# The Evolution of My First Vivarium



## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

This post is intended to be a photojournal of sorts where I can get valuable feedback and document the development of my first vivarium. I'll post pictures as soon as I have something worthwhile to look at! 

It is also intended to be an introduction, as I'm brand new to this hobby and just discovered these boards last night. Needless to say, I was up until the wee hours of the morning stuffing my brain full with as much information possible.  

My goal: To create a 10 gallon vivarium that functionally supports a waterfall, live plants, and a pair of D. auratus.

What I have so far: A ten gallon tank and 50 gallons of ideas. :? 

At first, I siliconed a 2" strip of plexiglass from one corner of the tank to 2/3 down the other side, sectioning off 1/3 of the base. Afterwards I decided that a waterfall feature would be even better, but could only place the pump on the designated front of the terrarium. I want to be able to see the water from the front of the glass, and have the waterfall in the back of the tank. After debating about this setup, I decided to tear down my first plexiglass wall. 

Now I'm planning on sectioning 1/3 of the tank with a plexiglass wall about 4" high and adding a section of plexiglass across the top of that wall- extending the land over the water section. I must admit that I'm tempted by the thought of adding 3 or 4 neons, but I don't want to over-plan a tiny 10 gallon tank. 

Did I mention that I don't plan on getting the frogs anytime soon? I have a feeling that this little project is going to take me at *least* a few months to build.  

The background is going to consist of polyurethane foam with coco pressed into it. I'm impatiently waiting for its arrival (should be Thursday) as well as some swahala driftwood to really start planning out the design. I need to seriously consider appropriate substrate for my setup, as well as whether or not I want to attempt a false bottom. I'm leaning towards LECA, but I'm wondering if a false bottom would be better for the long run... Any thoughts?


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## dragonfrog (Feb 16, 2006)

Sounds like you have a few ideas. You might want to rethink the plexiglass idea. It has a tendancy to warp badly. Use glass instead. It might leak on you later.
As for a false bottom, I wouldn't do a viv without one. Your soil will be a soggy mess without it.


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

Thanks for the advice! I'm so glad you said that- I just went out and bought some egg crate for the false bottom.  

I'll keep the warping in mind about the plexiglass. I'll put some extra reinforcements to make sure it doesn't warp too much. 

I ought to keep a tally of how much I'm investing into this project... Today's bill alone wasn't too shabby. 

Pump: $20
Egg Crate: $11.90
Pipe for False Bottom: $1.60
ExoTerra for Substrate & Background: $9
Plexiglass: $3

The price of having something to work on during the weekend? Priceless!


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

*False Bottom: The Construction Begins!*

Tonight I embarked on constructing a false bottom. I divided the tank into two sections again and have started to plan out my setup.










I haven't secured the pipe pieces yet, so everything still is rather flexible in case I change my mind or hear of a good suggestion. 



















I plan to have a sort of a "cliff" overhang the water area. I'd also like to have a small drift wood piece act as the cornerstone- I need to find one that has just the right dimensions to prop the ledge up with. 

In the back right corner, I'll build a housing for the filter. It will be incorporated into the waterfall. I'm not sure how I want the waterfall yet... I kinda like the idea of water trickling a series of staggered stones... but I want it to really fit here. I guess it all matters on the driftwood pieces I'm getting in the mail and my inspiration at the moment. :lol:

How necessary is it to include PVC pipes in with the background? I'd like to have some breeding froggies eventually, but would like a more natural approach. Am I wrong to assume broms take place of canisters? Forgive my ignorance.


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## roadkillkitty (Jul 26, 2006)

broms take the place of film canisters, but if your planning on taking care of the eggs, it's harder to get them off the broms, than out of the film canisters, but yes that's what there used for i would go with both


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## FrogOnMyToe (Jun 23, 2006)

So, the water will be higher than the ground? Or are you going to have a lot of gravel/soil/whatever to make the ground even with the ledge that hangs over?

[Sorry if this was answered already, I was just browsing through the pictures]


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## topherlove (Jul 14, 2006)

may be kinda dumb, but what is the plexi, or arcylic in there for, im kinda new to just curious? i thought eggcrating the tank was for total tank circulation and humidity?


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

FrogOnMyToe- I love your name! The false bottom isn't completely done, but what'd I'd like to do is have a small hill in the back left of the tank. There will be a "valley" in the middle, and the land will rise up to be higher than the water's edge on the left. I don't think I'm making myself very clear... but basically the land will be higher- I want a lot of substrate for filtration + plant growth.  

topherlove- I'm glad I'm not the only new one around! Do you have frogs already or are you gearing up for it like I am? It'd be great to have a buddy in all of this. 

I'm experimenting with keeping the water separated from the land for a couple of reasons- I may want to put something little and lovely in the water (probably not, but I want to leave my options open for it). But mainly it's just because I like the look of clean running water.  I just want to be able to see a lovely little waterfall that isn't the color of urine. 
I am aware that this is a very shallow reason... it'll just look pretty! :lol: 

Thanks roadkillkitty! I'll get both as well. Doesn't hurt to have options, right?


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## topherlove (Jul 14, 2006)

ves i have frogs, i was just curious to why you were using the plexi and the eggcrate, ive used plexi to keep the water clean before, and keep the substrate section seperated from the water but on the land i didn't use a false bottom i just used Leca balls

was just interested looked like a created display keep putting updates

looks great so far though :lol:


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

Thank you!! The process is certainly entertaining... let's hope the actual frogs are just as amusing. 8) 

So tonight I drafted a very shoddy sketch in paint. I've never really had a knack for art of any form whatsoever, so I'm hoping that this is somewhat understandable. 










The corner of the ledge is going to be supported by driftwood. There will be two decorative pieces of driftwood in the back (if I find suitable pieces, of course), and the waterfall I've decided (for the next 24 hours, I'm sure I'll change my mind!) will have shallow thumbnail pools cascading into the water.

Anyway, it's just a sketch and kinda shows what I'm envisioning for this project.  I plan on having a TON of plants in there (even though I have a black thumb... I'm being brave here..). I might be a little over-ambitious with the waterfall and the mini-pools. I have never worked with polyurethane before so it should definitely be an exercise in chaos. :lol:


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## Guest (Sep 12, 2006)

i like your drawing. it gives me an idea of what you are shooting for anyway. the cascading pools sounds neat. i kind of like your overhang idea, but a lot of people on this board reccoemend against design like that, for fear a frog may get stuck under there. i had something similar in a much larger tank, but never had problems.

seems like you are trying to cram 50 gallons worth of stuff in a 10. thats a good way to start. you seem patient and open to redoing things, so as long as you keep up with that youll be successful.

good luck!!


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

Thank you 2mnytnx!

I'm going to make sure there's an out for a froggy trapped in the lagoon. The last thing I'd want is to build a tank for a beautiful frog just to have it drown.  

I just looked at your vivarium building post and have to say I'm very impressed! I found it amazing that you were able to stick so closely to your original design. It's a beautiful setup. 

I need to really look at lid/lighting options. Seeing how it's a standard 10 gallon, I'm hoping that it won't be a terribly difficult task. I want something that has adequate airflow but keeps in moisture/flies. I'm halfway tempted just to buy a piece of glass and have it fitted for the tank. I kinda like the minimalist approach, although I'm terrified of condensation. Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated!

Things to buy for the weekend: 

-2 pieces of pipe- one large enough to fit a baster.
-Turkey baster.
-Styrofoam balls of various sizes to mold the puddles of the waterfall
-Black silicon to hide the false bottom. 
-Fine mesh. 
-Rubber gloves! 
-Film canisters + pipes to fit them in. 
-Additional piece of driftwood to prop up ledge. 
-Aquarium tubing splitter (can't remember tech. term)

And that's it for now.  I can't wait until payday.


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## Guest (Sep 13, 2006)

thanks for the compliment. its very seldom a plan stays in tact for a complete project 

sounds like youve got good plans  id get the latex disposable gloves. ive tried a few of the heavy duty types, but in the end they are always too hard to clean. the nylon disposable gloves are a little cheaper, but for some reason the latex is easier to work with silicone, IMO. they usually have them in the paint department at Ls or HD.

also, be careful about what types of styrofoam you use. from what i understand some types will break down after constant contact with moisture. once they begin to break down, they oculd be releaseing chemicals into the water. a good coat of epoxy could remedy this, but using a safe foam would eliminate that step in the process. a lot of people (myself included) like to use the expandable polyurethane foam (common brand "great stuff") to mold and form water features and back grounds. i would reccomend it for your pools, as its easy to work with and easily moldable.

good luck and keep postin'!


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

I'm using Handi-Foam for it, and so far it's working like a charm! I'm simply amazed by how fast the stuff dries and how it expands. I've been playing with it for a few hours now, and it just doesn't get old!  I really need to get a life. :? 

Anyway, progress! I deviated from my plan a bit (my pieces of driftwood really changed my plans!) and here's what I have so far- Warning! This is possibly the messiest picture ever posted on this forum! I'm still working so I'm not going to clean up just to create another disaster. 








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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

Alright! Another update: 

After a day's work, it all comes together: 










Now I just need a TON of plants. Here's a sketch of the tank with a little green: 










Any recommendations right now would be very appreciated!! I'm new to the whole tropical plant thing. 

I'm officially covered in polyurethane foam and I managed to nearly saw off my finger. After all the blood and all the cursing, I have to say that I would do it again in a heartbeat. 

So this is how the vivarium addition begins, isn't it? :lol:


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## Frogtofall (Feb 16, 2006)

I have a question. Are you planning on leaving all that Handi-foam bare? Did you decide not to cover it all the way? Also, did you let everything dry for at least a solid day before you put the water in the pond area?

What is your substrate consist of? Is it just peat or??


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

1. No.
2. Yes. I prefer the "rockier" appearance. 
3. No. 
4. Coco and eventually peat. Did not add for trial run.


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## Frogtofall (Feb 16, 2006)

foxhunt006 said:


> 1. No.
> 2. Yes. I prefer the "rockier" appearance.
> 3. No.
> 4. Coco and eventually peat. Did not add for trial run.


1.Gotcha but how will you cover it with it all setup like that? Will you drain everything?
2.Gotcha
3.Why not? Its a good idea to.
4.Coco and peat are horticulturally the same thing. You might want to mix some orchid bark or something for drainage in there.


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

I'm completely confused by the drainage question. I have a syphon tube set up on the left hand corner of the tank in the back that will allow me to drain the false bottom when it's full. 

In my trial run with the foam I piled it high and cut it open after 3 hours. It was completely dry by that point. On the product I used it stated that it was typically cure within a few hours, which was evident in my first run with it. 

Thanks for the advice concerning the orchid bark! I'll be sure to grab some tomorrow.


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## Frogtofall (Feb 16, 2006)

I'll give a quick run down, or at least try to.

I was referring to the covering of the background with silicone and then applying the coco fiber over that. Adding the coco to the wet handi-foam (or Great Stuff) doesn't work that great. When it dries it tends to fall off so its nice to use the silicone. I'm not sure which you did though.

Drainage for the substrate is important b/c you don't want your future plants to have soggy roots. A good mix to try would be peat, perlite, charcoal and orchid bark. Find a ratio that works well for you. Peat is the basis of the mix so there will be more of it than anything else. Or coco, which ever you choose.

You have many plant options but I'll wait to see your "final product" to recommend them.

Good luck.


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

It's been a while, but the vivarium project continues! We've just finished moving so instead of unpacking I've been catching up on this board... The boxes can wait, right? :lol: 

With your suggestions in hand I ventured off to HD and grabbed some of Shultz's orchid mix and bark and dumped the whole lot into an expanded brick of coco bedding. 

While at HD I spotted an african violet, a polka dot plant, and a prayer plant. I washed off as much of the dirt off and wipeddown the leaves and placed them in the viv. Everything is doing wonderfully- the violet WON'T stop blooming, the prayer plant is already getting too big (there goes that experiment!) and the polka dot plant has already been pinched back twice. I still want a fern of some type in the corner behind the waterfall, and I want to get some duck weed for the pond area... I need a lot more smaller plants in this! It just looks too bare for my liking. 

Suggestions? 

Oh, to answer the questions about the silicone- No, I didn't add it to the background. It seems like there's a huge war out there regarding as to whether or not silicone is worth adding to the background... For my next one I'm going to give it a shot and see how it turns out. 

Someone should have told me this stuff was addictive! I'm already daydreaming about the next viv.... I'd love to have a corner tank vivarium!


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

BTW, I just wanted to thank you for all of your advice! You have no idea how much it means to me! I really appreciate it.


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## Guest (Oct 3, 2006)

sounds like the move is going ok so far. thats good. good luck getting unpacked. wever been back in our house since March and still havent unpacked everything....

as far as small plants, i bet Antone could hook you up. you could give him a PM with what you are looking for. aslo, there are always a few good threads in the classifieds.

current ones 

Kevin can custom taylor yuou a pakcage if you are looking for just smaller leafed plants.
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=20361

the third and fourth plant in this link are good small ones.
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=20474

another with some clippings priced to sell, but maybe not as small as you are looking for.
http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=20244

that should get you started, but keep in mind the classifieds change daily!


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

Update: 

I'm so glad I set this thing up before thinking about getting any frogs. The fountain broke and I had to tear the thing apart. Because I refuse to subject my future frogs to a ill-functioning waterfall and the stress of repairing their environment, I tore out everything and installed a new false bottom with a shallow pool in the front of the tank to syphon out the water. The design is simple, but allows for more plants and more terrain. 

I'm a bit heartbroken by losing my mini-waterfall, but I'm confident that this will be a lot safer for my future frogs. This setup will give me a lot more room to experiment with plants, and I won't have to worry about a frog getting stuck somewhere in the waterfall or drowning in the pool. 










I'll probably replace the rocks with something that looks a bit more natural. We'll see where it goes!

Thanks 2mnytnx! I've been browsing the marketplace but haven't been brave enough to order anything from anyone yet. I'm going to see if I can get some plants ordered in the next couple of days.


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

After replacing the chunky rocks with something more natural, hiding the false bottom and planting more foliage, here's where we're at: 



















I still need something nice to climb all over the back wall. I'm heading to NW Expo tomorrow morning in hopes that I'll find some inhabitants for this tank and a nice plant to throw on the back wall. 

Some pics of the blooms in the tank: 




























I'm also hoping to find some nice ground cover for the tank while I'm there. Wish me luck!


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## Guest (Oct 25, 2006)

what are those blooms from? 

the tank look a lot nicer with the smaller gravel. congrats on a nice tank, and i look forward to new pics of what you add later


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## maxmlax (Aug 13, 2006)

for some reason, vivs without broms, are like...... potatoes without gravy....


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## stchupa (Apr 25, 2006)

maxmlax said:


> for some reason, vivs without broms, are like...... potatoes without gravy....


I for the most part totaly agree, but for somereason, some people seem 'above' about being original. :roll: 

Nice to see you didn't hesitate....again.........and...........again to make things as workable/happy as possible. You was able to learn from your first one, and still fix it, which sounds appears as a rarity here to me. Good to see someone with a healthy amount ambition.

Now, all you have to do is apply 'that' to those lovely boxes patiently awaiting your attention.


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## foxhunt006 (Sep 10, 2006)

The blooms are from an orchid and two mini african violets. All are thriving.



> I for the most part totaly agree, but for somereason, some people seem 'above' about being original.


Ugh, I've noticed. The ones I've seen in person would have simply been HUGE in the tank, and would have dwarfed everything I had already planted. Broms just don't really do it for me, but I'll probably throw one or two into the next one. 

As much as I enjoy seeing a tank with a ton of driftwood and a billion broms in it, I have to live with seeing this tank every single day. It's vital to have plants that can function in tank conditions, but it's also important to have plants that I can bear to look at. 



> "Nice to see you didn't hesitate....again.........and...........again to make things as workable/happy as possible. You was able to learn from your first one, and still fix it, which sounds appears as a rarity here to me. Good to see someone with a healthy amount ambition.


Thanks- I figure I had to use what I had. Now I understand why there's a post every other week or so about a newcomer trying to build a viv with a waterfall/other moving water feature and so many people are honest about starting simple... I'm stubborn, so I had to find it out the hard way. :roll:


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