic.) 

- Change part of the water periodically (20 % to 50 % weekly or monthly - the often the better). This will help with reducing amount of Nitrate in the water.


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## Derek Benson (Feb 19, 2004)

I agree with the above statements about water quality issues reguarding ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. In order to be successful with amphibians, I think you should have a firm grasp on the nitrogen cycle, as amphibians are pretty much fish on land (half of their life).

One thing that I do is add a liquid nitrifying bacteria additive to my misting water along with a water conditioner (prime) in order to make the bromeliad axils and film canisters much like that of a mature aquarium. It doesn't take much and it smells awful, but i've noticed a lot better bromeliad survival rate and growth than in the past. This will allow tads raised in the axils and canisters to be under respectable water parameters and with the viv temperature already set, you've knocked out quite a few variables that can contribute to poor tadpole care (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH, alkalinity, chlorine).

Sometimes I wonder about people that strictly mist with r/o water and how it could possibly hinder growing tads in these containers. Like mentioned above, in order to complete the nitrogen cycle, it takes several weeks without any cheating devices (bacteria additives), so continually filling axils with r/o could accumulate high levels of the above ammonia/nitrite/nitrate. Just a thought...


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## Fishinfl321 (Aug 10, 2006)

Thank you everyone for the responses. I am going to keep an eye on the amount of waste/debris that accumulates and go from there.

Troy


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## brad0608 (Jun 5, 2012)

I have tads dropped into Wat I thought to be unsuitable for anything to live in and ther fine


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