# 20 long cobalt build



## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

heres the build of my new viv for my little cobalt, if anyone knows good methods for making a GS background please tell me because I don't know where to start

so heres what I've come up with so far, I plan on making a GS background and mounting plenty of bromeliads and air plants. Tips on making the background are welcome 



this is just the planning so far, so i can change it if anyone has any pointers


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## Nismo95 (Jul 30, 2011)

my input. I love the placement of the wood. has the potential to be a really awesome vivarium.. But its a double edged sword.. I do not envy you trying to GS and cover it once its cured! gonna be a pain in the butt to get every bit of GS covered hahaha! But good luck, I hope you can do it! One thing I have done in the past is laid down my GS then set the wood into it while its still wet and then foamed over parts of the wood as well. hope that helps


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## Damon Ryan (Nov 13, 2015)

You could make a removable background


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

I also LOVE the wood. How about using tree fern panels or cork flats as a background? Either one could be cut or shaped as needed allowing the wood to rest on the background. This would be a lot easier than trying to cover foam.
The only other issue I see is the false bottom. Right now it looks like it is resting on the bottom of the tank. I'm not sure how much you could raise it without needing to cut the wood shorter.


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## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

That is alot of dollars in wood for a frog that most likely wont use it post juvie. i like wood heavy tanks, just be careful not to lose half of it in the great stuff

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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Nismo95 said:


> my input. I love the placement of the wood. has the potential to be a really awesome vivarium.. But its a double edged sword.. I do not envy you trying to GS and cover it once its cured! gonna be a pain in the butt to get every bit of GS covered hahaha! But good luck, I hope you can do it! One thing I have done in the past is laid down my GS then set the wood into it while its still wet and then foamed over parts of the wood as well. hope that helps


Thanks for the tips, I assumed already that that part would be a pain, and I like your method of placing the wood in after the foam but would I be able just to put foam in all behind it then carve the excess away?


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

chillplants said:


> I also LOVE the wood. How about using tree fern panels or cork flats as a background? Either one could be cut or shaped as needed allowing the wood to rest on the background. This would be a lot easier than trying to cover foam.
> The only other issue I see is the false bottom. Right now it looks like it is resting on the bottom of the tank. I'm not sure how much you could raise it without needing to cut the wood shorter.


Thanks, I have some bark that I plan on using along with coco fiber for the background. And about the false bottom, I've had great success with one this small in my previous two vivs and most of the plants will be mounted and not in the soil


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Erikb3113 said:


> That is alot of dollars in wood for a frog that most likely wont use it post juvie. i like wood heavy tanks, just be careful not to lose half of it in the great stuff
> 
> Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


I actually collect and sanitize all my wood myself and the tank was given to me, and the egg crate was salvaged so the only thing I bought was the light and a plant growing bulb for it, each about 12 dollars  All I will have to buy is great stuff, coco fiber, silicone, and plants (I've got another of the same lights I'll put on it)


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

YoDamon said:


> You could make a removable background



I've kinda got my heart set on a GS/bark background


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## GandalfTheGrey (Nov 18, 2015)

This is just my opinion, but instead of the GS (I'm assuming that you're going to use the yellow foam then cover it with coir, please correct me if I'm wrong), you could use the black pond sealant that Tetra sells (I think GS also sells it). It's like regular foam, but it cures black, so it looks like rocks. You could use that if you would like a more rocky-looking background.
Good luck!


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

GandalfTheGrey said:


> This is just my opinion, but instead of the GS (I'm assuming that you're going to use the yellow foam then cover it with coir, please correct me if I'm wrong), you could use the black pond sealant that Tetra sells (I think GS also sells it). It's like regular foam, but it cures black, so it looks like rocks. You could use that if you would like a more rocky-looking background.
> Good luck!


im not exactly looking for a rocky look but black would be easier to hide with coco fiber than yellow. any tips on the actual construction?


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## GandalfTheGrey (Nov 18, 2015)

Lake said:


> Thanks for the tips, I assumed already that that part would be a pain, and I like your method of placing the wood in after the foam but would I be able just to put foam in all behind it then carve the excess away?


Carving the excess foam away would work but you'd have to remember exactly where you put the wood and I don't imagine that the GS would come off the wood easily, it may leave some behind when you carve it off. You could probably do a test with a small piece of wood and try letting some GS cure on it then seeing how easily it comes off.


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## GandalfTheGrey (Nov 18, 2015)

Also I think I remember reading on one of the GS cans that it expands 2x the original amount, so you may want to keep that in mind if you go ahead and put in the GS behind the wood


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## Judy S (Aug 29, 2010)

am I missing something? Where is the drainage area??? Where is the 1/2 - 1 inch gap to prevent the "soil" substrate from wicking moisture from the drainage? If you go to the construction forums here, you will understand the importance to not only your future frogs, but also to the plants...Please, please take that time --the pictures I looked at are doomed as a viable vivarium...sorry....


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Judy S said:


> am I missing something? Where is the drainage area??? Where is the 1/2 - 1 inch gap to prevent the "soil" substrate from wicking moisture from the drainage? If you go to the construction forums here, you will understand the importance to not only your future frogs, but also to the plants...Please, please take that time --the pictures I looked at are doomed as a viable vivarium...sorry....


The white grid on the bottom is a 1/2 inch drainage layer of egg crate plastic  this amount of drainage has worked well on my three other vivs. Again, this is just a brainstorming phase and I have not put in the screen to cover it yet so that might be why you didn't se it. Thanks for your concern, I'm glad you're looking to help


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

GandalfTheGrey said:


> Also I think I remember reading on one of the GS cans that it expands 2x the original amount, so you may want to keep that in mind if you go ahead and put in the GS behind the wood


Ok, I think I will put a small amount behind all of the branches and see how it expands since I can always add more


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

I would recommend increasing the height of drainage to 1" to 1.5", as half an inch would mean constantly removing water. Otherwise, the water will touch the screening barrier and wick up into the soil, creating a veritable swamp. Just for ease of care, I think adding just that little half inch to an inch of drainage will save you a lot of frustration. Anyways, just a suggestion, take it as you will.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

jarteta97 said:


> I would recommend increasing the height of drainage to 1" to 1.5", as half an inch would mean constantly removing water. Otherwise, the water will touch the screening barrier and wick up into the soil, creating a veritable swamp. Just for ease of care, I think adding just that little half inch to an inch of drainage will save you a lot of frustration. Anyways, just a suggestion, take it as you will.


I might do that, but if I did I would have to trim a few of my main pieces of wood. I might just stack extra egg crate overtop of the existing pieces in a sort of mosaic around the base of the wood that would need to be trimmed and just cover it in a second layer of egg crate


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

I've done something similar. I had a central piece of wood that was too tall, and I basically stuck it halfway into the drainage layer (I lightweight porous rocks), and then just cut a whole in the screen soil barrier and placed it around the piece so that the soil just went around the wood piece and not down into the drainage layer.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

jarteta97 said:


> I've done something similar. I had a central piece of wood that was too tall, and I basically stuck it halfway into the drainage layer (I lightweight porous rocks), and then just cut a whole in the screen soil barrier and placed it around the piece so that the soil just went around the wood piece and not down into the drainage layer.


I might just buy hydro balls to solve the problem. Or I could stick to plants that like wetter conditions


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

As far as construction goes, I would take the wood out and add GS foam. Carve it down to whatever thickness you want, cover with coir and put the wood back in. The wood would sit loose in the tank resting on the GS. You can carve little notches as needed for the wood to rest on.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

chillplants said:


> As far as construction goes, I would take the wood out and add GS foam. Carve it down to whatever thickness you want, cover with coir and put the wood back in. The wood would sit loose in the tank resting on the GS. You can carve little notches as needed for the wood to rest on.


Ok, do you think a good method would be to do that, then after adding the wood, add a little more foam around where the wood meets the foam then carve, silicone, and cover that in coco? I'm looking to make as smooth of a transition as possible


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

Do you need GS to hold the wood? Think about this...what if a frog or something else was stuck behind the wood. You would have to break the wood/GS bond to get to whatever was behind it. If you ever need to catch a sick frog/baby frog, or remove all frogs for whatever reason, all that wood would prevent an easy capture. Also, adding/removing plants attached to the wood would also be much easier if you could just lift the piece out.
All in all, I think the wood would look fine just loosely resting on the top of the GS.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

chillplants said:


> Do you need GS to hold the wood? Think about this...what if a frog or something else was stuck behind the wood. You would have to break the wood/GS bond to get to whatever was behind it. If you ever need to catch a sick frog/baby frog, or remove all frogs for whatever reason, all that wood would prevent an easy capture. Also, adding/removing plants attached to the wood would also be much easier if you could just lift the piece out.
> All in all, I think the wood would look fine just loosely resting on the top of the GS.


A few of the pieces in the picture are temporarily glued to the background to keep them up, Ill look at it again and see if I could make that work, but I might have to rethink the wood placement to get the look I'm striving for if I use that method

(EDIT) I've looked at it and that method would make the project a lot easier, to keep the same layout I will only have to actually attach two or three pieces of wood to the background. Thanks for the help


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## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

Trim the wood because that is not enough of a drainage layer to prevent rotten soil. Draining would be impossible. The wood will also wick water into the substrate if left in drainage layer

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## Mohlerbear (Feb 20, 2014)

Lake said:


> Ok, do you think a good method would be to do that, then after adding the wood, add a little more foam around where the wood meets the foam then carve, silicone, and cover that in coco? I'm looking to make as smooth of a transition as possible



Perfect idea. Exactly what I would do. Do as much as the back ground you can with foam/carving/silicone/substrate. Then put the wood back in and spot gs foam it in, carve that after its cured and silicone/substrate it. Can't go wrong. Ive never had a frog stuck...


Loading bowls and building vivs! Braaap!
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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Mohlerbear said:


> Perfect idea. Exactly what I would do. Do as much as the back ground you can with foam/carving/silicone/substrate. Then put the wood back in and spot gs foam it in, carve that after its cured and silicone/substrate it. Can't go wrong. Ive never had a frog stuck...
> 
> 
> Loading bowls and building vivs! Braaap!
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thank you, Ill do that method


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Erikb3113 said:


> Trim the wood because that is not enough of a drainage layer to prevent rotten soil. Draining would be impossible. The wood will also wick water into the substrate if left in drainage layer
> 
> Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


don't worry, I'm raising the false bottom


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## Mohlerbear (Feb 20, 2014)

Leaving some of the wood in the substrate layer isn't the worse thing? I guess pending what kind of wood. I like having some of my Malaysian driftwood wick some of the water up. Keeps it damp and perfect for growing mosses. 


Loading bowls and building vivs! Braaap!
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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Just bought the foam and silicone, I got brown because I thought it would be easier to hide than other colors


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## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

Mohlerbear said:


> Leaving some of the wood in the substrate layer isn't the worse thing? I guess pending what kind of wood. I like having some of my Malaysian driftwood wick some of the water up. Keeps it damp and perfect for growing mosses.
> 
> 
> Loading bowls and building vivs! Braaap!
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Substrate layer no, drainage layer yes, and with a 1/2" it would be in the drainage 

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## Jjl (Feb 2, 2014)

Hi Lake,

I noticed that you plan on using several bromeliads and air plants...I've seen Cobalts hanging out in bromeliads once in a while, but I don't really consider them necessary, because the frog itself is more terrestrial. Just my $0.02, maybe you can save some plant money.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Jjl said:


> Hi Lake,
> 
> I noticed that you plan on using several bromeliads and air plants...I've seen Cobalts hanging out in bromeliads once in a while, but I don't really consider them necessary, because the frog itself is more terrestrial. Just my $0.02, maybe you can save some plant money.


Yeah, I know that the cobalt (especially once mature) won't really use the vertical space as much but I mainly want the epyphites for looks, I'll be choosing terrestrial plants as well for my frog to hide in on the ground. I was also thinking of maybe getting a pair/trio of leucs and making another tank for the cobalt but for now, the broms and air plants are just for looks.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Erikb3113 said:


> Substrate layer no, drainage layer yes, and with a 1/2" it would be in the drainage
> 
> Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


Yes, I've doubled the drainage layer so the wood will not touch it


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## Erikb3113 (Oct 1, 2008)

Lake said:


> Yes, I've doubled the drainage layer so the wood will not touch it


In my opinion, only my opinion, that still wont be enough. Since you are using egg crate directly on the bottom, there will be no exchange. Idividual cells will fill with debris that makes its way through the screen and will work as a wick. I prefer to put a few pvc sections under mine to bring it up at least an inch. Once again, just my opinion develped through good and bad experience.

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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Erikb3113 said:


> In my opinion, only my opinion, that still wont be enough. Since you are using egg crate directly on the bottom, there will be no exchange. Idividual cells will fill with debris that makes its way through the screen and will work as a wick. I prefer to put a few pvc sections under mine to bring it up at least an inch. Once again, just my opinion develped through good and bad experience.
> 
> Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk


I've already foamed in the background so I can't take it out now, my other vivs with half that height never did that so I'm hoping this one won't either.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Updates coming very soon!


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

so after i foamed and carved it, I noticed 2 of my main pieces of wood were ceder/pine  so i had to rethink the wood layout:


adding coco fiber:

Started getting plants, so far only one orchid and an air plant:


random pics of the frog:


I've added the wood and tied moss onto some of it. I've also added the air plant I bought. Tips on mounting orchids are welcome  its kinda hard to tell from the photos but I have the wood arranged so some of it it juts out into the center from the background:


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## Jjl (Feb 2, 2014)

This tank looks great! It looks like your air plant is a Tillandsia, and your orchid is some kind of Phalaenopsis. Tillandsias need to be able to dry off between mistings, and good air movement never hurts either. Phalaenopsis are usually kind of troublesome vivarium orchids, because they get crown rot fairly easily. You can try avoiding this by mounting it sideways or upside down, but it isn't worth the trouble (in my opinion).

Frequently used mounting materials include fly fishing line, zip ties, florist wire (my personal favorite), and in some cases, toothpick "spears" (which I would not recommend for your orchid).


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Jjl said:


> This tank looks great! It looks like your air plant is a Tillandsia, and your orchid is some kind of Phalaenopsis. Tillandsias need to be able to dry off between mistings, and good air movement never hurts either. Phalaenopsis are usually kind of troublesome vivarium orchids, because they get crown rot fairly easily. You can try avoiding this by mounting it sideways or upside down, but it isn't worth the trouble (in my opinion).
> 
> Frequently used mounting materials include fly fishing line, zip ties, florist wire (my personal favorite), and in some cases, toothpick "spears" (which I would not recommend for your orchid).


Ok, thanks for the input  I'll move the air plant to a drier spot. Could I just mount the orchid in a spot the minsters miss? Cause it would still be humid, but it wouldn't be sprayed directly


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## GandalfTheGrey (Nov 18, 2015)

Looks good! Are you planning on putting a water bowl in there? In my experience my azureus like to hang out in the water bowl quite a bit


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## Jjl (Feb 2, 2014)

Lake said:


> Ok, thanks for the input  I'll move the air plant to a drier spot. Could I just mount the orchid in a spot the minsters miss? Cause it would still be humid, but it wouldn't be sprayed directly


I think it's worth a try.


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

I use green fishing line from Walmart. It's called EZ Braid Spiderwire. I originally starting using this stuff for planted aquariums and it lasts forever even under water.

I really like the way the wood sticks out on the left. I think a few real nice orchids or mini gesneriads would make it really stand out. For other plants, I would try and stick with smaller varieties that would accent the wood and help it look like roots coming across. Some Soleirolia soleirolii or Pilea glauca for ground cover and maybe Pellaea 'Glowstar'. It stays fairly small for me.


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

GandalfTheGrey said:


> Looks good! Are you planning on putting a water bowl in there? In my experience my azureus like to hang out in the water bowl quite a bit


I might, but I might also get a few leucamelas instead and make another viv for the cobalt... Not sure yet


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Jjl said:


> I think it's worth a try.


I'll try it then


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

chillplants said:


> I use green fishing line from Walmart. It's called EZ Braid Spiderwire. I originally starting using this stuff for planted aquariums and it lasts forever even under water.
> 
> I really like the way the wood sticks out on the left. I think a few real nice orchids or mini gesneriads would make it really stand out. For other plants, I would try and stick with smaller varieties that would accent the wood and help it look like roots coming across. Some Soleirolia soleirolii or Pilea glauca for ground cover and maybe Pellaea 'Glowstar'. It stays fairly small for me.


Thanks for the tips! I've already got my eye on some Pilea glauca at a local shop, and I've collected a fern species that I've mounted before (sorry, don't know the name) would you be able to tell me your favorite/best species of mini gesneriad for mounting? I've never worked with them before. Thanks


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Some more plants: Im getting some more bromeliads, maybe 1 or 2 more air plants, a few pilea glauca, and a few others


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

The tank is looking great, but I'm still confused as to how you did drainage, there's hardly any room under the soil if at all. I would really hate for such a good looking tank to become swamped


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

jarteta97 said:


> The tank is looking great, but I'm still confused as to how you did drainage, there's hardly any room under the soil if at all. I would really hate for such a good looking tank to become swamped


So far it's draining well, this is twice as much drainage as is on my original cobalt tank. Also, the plants (all but one) that I got for the ground level do well with reasonably saturated soil.


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## GandalfTheGrey (Nov 18, 2015)

Looks good! Are you putting any mosses on the ground?


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

GandalfTheGrey said:


> Looks good! Are you putting any mosses on the ground?


Probably only a little, I like the look the leaf litter gives


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

I bought five new plants and I've done some planting, so I'll get some pictures when I get home today.


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## Kyman (Sep 18, 2015)

is that really a 20L its seems so tall compared to mine?


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Kyman said:


> is that really a 20L its seems so tall compared to mine?


It is, I never thought it to be very tall


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

Sorry for terrible quality on this picture  I've got some more planting to do but here's a start


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## Lake (Jan 31, 2015)

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