# Heat for a very cold room



## JCunha (Feb 10, 2012)

Hi, My name's João...
I'm a regular viewer of this fórum, but this is my first intervention. I begin to plan my little terrarium (45x45x60) for a pair of leucomelas, with all the value tips a learn here...but i miss something...
I have the terrarium already planted, but i make a ugge mistake, i believed that with the lights my temps were fine, but this revealed catastrophic, in the day my temps are 19C and at night 15\16C...I have a 10cm substrate, so i think an under heat mat wont do anything. I start to look at halogen basking lamps, and even kwon that can dry the environment, i think is the only way, without dismount everything...My main concern is that i read somewhere that this type of lamps can burn plastic or crack glass...
What options do i have?

Thanks for all
Best Regards
JP


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## zth8992 (Jul 19, 2012)

I am moving next year and will probably be in a colder room so I have read a lot about this and here is what I have read. I don't know how big the room is but the safest and seemingly best way to raise the temperature of your tank is to raise the temperature of the room. You could get a space heater (either oil or electric) and just heat the whole room up a couple degrees. Also using compact fluorescent bulbs helps because those put out heat but not like a basking lamp does. The in tank heaters can crack the glass so I would not do that, I have read too many bad things about them.


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

Greetings Joao:

Check out this thread I started a month ago:

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/beginner-discussion/92625-winter-heating-cold-climates-poll.html


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## JCunha (Feb 10, 2012)

Thanks, for all reply...
Its seem the best option to heat the room, but this way its too expensive with electricity bill...
I need to find another option...

Best Regards
JC


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

Where do live if you do not mind my asking? 1) Your name sounds Portuguese; (2) You use metric units. But somehow, I do not think you're in Brazil 

What are your winter ambient temperatures(day/night)?

Hmnn, for a tank your size (24x18x18 English units), you have two options:

1) A UTH (stick on heater) on the back of the tank--you can put it on a thermostat;

2) One of those heating cables under the tank. Will keep the substrate a bit warmer, good for the plants.

In a tank your size, do not use heat lights--they will concentrate too much heat due to the greenhouse effect (through the glass). I use a basking bulb on one side on standard (i.e., long) aquarium tanks--but your tank does not allow this option.

Hope this helps.


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## JPccusa (Mar 10, 2009)

Oi João,

You can try the UTH since it would warm up the water and maybe that heat would radiate upwards. Another option would be oil filled room heaters. 

Where are you keeping the vivarium for it to be in such a cold room?


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## JCunha (Feb 10, 2012)

Hi again,
Yes, you were wright, i am Portuguese, a live in a small fishing village, call Sesimbra. Today the temperature is 15c (60f), at night is about 10c...
I have the terrarium in kitchen...i know that there is not the most suitable place, but for now, it has to be there...
Regarding the options...my background is a zoomed cork tile. Do you think that the heat mat is suitable in back? And the silly question, in the background and with the heat that produce, the silicone that i use to stick the background dosen't melt?

Best regards 
Jc


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## JCunha (Feb 10, 2012)

Hello,
For now i'm a little confused, with all the options that i have, but supose that...
My terrarium is 45x45x60 (18x18X24) hight, i have a glass plate in the top of terrarium with 4cm (about 2inches) gap close the from glass, and other 4cm in back, for ventilation. My humidity is set above 90%, misting by hand, for now...
If i put a halogen lamp, with low voltage (20-35W) in a clamp stand 15cm (6inches) higher from the terrarium top, do you think that can work? Its safe enough not to crack glass, or burn some plastic frame? Or do you think this can be dry out the terrarium to fast....

Best Regards
JC


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## GP dynamite (Feb 19, 2013)

If you keep the lamp 6 inches above the glass, it shouldn't crack. I would watch the temp in the terrarium to ensure that they don't get too high. Halogen lamps can get pretty hot. As for the silicone melting, that should not happen. You're only looking to reach temps of 22C to 25C. If the temp gets hot enough for the silicone to melt, you have bigger problems. 

With regards to humidity, you'll have to watch your hygrometer to ensure you maintain the minimum 80% and mist as necessary. 

Best of luck.


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## JCunha (Feb 10, 2012)

Hi there,
I'm study the options i have, and come with another possibility...
Can the Exo Terra Dual canopy, with two fluorescente lights and one mini halogen with 35w, work? The Halogen bulb has a GU10 fiiting, it can be replaced with one led bulb. Do you think led bulb can produce enought heat?
This Bulb is dimmeble and can be controlled with a thermoststat.

Best Regards
JC


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## calz (Feb 18, 2013)

Hi, I don't know if i can chuck out a complete alternative to the standard heating solutions.. 

On another forum, there is a guy from Scotland who has a 6m x 6m greenhouse which he has heated using under floor heating components. So he has a boiler circulating hot water pipes under the ground and up some sides. 
He suggested for heating smaller vivariums for a low electricity cost (set up may be a little pricey) would be to have a sump with an aquarium heater set to ~32oC and the water to flow through coiled pipes in the substrate and the back ground (and sides if covered) these could be easily covered and it shouldn't crack the glass. you are also not putting another piece of electrical equipment inside of the actual terrarium. The volume of water should also act as a buffer to prevent major temp swings. plus the heated soil will work wonders for the plants.
If you then place polystyrene or another insulator on the outside of the viv it will stop heat escaping. you will end up with a similar design pattern to the guy in scotland who has stable temps of ~24oc. 

A shopping list will be

-small glass tank maybe 10gallon? you might get away with a sweater box ---with lid to help prevent evaporation. 
-aquarium heater
-small pump
-some tubing
-optional polystyrene

the water will be in a closed system and should not ever come into contact with the frogs or substrate so you could use some of water they use in pc water cooling systems, although i guess 10 gallons of this will be expensive. 


this is just an idea and i have not tried it myself.



edit: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=WC-004-MH 

Warning : Mayhems Ultra Water is food safe, Human safe and Animal safe however we do not recommend that you attempt to consume our liquids as they have been specially made for water cooled PCs.

so even if it leaked it would be safe for frogs. i though these waters had some kind of anti fungal solution in them but its just super pure water.


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## calz (Feb 18, 2013)

* antimould not fungus. excuse me


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## Dendrobati (Jul 27, 2012)

JCunha said:


> Hi again,
> Yes, you were wright, i am Portuguese, a live in a small fishing village, call Sesimbra. Today the temperature is 15c (60f), at night is about 10c...
> I have the terrarium in kitchen...i know that there is not the most suitable place, but for now, it has to be there...
> Regarding the options...my background is a zoomed cork tile. Do you think that the heat mat is suitable in back? And the silly question, in the background and with the heat that produce, the silicone that i use to stick the background dosen't melt?
> ...


If you are portuguese, then you are a good person for sure!

I hope you are able to find a good solution to keep your leucs warm. Seems like you have plenty of helpful tips already

Boa sorte!
Marta


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## Groundhog (Dec 17, 2006)

JCunha said:


> Hi there,
> I'm study the options i have, and come with another possibility...
> Can the Exo Terra Dual canopy, with two fluorescente lights and one mini halogen with 35w, work? The Halogen bulb has a GU10 fiiting, it can be replaced with one led bulb. Do you think led bulb can produce enought heat?
> This Bulb is dimmeble and can be controlled with a thermoststat.
> ...



Not a bad idea--but you cannot mount any plants up close to to the halogen!

How cold can the room get on a cold winter day? Below 15c? If you can get the tank to 23c day, 19c night in winter, that should be good enough if only for three months. The animals will move closer to the heat if needed.

I would be more inclined to mount the UTH to the bottom (not under the water basin!), rather than the back--because if you heat the back, it may cook any mounted plants.


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## JCunha (Feb 10, 2012)

Hi again..and thanks for the help...
Yes in cold winter days, the room can reached easily to 15C. Today the temps outside are more warm, so in the viv i get temps that range from 20C in the day and 18 in night....I think in summer i dont have any problems to get the desire 23\24C in day and 19C in the night without any heat source. My main concern is in winter...I think for now i'll try the option with dual canopy. I might get one halogen lamp with 20w...witch is a lower wattage, so i think it produce less heat. I dont have any plants too hight, but i will try to locate the halogen in a place where there is less flora (plants)...

Best regards
JC


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