# D. Azureus weird color?



## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

I have bred six D. Azureus froglets and they are doing well. Five of the froglets are the usual blue and black, but the other one has blue feet and legs, and the body instead of being blue and black is black and yellow with the same pattern.
Their parents are both blue and black.
Will it eventually change color to blue and black or is it an albino or something similiar.
Any help would be appreciated, Thanks.


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## SamsonsFrogs (Mar 4, 2009)

Got any pics? 
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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

Yes I do have a photo of it, how do I put it on the site


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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

I have enclosed a photo of the froglet, hope it works?


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## Redhead87xc (Jan 27, 2010)

PhoenixFrog said:


> I have enclosed a photo of the froglet, hope it works?


Wow. I have never seen that color in an Azureus before. Do you keep any other Tincs that are breeding and possibly mixed it up with other offspring from anotehr morph? I am just thinking of all the possibilities. That frog definitely doesn't look like an Azureus. But it could just be one of those freak things. It looks pretty nonetheless.


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## Taron (Sep 23, 2009)

As it gets older the blue will start to show. This is common in azureus.

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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

I have only one proven pair of D. Azureus, I don't have any more only a pair of D.Imitator and they are in a seperate tank and they have not bred.


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## Redhead87xc (Jan 27, 2010)

ReptilesEtcetera said:


> As it gets older the blue will start to show. This is common in azureus.
> 
> Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk


Really? I know I don't have a lot of experience raising froglets up, but I thought they came out looking pretty similar in color to an adult. Maybe it just varies from Azureus to Azureus.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I've seen it too, when I did Azureus years ago. At first I thought I somehow mixed it up with a sip tad.


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## Redhead87xc (Jan 27, 2010)

PhoenixFrog said:


> I have only one proven pair of D. Azureus, I don't have any more only a pair of D.Imitator and they are in a seperate tank and they have not bred.


Well then I would imagine like Reptiletcetera said that it would color up eventually. Too bad they don't stay like that. Azureus are still my favorite frog but your froglet would look cool as an adult. It reminds me of a Green Sip.


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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

Thanks for all your help, I am a little dissapointed to find out it will probably turn blue, I will keep my eye on it and see.
Once again thanks so much.


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## saruchan (Jun 12, 2010)

Before morphing completely out of water the tads/frogs are usually light blue(while still getting its pigments). I've never seen it to that extreme though ,interesting.


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## SamsonsFrogs (Mar 4, 2009)

That is a pretty looking froglet! I would like to possibly see more pictures of it if you wouldn't mind taking the time. I've never seen any azureus look like that and it would be cool to follow its development. 

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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

I have produced a huge amount of Azureus over many years and have never seen this. It even has wristbands, I personaly don't think that this could be pure Azureus, I have never even heard of this before, just my opinion, Bill


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## evolvstll (Feb 17, 2007)

billschwinn said:


> I have produced a huge amount of Azureus over many years and have never seen this. It even has wristbands, I personaly don't think that this could be pure Azureus, I have never even heard of this before, just my opinion, Bill


I am with Bill on this one. I have produced a huge amount of Azureus also and have never seen this. 
What is the background information you have on the parents? Where did you purchase them? Line?


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## Percularis (Mar 22, 2011)

When I saw it I immediately thought that one of the parents could've been a cross between an Azureus and another tinc.


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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

I see the influence of a Patricia in that frog, can you post a pic of some of its siblings from the same litter?


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## Tony (Oct 13, 2008)

billschwinn said:


> I see the influence of a Patricia in that frog, can you post a pic of some of its siblings from the same litter?


Parents too...


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## SamsonsFrogs (Mar 4, 2009)

billschwinn said:


> I see the influence of a Patricia in that frog, can you post a pic of some of its siblings from the same litter?


Thats what I thought of when I first saw the pic. The wristbands were an indicator for me as well.

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## taisavet (Jun 21, 2009)

ive seen this with a few of my breeding pair of Azureus.


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## son of a addict (Jul 3, 2009)

Thats very interesting. You have to love the diversity that still appears even after many generations of captive breeding. For the record my azureus have all morphed almost completely black with just a small amount of blue, then colored up after a few days.


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## Rain_Frog (Apr 27, 2004)

This just goes to show that selecting animals based on color alone is not always reliable for determining the locale.


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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

Can we see some more pics? Thank you.


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## Woodsman (Jan 3, 2008)

There's a lot of color variation in Azureus froglet color. I have not seen any that come out with wrist bands, though. Please post some photos of the parents. Thanks!

Richard.


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## Taron (Sep 23, 2009)

I looked at my tads and I have a azureus with this same coloration. I will take pics tonight.

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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Yes, like many have said, it is normal to occur every now and then. 

I was almost surprised. I was reading down the first page thinking "wow, no one has screamed out hybrid just because they haven't seen this themselves yet" 

Got to page two, and what do you know, there it was.


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## Woodsman (Jan 3, 2008)

Hi Scott,

Do you know for a fact that this is a known bloodline D.t. azureus? I have collected many of the known bloodlines of Azureus and do see a lot of variation in the froglets (though I have not seen bracelets in my Azureus froglets). Requesting photos of the parent frogs would be the normal course of order in trying to help the OP determine if his concern about the frog is justified.

I don't know if the snarkiness helps throw any light one the subject.

Thanks, Richard.



Scott Richardson said:


> Yes, like many have said, it is normal to occur every now and then.
> 
> I was almost surprised. I was reading down the first page thinking "wow, no one has screamed out hybrid just because they haven't seen this themselves yet"
> 
> Got to page two, and what do you know, there it was.


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## Taron (Sep 23, 2009)

So I went home after work and snapped some pics. I took two pics one of a azureus tad and one of a oyapok tad.

Here is the azureus tad where the white bracelet is visible. This tad is showing more blue but some I have show more white.









This is a oyapok tad which looks really similar to the tadpole in question. However I have ran across many azureus that look similar to this tad.









A week prior when they both had tails and they showed no difference.

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## illinoisfrogs (Apr 16, 2010)

Woodsman said:


> I don't know if the snarkiness helps throw any light one the subject.
> 
> Thanks, Richard.


I love the use of the word "snarkiness"!


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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

The adult pair were bought as a sexed proven pair from Alpha Pro Breeders.
Here are a couple of pictures of the parents plus one of the other frog lets.
Sorry about the quality of the pictures.
Thanks everyone for all your help.


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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

If you need better pictures of the parents I will take some tomorrow and post them.
Let me know, as I know the pictures are not very clear but it is all I have until I take some new ones.
The male is the one sitting in the dish.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

billschwinn said:


> I have produced a huge amount of Azureus over many years and have never seen this. It even has wristbands, I personaly don't think that this could be pure Azureus, I have never even heard of this before, just my opinion, Bill


Here Richard. Thanks Taron


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## Phyllobates azureus (Aug 18, 2010)

PhoenixFrog said:


> I have only one proven pair of D. Azureus, I don't have any more only a pair of D.Imitator and they are in a seperate tank and they have not bred.


Not to be annoying or anything, but the modern name is Ranitomeya imitator, not Dendrobates imitator.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Phyllobates azureus said:


> Not to be annoying or anything, but the modern name is Ranitomeya imitator, not Dendrobates imitator.


Yes, but for over 50 years, it was dendrobates

When you are used to calling something by a certain name for years and years, it is hard to change.


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## Taron (Sep 23, 2009)

No problem scott and I think we can all sleep better tonight knowing its a azureus baby. Which it is and the parents are azureus. Give the little guy some time to color up.

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## PhoenixFrog (Dec 19, 2010)

Thanks to everyone for all their help, it has been very interesting and informative.
Here are two better pictures of the parents.


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

Scott Richardson said:


> Yes, but for over 50 years, it was dendrobates
> 
> When you are used to calling something by a certain name for years and years, it is hard to change.


Ranitomeya imitator was first described as Dendrobates imitator in 1986 by Schulte. However, no frog dies when you call them Dendrobates.


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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

I learn something new everyday.


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## epiphytes etc. (Nov 22, 2010)

is it me, or does the adult male have some slight wrist bands?


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Chris Miller said:


> Ranitomeya imitator was first described as Dendrobates imitator in 1986 by Schulte. However, no frog dies when you call them Dendrobates.


True, following Silverstone's reclassification of the Dendrobatidae group in 1975. 
You are referring to his find along the tarapoto-yurimaguas road. It was added to the Quinquevittatus group at the time.

However, Imitator was first described in Germany in 1953, but was assumed to be a member of Ventrimaculatus.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Oh, great website btw Chris. Just put two and two together. Planning on hitting the Wheaton show this summer.


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

Scott Richardson said:


> However, Imitator was first described in Germany in 1953, but was assumed to be a member of Ventrimaculatus.


I was thinking just along the lines of when it was recognized as it's own species. But again everyone knows what someone means when they say dendrobates. 



Scott Richardson said:


> Oh, great website btw Chris. Just put two and two together. Planning on hitting the Wheaton show this summer.


Thanks! Needs some updates. Let me know when you make it; you are more than welcome to swing by for a frogroom visit.


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## markpulawski (Nov 19, 2004)

Newly morphing froglets can look very strange depending on what you feed the tads, feeding color enhancing flakes can dramatically change what an emerging froglet looks like. It would be better to check this guy out in 3 -5 months and then assess its appearance.


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

markpulawski said:


> Newly morphing froglets can look very strange depending on what you feed the tads, feeding color enhancing flakes can dramatically change what an emerging froglet looks like. It would be better to check this guy out in 3 -5 months and then assess its appearance.


No! By waiting that long to find out, we have to waste so much precious speculation time. Haha.


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## Scott Richardson (Dec 23, 2010)

Chris Miller said:


> No! By waiting that long to find out, we have to waste so much precious speculation time. Haha.


I was reading a thread on Dart Den, and the OP said He had a forty breeder with 4 frogs. A green auratus, a blue auratus, a white and brown auratus, and an azureus. And If he got a 75 gallon how many more frogs could he put in there. 

They all about shit!!!!!!!!! And explained mixing is bad.......

So he said he understood, and would set the 75 up for some tincs and put the azureus in with the other tincs. He wanted tincs, because they wouldn't be mixed, but each frog would be different colors, because tincs come in so many different colors. It would make a better display. 


I was rolling on the floor reading it. I imagine a couple of strokes took place.


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## jbherpin (Oct 16, 2009)

To me, this is a potential demonstration of the connection of other Tincs to Azureus Tincs through genetics. As said before, however rare it may be, some froglets will show some old genes just through pure chance alone. I think it is pretty interesting, and would love update pics.

JBear


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