# Way to go, Europe!!!



## aspidites73 (Oct 2, 2012)

Link to Article: Herpnews-blog: Should the location of newly discovered species be hidden?


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## Dane (Aug 19, 2004)

So sad. The pic reminds me of some of the slides that Mark Pepper showed at the 2010(?) Microcosm presentation, except there were LOTS more animals shown, and most were Atelopus.


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

I remember those slides. So dam sad


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## phender (Jan 9, 2009)

FWIW, the article was written two years ago.


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## Blakek (Feb 22, 2012)

Please don't put all the blame on Europe...It's not like other continents are just as guilty.


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## easternversant (Sep 4, 2012)

The blame certainly does not lie with Europe alone. If you are interested, the 2011 revision of Ranitomeya by Brown and Twomey et al. has a section about smuggling and conservation that is worth a read and has a few other pictures. I think it is available for download on Dr. Brown's website. 

On a related note, Bryan is a nice guy and does a lot of interesting frog work in Asia. His stuff is pretty interesting as well.


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## Shockfrog (Apr 14, 2004)

Yerr, it's the same shit on every continent

Hundreds of smuggled reptiles destined for exotic pet trade in U.S. die after being crammed into plastic tubs for five days | Mail Online


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Just once I`d like to see the smugglers laid out on those tables with the animals standing over them.

I don`t think that`s asking too much.


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## zach77 (Feb 8, 2012)

Shockfrog said:


> Yerr, it's the same shit on every continent
> 
> Hundreds of smuggled reptiles destined for exotic pet trade in U.S. die after being crammed into plastic tubs for five days | Mail Online


Ugh! Why are mantellas still being exported?


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## Pubfiction (Feb 3, 2013)

Everywhere smuggles Europe is just known for it because its easier there. You have a special case where a bunch of very rich developed nations are part of the EU which is connected to a lot of nations of varied economic status. It created the perfect situation for easily moving animals around and being able to pay people low, and then get really high prices for them. 

I disagree with one item in that article, that they cannot count on the governments of those countries. In fact it is the governments of richer countries who are not willing to bring a hammer down and make those governments shape up. In some of the countries they mentioned like Laos and Thailand the governments there do react when America or other first world countries really press them for performance on an issue. They can't afford a trade war or loss of tourism revenue. The tiny amount of money in smuggling pets is nothing to them. They don't give a rip about it and they would enact measures to stop it and educate people quickly if there was a threat to one of their more lucrative money makers. 

The reality is these issues just aren't very high on the priority list of any country rich or poor.


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

I do not know the reality of other countries, but here in Italy, there are infos relate to the fact that trafficking in exotic animals are run by organized crime. In this short article it is said that - on a worldwide basis - the profits of the illegal trafficking of animals are in third place after trafficking of drug and arms. 

IL TRAFFICO DI ANIMALI ESOTICI - IL TRAFFICO


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## PumilioTurkey (Feb 25, 2010)

Not gonna change human habits of wanting things they can't get their hands on....


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## dartsanddragons (Jun 6, 2004)

So hopefully some of these Frogs that are being smuggled into Europe, and from what several others have indicated are already heading for the U.S Understory can get these legally so hundreds if not thousands of Frogs die to fill a wish list here in this country. We have all seen the pictures many times, and a lot have chimed in on how horrible this is, but yet there will be buyers as in the past that will snatch these up and they then will be washed thru the system and soon readily accepted


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## Conrauaboy (Apr 7, 2014)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> Just once I`d like to see the smugglers laid out on those tables with the animals standing over them.
> 
> I don`t think that`s asking too much.


I'm right there with you!


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## Phyllobates azureus (Aug 18, 2010)

I rarely get angry over the Internet, but this is one of the few things that has got me genuinely angry. How many is that, 40? No wonder mysteriosus is endangered. These species have small and (in many cases) fragmented ranges, the last thing they need is wild collection for the so-called pet trade. And on top of that they have chytrid fungus to worry about. And darts aren't the only amphibians being captured like this, either. I'm sure I don't need to remind everyone of the Mantella crisis and the Atelopus zeteki talismans. I'm beginning to fear for the future of amphibians in the wild. Regardless, the sick-minded individuals behind this need to spend the rest of their pathetic lives locked in a cell.


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## SaFFyR (Jun 23, 2014)

It's really sad to see  

However, the darts in your vivs didn't hop in there by themselves. In the end we are to blame.


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## aspidites73 (Oct 2, 2012)

SaFFyR said:


> It's really sad to see
> 
> However, the darts in your vivs didn't hop in there by themselves. In the end we are to blame.



There is a HUGE difference between stuffing 50 frogs into a spare tire and driving across the border and buying frogs from UE or any number of conservation minded companies. Even buying imports has its place. Sustainably and legally harvested, and available to responsible keepers/institutions will never receive my ire.


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## darterfrog4774 (Apr 24, 2014)

This just makes me shudder and want to go sit with my frogs for a bit. I can't believe anybody human can be able to do this to, in my opinion, these soulful animals(we all know what i'm talking about, the eyes). We should try to boycott wild caught animals, or at least try to buy wild caught, and breed them to sell their offspring back in for more CB. I've been trying to breed my bigeyes, and I know they are very hard to breed, but at least one of mine is male, because i've heard croaking at night, and there are no other tree frogs in my house


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## topher (Oct 9, 2013)

Wow.. Europe definitely is not the only place this happens.. but still horrible.... Would love to one day be able to get mysteriosus in the states.. but with things like this happening i doubt we ever will.


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## Cutterfly (Apr 9, 2009)

That's so sad...
I breed mysteriosus since several years. All my offspring is always well developing, bold, nice texture, etc.
Nonetheless every once in a while there is some stupid person claiming fresh blood to be neccessary and hyping these wild caught frogs.
Then year by year the prices for my offspring drop because "everybody" wants to have this outstanding "new blood" (full of worms and coccidia...) instead of my "usual" offspring.

This happens with so many frogs which are established in the hobby.
Nobody ever knows why and some of those who don't know why will be the first thirsting for fresh blood... 
That's where to sort the wheat from the chaff - the serious keepers from those with collecting mania...


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