# First breeding behavior!! :D what to do next?



## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

Im so happy! I've been waiting so long and i finally saw my male azureus on top of my female! She started jumping with him on her but it ended in about 10 seconds, then it started again for another 5. This is my first darts to have breeding behavior. I didnt see calling, though i'm positive it was mating behavior. So my questions are, what should i do next? Im guessing increase spraying and throw a ton of food in and then....? I only have one coco hut with a petri dish in it and a film can, what else should i put in there to entise breeding? And one more thing, to get my male to call should i play a video of azureus calling? Thanks for all the help! 

-Nick


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## heckler (Dec 28, 2011)

Are you positive it was male on female? As far as I know, azureus don't partake in traditional male on female's back mating. Your signature says you have 2 females. It could be the 2 females fighting


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

Yes im positive it was the male and female. They were from an original pair that i baught proven, the other female was raised by me and they look very different. And how i know it was the male on top is because of the markings on his head, the first time i didnt see but then I watched him follow her and do it again.


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Sorry to break it to you man but it seems like to me that you have a rare case of male on female aggression. Females court the males not the other way around. 
Sorry 
Buddy


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## Amphinityfrogs (Jan 30, 2013)

Like buddy said it sounds like aggression, with dart frogs generaly the breeding behavior consist of the male calling and the female giving the male a "back rub "


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

damn! After being a proven pair can that happen? I dont know if you have kept mantellas but it looked exactly like when mantellas breed, the male gets on top and wraps his arms on her.


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

Well it seems like i will have to keep trying. How can i end the argession??


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

reptiles12 said:


> damn! After being a proven pair can that happen? I dont know if you have kept mantellas but it looked exactly like when mantellas breed, the male gets on top and wraps his arms on her.


That is amplexus. Dart frogs don't breed this way. I have a pair of azureus I moved to a new 40B. The male instantly wrapped around the females throat and rode her around the cage. I pulled him for the night, put him back in today, and now they're courting again. This pair had been together for two years.


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## jdooley195 (Oct 19, 2009)

reptiles12 said:


> They were from an original pair that i baught proven, the other female was raised by me and they look very different.


Are there 2 females in this tank?

Some shady sellers may label frogs as proven, even though they are not...I'm not at all saying that's what happened, but it's a possibility. (No offense if the seller is reading this, just putting out the possibilities)

I've had about 10 pairs of Azureus over the past few years, and have never seen this except once...The male jumped on the female upon introduction, 10 seconds later he called, then he jumped off, the next morning I had eggs and never saw this behavior again.


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

Alright maybe there some hope for me haha. There are two females, I have never seen fighting in the cage except for right now if it was agression. The guy originally told me that he had the frogs in a trio but he had too many tads from the trio so he pulled a female. One is noticably always wider than the other but there is no real size difference. it looks as if it was sold as a regular pair. Maybe ill play an audio track and watch the reaction of the male.


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## jdooley195 (Oct 19, 2009)

Well, regardless of which frog was on which, the first preventative step to avoid aggression would be to pull a female out. Two Azureus females with one male in a tank usually leads to trouble.

On that note, you could post some good pictures (focus on the front toes) of all of these three frogs in the Identification section, and we could double check the sexes for you (in case you have 3 females or 2 males or something unexpected).

-Tommy


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

I have already had the sexes checked. Both females have rather small toe disks and the males are huge. I could only grab a photo of the one female though that I took in the past. I can post it in a few minutes.


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

reptiles12 said:


> damn! After being a proven pair can that happen? I dont know if you have kept mantellas but it looked exactly like when mantellas breed, the male gets on top and wraps his arms on her.


That is definitely aggression.
Buddy


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

Back to the original questions...if you've never had frogs contemplating breeding....what ARE the things you should do?? I hate to admit total ignorance...but other than the coconut hut, petri dish...misting...what? If the fertilized eggs are in the petri dish...do you let the parents take care of them?? Okay...back to the forum boards for the care of the eggs...don't whip up on me...


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## koldshot (Jan 21, 2010)

Judy S said:


> I hate to admit total ignorance...but other than the coconut hut, petri dish...misting...what?


Playing a nature cd with sounds of rainforest and rain, or open windows during rain to let the sounds in. Look in massage/relaxation type sections for cds or pm me.


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## Buddysfrogs (Mar 29, 2012)

Judy S said:


> Back to the original questions...if you've never had frogs contemplating breeding....what ARE the things you should do?? I hate to admit total ignorance...but other than the coconut hut, petri dish...misting...what? If the fertilized eggs are in the petri dish...do you let the parents take care of them?? Okay...back to the forum boards for the care of the eggs...don't whip up on me...


I would pull out the petri dish and put the top on. In two days check on it and lighty put a couple drops of RO water in. Make sure they stay wet, but not submerged for the two or 3 weeks.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Here are a couple videos of tinc courting. First one is a pair of Azureus. The second one is one of my pairs. Notice how the female follows and taps the male on the legs and back.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

koldshot said:


> Playing a nature cd with sounds of rainforest and rain, or open windows during rain to let the sounds in. Look in massage/relaxation type sections for cds or pm me.


Should I assume you're talking about my frogs???


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

Thanks for all the help, I will just have to keep trying and hopefully I can get them to breed. I'll try to play some CDs or something off YouTube. It's only been 4 months since I baught them so maybe they still need to get back into it.


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## WendySHall (Aug 31, 2010)

I know that the calls will work for leucs and terribilis...but I've honestly never had a tinc respond in any which way to the calls.

Whether they be male/female or female/female...I have to agree with everyone else. It sounds like aggression. Keep an eye on them. If it continues and one starts to lose weight or hide a lot, consider separating.


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## limike (Dec 29, 2012)

There must be something in the air. I got home today from a dart frog road trip and there was my male azureus on my female holder her down. I was watching to see what happened next and sure enough when he got off, she was courting him. bobbing her head, rubbing his back. This seemed to go on and off for some time. I dont know, but to be honest it seemed to get her going?


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

So lucky!!!  I can't get mine to start and I try everything. Also, I havnt seen any other aggression in the tank and never have in the past. I will most likely remove one female if it happens again. The guy told me it was a successful trio at one point so I will trust him for now. Again thanks for the help guys.


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## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

Don't push them to hard. They still have to be willing to breed before any breeding happens. If I were you I would most definitely pull one of the females. Probably the one that the male seems to like the least. My pair of Azureus did weird things when they were first getting started and occasionally they still do weird things. Just give them some time. They may just need to get comfortable or something.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

I haven't checked yet on the forum categories...but wouldn't it be great to have a repository on DB with the calls of the various species that could be used to stimulate breeding...I do not have the experience (or time actually), but it seems it would be do-able....


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## carola1155 (Sep 10, 2007)

Judy S said:


> I haven't checked yet on the forum categories...but wouldn't it be great to have a repository on DB with the calls of the various species that could be used to stimulate breeding...I do not have the experience (or time actually), but it seems it would be do-able....


This already exists elsewhere... 

http://www.dendrobates.org/species.html

http://www.mistking.com/pages.php?pageid=5

Also, you can YouTube a lot of videos of calls.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

I guess I was looking for "the easy way" by having all of them in one place...and going through the You Tube route is kinda a pain...a lot of them are really very short, or have a bunch of background noise...that sort of thing...but I appreciate the imput...


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

OH! Now all I have to do is futz around and figure out how to play the dang things...Mist King seems to have the topic covered! "Nero" is giving me fits....


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## WendySHall (Aug 31, 2010)

You're right...it's hard to find good calls. Here's the best You Tube ones that I have in my bookmarks for Tincs...


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

I saw some more agression between females so i separated the one female and im going to place it up for sale with a few others


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## limike (Dec 29, 2012)

Well I guess it wasn't aggression in my viv, I came home to a little surprise today


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

I'm still hoping, congrats


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Grats!


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## limike (Dec 29, 2012)

Thanks guys


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## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

reptiles12 said:


> I saw some more agression between females so i separated the one female and im going to place it up for sale with a few others


Don't place it up for sale to soon. If I were you I'd hang on to her (unless you don't have a viv for her) and wait to see how the other female does with the male. It may sound silly at first, but some frogs don't like other frogs. Even if it is a male and female. The one you take out might breed more with the male than the one you leave in. So I'd hang on to the extra female just in case.


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## reptiles12 (Jul 18, 2012)

Hey guys im not kidding this time! lol i caught my azureus in the act today . I have some videos if you guys would like to look, they are of the female following the male around stroking his back and of them in position in a clear film can i put in. They actually tipped the can over haha. Sound i be ready to search for eggs tomorrow? the flim can has a cm of water in it that is conctantly running through it though so they will have to lay somewhere else. Should I put a second coco hut in tonight?? I can post the videos on youtube if you guys want.


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## KC3 (Sep 12, 2012)

I'd like to see 



reptiles12 said:


> Hey guys im not kidding this time! lol i caught my azureus in the act today . I have some videos if you guys would like to look, they are of the female following the male around stroking his back and of them in position in a clear film can i put in. They actually tipped the can over haha. Sound i be ready to search for eggs tomorrow? the flim can has a cm of water in it that is conctantly running through it though so they will have to lay somewhere else. Should I put a second coco hut in tonight?? I can post the videos on youtube if you guys want.


If this were the case how long should you wait before switching mates in hopes of breeding? A month, several months, a year? I've had similar issues where the female just doesn't seem interested and was curious? 



Elliot said:


> Don't place it up for sale to soon. If I were you I'd hang on to her (unless you don't have a viv for her) and wait to see how the other female does with the male. It may sound silly at first, but some frogs don't like other frogs. Even if it is a male and female. The one you take out might breed more with the male than the one you leave in. So I'd hang on to the extra female just in case.


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## Elliot (Apr 6, 2011)

It depends. My Azureus are seasonal breeders of sorts. Even though I can get them to breed almost anytime I want to they breed better and more willingly during the spring warm up period. Basically right now. Certain frogs prefer certain seasons than others. You might have a frog that likes fall or winter better than spring. If you want to be 100% sure that a certain pair can't work together than I would wait a year, but it really comes down to you observing them as closely as you can with out disturbing them. If you really feel like they just won't work at all, then I would say move on. There is no real formula for me or anywhere for that matter. Nobody knows their frogs quite like their owners, so the decision really comes down to you.


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