# New to poison dart frogs, need opinions!



## xAlyssaMarie (Aug 15, 2013)

I work at a pet store and I got an AMAZING deal on the Exo Terra 18x18x24 tank. I was trying to figure out what would go good in there, and also be a good conversation piece for my living room. I've decided poison dart frogs. I admire them every time I see them, I spend the most time at their exhibit at the zoo by far. I have the tank, the hood, the bulbs and the thermometer/hydrometer (I'm currently saving up to get the monsoon mister). Now it's time to start getting the supplies for inside the tank.

I'm sticking with Exo-Terra because it's the brand we use where I work, and it's the brand I've grown to trust with my own reptiles. I'm leaning toward getting my frogs from "Josh's Frogs", unless any of you have any better suggestions. 

I've only had personal experience with desert animals, but I take care of lot's of tropical reptiles/amphibians at work so I have the basic concept down.

So I have 3 main questions.

1- What do you think of this starter kit? Is there anything that I don't need, or anything better you could recommend or add on?

Dart Frog Tankless Kit (18x18x24) - Tankless Dart Frog Habitat Kits | Josh's Frogs

2- What do you think about adding the small waterfall in the tank along with the poison dart frogs?

Exo Terra Natural Waterfall with Pump (Small) | Josh's Frogs

3- Lastly, the plants he suggests for the tank. I feel like it might be a little bit excessive, so I might abandoned the kit and just get them separately. And what moss would be the best to get a carpet affect on the bottom of the tank?

18x18x24 Tropical Vivarium Plant Kit | Josh's Frogs


So excited to hear back from whoever takes the time to reply.


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## mfsidore (Oct 10, 2012)

xAlyssaMarie said:


> I work at a pet store and I got an AMAZING deal on the Exo Terra 18x18x24 tank. I was trying to figure out what would go good in there, and also be a good conversation piece for my living room. I've decided poison dart frogs. I admire them every time I see them, I spend the most time at their exhibit at the zoo by far. I have the tank, the hood, the bulbs and the thermometer/hydrometer (I'm currently saving up to get the monsoon mister). Now it's time to start getting the supplies for inside the tank.
> 
> I'm sticking with Exo-Terra because it's the brand we use where I work, and it's the brand I've grown to trust with my own reptiles. I'm leaning toward getting my frogs from "Josh's Frogs", unless any of you have any better suggestions.
> 
> ...


It's a good kit josh definitely knows what he's doing
A small waterfall might be be nice, just make sure it doesn't take up to much space.
Don't buy frog moss for pet stores it lives for 15 minutes. I got lucky and my spagnahm moss turned green and grew. Joshs frogs has good carpet moss. Try another live chat if you haven't tried, do it!!!!¡
Good luck! Hope this helps.
Mike


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## mfsidore (Oct 10, 2012)

Oh if you buy seperatly from a lowes or Home Depot make use u get any fertilizer and junk of. I've bought plant kits form joshs fros and it did very well in my 18 by 18 exo. I bought a brom from from Lowe and didn't clean it, big mistake. Fertilizer was in the dirt, everything came out fine because a very generous db member donated a plant package to me along with micro fauna to fix everything. Another member offered to come to my home and help me fix it. Can't wait to see the tank done!
Mike


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## dartboard (Jan 30, 2011)

A kit is a good way to go the first time... also it seems most people new to the hobby want some kind of water feature, and thats fun as well. I would suggest getting a kit and then getting some beginner frogs and then as you read more about them youll probably get more interested in customizing your future vivs (you can never stop at one... too addicting).

the more leaf litter and plants in the viv, the safer the frogs will feel, and actually the more youll see them out and about. Get some bold big frogs like leucs or tincs. Good luck!


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

It would keep it simple for your first build and leave out the waterfall. You can always get a bigger tank later with more floor area and do a water feature then. Building a first tank is always tough, why complicate it with an unnecessary feature that will end up taking way too much space. Plus the worries if building in access to the pump and making sure everything is watertight. Just keep it simple on this one.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

Hey, welcome to the forum!!  

#1
Ehhhh, the Josh's kit is alright, but it's not the best. It's basically a kit for substrate/false bottom for vivs. I personally recommend this sponsor's Vivarium Base Kits: New England Herpetoculture LLC - Substrate - Vivarium. They also have a handy guide of how much stuff to get for the depth that you want. I can't recommend them highly enough in general.

#2
Lots of people do water features in their vivs. From what I've read if you haven't dealt with water features before you might not want to do a waterfall because pumps can get rocks or dirt stuck in there, and then it's a pain to take apart and get at to fix.

#3
I would recommend not getting the plant kit. Nothing wrong with those plants; it's just more fun to pick and chose you own plants and designing your viv that way  .
I recommend looking through the sponsors and seeing all the different plants they have to offer:
Dendroboard.com - Sponsors
Black jungle has almost 200 different plants to chose from in their Vivarium Plants for Dart Frog Habitats section:
...for Dart Frog Habitats
You can even do orchids!

For moss i recommend either (or both) of NE Herp's terrarium moss or pillow moss, depending on what kind of look you want:
New England Herpetoculture LLC - Moss

Hope that helps, and have fun with it!


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## xAlyssaMarie (Aug 15, 2013)

mfsidore said:


> Oh if you buy seperatly from a lowes or Home Depot make use u get any fertilizer and junk of. I've bought plant kits form joshs fros and it did very well in my 18 by 18 exo. I bought a brom from from Lowe and didn't clean it, big mistake. Fertilizer was in the dirt, everything came out fine because a very generous db member donated a plant package to me along with micro fauna to fix everything. Another member offered to come to my home and help me fix it. Can't wait to see the tank done!
> Mike


Thank you! I can't wait either.


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## xAlyssaMarie (Aug 15, 2013)

hypostatic said:


> Hey, welcome to the forum!!
> 
> #1
> Ehhhh, the Josh's kit is alright, but it's not the best. It's basically a kit for substrate/false bottom for vivs. I personally recommend this sponsor's Vivarium Base Kits: New England Herpetoculture LLC - Substrate - Vivarium. They also have a handy guide of how much stuff to get for the depth that you want. I can't recommend them highly enough in general.
> ...



Yeah I'm probably going to leave out the waterfall for now, maybe put it in at a later date when I'm more comfortable with the environment.

That moss is perfect! Thank you for the link.


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## xAlyssaMarie (Aug 15, 2013)

dartboard said:


> A kit is a good way to go the first time... also it seems most people new to the hobby want some kind of water feature, and thats fun as well. I would suggest getting a kit and then getting some beginner frogs and then as you read more about them youll probably get more interested in customizing your future vivs (you can never stop at one... too addicting).
> 
> the more leaf litter and plants in the viv, the safer the frogs will feel, and actually the more youll see them out and about. Get some bold big frogs like leucs or tincs. Good luck!


I'll probably get the kit just because I know it has everything I need in it, I wouldn't wanna get things separately and leave something important out, or get things that don't work well together.

Thanks for the suggestions!


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## TundraDragons (Jan 24, 2013)

I've done quite a bit of business with josh frogs. and I have a number of frogs and plants in my collection from them, all of them have been healthy and solid frogs, the plants did not do as well as I had hoped but that could have been from rookie mistakes at that time. 

I have also gotten a large number of plants and broms from glassboxtropicals and all of the plants I got from mike were super nice, healthy and I've only lost a couple, again probably due to me not placing them in the correct spot in the viv.

I love my frogs and it has quickly become an obsession for me. I keep leucomelas and E. Anthonyi in the 2 18x18x24 exo terra's I currently have set up. if your serious about a mister though I would go with a mist king rather than the monsoon, I am also an exo terra distributor and I have heard nothing but horror stories about the monsoon. I personally have a aquatic misting system (same as a mist king basically) and it has been 100% flawless. only difference is you will need a separate reservoir, which can sit under your tank if you use a stand. 

i did a lot of looking at peoples vivs before i set up my first one, and i watched josh's frogs how to build a background video about 100 times before doing it myself .  it's much simpler than i anticipated and will be doing 7 more vivs here shortly to house my new groups of frogs.

Have fun with it it's really a blast!
;-)


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## MrBiggs (Oct 3, 2006)

xAlyssaMarie said:


> (I'm currently saving up to get the monsoon mister)


Skip the Monsoon and save up for a basic MistKing setup instead. You'll thank me eventually!


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## shibbyplustax (Feb 28, 2011)

MrBiggs said:


> Skip the Monsoon and save up for a basic MistKing setup instead. You'll thank me eventually!


+1.



New England herp is the way to go too, their awesome there.


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## xAlyssaMarie (Aug 15, 2013)

TundraDragons said:


> I've done quite a bit of business with josh frogs. and I have a number of frogs and plants in my collection from them, all of them have been healthy and solid frogs, the plants did not do as well as I had hoped but that could have been from rookie mistakes at that time.
> 
> I have also gotten a large number of plants and broms from glassboxtropicals and all of the plants I got from mike were super nice, healthy and I've only lost a couple, again probably due to me not placing them in the correct spot in the viv.
> 
> ...


My co-worker was telling me to get the Mist King also, so I think that's the route I'll be taking. I've been researching for months now. I got the tank about 2 months ago, but I haven't fully started anything because I want to know exactly what I'm doing before I have the chance to screw anything up. Thank you for the advice!


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

Honestly, in my opinion? Save your money, skip the misting system, and spend the money on cork for the background (I say cork because after 4 real builds and about 10 practice builds, cork is my favourite basic background). If you use cork, you can use "rounds" to create "branches" coming out of the background. 

As mentioned above, skip the waterfall. It will add nothing visually to the display, and just give you more headaches than anything else.

Edit: Since I noticed you're in NY... http://www.facebook.com/groups/338459806174859?ref=bookmark&__user=100002688852542 there's a lot of friendly locals here


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

ALSO, if you're only dealing with a few/one tanks you can hand mist. That's what I do!


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

hypostatic said:


> ALSO, if you're only dealing with a few/one tanks you can hand mist. That's what I do!


Whoops. Yes, that's what I meant when I said not buy an automatic misting system. I've actually found that I enjoy my vivariums more whem they need more maintenance...


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## Trickishleaf (Jun 29, 2012)

I only have 7 tanks to mist, but I love hand misting. I get to check out the plant growth while I'm spraying and concentrate more on the mossy areas etc...
There's at least one person on here with 50+ tanks who still hand mists because he feels like he enjoys the frogs more.
Forgot who it was though.


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## xAlyssaMarie (Aug 15, 2013)

hypostatic said:


> ALSO, if you're only dealing with a few/one tanks you can hand mist. That's what I do!



I was actually thinking about that, maybe setting it up and then if I feel like getting one later I can. Where I work, we hand mist over 20 terrariums 4 times a day, so I think I can handle one at my house.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

Yeah, I'd imagine you could handle hand misting then lol.

Any idea what frogs you're gonna put in there?


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## jacobi (Dec 15, 2010)

xAlyssaMarie said:


> 20 terrariums


It's very important to provide photographic proof! 

(Sorry for the hijack )


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