# Help my galac please



## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Hi I have an orange A. galacto notus who seems to not be doing well. 4 days ago and for weeks even months before that he would spend a lot of time in the front of his terrarium looking around moving around being very active, but in the last 3 days or so he seems to be missing in action. I believe I did see him eating flies yesterday and I add food everyday which seems to disappear. So that part is hopeful but he is just not happy peppy little guy that he normally is. His humidity has been pretty consistent, the only thing I can think of is that the last few days the temperature in his terrarium may have dropped a little from around 76° on average to closer to 72 or 73. I've adjusted the heat, so at this point it is back to a faily consistent 78 degrees. Could the temporary cool spell explain his behavior or should I be concerned about his health. It just worries me that I just don't see him very much at this point. Thanks for any help or advice.

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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Oh, I forgot. Due to worsening depression I have been unable to consistently turn the light on at the same time every morning like I used to. I've been getting better about that the last few days, and I'm working towards getting an automated system so that I don't have to worry about managing the lightning. I know my terrerium isn't ideal and I'm planning to build a 16-in cube enclosure in the very near future. I will take some pictures for now.

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## Paskui (May 23, 2020)

Temp is not the problem in this case.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

Without any other information I tend to agree with @Paskui , temperature doesn't appear to be the issue to me. My frog room is regularly in the low 70s in the winter and my Adelphobates galactonatus are always out and about.

Pictures of the tank will probably help us.

Can you fill this out?

Answer all these questions as best you can (cut and paste):

1. What species ? How long have you had the frog(s) and where did you acquire them ?

2. What are your temperatures (day and night - highs and lows) and how do you measure those temperatures? Does the vivarium have any supplemental heating, and if so, what type?

3. What lighting is on the enclosure (brand, type, wattage) and does the lighting add heat to the vivarium?

4. What is the Humidity like (percentage or guesstimate)? What type of water are you using? What is your misting procedure (automated or hand mister, how long and how often)?

5. Describe your tank/enclosure and its lid or top, and give details about the ventilation (how many vents, where are they positioned, how large are they).

6. What kind of food are you providing, how much and are you dusting it? What superfine powdered supplements (brand and exact product name) are you using and are they fresh (i.e. how long has the container been open, and how is it stored)?

7. Any other animals in the enclosure currently or recently? Tankmates / other frogs ?

8. Any type of behavior you would consider 'odd' ?

9. Have you handled or touched the frogs recently ? Any cleansers, paint, perfumes, bug sprays etc near the tank ?

10. Take pictures of EVERYTHING -- the frogs, the enclosure, the vents. Take numerous pics of everything - that will be of great help.


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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Here are some photos, I did get to see him and he looks a little skinnier. He did hop around a little, but when I replaced the items I'd disturbed in the tank, he promptly went back and hid. I also removed the pump that got a bit of stuff stuck in it and made a pretty scary sound for a minute or so. Maybe he just got spooked?



















































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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

This is not an appropriate setup for a dart frog. Largest problem is that it is way too wet. A little bit of research on this forum will go a long way to helping you fix it up. Start Here. 

Second, a simple timer to automate your lights costs $10. 

Third, if you have mental health issues that are causing you to not be able to provide the appropriate care to your animals, I would really suggest rehoming the animals so you can concentrate on your self. Not a dig at you by any means, it is important to look after yourself. If you can't do that, how are these animals going to be able to depend on you?


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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Some answers to questions.
Adelphobates Galactonotus orange splash back
LLL reptile three months ago as a froglet

Feeding daily heydei, maybe around 30

Sups added every other feeding reptical, and Repashy super food with A, both sups opened around 3 months ago. 

Lighting with 3 RBG lights that came with terrerium, no heat fair to poor quality light, light generally on from 8 to 9.

No tankmates except springtails, added periodically from same culture

Has pool of water about 3/8 inch deep. 

Bioactive, no cleaning done

Lid black plastic with integrated light.

Ventilation, stainless mesh covering 2 square inches on top.

Noticed some whitish fuzzy mold on some moss, added springtails, its gone now.

Temperature variance over last couple weeks has been 72-78. Just raised temp to maintain around 77.

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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Got it, I think ventilation, light timer and providing a more suitable environment that has leaf litter. I'm getting all the parts together to build a euoro style front opening tank with appropriate lighting 6500k LEDs, and good ventilation. The setup seemed okay for a tiny froglet, but not much more.

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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Frog has not been handled, I wear nitrile gloves if I need to do anything inside the tank. I just periodically take soil temps and adjust as needed. The temp in my apt is consistent day, night. Probably good idea to take and log daily am pm temps

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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

@Chris S gave some good advice.

Sounds to me like there are a few things that need fixing, you've already hit on them: ventilation, tank design (it's great to have a range of humidity levels in the tank), leaf litter. 

One more I'll add: I would highly recommend switching to ONLY use "repashy calcium plus" as your supplement. It's truly an all in one supplement, use it every feeding. Store the container in the fridge, replace it every six months. 

Here are some pictures of my Adelphobates galactonatus terrarium. I have 3 Adelphobates galactonatus on a 39x19x19" tank.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

I agree that supplements should be changed to only 'Repashy Calcium Plus' at every feeding, and this change should occur immediately. I'd also look deeper into this part, though:



imchet said:


> Sups added every other feeding reptical, and Repashy super food with A, both sups opened around 3 months ago.


I take this to mean "every other feeding, the FFs were dusted with a mix of 'RepCal Calcium' and 'Repashy Vitamin A Plus'. If so, the frog is very likely extremely deficient in Vitamin D and calcium, and has been overdosed on Vitamin A, and should see a vet.

If, alternatively, this means "every other feeding, the FFs were dusted with a mix of 'RepCal Calcium *with D3*' and 'Repashy Vitamin A Plus', then the frog is likely overdosed on Vitamin A, and deficient in a range of other minor vitamins.

If this means "every other feeding, the FFs were dusted with a mix of 'RepCal *Herptivite*' and 'Repashy Vitamin A Plus' then the frog is likely overdosed on Vitamin A.


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## MorseToad (Mar 27, 2021)

The posts above are good advice. Advanced dart frog keepers can sometimes get away with a water feature, but it is definitely not something that is recommended for beginners.

A few more things:
Your drainage layer seems very thick. If you decide to rebuild the vivarium, I would recommend taking out a lot of that gravel. It will give you a few more inches of space to play with branches and sturdy plants to increase the usable area for the frogs. My galact climbs quite frequently and bromeliads are some of his favorite perching spots. I would also remove the layer of what looks like sphagnum moss and add thick layer of leaf litter instead. More plant cover will also make the frog more comfortable and more willing to be out where you can see it.

I am sorry to hear about your struggles with mental health. This past year has been really difficult for so many people. For me personally, building and tending vivariums and watching happy frogs go about their lives is very therapeutic. They are such beautiful and serene creatures. I hope you have the same experience with your vivarium and frogs.


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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Thank you everyone! I'll order the Repashy now and use as advised refrigerated and marked with opening date to be changed out every six months.

The tank is really just too small I think. It was my first attempt and I've learned a lot sinse then for sure.

I've bought a more appropriate sized terrarium and will be putting it together over the next few days. It will have an apprpriate false bottom, and I'll have magnolia leaves over ABG mix with some nice and much larger frog safe plants including a few nice plants from Joshes frogs. I'll also be putting in a timed mist king system and monitor the temps and humidity levels more closely. I'll have a daylight spectrum zoomeds LED for lighting on a timer. He'll have a nice coconut hut for him as well.

It's been so nice to care for him, and I've gotten quite attached to him. So thanks for the support!

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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

fishingguy12345 said:


> @Chris S gave some good advice.
> 
> One more I'll add: I would highly recommend switching to ONLY use "repashy calcium plus" as your supplement. It's truly an all in one supplement, use it every feeding. Store the container in the fridge, replace it every six months.


I'll counter here that you shouldn't keep your supplements in the fridge, but rather a cool dry place. Taking supplements in and out of the refrigerator causes condensation and degrades your supplements faster. There's a thread on here somewhere about this.


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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

JasonE said:


> I'll counter here that you shouldn't keep your supplements in the fridge, but rather a cool dry place. Taking supplements in and out of the refrigerator causes condensation and degrades your supplements faster. There's a thread on here somewhere about this.


Fair point. I'll clarify what I mean:
I keep my supplements in the fridge except I take out the amount that I expect to use in the next 2 weeks of feedings, and put that in a container that stays at room temperature. Minimizing the removal of the supplements from the fridge. 

Not to generalize too broadly but this is the advice that is almost always given out when it comes to keeping/preserving supplements.


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

fishingguy12345 said:


> Fair point. I'll clarify what I mean:
> I keep my supplements in the fridge except I take out the amount that I expect to use in the next 2 weeks of feedings, and put that in a container that stays at room temperature. Minimizing the removal of the supplements from the fridge.
> 
> Not to generalize too broadly but this is the advice that is almost always given out when it comes to keeping/preserving supplements.











How long does repashy vitamin a last?


I've read that repashy calcium + is only good for 6 months after you open it, is there a similar shelf life for repashy vit a?




www.dendroboard.com





Here is a thread talking about exactly what you're saying. Most people just keep the entire thing in the fridge and add cold supplements to warm flies. Your method is the proper way to keep supplements refrigerated. Apologies for any offense.

From everything I have read over the years, if you're going to religiously change your supplements every six months, then a cool dry place is sufficient.


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## Chris S (Apr 12, 2016)

I keep mine in a "normal temperature", dry place, not the fridge. But I change them religiously every 6 months.


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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Update, his condition hasn't worsened. I've transferred him to an iso enclosure with a sprig or two of sphagnum moss for himidity, and a a number of magnolia leaves. He seems to be quite happy between the leaves. Got the new sups today and will be feeding daily with dusted mels. Additionally, I've been misting and then removing any excess water with a pipette. Temps have been constantly 73-75. Got humidity sensor and will be closely monitoring that. Light on a 12 hour timer now. Sould have his new build done by Tuesday or Wednesday. Thanks for the help. I love this little guy!

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## fishingguy12345 (Apr 7, 2019)

Thank you for the update. We all appreciate hearing how the frogs are doing.

Hopefully the frog's condition will start to improve soon.


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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

My Galac is still doing okay, bur still isn't his peppy self. I've added leaf litter over ABG in his iso enclosure and continue yo monitor him. 

I'm very happy to say, I have his new enclosure done. 12x12x18, smaller than ideal, but I really liked tge way it turned out. Still need to hook up the misting system, and set up propper lighting, all of which I have and will have in place probably this evening.

My plan is to put him in here while I build a larger tank where he'll have room for a couple friends, also orange galacs.

Once he's moved, I'll either put a single auratus, or a few thunbnail frogs ( with more climbing options.










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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Bad news, I just checked on him and despite my efforts he is now certainly looking very poorly. I have observed him hopping once or twice, but I'm afraid he looks pretty sad. Should I continue, or would it be best to consider euthanasia? He was on his side sortof wedged in and all covered with bits of debris. I placed him in his water dish to rinse him off. Sorry about the bare hand, I thought he was dead.












































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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

imchet said:


> Once he's moved, I'll either put a single auratus, or a few thunbnail frogs ( with more climbing options.


Given that the cause of the current frog's condition is unknown, I personally would not put another frog in there without a teardown and sterilization.

You never did clarify what the supplement routine was, per the questions in my last post. It may play a role in answering your question about what to do at this point.


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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

I dust fruitflies daily now with Rapashy Calicium Plus.

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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Socratic Monologue said:


> Given that the cause of the current frog's condition is unknown, I personally would not put another frog in there without a teardown and sterilization.
> 
> You never did clarify what the supplement routine was, per the questions in my last post. It may play a role in answering your question about what to do at this point.


I'll be sure to thoroughly sanitize or discard anything he's come in vontacy with. Thanks, and thanks for your earlier advice.

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## imchet (Apr 7, 2021)

Thank you for all the input. I'm sorry to say he didn't make it. I am however applying all I've learned with a new pair of orange galacs who are both doing well.

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