# cooling down a tank...



## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

looking to figure out how to cool down a tank to the mid 70s.....i have 2 fans running in the tank and 2 fans outside the tank running across the light area....tank is still staying around 80.....want to know if there is some trick that i havent figured out....the house temp is 74 degress and it seems the light setup with 4 39 watt 6500 t5 arent the main source of heat....any tricks anyone could help with would be awesome....thanks i dont have frogs yet and am in the process of setting up my mistking ultimate hopeing that will help with heat some....thanks mickey.....i am sure this is not the last stupid question i will ask....thanks all......ps i have tought about a window unit but really dont want to dry out the air and the fact that i have a 210 gallon fresh and 55 gallon fresh tank in the room might also being keeping the heat up?


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## SnakePaparazzi (Jul 20, 2008)

What size tank? Any ventilation (not talking airflow)? How far off the tank are the lights?


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

How big of a tank is it? My first thought are that your ambient room temp is fine, it's your lights that are making it too hot. Fans inside the tank won't necessarily help to cool it. In fact the motors from those fans will give off additional heat. It is good to have fans blowing across the hot lights however. Have you tried raising the lights up further away from the viv? Why did you go with 4 T-5's? I've seen a lot of tanks with 2 T-5's, but 4 may be over kill.


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## radiata (Jul 24, 2010)

Would a conversion from T5s to LEDs improve the temperature problem, and by how much?


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## Pacblu202 (May 8, 2012)

Yeah. That will help. Im not sure how much but a few degrees.


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## holidayhanson (Apr 25, 2007)

I have heard of people reversing their light times in the summer months in hot locations.....lights on at night and off during the day. 

Moving the lights up a few inches will certainly help some too. The misting/humidity should also help cool the temps too. 

Good thing you are figuring this out before you have frogs.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

That's a lot of light. That's where your built up heat is coming from. At the least, lose 2 of the bulbs. However, switching to LEDs would make the most difference. I love my screw in LEDs. You can find them at Light Your Reptiles. Todd at LYR can also help you decide how much light you might want to consider for your tank.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Oh, and do you have any passive ventilation screen strips in the viv? That would help lower the temp a little too. It would also allow the frogs to handle the heat better. If there is a little ventilation, the frogs can regulate their body temperature a little through evaporative cooling.


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## Rusty_Shackleford (Sep 2, 2010)

Switching to LED's would require the purchase of another light fixture. He hasn't even said how big the tank is yet so at this point we don't even know if the T-5's are too much or if LED's would be better.
I think Doug has a good idea about ditching two of the T-5 bulbs. I have a viv with two T-5's and it's plenty bright. I can't imagine how bright and hot 4 must be.


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

lots of great questions...sorry for not filling them out to start off with....56 gallon tank....light fixture is sitting on top of 3in pvc tubes to keep it of the tank...i do have an led light fixture in use on my freshwater tank that is the same lenght as the one is am using....it is a 36in strip...maybe i will move it over to this tank to see how the temp works...i figured it might be overkill on the light fixture but it came with the tank setup that i bought so i figured i would use it...i hope i answered some of the questions....if i didnt please ask more...thanks mickey


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

Pumilo said:


> Oh, and do you have any passive ventilation screen strips in the viv? That would help lower the temp a little too. It would also allow the frogs to handle the heat better. If there is a little ventilation, the frogs can regulate their body temperature a little through evaporative cooling.


i am sorry i googled this and had no luck....i really am not sure what you mean...the tank has glass lids with no screen strip on top...i guess this is what you meant....the lids are on top like a fish tank...hope that answers the question.....but just taking a stab...


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

holidayhanson said:


> I have heard of people reversing their light times in the summer months in hot locations.....lights on at night and off during the day.
> 
> Moving the lights up a few inches will certainly help some too. The misting/humidity should also help cool the temps too.
> 
> Good thing you are figuring this out before you have frogs.


this was my first try at trying to lower temp....i really think the lights and lack of ventilation might be problem...as even when lights are off the tank is around 78 degress....i dont want to experiment on animals i never do....i want to do it right before i get the frogs as i want them to be happy and have the best enviroment possable...


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## Pacblu202 (May 8, 2012)

That's what he meant. He has screens on most of his tank I believe if not all. They have come to the conclusion that it's okay to have some screened area and it helps lower temps and humidity a bit since 90% humidity isnt really likely all the time in there respective wild habitats


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

Pumilo said:


> That's a lot of light. That's where your built up heat is coming from. At the least, lose 2 of the bulbs. However, switching to LEDs would make the most difference. I love my screw in LEDs. You can find them at Light Your Reptiles. Todd at LYR can also help you decide how much light you might want to consider for your tank.


well that wouldnt be a problem and they are on seperate ballist....i could just turn on 2 lights....really wasnt sure if 2bulbs would be enough to grown the plants in the tank....but apparently it should be....i read some crap about 2watts per gallon guess it isnt needed in this setup...i wish i new more about the plants that are planted in the tank but like i said i am a newb....i bought the setup complete...i do know that it has one mini orchid but really not much about the rest....thanks for all the replys....i appreciate it..seems to be a great community of pdf fans and am glad i joined.....


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

Pacblu202 said:


> That's what he meant. He has screens on most of his tank I believe if not all. They have come to the conclusion that it's okay to have some screened area and it helps lower temps and humidity a bit since 90% humidity isnt really likely all the time in there respective wild habitats


thank you i can make that happen also...as the front section of the glass top is only about4in wide and it doesnt fit really nice anyway...so i guess i will make a frame and screen it for the short section on top of the tank...


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

what type of mesh would you use? stainless steel? what micron? the thinner the better? sorry for all the questions....thanks again mickey


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

i am very sorry about this but the size of the tank is 68 gallons....i didnt measure it when i bought it but that is what it is....not 56 gallons...


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

tattoomc said:


> what type of mesh would you use? stainless steel? what micron? the thinner the better? sorry for all the questions....thanks again mickey


Some have used a stainless steel mesh. I've seen people say you can find it at McMaster Carr online.
I have been using NoSeeUm which is a polyester fabric mesh. 
Oh, looking for a NoSeeUm link for you I found this. 


zBrinks said:


> Here's what I get from McMaster-Carr:
> 
> 9241T39	Strainer-Grade Woven Wire Cloth, 304 Stainless Steel, 120 X 108 Mesh, .0035" Wire Diameter, 12" X 60" Sheet


Here's one for NoSeeUm. mesh fabrics Get the black in NoSeeUm. Black mesh is easier to see through than lighter colors. I know that sounds backwards, but 20+ years building screens says to get a black mesh. When I built mine all I could find locally was dark brown. That one is pretty easy to see through too.


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## frog dude (Nov 11, 2011)

Pacblu202 said:


> That's what he meant. He has screens on most of his tank I believe if not all. They have come to the conclusion that it's okay to have some screened area and it helps lower temps and humidity a bit since 90% humidity isnt really likely all the time in there respective wild habitats


my azureus vivarium is 90% humidity and 80 degrees F constanly and they are always bold and active and I get clutches weekly.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

frog dude said:


> my azureus vivarium is 90% humidity and 80 degrees F constanly and they are always bold and active and I get clutches weekly.


That may be, but with no ventilation (I'm assuming with 90% humidity) and a temperature of a consistent 80 F, you are at the upper limits of what they may be able to take. An afternoon a few degrees warmer could prove disastrous. You should really be considering cooling options, too.


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## frog dude (Nov 11, 2011)

Pumilo said:


> That may be, but with no ventilation (I'm assuming with 90% humidity) and a temperature of a consistent 80 F, you are at the upper limits of what they may be able to take. An afternoon a few degrees warmer could prove disastrous. You should really be considering cooling options, too.


Thanks for your concern. I have multiple backup plans ready at any given moment, and it is one of my priorities to ad some screen to the lid to get some air movment in that viv while it is empty (I'm going to move the tincs to another viv as soon as it's ready so I can tear down & rebuild this one).


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## ZookeeperDoug (Jun 5, 2011)

I see a number of solutions to drop the temps.

1. Screen in at least part of the top of the viv to allow for ventilation. I'd recommend doing the front since that generally helps with front glass condensation as well

2. Drop down to 2 bulbs. I also have 4 bulb T5s, but only run 2 in the summer, all 4 in the winter to warm the tanks.

3. Increase the distance of the lights from the tank.

4. Does your light have an acrylic splash gaurd? If so, remove it. I find that this lets the bulbs stay cooler and run cooler thus less heat in your viv.

Lastly, I wouldn't worry TOO much as long as the temps don't climb over 80. Where are you measuring temps? There is always a gradient. I find my tanks sit around 76-78 on the leaf litter durring the day and about 78-82 up at the very top. With a proper gradient and ventilation the frogs can and will thermoregulate on their own. A sealed up super humid viv at high temps is more or a problem than one that is slightly less humid and has some ventilation.


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## herpkeeper10 (May 1, 2012)

i turn my lights off and turn the a-c up or if my parents dont let me i put an ice pack in top of the tank when it gets too hot


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## Totenkampf (Jun 25, 2012)

not all T5HOs are equal. i bought my setup from the same person as the OP so I am sure that the fixture is an odyssea with stock lamps. the odyssea lamps are junk, i am running all four lamps and the plants look good with some red on the neos but it definately isnt too bright. i know it would be much more intense if i were running aquaticlife or currentusa lamps. i should say that i have a 20" fixture too and the smaller lamps dont have near the PAR of the longer ones if you consider them by their length. (eg, a single 48" T5HO lamp with have better PAR than two 24" lamps of the same model)

did your viv come with internal fans? i would say that these plus the evaporative cooling of the mist system plus some ventillation screen will get you there. one quick way to check your problem is measure the temp under the glass top where the lights are. it probably isnt too hot with fans blowing across it so i would not think all your extra thermal energy is coming from the fixture in that case


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## CJW (Nov 14, 2011)

^good advice

D-D Giesemann Powerchrome Aquaflora T5 High Output Fluorescent Lamp

These are good bulbs, two of these would barely generate any heat on the floor of that tank (assuming you include some form of the recommended ventilation), and would be plenty of light. Just use your eyes and watch for any plants looking any worse or better and adjust accordingly.


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## Totenkampf (Jun 25, 2012)

yeah i probably should have offered a good brand, 20" lamps are limited to just a few manufacturers. my larger planted aquariums have powerchromes and hagen life-GLO lamps and the difference in plant growth is very noticable


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## skanderson (Aug 25, 2011)

a couple quick things i would suggest. first my similar sized viv to yours runs with 4 t5hos of the same size over it without heating up quite as much as yours. lots of good advice from previous posters. the light level with all 4 lights on will allow you a larger assortment of plants and will help bring out more color from some of them. i would definately try to raise the lights at least 3 or 4 inches off of the top glass and i would definately run a small computer fan or 2 pushing air across the top to keep heat from building up. this will also move a bit more air through the screening on top that you are going to install. i strive for 100 par at the floor of my vivs when the bulbs are new. im at 9 months on my t5s now and the par has dropped to in the 70s. growth and color in my vivs is excellent. you can definately use much less light if you are sticking with lower light plants. like earlier posters it is a pleasure to see someone trying to figure out all of the details before they get the frogs. not many people have the patience to do things in the correct order. leds would certainly lower the temp in the tank. other than the premade ones you can diy one without much difficulty and lower the wattage you are using by at least half. also good single bulb reflectors will make a large difference in t5ho performance. the ability to reflect light well and smaller diameter is why t5 outperforms other flourescent platforms. keep asking questions i hope this was of some help.


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## tattoomc (Aug 23, 2012)

thanks all for the replys and suggestions.....i have raised the light about 3in from the top of the tank....removed the short glass section and had a solar screen made for it to help ventalation and flow.....this has basically solved my temp problem....i has been staying between 75 and 78....what would be the optimum humidty for luecs? i have been holding around 60 to 70 percent...i ordered some abg to give more substrate in the tank...i think this will also help on holding humidity...i dont think my top layer is thick enough....ps the mistking is running great....so i hope to have all the bugs worked out before the end of the month for the houston herp show....hoping to pick up some leucs there.....once again thanks for all the help....ps with all yalls knowledge and some extra cash.....it is going to work out..


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