# missing frogs



## dperrucc (Sep 5, 2006)

If I am missing approx three frogs over a two month period and presume they died ,how harmfull if you can not find the dead frogs?
VIV is 120 gallons with many plants.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

What kind of frogs are/where they? For the bolder frogs I think it would safe to assume they are gone, but for some of the shier auratus species or thumbs they could still be in there hiding. 

If you are fairly sure they have died, the reason why they died would matter a lot. If they drowned, had a deformity, starved, got bullied ect you can make some changes so the other frogs will live. If it was some sort of pathogen then all your frogs will be affected. 

Did you quarentine all frogs? its a good idea to do so before putting frogs into permanent vivs, especially one of that size.


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## dperrucc (Sep 5, 2006)

Two tincs,one leuc C BRED, they were eating like horses(plumpy),no deformities,fungus.They were getting vits and Ca.Water fall at 75f,ph6.8,approx 12gal sump.Mist king 6 nozzle spray using dist ,spring and tap water with AMQUEL,kept at 76F.VIV kept at 69 to 75.6F and 85%humidity.
My conclusion eating dirt with flies getting impacted or low humidity 50%until 8 weeks ago,I thought gauge was malfunctioning until raised spray time then up to 85 to 95%h

ANY IDEAS
THANK YOU
Don


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## bstorm83 (Jul 16, 2007)

I would tend to not think that it was dirt causing impaction. They know what they are doing when they are eating and having three die of that same cause would seem odd to me. So I would tend to not think that.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

dperrucc said:


> Two tincs,one leuc C BRED, they were eating like horses(plumpy),no deformities,fungus.They were getting vits and Ca.Water fall at 75f,ph6.8,approx 12gal sump.Mist king 6 nozzle spray using dist ,spring and tap water with AMQUEL,kept at 76F.VIV kept at 69 to 75.6F and 85%humidity.
> My conclusion eating dirt with flies getting impacted or low humidity 50%until 8 weeks ago,I thought gauge was malfunctioning until raised spray time then up to 85 to 95%h
> 
> ANY IDEAS
> ...


So all frogs in the tank are missing? the leuc could have been bullied by the tincs, they can be very aggressive to non-dominant tank mates.

I agree with bstorm that the frogs probably did not die of impaction, they are pretty accurate when they are hunting so its unlikely that they ate anything that wasn't food. And as long as the substrate remained moist the low humidy should not have caused their death either. 

Did you ever quarentine? this can really help prevent problems later on


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## LucasJ (May 7, 2007)

Escapees is always a possibility. Maybe double check the lid and make sure there are no small gaps they could squeeze through.


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## dperrucc (Sep 5, 2006)

still have 2 tincs,2leucs and 2 aurantaneo left.Could not escape.Had them since April 08.Since they are captive bred did not quarentein them.No bullies all seemed to get along .


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## GSXR_MURRHEE (Sep 16, 2006)

Try looking in the substrate if you can, or any small gaps (even if you think they can't fit in there). I've had frogs dig/tunnel down in the dirt and disappear for a couple of days, especially on the back side of the tank. Sometimes frogs are just really good at hiding.


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## Otis (Apr 16, 2006)

dperrucc said:


> still have 2 tincs,2leucs and 2 aurantaneo left.Could not escape.Had them since April 08.Since they are captive bred did not quarentein them.No bullies all seemed to get along .


Oh boy, I can see another mixing debate comming...do a search for mixing species on this forum. 

All frogs should be quarentined, regardless of where you got them. A lot of captive bred frogs need treatment for one thing or another. And since you have so many different species there is an even greater chance of disease transmission.

What is your statement "they all seemed to get along" based on? personal observation? even if you observed your frogs for an hour a day, thats excluding the possibility that they bullied eachother in the open, excluding the possibility that you missed it during that hour, and excluding bullying you mistook for "play" or breeding behavoir. Your leucs could have very well been bullied. The bullying could have been aggressive tincs physically wrestling, but the stress from this bullying could have been enough to stress the frog to death. 

I would suggest separating all your frogs into at least single species tanks (individual tanks would be better so you can monitor) and if you can I would get fecals done. 

I also would suggest doing more research before you buying future frogs. There is enough information on this site and on others where you could have found out more about mixing.


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## stemcellular (Jun 26, 2008)

You beat me to it, Em. Yes, you should really reconsider mixing species and quarantining all future frogs. In the end its good both for you ($) and for your frogs.


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## bstorm83 (Jul 16, 2007)

So my efforts to mix every species i can find to one super frog is bad?


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## JL-Exotics (Nov 10, 2005)

dperrucc said:


> If I am missing approx three frogs over a two month period and presume they died ,how harmfull if you can not find the dead frogs?
> VIV is 120 gallons with many plants.


To answer your original question: If your frogs did die, their bodies will decompose within a matter of days. Sometimes even faster. If a body is not discovered within the first 24 hours the chances of recovery are very slim. A small sealed tank could pose a risk for a bacterial bloom that may put other frogs at risk. In a tank that size there is very little risk. 

Good luck with your remaining frogs.

Oh, and be careful bstorm83. Sarcasm is generally not well received around here...


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