# HUGE Charcoal for springs



## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

I'm ashamed to admit that I forgot the name of the gentleman at Jason's last meeting who so graciously donated 2 springtail cultures and many plant cuttings....thanks again!

I'm even more embarassed to have completely forgotten where he said he obtained the HUGE almost brick sized pieces of charcoal.

I think they are awesome for spring cultivation and no more little pieces for me.

Anyone have a source for the HUGE charcoal? I checked my local Lowes and Home Depsot but none....


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## Julio (Oct 8, 2007)

I hv gotten those large pices from Josh in the past.


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## The_Greg (Sep 10, 2007)

Why is huge charcoal better than small stuff? You can get 1-3" pieces from walmart.. its oak somethingsomething.. in a red bag.


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## boombotty (Oct 12, 2005)

Just look in any grocery store or westlake hardware. What you are looking for is natural lump charcoal, Cowboy Charcoal is a popular brand. If you can't find any, which I'm sure you can, I can send you some. I have a Big Green Egg and that is what I burn in it.
Scott


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

The_Greg said:


> Why is huge charcoal better than small stuff? You can get 1-3" pieces from walmart.. its oak somethingsomething.. in a red bag.


 
These were like.....4-5 inches.

Just so much easier to grab the larger piece and shake off the springs. I'm sick of the medium and smaller chunks floating around on me as well...

just preference, I guess.....which is 90% of this hobby.


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## boombotty (Oct 12, 2005)

The larger pieces work great for getting springs out. I take a large piece covered in springs and blow on it over a 32oz ff container. 
Scott


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## The_Greg (Sep 10, 2007)

Philsuma said:


> These were like.....4-5 inches.
> 
> Just so much easier to grab the larger piece and shake off the springs. I'm sick the medium and smaller chunks floating around on me as well...
> 
> just preference, I guess.....which is 90% of this hobby.


There are some pieces in there that are huge like that.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Cool....thanks for all the help everyone.

I've tried coco fiber.....mag and oak leaves on top. Epiweb and tree fern panel squares...cardboard ect ect and it seems like large charcoal works the best and feeds out the best.

I lost 6 pum froglets recently due to lack of adequate spring feedings and some other issues.

Never again.


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## Phyllobates (Dec 12, 2008)

Phil do you use the "flood the container and scoop them out" method or the "pick out a piece of charcoal and tap it off" method?

I'm curious because I use the flooding method the the charcoal I have floats and it's quite annoying.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Phyllobater said:


> Phil do you use the "flood the container and scoop them out" method or the "pick out a piece of charcoal and tap it off" method?
> 
> I'm curious because I use the flooding method the the charcoal I have floats and it's quite annoying.


Tried them both.

The flood method is anoying and the small charcoal floats -hence my quest for da big stuff.

Tried the "tap" off method with all of the above as well.....just wasn't cutting it. Now with the HUGE charcoal...it seems easier and more productive somehow.

Then I see some guys with spring cultures that you could spoon off with a gravy ladle....huge


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## boombotty (Oct 12, 2005)

I use the large chunks with Ed's springtail food and have GREAT production.
Scott


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## Adven2er (Aug 17, 2008)

Hi Phil,

I'm glad you liked the springtail culture. That is Cowboy brand charcoal I bought at Lowes. I found the reciept it was $6.97 for a large bag of it. You get about 50/50 small/large chunks in the bag. I use the smaller pieces in the bottom of the culture and the larger ones at the top. I only use active yeast to feed the springs and it doesn't smell. I use the tap in method (like a Springtail salt shaker)


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## Dragas (Sep 4, 2008)

The_Greg said:


> You can get 1-3" pieces from walmart.. its oak somethingsomething.. in a red bag.


This is the stuff I have found at our local wally world as well. Pretty nice size chunks. 

Its wonderful to cook with too !


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## JeremyHuff (Apr 22, 2008)

I don't think the springs eat the charcoal, so couldn't you use pink or blue styro? You could cut it to size, see the springs on it and keep it sterile. Also, if you use the flood method, you would have clean water rather than black, dusty water. I may have to try this tonight...

Jeremy


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## The_Greg (Sep 10, 2007)

isnt charcoal used for its Co2 handling properties? I could be wrong.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Philsuma said:


> I'm ashamed to admit that I forgot the name of the gentleman at Jason's last meeting who so graciously donated 2 springtail cultures and many plant cuttings....thanks again!
> 
> I'm even more embarassed to have completely forgotten where he said he obtained the HUGE almost brick sized pieces of charcoal.
> 
> ...


Phil,
you really need to tone it down a bit at the "arcade"
Ok, this bit`s getting a little old-no more I promise!

John


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Adven2er said:


> Hi Phil,
> 
> I'm glad you liked the springtail culture. That is Cowboy brand charcoal I bought at Lowes. I found the reciept it was $6.97 for a large bag of it. You get about 50/50 small/large chunks in the bag. I use the smaller pieces in the bottom of the culture and the larger ones at the top. I only use active yeast to feed the springs and it doesn't smell. I use the tap in method (like a Springtail salt shaker)


 
Thanks Rick...I certainly appreciate that culture.

No ventilation needed? You have the cap screwed on tight.

Thats what's cool about the hobby.....constant modifications, innovations and lotsa help with everything.


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## Adven2er (Aug 17, 2008)

I always keep the lid screwed on tight. I open about once every 7-10 days to feed out. I then add more yeast and mist lightly to activate it. One thing to note.... When setting up a culture you need to rinse the charcoal well and microwave it. I got mites in the first cultures I set up. No more problems after cooking the charcoal. After rinsing the dust off the charcoal you shouldn't have black water.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Good stuff...


But....still cannot find "Cowboy Charcoal" anywhere in central PA.

I think it is out of season already.

Anyone seeing this stuff local LMK please.


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## stemcellular (Jun 26, 2008)

Philsuma said:


> Good stuff...
> 
> 
> But....still cannot find "Cowboy Charcoal" anywhere in central PA.
> ...


Weird, its everywhere around here (I use it for grilling a few nights a week). One thing that I've found to work is just layer leaf litter on top of the charcoal. The springs load up all over and I just tap the leaf litter into the tanks. Alternatively, you could just toss the leaf litter in as well.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

stemcellular said:


> Weird, its everywhere around here (I use it for grilling a few nights a week). One thing that I've found to work is just layer leaf litter on top of the charcoal. The springs load up all over and I just tap the leaf litter into the tanks. Alternatively, you could just toss the leaf litter in as well.


I have tried eveything on top.....Leaf litter, Epiweb, Fern panel, cardboard ect

Rick's cultures with the HUGE (John) charcoal seems to be the best yet - my opinion only, naturally.


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## boombotty (Oct 12, 2005)

Hey Phil,
It doesn't have to be "Cowboy Charcoal" brand, just a natural lump charcoal. 
Scott


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

For Folsomia (white springtails), I get the best production with a mixture of charcoal and infield conditioner. If you have good hearing you can actually hear a hissing sound from the numbers of the springtails jumping around. 

Ed


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## Adven2er (Aug 17, 2008)

Just got home from my bartending job. One of my customers is a manager at Lowes. She told me if your local store doesn't have something, they will ship any single item from another store usually within a couple days.


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## sports_doc (Nov 15, 2004)

I make my own. You can too...

Get some nice hardwood firewood going strong in the woodstove or outdoor BBQ, nice and red hot coals, close to being all used up. Pull them out and dunk in a bucket of water....

Although, I'd like to find a source of 'infield conditioner' locally to try Ed's mixture now.

You feeding them anything special Ed?


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## gary1218 (Dec 31, 2005)

sports_doc said:


> You feeding them anything special Ed?


In the past Ed has mentioned that he feeds his springs on active yeast, bought at bulkfoods.com I believe.


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## Jason (Oct 14, 2004)

sports_doc said:


> Although, I'd like to find a source of 'infield conditioner' locally to try Ed's mixture now.


I would try contacting them if you have not already. The let me know of a local supplier and you can pick up a 50 lb bag for about $15.

Contact Pro's Choice


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

sports_doc said:


> I make my own. You can too...
> 
> Get some nice hardwood firewood going strong in the woodstove or outdoor BBQ, nice and red hot coals, close to being all used up. Pull them out and dunk in a bucket of water....
> 
> ...


No, I feed them live baker's yeast. If you try that method, you need to soak the infield conditioner and charcoal before mixing them as otherwise the conditioner just settles to the bottom of the conntainer. 
I change the water at least once a week and feed several times a week depending on how quickly the springtails consume the food. 

Ed


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## NathanB (Jan 21, 2008)

Phill: Cowboy Charcoal Co. - Real Flavor....Real Fast
its around down here still.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

bussardnr said:


> Phill: Cowboy Charcoal Co. - Real Flavor....Real Fast
> its around down here still.


 
Thanks Nate but my Google-Fu is actually quite good....I know it's out there somewhere.

I just try hard to find local products within gas range rather than fill out info and pay online.


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## NathanB (Jan 21, 2008)

Philsuma said:


> Thanks Nate but my Google-Fu is actually quite good....I know it's out there somewhere.
> 
> I just try hard to find local products within gas range rather than fill out info and pay online.





> Regionally - For regional locations, call us toll-free at
> 1-800-775-4060 for a retailer near you!


try calling them


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

bussardnr said:


> try calling them


 
Just got off the phone with them...

They say....

Try any Lowes store. Lowes should "always" have some Cowboy Charcoal in stock.

Ok...I'll try a _different_ Lowes...


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## pl259 (Feb 27, 2006)

Up here it's seasonal. I had to wait until the spring for my Lowes to get it in. I've also seen it at Walmart and some grocery stores.

If you really get stuck, I have a bunch of it and can send you down a flat rate box full of the stuff.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Cool

Thanks Eric

I'll give it a few more tries...


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## NathanB (Jan 21, 2008)

if you can find anything, i'll pick up a few bags for you. we're bound to run into each oter before spring


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

bussardnr said:


> if you can find anything, i'll pick up a few bags for you. we're bound to run into each oter before spring


 
R U go-in to Hamburg?


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## NathanB (Jan 21, 2008)

i might, depends on what i have going on at the time


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## mellowvision (Feb 6, 2009)

can you post a photo of one of the cultures you're talking about? I think I have a good idea what you're doing, but would like to know for sure.

thanks!


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## NathanB (Jan 21, 2008)

phil, HD caries them too


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Looked there too, Nate....

Believe me...I have my "circuit" down pat for all things frogs..

1. Lowes
2. Home Depot
3. Wal mart
4. Tar-jay
5. the Restaurant store
6. that Fish Place
7. grocery stores
8, state store....actually scratch that one...it's not frog related.


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## boombotty (Oct 12, 2005)

You don't have to use the brand Cowboy Charcoal. Just look for natural lump chacoal, it is the same thing. There are only a few plants around the US that make it, so it is all pretty much the same.
Scott


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

ok....I _finally_ got the Cowboy brand charcoal..

either Lowes was totally out of stock, the couple times I looked or I missed the aisle and was too much of a d-bag to ask for it.

Which one? 

anyhoo...the stuff is AWESOME. HUGE chunks with minimal black dust. I did a quick laundry sink rinse and made @ 4 clean cultures with it.

I like it...a *lot*.


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## boombotty (Oct 12, 2005)

Yeah, I have way better production with the large chunks than with the smaller stuff.
Scott


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## Dragas (Sep 4, 2008)

What type of container are you using ? 

I am accumulating the large glass containers that restaurants just throw away. (They also make great containers for sangria.)


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Dragas said:


> What type of container are you using ?
> 
> I am accumulating the large glass containers that restaurants just throw away. (They also make great containers for sangria.)


 
You could prolly use many different containers....I would recommend a higher or taller size....I'm using the same 32oz deli cups that we all culture FF in.


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## Boondoggle (Dec 9, 2007)

Philsuma said:


> You could prolly use many different containers....I would recommend a higher or taller size....I'm using the same 32oz deli cups that we all culture FF in.


You don't have any pics of that do you? The charcoal I have been picturing doesn't seem like it would fit in the deli cups.


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Boondoggle said:


> You don't have any pics of that do you? The charcoal I have been picturing doesn't seem like it would fit in the deli cups.


no pics sorry.....but you are correct, it bearly fits in the cups. In fact there were severla peices that I had to snap in half with my hand.

Several of the smaller sections that were about matchbox car sized fit in the center of the cup with a few slightly smaller ones on the bottom.

The idea is to have 3 or 4 Really big chunks on top where they can be easily picked out and dusted into the viv ect...

make sense?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Philsuma said:


> The idea is to have 3 or 4 Really big chunks on top where they can be easily picked out and dusted into the viv ect...
> 
> make sense?


I just waterlog it at the start up (soak it until it doesn't float well) and then simply add water pour off the springtails into a cup and off they go to he the offering from the food gods. 

Ed


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## pl259 (Feb 27, 2006)

Philsuma said:


> The idea is to have 3 or 4 Really big chunks on top where they can be easily picked out and dusted into the viv ect...


I keep my springs in Gladware containers with a layer of smaller chunks on the bottom, and a half dozen or so of the big chunks on top. When I harvest them, I just take out a big chunk and tap it against the inside of a 32oz deli container. Repeat for all the big chunks. I end up with a lot of springs at the bottom of the cup that I can dust as usual.


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## ChrisK (Oct 28, 2008)

Philsuma said:


> You could prolly use many different containers....I would recommend a higher or taller size....I'm using the same 32oz deli cups that we all culture FF in.


Phil do you use the vented ff lids on the springtail cultures also?


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

ChrisK said:


> Phil do you use the vented ff lids on the springtail cultures also?


Chris...no....not vented like the FF lids.

I used a craft store hand punch to punch 4 tiny airholes in the top ring of the cup sides and use a regular clear plastic lid. After coming home from down south (10 days) there was a little too much evap for my liking.

gonna keep experimenting...


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## melas (Oct 24, 2007)

Found this one at Walmart for $6/10lb bag - I found a few HUGE pieces on top - the 2nd pic is more representative of the rest though . . .


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

Good find...not bad.

I think the Cowboy brand is bigger on average. I can't really say how much I paid for it as I just considered myself fortunate for being the blind squirrel and actually finding it.

It may well have cost $50.00 a bag....I often buy things without looking at the price.


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## jubjub47 (Sep 9, 2008)

I noticed that they also sell the cowboy brand stuff at Bass Pro Shops.


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## melas (Oct 24, 2007)

Philsuma said:


> I think the Cowboy brand is bigger on average.


Yeah there were about 5 pieces on top that were 5-6" long and 2-3" wide. I haven't used much of it yet so I can't say what's it like in the middle or the bottom. I actually broke up the bigger pieces anyhow.


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## Rana Exotica (Sep 26, 2009)

Philsuma said:


> Good find...not bad.
> 
> I think the Cowboy brand is bigger on average. I can't really say how much I paid for it as I just considered myself fortunate for being the blind squirrel and actually finding it.
> 
> It may well have cost $50.00 a bag....I often buy things without looking at the price.


After reading this thread I found the Cowboy brand charcoal at Home Depot for $6 and change. That's a lot of charcoal and the peices really are bigger than that red bag


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

I've got a bag of the Cowboy brand in the basement and as I set up new cultures have been crushing it down as I flood and pour off the springs that I want to use, seems like I could have been charging a premium for the big pieces out of the bag.... 

Ed


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

I'll give you $1000.00 for any piece bigger than your head.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

Philsuma said:


> I'll give you $1000.00 for any piece bigger than your head.


Have you seen the size of his head?
Where do you think he keeps all that knowledge?!

John


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Philsuma said:


> I'll give you $1000.00 for any piece bigger than your head.


Hmm... given that I know how to build a charcoal kiln and have about 5 acres of wooded property.. a $1000 maybe worth the effort... 

Ed


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## Philsuma (Jul 18, 2006)

NOT happy with my all-charcoal spring experiment. They all seemed to do well for a week or so and then die out. A couple other people told me that they were not happy with a small size all-charcoal attempt either.

and then there were some mites, but I really don't think they made the cultures fail.

NOW

I'm going to go with big shoebox or sweater box size containers with a rich and vaired substrate, just like I use in vivs and I'm going include the *same big chunks of charcoal* and small pin oak / live oak and medium mag leaves on top. Some cork, some rotting wood and branches and some long spag......


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

yeah, and then just put some cardboard on top, which will FILL with springs for easy removal and feeding. no flooding, no BS!


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Philsuma said:


> NOT happy with my all-charcoal spring experiment. They all seemed to do well for a week or so and then die out. A couple other people told me that they were not happy with a small size all-charcoal attempt either.
> 
> and then there were some mites, but I really don't think they made the cultures fail.
> 
> ...


Try adding infield conditioner or small leca under the charcoal.... This seems to increase production in these types of cultures... I do have all charcoal cultures that do well.. 

Ed


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