# maggots on top of lid



## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

I'm in the process of starting my first fruit fly cultures, and so far everything has been going okay. But when I checked on my cultures this morning, I found 15-20 of the maggots on the _outside_ of the lids. It appears as though they bore through the top of the cloth used for ventilation.

I am using 32oz deli cups with ventilation lids supplied by Josh's frogs; I tried doing a search on the forum, and couldn't come up with any cases like this. The lids were not loose in any areas. Did I do anything wrong in setting up these cultures?


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## beatusb (May 3, 2011)

Can't say you did something wrong, unless you poked the hole yourself. I would make sure the lid was fully on. If it was and the cloth on the top has a hole large enough for escape, change the lid.


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## EntoCraig (May 17, 2011)

are they reused lids? after a few times of washing the cloth becomes very loose... I only reuse a few times.


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

both lids were on tight, and the cloth had no holes. It looks as if the maggots crawled in between the cloth and the lid, and then escaped to the top of the lid via the ventilation holes. In any case, I changed the lids.

Could it be possible that these are faulty lids? It just seems so strange that no one has reported this before...



EntoCraig said:


> are they reused lids? after a few times of washing the cloth becomes very loose... I only reuse a few times.


Nope, everything is brand new. These are my first homemade fruit fly cultures


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## EntoCraig (May 17, 2011)

Lids or just one lid? Its more likely you got a bad lid then a whole batch going out wrong.


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

EntoCraig said:


> Lids or just one lid? Its more likely you got a bad lid then a whole batch going out wrong.


I found maggots on the tops of both of the two cultures I set up. 

so at least two lids


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## joshsfrogs (May 6, 2004)

Is the fabric coming loose from the lid? That can happen if it doesn't get sealed properly when they make the lids.

Contact us through our site and we can put a claim in with the manufacturer and get you taken care of.


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## JeffP (Mar 2, 2010)

I've had this happen occasionally. It seems that if it's extra wet, the paper gets mushy and they find their way through.


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

looks like they're getting through again, on a new set of lids.... I literally just set these up less than 5 minutes ago.


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## Eric Walker (Aug 22, 2009)

how do you have larva allready if you just set up the cultures? I have been reuseing my lids for about 2 years now and i am just starting to get some wearing through and I use a bleach solution when cleaning. they are pretty tough.


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## frogfreak (Mar 4, 2009)

Looks like I'm not the only one having problems. These newer lids being supplied are not the same quality as the older ones. I have had fliers getting in and larva getting out. I now have to check every single lid before I use it. There are a lot where the material is coming loose.


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## EntoCraig (May 17, 2011)

This isnt adding up for me... 

How dose a brand new culture even have maggots already? The lids look perfect, with no holes. they are not coming from the inside, they are outside and crawling up to the smell of the media.

My vote is you have maggots somewhere near by...



frogfreak said:


> Looks like I'm not the only one having problems. These newer lids being supplied are not the same quality as the older ones. I have had fliers getting in and larva getting out. I now have to check every single lid before I use it. There are a lot where the material is coming loose.


I have had ZERO issues with the 'new' lids.


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

Eric Walker said:


> how do you have larva allready if you just set up the cultures? I have been reuseing my lids for about 2 years now and i am just starting to get some wearing through and I use a bleach solution when cleaning. they are pretty tough.


These cultures were started on 9/7, so I meant that they are new (new to me as well as relatively freshly started), not created today. Sorry if that was ambiguous. I've noticed maggots in these cultures for about 2-3 days now.


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## Zombie Frawg (Aug 31, 2010)

I recently received new lids and am having issues as well. Maggots/pupa coming out through holes in the top (around the edge of the lid). Now I just got home to find hydei all over the outside top of a just booming culture. It looks to me like the flies managed their way under the cloth to escape through the ventilation holes. Not too happy about it. I don't need any more loose flies in my frog room or house. The quality is definitely not as good as my old lids. 

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## GRIMM (Jan 18, 2010)

Yes Jeff is right, if condensation builds up on the fabric they can wiggle through it. I was keeping my culture overly humid and this kept happening to me. You can typically tell if the culture is too humid or not from the level of the small maggots, kinda like a humidity guage


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

GRIMM said:


> Yes Jeff is right, if condensation builds up on the fabric they can wiggle through it. I was keeping my culture overly humid and this kept happening to me. You can typically tell if the culture is too humid or not from the level of the small maggots, kinda like a humidity guage


I'm not sure that condensation is the problem. The cultures were made using Josh's frogs ff media, and I followed the instructions on how much water to add. The cultures are kept in a sterilite container in a dry, room temp corner of my apartment. I could maybe see how condensation might have been a problem with the first two lids I used (although I didn't note any condensation when I removed them), however the issue is still occurring with new lids that were placed on minutes ago (my picture on the first page is with the fresh lids). Condensation has not even had a chance to conceivably build up yet!


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

EntoCraig said:


> are they reused lids? after a few times of washing the cloth becomes very loose... I only reuse a few times.


I've been using some of the same lids for more than a couple of years now.... 

As an alternative reason for why the maggots may also be trying to escape is because the levels of CO2 may be higer as well. 

Ed


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

Ed said:


> I've been using some of the same lids for more than a couple of years now....
> 
> As an alternative reason for why the maggots may also be trying to escape is because the levels of CO2 may be higer as well.
> 
> Ed


thanks Ed, I was wondering if there might be a specific reason they were trying to escape.

I do keep these cultures in a closed sterilite container, but I generally vent this container once a day to check up on the cultures. Could this still be leading to too much CO2 accumulating in the container?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Venting the exterior enclosure may not be supplying enough venting for the cups. Keep in mind that CO2 is heavier than air so it can settle in the cups with a layer forming on the media (particularly since there is little or no air circulation external to the cups). The media is an uncontrolled bioreactor between the microbes and the larva. If you are seeing a variety of maggot sizes up the sides that means it could be due to CO2 issues. When cultures are too moist, particularly those housed in something with minimal air flow, the excess moisture doesn't evaporate through the lids bit neither does the CO2 get off gassed from the cups. 

Ed


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

so what do you do to resolve this issue????


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

Judy S said:


> so what do you do to resolve this issue????


I've taken two new lids (the third set for these two cultures...), and hot glued the edge of the fabric, in an attempt to create a better seal. I'm also keeping the sterilite container open to aid ventilation (would this be adequate?)


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## Coppertop (Aug 13, 2011)

Ed said:


> Venting the exterior enclosure may not be supplying enough venting for the cups. Keep in mind that CO2 is heavier than air so it can settle in the cups with a layer forming on the media (particularly since there is little or no air circulation external to the cups). The media is an uncontrolled bioreactor between the microbes and the larva. If you are seeing a variety of maggot sizes up the sides that means it could be due to CO2 issues. When cultures are too moist, particularly those housed in something with minimal air flow, the excess moisture doesn't evaporate through the lids bit neither does the CO2 get off gassed from the cups.
> 
> Ed


could the buildup of CO2 also be caused by too much yeast in the culture?


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## beatusb (May 3, 2011)

Yeast does generate CO2, so it could be. You need only like a dozen grains of yeast in a new culture.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

beatusb said:


> Yeast does generate CO2, so it could be. You need only like a dozen grains of yeast in a new culture.


Yes, the yeast does generate CO2 but so do the flies and the microbes.. So I'm not sure that is appropriate to pin it all on the yeast.... The active yeast added to the cultures is not well adapted to those conditions, which is unlike the microbial mix that is carried in on the flies (in fact you can skip using activated yeast and the flies will seed it with yeast (and other microbes) so what typically happens is that the activated yeast is rapidly replaced by the introduced yeasts and microbes. 

Ed


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## wickerstone (Jan 19, 2009)

I hate to hijack this thread, but what solution are you using to reuse your lids? I've just been throwing mine away when the cultures crash. I would like to reuse the lids if someone could tell me how to clean them. And, is it okay to use them even if the tops have turned a light brown or will the cleaning solution rid the top of this? Thanks...sorry to steer the topic in another direction.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

10% bleach soak. It may take a day or two but once they are white (or mostly white) I pull them out rinse and air dry them before reusing them. 

Ed


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## Neontra (Aug 16, 2011)

I agree with Ed with the bleach. I just scrub mine lightly with an old tooth brush with 10$ bleach solution and works like a charm. I've never had my flies escape with Josh's lids, been using same ones for 3 months, and well, being scrubbed, they're still holding fine.


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

For recycling, I've tried soaking lids in a bleach solution. Unfortunately you can't do this too often - seems the bleach eventually weakens the fabric and holes develop...


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

radiata said:


> For recycling, I've tried soaking lids in a bleach solution. Unfortunately you can't do this too often - seems the bleach eventually weakens the fabric and holes develop...


I have lids that I've been reusing for going on two or more years now. I have more issues with the plastic breaking than I do the fabric on the top (partly because I toss them into the basement so I'm not walking down the steps until I have to...

Ed


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## JakkBauer (Jul 11, 2011)

Ed said:


> I have lids that I've been reusing for going on two or more years now. I have more issues with the plastic breaking than I do the fabric on the top (partly because I toss them into the basement so I'm not walking down the steps until I have to...
> 
> Ed


Would love to see Ed's basement lol

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