# Automation for your Vivarium



## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

I am working with 2 people on making a Vivarium controller.

This is going to be a while but i am looking for input and suggestions.

The Temp, Humidity, Clock will show on a LCD Screen.

Basic Functions...
Lights (On/Off)
Temp Sensor
Humidity Sensor
Mist System (On/Off)
Temp Alarm
Humidity Alarm
Clock

Advanced Functions...
Sunrise/Sunset - Need LED's (Lights dim from 0%-100% then 100%-0% at night over a 1/2/3/4 hour period, whichever you choose)
Moonlight
Temp Control
Humidity Control
Mist System
Temp Alarm (when tanks get too hot)
Humidity Alarm (when humidity drops below set point)
Auto Draining (Single/Multiple Tanks)
Lightning Effect (Flashes Certain LED's)
Cloudy Day Effect (Dims LED's randomly)
Storm Setting (Cloud Effect, Lightning, Extra Misting)
Clock

There will be an LCD to show the stats and on the advanced options there will be a menu with a joystick. You can navigate and adjust settings. Also you can go thru the menu tank by tank and adjust individual tanks.

Ethernet connection will be available at a later date after the controllers are out. (Too pricey to add now)

Please be patient as designing this and getting it together will take some time.

Post any ideas or things you'd like to see available and i will gladly take them into consideration.

-Chris


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## mellowvision (Feb 6, 2009)

dual temp controllers would be ideal, since you'd potentially want a different water temperature than the air in a paludarium situation.

It would also be great to be able to monitor water ph.


A lot of the more advanced controllers I've started to see on the market allow you to immitate the exact sun/moon cycle and day/night temperature ranges of specific regions, and have presets for those regions with the ability to make adjustments as well... that would be pretty nice to have.


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

Good idea, i can def. get the dual temp controller incorporated into it along with ph. I wouldn't know where to get the info for the region information.

-Chris


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## markbudde (Jan 4, 2008)

This will be killer if you follow through. People have posted things like this before and then disappeared forever, so you might want to watch your back 

A few suggestions...
1 - It sounds like you use leds. That's pretty cool, but puts you in the extreme minority. Instead of sunrise/sunset with LEDS, it would be more useful for me to just have a bunch (maybe 4-8) automatable switches. I have 4 to 8 lights on my viv and turn them on at different times, so a simple switch that I could plug wires into would allow me greater control using your device. But this isn't such a big deal. IMO, what is a REALLY big deal and would make this product a must have would be...

2 - A fan controller! Here is the product that I would buy. It looks like a surge protector, with maybe 8 outlets on it, positioned in such a way that multiple wall-warts won't obscure each other. Each outlet has a number, which is programmable when certain criteria are met (time of day, temperature, humidity). What would be critical for me would be the ability to turn on a fan at a certain temperature and turn off the lights at another temperature. I would pay around $150 for this product.

-Mark


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## jeffr (May 15, 2009)

what happens if you get power surges or power failure?


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## VivariumWorks (Feb 27, 2008)

If/when you get a working model I know I'll want one of your full up systems. Mostly due to having the lighting/thunder effect. That single thing right there is something I've never been able to figure out how to do. Heck even if you made a misting timer/thunderstorm device, I bet that would sell well. Have it turn off the standard lights, turn on a blacklight and your misting system, then thunderstorm sounds w/ flashes timed with thunderclaps.... oooh yea!


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## RarePlantBroker (Aug 3, 2008)

markbudde said:


> This will be killer if you follow through. People have posted things like this before and then disappeared forever, so you might want to watch your back
> 
> A few suggestions...
> 1 - It sounds like you use leds. That's pretty cool, but puts you in the extreme minority. Instead of sunrise/sunset with LEDS, it would be more useful for me to just have a bunch (maybe 4-8) automatable switches. I have 4 to 8 lights on my viv and turn them on at different times, so a simple switch that I could plug wires into would allow me greater control using your device. But this isn't such a big deal. IMO, what is a REALLY big deal and would make this product a must have would be...
> ...


I also use multiple lighting fixtures for my setups, and can simulate a range of lighting conditions with flourescent lighting. So, the possibility of 4 independant switches for lighting would work well.

The fan controller would be a great addition. Set it up as DC converted with a variable voltage rheostat ranging from 8v to 15v (I've run PC fans in this range without any issues)--and have them programmable for either straight on/off times or connected to the thermostat/humdistat.

Misting system controlls need to be timed to the second. The way I set up my tanks/nozzles, a minute's run time would quickly fill my vivariums with water. I prefer to mist in short bursts (5-7 seconds) multiple times through the day, and a single longer event (30 sec.s) for an afternoon "thunderstorm" during my wet season cycle.

If/when you offer ethernet connection as an option--I'd be interested. You need to come up with a fairly simple software package to program the controller. The one thing I can't stand right now is having to push tiny buttons and look at a small screen to program digital controllers. Additionally, all the timers/automation control for my vivariums is housed in a cabinet below the vivariums (to keep the vivariums themselves in line-of-sight), and it is difficult to crawl into the cabinet everytime something needs to be re-programmed. It would be quite pleasant to be able to connect to my laptop, program the controller, and move on. 

As for price, right now, I use one of MistKing's seconds timers for my misting, two Zilla dual analog timers, and two single outlet digital timers for each of the three "areas" that I have vivariums set up. That's about $130 for timers that all but one isn't programmable, they have no temp/humidity over-ride capacity, and I have to crawl underneath the vivarium/rack to change the programming.... I'd gladly pay double that for an intergrated piece of equipment that could meet all those demands.


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## RarePlantBroker (Aug 3, 2008)

Forgot to add one thing....

For your lighting effects (lightning specifically), you may want to look into emergency/safety strobe lights used by divers. I've got a couple units that are battery powered that I bought for under $20--you could easily use something like this with a simple on/off switch to create lightning effects (the strobe itself is set to flash every couple seconds...).


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

Having a built in ability to load and play sound on a loop at set times to compliment the thunderstorm effect, or our own effect lights like strobes or plasma luminglass devices plugged into the controller. Could have an sd card slot, or flash drive...some way to load a recorded sound and play it would be awsome. Seems like a basic mp3 player function with some code to make it play and loop automatically when its on wouldn't be to hard.

I also like the idea of a fan controller and the ability to switch several lights on in sequence since most of us don't use Led fixtures and many compact fl bulbs are not dimmable. Led looks to still be a couple years away from becoming the standard lighting solution unless tons of new products come out and prices drop by 50% or more in the next year.

Timers lots and lots of timers...I want my lights on a timers(each of them), my misting on a timer, drip wall pumps on timers, effects light/sound all on separate timers. 

Or at least give me some always on plugins that I can plug power strips into and put timers on those. The ability to change each outlet between always on or timed would be nice too.

It would be great if the timers could go down to the second, or at least 30 second intervals 

Just having 4-6+ outlets on the system that can each be on a timer with 30 second intervals would be awsome.

Anyways thats what i'd like to see in a device.

Good luck!


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

I assume the unit will only have temp/humidity probes for 1 tank? I'm not understanding what we'll be "adjusting for other tanks" other then maybe lighting but how do you pull that off without a crap load of outlets on it? I'm all for a crap load of outlets though  

Having the ability to add more probes and link multiple vivs into a single controller would be nice. A linkable system...wireless ideally but wired would be a good start. That would also make it easier for people to justify the cost if they can run all or most of its features for multiple vivs. For a really large spectacular viv I may pony up a few hundred for a nice controller but give me one that I can use to control 5-10 vivs or even more (with minimal cost for additional probes) then I might be willing to pay around 500-1000 or so for it.


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## Dendro Dave (Aug 2, 2005)

RarePlantBroker said:


> Forgot to add one thing....
> 
> For your lighting effects (lightning specifically), you may want to look into emergency/safety strobe lights used by divers. I've got a couple units that are battery powered that I bought for under $20--you could easily use something like this with a simple on/off switch to create lightning effects (the strobe itself is set to flash every couple seconds...).


There are small strobes out there for stage shows and novelty purposes that run off ac power. Like this...








Its fairly small, 5" x 3.25" x 2"
Amazon.com: Chauvet Mini Flash Strobe Light: Musical Instruments

I'm no expert but seems something like this may not be hard to incorporate into the product? There are Led versions out there also, which may be better...xenon might be overkill


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

You can have the controller programmed to your needs as far as which tanks come on a which times.

A fan controller would be included, they would turn them on when the tank gets hot and off when it gets cool, same with humidity. I can work something out for you. I have a lot of trial & errors to run and codes to get made. This is going to be a long process but i will try my best to work fast and get these out.



markbudde said:


> This will be killer if you follow through. People have posted things like this before and then disappeared forever, so you might want to watch your back
> 
> A few suggestions...
> 1 - It sounds like you use leds. That's pretty cool, but puts you in the extreme minority. Instead of sunrise/sunset with LEDS, it would be more useful for me to just have a bunch (maybe 4-8) automatable switches. I have 4 to 8 lights on my viv and turn them on at different times, so a simple switch that I could plug wires into would allow me greater control using your device. But this isn't such a big deal. IMO, what is a REALLY big deal and would make this product a must have would be...
> ...


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

The code will not be lost in the program, but it would come down to having a battery backup. That would be up to the end user if they want to purchase a computer power backup.



jeffr said:


> what happens if you get power surges or power failure?


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## RarePlantBroker (Aug 3, 2008)

Our electrical service is horrible, and we have "brown outs" and/or short outages on a weekly basis. I already keep battery backups on all of my vivariums, computers, tv's, etc. It has definitely extended the life of all the electrical components.

Chris, what type of amperage will your controller be able to handle? On my newest rack, I'm running a total of 24 T-8's, 8 LED "moonlights", 20 PC fans, 6 recirculation pumps, a large diaphragm pump, and 2 foggers. During the mid-day part of the cycle, while misting, I'm drawing about 16 amps....


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

I am unsure about the details of the technical electrical questions, i have to ask my buddy he knows it very well. I am still designing this and havent purchased anything for it. When i know more i will def post. Right now im looking for input as far as what people would want in their system and when i get a bunch of answers i will design the code and order the components as needed for 1 controller, do some trial and errors on it, then offer them for sale. I am basically still in the design stage.



RarePlantBroker said:


> Our electrical service is horrible, and we have "brown outs" and/or short outages on a weekly basis. I already keep battery backups on all of my vivariums, computers, tv's, etc. It has definitely extended the life of all the electrical components.
> 
> Chris, what type of amperage will your controller be able to handle? On my newest rack, I'm running a total of 24 T-8's, 8 LED "moonlights", 20 PC fans, 6 recirculation pumps, a large diaphragm pump, and 2 foggers. During the mid-day part of the cycle, while misting, I'm drawing about 16 amps....


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## RarePlantBroker (Aug 3, 2008)

Not a problem.

I was curious what type of electrical draw others have for a rack system. I know most of the 110v controllers and timers I've seen are set up for a 10 amp to 15 amp max. When using multiple timers/controllers it's not an issue--but an "all in one" controller may need to regulate more power.


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## james67 (Jun 28, 2008)

perhaps a 220V version for the entire frogroom? i can see this turning into a rather large piece of equipment 

james


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## markbudde (Jan 4, 2008)

chris92486 said:


> The code will not be lost in the program, but it would come down to having a battery backup. That would be up to the end user if they want to purchase a computer power backup.


Is there a way to incorporate solid state memory, maybe as a removable thumb drive? I have no idea how much it costs to incorporate a thumb drive reader, but if possible then you could have the owner store their program file on a usb drive and then plug it into the outlet device to run the program. The thumb drive should be protected from power outages and could double as a data logger.


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## RarePlantBroker (Aug 3, 2008)

james67 said:


> perhaps a 220V version for the entire frogroom? i can see this turning into a rather large piece of equipment
> 
> james


James, does this mean we don't want to build a supercomputer and have a server room to run our vivariums? 

Now, if we can just figure out a way for the controller to make FF cultures...


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## Brien (Aug 27, 2009)

Most of us have more then just 1 tank some have a tons of tanks. Why not make it where it can control many tanks at once.


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## Brien (Aug 27, 2009)

You can also make it where one mistking hooked up to say 10 tanks can mist only one tank if you program it that way or mist them all at different times with only one pump. The way you would have to do it is with solenoid valves.


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

im working on 2 different setups, either control all tanks as one or control them individually. The misting w/solenoids is a good idea. Thanks for the input.

Its hard with limited funds to get this going in a shorter time frame but im doin my best. I hope to have the test one up and running within the next 2 months.

During that time i plan on setting up my new tanks and configuring the lighting (LED's) and using one of the tanks as a test tank with this new controller.

Keep the ideas coming.

-Chris


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## Brien (Aug 27, 2009)

Try not to be in such a hurry, get a good product out there and if it takes you a little longer then it does but it will pay off in the end. 

I would be interested in seeing your business plan


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## wwiggins (Sep 13, 2010)

I found this thread while searching to see if anyone had existing arduino code or schematics for this very thing. I've done some basic projects with arduinos before, but I haven't ever messed with relays. I would totally donate money to this project if you were to start a kickstarter campaign or something. 

I'm getting ready to build a new tank, and I've kind of decided that I won't start until I've figured out a way to automate environmental controls.


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

wwiggins - sent u a PM.

Does anyone else have any ideas or things they would like to see before i come up with a final draft of this project. I want to order all the supplies at once for everything and start the build.

-Chris


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

Don't worry everyone I have not disappeared. Times are tough and being on unemployment i am on a tight budget, also with the holidays coming money is even tighter. I have drawn a complete sketch for my own controller and i have the concept on paper.

I am in the process of building a custom stand for my 4 exo terra tanks and once the stand is built i will slowly put together a controller.

In the mean time if anybody would like a quote for one, send me your specs (Number of tanks, How many Lights/Pumps/Outlets/Etc.) And the options you would like and i can put together a quote and go over the build with you. I am opening this up to anybody who would like a controller made without actually seeing a final design. I can work with you on getting the best prices, i have a programmer who is doing the coding and for the first couple builds i will not charge any labor.

If you would like to wait until i have mine done which is going to be shortly after the holidays we can arrange for that just send me the info for your build anyway and i can start the pricing/designing in the mean time.

Send all messages via PM.

Thanks
Chris


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## vivbulider (Jan 23, 2010)

if it's not to late what about a dimer on a timer


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

Its not too late at all i will build the controller to your specific needs.

I have tons of other ideas that i havent added into the list. Dimmer, Timer Control through screen, Possible Touch Screen.

PM Me exactly what you have and want because everyone's build is going to be different. I will add/subtract pats as needed to make it specific to your needs.

Including length of temp sensor wires etc.

-Chris


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## frogfreak (Mar 4, 2009)

brien said:


> Try not to be in such a hurry, get a good product out there and if it takes you a little longer then it does but it will pay off in the end.


I have to say, that I agree with Brien here.

I don't see how you can pull this off in the amount of time you've alotted youself.


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

Honestly the hardest part is the coding of the controller which i have someone to do that for me. Th rest is plug and play. I would like someone to send me specs on their setup and what they need for it and i will put together a price/build.

-Chris


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## raimeiken (Dec 24, 2006)

this sounds awesome! I can't wait to see the final product


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## tommy2 (Feb 13, 2007)

Any updates on pricing?


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

I have a price sheet for the components but i have not made a prototype build yet. I will have one done after the holidays for my own tanks and will be posting the details then.

Sent u a pm.

Thanks
-Chris


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

To anyone who is interested. I have left the dart frog hobby and have this great idea for automation. Is there anyone that would like to take over the idea? I have all the information. Just need someone who can fund a project and do some testing. Its a great opportunity to market a great product.

Email me at [email protected] for details.

Thanks
-Chris


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## xxxxxxxxxchris92486 (Apr 17, 2010)

Hey Everyone,

Well I finally decided to move forward with this venture as I have been tied up with a lot of other things this past year.

I am stuck on a few things. I am looking for some help from anyone that wants to get involved with helping me start this up.

Im looking for someone who is familiar with...
Electronics (low voltage, relays)
Coding

Any help would be great.

Thanks
Chris


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