# mites gone forever!!



## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Ok so i have been doing some research at home for finding a natural solution to mite infestation of spring tail cultures that will control mites and be safe for the springs and frogs.And to my amazement it seems to have worked in fact so well all infested cultures treated are mite free and booming again with no cleaning involved.So before i decide to publish my method for our entire hobby i would like others that have the funds,means,and time to conduct their own experiments to back up my findings.experience with springs favored.


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## markpulawski (Nov 19, 2004)

Would this work for fly cultures?


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## Celtic Aaron (Jun 12, 2013)

I am considering starting a breeding stock with the culture I just acquired. What can I do to help reduce the problem with mites? Will this also work with my fly cultures? Thanks for the help.

Aaron


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

I became interested in finding natural solutions that worked on mites or aphids for plant application. While reading a few random threads i found a thread where a grower of a certain controlled substance used garlic extract in a water dilute sprayed on and under the leaf. While it does not kill the adult spider mite it somehow halts the growth completely or kills off the egg. So after the adults die no more hatch....no more mites! Ok i realize we are talking about two different species of mites how do i know it will still apply you ask??? Because i tried it 5 times !!!  I decided to go with garlic powder for three reasons 1) im cheap and i already had it. 2) i figured they could eat it. 3) because i thought for charcoal it may work better rather than it just running off.Which as doug has brought to my attention may not be the case and garlic extract may be better allowing a better coverage and faster results. My method i simply took 5 infested cultures and sprinkled a light dusting of garlic powder over the suface of the charcoal every time i feed my springs.Given the average life cycle of a mite is 30 days or less you will notice a gradual decrease in mites until you have nothing but dead mite exo's and a booming spring culture. Dougs method may and probebly will work better ..So with that being said let the experiment start !


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Celtic Aaron said:


> I am considering starting a breeding stock with the culture I just acquired. What can I do to help reduce the problem with mites? Will this also work with my fly cultures? Thanks for the help.
> 
> Aaron


Been wondering the same about the flies my self... Hmmmm.


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## Toxic (Jul 9, 2012)

Will this also work with isopod cultures? or is it only for springtails?


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Toxic said:


> Will this also work with isopod cultures? or is it only for springtails?


I still have not tested it but i have no reason to believe it would not work.


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## JasonE (Feb 7, 2011)

Its brilliant. Thanks for sharing this. I can't wait to try it.


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## Brian317 (Feb 11, 2011)

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing! 

So you just sprinkled a small amount of Garlic powder over an infested culture during feeding? Did you see any ill effect to the springtails? Did you try just charcoal cultures or have you tried other substrates?

I'm looking forward to trying this out! I hate mites!!!


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Brian317 said:


> Very interesting. Thanks for sharing!
> 
> So you just sprinkled a small amount of Garlic powder over an infested culture during feeding? Did you see any ill effect to the springtails? Did you try just charcoal cultures or have you tried other substrates?
> 
> I'm looking forward to trying this out! I hate mites!!!


Yes just lightly dust the surface.No ill effect on the springs in fact they eat it.And i have not tried any other substrate yet.


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## oddlot (Jun 28, 2010)

Thanks for the info.That's easy enough to try.I thought it was going to be more expensive to try by the way you wrote "if you have the funds" in your original post,but this is realistically not expensive at all and if it works will be priceless!This may be a good preventive action as well.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

oddlot said:


> Thanks for the info.That's easy enough to try.I thought it was going to be more expensive to try by the way you wrote "if you have the means" in your original post,but this is realistically not expensive at all and if it works will be priceless!


I was just looking to attract those interested in taking the time to see if its something that will benifit the hobby in the long run.Rather than just putting out info that has only been tested on a small scale.


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## oddlot (Jun 28, 2010)

I hear you,I was almost scared off being I was laid off for the holidays and didn't want to spend a ton of cash on it, but figured I would see what it was about and if I could afford it.I can though.I am curious why/how it works and think that it could be a good preventative.I agree that if it works for springs that it should be good for isos unless it works by destroying the exoskeleton.Either way definitely worth trying.Thanks again.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

oddlot said:


> I hear you,I was almost scared off being I was laid off for the holidays and didn't want to spend a ton of cash on it, but figured I would see what it was about and if I could afford it.I can though.I am curious why/how it works and think that it could be a good preventative.I agree that if it works for springs that it should be good for isos unless it works by destroying the exoskeleton.Either way definitely worth trying.Thanks again.


As i stated before it does not kill the adult mite but rather the egg.So i doubt it would effect the iso and it doesnt effect the springs exo either.And your welcome enjoy.


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

Holy crap this make total sense. I have two mite infested pink and silver cultures. I'm going to split them and try this out.

If this really works, man you have stumbled upon something that is seriously game changing!

This has me thinking of all kinds of crazy things to try in on though. Garlic is such an amazing product. I used to grind it up and add it to a custom fish food I made.

Some ideas:

1.) Could it work with fruit flies? I'm going to try adding 1/4 tsp to a culture and see if it has any affect on mites or flies.

2.) what about lightly powdering fly storage areas? A natural chemical free mite prevention. I hate the way fly paper makes my fingers smell and don't like the water/soap method.

3.) and this one is really out there. But what about powdering flies for frogs directly? We know that is has some amazing healing properties in humans and animals, but could it do the same for frogs? Obviously there are some ethical implications and risks experimenting here.


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## JPccusa (Mar 10, 2009)

ZookeeperDoug said:


> 2.) what about lightly powdering fly storage areas? A natural chemical free mite prevention. I hate the way fly paper makes my fingers smell and don't like the water/soap method.


You can try using food grade diatomaceous earth.


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## Brian317 (Feb 11, 2011)

marylanddartfrog said:


> Yes just lightly dust the surface.No ill effect on the springs in fact they eat it.And i have not tried any other substrate yet.


Thanks for the reply and I have a couple infested pink and silver cultures on both Charcoal and coco/leaf litter mix. Looking forward to trying it out. As Doug mentioned...I may try to see if it works on fly cultures as well.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Systematic and Applied Acarology 2007

RACHNA GULATI; Potential of garlic as grain protectants against Tyrophagus putrescentiae Schrank and Suidasia nesbitti Hughes in wheat; 2007; Systematic & Applied Acarology 12, 19–25.

I would be careful with claims of it having no effect on springtails, or isopods... the active ingredient has effectiveness against other arthropods.... 


S.H. HoCorresponding author contact information, a, L. Koha, Y. Maa, Y. Huanga, K.Y. Simb; 1996;The oil of garlic, Allium sativum L. (Amaryllidaceae), as a potential grain protectant against Tribolium castaneum (Herbst) and Sitophilus zeamais Motsch; Postharvest Biology and Technology (9)1: 41-48

I should also note that there are mites that do feed on garlic so you may swap one species for another if your not careful. 

Some comments 

Ed


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## skarasek (Mar 2, 2012)

Any idea what it is actually doing?


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## epiphytes etc. (Nov 22, 2010)

Just to be clear, did you use garlic powder, or granulated garlic?


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Garlic powder


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

epiphytes etc. said:


> Just to be clear, did you use garlic powder, or granulated garlic?


Either should work.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Ed said:


> Systematic and Applied Acarology 2007
> 
> RACHNA GULATI; Potential of garlic as grain protectants against Tyrophagus putrescentiae Schrank and Suidasia nesbitti Hughes in wheat; 2007; Systematic & Applied Acarology 12, 19–25.
> 
> ...


If mites that feed on garlic are transported via powder.would extract be better?And would they even be a threat?Or another food source?


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Ed said:


> Systematic and Applied Acarology 2007
> 
> RACHNA GULATI; Potential of garlic as grain protectants against Tyrophagus putrescentiae Schrank and Suidasia nesbitti Hughes in wheat; 2007; Systematic & Applied Acarology 12, 19–25.
> 
> ...


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

I would think that if somehow someone got mites that fed on garlic, that getting rid of them would be pretty easy. Just stop using garlic for a while. I'm also thinking that using garlic extract might be a good way to avoid that potential issue.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

dscichlids said:


> Sorry saw it after i post that


Its cool maybe a mod can shorten the thread a little to just to knock off the first few pages.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

ZookeeperDoug said:


> Holy crap this make total sense. I have two mite infested pink and silver cultures. I'm going to split them and try this out.
> 
> If this really works, man you have stumbled upon something that is seriously game changing!
> 
> ...







Hey doug after doing a little more reading on garlic it also has some anti molding & anti bacterial properties that may be useful for ff cultures as well as fixing the mite issue.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Found something else pretty cool thats spring & garlic-ish related....I found this article about garlic mustard and its relationship with springs.Didnt want to create another garlic named thread so im putting it here 

http://www.bioone.org/doi/abs/10.1656/045.020.0205


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Heres a pic .Its in the mustard family and smells like garlic....can i eat it? jk


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

Some fish flakes are based on the antibacterial properties of garlic. 
Alliaria officinalis seems to be very common here, but I'm not an expert on plants. 
I follow this thread with interest.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

marylanddartfrog said:


> Heres a pic .Its in the mustard family and smells like garlic....can i eat it? jk


it is a real pest in pastures...a pretty plant with yellow flowers...kids used to get paid for each plant they pulled up... you can eat it... About the garlic...wonder whether making garlic "water" the same way you make tannin "tea" for tadpoles would have a place in this program...so when you mist the springtails and isopods, there is another method..or would that be pointless??


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Hey judy.I guess springs can eat it maybe....I think the article is saying the plant changes the soil PH which in turn attract more springs...I think regulating the ph in the water of a charcoal culture may be more effective.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Judy S said:


> it is a real pest in pastures...a pretty plant with yellow flowers...kids used to get paid for each plant they pulled up... you can eat it... About the garlic...wonder whether making garlic "water" the same way you make tannin "tea" for tadpoles would have a place in this program...so when you mist the springtails and isopods, there is another method..or would that be pointless??


Could make an intresting spice....hmmm....


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

Acidic or basic PH?


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Alkaline increase


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

My bad....I'm confusing two weeds...and I should know better... The yellow bloomed weed in pastures is a springtime weed, and is commonly called mustard weed...the other weed is much more obnoxious--and really hard to eradicate...


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

@Marylanddartfrogs: Just what I thought. When I was using tap water in my cultures, I noticed more production of springtails. Now I use RO water or acidic water, and I have less production. I'll try again alkaline water. 
Thank you, really useful this thread.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

rigel10 said:


> @Marylanddartfrogs: Just what I thought. When I was using tap water in my cultures, I noticed more production of springtails. Now I use RO water or acidic water, and I have less production. I'll try again alkaline water.
> Thank you, really useful this thread.


No problem glad to help.


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## epiphytes etc. (Nov 22, 2010)

I can testify that the springs on the propagation bench at the nursery really thrive in tap water, which is liquid rock here, chlorine and all.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

im gonna do a little PH adjusting


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Judy S said:


> My bad....I'm confusing two weeds...and I should know better... The yellow bloomed weed in pastures is a springtime weed, and is commonly called mustard weed...the other weed is much more obnoxious--and really hard to eradicate...



The yellow flowered one in the spring and summer is field mustard (Brassica rapa) and the white flowered one in the fall is garlic mustard (Alliaria petiolata) and yes both are edibles. 

I don't think that at least with garlic mustard, it would be a good idea to pour a tisane or tea made from it into a culture and from there into your enclosures. It has allopathic abilities and can impact root growth. See An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie

Some comments 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

marylanddartfrog said:


> Found something else pretty cool thats spring & garlic-ish related....I found this article about garlic mustard and its relationship with springs.Didnt want to create another garlic named thread so im putting it here
> 
> An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie


There are some other possible explanations as well 

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but I suspect that calcium bioavailability is critical since it is of major importance in the formation of chitin. As an anecdotal observation, I've seen a significant difference in springtail colonies between those with straight charcoal and those that were a mixture of charcoal and Turface or marble chips. 

Some comments 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

marylanddartfrog said:


> And as far as claims to no effect on springs is my own conclusion of over a month of application.And the reason for this thread .In hopes others can test and come up with their own conclusions and data.



Again, this doesn't mean that you can claim it is safe as your not evaluating the effect on the springtails per se... Given it's wide toxicity, I would suspect that in your system, the dose isn't sufficient to crash the springtails but I'm willing to bet that it is doing something to them... 

You may want to track down this citation.... 

Hui, Wang; Youquan,Yang; Jianing, Li; Morphology, damage and control of springtails (Collembola) feeding on garlic; Institute of Agricultural Information, Chinese Academy of Agricultural Sciences

Keep in mind that several of the articles on the use of garlic's active ingredients for pest control indicate that there can be nutritional impacts on the arthropods. 

In addition not all species of mites are affected by the active ingredients in garlic.. there are a number that actually show population increases in it's presence including soil dwelling or detrivore species like the Cunaxidae of which many are predators of soil dwelling arthropods. 

I'm not saying to not use it to control mites just that people need to be aware that there are potential downsides and it may not work for everyone... 

Some comments 

Ed


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Ed said:


> Again, this doesn't mean that you can claim it is safe as your not evaluating the effect on the springtails per se... Given it's wide toxicity, I would suspect that in your system, the dose isn't sufficient to crash the springtails but I'm willing to bet that it is doing something to them...
> 
> You may want to track down this citation....
> 
> ...






Everything has a down side.But the only way to get past speculation its to test.And then test again.Im not really comfortable with guessing or betting i need data.which is why im not saying it has zero long term effects for eveyone that uses it.And i believe their is a huge margin for error but the only way to learn boundaries is to push them.


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Ed said:


> Again, this doesn't mean that you can claim it is safe as your not evaluating the effect on the springtails per se... Given it's wide toxicity, I would suspect that in your system, the dose isn't sufficient to crash the springtails but I'm willing to bet that it is doing something to them...
> 
> You may want to track down this citation....
> 
> ...




If someone cannot read " my own conclusion" then maybe they have a comprehension issue .Which is an entirely different problem altogether.And probably Havent read the thread in its entirety which leads to the problem of assumption.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I see two people saying similar things in different ways. "Proceed TESTING with caution. It MAY help, it MAY still have problems of it's own. Please don't just flood every culture you have with various garlic extacts, as it is NOT yet PROVEN fully safe."
But that's just what I see.


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## Sirjohn (Jan 1, 2014)

I think that everyone is losing the spirit of this... 

Yes there are pros and cons to everything, truth be told. But I think that what was originally suggested was experimentation. This is not a cure all.. Its a possible direction to a problem that plagues the hobby..

The exact doses, the exact element Oil, powder, whatever.. The base being Garlic. Its up to everyone to cunduct their own experiments with this direction and reveal their findings here for others to add. Even in a lab experiment there are not so many people working on the same thing as obvious by all the posts in response to this thread. 

This was not meant to be ongoing, as once rid of the mites and culturs cleaned, can the new growth be added to create new cultures free of mites.. These are questions that WE as a group have to answer through trial and error and experimentation..

Edison had an idea, and tried 1000 times before eventually finding the correct materials amounts and order, to create his vision.. He then said, I know 1000 ways it does not work, but its the ONE way we are all looking for... 

Practically all of us culture springtails, and isos at minimum to seed out tanks, and certainly use FF as a main food source.. Lets all explore the possibilities with this potentially good mite elimiator.. I know there are hundreds that have read this thread, that means 100's of experiments can be made with caution of course. What is the exact dose? is one dose enough? etc...

Thats my 2 cents worth...


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

Any updates ?


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## marylanddartfrog (Jun 6, 2011)

been using tums also seems to help production.


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## toostrange (Sep 19, 2013)

Have been using on 1 spring and 1 dwarf white culture that were infested with mites. Have seen serious decline in mite population. Not noticing any adverse affects on spring or iso population. Still early to tell long term affects,so we'll see. No harm done woulda thrown cultures out anyway.
Thanks for starting post this just could be help for problem that plagues most if us.


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## pinkpony (Mar 22, 2013)

Any more updates? 

I'm hoping this works for mite control. My one and only concern is.. I know they used to recommend adding garlic powder to dog food to help deter fleas. But now they say garlic is bad for dogs except in very small amounts. If the bugs do in fact eat the garlic, will it affect the frogs? I know you can't gut load flies so that isn't an issue (I don't think?). But what about the isos? I think I read before that if isos eat a lot of the calcium it can be bad for the frogs.. 

I do plan on trying this garlic method with isos but will wait a while before I use them in a tank with my frogs. Just in case and until someone some how can do some kind of research. 

Thank you for the great idea of trying garlic! ! I added a pinch to a small culture tonight


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## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

just found this, suprised no more updates.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

that's what I love--the digging up of old threads and perhaps some new information to be added...


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## ngeno626 (Nov 14, 2013)

I didn't see this thread when it was started, im going to try the garlic extract method on a culture I have as well. 
Updates would be appreciated.


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## scoy (Jan 22, 2013)

I might be the only person this didnt work for.


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## Miguel_San_Martin (4 mo ago)

ZookeeperDoug said:


> Holy crap this make total sense. I have two mite infested pink and silver cultures. I'm going to split them and try this out.
> 
> If this really works, man you have stumbled upon something that is seriously game changing!
> 
> ...


About number 2 I could add that a more effective way to powder storage areas of any culture (springtails, flies, etc.) is using *Diatomaceous earths*. It's odorless, natural and very effective.
Best regards.


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

This is an old thread. There have been lots of discussions of the various ways to use DE lately -- when searching, ordering results by date is often a good idea for finding relevant info.


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