# Abrasion, fungus. or lightness in pattern?



## moorep5 (May 23, 2019)

So this is an adult azureus I have housed in a 10 gallon until my other 2 get big enough to put them together in a 55 gallon I have. These spots are new and something I've recently noticed. I'm thinking abrasion but have concerns. Any help would be great.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

No photo so dont know but heres an arrow in the dark if you use mopani wood go over the points, shards they usually have alot.

In a closed system repeat contact is guaranteed. Especially if there is gestalt of a nice little place to dash under. 

Other materials can abrade too, run your fingers up under ledges, leave 2, 3 fingers passing width between immovable hardscapes and rocks. 

Its much easier to safety artifacts before they are put in. I use rocks and stone, and have collected almost as many files as favorite rock and slate pieces.

Just sayin as I actually sorted some stuff today


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

It seems to be difficult to post pics here, I have a 7+ year old Nokia smartphone that becomes more uncooperative in function per week so I dont even try, and it seems my Flickr page is frozen.

Anyway it would be great to see a photo, not to "diagnose" but abrasions often do have identifiable markers. Especially if you can get close shots.

Frogs can efficiently and quickly heal from minor abrasions on the dorsum if not kept too cold and wet. 

Environment photos and descriptions provide history and etiology clues for other issues. 

If they are mild abrasions and are resolving it is best not to tinker around with corneum softening antibiotic ointments or solutions. Once there is a generated layer of new cells at the site, it is best to leave the frogs own healing mechanisms alone. 

I would not stress them by quarantining them if they are mild abrasions. This may be contrary to others respectable advice. 

I am interested in seeing photos and I am sure others are too, and hope indeed the marks you see are not illness. If they are not raised but flat, and in certain locations (ie; the "roof" of the frog) that can be a good albeit basic sign.


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## moorep5 (May 23, 2019)

https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/49739391808/in/dateposted-public/

Hopefully you can go to this link and see the photo. It's weird the photo shows up on my computer in the original post. Anyhow, thanks for the response and advice. I've had this tank for over a year and pretty confident it's safe. My concern is it may be due to stress from being moved recently from another tank. However, this tank has just about the same amount of room. The spots have gotten smaller and lighter. But there are days where it is more noticeable as well. It's strange but the frog behaves boldly and healthy. It chomps and eats well. Pretty sure it's a female.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Those arent abrasions.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Im not going to guess what that are but its good they are strong and eating. 

I would think its worth a formal diagnosis, as a fungal thing, disease papule or encapsulated protozoa is often very specific in medication needs. 

Maybe someone here recognizes it but man it makes me want to dab it with methylene blue.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

I had asked on a post previous if the spots were raised, or if thats a glare artifact of the photo that just makes it appear that way, but the post does not seem to be here. Often there is a delay it seems.

Anyway i think youd be able to tell easily and get adequate visual in a 10. The largest 'spot' that looks orangish makes me wonder if that one has progressed and showing some hemorrhagic activity and that it just looks orangy because of the photo diffusion. 

I dont know if i can be of anymore help than anyone else, probably not but i am interested and hope the best for your frog.

Sometimes when folks worry about their frogs, and dont have the misting 'system' of a larger permanent enclosure, the worry can translate itself into over misting which can create a wet circumstance that fosters problems. Water contact is an organism sustaining, dependable vehicle of transmission. 

Not saying that you have just saying that sometimes that happens. 

Frogs need a hospitable aspect in their environment where they can escape wet contact.


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## moorep5 (May 23, 2019)

It doesnt appear to be raised to me. It's level with the skin for sure. I've been keeping an eye on it for a couple weeks now. Trying to do research on what I should do but I can;t find much info on this it seems. I've seen no progression but like I said it goes back in forth visually. 
I ordered some methylene blue. I was thinking a 1% solution in a gallon jug? Can't find much about treatment on adults. Find a whole lot about using it in tadpole water to prevent fungus and mold. So I feel like if it is harmless in breeding it should be harmless to the adult in small dosage. I'm no expert but I do have a Bachelors in Env. Science and took toxicology. Frogs are sensitive to everything so I'm hesitant to treat it but I don't know what else to do. This frog was a rescue from a friend. Way to big for my two other azureus. So I'm waiting for the other two to get to size first. Then trying to observe for a breeding pair. 
Now I'm just trying to save it. I try not to over water. Especially this fella because it is by itself and I'm not trying to induce breeding. I mist maybe 3 times a week. Give or take. I appreciate the responses and attempt to help. I'm thinking it's a fungus. I'm reducing misting and will likely treat with 1% I'm thinking by q-tip dab or small spray bottle. The tank is a 10 gallon but it is stuffed with plants and a hiding spot of cork.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Have you contacted a vet, an ARAV vet? 

You may be able to email some photos but you are going to have to take more shots, as the photo you are showing doesnt present clearly.

It makes the spots look like raised white papules and if its not, its as good as no photo at all, you know?

It could also be an unusual chromatophore response induced by stressors


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## Socratic Monologue (Apr 7, 2018)

Kmc said:


> I would think its worth a formal diagnosis, as a fungal thing, disease papule or encapsulated protozoa is often very specific in medication needs.


I agree. A good vet could culture that or look at a scrape pretty easily.

https://arav.site-ym.com/search/custom.asp?id=3661

I (who am not a vet) couldn't find any reason to think that's a fungus, after a bit of poking around. Seems cutaneous fungi are often on the ventrum, and are often rapidly progressing.

https://www.merckvetmanual.com/exot.../amphibians/infectious-diseases-of-amphibians

I couldn't find any decent photos of gross pathology, but cutaneous nematodes look to present much like your pic, and fit the "fine until the stress of a move" (and are "often diagnosed as mycosis") etiology. 

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._of_South_African_clawed_frogs_Xenopus_laevis


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## moorep5 (May 23, 2019)

Hey guys, 
Wanted to respond and say thanks for the leads and recommendations. I'm reaching out to two vets. So far, one has said to move forward with applying 1% methylene blue solution to the spot with a q-tip daily and track for improvements. He feels it is worth a shot in the short term given that it should be a pretty harmless treatment strategy outside of stressing out the frog. He said he believes it is either fungal or a bacterial pustule. This one is a family friend so I trust his word, but want a second opinion before I do any treatment at all.
Hopefully the other vet is easy to access. I'd like to get a real formal diagnosis if possible (sample and lab would be great), concerned about cost and about accessibility given the crazy times right now. I'll update the post as things change or if things get better. Hopefully the frog ends up being okay. Still eating and behaving healthy today.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

I hope it all turns out well.

I have to admit its really the best, when human beings rally around a lovely little lucky guy like this.

No matter what happens, i hope you know that your frog really is a lucky guy and he is in my thoughts. 

Follow nose and eyes and many delicate puffs through the day are better than a wet down. If the moss globs with water or hes up on the side mitigate.

Frogs actually Rarely Dry Out in our care. Quite honestly. Unless we get arrested or something. Its true. 

I dont know about your ventilation so forgive if im making error assumption but if you perforated the lid for air, poke holes or sharp implement slashes wont do. Either drill them or melt them. 

Leave one ample corner, with a few extra vent dryer than the rest of the Q bin. Please I humbly ask you to trust me on this.

It would be very good if you could make sure he doesnt get below the low 70s. 

If I shared the optional hi end temp i actually make available to isolated subjects it would get ugly.


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## Kmc (Jul 26, 2019)

Ah dang, you got her in a tank thats right. I'm sorry. 

If its not too much trouble for you and esp the frog I would really like to see some more photos and follow up on how things are going. You can PM mw if you'd like. But I'm interested and really hope she shakes this off. 

Kel


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## Amagaeru (May 6, 2015)

moorep5 said:


> Hey guys,
> Wanted to respond and say thanks for the leads and recommendations. I'm reaching out to two vets. So far, one has said to move forward with applying 1% methylene blue solution to the spot with a q-tip daily and track for improvements. He feels it is worth a shot in the short term given that it should be a pretty harmless treatment strategy outside of stressing out the frog. He said he believes it is either fungal or a bacterial pustule. This one is a family friend so I trust his word, but want a second opinion before I do any treatment at all.
> Hopefully the other vet is easy to access. I'd like to get a real formal diagnosis if possible (sample and lab would be great), concerned about cost and about accessibility given the crazy times right now. I'll update the post as things change or if things get better. Hopefully the frog ends up being okay. Still eating and behaving healthy today.


Any update as to how the Azureus is doing?


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