# Terribilis shots



## gex23 (Apr 15, 2008)

Took a few snaps of my Phyllobates Terribilis and their setup :


P.Terribilis 2 by DEAF N1NJA, on Flickr


P.Terribilis 1 by DEAF N1NJA, on Flickr


p.Terribilis 3 by DEAF N1NJA, on Flickr


P.Terribilis Vivarium by DEAF N1NJA, on Flickr


----------



## dfrmav (Feb 22, 2011)

damn what is that big vine in the center? loving it!


----------



## johnc (Oct 9, 2009)

I don't know the name but I've got some of that too - from Scott Menigoz at last December's MADS meeting. It's a beautiful looking climber, but once it gets going it can get crazy .

Gex - those look like "Frye" line yellow terribilis. Am I right?


----------



## FrogNick (May 3, 2009)

They from Mworks? Stunning frogs love how terribilis "pose".


----------



## jckee1 (Mar 22, 2011)

I think the vine is Cissus amazonica
Jim


----------



## eos (Dec 6, 2008)

Very nice! Great looking tank and frogs.


----------



## gex23 (Apr 15, 2008)

johnc said:


> I don't know the name but I've got some of that too - from Scott Menigoz at last December's MADS meeting. It's a beautiful looking climber, but once it gets going it can get crazy .
> 
> Gex - those look like "Frye" line yellow terribilis. Am I right?


I'm not sure of the specific lineage, i'll find out from the breeder who's quite prominent on here (UK) 'Mworks'. What makes you draw that conclusion out of interest?



FrogNick said:


> They from Mworks? Stunning frogs love how terribilis "pose".


Yes they are, stunning frogs  - I have a really poor video recorded on my phone of one of the males calling, tempted to upload it.



dfrmav said:


> damn what is that big vine in the center? loving it!


Cissus Amazonica. Once established it goes mad though - be warned!



jckee1 said:


> I think the vine is Cissus amazonica
> Jim


Correct 



eos said:


> Very nice! Great looking tank and frogs.


Cheers


----------



## Happy_Frogger (Oct 19, 2011)

Beautiful pictures and set-up!


----------



## R1ch13 (Apr 16, 2008)

Great snaps mate.

May I ask how old they are?

I picked up 4 of these wee beasts from Graham and Marcus in early November.

They are all past a year now, and despite my huge 3 year old Male calling up a storm none want to reveal their sexs as yet...

Best regards,
Richie


----------



## johnc (Oct 9, 2009)

gex23 said:


> I'm not sure of the specific lineage, i'll find out from the breeder who's quite prominent on here (UK) 'Mworks'. What makes you draw that conclusion out of interest?


I didn't know you weren't in the US. My comment only applies if you are. Over here they've got only 1 real line of yellow terribilis, and it came from Europe. Yours look just like them, hence my comment, that's all. 

Cheers,

John


----------



## R1ch13 (Apr 16, 2008)

Only one real line John?

Care to elaborate?

I'd say the same goes for the UK mate.

As of late I've been seeing tonnes of suspect Terribilis which I'm almost 100% sure are the result of Yellows and Mints being housed together.

A fellow Scottish frogger recently got bitten by this and is now laden with 3 quite probably hybrid Terribs which were sold to him as Yellows.

Best regards,
Richie


----------



## gex23 (Apr 15, 2008)

Happy_Frogger said:


> Beautiful pictures and set-up!


Cheers



R1ch13 said:


> Great snaps mate.
> 
> May I ask how old they are?
> 
> ...


Cheers 

I collected these from Marcus last August, at which time I beleive they were about 2 - 3 months of age, so that makes them about 17 / 18 months of age? I have, i'd say 1 male and 2 females for sure, and another slim specimen I suspect is another male, so hopefully a 2.2 group.

The male calls an awful lot, and while the females seemingly react by increased movement, no courtship has been witnessed so far. 

Can I ask what the ideal spawning sites are for these guys? I've got a couple of petri dishes with minimal - no water underneath the 'huts'.

Cheers

Anthony


----------



## johnc (Oct 9, 2009)

R1ch13 said:


> Only one real line John?
> 
> Care to elaborate?
> 
> ...


Historically there were few exports (illegal or legal) from Colombia, so the real terribilis that we have are likely all descended from very few groups. The yellow terribilis and orange terribilis (not sure about mints but probably them as well) in the US came from Europe, so we're all in the same boat.

Mixing-wise, I firmly believe that there has been a lot of hybridization of yellow terribilis with yellow bicolor. I've been sold such frogs as yellow terribilis here in the US, and having the genuine article already, I was immediately suspicious of these animals.

On the subject of mints and yellows hybridizing, I recently spoke to Marcus Breece here in the US (he of SNDF) and he said something very similar to what you have brought up - he doesn't seem to think there are many genuine mints in the US.



gex23 said:


> The male calls an awful lot, and while the females seemingly react by increased movement, no courtship has been witnessed so far.
> 
> Can I ask what the ideal spawning sites are for these guys? I've got a couple of petri dishes with minimal - no water underneath the 'huts'.


My yellows did not lay eggs for the first time until they were 18-19 months old. They didn't produce viable eggs until they were 21-22 months old. So you have some waiting to do. Petri dishes under coconut huts seem to work fine. Mine have only laid outside a couple of times, and always on a large aroid leaf.


----------



## Smashtoad (Apr 27, 2007)

johnc said:


> Over here they've got only 1 real line of yellow terribilis...


You don't need to convince me...here are two of the trio I bought almost three years ago, one with a giant goiter, and the other a crooked spine. I'd say some outbreeding is in order.



















Funny thing is, there seems to be no recourse for a buyer years later when his frogs, that he paid good money for, start gimping out. The breeder just says, "I have seen no other issues...you must be feeding them wrong." 

Thing is, the third is fat and stunning. 










Awesome pics, buy the way. You using a Canon 100mm Macro?


----------



## Smashtoad (Apr 27, 2007)

From the classifieds...

Species - P. Terribilis "Yellow"
Line/Origin - XXXXXXXXXX
Age -12-16 months. Sex unknown
Quantity -2
Price - $150 for both. ONE IS A RUNT and the other is fine. 
Group Prices -Only selling together
Preferred Payment Method -Paypal
Shipping Rates & information -USPS overnight
Pictures -Available upon request

Hmmmm....same line as mine. Please notice the Capital letters.


----------



## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

Smashtoad said:


> You don't need to convince me...here are two of the trio I bought almost three years ago, one with a giant goiter, and the other a crooked spine. I'd say some outbreeding is in order.


Obviously, if frogs are displaying genetic defects the first thing one should do is breed them with a different locality frog.

I understand that for many frogs (not just the Yellow terribilis) there were few exports of that frog providing a small founding population and few unrelated frogs. However, a main contributor to inbreeding is people selling and buying siblings as "pairs" and breedable. Instead of throwing some mints in with your single viable Yellow terribilis, perhaps you should consider getting some additional Yellows from different sources. Same locality, but different enough genetics (likely) to provide healthy offspring for at least a few generations.


----------



## Smashtoad (Apr 27, 2007)

SmackoftheGods said:


> Obviously, if frogs are displaying genetic defects the first thing one should do is breed them with a different locality frog.
> 
> I understand that for many frogs (not just the Yellow terribilis) there were few exports of that frog providing a small founding population and few unrelated frogs. However, a main contributor to inbreeding is people selling and buying siblings as "pairs" and breedable. Instead of throwing some mints in with your single viable Yellow terribilis, perhaps you should consider getting some additional Yellows from different sources. Same locality, but different enough genetics (likely) to provide healthy offspring for at least a few generations.


Yeah, you're probably right. I am considering trading this frog...If I decide to, I'll put her in the Trading Post.


----------



## johnc (Oct 9, 2009)

Not to split hairs here, but what Smashtoad is seeing might not be down to genetics. In fact if there isn't a wide set of instances like this with yellows then it's likely not due to genetics at all. Inbreeding isn't a good thing in the long term, but it doesn't necessarily cause problems like those reported above, unless carried out for many generations.


----------



## poison beauties (Mar 1, 2010)

There are plenty of cases where husbandry plays a role in many issues, not just tad and froglet conditions but all the way back to the care of the breeders having to due with the outcome of the frogs.

Thats horrible luck Jarrod but those frogs should be kept from any breeding population here to be honest. Best of luck with that nice female you posted up., Can anyone confirm this, Ive been hearing things about there being two unrelated yellow terrib population here? I have seen certain differences in the supposed two but have no idea as to if its breeding outcome due to the few lines or to me it seems the larger and lighter colored ones seem to be possible bicolor yellow crosses.

Michael


----------



## SmackoftheGods (Jan 28, 2009)

Smashtoad said:


> Yeah, you're probably right. I am considering trading this frog...If I decide to, I'll put her in the Trading Post.


I know a few froggers who might be willing to take it off your hands who are working with Yellows.


----------

