# Suggest inhabitants for my viv



## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

I have this 18x18x24 ZooMed that has been sitting around growing in for several months. I had planned on putting in a trio of S.I. tricolors (anthonyi), but now I am thinking about maybe a pair of red bastis.

My concern on the bastis is that I won't see them very often, but when I do it will be a real treat. On the plus side, it should be pretty easy to sell any babies that might be produced.

The plus side of the SI's is that they will be out and about more often. The down side is, since there is a small pond in the viv, they may produce a lot of babies and the market for them seems to be a little depressed right now.

So, I thought I would post a pic of the viv and see if you guys think it is more suitable for a trio of SI's or a pair of red bastis.

Thanks for looking.


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## bmore (May 11, 2010)

the viv looks great. i would personally go with bastis. a pair would be perfect. i am actually looking for some myself. btw what lighting are u using?


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

It's very sobering and a bit sad, to hear potential selling as a major consideration.

IMO....1.1 pumilo would be much better suited to the design of that viv and yes....they will be bold and you will soon see them all the time.


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## Mitch (Jun 18, 2010)

I just bought a trio of S.I.'s and love them! They're super bold and their call is great. I don't really take breeding into consideration when choosing a frog, I choose the frogs that I like best and then think about breeding after. I'd rather see someone love their frogs than just have them to sell the babies. If you're going to do that then I feel like its kinda sad. Although, Bastis are better suited for this tank anyways. My S.I.'s lik to spend a good amount of time on the ground.


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

Philsuma said:


> It's very sobering and a bit sad, to hear potential selling as a major consideration.
> 
> IMO....1.1 pumilo would be much better suited to the design of that viv and yes....they will be bold and you will soon see them all the time.


Thanks for your frog suggestion and your reasoning, but you kind of missed the point on the selling part. 
If I give the frogs the proper conditions they will produce babies. All of my current frogs are producing babies in their tanks, except my azureus because they don't transport. If I don't collect the leuc tads the male transports to a pond, but I only get one baby per batch. I don't have a problem finding homes for all of my leuc babies. SI's produce a lot of tads and they aren't cannibalistic. If I give them good conditions, I could be overrun with froglets. What do I do with them if no one wants them? Its not a money thing, I would give them away for free. I just don't really want to be in a situation where I have to consider euthanizing frogs.
I've been there before. I used to raise clownfish. Ocellaris (common clowns) are easy to raise and wholesalers and fish stores will usually buy as many as you can produce. I had a pair of orange skunk clowns that produced 200 fry every two weeks. They are pretty and a little unusual. Unfortunately, the first batch of babies pretty much flooded the local market. I stopped raising babies and it took months to unload the babies I had on hand. I wasn't looking to make money, I just wanted to give a little back to the hobby. 

My concern about the market for the frogs was about my concern for the disposition of possible babies, not the condition of my wallet.


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

bmore said:


> the viv looks great. i would personally go with bastis. a pair would be perfect. i am actually looking for some myself. btw what lighting are u using?


I have 4 36" HO T5 tubes over this viv and another that is next to it. It used to be covered with glass. When I replaced the glass with overhead transparency film, the colors on the broms got much better.


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## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

Sick viv, great job on the layering. What is that aroid (alocasia?) at the bottom? Is it planted directly into the substrate? Pums for sure.


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## Elphaba (Aug 26, 2007)

I'll toss my vote in for the bastis as well.  I think they'd love that viv. I'm impressed by the tank's different levels, and I think because of those levels you'll see the pums more than you might initially expect. So many hiding/foraging spots!


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

fleshfrombone said:


> Sick viv, great job on the layering. What is that aroid (alocasia?) at the bottom? Is it planted directly into the substrate? Pums for sure.


Thanks for the compliment.
The largest leaf plant is Alocasia rugosa and it is planted in the substrate There is a Monstera sp. I got from EricM crawling underneath it and S. rayii behind it.

The rugosa grew well and then died back. I think I was getting the leaves too wet. It has grown back very nicely and now I just spray the leaf litter underneath it.


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

great tank! most thumbnails would be nicely suited in there.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

phender said:


> My concern about the market for the frogs was about my concern for the disposition of possible babies, not the condition of my wallet.


You, in no way, shape or form, made that clear in the OP though.

You did use the word "sell".....


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## SoCalSun (Oct 29, 2009)

phender said:


> If I give them good conditions, I could be overrun with froglets. What do I do with them if no one wants them? Its not a money thing, I would give them away for free.


Ill be more than happy to take those froglets off your hands Phil!! Hehe


Very nice tank!! Really digging your plant variation!! I think some red bastis would look pretty sweet in there.


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

Philsuma said:


> You, in no way, shape or form, made that clear in the OP though.
> 
> You did use the word "sell".....


Why wouldn't "what am I going to do with the babies?" be a major consideration in choosing the right frog for me?
I probably should have talked about the SI's first and stated that I was concerned about being over run with babies. It would have made my meaning more clear about the bastis. I also could have used "find homes for" instead of sell, but don't most of us sell our extra frogs. Why should I sugar coat it. I seem to recall seeing you posting some "for sale" ads.
Reading the post as a whole, I still don't think it sounded like I was choosing frogs based on how much money I could make. Maybe you could have asked for clarification instead of jumping my case.

Or better yet, instead of blaming me for your mistake, just post "OK, I didn't get that from your original post" and be done with it.


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## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

Battle of the Phils, let's get ready to ruuuuumbleeeeeeee.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

lol....just had to re-read it. I thought I was missing it or seeing things....

Whatever...yeah...I probably shouldn't have posted anything at all.


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

First I have heard of transparency film. Does this allow for UVB penetration? How do you prevent it from drooping down? Is one piece large enough to cover the top or are there a couple, and if there are a couple how are they secured together? Sorry for all the questions but interest has been sparked.


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## randommind (Sep 14, 2010)

Pardon my selfishness, I forgot to mention that it is a great looking viv and I would personally go with the Basti.


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

First, great tank, I would go with the bastimentos because of the layout.

Second, don't forget about the option of wholesaling froglets. You will do the hobby and the frogs a favor by wholesaling frogs instead of giving large quantities away. Every CB frog in a wholesaler's tank is a WC one (even if it's a different species) left in it's home country. Will it ever stop imports, probably not, but it can have an effect.



phender said:


> Why wouldn't "what am I going to do with the babies?" be a major consideration in choosing the right frog for me?
> I probably should have talked about the SI's first and stated that I was concerned about being over run with babies. It would have made my meaning more clear about the bastis. I also could have used "find homes for" instead of sell, but don't most of us sell our extra frogs. Why should I sugar coat it. I seem to recall seeing you posting some "for sale" ads.
> Reading the post as a whole, I still don't think it sounded like I was choosing frogs based on how much money I could make. Maybe you could have asked for clarification instead of jumping my case.


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

fleshfrombone said:


> Battle of the Phils, let's get ready to ruuuuumbleeeeeeee.


Sorry to disappoint you, but I think we are done.


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

randommind said:


> First I have heard of transparency film. Does this allow for UVB penetration? How do you prevent it from drooping down? Is one piece large enough to cover the top or are there a couple, and if there are a couple how are they secured together? Sorry for all the questions but interest has been sparked.


I can't take credit for the transparency film. I got the idea from Jason (evolvstll). It lets through more UV than glass and seems to color up the broms a bit better. I use regular transparent tape to tape the 8.5"x11" pieces together and to the ZooMed's screen top. I leave a little gap in front of just screen. Its not beautiful to look at, but with the light on top you really don't notice.



Chris Miller said:


> First, great tank, I would go with the bastimentos because of the layout.
> 
> Second, don't forget about the option of wholesaling froglets. You will do the hobby and the frogs a favor by wholesaling frogs instead of giving large quantities away. Every CB frog in a wholesaler's tank is a WC one (even if it's a different species) left in it's home country. Will it ever stop imports, probably not, but it can have an effect.


Thanks for the compliment. 
I have wholesaled my azureus and leucomelas when I have a lot of them, but I was concerned that since SIs don't get their red color for a while, they might not be in much demand from my local stores. That coupled with their potential to produce a lot of babies without my help, had me a little concerned. I was hoping that somebody might say that while SI's have the potential to produce a lot of babies, it usually doesn't happen that way, but I'm not hearing that yet.


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## Chris Miller (Apr 20, 2009)

Yeah, if you don't give the SI's seasons, they will go nuts and you will end up with a ton of babies. If you dry them out for a long period of time, then you won't be overrun.


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## dendrothusiast (Sep 16, 2010)

bastis will do just nicely in there, depending on how much you mist you'll get alot of activity from them. Theyre great starter pums and why I chose them as my first pums.

The tank is very well landscaped given its size, great job!


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

Well, here is the answer to my question thanks to EricM and Jonny5. Almost full adult size.

A pic of them just released:









What we think might be a male, posing for a picture. I love the white bellies.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Gorgeous! Good choice


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## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

Right on man!


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

They have been hanging out together and tonight I caught the smaller one calling. Looks like I have a pair! 
Thanks again Eric for your ability to pick pairs from your subadults. That makes you two for two for me.


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## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

Where did you get that Alocasia rugosa? Neat plant, I want to put one in my BJ viv.


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

fleshfrombone said:


> Where did you get that Alocasia rugosa? Neat plant, I want to put one in my BJ viv.


I got my rugosa from Logee's several months ago. You had to do a search to find it. I didn't come up otherwise. They don't seem to have anymore.
I also picked up A. cuprea and A. nebula 'Elaine' from Black Jungle a couple months ago. I must have ordered them just at the right time, because all their small alocasia's seem to be out of stock as well.

You have pm


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## fleshfrombone (Jun 15, 2008)

Thank you sir! Hey wanna send that elaine my way?? Eh? You know you want to.....


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