# 77g Azureus Tank [Build Log]



## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Hey All -

After finishing my first ever vivarium (18x18x24 Exo Terra) that I was going to put my Azureus in, I ended up getting 4 Varaderos and putting them in it instead. It's much better suited for thumbs anyways, and they love it. BUT, now I have nowhere for my Azureus to go once they outgrow their growout tank (they're only 4mo old so I've got some time). After enjoying my first build so much and still having tons of ideas I wanted to try, I decided to build a new tank for the Azureus. A local fish store was having a huge blowout sale, so I picked up a nice new Visio 77g aquarium for 60% off. It's 36x15x31, and must be made of some serious glass because it's crazy heavy! 

I know such a tall tank won't be fully utilized by a terrestrial frog, but I wanted to create a display tank to show off some nice epiphyte bromeliads and orchids at the top 1/2 of the tank. I've gotten lots of inspiration from all your builds on here as well as others (I love Josh Moore's builds!), and I'm really excited to see how this turns out. Please feel free to comment with any ideas, advice or suggestions!

Here is the tank with my initial egg crate bottom. The first and only other tank I did had hydroballs, so this is my first time working with egg crate. I must say it was more enjoyable than I thought it would be. 



Shameless plug of my 1 year old wanting to help out while her brothers and sister were too busy playing Minecraft...



Skeleton concept of the bottom/ground profile. The corner will house a submerged pump for a waterfall. 



Bottom finished and covered with screen.



Then came the first more fun part... trying to arrange the background. I'm sure it will still change some, but this is my initial, basic concept. Sorry for the sun glare. I love the cork bark I was able to find... lots of chunky character pieces. I'll have more potting cups than shown. The blue tape is my idea for the waterfall flow down to the little ravine. Still working ideas on how to best make the descent... I'll most likely sculpt it out in the GS and add rocks. I'm also planning to get some large ghostwood pieces to span the tank and make 1 or 2 ledges for more surface space.



Here are some of the plants I've been growing to use in the tank. Andy's Orchids is only about a 20 min drive, so I may end up with a ton of orchids! I'm also planning on getting a lot of neoregelia bromeliads too. 



Lastly, the future inhabitants in their temporary apartment:



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That's as far as I've gotten so far. Next up is covering the whole back with black silicone. Then I'll add GS to the egg crate and sculpt the bottom. Bottom will go in, then I'll place the bark and start the GS background process. I still plan to get 1-2 nice pieces of ghostwood to stretch across the tank. 

My light should arrive today. I went with a 36-48" Current Satellite Plus PRO model. It kind of anxious to see how it will do as I was never able to find any solid advice for this size tank. The manuf assures me it will be more than enough. I'll also be picking up a MistKing Starter kit for this tank and the Exo Terra. And I'm fortunate enough to have forum member Dane building a custom lid for me too! Oh, I'll also be putting in at least 1 internal fan (probably mounted to the lid) for circulation for the orchids. Anyone have any advice on where to get whole kits? I know hydrophye sells them but is currently out.

Question:
How should I affix the cork bark to the siliconed back glass? I heard silicone to silicone is prone to fail, which was how I was thinking to glue on the cork bark. Should I just place them and use the GS to hold and affix them?

What timer would you all recommend for the fan? One that can run multiple times a day for short increments. 

Thanks for looking and getting this far! Again, and advice, comments or suggestions are welcome and appreciated!


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## craigrbns (Feb 1, 2016)

I do not have the experience most people on the forum have, but here is my two cents regarding the cork background based on the recent 180 gallon background I finished.

Consider using silicone to attach egg crate to the back of the tank, and then use GS to attach the foam to that. The egg crate I siliconed to my tank is def rock solid, and it will give surface area for the foam to attach to. I tried using silicone on the back of the large cork I used without success. The cork was not flat enough to allow the silicone to work. I ended up attaching the cork to the egg crate back ground using only the GS. It held even my largest pieces (12"X14") of cork without any issues.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Hey, thanks for the suggestion craigrbns. That makes great sense and I just may end up doing that. My only hesitation would be the extra 1/2" or so the egg crate would take up as I already have a shallow depth of only 15". BUT, if it's the difference of the background holding up better, it would be worth it. A few of the cork pieces are pretty big. 

Another note/update. My Current Satellite Plus PRO light came in yesterday and so far it works and looks great. Much narrower than I thought, but it seems to put out a ton of light on it's brightest setting. I haven't programmed it yet, but went through all the settings and I'm super excited to see it when the tank is planted. 

Next on the list to procure is my MistKing Starter system and a fan kit.


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## C los7 (Sep 24, 2015)

I'm my experience my azureus use the entire tank. Believe me they will hangout near the top just as much as the lower section.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Small Construction Update:

I took craigrbns' advice and "glued" some egg crate to the back glass with silicone, as well as on the right side. This stuff is pretty dang stuck on there, so I have much more confidence that the Great Stuff and cork will stick better now. Thanks for the advice!



I also rearranged the cork pieces on the back - man that's a lot of cork! 



I'm planning to try my hand at carving up a faux rock waterfall out of the GS where the void is to lead down into the divot in the bottom. I've seen lots of posts and various methods and am still debating which I should attempt. I know some people favor using Drylok for a more natural look, and others will paint the foam directly. My only hesitation with the Drylok is the whole pH thing and trying to neutralize it. 

My MistKing should arrive this week, and I should be picking up my custom lid as well. I ordered some ABG mix and a nice piece of ghost wood from NEHerp that will hopefully arrive soon as well. 

*Couple questions:*

- Any recommendations on creating the faux rock? I think carving up some Great Stuff (or other foam) will be the best, just not sure on the finish. I'm also debating if I should create it independently outside the tank, or load up the GS when I do the background and then carve it out of that in place... I know I can get a lot more detail if I do it outside the tank, but I'm not sure on how I would "glue" it in place on to the background. 

- I'm also not sure if I should affix the bottom and then the background, or background and then the bottom. I've noticed most people do their background first and then the bottom, but with my tank size and shape, it will be difficult to put the bottom in after the background is in place. Plus, it's hard to access anything at the bottom since I only have the open top. Ideas or suggestions?

Thanks!


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## austin (Dec 6, 2013)

Looking like it's going to be nice, I really like the dimensions of the tank!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

austin said:


> Looking like it's going to be nice, I really like the dimensions of the tank!


Thanks austin! I'm hoping it's going to be nice... cross your fingers! I'm trying new things with this build and sort of upping my game with better fixtures and systems than I did before, so I'm just hoping I don't mess them up! 

I like the tank as well, and I think once it's done it will look really cool... so long as it comes out like I imagine. It's just a pain to work on since it only has the top to access it, and it's really deep. Plus that glass bar in the middle of the top is quite annoying...


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## Lokirathehunter (Oct 16, 2015)

I can't see any of the photos


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Lokirathehunter said:


> I can't see any of the photos


Oh no, I have no idea why they wouldn't show up... I've never not been able to see them. I just used the external Photobucket link that seem to usually work. Sorry!


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Not sure how to say this but have you thought about how your going to maintain this viv?

I see you've already posted some grumblings that in my experience are only going to get worse.

If your tank was a front opening viv those dimensions would be amazing but since you only have access from the top your going to be hating life down the road maintaining and working on it.

I had a 40 gallon fish tank with the same dimensions (Tall) and I hated having to work on that. It was okay when I was building it because like you I had it on the floor. When I was done I put it on the stand and it was much harder to reach the bottom then my other tanks and that one wasn't nearly as tall as yours.

Another problem I had was with flow. I needed to get a stronger pump because the water on the bottom of the tank was not moving enough because of the strange dimensions.

In your case your going to have a similar problem with air flow unless your planning on having a fan with ducts that reach the bottom. This could result in constant problems with mold or plants rotting near the bottom.

Not saying it can't be done just going to be much more of a chore to do simple things like clipping an overgrown plant. Having to move the lights every time you feed etc etc.

The main thing is that once your done building, I'm assuming your going to put it on a stand of some kind? Once you do that how are you going to reach the bottom? Also I may have missed it but I don't think your drilling it so taking water out of it is going to suck or catching a sick frog or moving froglets or eggs.

Anyways, sorry to be a bummer but I'd hate to see you finish it and see all the problems when there is nothing you can do about it.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

cam1941 said:


> Not sure how to say this but have you thought about how your going to maintain this viv?
> 
> I see you've already posted some grumblings that in my experience are only going to get worse.
> 
> ...


Thanks cam, I really appreciate all the thought and comments. Most of those issues I have already thought about, some were new to me. While I knew all those would be problematic issues and potential headaches, it's nice to hear from someone who's been down that road already. What I think could be a minor issue might actually be a huge pain later on. 

Again, I have thought about most of those, and have tried to think of ways around them. I.e. I have access to the water pump behind the angled egg crate with the intention of being able to access it for maintenance as well as siphoning the water table if it gets too high. It will be somewhat of a chore, but I have the same situation with my 30g and it's not bad at all. It will be on a piece of furniture (kitchen hutch) and the top will be about 7' high when done. I plan to use a step ladder when I need to access it. Again, probably a pain to routinely do but one I'm prepared to live with. Yeah, I'll have to take the light off when I open the tank to feed, but I'm already doing that with their grow out tank. Trimming plants will be a pain though, but hopefully that will be spread out enough to not be a big issue. 

I'm planning on putting at least one fan in the top corner of the tank to blow across the background for the plants to air out. I supposed it would be easy enough to add another one angled down to blow across the bottom of the tank. I hadn't thought about that, so thank you. 

Luckily, I have 2 very experienced local dart keepers that are close by and are planning to come over so I can get some specific advice and pointers for my tanks. I'm hoping issues just like you mentioned will be brought up and hopefully figured out. 

One idea I've been thinking about is maybe getting the front glass taken out and replacing it with an operable system. I think that would be HUGE with all the stuff you mentioned, but I'm not sure how and where to go about doing that, or how possible it is. I supposed anything is possible if I can find someone that can do it.


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Cool Josh yeah, since I've had the experience I wouldn't have felt right not saying anything. I also had that thick piece of glass in the middle just like your tank. It must be something they do for support for these tall tanks.

Like I said, I'm sure it can be done just wanted to make sure you knew about some of the pitfalls I encountered. Also I figured if I said something now you would still have time to sell it to Kobe since he is looking for something to do with his time; would be perfect for him 

The dimensions are perfect for a beautiful display, so if you could find someone who could convert that to a front opening viv that would be a huge added bonus. Convenience and aesthetics... Perfect. 

Since your so close Andy's you could easily make it orchid heavy. You never hear people complaining about having to trim those back. They are like, grow wherever you want, just grow lol

Glad I said something, to me whats the point using this forum if not to share experience's to help each other out. 

Good luck and enjoy the build while you can! As you know, you will be fiending for more once its done


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

You're right on all accounts cam - you're advice is truly appreciated, as is all on this forum. That's the main reason I posted the build log - to get pointers and advice. Definitely not to show off since there are so many much more amazing builds on here! 

I've already contacted someone who I'm hoping can make that front panel conversion for me. I think that would make it like night and day for functionality and I'm kinda kicking myself that I hadn't thought of it earlier. At least I'm still early enough to get it done with no negative impact. 

Yeah, Andys being so close it amazing and scary in that I could spend hundreds of dollars there and still want more! My main plan was to fill the top of this higher tank with neoregelias and orchids since I think those are both such cool and showy plants. I've got contacts from this board that I'll be buying more Neos from and I've already got 2 orchids in my varadero tank and at least 4 that will be going in this one. Regardless of the tank, I'm super excited to get it planted!


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## nyskiffie (Mar 6, 2016)

Sorry if you already mentioned this but how will you be lighting this viv? Very similar height to mine so I'm curious.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

nyskiffie said:


> Sorry if you already mentioned this but how will you be lighting this viv? Very similar height to mine so I'm curious.


Hi nyskiffie -

I purchased a Current Satellite+ Pro light (link) and am hoping it will be enough. I'd read a lot of mixed reviews on whether or not it would be enough for this size (not mixed reviews on the light itself, it seems to be well rated), but couldn't find a straight answer so I just went ahead and got it since I really liked the features and price point compared to others that offered the same. The manufacturer's rep assured me it would be more than enough light, so I'm hoping that wasn't just a sales pitch! I did hook it up when it arrived and it looks plenty bright. I think worst case scenario is if I see plants at the bottom not seeming to get enough light, I might buy an LED spot or two to address that. 

I'm also going to have to carefully plan out the location of all the epiphytes I'm wanting to put on the background to that they don't create too many shadows for the plants in the substrate. I think if I place my light at the front of the tank it should penetrate most everything. It will be some trial and error I'm sure.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Quick update:

I'd been anxiously brewing over the pros and cons of the fixed aquarium tank and the cons were just too much. I put a lot more thought into what cam was saying and decided that not having a front access would just be too limiting and too much of a pain. So, I decided to put my head down, bite the bullet and buy an Exo Terra.



Awesomely enough, the dimensions are close enough that I can still use most everything I had already worked on and planned to use. The new Exo tank is a bit bigger, which is a plus. But, I already have much more peace of mind knowing how much easier the build and maintenance will be with the front access. Now I need to sell the old tank... any buyers?? 

I also figured out how I wanted to do the faux rocks and waterfall, so I tried my hand at the Drylok method and am pretty pleased with the results. Basically I just sprayed a ton of GS, carved it up, 2 coats of Drylok and then drybrushed several layers of non-toxic acrylic paint from Michael's. The research I did seemed to conclude that the Drylok will be enough on it's own without any need to cure or be sealed. I still might look for a frog-safe clear coat sealer if there is such a thing... anyone recommendations??

Here are some pics of the process. I think once it's all planted the rocks will look pretty realistic (hopefully!). I'll do the same thing with the waterfall, carved from GS when I do the background. 

Great Stuff (I added more than is shown)


Carved up


1st coat of Drylok (added in Quikrete coloring)


2nd coat of Drylock


Last few coats of the drybrushing


Final result


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Glad I could help... 

Your rocks look good... I love using Drylok and will be using it in an upcoming project. 

Drylok is completely inert when dry and does not need to be treated like concrete does. Not sure if you thought that from what you wrote but I've seen that a few times recently around so I thought I would add that here.

If you don't want to have to seal it all you have to do is mix it with the quickrette, like you did for the base coat, on all subsequent dry brush coats ending with plain old white Drylok as your final drybrush coat. That way you don't have to use the acrylics and or worry about having to seal it.

It will look better then sealing it because whatever ever you seal it with will add a somewhat glossy finish, even if you use a non gloss, while the way the Drylok looks by itself looks much more natural.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

cam1941 said:


> Glad I could help...
> 
> Your rocks look good... I love using Drylok and will be using it in an upcoming project.
> 
> ...


Thank you once again, cam, for your advice!

I was under the impression that Drylok _did not_ need to cure like cement does, so thank you for confirming that. The can said to use 2 coats, so I did a full base coat with the dark Quikcrete dye, and then a 2nd full coat with a lighter (added less) Quikcrete dye. After that, I just drybrushed on acrylic paint. Is the the correct application? I know I could have just used lighter mixes of Drylok, but I figured the paint would be easier, quicker, and less build up. Will I still need to seal it because of using the paint in that order? Do you know of any good matte sealers? I'd rather have a semi-glossy finish than have it break down or be unsafe. 

Thanks cam! You've been a huge help!


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## waterbed fred (Jan 10, 2010)

Looking great!!! I can't wait to see it completed!!!!


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

No problem, I personally use a base coat of plain old Drylok to really ensure its completely sealed and waterproof. Anything you use to tint it could weaken its waterproof properties depending on how much you add so I do that just as a precaution. In your case I wouldn’t worry about it as your not sealing a pond that needs to be completely water tight; yours is part of the false bottom. 

The only thing that could be a problem for you is the plain acrylic. You could have used the acrylic to tint the Drylok by the way although I use Quikcrete like you did. The acrylic will probably not last unprotected, just a question of how long, so it will definitely need to be sealed. Unfortunately I don’t know of a sealer that I personally have used and can recommend but I think Dendro Dave mentioned one recently in his Dryad thread. I think its a rattle can though which could be a huge pain in the ass for you considering your rocks are attached to your false bottom. 

In my experience the Drylok is just as easy to work with as any paint. Even though its really thick, as you know with dry brushing, you use so little that it is no longer thick and drys really fast.

Edit: Also keep in mind that if you seal it you could just have used acrylic paints from the beginning, which would have saved you the cost of the Drylok. 



Gibbs.JP said:


> Thank you once again, cam, for your advice!
> 
> I was under the impression that Drylok _did not_ need to cure like cement does, so thank you for confirming that. The can said to use 2 coats, so I did a full base coat with the dark Quikcrete dye, and then a 2nd full coat with a lighter (added less) Quikcrete dye. After that, I just drybrushed on acrylic paint. Is the the correct application? I know I could have just used lighter mixes of Drylok, but I figured the paint would be easier, quicker, and less build up. Will I still need to seal it because of using the paint in that order? Do you know of any good matte sealers? I'd rather have a semi-glossy finish than have it break down or be unsafe.
> 
> Thanks cam! You've been a huge help!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

waterbed fred said:


> Looking great!!! I can't wait to see it completed!!!!


You and me both, Fred! Thanks


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

cam1941 said:


> In my experience the Drylok is just as easy to work with as any paint. Even though its really thick, as you know with dry brushing, you use so little that it is no longer thick and drys really fast.
> 
> Edit: Also keep in mind that if you seal it you could just have used acrylic paints from the beginning, which would have saved you the cost of the Drylok.


I think I'm out a total of about $10 for the Drylok AND the paints, so no biggie there. I'll check out DD's post and look for the sealer. Thanks again cam!

I'm planning to do the same rock theme for the waterfall, and was thinking of coating it first with 2 coats of plain Drylok and then I can drybrush with more Drylok. Because this part will be constantly saturated with water, I want to make sure it's waterproof. If I can find that sealer and it works well, I'll probably add that just to double it up on waterproofing.


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## ruairidh_ (Feb 9, 2016)

Quick question, if the paint is going to be a problem couldn't you just drylok over it? 

Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

ruairidh_ said:


> Quick question, if the paint is going to be a problem couldn't you just drylok over it?
> 
> Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk


Yeah, I think that would be an option. I've been reading a lot of mixed opinions on the longevity and durability of just acrylic paint. I think the ideal way would be to add the acrylic into the drylok and paint that way. I've heard several testimonies that just the acrylic will hold up just fine too, so it's hard to know what to believe. Of course every condition is always different so what works for one might not work for another. I think I'll leave it on this one since it won't be constantly saturated, and use more drylok on the waterfall rocks.


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## K3viin128 (May 3, 2016)

Man those rocks are really looking good... Nice work. And glad to see you went exo terra... Tall tank like the previous sure would be hard to access for plant trimming and other stuff... Don't forget to FF proof front vent


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

K3viin128 said:


> Man those rocks are really looking good... Nice work. And glad to see you went exo terra... Tall tank like the previous sure would be hard to access for plant trimming and other stuff... Don't forget to FF proof front vent


Thanks Kevin! I'm glad I ended up getting the Exo Terra as well... that other tank would have been such a pain, and probably led me to despise it! Good call on proofing the vent, I didn't think about that. I have a smaller Exo Terra for my varadero and didn't FF proof it, but I've had little to no escapees that I've seen. Might as well do this one though since it's all open.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Well, here we go again... Ready to start version 2.0! 

I think I've got about everything I need, minus a pump for the waterfall. Going to be choosing one and ordering this coming week. Now it's time to get the back and side glass siliconed in and add egg crate for the GS to stick to. Then the fun part of doing the GS and cork background! Gonna spray extra GS for the faux rock waterfall and coat with lots of Drylok. Brown silicone and coco fiber will cover the rest of the GS outside the cork. Once that's in, I'm gonna see how to best place the ghostwood. ABG mix is ready to go. After that it's time to plant! Man, I've got so many great ones, it's gonna be hard choosing which go and where to put them. But, that's the fun part!







I'm excited. Although, I'll probably have to wait til next week since apparently there's some special "mom day" or something tomorrow that my wife thinks we should celebrate


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## roundfrog (Jan 27, 2016)

That's gonna look awesome. How long did it take for your neherp order to ship. I've had recent problems: order not shipping, no contact, no tracking info, and then ups took the package off the porch after i had been delivered when no one was home. They still haven't tracked it down.


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## Lokirathehunter (Oct 16, 2015)

Please don't use that silicone!! It has mold inhibitors in it!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

roundfrog said:


> That's gonna look awesome. How long did it take for your neherp order to ship. I've had recent problems: order not shipping, no contact, no tracking info, and then ups took the package off the porch after i had been delivered when no one was home. They still haven't tracked it down.


Thanks roundfrog - I know NEHerp is still pretty behind in their processing since Mike and Jessica just had their baby, but hopefully they are catching up. I pretty much expect anything I get from there to take a couple weeks, so I won't order anything I need ASAP until they are back on track. They are pretty good about sending a tracking number email when they get your package out though. That sucks about your package! I wonder why UPS would take the package back??



Lokirathehunter said:


> Please don't use that silicone!! It has mold inhibitors in it!


Hey Lokira - I've read sooooooooooooo many posts about silicone and the majority consensus seems to say that GE II is ok. GE I is better, but I can't get it in any color other than clear and I hate how that looks when there are inevitable spots of missing coco fiber. Most posts I read seemed to say that no one's really observed any long term negative effects as of yet with the GE II. I used it in my other tank with no issues so far. I'm just trusting that the what I gathered from people's responses is correct!


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## Lokirathehunter (Oct 16, 2015)

Ah, ok! I think I read something about it a few years ago, but if it's been tested with no issues, I may start using it!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Thanks though, Lokira! Your post probably would have freaked me out had I not already researched which types of silicone are ok so much. Many people have sworn that GE II is totally fine, and they've had it set in their fish tanks and vivariums for years with no harmful side effects they've seen. Breeding and healthy offspring included. Good lookin' out though!


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## baskis (Jun 7, 2015)

Lokirathehunter said:


> Ah, ok! I think I read something about it a few years ago, but if it's been tested with no issues, I may start using it!


What have you been using in your tanks? I thought ge 2 was the standard


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## Steuss (Apr 20, 2016)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Yeah, I think that would be an option. I've been reading a lot of mixed opinions on the longevity and durability of just acrylic paint. I think the ideal way would be to add the acrylic into the drylok and paint that way. I've heard several testimonies that just the acrylic will hold up just fine too, so it's hard to know what to believe. Of course every condition is always different so what works for one might not work for another. I think I'll leave it on this one since it won't be constantly saturated, and use more drylok on the waterfall rocks.


FWIW, my understanding is that while acrylic is water resistant, it isn't truly water-proof, and has micro-pores that can allow for water transfer if left in constant contact with water, or for prolonged periods. 

What potentially happens is the water can gradually get between the acrylic, and whatever the acrylic was painted onto (i.e. foam, epoxy, etc.). When this occurs, it can cause the acrylic to slowly separate from the object it's painted on -- especially if the object it's painted on is non-porous. Once that small separation occurs, it's easy for tears, etc. to form on the thin layer of acrylic that is now essentially free-floating.

If it isn't going to be in constant and/or extended contact with water, you should be ok without adding any type of additional sealant/water-proofing.

Of course, that's just my understanding, so caveat emptor, and all that Latin jazz.


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## Ryandean360 (Apr 29, 2016)

Hey, was just wondering how many coats of drylok you decided to go with? I'm currently on a 20 gal, and I've used 3 coats painted on and went extra heavy around my waterfall feature. You think that's enough?


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## Wy Renegade (Feb 15, 2012)

Tagging in to follow along, those rocks look great! A quick question if you don't mind. Does the DryLoc actually seal the foam so water cannot penetrate or does it only make it more moisture resistant? And in regards to the GE II, I've used it in aquariums without issue, so you should be good.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Ryandean360 said:


> Hey, was just wondering how many coats of drylok you decided to go with? I'm currently on a 20 gal, and I've used 3 coats painted on and went extra heavy around my waterfall feature. You think that's enough?


Ryan -
I used 2 coats of Drylok on the rocks shown and then put the acrylic over that. I was just going by the label which said 2 coats. I think for the waterfall rocks I'll do 2-3 coats of plain Drylok, and then add paint to the Drylok for the drybrushing. I think that might be the safest bet. 

Sounds like your 3 heavy coats should be fine.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Wy Renegade said:


> Tagging in to follow along, those rocks look great! A quick question if you don't mind. Does the DryLoc actually seal the foam so water cannot penetrate or does it only make it more moisture resistant? And in regards to the GE II, I've used it in aquariums without issue, so you should be good.


Thanks... That was my first try, so I'm hoping my background rocks will look even better. I think I might do less white highlights this time around...

I'm not totally sure if it seals it or not. The label says it "provides a waterproof coating" and "excludes leaks due to cracking of the surface". I think it just add a waterproof coating over the foam is all. Not sure if that answers your question or not, sorry.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Update:

Got the back and sides covered in black silicone, then added the egg crate to help the GS stick. Also added the waterfall sectional divider. I cut a hole at the bottom for the water to pass through from under the false bottom and added window screen as a pre-filter of sorts. I'll also add more filter media (sponge) and hopefully that will keep most of the debris out of the pump. _*Any thoughts? Do I need more/better filtration to keep the pump from mucking up?*_ I think that's why my others keep failing (and they were cheap ones initially). I siliconed all around the sectional divider so the water can only pass through the filtered area.

I also have a diamond bit drill set on it's way so I can drill the top glass for my mistking nozzles and I'm debating drilling the side for a drainage bulkhead. I've never drilled glass before and I can practice on the top pieces since they are cheap and readily available from Home Depot, but I can't afford to mess up on the tank... 







I also finished the false bottom piece. Not sure I like the aquarium stones, but I'm hoping it will look better once it's in and planted with some aquatic plants.



Thoughts and advice is always welcomed and appreciated!


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## tim.v.u (May 8, 2016)

Looking good mate! I'd realy like to know how you get the shape and the colours so realistic! Maby I can try it out in my viv's


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## ruairidh_ (Feb 9, 2016)

Maybe filtration foam on the side with the pump?

Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

tim.v.u said:


> Looking good mate! I'd realy like to know how you get the shape and the colours so realistic! Maby I can try it out in my viv's


Thanks! For the rocks, it was really just carving the GS until I thought it looked kind of "rocky" and then the painting part was really simple. If you look higher up in the pictures, you can see the carved foam before it's covered in Drylok and painted. Then just cover it in Drylok and drybrush it until you like it. Super easy!



ruairidh_ said:


> Maybe filtration foam on the side with the pump?


Yeah, I was planning to have some sponge filter on the inside of the screen and probably have it wrap all around the pump. I did the same thing with my current setup and I think it was still getting muck in the pump causing it to fail, so I was wondering if there was a better way.


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## Steuss (Apr 20, 2016)

For the pump... if you are feeling like undertaking a little engineering project, of sorts. You could use an inline pump, instead of a submerged pump. That way, you can create some sort of filter (either out of PVC, or maybe a Tupperware container -- anything that can be made to be water-tight) before it hits the pump. With a big enough filter, and the right media combo, your pump should last for a really long time (especially since you'd be eliminating not only particulate wear, but you shouldn't have the backpreasure associated with having the pump in front of filtration), and you'd probably only have to replace the filter media once every 3-6 months -- possibly longer if the filter was big enough.

Just a random brainstorm (that should be treated as such).


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Steuss said:


> For the pump... if you are feeling like undertaking a little engineering project, of sorts. You could use an inline pump, instead of a submerged pump. That way, you can create some sort of filter (either out of PVC, or maybe a Tupperware container -- anything that can be made to be water-tight) before it hits the pump. With a big enough filter, and the right media combo, your pump should last for a really long time (especially since you'd be eliminating not only particulate wear, but you shouldn't have the backpreasure associated with having the pump in front of filtration), and you'd probably only have to replace the filter media once every 3-6 months -- possibly longer if the filter was big enough.
> 
> Just a random brainstorm (that should be treated as such).


Hmm... sounds very interesting. I don't fully understand the concept, but I'll do some research on inline pumps and see if I can figure out something. I'm hoping to fully utilize the K.I.S.S. method since I certainly fall under the last letter!


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## Steuss (Apr 20, 2016)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Hmm... sounds very interesting. I don't fully understand the concept, but I'll do some research on inline pumps and see if I can figure out something. I'm hoping to fully utilize the K.I.S.S. method since I certainly fall under the last letter!


I just spent some time looking at inline pumps. Even if you ended up being able to build a cheap filter (i.e. $20-ish) it'd end up costing just about as much just to buy a small canister filter. Also looks like most inline pumps have a GPH output that would be far too much for this application.

In other words... all I did was use up some board bandwidth with my brainstorm.

Don't mind me. _*whistling as I walk away*_


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

As far as drilling glass I found it very easy for a first timer. I'm working on my first viv now and have never cut or drilled glass before. I just jumped right in. I used a battery powered drill and I turned it way down so if it caught during drilling it just stopped. Very light on the trigger. I used playdough to make a damn to put water in to keep everything cool during drilling. Most important part is probably making sure to start out at 45° angle so the bit doesn't wander. And slow down when you're about to break through the other side. I used masking tape on the other side to help with chipping.

All in all I think it was pretty simple.

Sent from my LGMS631 using Tapatalk


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## newebb (Mar 26, 2016)

Apparently my first post didnt go through , I was just saying I thought you did a great job on those rocks. Can't wait to see it finished

Sent from my LGMS631 using Tapatalk


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

newebb said:


> As far as drilling glass I found it very easy for a first timer. I'm working on my first viv now and have never cut or drilled glass before. I just jumped right in. I used a battery powered drill and I turned it way down so if it caught during drilling it just stopped. Very light on the trigger. I used playdough to make a damn to put water in to keep everything cool during drilling. Most important part is probably making sure to start out at 45° angle so the bit doesn't wander. And slow down when you're about to break through the other side. I used masking tape on the other side to help with chipping.
> 
> All in all I think it was pretty simple.
> 
> Sent from my LGMS631 using Tapatalk





newebb said:


> Apparently my first post didnt go through , I was just saying I thought you did a great job on those rocks. Can't wait to see it finished
> 
> Sent from my LGMS631 using Tapatalk


Hey, thanks newebb. I can't wait to see it finished either! I'm trying though to be patient and let everything settle, cure, harden, solidify and not rush anything. That's the hardest part!

Thanks for the advice on the drilling. I've watched several videos and was planning to incorporate all those things you mentioned, except for the masking tape which is a great idea. Thanks!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Big weekend! I finally had a good chunk of time to work on this thing on Memorial Day, so I got crackin'! 

Last week I got the water pump figured out with some advice from you all. I'm using a small 80gph external canister filter that I bought for my other tank but didn't end up using. This is not where it will go obviously, but I got it working how I wanted and I think it will do the trick! I bought my bulkheads, fittings and tubing, so at some point I'll have to start drilling  I drilled some glass for the lid to fit the mistking nozzles, but that was cheap and easy to replace... the tank, not so much. I'm just gonna take my time... even it takes an hour per hole! I'll do an inlet hose bulkhead, output hose bulkhead, and then on the opposite side and drainage bulkhead.



Now, with my day off - time for the background! 

Got cork? 


I started with the side/edges since I had a specific idea how I wanted them to look. The black silicone is a little more prevalent than I was wanting, but I think it still looks good. I spent a couple hours just scraping excess silicone off the glass and cork!




Next, I arranged the cork pieces and siliconed them in place before adding the GS. Also got the plant cups where I thought would work and ran a drain tube for them.


1st can of GS emptied on round 1. 




Next up is to fill in the rest of the empty space with more GS. I'lll also add a couple more plant cups and then fill over them. Then I'll probably start carving/shaving the background foam, and then start piling on more GS to form the waterfall shape. Then I'll probably spend forever carving that up to make the waterfall "rocks".

Stay tuned


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Well, we've hit a minor setback. 



Yeah, that happened. I'm totally bummed. I had the tank on it's side (not the first time), and when I was carefully closing the top door hanging down, when it got to the closed position and touched the frame, the small plastic hinge pin broke and the whole door came crashing down on the open one and shattered it. So lame! I'm not sure why they use such a weak pin on the hinge - definitely a design flaw in my opinion. Those big doors aren't light, and I'm surprised they used plastic on those. 



I've got an email in to Exo Terra and will call my local LLL Reptile where I bought it and see if it's covered under the warranty. I've only had it like a month. Hopefully between those 2 we'll get it sorted out and a new pair of doors on their way ASAP. In the meantime I'll keep working on the tank. Just carving out all the foam now.

Anyone have any comments on working with Exo Terra on replacement parts or warranties? TIA.


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## Blueper (Feb 27, 2016)

Damn. That hurts.
I had a 40 gal on its side, trying to pull Velcro off the the glass with pliers and dropped the pliers. They shattered the side glass it was sitting on. Felt like getting kicked in the stomach for a second.
Hopefully they work with you at least a little so you don't take a big hit. At least it was a door and not one of the inner panels.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Blueper said:


> Damn. That hurts.
> I had a 40 gal on its side, trying to pull Velcro off the the glass with pliers and dropped the pliers. They shattered the side glass it was sitting on. Felt like getting kicked in the stomach for a second.
> Hopefully they work with you at least a little so you don't take a big hit. At least it was a door and not one of the inner panels.


That's exactly what it felt like... and I watched it fall in slow motion until the sound of glass shattering brought me into the sad reality. 

I called the place I got it, and the worst case scenario is I can order new doors for like $26/ea and a little shipping. So, it's not the end of the world by any means, but still bites. 

I'm still nervous about drilling the tank, but hopefully this incident will cover the bad luck on this tank!


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## waterbed fred (Jan 10, 2010)

What a bummer!!! But it could have been worse.....WAY worse!!!
Is there anything in the in the instructions that states don't lay or transport
these on their sides?? That seems like a lot of weight to put on the load-bearing bottom hinge.......just sayin'.....


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Indeed fred, it could have been worse. I heard back from Hagen/Exo Terra and they said to return it to the store I got it from. I called the store previously before hearing from Hagen, and they said I could order new doors at $26/ea + minor shipping. So, looks like I'm out about $60, but all in all that's not too bad. I don't think there were any "instructions" or any documents that came with the tank saying how to/not to handle it. 

Although, it's been kinda nice with the doors off and not having to worry about them when working on it... note to self for future builds 

Here is the background all foamed and mostly carved. I still might tinker around with minor carving details, but I'm trying not to get too caught up in that since I know the silicone and fiber will cover up any detail work. I'm anxious to get it all slathered and covered. The ghostwood piece is just sitting there... I haven't "glued" it in yet. This thing is still evolving as I go.

FTS:




I'm curious to see how the waterfall will pan out. I realized once I laid the foam that it was much steeper than I thought. I ended up carving the channel a lot deeper and more narrow than I originally was thinking, hoping the water will stay more contained. I'm hoping it will look ok once I get it all painted. 





I still am not 100% sure on what to do at the bottom where it will spill into the void in the bottom. I'll most likely end up adding more foam to create a spillway leading into it... kinda designing that as I go 

Next up is to slap 3 coats of plain Drylok on the waterfall for testing. Then I'll have to drill the tank for the filter tubes!  I can then test the water's flow and stream to make sure it goes how I want. If not, I can still add more foam to adjust before I finish painting it. Then the silicone and coco fiber treatment on the rest. Then planting!


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## dentex (Apr 22, 2016)

Great job with this bg! And the false rocks already finished are really good.
Once finished, all will be awesome for sure.

Just a thought on the waterfall: it seems that the carving where the water will flow in, it's a bit narrow. But maybe it's just me.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

dentex said:


> Great job with this bg! And the false rocks already finished are really good.
> Once finished, all will be awesome for sure.
> 
> Just a thought on the waterfall: it seems that the carving where the water will flow in, it's a bit narrow. But maybe it's just me.


Thanks dentex. You're right, it is pretty narrow. You made me think... I think I might should widen it since the flow volume, even if slow, might take up the whole gully since it's so narrow. I should have enough room to widen it some, so thanks!!


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## dentex (Apr 22, 2016)

You're more than welcome! 

I think that happens that when looking and looking again at your own stuff, you can kinda get "tired" and don't notice some details. This is why maybe before putting into place everything related to bg, hardscape, etc, it's better to leave all there overnight and take a fresh look in the morning. I'll do like this with my build.


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## Ryandean360 (Apr 29, 2016)

That looks super awesome, and as for where water may spill into the viv, if you mean down by the pond I agree, you should definitely just build up more foam. Can't wait to see this done though, this looks awesome. Nice and big!


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## entropyhappens (May 25, 2016)

Beautiful job on this so far, I'm working on the exact same tank and seeing your background makes me wish I had bought some cork. I wouldn't worry about getting too much detail in the foam background. I spent lots of time carving, and the majority of detail all got covered up. Focus on the big details!

If it makes you feel better I had the same luck with my glass doors. One shattered on me and it was not a good feeling at all. On the bright side, I realized that I can make the doors easily removable by simply drilling the top hinge pin pocket completely out. By slipping an appropriately sized socket cap screw through to serve as the pin, I can easily remove the doors in seconds!

Feel free to check my build log out in the member's viv's section.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Thanks entropyhappens - I'll have to check out your hinge pin fix... did you mention it in your post? I didn't see anything about it. 

-------

Update: Woohoo! 

Tank drilling was a success! No cracks or mishaps! Got the two bulkheads for the canister filter tubes drilled and installed, and it all worked out great! Assuming it works lol. Still have to test it.



Ball valve in the output tube to regulate the flow.


The reflection makes it a little harder to see, but here is the intake tube sitting at the bottom in the back corner that will be submerged. 


I've got one coat of Drylok on the waterfall, so I'll add another coat or two and then test the waterfall to see if it runs the fall ok. If not, I can still add more foam or carve before I get to painting the rocks. 

More good news. LLL Reptile called me after looking into the broken doors, and they're having 2 new doors shipped this week at no charge! Sweet! Needless to say, I'll leave those off until the tank is resting soundly on it's new home and not to be moved again


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Lokirathehunter said:


> Please don't use that silicone!! It has mold inhibitors in it!


Many have used it with no ill effects and have even had very successful breeding.


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Ball valve in the output tube to regulate the flow.
> 
> 
> The reflection makes it a little harder to see, but here is the intake tube sitting at the bottom in the back corner that will be submerged.


I use the Tom's Rapids canister filter as well though I added better media to mine. 
I use some of the ceramic things that came with it but I put this in there since it carries a better bio load. You might not need it since you don't have fish but I have fish in mine.









This here is pretty much the same stuff 









The only thing I can see going wrong is the basket filter on the intake getting clogged and you might not be able to reach it. Also if you're not separating the drainage and the water then I wonder how well the filter will keep it clean. 
I have pretty much the same setup with a ball valve.

Anyway it's looking great!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> I use the Tom's Rapids canister filter as well though I added better media to mine.
> I use some of the ceramic things that came with it but I put this in there since it carries a better bio load. You might not need it since you don't have fish but I have fish in mine.
> 
> The only thing I can see going wrong is the basket filter on the intake getting clogged and you might not be able to reach it. Also if you're not separating the drainage and the water then I wonder how well the filter will keep it clean.
> ...


Thanks Brandon. Your video helped me figure out the filter set up, so I thank you for that. Same with the ball valve idea! Also, thanks for mentioning the better filter media... I might give it a try. The water shouldn't get_* too *_dirty being it's just the drainage beneath the false bottom, but better filtration is always nice. 

I can still access the intake tube with the basket filter on the end, and left off siliconing a window to be able to see down there if it gets too clogged. So, it's doable. 

Also, what did you mean by "not separating the drainage and the water"? Sorry, not following that part 

Thanks for the kind words and advice though!


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Thanks Brandon. Your video helped me figure out the filter set up, so I thank you for that. Same with the ball valve idea! Also, thanks for mentioning the better filter media... I might give it a try. The water shouldn't get_* too *_dirty being it's just the drainage beneath the false bottom, but better filtration is always nice.
> 
> I can still access the intake tube with the basket filter on the end, and left off siliconing a window to be able to see down there if it gets too clogged. So, it's doable.
> 
> ...


What I meant was having a pathway just for the water separating it from the drainage water.
Some build channels just for this purpose.
When the water goes through the soil and everything it turns brown but that might not be too bad of an issue because there is a such thing as tannin water and in the wild a little pot like that would have tannins it wouldn't be clear

Sent from my Samsung GALAXY Note4 using Tapatalk


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

DragonSpirit1185 said:


> What I meant was having a pathway just for the water separating it from the drainage water.
> Some build channels just for this purpose.
> When the water goes through the soil and everything it turns brown but that might not be too bad of an issue because there is a such thing as tannin water and in the wild a little pot like that would have tannins it wouldn't be clear
> 
> Sent from my Samsung GALAXY Note4 using Tapatalk


Oh, gotcha. Yeah, too late to do any of that now! I don't mind tannins. There shouldn't be a whole lot anyways with just the ABG and runoff from the coco fiber on the walls. There aren't any tannin-heavy wood pieces in here. Plus, the activated carbon in the filter will help reduce the tannins somewhat, but all in all, I don't mind a little tea colored water


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## DragonSpirit1185 (Dec 6, 2010)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Oh, gotcha. Yeah, too late to do any of that now! I don't mind tannins. There shouldn't be a whole lot anyways with just the ABG and runoff from the coco fiber on the walls. There aren't any tannin-heavy wood pieces in here. Plus, the activated carbon in the filter will help reduce the tannins somewhat, but all in all, I don't mind a little tea colored water


I use ABG in all my vivs and all the drainage water is indeed brown

Sent from my Samsung GALAXY Note4 using Tapatalk


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## Jay2 (May 19, 2016)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Big weekend! I finally had a good chunk of time to work on this thing on Memorial Day, so I got crackin'!
> 
> Last week I got the water pump figured out with some advice from you all. I'm using a small 80gph external canister filter that I bought for my other tank but didn't end up using. This is not where it will go obviously, but I got it working how I wanted and I think it will do the trick! I bought my bulkheads, fittings and tubing, so at some point I'll have to start drilling  I drilled some glass for the lid to fit the mistking nozzles, but that was cheap and easy to replace... the tank, not so much. I'm just gonna take my time... even it takes an hour per hole! I'll do an inlet hose bulkhead, output hose bulkhead, and then on the opposite side and drainage bulkhead.
> 
> ...



Silly question but how did you fixate the drainage for the pots? Is it as straight forward as attaching a tube to the bottom of each pot and gluing the tube in place?
Would you happen to have any pictures?

Great log and thanks for all the help!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Jay2 said:


> Silly question but how did you fixate the drainage for the pots? Is it as straight forward as attaching a tube to the bottom of each pot and gluing the tube in place?
> Would you happen to have any pictures?
> 
> Great log and thanks for all the help!


Hi Jay -

Thanks for showing interest in my build. As for the net cups, I really didn't connect them in any way before spraying on the Great Stuff all around them. Once the GS starts to cover and surround them, you can kinda position them a little more as it's drying. Those pictures above show the tank resting on it's back, so all the cork and cups are just sitting there. I siliconed the cork down previous to spraying the GS, but not the cups.

The drain tubes are little 1/4" (I think... maybe 3/16") vinyl tubes from Home Depot. It's like $3 for 10' of it. One some of the cups, I drilled a hole for the tube to fit tightly into, at the center of the cup where there was a solid circle of plastic to drill. This was a poor design on my part, as once the cups are in and angled against the background, the tube is now in the center of the cup and up from the lowest point on the cup. If that makes sense. On other cups that didn't have that center circle of plastic to drill (different brands), I just put the hose in between the little "bars" of the cup. After set in the background, the tubes on these cups are at the perfect lowest point to drain. See the diagram below... this is how I should have done them all for the best drainage.



As far as fixing the tubing, you don't necessarily have to. The tubing I used was stocked and stored rolled up, so it was constantly trying to bend and curve, which was a nuisance. A couple particularly curved hose segments I actually did silicone down to get it to stay. Other than that you can just cover it all in GS and it won't matter, so long as it's a straight shot down into the false bottom to drain. 

Hopefully that all made sense and I didn't just confuse you even more!


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## Andrew Lee (Jan 21, 2014)

Oh man this is exciting! Sorry about the tank. Hope you can find something to easily replace it. You know on the bright side, your temporary ten gallon is something better than I can make!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Andrew Lee said:


> Oh man this is exciting! Sorry about the tank. Hope you can find something to easily replace it. You know on the bright side, your temporary ten gallon is something better than I can make!


Thanks Andrew! It certainly is keeping me on my toes. I thought I had it all planned out and then things keep popping up that throw me for a loop. Changing tanks, doors breaking, pumps not working... it's all fun and I'm learning a bunch as I go. All things that will help me on my next build!! 

Man I do need to hurry up and finish this one though because those guys are growing so quick and will outgrow that 10g soon!


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## Jay2 (May 19, 2016)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Hi Jay -
> 
> Thanks for showing interest in my build. As for the net cups, I really didn't connect them in any way before spraying on the Great Stuff all around them. Once the GS starts to cover and surround them, you can kinda position them a little more as it's drying. Those pictures above show the tank resting on it's back, so all the cork and cups are just sitting there. I siliconed the cork down previous to spraying the GS, but not the cups.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much for this! It definitely answered my question!

Another question, when you used the GS for the carved rocks did you have air holes/pockets? I'm working on my first viv and experimenting w/ GS but there seems to be a lot little and some larger holes... any way to get around this? 
I intend on creating a water feature also but the holes are making it a little tougher.

Thanks again!


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## kblack3 (Mar 9, 2015)

For the drainage tubing is it safe to use drip line? I have an abundance of that stuff


American Dad Living The American Dream


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## dennis2311 (Feb 11, 2016)

Hi Josh,

fantastic work! I'm looking forward to see the vivarium when there are plants in it!

Are you really sure that there is no water overflooding the waterfall? I think your pump needs a very low flow rate.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Jay2 said:


> Thank you so much for this! It definitely answered my question!
> 
> Another question, when you used the GS for the carved rocks did you have air holes/pockets? I'm working on my first viv and experimenting w/ GS but there seems to be a lot little and some larger holes... any way to get around this?
> I intend on creating a water feature also but the holes are making it a little tougher.
> ...


Jay - There are always holes of various sizes in the GS once it dries - at least as has been my experience. I think it has a lot to do with how thick you spray it and how long it dries before you start carving. I think thinner layers would have smaller holes. I have no scientific evidence of this, just my experience. 

The medium to small holes just get filled in with Drylok when I apply it with heavy coats. If there are any large voids (from spraying too much and it not drying correctly), I will stuff in some carved foam into the hole (like a plug) and then just Drylok over it. Seems to work so far. Even with a somewhat rushed and careless carving out of the water flow crevice, once I applied thick coats of Drylok, it all got covered up and smoothed out. 

Even if you're not planning to use Drylok, from all I've seen most all GS ends up covered with something. I'll cover the rest of my GS background with silicone and add coco fiber, so any holes and crevices will get covered up and filled with that.



kblack3 said:


> For the drainage tubing is it safe to use drip line? I have an abundance of that stuff


Not sure kblack, sorry. I guess it depends on what kind of tubing it is. I know big box stores carry the soft, clear vinyl tubing (what I used), the small, hard black tubing, and the soft black rubber kind for outside irrigation - but I'm not sure their pros and cons. Sorry! I would think the small black hard kind (what I think you're talking about) would be fine, as I would think it'd be inert and safe to use, but don't quote me on that. Hopefully the stuff I'm using is! 




dennis2311 said:


> Hi Josh,
> 
> fantastic work! I'm looking forward to see the vivarium when there are plants in it!
> 
> Are you really sure that there is no water overflooding the waterfall? I think your pump needs a very low flow rate.


Thanks Dennis for the kind words and advice! I LOVE how your Varadero tank turned out. Very inspirational. If this one turns out half as nice as yours, I'd be happy 

I've tested the waterfall several times - mostly trying to get the canister filter working properly. Through those times, the flow rate would... well, ebb and flow, as I was adjusting the filter/pump. I noticed a couple places where the water would run over the intended channel and down the side, but only when the flow was at it's highest. Once I got the pump all figured out, I let it run at it's normal output and noted the water run over areas on the falls/rocks. I do have a ball valve on the output tube, so I can control the water flow that way. But, even when it's fully open and the filter is pumping out the max flow, it's still pretty low. Less than I expected actually, but that's better anyways. 

Since then, I've carved out more of the flow channel in the rocks to hopefully fix that one problem spot where it was running over. There was one other minimal run off, but I liked how it looked, barely dripping down the side, so I've left it for now.


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## Blueper (Feb 27, 2016)

Are you gonna line the cups with any type of fabric or filter, so the drain lines don't get clogged with debris?


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Blueper said:


> Are you gonna line the cups with any type of fabric or filter, so the drain lines don't get clogged with debris?


That, sir, is a great idea... 

So, yes. _Now_ I will add in something!


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## Blueper (Feb 27, 2016)

I haven't done a net pot in a wall yet. That was something I was wondering about. I'm sure that no matter what, over time, one or two may get some funk or a root in them. But I was thinking that when I do my large viv,....if I do net pots in the wall or just any soil-filled crevices with a drain, I might throw some landscape fabric down to help keep out the majority of debris.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Blueper said:


> I haven't done a net pot in a wall yet. That was something I was wondering about. I'm sure that no matter what, over time, one or two may get some funk or a root in them. But I was thinking that when I do my large viv,....if I do net pots in the wall or just any soil-filled crevices with a drain, I might throw some landscape fabric down to help keep out the majority of debris.


Yeah, thats a great idea Ron. This is my first time doing the net pots too. I realized too late about the position of the tubing that I mentioned above with the little diagram, so next time I can do it right. The opening of the tube is so small, only fine pieces of dirt should be able to get though, but a barrier of some sort would still be a good idea to keep even that out, and hopefully pesky roots. I imagine at some point the tube(s) would get clogged and there'd be no way to clear it unless you pull the plant and substrate out and stick an air compressor nozzle to it and blow it all clear.


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## Blueper (Feb 27, 2016)

I wish I would have joined this site about 4-5 yrs ago, before I built my first viv.
I had the right ideas and headed in the right direction on most of the build, but there are so many little things I would have done different and a few tricks I never thought of. 
My next one will be a composition of all the best and most effective tricks I've picked up from other people's builds on here.
Hopefully it all comes together and then I can pass on the results of my efforts and contribute back into the pool of ideas.


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## Jay2 (May 19, 2016)

Thank you! Definitely going to continue to follow your log and use this as a guide for my first build! Keep up the great work and thanks again for all the detailed steps!


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## roundfrog (Jan 27, 2016)

Do the tubes going from the net pots empty on to the bg? It will create like a mini drip wall after you mist, as the water will flow down, and be more realistic because during a rainstorm, the water will flow down the tree trunks and rocks.
FYI: pls don't learn this lesson the hard way: test the landscape fabric to make sure water can flow on both sides. Some types only drain from 1 side, so if you orient it the wrong way, the pot will fill with water.
build looks great by the way


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Jay2 said:


> Thank you! Definitely going to continue to follow your log and use this as a guide for my first build! Keep up the great work and thanks again for all the detailed steps!


Thanks Jay, glad you like it and even more glad it's being of some help to you! Learn from my mistakes, haha!

---------------------

So, still adjusting the waterfall...  Here is a short video I took of it working quite well actually. 

https://youtu.be/ilWGUbzfImY

But, as luck would have it, shortly after I took the video and tweaked the tubing and flow some, the water flow started pouring over the side big time and getting everywhere. Arg.  So, I grabbed another can of Great Stuff and started building up more at the overflow spots, rather than carving the channel down more. Now, with the added foam, I'll have some "tunnel" parts on the falls that I think will look pretty cool. Still going to make them look like rocks, but I'm going to try and train some Marcgravia up it all, and I think it will look nice. Just bites that the days keep passing by as I'm still trying to get this part right. But, this is what I get for sticking with the water feature!  

At least now I have the filter/pump working how it should and think I've resolved the issues with that part of it. 



FTS:


I added a little more cork at the right side corner. I can't wait to get the waterfall finished and painted so I can finish covering the background, throw in the ABG, and start planting!

Also, cool story. LLL Reptile did me right and got 2 new doors shipped at no cost! They just called yesterday saying they came in.... both shattered. Awesome. They contacted the manuf. and they're shipping 2 more now. Glad I'm in no hurry on them!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

roundfrog said:


> Do the tubes going from the net pots empty on to the bg? It will create like a mini drip wall after you mist, as the water will flow down, and be more realistic because during a rainstorm, the water will flow down the tree trunks and rocks.
> FYI: pls don't learn this lesson the hard way: test the landscape fabric to make sure water can flow on both sides. Some types only drain from 1 side, so if you orient it the wrong way, the pot will fill with water.
> build looks great by the way


Thanks - good call on the landscape fabric. I didn't know that.

The drain tubes from the net pots actually go all the way down through the false bottom and empty into the water table below. It could have been cool to have them drip to the background, but sadly too late for that now. Next time I think I'll try that!


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## roundfrog (Jan 27, 2016)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Thanks - good call on the landscape fabric. I didn't know that.
> 
> The drain tubes from the net pots actually go all the way down through the false bottom and empty into the water table below. It could have been cool to have them drip to the background, but sadly too late for that now. Next time I think I'll try that!


don't quote me on the landscape fabric, I just remember reading that on the boards a while back in someone's build.


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## dennis2311 (Feb 11, 2016)

The waterfall looks fantastic, great work! Hope for you that it turns out well and doesn't flood the tank, but I'm very confident! 

Keep us updated!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Update:

So close! I was able to put in a bunch of time this weekend to try and make some major progress, and I'm almost done with the background.

What was taking way more time than I thought, was fixing the overflow areas of the waterfall. It seemed I'd fix one area only for another to pop up. So, after half a dozen or more adjustments of adding foam or carving some out, I ended up realizing it would just be best to cover the problem areas completely by covering the flow channel completely in those areas, creating a sort of tunnel. I was bummed at first to cover all that up, but I actually kind of like it now. 



I tested it for a while after this, and no spills! I envision lots of climbing plants going up the rocks, so I think it will look good and divert the fact that 1/3 of the waterfall is covered 

So finally it was time to paint the rocks. Added the first coat of colored Drylok (which was like the 5-6th coat of Drylok overall!). 



Then started to lighten it up with drybrushing on grey acrylic paint. 



Last few coats of highlighting with white:



Once I was done with the highlights, it was time to try and finish covering up the foam with the coco fiber. I got about 80% done, and here is where it sits as of this posting. 



There was so much to cover, and I'm super ready for this thing to be finished, I didn't spend as much time as I should have painting the rocks. Regardless, I'm still happy enough with how they turned out to let them be. Besides, once it's all planted and dirty, you won't notice the rock detail as much, which will be my saving grace. 

Once I finish covering the foam and all the little spots here and there I missed, I'll add and affix the ghostwood piece. Then it's into the house, onto the stand, and time to get going with planting!!


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## dentex (Apr 22, 2016)

Rocks on your waterfall are looking really good! 
Good job


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## dennis2311 (Feb 11, 2016)

Fantastic work, Josh! The whole vivarium will look fantastic! Also it's a really cool size, my next vivarium will be this size too. The Azureus will be thankful for this amount of space. 

Did you order any plants yet?


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

dennis2311 said:


> Fantastic work, Josh! The whole vivarium will look fantastic! Also it's a really cool size, my next vivarium will be this size too. The Azureus will be thankful for this amount of space.
> 
> Did you order any plants yet?


Thanks Dennis! What are you going to put in yours when you're done? This has been a fun build - sometimes frustrating - but I've been learning a lot along the way. The tank size and weight alone presented tons of obstacles themselves I would have never anticipated. 

I have lots of plants just waiting to go in. So far I have about 14 different Neoregelias plus 4 in the mail. I've got about 8 miniature orchids waiting to go in, and 3-4 Tillandsias. I've got 5 different Marcgravias and a huge pleathora of terrestrial plans I've been growing out for months. 6+ different Begonias, several different Peperomias, Alocasias, Biophytums... too many to remember off the top of my head. I'll take a pic of my grow out thanks and post it tonight just for fun. I have several that I for sure want to put in, and the rest I'll just have to decide along the way when planting. 

This tank has been in the works for a few months now, and I've been collecting plants for it the whole time. I'm over-covered in the plant area!


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## Jay2 (May 19, 2016)

Looks awesome!

How do you plan, if you are, on covering the egg crates from view?

Trying to figure this out on my own build and I thought I'd see how others are doing it!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Jay2 said:


> Looks awesome!
> 
> How do you plan, if you are, on covering the egg crates from view?
> 
> Trying to figure this out on my own build and I thought I'd see how others are doing it!


Thanks Jay -

The top part of the false bottom egg crate will be covered in ABG mix. On the sides underneath that, I'm planning to fill the space between the glass and screen-covered egg crate with aquarium gravel. It is only about a 3/8" space. I saw that on someone else's build and thought it was the best and easiest way to hide the false bottom from view. Plus it looked cool in their pictures. Hopefully I'll be at that point later this week and I'll post some pics of it.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Dennis -

Here are my two plant grow out tanks and some of the neoregelias.


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## dennis2311 (Feb 11, 2016)

Awesome! I'm really jealous right now, that amount of plants! I know the feeling when you want to plant more and more because you just have so many plants but there's just not enough space in the vivarium to plant them all. That's really cool, it looks like the room of a small vendor  

I can imagine how many work it took to build this vivarium and I'm admiring your discipline in working out every detail. 

By the way I don't know what I will put in my next vivarium. I love the Ranitomeya species but I don't know at this moment. Maybe I will move the Varaderos to the new tank to give them more space. 

Well, I hope you'll find enough time to finish the vivarium in the upcoming weeks, great work!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Update:

I finally got all the coco fiber pressed onto the background last night. Man, getting up and under and behind that waterfall arch was a pain! I've noticed a few of those inevitable tiny spots here and there where some GS is still showing, but rather than obsess and keep filling with silicone/fiber, I'll just stuff them with sphagnum or plants. Easy fix. 

I also got the ghostwood piece set in. I ended up drilling a couple holes through the wood and cork and stuffed a chopstick and toothpick with glue through to help hold it. I used Gorilla Glue on the top and silicone to close up and affix the bottom. After only about an hour, it seemed really stuck in place, so once it's all completely cured I imagine it won't budge. 







There were a couple pretty big open gaps both in and around the wood where it met the false bottom, so I ended up stuffing some dried GS foam in there and siliconing over it all. Worked like a charm. 

I'm hoping to get my neighbor to help me move it into the house and onto the stand this evening since it's such a beast. Then it's time to start hooking it all up! Light(s), filter, mistking, fan, timers, etc... Then water, ABG and plants! Hopefully my replacement doors come soon... in tact this time!


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## scubafreak (Mar 7, 2016)

looking great, following you thread anxiously for updates.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

It's been feeling lately like this day would never come, but here we are! I took a half day off work (birthday, yay!) to get this thing ready to set up. I grabbed my neighbor and we hefted this monster up onto the hutch stand and it's finally inside!



To answer Jay2's question, here is how it looks with the aquarium gravel filled in on the sides. I admit it looks nicer than I was anticipating.



I had the waterfall running for a couple hours with no issue, so that's a nice relief.



Also got the ABG in and spread around. Filled in the net cups with weed block and then some ABG as filler. I also got the Current Satellite+ PRO light set up, which was way easier than I thought it would be. It's got some nice features I was playing with, so I'm happy so far. I put it on full spectrum, but still not sure if it will be enough for the plants. Seems kinda dim overall, so I might have to get another light. Not crazy about dropping another $250 on the same light, but I may end up doing that. I guess we'll see how the plants for after a bit.

Next up is to get those replacement doors, and hook up the fan and Mistking. Then come the plants!


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## Andrew Lee (Jan 21, 2014)

Hmm, that looks really bad. You should give it to me so that you don't need to see it anymore. Sorry, I think that is an old joke around the board and I just had to say it. It is looking fantastic! I am really excited to see what your progress!


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## Blueper (Feb 27, 2016)

For years now, any time I was asked to do a project at work, everyone would bust my chops and ride my rear about how I over communicated, over planned, over engineered and most importantly,.....took forEVer to do anything.
But the end result was always the same and till this day, I'm still the only one on the staff that they come to for special projects/builds. (And of course, they still give me a hard time,....every frikkin time).
This build reminds me of that. Was well thought out, had a plan and vision the whole time, communicated every step, took your time, paid attention to detail and it shows. It came out really nice. 
I would ask you to build me a tank in a heartbeat.
Then ride your ass for 3 months while you built it


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Andrew Lee said:


> Hmm, that looks really bad. You should give it to me so that you don't need to see it anymore. Sorry, I think that is an old joke around the board and I just had to say it. It is looking fantastic! I am really excited to see what your progress!





Blueper said:


> For years now, any time I was asked to do a project at work, everyone would bust my chops and ride my rear about how I over communicated, over planned, over engineered and most importantly,.....took forEVer to do anything.
> But the end result was always the same and till this day, I'm still the only one on the staff that they come to for special projects/builds. (And of course, they still give me a hard time,....every frikkin time).
> This build reminds me of that. Was well thought out, had a plan and vision the whole time, communicated every step, took your time, paid attention to detail and it shows. It came out really nice.
> I would ask you to build me a tank in a heartbeat.
> Then ride your ass for 3 months while you built it


Ha, thanks for the kind words guys. It has definitely been a fun ride getting here. Ups and downs along the way but I'm happy with it all, so, so far it's been worth it. I've still got some things to finish on it, and of course all the planting and then the waiting before the frogs go in, but I think they'll like it. Undoubtedly much more than their current 10g!

The whole point of this build log was to share ideas and get the creative juices flowing. There are much better builds posted on here, but I wanted to both give and receive ideas along the way, and share them with the board. This has been as much my work as everyone else's who gave input both directly and indirectly through their own build posts over the years. I wouldn't have gotten even a fraction of where it is now without the invaluable advice from others. Hopefully this will give other people some insight and ideas for their own, just as others have for me. Thanks to all who've helped me get here! 

More posts to come once the plants and other components go in.


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## dentex (Apr 22, 2016)

Great words! And beautiful tank and log! Has been a pleasure to follow all your steps since now (even if I don't comment that much).

I also agree in doing everything slowly... and it's clear looking at how long is taking for my build also...

Looking forward to seeing your tank planted.


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## Jay2 (May 19, 2016)

Thanks for the side picture!

Your log has definitely inspired, helped, and answered tons of questions on my end!

Also, happy birthday!


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## mpods20 (Jun 25, 2016)

Looks great. I love the waterfall feature. I can't wait to see it planted!


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## entropyhappens (May 25, 2016)

I don't have any pictures of the hinge pin fix as I still haven't ordered a new door for my tank. All you have to do is stand directly above the tank and drill a hole completely through where the pin sits. It's maybe 1/4" of plastic max that you drill through, and with that removed you can use anything you'd like to replace the pin. I just grabbed a screw from the garage and dropped it down into the hole. To remove the door all I have to do is remove the screw and the hole door lifts up out of the bottom factory hinge.

Looks great so far! Hurry up and plant it already!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

entropyhappens said:


> I don't have any pictures of the hinge pin fix as I still haven't ordered a new door for my tank. All you have to do is stand directly above the tank and drill a hole completely through where the pin sits. It's maybe 1/4" of plastic max that you drill through, and with that removed you can use anything you'd like to replace the pin. I just grabbed a screw from the garage and dropped it down into the hole. To remove the door all I have to do is remove the screw and the hole door lifts up out of the bottom factory hinge.
> 
> Looks great so far! Hurry up and plant it already!


Thanks for the clarification. I actually got the doors in yesterday and just put them in with the original hardware. I had to cut the silicone at the top in order to lift up the plastic trim enough to fit the pin back in, but it's all done and in now. 

Only issue I have with that whole situation now is that the tank is so wide, the top front bar bows a little so it's tough to close the doors all the way. I have to lift up that top bar for them to shut. When I open one door, they kind of "pop" out as the top bar bows down again. I think I may look into making a glass lid which hopefully with the rigidity of the glass, it will help hold up that front bar. Plus, that Exo Terra lid has two plastic cross bars that cast shadows from the light above. That alone makes me want to do a glass lid!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Alright, here we go!

Finally got this thing fully set up planted! Now it's just time to wait and hope everything starts taking off and cycling like it should. I've got some springtails and dwarf purple isopods in there, but still need more to add. Just waiting on my cultures to replenish or find more. I got the Mistking setup and running (WAY easier than I thought it would be), 80mm fan set up and running on a timer. I'll still play around with the mister/fan schedules to try and get optimal moisture and ventilation. Right now I don't have a whole lot of rhyme or reason between the 2.

Here it is...













I ended up with a lot of extra Neoregelias. I had put more in there but ended up taking them out because it looked too cluttered or they created too much shade below them. Man, that was a fine balancing act - trying not to shade out the stuff on the bottom. Oh well, that just means I have to make another tank to use them in! Right now I think I have about 40 different plants in there. I may have went a little plant-crazy... I did try and leave space for everything to grow out and not overcrowd... it's just so dang big! Here is the plant list:

*Bromeliads –*
_Neoregelia Donger
Neoregelia Fireball
Neoregelia Fireball x Inca
Neoregelia Wee Willy
Neoregelia Angel Face x Midget
Neoregelia Wild Tiger
Neoregelia Tiger Cub
Neoregelia Unknown (very small)
Neoregelia Dartanian
Neoregelia Blueberry Tiger
Cryptanthus Pink Earth Star (x2)
Tillandsia sp. Unknown_

*Orchids –*
_Porroglossum amethystinum
Pleurothallis grobyi
Pleurothallis megalops
Restrepia trichoglossa_

*Begonias –*
_Begonia bipinnatifida
Begonia leprechaun 
Begonia soli-mutata
Begonia amphioxus
Begonia thelmae
Begonia sp. Unknown (green/spots)
Begonia sp. Unknown (silver/red)_

*Marcgravias –*
_Marcgravia sintenisii
Marcgravia rectiflora Suriname
Marcgravia umbellata
Marcgravia sp. Unknown (tiny)
Marcgravia sp. Unknown (large leaves)_

*Peperomias –*
_Peperomia sp. Venezuela
peperomia perciliata
peperomia emarginella Ecuador
peperomia prostrata_

*Misc. –*
_African Violet “Rob’s Twinkle Blue”
Alocasia amazonica
Syngonium rayii
Biophytum sp. Ecuador
Sphyrospermum cf. buxifolium
Rhaphidophora cryptantha
Rhaphidophora sp. (?) Unknown
Limnobium laevigatum_

I'm sure I'll end up rearranging or adding stuff in the coming weeks. This coming weekend may spell trouble because it's Andy's Orchids open house AND the San Diego Reptile Expo. I'm planning to go to both with a wad of birthday cash, so I may end up adding to that plant list! I know for sure I want to add a few more orchids I'll pick up from Andy.

Either way, I'm pretty happy with how it turned out. Pretty much like I envisioned from the very beginning, so I didn't end up deviating from my plan hardly any. Shockingly, everything is working like it's supposed to and it's just a matter of some fine tweaking and waiting now! 

Thanks for following and all your support along the way!


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## Blueper (Feb 27, 2016)

Wow. That turned out really nice.
That would also make a really nice pumilio tank.


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## dentex (Apr 22, 2016)

Wow. Huge plant list... and a lot of work in planting them, for sure. Congratulations for you hard job. I'm sure everything will grow well in there. 

I'm not sure if it's some moss that I saw on the waterfall. If not, did you plan to add something in regards? (Just out of curiosity. I'm a big moss fan)😂


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## dennis2311 (Feb 11, 2016)

Hey Josh,

that turned out absolutely stunning! I really like it! Like the post before, it would also be a very nice tank for Pumilio or climbing Ranitomeya. 

When you reach a balanced clima there will be a lot of grow. Keep us updated!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

dentex said:


> Wow. Huge plant list... and a lot of work in planting them, for sure. Congratulations for you hard job. I'm sure everything will grow well in there.
> 
> I'm not sure if it's some moss that I saw on the waterfall. If not, did you plan to add something in regards? (Just out of curiosity. I'm a big moss fan)😂


Thanks dentex. I had just a couple small pieces of 2 different unknown mosses. One looks very similar to christmas moss (maybe it is) that hitched a ride on an orchid from Andy's, and the other was included in a plant bundle from a member here, but was unlabeled. I did put them both on the waterfall in hopes of them getting more water that way. I like mosses too, but I didn't add a whole lot down low in fear that they would't get enough light. I'm going to a reptile expo this weekend and will probably try and pick up some moss if I find any. 



Blueper said:


> Wow. That turned out really nice.
> That would also make a really nice pumilio tank.


Thanks Ron. I agree, see below...



dennis2311 said:


> Hey Josh,
> 
> that turned out absolutely stunning! I really like it! Like the post before, it would also be a very nice tank for Pumilio or climbing Ranitomeya.
> 
> When you reach a balanced clima there will be a lot of grow. Keep us updated!


Thanks Dennis. It was a lot of fun. I only ended up using about 1/3 of the plants I had in those grow out tanks, so I'll have to find another use for all the remainder! 

I know the vertical space would be perfect for an arboreal thumb species. And believe me, it's tempting. My whole vision from the start was a big tank for my Azureus, with just a ton of neoregelias, orchids and climbers up the back wall. That was all mostly just for looks. I know Azureus are climbers (not as much as other Dendrobates, but will still climb nonetheless), so I figured they could just have at it. Hopefully they won't be too destructive on the more delicate orchids up there. 

I know the stigma on mixing, and at present I have no plan to. It is very tempting, though, to look at all that vertical space and think a thumbnail would just love it. Gonna do more research to see the feasibility, but for now it's just a pipe dream which most likely won't happen.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Well, so... Andy's Orchids had an open house last weekend. I came out of there with 5 plants and even more I wanted but had to pass on. I ended up putting all 5 new orchids in the tank, plus one other I had in a grow out. New orchids are in bold.

*Orchids –*
_Porroglossum amethystinum_
_Pleurothallis grobyi_
_Pleurothallis megalop_s
_Restrepia trichoglossa_
*Lepanthes saltatrix
Phymatidium falcifolium
Restrepia dodsonii
Lepanthes astrophora
Pleurothallis simmleriana
Tolumnia (Equitant Oncidium)*


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

I had the opportunity to see this monster in person recently, and it's hard to believe that Josh has only been building tropical habitats for a few months now. Everything is very well thought out, and aesthetically arranged. Give it 6-12 months of grow time and this viv will be legendary!


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## RichardA (Jul 15, 2009)

Awesome build! 

Question..... What did you do for the top screens on the EXO? Did you remove and replace the entire thing with glass or cover the screens or what?

I am currently building my first big EXO and am looking at options.


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## nagasaki (Feb 9, 2012)

K3viin128 said:


> Man those rocks are really looking good... Nice work. And glad to see you went exo terra... Tall tank like the previous sure would be hard to access for plant trimming and other stuff... Don't forget to FF proof front vent


>> Real nice rocks . >Whats best way/s to fly proof the doors on exo terra?


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

RichardA said:


> Awesome build!
> 
> Question..... What did you do for the top screens on the EXO? Did you remove and replace the entire thing with glass or cover the screens or what?
> 
> I am currently building my first big EXO and am looking at options.


Thanks Richard! I actually left the lid as it comes. I cut a couple pieces of glass to fit inside the front two quarters, and just put them on top of the screen. I drilled the glass and cut the screen for the mistking nozzles. I know the Exo screen is prone to rust, so I may do a glass lid someday. Also hoping a glass lid will be rigid enough to help the front bar from bowing down, causing the doors to not close w/out help. I know a lot of people swap out the Exo lids with glass ones.



nagasaki said:


> >> Real nice rocks . >Whats best way/s to fly proof the doors on exo terra?


Thanks on the rocks - they were really easy to make if you ever thought about trying. I haven't fly proofed any of my tanks... I just don't seem to notice a problem with escapees, so I haven't felt a need to FF proof them. That said, I think most often people use no see 'um mesh and silicone it over the vents, or add silicone or vinyl tubing to cover the door spaces. There are several posts on here about those methods if you do a quick search.


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

Good looking orchids. I got some recently from Andy's too and was very happy with them.


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## dennis2311 (Feb 11, 2016)

Damn Josh, maybe I should try an Orchid too! Never have buyed one before


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

dennis2311 said:


> Damn Josh, maybe I should try an Orchid too! Never have buyed one before


I was scared of them at first, until a friend told me that they are really as easy to keep as most plants. Just make sure you know it's requirements and try and emulate that as best you can. Make sure it's an orchid suitable for vivarium conditions. I've been able to keep some orchid species alive and looking healthy with new growth for at least a few months so far. Those others I just got a week or so ago, so hopefully they'll be ok. They aren't cheap, so it's an extra sting if they start to die!


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

I like the Power Search that Andy's has. I put in my viv conditions and make selections based on that. It's not a perfect system, but it's been working so far for me. One thing I found though, is that high light plants will still have an adjustment phase under the LEDs. I've had to put some screen on the glass in some places to bring the intensity down.


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## ChrisAZ (Sep 6, 2012)

I second what chillplants said about having to cut back lighting. I use fluorescent and LEDs and find that it's very easy to burn or bleach out small orchids.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

chillplants said:


> I like the Power Search that Andy's has. I put in my viv conditions and make selections based on that. It's not a perfect system, but it's been working so far for me. One thing I found though, is that high light plants will still have an adjustment phase under the LEDs. I've had to put some screen on the glass in some places to bring the intensity down.





ChrisAZ said:


> I second what chillplants said about having to cut back lighting. I use fluorescent and LEDs and find that it's very easy to burn or bleach out small orchids.


Thanks for the advice guys. It's hard to judge being so new to this, but it doesn't look like they're getting so much light as to burn them. I just have the one light, and while it lights the whole tank pretty well - it really doesn't seem super bright. Hopefully it's at a good level for them. The couple that like more shade were planted in areas that had more shade. I'm hoping they do well... time will tell. Hopefully I can keep them happy!


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

I've really only had a problem with one. The leaves immediately started to turn purple. I moved it a little lower and the new leaves are coming out just fine. As soon as I have enough new leaves, I'll trim the older, purple leaves.
Something you may find is the newer leaves come out smaller than the older leaves if they are close to the light. This is a natural reaction of the plant to not use as much resources building larger leaves to collect sunlight. Not all plants do it, but I have 3 orchids that have smaller leaves than the original plant I bought.


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## ChrisAZ (Sep 6, 2012)

chillplants said:


> I've really only had a problem with one. The leaves immediately started to turn purple. I moved it a little lower and the new leaves are coming out just fine. As soon as I have enough new leaves, I'll trim the older, purple leaves.
> 
> Something you may find is the newer leaves come out smaller than the older leaves if they are close to the light. This is a natural reaction of the plant to not use as much resources building larger leaves to collect sunlight. Not all plants do it, but I have 3 orchids that have smaller leaves than the original plant I bought.




I've also had the opposite effect, with the new growth being much larger. Coloration can be dramatically different under artificial lighting as well.


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

Yeah, it can go either way depending on light level and needs of the plant.


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## Leuklover (Jul 18, 2016)

This is inspiring!


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## Jay2 (May 19, 2016)

Josh, do you have any tips or advice on applying substrate to the background? How did you get yours to come out so perfectly lol. 
With all the extra/loose substrate how did you prevent it from falling into the false bottom? 
I understand that you're applying everything while it's laying flat but i seem to get my background mix everywhere! 

Thanks for your help!


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Jay2 said:


> Josh, do you have any tips or advice on applying substrate to the background? How did you get yours to come out so perfectly lol.
> With all the extra/loose substrate how did you prevent it from falling into the false bottom?
> I understand that you're applying everything while it's laying flat but i seem to get my background mix everywhere!
> 
> Thanks for your help!


It's just a messy process. I had my false bottom in already when I applied the coco mix to the background for this one which was a little different. It's easiest to lay it on it's back (or side depending on what you're covering) if possible. I just smeared the silicone around in sections with my fingers to get in all the nooks & crannies. Then just dumped on the DRY coco mix (damp mix won't stick nearly as well). I pressed it in where I could to help it smoosh into the silicone better. After letting it dry for several hours to make sure the silicone was dry, I just grabbed out all the extra, loose coco fiber with my hands. Then used a vacuum to suck up all the rest. Then just repeat in other areas. I was able to save and reuse most the fiber that didn't stick, so it went a long way.


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## Officefishtank (Oct 31, 2015)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Update:
> 
> Got the back and sides covered in black silicone, then added the egg crate to help the GS stick. Also added the waterfall sectional divider. I cut a hole at the bottom for the water to pass through from under the false bottom and added window screen as a pre-filter of sorts. I'll also add more filter media (sponge) and hopefully that will keep most of the debris out of the pump. _*Any thoughts? Do I need more/better filtration to keep the pump from mucking up?*_ I think that's why my others keep failing (and they were cheap ones initially). I siliconed all around the sectional divider so the water can only pass through the filtered area.



Thank you very much for posting your viv building journey. The finished product looks fantastic! Would you mind just sharing what you used for the waterfall sectional divider in the above pictures?


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

Thanks! I'm hoping it helps people get ideas and answers to similar methods they're working on. That piece is a corrugated pvc panel from Home Depot. Pretty inexpensive. I cut a hole in it and siliconed on some screen to act as a sort of pre filter. My canister filter intake tube sits in that back corner.


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## Officefishtank (Oct 31, 2015)

Thanks for the information and idea! I went and got corrugated PVC panel today and am planning to use it instead (or maybe with) the egg crate to make my background externally. I wouldn't have thought of that material without this thread, so huge thanks again for sharing.


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## Leuklover (Jul 18, 2016)

I love this tank! Thanks for being so detailed! It's amazing!


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## KommentBox (Aug 26, 2016)

Thanks for sharing your journey! I just bought my tank this week and I'm in the planning phase... I'll start a thread soon and post build pics. I definitely took a lot of notes from yours.

Question for you: I have a 48"x31"x21" tank and the front doesn't open... I noticed that you had a similar tank at the beginning before you decided to upgrade to the Exoterra... how screwed am I going to be long term by having a tank that doesn't open? Do I just need to pick slow growth plants?


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

KommentBox said:


> Thanks for sharing your journey! I just bought my tank this week and I'm in the planning phase... I'll start a thread soon and post build pics. I definitely took a lot of notes from yours.
> 
> Question for you: I have a 48"x31"x21" tank and the front doesn't open... I noticed that you had a similar tank at the beginning before you decided to upgrade to the Exoterra... how screwed am I going to be long term by having a tank that doesn't open? Do I just need to pick slow growth plants?


Glad you were able to get some ideas from this... hopefully you can avoid some of the mistakes I made! Like the tank style...

Read through what cam1941 had to say on page 1 since he was the one that brought to light a lot of issues that would come with a top opening only tank. From all I gathered and could think of, obviously you could still do it that way, but I think you should weigh the pros and cons and see if it's worth it for you. Of course I didn't want to spend the money on a whole new tank, but I thought that would be the best bet for the long run. 

Looking at all I've been doing with my Exo tank since planting and maintaining it and the frogs thus far - I'm 100% confident I made the right choice to switch. I think having it only accessible from the top would have been a nightmare. Having front opening doors (however they work) is paramount in working on the viv both during construction and after it's all done.

I would personally advise you to get a tank that has the front opening. I think it will save you much frustration and headaches, and you'll be glad you did.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

UPDATE TIME!

It's been about 6 months since this beast was planted, and I'm happy to say that things have been growing in nicely! I've moved and swapped some plants since the initial planting as well. I had been using just the single 36" Current Satellite+ Pro until about a week ago when I added two 20W LED floodlights up front to see how that works. Too early to tell, but I'm hoping the extra light will help spur some of the slower growers. I'm still happy with how that light works and the growth I've been getting. Most my orchids have been putting out a lot of new leaves in the last few months... several blooming regularly. The neos all have kept their color well, aside from the very lowest Donger on the bottom right. The waterfall works well still. It spills over the sides more than I want, but oh well. I've only changed the water and tubing twice in the 6 months it's been going, and it only takes like 20 minutes. The "rocks" have tons of algae on them, which I'm not sure if I like or not. I can clean it off easy enough with a toothbrush (pro tip: not the one you use!). The foam rocks seem to be holding up really well too.

What else... the 5 Azureus seem to be doing well. They're about 12 months oow now, so no calling, courting or reproducing yet. No obvious aggression yet either, but I'm just waiting for that. They do climb up to the very top every so often and trample some of the more delicate plants along the way, but nothing major. They've fallen and jumped into the water many times, and always have no issue getting out. My goal/idea was to have them deposit tads in that little pool, so we'll see. 

It was a fun build for my second ever tank. Working on another same sized tank now for a buddy. I'm happy with how it's been working out, and can't wait to see how it looks this summer!

Now Pics!


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## ruairidh_ (Feb 9, 2016)

Absolutely amazing, if I ever get round to making a viv of my own you may get a msg from me  brom placement is really nice too, like they would be in the wild  how loud is the waterfall when you're in the same room as it?


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

ruairidh_ said:


> Absolutely amazing, if I ever get round to making a viv of my own you may get a msg from me  brom placement is really nice too, like they would be in the wild  how loud is the waterfall when you're in the same room as it?


Thanks! I'm happy to help however I can, so ask away. The waterfall isn't loud by any means. If it's deathly quiet in the house (which it NEVER is with 4 kids), you can hear it several rooms away, but it's never loud enough to be distracting. The water only drops like 2" from the fall, so it doesn't really even have the potential to be very loud. I like it... at night it's a faint sound in the background when lying in bed... Very relaxing.


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## JuanBlack (Feb 15, 2015)

Hey where did you get the little information placard? It's a nice little touch for people who are interested about the frogs.


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## Gibbs.JP (Feb 16, 2016)

JuanBlack said:


> Hey where did you get the little information placard? It's a nice little touch for people who are interested about the frogs.


Jared Page on Facebook... he's offered them on the Frogroom page a few times.


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## JuanBlack (Feb 15, 2015)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Jared Page on Facebook... he's offered them on the Frogroom page a few times.




Thank you for the info!


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## JuanBlack (Feb 15, 2015)

Gibbs.JP said:


> Jared Page on Facebook... he's offered them on the Frogroom page a few times.




Can't seem to find him on Facebook can you send me a link for him?


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## dwllama (Aug 29, 2020)

Found this looking through water feature builds trying to decide if I want to go for one. How has it held up over time? Any problems or learning opportunities since the last update? Thanks


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