# Holy Springtails!!



## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)




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## nate_88 (Dec 3, 2013)

Damn I want all of them 

~N8


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## Aldross (Dec 30, 2013)

I would settle for one

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## xIslanderx (Dec 8, 2012)

Whoa! They on 'roids or what?!


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## nonliteral (Mar 26, 2012)

Wow! Are those actually being cultured open-topped, or are they just opened for maintenance?


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

Wow! That guy has one hell of an ingredients list in his springtail food!


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## toostrange (Sep 19, 2013)

Is it an Ancient Chinese Secret or what would love to know his technique. I can get mine boomin but not like that.


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## Aldross (Dec 30, 2013)

Makes me feel like all mine are failures

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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)




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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

Here's his ingredient list.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Thanks Gary.
That`s an insane amount of ingredients...but that`s an insane amount of springtails.


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## toostrange (Sep 19, 2013)

Do you think compost makes a diff? That's the first I've seen that.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

I guess when you think about it there`s plenty of things in compost the springtails would love.


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## toostrange (Sep 19, 2013)

Holy crap I think his springs eat better than I do! But I imagine that they are very nutritious for the frogs. More so than ones just fed yeast?


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> Thanks Gary.
> That`s an insane amount of ingredients.


I think so too.

I really think the big key to his production was his comment that he feeds every 2-3 days. I get pretty much the same results feeding that often without his fancy food formula.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Gary, what are you feeding with?
I usually go with yeast, mushrooms (after a good zap in the microwave) and Bug Burger


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

toostrange said:


> *Holy crap I think his springs eat better than I do!* But I imagine that they are very nutritious for the frogs. More so than ones just fed yeast?


That's how I feel about the shrimp I feed to my marine tropical fish!


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

toostrange said:


> Do you think compost makes a diff? That's the first I've seen that.


The "composted" "peat moss" he's using seems pretty moist, compared to the peat moss I buy at a local garden center in the US, which I would describe as "powdery dry".

Leading to the question "How does he *compost* his peat moss?", if he indeed does.

Also, what is the US alternative to the breakfast cereal he's using?

And, finally, how does he harvest his springtails?


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## Mike1239 (May 15, 2012)

He did say the compost you can get at any garden center. I don't think he makes it. I know what you mean about peat moss being dry. I think it is a peat based compost.
http://m.acehardware.com//product/index.jsp?productId=16903776&KPID=14516072&pla=pla_14516072


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> Gary, what are you feeding with?
> I usually go with yeast, mushrooms (after a good zap in the microwave) and Bug Burger


I use the typical/usual suspects - flake food, baby cereal, yeast, bug burger. The baby cereal does seem to be their favorite.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

radiata said:


> Also, what is the US alternative to the breakfast cereal he's using?


I would just check the cereal aisle in your local grocery store.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Gary, have you ever any issues with mites?
Just asking, I don`t want to jinx you.

Also, with all those ingredients that guy is using I wonder if mites were ever an issue for him and would the blender kill them.
Looking at those cultures I would be surprised if he had mites.


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## Giga (Mar 31, 2011)

good stuff the spread of info like this is what pushes the hobby forward, whether is moot, good or bad. In this case good I think


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> Gary, have you ever any issues with mites?


No. I keep my cultures wetter than this guy does so mites have not been a problem.



Enlightened Rogue said:


> Just asking, I don`t want to jinx you.


If I do get them now I WILL come and find YOU


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## JPccusa (Mar 10, 2009)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> Also, with all those ingredients that guy is using I wonder if mites were ever an issue for him and would the blender kill them.
> Looking at those cultures I would be surprised if he had mites.


He makes me feel obsessive/paranoid about mites.


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## NM Crawler (Jan 23, 2012)

toostrange said:


> Is it an Ancient Chinese Secret or what would love to know his technique. I can get mine boomin but not like that.


I've been using this recipe since early last year and it's been working wonders for ME. I've always had sh*ty luck with springs not booming and getting mites. I decide to try his method out. first thing I do Is pressure cook the peat moss with a gallon of water (Premier, 3 cu. ft. Peat Moss, 70976040 at The Home Depot - Mobile) let cool mix turface and crushed leaf litter and set up new giant spring cultures with whole .003 shroom filters glued to the top. I feeding ever 2-3 days as well. What you need to keep a eye on is not to over feed as you will get crazy amount of mold over night. I do like the shaker idea of a clump of food in one spot. I will never go back to yeast after using this mix. Here is the list of ingredients I use, I also bake everything as I go. All my fly as spring cultures are kept in 3 draw plastic bins with DE (thanks JP for the idea) and a egg crate false bottom. The DE works like a charm! 

Springtails food ingredients 
Black eye peas
Salad bean mix 
Spirulina powder
Green peas 
White rice and brown rice 
Veggie broth mix
Pearl barley 
Coco nut shreds 
Potato powder
Muesli fruit& nut or tropical trail mix if you can find the Muesli
Bee pollen 
Hikari brand crab cuisine pellets 
Wheat germ 
Dried Mushroom powder (5-8 pounds of fresh mushrooms places in the dehydrator)
Mix vit
Cream of wheat instead of the ready Brek 
Steel cut Oat meal powered Instead of flour


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

JPccusa said:


> He makes me feel obsessive/paranoid about mites.


Welcome to my world JP, only with me it`s spiders.


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## nonliteral (Mar 26, 2012)

NM Crawler said:


> whole .003 shroom filters


I'm not sure what this is -- can you elaborate? Thanks!


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## JPccusa (Mar 10, 2009)

nonliteral said:


> I'm not sure what this is -- can you elaborate? Thanks!


He is talking about this: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...0-horizontal-90g-display-tank.html#post719973


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## nonliteral (Mar 26, 2012)

JPccusa said:


> He is talking about this: http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...0-horizontal-90g-display-tank.html#post719973


Awesome; thanks! Looks like they only have .2 micron at the moment; anyone have any idea if that'll work as well?


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## NM Crawler (Jan 23, 2012)

Correct, they are just for air exchange so you don't gas out te culture. Let me find a better link as I don't buy from these guys. I think I paid $40 or $50 for 100 of them. The link will give you a idea of what I'm talking about. Synthetic Filter Disc (90mm Wide Mouth Jars)


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Ok, I have a question.
Is there much of a difference between compost and peat?


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## NM Crawler (Jan 23, 2012)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> Ok, I have a question.
> Is there much of a difference between compost and peat?



Not to sure John but I think when David speaks about composting in his clip he is talking about peat you get @ a garden center. I don't think it's the compost you make in your compost heap in your back yard. I'm going to pm him and see what he says.


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## nonliteral (Mar 26, 2012)

Another silly question, but browsing mushroom supply sites I saw 3M Micropore tape that's apparently also used for 'shroom culture filters. Does anyone know if this would be appropriate for our use? At $1 or so for 10 yards and self adhesive, it looks tempting.


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## Dendrobait (May 29, 2005)

I their any rhyme or reason to the addition of so many ingredients? Perhaps only a few are actually key to success. Clearly they can breed on just yeast alone.

Although those of us who culture bean beetles may now have a use for that bean powder that collects on the bottom of the cultures.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Right, I don`t know if I could deal with that many ingredients, but hey whatever works for ya. 
I also wonder if having that many springtails in one culture could cause a crash.

Thoughts?


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

I'd like to know how many frogs he's feeding ALL those springtails to


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## stu&shaz (Nov 19, 2009)

gary1218 said:


> I'd like to know how many frogs he's feeding ALL those springtails to


Just one,a tincasaurus

The serious question though is this,grain mites are our main enemy,that's why so many use yeast,right. so are legumes attractive to grain mites?

many thanks

Stu


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

stu&shaz said:


> so are legumes attractive to grain mites?
> 
> Stu


Someone correct me if I`m wrong but I would say yes.


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## stu&shaz (Nov 19, 2009)

Thanks John ,I've long wondered on this , the simple charcoal yeast method,is serving me well,I'm not particularly up for changing. 

One thing I have always wondered about though is if this particular species ,I believe it's a type of Sinella,is simply very productive,if that is part of the story. I may well be wrong,but I'm fairly sure I culture the same beastie,being in blighty and with David supplying alot of cultures to folks here it's likely,although I have never bought from him. For me at least this little feeder is out performing the others I culture numbers wise. It seem to do equally well on co co fibre too ,but tens of tiny cultures eat in to my froggy time,so it's big charcoal all the way for me,so damn easy to feed out too and no bits for tiny things to fight with

take care

Stu


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## Dendrobait (May 29, 2005)

Has anyone done taxonomic studies on the springtails we circulate in the hobby? I know everyone has latin names stuck to them but everyone just uses common names...


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## mark c (Jun 17, 2010)

I tried a slightly-damp peat-based compost, like was mentioned in the video, but that has been a total bust. Maybe I was not understanding something.

On the other hand, I mixed just a few of the many ingredients on his list and found it works very well on a charcoal culture. I used flour, walnuts, wild rice, and powdered spirulina (just what I had on hand). I think I added some brewer's yeast as well. 

For me, using the coffee grinder to get a really fine powder made all the difference.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

I`ve been using ABG mix with good results. I have a large culture exploding now using mushrooms/bug burger.
I don`t think we ever found out about his "compost"


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

mark c said:


> I tried a slightly-damp peat-based compost, like was mentioned in the video, but that has been a total bust. Maybe I was not understanding something.
> <SNIP><SNIP>


Mark,

I've been unsuccessful in my search for any composted peat moss. I think it may be a UK thing. When I first Google'd it I found it at an ACE Hardware site, but the link is no more...

Let us know if you find any!
Bob


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## frogfreak (Mar 4, 2009)

They're talking about a product similar to this.

Alaska Peat 3.8 cu. ft. Canadian Sphagnum Peat Moss-323209 at The Home Depot

It's also called Sphagnum peat as well.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Thanks Glenn....

So I`m wondering if this peat would be a better a substrate than ABG, charcoal or what ever.


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

frogfreak said:


> They're talking about a product similar to this.
> 
> Alaska Peat 3.8 cu. ft. Canadian Sphagnum Peat Moss-323209 at The Home Depot
> 
> It's also called Sphagnum peat as well.


I think you'll find that this product is as dry as a bone. I use it in my gardening, and it is quite powdery. My expectation is that a "composted" peat moss would already contain quite a bit of moisture. 

When I have the time (currently on vacation), I'll have to search British gardening sites or attempt to contact the Brit who posted those You Tube videos...


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

I think maybe you guys are getting a little too caught up in what substrate to use. There are people on the board here having success raising their springs on a number of different substrates.

Whatever substrate you use I think if you feed your springs an amount of food that they will eat in the course of 2-3 days, AND THEN feed your springs every 2-3 days, you'll have good success.


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

gary1218 said:


> I think maybe you guys are getting a little too caught up in what substrate to use. There are people on the board here having success raising their springs on a number of different substrates.
> 
> Whatever substrate you use I think if you feed your springs an amount of food that they will eat in the course of 2-3 days, AND THEN feed your springs every 2-3 days, you'll have better success.


Hi Gary,

I agree with you that any number of substrates will work with springtails. I've never had a culture actually "crash" in any of my shoebox cultures. 

I would like to find an "optimum substrate", but it is quite possible that the optimum could vary between springtail species. Nonetheless, I sure would like to know what the guy who posted the You Tube videos is actually using for the species of springs he is culturing...

Regards,
Bob


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Just curious Gary. Trust me I`m not going to put a grocery store in my blender like this guy does when I get the same results from mushrooms or change my substrate.
I do find it interesting anyway.


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## Yobosayo (Sep 27, 2009)

frogfreak said:


> They're talking about a product similar to this.
> 
> Alaska Peat 3.8 cu. ft. Canadian Sphagnum Peat Moss-323209 at The Home Depot
> 
> It's also called Sphagnum peat as well.


I don't know Glenn... I've bought the larger bags of peat at HD before and it is pretty much bone dry, which is why I like to use it for backgrounds.

After seeing the ACE link I took a drive to my local ACE. Here's what they have down here in TX. Closest thing to compost I've found that has a good amount of peat in it. This stuff is very moist, moist to the point where I have major condensation on the lids of my containers. I've started a few cultures on it, just not using the grocery store food formula quite yet. 

Brad


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## frogfreak (Mar 4, 2009)

Pet moss is bone dry until you add water lol The stuff is like a sponge! He very well could be talking about something else though. 

I do agree that the substrate and the 5,000 items put into that recipe are unwarranted. But, I haven't tried it and don't plan on doing so either.


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