# Canivours Plants



## oilersface (Jan 15, 2012)

Hi all, this might be a stupid question but I am going to ask it anyways. Is there a suitable canivours plant that one can have in a tararium with Tincs in it?


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

Pinguicula that don't require a dormancy period, mini Drosera, terrestrial Utricularia. Although they will capture fruitflies and microfauna... Any pitcher forming species (except maybe Cephalotus, but they wont survive in a tropical Vivarium) have the potential to kill your frogs, as do Dionaea. I'd personally stick to mini Drosera, and Utricularia. If you have the right conditions, the Utricularia will spread across your substrate and produce fantastic flowers. 

Jake


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## Hornet (Sep 29, 2010)

There are a few options, as mentioned, Utricularia can do well but i'd stick to the epiphytic species, in my experience terrestrials often love full sun and a poor sandy soil and probably wont thrive in the viv. Mini drosera again have needs that probably cant be met in the viv (full sun, poor sandy soil). There are 3 drosera that can be used, often called the 3 sisters of queensland, Drosera adelae, D. prolifera, and D. schizandra. They are naturally rain forest dwellers and love low light conditions. Other carnivores you can use include Genlisea species and the carnivorous bromeliads


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## brinkerh420 (Oct 2, 2011)

Agreeing with hornet, the Three Sisters of Queensland can be used in vivariums, but I know from some friends collections, Adelae is by far the easiest. Schizandra is pretty hard (I haven't tried it, but from some friends' experience, it needs LOTS OF HUMIDITY) and I am not quite sure about prolifera. 

Whatever plants you want to put in, make sure they are all TROPICAL SPECIES unless you decide to make a bog garden terrarium.

Sphagnum moss can also thrive in a vivarium if given high light.

More about light, the plants should be good if you have a 4 Bulb 24" T5 Fixture. You might not get the best colors out of them, but they will still do well.

If you do end up getting adelae, I would highly recommend taking root cuttings once the plant is mature. When I planted my adelae, I accidentally left one root sticking out (2 weeks ago) and there is already a new plant growing off of the root.

Hope it helps,

Will


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## ICS523 (Mar 10, 2012)

with nepenthes (tropical pitcher plants, the only ones witch actually work in vivariums) you can use any small species, only the largest nepenthes are a real danger to your frogs and these probably wont fit in your average viv.
as for venus flytraps (dionaea) they are from North Carolina and require a dormancy period in the winter.


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## oilersface (Jan 15, 2012)

Thank You all for your replies I will see what I can find up here in Canada and go with what you all have suggested. I do like the Nepenthes and also the adalae. What substrate does on use?


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## brinkerh420 (Oct 2, 2011)

I use either a mix 1:1 Peaterlite or 1:1 Peat:Sand

For Perlite and Peat, make sure you DO NOT USE MIRACLEGRO PRODUCTS! They have fertilizers that will kill your plants.

For sand, make sure you get 100% Silica sand.

Will


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## Dartolution (May 30, 2011)

I too am curious about using one or two species of nepenthes but dont know if highland or lowland species work better. 
I like the small ones anyway.. 


What about mixing vermiculite in the peat mix?


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Peat/sand is a horrid Nepenthes mix. They need good drainage. 50% long fiber sphagnum, 50% fine orchid mix is what I use.


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

ICS523 said:


> with nepenthes (tropical pitcher plants, the only ones witch actually work in vivariums) you can use any small species, only the largest nepenthes are a real danger to your frogs and these probably wont fit in your average viv.


What do you mean by small species? Assuming you mean small pitchered Nepenthes, the pitchers are still large enough to potentially trap and kill dart frogs. Many Nepenthes can reach 20-30 feet, so "small" is a misnomer. Personally, as much as I love Nepenthes, I would never grow one in a Vivarium with any animal that could potentially be trapped. Even a slight risk to the inhabitants purely for the sake of the cool factor is wrong. In my opinion, no form of pitcher plant should be kept with an animal, unless the animal is much bigger, like an arboreal snake or iguana type species, although they may pose the risk of damaging the plant....

Jake


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## Hornet (Sep 29, 2010)

jacobi said:


> What do you mean by small species? Assuming you mean small pitchered Nepenthes, the pitchers are still large enough to potentially trap and kill dart frogs. Many Nepenthes can reach 20-30 feet, so "small" is a misnomer. Personally, as much as I love Nepenthes, I would never grow one in a Vivarium with any animal that could potentially be trapped. Even a slight risk to the inhabitants purely for the sake of the cool factor is wrong. In my opinion, no form of pitcher plant should be kept with an animal, unless the animal is much bigger, like an arboreal snake or iguana type species, although they may pose the risk of damaging the plant....
> 
> Jake


or vampire crabs that naturally live in them, or other inverts that you dont mind losing


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

Hornet said:


> or vampire crabs that naturally live in them, or other inverts that you dont mind losing


Obviously my statement excludes any fauna with a symbiotic relationship to Nepenthes... And according to what I've read, they were found in the terrestrial pitchers of N. ampullaria. I wonder whether they would be capable of climbing out of a larger pitchered species.

Jake


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## Orchidvore (Jan 7, 2012)

Like has been said before Nepenthes get much too big for most vivs. They are climbing vines but you could cut the stems back to the ground once they start bolting skyward. Neps will sprout new growths pretty easily. I looked at putting one in a viv I'm making, (24"x24"x36") but decided it would take up too much room, and I didn't want to risk it eating a frog. Even though tincs are big, all of the commonly available Nepenthes make pitchers plenty large to trap a tinc. With that said, if you still want to look into it, I'd suggest N. ampullaria (compactish growing) or N. gracilis (smaller species).

I have grown Drosera capensis, adelae, and binata before, and I think they'd grow well in a viv, but would get trampled by a larger frog like a tinc, and possibly eat a smaller frog like a thumbnail froglet.


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## brinkerh420 (Oct 2, 2011)

frogparty said:


> Peat/sand is a horrid Nepenthes mix. They need good drainage. 50% long fiber sphagnum, 50% fine orchid mix is what I use.


Sorry, at the beginning Nepenthes wasn't an interest, so I didn't include that mix.

You could also use 1 Coco Fiber:1 LFS

Vermiculite can be used as a substitute for peat, but it degrades quickly (3 or 4 years) so some people do not like to use it.

Will


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## brinkerh420 (Oct 2, 2011)

Orchidvore said:


> I'd suggest N. ampullaria (compactish growing) or N. gracilis (smaller species).
> 
> I have grown Drosera capensis, adelae, and binata before, and I think they'd grow well in a viv, but would get trampled by a larger frog like a tinc, and possibly eat a smaller frog like a thumbnail froglet.


N. Ampullaria can be a good choice, but remember that it can completely collapse with a lack of moisture, and if we are talking about thumbnails, then bye-bye. The pitchers are still pretty big compared to a thumbnail.

The only part about sundews in a terrarium that I don't like is that their food gets moldy and gross looking. Capensis would work fine(IMO, a thumbnail would survive), adelae would work fine, but then there is binata. Depending on what species this sundew is a big no-no(unless you trim!!) Drosera Binata Multifida can take over a terrarium, like these plants in the picture:










Will


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Orchidvore said:


> Like has been said before Nepenthes get much too big for most vivs. They are climbing vines but you could cut the stems back to the ground once they start bolting skyward. Neps will sprout new growths pretty easily. I looked at putting one in a viv I'm making, (24"x24"x36") but decided it would take up too much room, and I didn't want to risk it eating a frog. Even though tincs are big, all of the commonly available Nepenthes make pitchers plenty large to trap a tinc. With that said, if you still want to look into it, I'd suggest N. ampullaria (compactish growing) or N. gracilis (smaller species).
> 
> I have grown Drosera capensis, adelae, and binata before, and I think they'd grow well in a viv, but would get trampled by a larger frog like a tinc, and possibly eat a smaller frog like a thumbnail froglet.


Mature N. ampullaria gets a leaf span well over a meter wide. It's not small


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## brinkerh420 (Oct 2, 2011)

MATURE Nepenthes of any kind do, but it may take up to 20 years for a plant to mature. If you buy a smaller plant (probably the only kind available, unless you were trying to buy a nepenthes like miranda or alata, something along those lines), it will probably be a few years to become a problem, although as frogparty said, these plants do grow big.


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## EvilLost (Jan 10, 2011)

Nepenthes do not grow that fast and there are tons of variants that do not get bigger...


I have several growing in my chameleon free-range (granted only been growing them about 3 months) but they barely go anywhere....esp if you start with a (cheap) small plant, it will take ages to get to a size that would be a threat to your frogs...some variants don't have very big pictures (though I'd still be wary around thumbs)


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Once they go from basal rosette to vine they can grow several feet each year. I trim 3 or 4 feet off my ventrata each year. 

The smallest Nepenthes I have grown is Gymnaphora/izumaea.


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Oh yeah, I find it much cheaper and more rewarding to purchase cuttings of mature vines as opposed to seedlings or tissue culture rosettes. You'll lose far fewer plants and seedlings and cuttings both grow far better than tissue culture clones


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

frogparty said:


> I trim 3 or 4 feet off my ventrata each year.
> QUOTE]
> 
> What do you do with the cuttings?
> ...


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Most cuttings I get cheaply off eBay!

I give cuttings away, or toss them. Most people like rarer stuff besides ventrata


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## Robert.hallam (Oct 26, 2012)

Im sorry but honestly im tired of reading these types of misleading posts about tropical pitcher plants in terrariums. Look, it no secret that its VERY COMMON for dart frogs to lay their eggs inside the pitchers of MANY pitcher plants inlcuing all types of nepenthes that can be kept alive in terrariums. It has nothing to do with pitcher size or anything like that, pitcher plants are not looking to eat posion dart frogs....they dont even need to eat carnivorously at all, a few small insects a year is more then enough for them theyre not going to digest the bones of amphibians and that rumor should not be spread any longer. If YOU personally dont feel comfortable putting a pitcher plant in your terrarium with your frogs because of something you read online then dont do it, but dont go around telling people that its a horrible risk and that it will potentially kill their frogs because its not true. Feel free to discuss this with the owner of blackjungleterrariums and he will gladly give you the same answer.


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