# 12x12x18 Zoo Med Starter Viv



## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

Well I've been asking questions and doing research on here for a bit now, so I think it is time to start my tank. I am just going to do a basic setup with a small water feature. I am not going to be adding frogs for quite a while, and if I do I will start small to give them enough time to move them to a new tank.

So far I have: 
-dual 50W GE 6500K energy efficient lights
-Zoo Med 501 canister filter for waterfall
-size small heat pad if needed (my house gets pretty cold)
-dual 1 1/2" computer fans to be hooked up for re-circ system
-all of my substrate and materials to complete the background
-a few plants I saved from Petco that were dying, but I'm not sure what I can use yet.


I still need to buy a few small things (such as humidifier), and I am going to drill the tank for all of the plumbing I will need.

Please keep in mind this is my first real viv, so I will probably need a lot of advice and opinions. Thanks in advance, here is a picture of how the tank sits today to tide you over:


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

What type`s of frog`s will you be getting?
Please keep in mind you`re going to have very little-if any floor space in a viv. that small with a water feature.

John


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

Enlightened Rogue said:


> What type`s of frog`s will you be getting?
> Please keep in mind you`re going to have very little-if any floor space in a viv. that small with a water feature.
> 
> John


Well I've kept some fairly difficult animals before, and since I'm going to have plenty of time to do my research, I've decided that I will most likely do a pair of one of the easier thumbnails. This is if I decide to do darts at all, and I will try to build them a newer habitat as soon as I can, but the reason I am starting with this one is because my fiance is unsure of the entire thing.


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## LorenK (Apr 3, 2008)

Nice. I'm starting with the same setup. It will be interesting to watch your progress.


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

I would really advise against a water feature in your first viv, especially with that little floor space. Save yourself a lot of hassle and impress the little lady with a simpler setup first, just getting the basics down. Once you feel like you've got that nailed... then try for the water feature. I do like that driftwood. Water features really aern't necessary, and I think you will be stoked just going simpler your first time around. I know that they look awesome, and I really wanted one in my first viv too, and it was 3x that size, but I didn't put one in, and Im really glad I didn't. 4 more vivs later and I haven't put one in yet, but my hardscaping and planting gets better all the time, and the maintenance is nil, and complications to construction and maintenance are really kept to a minimum.


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

frogparty said:


> I would really advise against a water feature in your first viv, especially with that little floor space. Save yourself a lot of hassle and impress the little lady with a simpler setup first, just getting the basics down. Once you feel like you've got that nailed... then try for the water feature. I do like that driftwood. Water features really aern't necessary, and I think you will be stoked just going simpler your first time around. I know that they look awesome, and I really wanted one in my first viv too, and it was 3x that size, but I didn't put one in, and Im really glad I didn't. 4 more vivs later and I haven't put one in yet, but my hardscaping and planting gets better all the time, and the maintenance is nil, and complications to construction and maintenance are really kept to a minimum.


I will keep that in mind.

I was looking at an intermedius imi pair, or any of the vents as my first.


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## R1ch13 (Apr 16, 2008)

schgriffith said:


> I will keep that in mind.
> 
> I was looking at an intermedius imi pair, or any of the vents as my first.


I wanted to get myself 4-5 Ventrimaculatus Borja Ridge as my first, for my 54 gallon tank...

But it was suggested to me that even though they are seen as a good beginner thumb, they are not recommeneded as a beginner dart.

In my case ive never kept any amphibs in my life, only planted aquariums etc, so i have now reconsidered and im deciding between Leucs and Tincs.

Give this some serious though buddy 

Richie


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

R1ch13 said:


> I wanted to get myself 4-5 Ventrimaculatus Borja Ridge as my first, for my 54 gallon tank...
> 
> But it was suggested to me that even though they are seen as a good beginner thumb, they are not recommeneded as a beginner dart.
> 
> ...


Well as far as amphibians go, I've kept green tree frogs, horned frogs, tiger salamanders, and fire bellied toads in the past. I have also had corn snakes, black snakes, leopard geckos, bearded dragons, and anoles for reptiles, and a great assortment of difficult saltwater fish which I have also bred (currently breeding Picasso Clownfish if anyone is interested).

I also work at a Petco, and although the corporation itself isn't great, our store is one of the best. I also get experience working with all the animals there that I do not own (am pretty much in charge of aquatics and reptiles).

Plus, I will have a good 5 months at LEAST to consider, do my research, gather supplies, cultures, etc and make up my mind. 

But hey, the fiances not looking too happy about the viv idea at all now, so this might all be pointless.


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## jackxc925 (Dec 22, 2007)

french guyana vents were my first dartfrog. but i have experience with amphibnians and reptiles that share similar requirements, so i felt that i could better handle a thumbnail. they have been very hardy and as long as you talk to people with experience a lot before you jump in you should be fine


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## R1ch13 (Apr 16, 2008)

Was just saying... 

Well fire away then, youve owned enough animals to have your own ark by the sounds of it 

Good luck man, 

Richie


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

jackxc925 said:


> french guyana vents were my first dartfrog. but i have experience with amphibnians and reptiles that share similar requirements, so i felt that i could better handle a thumbnail. they have been very hardy and as long as you talk to people with experience a lot before you jump in you should be fine



Good to know! I'm planning on visiting a couple local breeders, and my general manager is friends with a guy who's been breeding for years apparently (still haven't found out his name).



R1ch13 said:


> Was just saying...
> 
> Well fire away then, youve owned enough animals to have your own ark by the sounds of it
> 
> ...



Thanks 
I didn't mean to come off negatively, if that's how it seemed! I just wanted to make everyone aware that I have had experience with many animals, and enough amphibs where I think that with enough research I could handle this fairly well. 

But the main point is that I WILL be doing my research, and if I don't feel like I can achieve absolute success and 0 losses, I will not get a PDF period. When you spend $300 on a pair of clownfish, you have to be pretty confident you can care for the animals as well 

Here are Celebrator and Devastator, my Picasso Clowns:


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

Wow! Got a lot of PMs about the Picassos, so instead of replying to each one with pictures I'm just going to post more here. 

Here they are in their old home:


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

Well I was able to trade my 12x12x18" Zoo Med for a 18x18x24" Exo Terra 

Looks like my decisions got a whole lot easier.

PS, I will most likely start a new thread for this for the new tank.


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## jackxc925 (Dec 22, 2007)

you could easily house a nice group of thumbs in there, i am building the same size exo terra right now and i plan on housing a few intermedius


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

18x18x24 are great sizes. Gives you a lot more options. Youve' got a ton of vertical space to mess with if you want thumbs or smaller frogs. You've got some good ground space if you want something like a leuc or auratus or pumilio (don't get pumilio as your first frog).

By the way, leucs are my favs. Bold, vibrant, loud call...


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

SmackoftheGods said:


> 18x18x24 are great sizes. Gives you a lot more options. Youve' got a ton of vertical space to mess with if you want thumbs or smaller frogs. You've got some good ground space if you want something like a leuc or auratus or pumilio (don't get pumilio as your first frog).
> 
> By the way, leucs are my favs. Bold, vibrant, loud call...


yeah i was originally going to go with a group of leucs for the 40br, but when i switched to aa smaller tank i fell in love with the intermedius. as of now it is between the two for sure, but i have a good 6 months before i buy frogs. i just have to work on convincing the fiance to let me start the tank, ive got my bulkheads and everything ready to go.

ps, i decided to do a water feature in the exo since ill have the room. the waterfall was part of what made this so interesting for me.


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## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

Water features take some work. But if you're going to take six months before even thinking of getting frogs I'd say that'll give you plenty of time to work out all the kinks. I'm sure it'll look great.

And I'd really recommend those leucs


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## jackxc925 (Dec 22, 2007)

schgriffith said:


> yeah i was originally going to go with a group of leucs for the 40br, but when i switched to aa smaller tank i fell in love with the intermedius. as of now it is between the two for sure, but i have a good 6 months before i buy frogs. i just have to work on convincing the fiance to let me start the tank, ive got my bulkheads and everything ready to go.
> 
> ps, i decided to do a water feature in the exo since ill have the room. the waterfall was part of what made this so interesting for me.


i hope its just a water feature and not a paludarium. I think too much floor space is wasted even with thumbs


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

jackxc925 said:


> i hope its just a water feature and not a paludarium. I think too much floor space is wasted even with thumbs


Water feature, I want a small waterfall going into a little pond.

I would honestly just do a waterfall with a good place to drain and no pond, but I think in the long run a pond will work more in my favor.


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## schgriffith (Mar 16, 2009)

Please continue all posting in my new thread:
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/me...-build-journal-first-vivarium.html#post347900


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