# Shallow puddle in frog tank?



## Domthemenace (Aug 16, 2014)

Hello, 

I am new here and am a complete beginner to dart frogs, and am currently in the process of building my own vivarium. 

I wanted to create a false bottom out of eggcrate, but leaving a patch of water in the front of the viv around 2cm deep, with mosses etc hiding the false bottom. My question is whether it would be okay to have this small amount of standing water or would it be a health risk to the frogs?


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## zreedman (Apr 8, 2006)

Hi there. I've done this with all the tanks I had false bottoms in. Looks kinda cool and the frogs like to deposit tads there. My only caution is to make sure it is completely secure so that the frogs and tads can't get under the false bottom. I've had to tear down a tank twice because of tads getting under there somehow, you'd be amazed the tight spaces tads and frogs can get into. I'm not aware of any health risks other than the ones I just mentioned. Every once and a while I've siphoned the water out with a turkey baster and let it replenish from mistings. 

Good Luck and be sure to show off some pics when you complete it.


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## Domthemenace (Aug 16, 2014)

Thanks man! Yeah I thought they looked pretty cool but just wasnt sure if there was a risk of diseases or bacteria building up in the water etc etc, at least i know i can do it now! How much of a gap between the 'bottom' of the false bottom and the top of the waterline should i have? 

And I will! I actually have a riparium/paludarium style aquarium going, not sure if its worth posting on here?


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## frogface (Feb 20, 2010)

I like to add small pools to my tanks and the water stays pretty clean and odor free. Make sure that the water doesn't touch the substrate, or, it will become saturated.


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

If even a little water touches the substrate, it can wick. Some substrates can wick a lot and make a real problem over time.
Consider a built in drain, with a short standpipe about an inch or so high. Water from misting will build up in the tank until it reaches the top of the standpipe. It will never raise higher because any more water will simply drain over the standpipe. This sets the top of your pool to the exact depth you determine, and it will never build up and saturate your substrate.


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## Domthemenace (Aug 16, 2014)

Thats actually a pretty good idea man. However i would have to drill the bottom to do that, a job im not too keen on doing! Do you think it would be okay if i built the false bottom a good height above the waterline, say 2" or so, and used rocks/wood to help blend it into the water? And just kept an eye on the water level and emptied with a turkey baster if need be?


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Yes, it would be. However I am a glass guy and have put together a thread that have helped many to drill their glass for the first time. If you're interested...http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/58594-how-drill-your-glass.html


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

Water features are very easy to make. We use the Mini-Jet 404 submersible pump to create a small circulating water feature and cut out enuf egg-crate to make a very shallow pond. We're very careful about overlapping the screen so that the frogs and tads don't find a way to the dark underwaterworld.

This is the last vivarium we finished up just recently, and it doesn't look like much compared to the works of art seen on this and other forums. My galacts dig it, tho -

Orange Galactonotus - YouTube

You'll do fine as long as the water area is secure ~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
kristi
pdf hobbyist since 2002


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## Domthemenace (Aug 16, 2014)

Thank you pumilo, i will be taking it into consideration- i am still in the planning stages at the moment haha, so everything will be considered! 

and guppygal- that is an AWESOME water feature! How did you go about it? what would i need to do to create one? Do you have a step by step? Also i'm contemplating whether that would be possible in such a small viv like mine- 24Lx18Hx13D? 

Thanks for all your help!


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

I think I have some 'before the substrate' and 'after the rest of the stuff' pix. Lemme look and I'll post. My galacts absolutely LOVE the water feature


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## guppygal (Aug 23, 2007)

Okay - this is not even CLOSE to the gorgeous tanks we see here online, but it was quick and easy to make, and my frogs are lively and very comfy. I have just the one decent pix of the driftwood, which is heavy malaysian and never rots. We pick out the ones that look like they'd make nice water features, whether we use them in such a manner or not.

Anyway, this first pix is positioning the wood. Husband had already placed a piece of 3/8 or 1/2 inch clear tubing into a position that allows a pool to form in the large shallow area of the wood. Once he got it situated to where it would flow correctly (sort of), he pushed the tubing thru the eggcrate, connected it to the 404 submersible pump, leaving me enuf leeway to add the pvc pipe for the false bottom. I think I went with 4" tall. This pix just shows placement. I pulled everything out after he marked the corner of the tank for height and position, and proceeded to attach the legs to the eggcrate. We prepared the eggcrate in two sections to make it easier.

Upon finishing that, husband attached the pump beneath the eggcrate and we set that portion back down in the tank. The other half was easy to place on the right end. Husband took the power cord from the pump and ran it up the corner of the tank where I covered it with a piece of bamboo.

Next, I cut large pieces of screen and placed them over the eggcrate, making sure I placed extra pieces around and under the driftwood. I cut a large X in the screen where the pond was going to go - I had already cut the eggcrate out. I took several more pieces of screen and siliconed small pebbles to the bottom, then criss-crossed them over the X. The X hole in the big part of the screen allowed me to make it as deep or as shallow as I wanted it. With frogs, we leave it pretty shallow. After I positioned the decorated screen over the hole, I placed a large piece of damp cardboard with small holes punched thru it on top of the screen with the pond cutout, and I cut smaller pieces of cardboard to go under the driftwood and the rest of the tank. Gotta LUV that cardboard - my bugs sure do!

So, now we have the eggcrate in place with the water feature and a dip in the screen to allow for a puddle. Time to test the pump and flow of the water. The 404 pump has low to high settings and I'm thinking that it was set on high cuz it was gushing out. I used rocks to tip the wood to allow the water to flow in the right direction, but it was using about a quarter of the wood, when there was another really nice smaller area (in the wood) that would also look great with water. I found a good length of very small aquarium tubing and shoved about 8" inside the larger tubing, then wrapped it around the back of the wood and up to a narrow hole near the smaller pond on the wood. I had to place a rock on top of it to hold it down. If you look closely, it kinda resembles a drinking fountain. I also place larger stones over the larger tube to direct the water flow. There was no way I was going to take it apart and lower the output, and this worked out great!!

Next, I layed down about an inch or so of damp peat mixture (ABG) filled with isopods and springtails. I had raked up a couple of large bags of oak leaves last year and I used a good amount to cover the coco peat mixture. I first cooked the leaves in the microwave in some water to kill any nasties, especially snails. I covered the substrate with the damp leaves after they cooled.

I let it sit for a few days and then I got busy again. I placed another small piece of wood on top of the main piece to hold a brom. I added large rocks leaning against other large rocks, additional pieces of driftwood (Mopani) some bamboo pieces tied together, other bamboo pieces poked horizontally in the soil, and added several well-washed 'discounted' broms from Kroger along with the nice ones from Josh's, which also supplied the jewel orchid. Afterwards, we placed the frogs in the tank and kept an eye on the temperature. This tank was a freebie from an ex-pdf hobbyist who was throwing it and the cabinet and light fixture away. We grabbed it just in time. Husband had to tone down the lights quite a bit due to the heat. The light fixture has fans on top, pulling the heat out from the lights, but it wasn't enuf. After the bulbs were changed out, it was all good, and it's a pleasure to watch while we're eating our meals. A lil weird, tho, having the frogs watching ME eat...


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## Waterside (Jun 5, 2014)

Domthemenace said:


> Hello,
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It seems like you already have some great advice from other forum users!

I wondered if you have already bought the tank?

I use a European style tank that comes with a built-in sloping glass bottom with a front trough to collect excess water. No need for an egg crate false bottom and you already have a water area at the front of the viv.

I part filled the front trough with clay substrate and gravel before planting semi-aquatic plants. Here are a couple of pictures:










The water stays pretty clean. I just do the occasional water change with a turkey baster.

The water is (at most) 2cm deep and my frogs love to sit on the gravel partly submerged.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Domthemenace (Aug 16, 2014)

guppygal said:


> Okay - this is not even CLOSE to the gorgeous tanks we see here online, but it was quick and easy to make, and my frogs are lively and very comfy. I have just the one decent pix of the driftwood, which is heavy malaysian and never rots. We pick out the ones that look like they'd make nice water features, whether we use them in such a manner or not.
> 
> Anyway, this first pix is positioning the wood. Husband had already placed a piece of 3/8 or 1/2 inch clear tubing into a position that allows a pool to form in the large shallow area of the wood. Once he got it situated to where it would flow correctly (sort of), he pushed the tubing thru the eggcrate, connected it to the 404 submersible pump, leaving me enuf leeway to add the pvc pipe for the false bottom. I think I went with 4" tall. This pix just shows placement. I pulled everything out after he marked the corner of the tank for height and position, and proceeded to attach the legs to the eggcrate. We prepared the eggcrate in two sections to make it easier.
> 
> ...


Whoa, thats a very detailed description! Thank you very much! You've given me a lot to think of... cant wait for the tank to get here so i can have a good play around with it and try out some of the ideas knocking about in my head! I have already purchased an aquaone 510 pump, pushes 400 litres per hour which is about the same as the 404 i think... I'm gonna build the tank so that the pump is easily accessible too if it should ever break or stop working or if i need to adjust the flow  

I'm thinking build a 'box' to place the pump in, cover in mesh, cut out a part of the false bottom the exact size as the 'box' for the pump, and sink the pump in that hole, which will be at the bottom of the water feature. Thoughts? 

And waterside, that is a great idea! I'm pretty committed to getting the tank i am originally going for, however i guess i could build something like that pretty easily by ordering glass cut to specific sizes and siliconing them together, and just placing that in front of the tank. Definitely something to think about! Thank you!


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