# What Could Be Wrong Arautus Bloated And Almost Lifeless



## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Ok I'm freaking out. One of my arautus that I have only had five day seems bloated and unable to move. Can someone help me and what is wrong. How can I fix him. I'm paranoid right now and upset. 

Frog right now:



















They day he arrived:










I hope he is OK ugh I'm about to cry now.....


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

I'm not an expert on frog ailments but I've seen a lot of threads regarding bloat. I recommend searching this section for 'bloat'.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

frogface said:


> I'm not an expert on frog ailments but I've seen a lot of threads regarding bloat. I recommend searching this section for 'bloat'.


That's what I'm doing but nothing is really compares to his symptoms.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

His mouth is open a tiny bit also. I'm dosing my flies one day with rep-cal herptivie with beta carotene skip a day then dose them with rep-cal calcium with vit d3. If that help.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Really sorry to hear it. My first thought was impaction but I don't think it could happen that fast. I'm in the dark.


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## Brian317 (Feb 11, 2011)

So he is not moving at all? sorry to hear about that, hope he gets better.....


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Pumilo said:


> Really sorry to hear it. My first thought was impaction but I don't think it could happen that fast. I'm in the dark.


Y
Yesterday at this same time he wasn't bloated and eating. How could it happen so faclst he was really active also.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

I don't know the why, the how, or the treatment, but I'll bet it's some sort of freaky water retention problem.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Brian317 said:


> So he is not moving at all? sorry to hear about that, hope he gets better.....


He appears dead with his little mouth open a tiny bit. But I happen to nudged him he barely moved and closed his mouth.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Pumilo said:


> I don't know the why, the how, or the treatment, but I'll bet it's some sort of freaky water retention problem.


Its all happened in a blink of an eye from healthy active eating to BAMN unable to move, bloated, and mouth opened.


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## Mer_ (Sep 11, 2011)

Could the frog have edema? I am no expert in frog illness though

I know edemas are caused either by bacteria or kidney failure


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Top post, page 2.
http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/ge...3-help-needed-treatment-yellow-galac-pdf.html

Page 2, Ed's post. http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-discussion/59525-rectal-prolapse.html

Beyond that, try searching water retention. I don't know this to be the problem, but I don't see what else could do this, that quickly. Sorry Man, I hope it turns out ok.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Mer_ said:


> Could the frog have edema? I am no expert in frog illness though
> 
> I know edemas are caused either by bacteria or kidney failure


His entire body seems to have bloated evenly across his body and no movement but still alive. It happen all in less than 24 hours.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Pumilo said:


> Top post, page 2.
> http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/ge...3-help-needed-treatment-yellow-galac-pdf.html
> 
> Page 2, Ed's post. http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/general-discussion/59525-rectal-prolapse.html
> ...


What's the sugar water method being mentioned and how much sugar do I use to an amount of water.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Krenshaw22 said:


> What's the sugar water method being mentioned and how much sugar do I use to an amount of water.


I think that was for prolapse. I don't know, I was just trying to research the symptoms for you.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Pumilo said:


> I think that was for prolapse. I don't know, I was just trying to research the symptoms for you.


Oh OK I'm still looking but nothing seems to fit the descrbtion and what could cause this problem so fast. If impacted could it happen that fast if he over ate.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Some of the information you want is in this thread...

http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/care-sheets/16433-emergency-supportive-care.html 

I am not a vet and this is not meant to be a diagnosis but there are several probable causes and this is one of those situations where veterinary assistence is probably make the difference between the frog surviving or not. Rapid onset of bloating like that can (not the can) be a sign of a massive infection of the frog. These infections can be contagious so you need to isolate the frog from the others in it's cage. Since it is bloated, you should consider the suggestions in the emergency supportive care thread and contact a vet as soon as possible. 
If the frog does have a septicemia, then how fast you respond can be the difference between whether it lives or dies. 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Pumilo said:


> I think that was for prolapse. I don't know, I was just trying to research the symptoms for you.


 
Yes that is for prolapses that are not caused by fluid retention. 

Ed


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Mer_ said:


> Could the frog have edema? I am no expert in frog illness though
> 
> I know edemas are caused either by bacteria or kidney failure


 
Edema (ascites) can also be caused by other infections including viral infections as well as liver failure (an exotic animal pathologist told me that he saw way more liver failure than he did kidney problems in amphibians afflicted with fluid retention) as well as other causes.... There are multiple possibilities although they two listed above are the most common bantered around on the net and those that are diagnosed on the net virtually none have a necropsy confirm the cause. 

Ed


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Ed said:


> Edema (ascites) can also be caused by other infections including viral infections as well as liver failure (an exotic animal pathologist told me that he saw way more liver failure than he did kidney problems in amphibians afflicted with fluid retention) as well as other causes.... There are multiple possibilities although they two listed above are the most common bantered around on the net and those that are diagnosed on the net virtually none have a necropsy confirm the cause.
> 
> Ed


I'm gonna call the two local vets in the morning but I'm highly doubting they have ever seen a frog come through there doors. Is there any at home methods I can try/ do to help this frog as it seems like he may be dead by morning (I know you a suppose to stay positive ).


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Krenshaw22 said:


> I'm gonna call the two local vets in the morning but I'm highly doubting they have ever seen a frog come through there doors. Is there any at home methods I can try/ do to help this frog as it seems like he may be dead by morning (I know you a suppose to stay positive ).


Amphibian ringers or if there is no other option pedialyte as it says in the linked thread.... 

Ed


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Ed said:


> Amphibian ringers or if there is no other option pedialyte as it says in the linked thread....
> 
> Ed


I have neither at the moment that's why I had ask if a home remedy could be used. Ugh this is depressing.


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## ocellaris123 (Jun 13, 2011)

Sorry to hear about the frog, hope he pull through. I would contact the breeder also to let them know the situation.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

ocellaris123 said:


> Sorry to hear about the frog, hope he pull through. I would contact the breeder also to let them know the situation.


I am in the morning.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Krenshaw22 said:


> I have neither at the moment that's why I had ask if a home remedy could be used. Ugh this is depressing.


If there is a late night pharmacy or grocery store they should have unflavored pedialyte. 

Ed


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

It will have to wait till morning I just hope he is still alive.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

when soaking in pedialyte do I dilute it or just use the pedialyte. How many times a day or how long should it the soak last. He isn't bloated anymore just weak and no moving. He does have a small lump under his throat could be a small bloated area.


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

I believe you can use the pedialyte as is at room temp -

Can you post another pix for us?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

I'm picking the pedialyte right now but when I get home I will.


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

I was reading thru the posts again and it almost sounds like an allergic reaction to something. Maybe the swelling under his chin was something that bit him. I know your tank is new - have you checked it for ants or any other critters that might bite him? It's odd that he's okay one day, then all swollen the next, and then the swelling goes down on its own.

Check your viv for ants and such -


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

I have looked and only thing I've seen is springtails, fruit flies, Isopods, and red earthworms they are Annelid worms. And if its an allergic reason why is he lethargic. Should I continue with the pedialyte. If so does it need to be diluted or just poor it. Also how long does the soaks need to be.


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## froggie too (Nov 6, 2011)

I am so sorry to read about your little guy. Wish I could help. Please keep us informed, on his progress. Hope he get better.


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

Sure. The pedialyte can only help. I'm thinking 15 minutes, but Ed will probably correct me. 

Now, doesn't it sound like some sort of bug bite that made his swell up so sudden? And now, the swelling has gone down, except for his throat. I know someone else who had a problem with fire ants in her vivarium - let's see if the symptoms are similar.

I was dusting with Rep-Cal products with a bit of paprika added for my yellow and red frogs. What do you have down for your substrate?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

He is actually responding now and hopping now since a soak in the pedialyte. Cocofiber, orchid bark, Sphagnum moss topped with oak and magnolia leaves. If he would lift his head alittle I can see his throat and his throat doesn't look like a bug bite.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Good to hear there is hope!


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

I just wonder these clause but I'm gonna let him soak another ten minutes. He is alert and very much responsive. He is trying to get out the Petri dish.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Him soaking in the pedialyte


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

It sounds like he's got a little life back, and that's a good thing. And you mentioned the swelling has gone down some - yay! In a little while, take some fruitflies and put them in the refrigerator for a few seconds just to slow 'em down - let's see if he's hungry. You can always drop in a small piece of charcoal with springtails nearby.

This is totally weird, Brian. I've never had an auratus scare the crap outta me like that. Since he's in quarantine, it probably won't hurt to dump the pedialyte onto the paper towels.

Still can't make him say 'ahhh', huh? Is his mouth still open?


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

Oh, yeah - him MUCH better! Whatever he got into seems to have gotten out of his system pretty quick.

Make sure you keep posting pix of his progress, okay?

cya!


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

guppygal said:


> It sounds like he's got a little life back, and that's a good thing. And you mentioned the swelling has gone down some - yay! In a little while, take some fruitflies and put them in the refrigerator for a few seconds just to slow 'em down - let's see if he's hungry. You can always drop in a small piece of charcoal with springtails nearby.
> 
> This is totally weird, Brian. I've never had an auratus scare the crap outta me like that. Since he's in quarantine, it probably won't hurt to dump the pedialyte onto the paper towels.
> 
> Still can't make him say 'ahhh', huh? Is his mouth still open?


No its closed he moving around a lot. He seems interested in food but doest eat it.


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

There was one gal on the board whose azureus was accidentally fed fire ants (long story). It took awhile before her frog would take food again. The good news is that the frog is still around. I keep thinking that the symptoms were similar. Maybe a wayward ant managed to get in your tank?

I'm glad to see him doing better. Is it safe to assume that the others are okay?


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

guppygal said:


> Sure. The pedialyte can only help. I'm thinking 15 minutes, but Ed will probably correct me.


 
Typically soaks like this are conducted for an hour. A bath for longer should be at the discretion of the vet. 

Ed


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

guppygal said:


> There was one gal on the board whose azureus was accidentally fed fire ants (long story). It took awhile before her frog would take food again. The good news is that the frog is still around. I keep thinking that the symptoms were similar. Maybe a wayward ant managed to get in your tank?
> 
> I'm glad to see him doing better. Is it safe to assume that the others are okay?


I don't have a ant problem in my home. But the other two are active eating and I believe so.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Ed said:


> Typically soaks like this are conducted for an hour. A bath for longer should be at the discretion of the vet.
> 
> Ed


Should I do another soak tomorrow and leave him in for an hour or should he be fine.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Krenshaw22 said:


> Should I do another soak tomorrow and leave him in for an hour or should he be fine.


You should talk to a vet. 

Ed


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

How's he looking today? Is he getting his color back?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

He still alive and I quarantine but is reclusive and he isn't bloated. I'm still monitoring him and making sure he eats.


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

It almost sounds like he has a belly ache. Have you seen any frog-logs?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

He hasn't pooped or eatin and only moved alittle since I last checked on him.



















Just took this pic. He seems to be wasting away but will not eat.


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## billschwinn (Dec 17, 2008)

The frog looks bad. Have you been to a vet yet?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

billschwinn said:


> The frog looks bad. Have you been to a vet yet?


No vets around here specialize in frogs. I'm trying hard to help the little Guy though.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

Krenshaw22 said:


> No vets around here specialize in frogs. I'm trying hard to help the little Guy though.


If your vet is willing to help, you can consult with a vet that does work with amphibians and get what you need. 

Ed


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## Taron (Sep 23, 2009)

It looks like a bacterial infection. Keep the frog in a sterile environment ie paper towell bottom cooked mag leaves. Don't feed him and keep him moist. I had this exact thing occur with a long term breeder female. The bacteria infection caused water retention issues and the frog couldn't disperse the water causing the bloated look. This may not be it but every symptom you described is what my female cobalt did.


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

Did the cobalt survive? If so, how did you know when to start offering her food?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

ReptilesEtcetera said:


> It looks like a bacterial infection. Keep the frog in a sterile environment ie paper towell bottom cooked mag leaves. Don't feed him and keep him moist. I had this exact thing occur with a long term breeder female. The bacteria infection caused water retention issues and the frog couldn't disperse the water causing the bloated look. This may not be it but every symptom you described is what my female cobalt did.


I was wondering What guppygal is also.


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## Ed (Sep 19, 2004)

The chance of a frog surviving a severe bacterial infection is greatly enhanced when one can use the appropriate antibiotics instead of taking a wait and see approach. If you have a local vet who is willing to work with you, you can get them to talk to a vet with experience and get the proper medications as welll as primer on how to tube feed the frog so it has a good chance to survive. 

Ed


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

Let's assume Krenshaw22 is a new hobbyist just starting out and doesn't have any $$ to spare. Any alternatives?


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Which I am. The little Guy is moving more this morning.


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## jkooiman (May 2, 2010)

The vet trip should set you back about 70-90 bucks.The vet doesn't need to be a specialist, any vet will consult literature and pursue proper treatment.The vet may even be tickled to be treating a frog, and cut you a break. In my experience, the frog will bounce back immensely with treatment. Bacterial infections are incredibly prevalent in amphibians, and I like to have antibacterial solution on hand at all times nowadays. Good luck. JVK


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

jkooiman said:


> The vet trip should set you back about 70-90 bucks.The vet doesn't need to be a specialist, any vet will consult literature and pursue proper treatment.The vet may even be tickled to be treating a frog, and cut you a break. In my experience, the frog will bounce back immensely with treatment. Bacterial infections are incredibly prevalent in amphibians, and I like to have antibacterial solution on hand at all times nowadays. Good luck. JVK


thank you for the input I will consult my vet when i get home today.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Good news I just witnessed the little Guy strike at two fruit flies. I believe his ordeal may be passing he has also started to be alittle more active. As long he continues to eat I'm gonna hut down some safe termites to pick his weight up. I hope everything continues on the right path. I have also been misting his enclosure with peadialyte.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

He just ate about six termites. I'm so excited. As soon his weight is picked up ill place him back into the viv.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

Great news! Keep us updated, please


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

frogface said:


> Great news! Keep us updated, please


I will Guys. Ill post pics of him tomorrow and I'm gonna have him on a fat diet to put the weight he lost back on.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

Ok I wanted to try something and I decided to place him back in the viv. The reason is because I feed him a few fruit flies then like 8 termites and he was eating like crazy. When I placed him in the viv he went straight to hunting flies so all is good I believe.


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## ocellaris123 (Jun 13, 2011)

Great to hear he is eating and acting healthy again


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

him back in the viv. He has gain a little of his weight back.


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## Freeradical53 (Jan 25, 2008)

Super! Glad to hear he is better.


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

He looks good! I hope this will be a success story. Keep us posted.


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## Krenshaw22 (Apr 21, 2011)

frogface said:


> He looks good! I hope this will be a success story. Keep us posted.


The way it looks it just may be a success. Just glad I didn't loose one my little Guys.


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