# Formic-Cal Plus



## jrodkinsey (May 27, 2013)

Just curious to if anyone has any experience with using Repahy Formic-Cal Plus with their darts. I already use Repashy calcium-plus 5 days a week and once a month I use Repashy vitamin A supplement. I would like to use the Formic-cal once or twice a week but would like to get some feedback first.


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

For the sake of the discussion here is the product information from the repashy website:

Formic-Cal Plus

Ant Eater Supplement

Our All-in-Oneî Insect Dusting Powder provides Formic Acid (40% active ingredient) to supplement obligate Ant eating species. It also contains essential vitamins, minerals and trace elements. Featuring both Retinol and Carotenoids as sources of Vitamin A.

INGREDIENTS: Calcium Formate, Calcium Carbonate, Dried Kelp, Brewer’s Yeast, RoseHips, Calendula Flower, Marigold Flower Extract, Phaffia Rhodozyma Yeast, Paprika Extract, Spirulina Algae, Turmeric, Salt, Potassium Citrate, Magnesium Gluconate, Canthaxanthin, Calcium Propionate and Potassium Sorbate (as mold inhibitors), Natural Flavoring, Lecithin, Rosemary Extract and Mixed Tocopherols (as preservatives), Vitamins (Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D Supplement, Choline Chloride, Ascorbic Acid Phosphate, Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin, Beta Carotene, Pantothenic Acid, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex, Folic Acid, Biotin, Vitamin B-12 Supplement).

Guaranteed Analysis: Crude Protein min. 2%, Crude Fat min. 0.2%, Crude Fat max. 0.6%, Crude Fiber max. 1%, Moisture max. 8%, Ash max. 35%, Calcium min. 17%, Calcium max. 20%, Phosphorus min. 0.6%, Vitamin E min. 2,000 IU/lb, Vitamin D min. 20,000 IU/lb, Vitamin A min. 200,000 IU/lb. Total Carotenoids min. 500 mg/lb.

WARNING Calcium Formate is an irritant. In case of contact with eyes, rinse immediately with plenty of water and seek medical advice.

DIRECTIONS: Lightly “dust” insects before feeding. The best application method is to place insects in a plastic bag or container with Formic-Cal Plus and shake to lightly coat insects. Feed insects to your reptiles shortly thereafter. Refrigeration will extend product life.

USAGE INFORMATION: This product should be considered EXPERIMENTAL. The requirements for dietary formic acid are unknown, and this product is designed to be a tool for research only. Use this product at your own risk. Formic-Cal Plus has a strong taste and may not be palatable to some species at full strength. If necessary, dilute with our Calcium Plus at decreasing ratios until accepted by specimen, or your desired test concentrations are reached.


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## Enlightened Rogue (Mar 21, 2006)

I don`t understand, if you`re using Repashy Calcium Plus and Repashy Vitamin A why would you want Calcium Formate?
Just asking.

John


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

If I understand correctly, OP is interested in the formic acid component of the supplement, as dart frog diets in the wild are usually high in ants; whereas in captivity they get almost no ants in their diet.

So, maybe, this could stand in as a substitute?


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## frogparty (Dec 27, 2007)

Interesting.... I was looking at this the other day, thinking I should be keeping some horned lizards 


Ants are a staple of a lot of Dendrobates..... Wonder if there would be any benefit to adding the formic acid into their diet


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## jrodkinsey (May 27, 2013)

Thanks hypostatic for posting the stats for the supplement. Yes, that is correct, I only want to use this as a substitute and not the main supplement.


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## jrodkinsey (May 27, 2013)

frogparty said:


> Interesting.... I was looking at this the other day, thinking I should be keeping some horned lizards
> 
> 
> Ants are a staple of a lot of Dendrobates..... Wonder if there would be any benefit to adding the formic acid into their diet



This is what I'm curious about. Could there be a possible benefit with them having formic acid in their diet like they have in their natural diet? 

Again, I would only be doing this once to twice a week.


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## FroggyKnight (Mar 14, 2013)

I have used formic-cal as an occasional supplement for some Phrynosoma lizards a while back and I was pleased with the results. Although, I still supplemented their diet with live harvester ants. 

I'm not sure how darts would react to this product though. For one, we really have no idea exactly how much supplement is needed to match the frog's natural diet. This supplement IS experimental.

I also don't know how the frog would react to the formic acid when it contacts its skin. I can't imagine it would feel good at all.

John


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## hypostatic (Apr 25, 2011)

FroggyKnight said:


> I'm not sure how darts would react to this product though. For one, we really have no idea exactly how much supplement is needed to match the frog's natural diet. This supplement IS experimental


Yeah, from what I discerned from reading the directions, if I were to use this product I would cut it with Cal+ and possibly increase the concentration. Maybe starting so that the final concentration of the first batch was 5% or 10% formic acid.

Also the question arises whether formic acid (here in the form of Calcium Formate) is beneficial at all to dart frogs.


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## jrodkinsey (May 27, 2013)

I took the plunge. Just got the formic-cal earlier this week. 

So currently what I am doing is every Tuesday and Thursday feedings, I am adding a pinch of the formic-cal into a deli cup with calcium-plus. I make sure that when I mix, I just mix enough so very little calcium powder is poured out while dumping in the flies. I will be doing this mix for the next two weeks and then after I will just do full strength with the formic-cal every Tuesday and Thursday.


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