# Frogs on a train for a few days?



## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

I am moving from Ohio to California within a week or two and I am planning on taking the train (Amtrak) to get there. I may actually pick the train up at Chicago Union Station, wince my father is going that route this weekend and was always the first transfer for any tickets I found in Ohio... 2 days on this train to LAX then a transfer to SJC...

I have 2 tincs (1 yr old) that I obviously either have to give away, or take with me...

According to baggage guidelines you can have 2 carryon bags plus a 12x12x12 that is not counted towards this limit of 2. I am considering using my morphing containers, which are tupperwares of decent size (two next to each other are about 12" wide.. I forget the exact dimensions though) .. and because I need to feed them I will obviously need to bring some FF cultures with me, and I have plenty ready to go, and just made 3 more jars yesterday. I say jars because I use canning jars and not plastic containers, so they should be verry durable during the trip. I might need to find a decent bag/cooler that can fit these guys plus some FF jars, or construct a bag, maybe out of canvas and wood edges. They will be on my lap the entire time so no need to worry about too much or too little heat..

Does anyone know with the recent arrival of TSA at CUS how easy I might be able to slip past "security" and bring them aboard? apparently they dont have xray or anything, but could the drug/bomb sniffing tool (like a digital k9) might find my banana+vinegear+oats+instant potato jars as something else? 
What would really happen if I get caught with little frogs in a container?
If I get caught before bringing them onbaord, anyone in Chicago that might be able to pick them up at a moments notice?

I would love to take them... and on a side note, I might need a vivarium ready to go as soon as I get to San Jose... or else I have to build one up...

Thanks!


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## Deanos (Oct 16, 2012)

Amtrak has a no-pets policy. See here:

Amtrak - Plan - Accessible Travel Services - Service Animals and Pet Policy


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

right, that's why they are going to be in a 12x12x12 bag/box .. the point is that they dont have enough man power/equipment to search everyone


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## ForbiddenFrogs (Feb 5, 2013)

i live in so cal i could have a temp 10 gallon ready for you if you like


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

ForbiddenFrogs, Thanks, very interesting.. Possibly someone closser to the (south) Bay area though... honestly it wouldnt be that difficult for me to get a temp tank going.. I have to get there first, so I'm more interested about sneaking them aboard.


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## carola1155 (Sep 10, 2007)

Your best bet might be to find a trusted member on the board to ship them to... Then when you get there, pick them up. 

If you are going to try sneaking them on the train, I wouldnt bother with fruit fly cultures or anything. The more stuff like that you have, the more potential there is for eyebrows to be raised. The frogs will be fine for a few days without food, just feed heavily before you leave. Just set something up with a local ahead of time to grab a couple cultures when you get there. 

The reality is that this is most likely one of those situations where you are going to need to rely on the generosity of the board to make it work. Luckily, this board is pretty awesome... and you already even have an offer for help with a tank as it is.


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

Beyond my 2 carry-ons and 1 checked in baggage, I will also be transporting my race bicycle, and in that I plan on taking many bicycle tools... I could possibly throw quite a few cultures in there for the arrival. 

Myabe a small salt shaker or something with a hundred flies or so might work out just fine.. I figure the least amount of metal as possible.

It is a bit nerve wracking to figure out... I will actually still have my place here since it might only be for 6 months, and I know of atleast one person that can take care of them when I'm gone, but I'd rather not...

I've never traveled on train before, and especially not in a busy station like Chicago's ... does any one have expierence with the station and possible security?


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## ForbiddenFrogs (Feb 5, 2013)

my brother takes the train from Phoenix Az to here and he sneaks things all the time on there, especially when he was moving back from college, you should be fine, the dogs wouldnt pick up the frog scent, but flys/cultures will be a dead give away, u should send them to the address your moving to, how long is your train ride


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

~66 hrs on trains, I think from Ohio, not sure from Chicago.. basically 3 days
3pm departure time in Chicago... two nights on the train, xfer at LAX, arrive at midnight at SJC


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

I would also go to the bathroom to feed them. No sleeping car.


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

Why are you transporting cultures? Why don't you just buy new ones when you arrive?


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

jacobi said:


> Why are you transporting cultures? Why don't you just buy new ones when you arrive?


Because a 3 day journey might(should?) require food, so why not bring atleast one jar?

Also, I am moving with two of my other buddies, but they are driving there like a week after, I'm sure they have enough space to put a few of the newer jars..

And I suppose I could buy some once I get there. I just dont know what is around, but I'm sure plenty people on this board live in the Bay area

edit: my vivarium is currently installed in a bookshelf and cannot come out, so my buddies would not be able to take it with them, and it's fairly large and his car just isn't


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## ForbiddenFrogs (Feb 5, 2013)

u should send them to the address your goin to, or have a friend send them the day after you leave, the train is ok as well but if u get caught youll lose your frogs....or you can send them to me here and pick up when you get to cali but i live in upland ca 91786 see how close your path is to mine maybe there a bus/train stop we could meet up at, it sux tryn to move long distance and tryn keep the things you love (pet/animal wise), let me know ill help as much as i can, takin the cultures will get you caught by the k9 for sure take something that doesnt put out such a potent scent, like 2day pin head crickets, spring tales


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

ForbiddenFrogs said:


> u should send them to the address your goin to, or have a friend send them the day after you leave, the train is ok as well but if u get caught youll lose your frogs....or you can send them to me here and pick up when you get to cali but i live in upland ca 91786 see how close your path is to mine maybe there a bus/train stop we could meet up at, it sux tryn to move long distance and tryn keep the things you love (pet/animal wise), let me know ill help as much as i can, takin the cultures will get you caught by the k9 for sure take something that doesnt put out such a potent scent, like 2day pin head crickets, spring tales


Thanks for the offer...

I do have a springtail culture...
Will a k9/electronic sniffing device detect banana as bad? maybe the vinegear, but I can make a small salt shaker or so of jsut banana to keep them going for a few days...

I read one account on another forum of successfully going on a 12 hr train ride with his frogs.

I have a few days to figure it out...


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

.... Maybe I should ask my buddies to take care of them for the week... that never really dawned on me... I think we're meeting up tonight so I'll ask then...


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## ForbiddenFrogs (Feb 5, 2013)

askin your buddies is prob your best bet


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

they got the job offer after I did, and so I was sort of stuck on going on the train at the start, and still plan to go on it, just prob without the little dudes... they just have to keep an eye on them and practice feeding them(including dusting)...


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## VenomR00 (Apr 23, 2010)

Really you could just tubaware them for 3 days and they would be fine. Most frogs are fat and overweight anyway. Just over feed three days before hand and by the time you get their they will be perfectly fine. No need to even open it as long as it is moist.

Also the no pet guideline is for domestic pets really. They, as the OP said don't have the power to check every bag. I never once was check when I would travel from Orlando to Fort Lauderdale.


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## johnachilli (Feb 8, 2007)

VenomR00 said:


> Really you could just tubaware them for 3 days and they would be fine. Most frogs are fat and overweight anyway. Just over feed three days before hand and by the time you get their they will be perfectly fine. No need to even open it as long as it is moist.e.


Agreed don't worry about feeding them, they will be fine for the 3 days, most froggers don't feed their adults at home that often. The added stress of having fruitflies crawling all over them during the transport is unneeded.


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## scoy (Jan 22, 2013)

I've never smuggled anything before, but if I did I wouldnt broadcast on the internet what, where, and when I was going to do it. You might wanna go another route.


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

At first glance my friends said Okay, then one of them said too much responsible... *sigh* ... I think I can convince the other guy

actually, I did find a different route that works well for my schedule.... but it's longer by another full day...

I'm not that worried about broadcasting, it's not like people are alergic to them like some are to cats/dogs, nor is it illegal. it's just against their guidelines. If I was transporting hundreds then it would be a concern... Are people really that paranoid?

I have faith in the common man


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## Joesfiddy (Sep 4, 2012)

Some of u guys are making it seem like hes smuggling drugs lol. No worries man they are just frogs.


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## papafrogger (Oct 21, 2012)

In all reality quantity isnt a factor. Transporting animals across state lines may very well be illegal. To my knowledge you could be violating the lacey act. Another thing is what you are transporting. The legal ownership of darts is not very widely known. Chances are if you happen to be caught the officers will see small, exotic frogs, and immediately question their legality. Sure the risk of getting caught is low, but are the consequences of being caught and quite possibly charged with smuggling worth that risk? Personally i say no. Ship them to a local to hold til you can pick up. Better to be safe than sorry.

Sent from my LG-LS840 using Tapatalk 2


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

I may be able to get my buddies to bring them, I dont see why not... I think because the guy that sort of said 'no' just had to give away his fish for the move... and he only had them like a month or two tops... maybe he can bond with my lil guys for the ride...

I wont be going in at chicago anymore, so a much smaller station... which should make this easier if I do need to sneak them aboard...


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## TheCoon (Feb 8, 2011)

Just do it. They don't need food for the trip. Buy flies when you get there. Seal the container they are in very well. Pack it out of sight. 

If instead the paranoia of the board rubs off on you, ship to a respected member and pick them up when you arrive. 

While it is against the company's policy, I believe they are more likely to focus their attention on larger animals such as cats and dogs, rather than a frog hidden away in some luggage. Not to mention the other ILLEGAL things they would be searching for, of which frogs are not.


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## scoy (Jan 22, 2013)

Why dont you just call the amtrak and explaine your situation. They are prolly more talking about cats and dogs when they say 'pets' . Just explain they'll never leabe your carry on and or be out in the open. I mean what if someone took the train home everyday and stopped by the pet store and bought a fish. Do you think they would tell them to get rid of it before boarding? But I gotta warn you leave the poison part out of dart frogs when asking, I explained I was building a vivarium to the lady at home depot when buying supplies and she ask me if I was scared that they would spit poison darts at me. Haha you wouldnt believe what some people think.


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## skanderson (Aug 25, 2011)

i thought this was going to be the title for the sequel to 'Snakes on a plane'.


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

Train ticket bought... and I am told by the buddy that said No, that he is still saying No... so looks like the lil dudes will go on train ride with me


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## Bjcg (Jan 4, 2013)

Sometimes you just gotta do what you gotta do 
U could also grab a couple of those salsa cups and put them in there with moist paper towel and put them in your pocket while you get on the train. Then you can place them on that other container in the bathroom?????? Might work

-Bryan


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

Guess what fellas? Ohhh yeah, 2 frogs, 200 flies in salt shaker w/ banana and 6 full jars


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

Just fed them for the night... used the changing table.. they were scared


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## ICS523 (Mar 10, 2012)

I wouldn't feed them again, they are stressed and they wont eat and the flies are making it worse. Chill out a little, They will be fine for a few days without food. Clearly you have a very strict feeding scheduled, but a lot of people (Hello) just sorta feed their frogs every few days, with no ill effects. Just think of this as shipping, but without all the shipping employees tossing them around. keep them humid and try to leave them alone as much as possible.
Good luck


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## Blue_Pumilio (Feb 22, 2009)

There is NOTHING illegal about transferring these frogs across state lines. No Lacey Act is being violated. People really need to calm down, just a couple frogs that he wants to take with him. They're in better hands then if he were to ship them FedEx. It seems like the least stressful way to me. 




papajuggalo said:


> In all reality quantity isnt a factor. Transporting animals across state lines may very well be illegal. To my knowledge you could be violating the lacey act. Another thing is what you are transporting. The legal ownership of darts is not very widely known. Chances are if you happen to be caught the officers will see small, exotic frogs, and immediately question their legality. Sure the risk of getting caught is low, but are the consequences of being caught and quite possibly charged with smuggling worth that risk? Personally i say no. Ship them to a local to hold til you can pick up. Better to be safe than sorry.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS840 using Tapatalk 2


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

Thanks for the advice. They've never really been shipped, I got them as tadpoles at a reptile show.
I saw them grab a few flies before I shoved the tubs back into my bag.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

IMO, leave them alone and in the dark for the duration of the trip. They don't need food. They need peace and quiet and security. Let us know how it goes!


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## Noxz (Jan 12, 2012)

I was waiting on the Cable Guy to install Internet, but he missed his timeslot...

Both tincs made it alright!
And 6 colonizing jars of FF... eating like champs...

Half way through the saltshaker clumped and killed all the flies in there. So I did leave them alone for a few days.. thanks for the knowledge to do that/

I'll figure out a vivarium soon enough.

It is VERY easy to transport frogs through Amtrak.


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