# paludarium sump help??



## Bokfan1 (Oct 17, 2010)

I'm in the planning stage of a 90+ gal paludarium and right now I am trying to figure out how the plumbing for it. my plan is to drill a hole in the side of the tank where i want the water level to be so that the water overflows down through the pipes and into my sump then a pump pumps it back into the main tank. Ive attached a rough sketch of it let me know what you think. 
I dont know a whole lot about higher tech aquariums and I know there are lots of people who have kept them on here. Please let me know what you think and if it would work.
Thanks


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## VicSkimmr (Jan 24, 2006)

That's exactly how a sump works, you should be good to go 

Just my opinion, but you may want to drill a second hole slightly above the water level for your return (and plug it) just for backup in case your waterfall doesn't work out as well as you would like. They're kind of unpredictable and once the tank is set up there won't be any more drilling holes in the glass.

I'd also suggest doing some research on durso standpipes to help you reduce noise. You can modify the idea to fit an overflow that's drilled in the back of the tank instead of in the bottom. I'll see if I can find some pictures of how I did it.


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## Bokfan1 (Oct 17, 2010)

Ok good, the noise was the main thing I was worried about. Is it necessary to have an overflow box or can it just drain through the bulkhead in the back of the tank? Thanks again..


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

It can drain through a bulkhead at the back of the tank set at the proper level. In fact I'm fairly confident that there are no overflow boxes on the market that would allow you to run the water level that low. They are designed for reef tanks which would be full.
Don't forget to incorporate screens on both the exit bulkhead and on the water inlet into the viv. A screen on the exit bulkhead is self explanatory (so your frogs don't escape through it). But don't neglect the water return inlet. If there is a power outage, they could plausible escape through there unless your frogs are obviously much bigger than the pipe.


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## the_deeb (Apr 21, 2008)

VicSkimmr said:


> Just my opinion, but you may want to drill a second hole slightly above the water level for your return (and plug it) just for backup in case your waterfall doesn't work out as well as you would like.


Great advice. I'd suggest actually splitting your return lines and installing ball valves so you can regulate the amount of flow to either the waterfall or directly into the water (or turn one off entirely). This is what I did with my paludarium build (using a canister filter instead of a sump, but same idea - see the link in my signature for more details).

You might also want to consider drilling a second emergency drain hole slightly higher than the first (in case you get a clog in the first). You can also set it up so that the first drain is fully submerged and regulate it's flow with a ball valve. See this site for some excellent info on the principle: BeanAnimal's Bar and Grill - Silent and Fail-Safe Overflow System



Bokfan1 said:


> the noise was the main thing I was worried about. Is it necessary to have an overflow box or can it just drain through the bulkhead in the back of the tank?


You can drain directly through a bulkhead but it can be a little loud. Modifying it into a durso will help with the noise. An overflow box will provide better skimming if that's something you want.



Pumilo said:


> I'm fairly confident that there are no overflow boxes on the market that would allow you to run the water level that low.


I'm not sure what water depth you're thinking of, but I'm pretty sure you could custom build a skimmer box or use a glass-holes overflow: Glass-Holes.com dope aquarium stuff


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

the_deeb said:


> You can drain directly through a bulkhead but it can be a little loud. Modifying it into a durso will help with the noise. An overflow box will provide better skimming if that's something you want.
> 
> I'm not sure what water depth you're thinking of, but I'm pretty sure you could custom build a skimmer box or use a glass-holes overflow: Glass-Holes.com dope aquarium stuff


Just commenting that most or all of the standard, hang on, overflow boxes made for fish tanks are designed to keep the water level within an inch or three of the top of the tank. You could not use one of those in this application. A custom built skimmer box or the glass-holes kit would be a nice modification.


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## Bokfan1 (Oct 17, 2010)

Thanks for all the help! Im pretty ignorant when it comes to high tech aquariums.



the_deeb said:


> Great advice. I'd suggest actually splitting your return lines and installing ball valves so you can regulate the amount of flow to either the waterfall or directly into the water (or turn one off entirely). This is what I did with my paludarium build (using a canister filter instead of a sump, but same idea - see the link in my signature for more details).
> 
> You might also want to consider drilling a second emergency drain hole slightly higher than the first (in case you get a clog in the first). You can also set it up so that the first drain is fully submerged and regulate it's flow with a ball valve. See this site for some excellent info on the principle: BeanAnimal's Bar and Grill - Silent and Fail-Safe Overflow System
> 
> ...


One question though I really like the idea of that was in the link you provided. My question is: is the overflow box necessary or can I go without? Ive attached a drawing of what I'm talking about..


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## the_deeb (Apr 21, 2008)

Drainage will work fine with just the bulkhead, you don't need the overflow box. That being said, the overflow box will provide better surface skimming (it will help to remove the layer of scum that can build up on the water surface). This is a big deal in saltwater aquariums but is less of an issue in freshwater setups, particularly if you provide some surface agitation from your returns.


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## ynotnad (Dec 21, 2009)

I put my overflow box in the back bottom corner of my tank and it drains out the bottom. You can have it drain out the back or side just make sure to have your drain hole at least 2" below your water level. While creating a sump is a nice feature I ended up removing my sump and replacing it with a canister filter which was easier to maintain and I liked using a closed loop filtration better. As far as screens for your inlet and outlet (as Doug already mentioned) you could just add a 90 degree pvc fitting inside your overflow box and have it face down. Then add a piece of pvc with with small teeth cut out of one side and have it almost touching the bottom of your overflow box. This will ensure your frogs or fish don't get sucked down into your filtration. I can post pictures if you would like of how I did this on my tank if it helps.

Tony


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## Shinosuke (Aug 10, 2011)

ynotnad, can you post a picture of the overflow box you're talking about?
I used to reef pretty heavily and over-flow boxes must mean something different in this hobby. As Pumilo said, an overflow box, ime, is meant to hang over the top of your aquarium and suck water off the top of the tank so you don't have to drill it.

The durso standpipe is pretty important, otherwise it sounds like you've constantly got a toilet flushing in your tank. It's really easy to do, though. 
I would consider the backup drain slightly higher than the first almost a necessity. A simple clog in the pipe could cause your tank to flood and then cause your pump to dry out. At best it will fry the pump, at worst it could catch fire.
The ball-valve is also a good recommendation. 
If I could add one more suggestion it would be to add a shut-off valve right after any drains. You never know when it will come in handy!


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## Bokfan1 (Oct 17, 2010)

Alright so assuming that I want the water level in the tank to be 12inches.....I woud put the main draing at 10 inches, the durso standpipe at 12 inches ,a and the backup overflow at maybe 13 inches with an upturned pvc elbow? Does that sound right? Thanks again for all the help!


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## Lbacha (Sep 7, 2011)

Bokfan1 said:


> Alright so assuming that I want the water level in the tank to be 12inches.....I woud put the main draing at 10 inches, the durso standpipe at 12 inches ,a and the backup overflow at maybe 13 inches with an upturned pvc elbow? Does that sound right? Thanks again for all the help!


Here is an example of what you are looking for 









Len


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## VicSkimmr (Jan 24, 2006)

Bokfan1 said:


> Alright so assuming that I want the water level in the tank to be 12inches.....I woud put the main draing at 10 inches, the durso standpipe at 12 inches ,a and the backup overflow at maybe 13 inches with an upturned pvc elbow? Does that sound right? Thanks again for all the help!


I think so.


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## andyl (Jan 4, 2012)

or two up from the bottom in typical stockman standpipe setup, was always my favorite as it was absolutely silent... ones your primary drain with a knife/gate valve for adjusting, the other is an emergency overflow...


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