# Background on sides



## Chesney001 (Jan 15, 2014)

In the planning stages of building a new vivarium in an 18x18x24 exo terra. Making a custom background and was considering doing the sides as well. Looking on opinions/pros/cons of using a background on just the back panel vs. the back and the sides.


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## Bighurt (Jun 18, 2011)

I just finished carving the the foam on 3 29's.

I wrapped the background onto the sides but only about half way and the bottom is done more than the top.

It makes the tank feel wider while providing more nooks and crannies. 

With my setup there is no need to do the sides but I didn't want to block any of the front glass so I made the compromise to do the half way deal and transition the background as much as I could.

It's not a 3 sided background its 1 and 2 halves...


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## gdebell (Oct 1, 2014)

Having a background on the sides does keep the frogs from see as much movement. The only thing I didn't like was see the background from outside. so I bought some black contact paper and did the sides and bottom front of my vivarium. The down side is that it take twice as much to do both side and the back as opposed to the back by itself.


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## Bighurt (Jun 18, 2011)

gdebell said:


> The only thing I didn't like was see the background from outside.


Probably should have mentioned this but yes it can be a distraction to me as the viewer. In fact it bothers me so much I lined the tank with Black silicone before foaming the BG.

I masked the bottom 3" of the three sides and the front 3 inches of the sides and spread 2 tubes across the remaining portion. What doesn't get covered in BG mix I'll cut back. Essentially (silicone and coco method) My BG is a giant Silicone sandwich.

I omitted the bottom 3" as I don't want any water creep from the false bottom.


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## Chesney001 (Jan 15, 2014)

Good advice, was planning on putting silicone on the glass based on the research I've done


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## gdebell (Oct 1, 2014)

I had a hard time finding black silicone. My local hardware stores don't seem to carry it sadly. But the black contact paper works just as well for my purpose of covering the ugly. It also hides the false bottom from the front of the tank.


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## hun73r (Jul 1, 2013)

gdebell said:


> I had a hard time finding black silicone. My local hardware stores don't seem to carry it sadly. But the black contact paper works just as well for my purpose of covering the ugly. It also hides the false bottom from the front of the tank.


Have you tried your local ACE hardware store? The one near me sell 100% silicone in numerous colors including black. Not sure how far you are from Boulineau's ACE hardware but that shows to be in MB.


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## run91 (May 28, 2013)

I put a custom background in an 18x18x24 that covered the back and half of one side, which I think is a good setup, especially if you are making a corner tank.

You just have to remember that the more you put on the back and sides of the tank, the smaller it gets. Just an inch on each side (without the front of course) turns your tank into a 16x17x24 which cost you around 7 square feet versus the empty tank. That doesn't even count false bottom or substrate layer. If you're planning a very thick background, it might not be the best idea if you're worried about space for the eventual inhabitants.


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## Broseph (Dec 5, 2011)

I've always "backgrounded" the sides of my display vivs. I hate the look of algae/poop/etc on glass. 

Pros: Looks good. More planting opportunity. 

Cons: Obviously more materials means more cost. Only viewing angle is from the front (this can also be a pro). Depending on what you're keeping, there is more potential for escape from a front-opening viv with planted sides.

Another method I've seen is when people make background islands on the sides. Whether it's a lone piece of wood or just a spot or two of Great Stuff, it adds depth to the view without using a ton of extra material.


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## Igofastr (Jan 16, 2015)

This is my experience, FWIW.

Most of my tanks have either cork and/or GS only on the back of the tank. The only tank where I covered three sides has some scratches that bothered me, and so I felt the obligation to cover them up.

GS sticks great to (clean) glass, but looks ugly from the outside (even the black stuff). I don't consider it a problem if only on the back, where it can't be viewed, but it is too ugly to be on sides that can be viewed routinely. 

Silicone, slathered on carefully (using a plastic drywall spatula in my case) looks good from the outside. Solid black, really quite flawless. I taped my edges, and they are sharp and professional looking. Great Stuff doesn't stick to silicone very well, though more silicone does. You'll have to put another coat on the inside to hold your coco fiber/ABG/moss etc. So, by the time you've made a silicone-GS-silicone sandwich, you've got a pretty solid wall.

The obvious downside, already mentioned, is that you'll lose significant volume to your enclosure. Other downsides are that you lose the ability to "look around" and you lose ambient light. On the plus side, you get to do more decorating!! (Of course that costs $$). And, shy species may feel less secure surrounded by glass, I don't know.

Personally, I would only do it on "special" enclosures, and would rather have the space in most cases.


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## Chesney001 (Jan 15, 2014)

Thanks for all the replies. After taking all the responses into consideration, i think I'll go with just the back and leave the sides be.


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## Wusserton (Feb 21, 2014)

Chesney001 said:


> In the planning stages of building a new vivarium in an 18x18x24 exo terra. Making a custom background and was considering doing the sides as well. Looking on opinions/pros/cons of using a background on just the back panel vs. the back and the sides.


I regularly coat 3 sides of my tanks, its hard in an exo because you have to allow for door clearense and stuff like that but for fish tank style like 10-20g verts its fine. you can always do a partial wrap and still have plent of door clearence, I did a background/one side partial in a fire belly toad tank and it looks good only because the back/right are covered and it sits right on my computer desk to the right of my monitor, thats was in a 12x12x18 with 2 fire bellies (male:female) any more I would need a bigger tank for them but yeah its absolutely possible just allow for door clearences. You can always do a great stuff background and than do nothing but silicone/treefern or whatever on the sides, the benefit is that it cuts on space issues because its essentially flat but offers blocks to the outside as well which can reduce stress and stuff like that, people always worry about scratches and see through issues, stuff like that, just buy some construction paper and either glue it to the outside walls or tape it, it blocks light and hidden scratches and stuff like that. You will have to just cut it down, there are safe glues you can apply it with as well if you want it to be more permanent.


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## carola1155 (Sep 10, 2007)

Honestly, this decision should probably be made by what frogs you plan on putting in there. Some frogs will really benefit from the added security of more walls. Usually the more secure they feel, the more often you'll see them.






gdebell said:


> I had a hard time finding black silicone. My local hardware stores don't seem to carry it sadly. But the black contact paper works just as well for my purpose of covering the ugly. It also hides the false bottom from the front of the tank.


TrueValue Hardware lets you order online and ship to a local store for free. If you have one near you, its not a bad option. I get black GE I that way.

Other option is some of the sponsors. I know at least a few carry it. I just got some from NEHerp this week actually.


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

Igofastr...I read the quote: ' Great Stuff doesn't stick to silicone very well, though more silicone does." ----and think you may have that backwards...you can't put a reliable coating of silicone on silicone...which is one of the problems to resealing a tank...but you can put more GS, or even better--Gorilla Glue, which is the same chemical without the propellent...on GS, especially if the surface of the original GS is abraded some...you may want to go to the construction threads to be sure about that... And it has been my understanding that putting the GS over the smeared silicone makes the GS adhere better to glass... As far as covering up the unsightly junk that you can see from the outside--spraying with a matte black paint does wonders--just use alcohol to clean the glass first, and make sure the paint used will adhere to glass..places where you don't want paint--smear something oily, or make a cutout pattern and use some spray on adhesive to hold it in place..


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## Igofastr (Jan 16, 2015)

Judy,

I agree with you about getting the glass clean.

As far as what will stick to what...I suppose it's all relative. Would I trust just slapping more silicone on top of old leaky silicone in a water-filled aquarium..no. I would definitely remove all of it, and start from scratch.

Will GS stick to silicone...not in my experience. Oh, it might stick a little, but I certainly wouldn't trust it structurally. I've seen large areas of GS delaminate when applied over silicone, while GS applied at the same time stuck just fine to glass. The best way to get GS to stick to glass though, is to spray a little on, and really smear it around. It'll collapse, but makes a great base to spray additional GS to, and that stuff will not come off.

Now, as far as my experience (I have 7 vivs right now), silicone will stick to cured silicone well enough to hold coco fiber (and large chunks of solid GS) in place.I probably wouldn't trust it to hold a big chunk of drift wood, but relatively lightweight stuff, sure.

I suppose that if I wanted to retroactively add a BIG chunk of heavy wood etc, I would probably cut away a portion of the silicone, and use GS to attache it directly to the glass. Then, I'd go back and touch up the areas of exposed GS with more silicone.

Anyway, that's what has worked for me. I have several tanks that have been going strong for more than 5 years...and none of them show any signs of delamination. 

Best regards,

Ron

Oh, and I agree, GS will stick to GS all day long...Gorilla glue..just a liquid form of polyurethane, right? I've never used it, but I'm sure it would stick to GS, too.


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## Igofastr (Jan 16, 2015)

Judy S said:


> Igofastr...I read the quote: ' Great Stuff doesn't stick to silicone very well, though more silicone does." ----and think you may have that backwards...you can't put a reliable coating of silicone on silicone...which is one of the problems to resealing a tank...but you can put more GS, or even better--Gorilla Glue, which is the same chemical without the propellent...on GS, especially if the surface of the original GS is abraded some...you may want to go to the construction threads to be sure about that... And it has been my understanding that putting the GS over the smeared silicone makes the GS adhere better to glass... As far as covering up the unsightly junk that you can see from the outside--spraying with a matte black paint does wonders--just use alcohol to clean the glass first, and make sure the paint used will adhere to glass..places where you don't want paint--smear something oily, or make a cutout pattern and use some spray on adhesive to hold it in place..


Judy,

I'm curious, do you paint the inside or outside of the glass?

BTW,
I know I have almost no posts...I was a member here for years...went inactive and my account was deleted. I recently had to start from scratch. That's why my post count is only 25. I'm a NOOB, but not a total NOOB


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## MasterOogway (Mar 22, 2011)

I've always wondered why people say smearing silicone over glass helps GS adhere better to glass. If you smear silicone over the glass, there's no more glass left to adhere to. And silicone doesn't stick to GS that well, especially if the GS hasn't been cut/roughed up. My last two vivs and the one I'm currently building have all had GS spread directly on the glass. Couple years and they're all holding up fine, and one of htem has sat outside, empty, all winter long (in Alaska), and the GS hasn't pulled away yet. I'd rather do it this way then smear silicone over the glass first any day of the week.


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## Igofastr (Jan 16, 2015)

T-guy,

Agreed. I've only done the "silicone first" method when the outside surface was going to be very visible when routinely looking at the viv. It can look nice (shiny, flawless..a lot like paint), but adds a good bit of complexity to the whole build, IMHO. I wouldn't even consider it on a surface that wouldn't be seen (the back).


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

I'M the Noob...trust me...I shall have to try the plain GS without the silicone! I've used the paint on the outside of the tank (obviously no frogs in tank--!) Welcome back to the obsession........


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## Igofastr (Jan 16, 2015)

Judy,

The reason I asked about the paint is that with the silicone on the inside, the outside is nice and shiny, and will stay that way. No chance of it getting scraped off (at least from the outside).

I suppose the same would be true of paint. I'm just not aware of a paint being used inside a vive with GS and/or silicone applied over the top. It might work if someone were to find a paint that sticks really well. I imagine a two-part epoxy would do it, and it's inert once cured, but I haven't tried it yet.

Best, Ron


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## MasterOogway (Mar 22, 2011)

Several people use black contact paper on the outside to cover up the foam and false bottom, I'm giving that a shot on this big exo terra I'm currently working on. Looks nice, peel, stick on, cut away the extra, done. 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3 using Tapatalk 2


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## nish07 (Mar 16, 2008)

I honestly feel like darkening the sides makes the frogs feel better. One viv I have a synthetic plant grow stuff on the sides.. another has tree fern. The tree fern is great for microfauna. Making frogs feel like they're secure probably goes a long way to their health and their willingness to reproduce (the ones that are difficult sometimes.)

About the sides, I use black vynil contact paper and put it on like someone who puts window tinting would. However, what Josh (Joshsdragonz) does is just get a fine roller and go over the sides with matte paint. I think that's the easiest thing to do if you do it before you do anything else and apparently if you want to it's pretty easily scraped off of glass. The contact paper is fine too but it's more expensive, difficult to work with and if the side has any cut outs for vents it's a pita. Also unless the paper is very wide you will get a seam sometimes.

-Nish


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## Nismo95 (Jul 30, 2011)

So, I do know that blocking views from neighboring vivs can be really beneficial for pumilio. as they can stress easily with a calling male next door if the males can see each other through glass... Just curious, has anyone made a background on just the back glass, and blacked out the sides, whether that be some spray paint or contact paper? Part of me has the mental image that it would look really good. the other part of me feels I would do this and then curse all night for having to scrape paint off from a terrible decision. lol

With that being said, I am in the building stages of building ten 40b verts, and given the limited space in depth and width, I will not be putting any material on the sides inside the vivs. I want to keep as much space as possible viewing wise. and instead of just putting film cans onto the glass, I will likely make my own get ups to disguise film canisters and blend into the background while taking up real estate space on the sides a bit. Sorry for rambling.


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## zonz540 (Feb 8, 2012)

Looks bad, but retains some light and heat until algae and moss take over, I've put Aluminum foil on the sides of a few of my tanks. Now, I use Hydroton on the sides and expanded cork on the back. Seems to be the perfect, although slightly boring way to build my vivs.


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## MasterOogway (Mar 22, 2011)

Nismo, I'm probably going to wrap up my xtra exo terra in the next week or two, I'll put on more contact paper on the sides (test small area first to see how easy it is to take off) then I need. I have very small amounts of foam on the sides that I need to cover, but I'll see if I can overlap it by a fair amount then take a picture for you if I can remember. See how it looks. 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3 using Tapatalk 2


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