# New additions to my collection



## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

I had a friend over to photograph some new additions today, I would just like to thank Ed for all the help and advice he has given me before I acquired these you have been a superb help mate! 

All of these are in separate 10 gallons for QT and nose rub treatments and gradual feeding until they move into a 200 liter vivarium in a few weeks. 

Enough from me here are some _Atelopus. s barbotini _


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## sounddrive (Jan 4, 2007)

how did you get them luck son of a gun, and when can i  awsome frogs.


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## Detrick105 (Apr 16, 2006)

Very nice pic's, beautiful animals. Sure wish they were available here.
Steve


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## bellerophon (Sep 18, 2006)

very cool to see they're in good hands. sure would make a nice addition to ASN :wink:


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## chrism (Apr 11, 2007)

Very jealous Paul!

Very very cool!


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

great frogs!!! best of luck, keep us posted on how they do.


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## meatslim (Jun 6, 2007)

holy crap! those must have set u back... i just saw an episode of "life in cold blood" on those guys.. really amazing animals. too bad they are disappearing


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## flyingkip (Jan 9, 2005)

Here in europe we had some legal imports by http://www.dutch-rana.nl
2 species of the atelopus genus came in.
Barbotini and spumarius. Hopefully people will find something to breed them!

Grtz,
THomas


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## tkromer (Dec 20, 2007)

Those are beautiful! I think I might have to get in line for some froglets in a year


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## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

Thanks everyone for the comments and votes of confidence  

Right now the goal is to keep them alive and hopefully attempt breeding with a few variants in conditions etc.


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## hooky87 (Mar 21, 2008)

stunning Atelopus paul how many have you got are these adult toads

Matt


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## hooky87 (Mar 21, 2008)

also whats nose rub


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## kj (Jan 15, 2006)

Nice looking animals mate, seen them on CB. Wish you all the best with them. 

Nose rub, if you look at there nose you can see there pale, this is because in transport they rub there noses on the rubs basicly,.


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## Guest (Jul 22, 2008)

Great looking toads!! Im sooo jealous.


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## Dancing frogs (Feb 20, 2004)

Very nice!


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## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

Thanks everyone 8) I was wondering if you wold see these khamul! :lol:


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## RBroskie (Jan 21, 2007)

amazing! absolutely gorgeous! look forward to reading of your success with them.


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## Guest (Jul 23, 2008)

MJ said:


> Thanks everyone 8) I was wondering if you wold see these khamul! :lol:


It was destiny, I usually don't check out this subforum. But something inside me told me to look.


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## housevibe7 (Sep 24, 2006)

I noticed the one looks like it is calling. What do their calls sound like Paul? BTW we missed you at NAAC.


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## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

Missed you all as well Sarah but alas the banking world of London needs my soul  

The one that looks like it's calling is just a camera angle thing :? :lol: I think these are the chirping I am hearing in the QT room but then I have a few things in there so I'm not sure the only ones I can pick out at anytime sound like a high pitched duck :lol:


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## 013 (Aug 9, 2006)

Any info one their behaviour? Shy, bold or something in between? I look forward to seeing your set-up.


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## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

It's not that easy to udge right now as I only view them at feeding and misting time so once a day but at this time they seem some what bold.

The robot around all day long :lol: tanks are some what basic right now for easy working on my part but eventually after treating them.. drainage layer, peat plates leaf litter some pothos a water dish each and leaf litter. They will have a water fall/stream and a slow pond in the permanent vivarium lots of plants with sturdy leafs for roosting and cover.


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## valledelcauca (Apr 13, 2004)

Hey Paul, nice Atelopus there

I would recommend to keep the males seperated from the females.
Females = big tank/permanent tank
Males= small "stream" tanks

For breeding I would go by seasons, make a dry season and after that a season with heavy and long lasting misting (soak that tank ). As far as I know putting 1 female into the small tank with 1 male makes them breed. 

Its not the only way and all I`ve seen at a friends house was a clutch off infertilized eggs (which did not make it)

But thats what imitates nature best in my opinion 

Greetings
Andreas


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## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

Thanks Andreas  Already way ahead of you there mate :wink: the males and female will only come into contact when breeding is going to be attempted and then separated if nothing is laid 8) but in this case the females will go into the smaller vivaria as I have a lot more males as do most people.


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## kyle1745 (Feb 15, 2004)

WOW those are wild... Hope everyone has good success with them.


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## valledelcauca (Apr 13, 2004)

Good to see that you already know the basics  Sign me up for some offspring!
Well there`s a rumor which says females need large vivs to "walk" alot, as they seem to do in the wild. You don`t find them around streams but relatively deep in the forest. So thats what I was refering to. But as I mentioned, there are several ways to do it right. I hope you find one soon 8) 

Greetings
Andreas


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## 013 (Aug 9, 2006)

I got 1.1 of these too this weekend. The owner of the shop actualy saw them in their natural habitat in Surinam. 

He told me there aren't any streams in the vicinity and the toads lay their eggs in small puddles, cans and other stuff they find. They often live alongside Tinctorius.


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## *GREASER* (Apr 11, 2004)

013 said:


> "He told me there aren't any streams in the vicinity and the toads lay their eggs in small puddles, cans and other stuff they find. They often live alongside Tinctorius."


I thought all atelopus laid in riparian sites. But I could be wrong but I think that man is mistaken.


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## MJ (Jun 16, 2005)

013 said:


> I got 1.1 of these too this weekend.



I find it highly unlikely you got 1:1 as all the guaranteed female where sold with only possible females available when I went to collect these 2 weeks ago out of 5 animals it looks like I have 1 or maybe 2 females in the group lol which is the norm when it comes to these imports. 

I hope the two you got do well for you man post some pics


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## 013 (Aug 9, 2006)

Though he usually doesn't guarantee sexes he was pretty sure one was a male. He was right. This morning i heard a soft sound from the tank, like a small bell being rung (can't describe it anyway else). So i guess there is a least one male in there. The other one being a female is wishfull thinking i admit :mrgreen:


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

*GREASER* said:


> 013 said:
> 
> 
> > "He told me there aren't any streams in the vicinity and the toads lay their eggs in small puddles, cans and other stuff they find. They often live alongside Tinctorius."
> ...



As far as is known in the literature, they do all deposit in riparian situations and the tadpoles are specially adapted for life in streams (see Lotters, Stefan; 1996; The Neotropical Toad Genus Atelopus; Verence & Verlags; Koln Germany) . 

Ed


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## 013 (Aug 9, 2006)

I heard about the special mouths of the taddpoles. It does suggest they are at least adapted to moving water. Still, like i said: the vendor took a look at their habitat and said there were no streams nearby. It was secondary forrest and the toads lived in the leaflitter. He found strings of their eggs in waterfilled cans et cetera.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

013 said:


> I heard about the special mouths of the taddpoles. It does suggest they are at least adapted to moving water. Still, like i said: the vendor took a look at their habitat and said there were no streams nearby. It was secondary forrest and the toads lived in the leaflitter. He found strings of their eggs in waterfilled cans et cetera.



Atelopus especially those that are from dry forests will migrate significant distances from the upland habitat down to the streams to breed. Not only the mouths are adapted to rivierine habitat but other morphology is also adapted to those systems. I have significant doubts that one subspecies would be adapted to small pool still water breeding when this would require a completely different morphological development of the tadpole (which also obtain oxygen from the water at least in later stages and not the air) . I'm making some inquiries with some people about other A. spumarius ssp and the one answer I got back is that they are stream breeders.... A quick check of the literature also shows that A. s. spumarius is also a stream breeder and the larva also have the ventral disk (see pg 88 in the book referenced above as well as the referenced literature). 

How did the collector determine that they were Atelopus eggs? 

Ed


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## 013 (Aug 9, 2006)

It might be easier to contact him in person at his site: http://www.dutch-rana.nl, as he is the one that actualy saw them... :mrgreen:


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## [theboardedwindow] (Jul 25, 2008)

very impressive...


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