# Encyclia's "Living Room"



## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

I have been wanting to do one of these for a while and finally got around to it. Apologies ahead of time - I write with maximum verbosity (little Zork reference for folk of my vintage).

ABOUT ME: My name is Mark and I am a frogaholic... About 20 years ago I took a run at keeping frogs with mixed success. I had to give them up at the time to move away and into University Housing where pets are not usually welcome. About 4 or 5 years ago, I got back into the hobby with a vengeance. I would now consider myself a novice knocking on the door of journeyman  

THANKS!: Before showing you my room, I would like to say thank you to everyone on the forum that shares their knowledge so generously. I would especially like to thank pumilo and Ed (and many others!) for their dedication to these boards and for their help for me personally. pumilo, especially, got me headed in a better direction with my builds and husbandry at a time when I was poised to make some serious mistakes. I appreciate his time and patience. pdfCrazy has been an amazing help to me here locally, as well. I also would like to say thank you to Jack and Dave at Feeder Frenzy Reptiles in Arvada, Colorado. Check out their store if you are in town!

THE ROOM: We had a room in the house that we weren't going to be using all that much. Thus, the "living room," where all the living things live, was born. This room is a bit different than than many of the excellent frog rooms I have seen on these boards. It would be far more efficient to just have a rack and be done with it. However, my wife insisted that we have "nice-looking" tanks in the living room. So, rather than having a concentrated location where all of the tanks are efficiently placed, I have little pods of tanks all over the living room (ok, and a little bit into the dining room). It made the installation of the Mist King a bit more complex, but I really like the way it came out. I will say that I am happy to have set up my frogs this way rather than a bigger rack in the basement. I have learned that, for me, if I have to walk by all of my animals, they are much less likely to be neglected. Anyway, here are some pictures. As can be seen, the livelihood of professional photographers in my area is quite secure.









This is my 90 gallon planted tank flanked by two sets of two 18x18x24 ZooMeds. The stands were custom built (relatively inexpensively) by a welder I connected with through Craigslist (thanks, Carey!). The dark area under the 90 is where my Leopard Tortoise (Babcocki) lives in the winter. She is happily munching away outside right now. Upper left - Vanzolinis, Lower left - Mint Terribilis, Upper Right - Southern Variabilis, Lower Right - Brazilian Yellow Heads.









The only pieces of furniture that fit in the living room. Upper Left - Anthonyi Santa Isabels, Lower Left and Right - Green Sirensis, Upper Right - Highland Bronze Auratus. 









Um, sorry, honey, it's only temporary, I promise! Actually, I moved to bins for froglets (great idea, pdfCrazy) because they are easier to move when we have people over and actually want to eat in the dining room...

















These tanks were originally built by pumilo and decorated by mindcrash before he passed them on to me. Great job, guys! As you can see, they are well used! Upper Left on first picture - pumilio Colon, Upper right - White Banded Fantasticas, Bottom - Yellowish (sold to me as orange) Galactonatus. Second picture - Upper - pumilio Esperanza, Lower - pumilio Bastimentos.









Upper tank - Green and Bronze auratus, Lower Left - Borja Ridge variabilis, Lower Middle - imitator Chazuta, Lower right - more Vanzos (still holding them for you, Chris!).

CLOSER-UPS:








Close up of the fish tank. Looks a little hazy since I had been messing with it. It's a handy way to generate some plants that I sometimes try in my vivaria. 









Mint tank. I recently added the broms from a different tank. The Mints never went up high before. Now they are all over those broms. Who'da thunk?









More bromeliad surplus in here. Gonna have to thin it out at some point. Hi BYH!


















FROG PICS: I am not bueno at taking pictures of my frogs. Here are a few that I have taken over time, many of the wee lads and lasses since they are too young and stupid to run away when I get the camera close to them. 

































Thanks for taking the time to look. I am always open to suggestions and other comments!

Happy froggin', 

Mark


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## SteppingStones (Dec 30, 2013)

I can't resist Congo Tetras and Denison Barbs! The vivs look spectacular! Keep the photos coming!


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## chillplants (Jul 14, 2008)

I am jealous of your beautiful tanks.


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## k5MOW (Jun 19, 2015)

Wow absolutely amazing. 

Roger


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Thanks, guys 

SteppingStones, I couldn't agree more. Two of my favorites. See below for why they are in the tank 

I thought I would toss in a few more pictures and a couple other things.









This is another picture of my tank from quite a while ago (before I had frogs). I love how it looked back then, but it takes a huge amount of time and tending to keep it that way. Also, this was just random clipping and allowing it to grow back. I am by no means an aquascaper. I tell people all the time that I am more autistic than artistic. However, even a broken clock is right twice a day!

I also wanted to include a few "tips" that I wish I had known back when I started. These are things that I am not even sure are 100% correct, but they are where my head is at right now. It will just be a jumble of stuff that may or may not be useful to folks and all of it will be wide open to debate. I shall call these "Stuff I Think I Have Learned" (SITIHV).

++++++SITIHV#1 "If you form a good relationship with a local fish or reptile store, they might be willing to trade you for stuff." I worked at local fish stores for 10 years during a miss-spent youth. I know the business pretty well. If you prove yourself not to be a hack, sometimes stores will treat you as a mini-vendor and allow you to trade them your stuff for credit in their store. You do have to lower your prices a bit and your "money" is only good at the store, but I find that I never have any trouble spending credit. Recently, I replaced my 90 with a brand new one (over $300) with just credit. This is also how I have some fairly expensive (for freshwater and for my sensibilities) fish in my 90. They were the result of trades over the years. I have traded froglets, bare tanks, vivariums, wood, ABG mix, and lots of other stuff over the years. I also sell cuttings from my 90 all the time. That's why I have it set up the way I do right now. It's to maximize the speed of growth and to tailor toward species that sell pretty well. I have also traded for more frogs. About a third of my collection was from trades I made with retail stores. So, that's just something to think about. A note of caution - you may have to work with the store to teach them how to care for the animals/plants you sell them. You don't want the stuff to die. Aside from not wanting anything to die, they will not want to buy from you anymore. You will have to make sure they are taking good care of the animals and giving good advice to the customers they sell them to.

Ok, that's it for now.

Mark


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

Gorgeous tanks! Congrats... The big auratus tank is wonderful!


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## 55105 (Jan 27, 2015)

Awesome! I love your place, and the concept for your "living room". I really need to get out there! I know I promised you photos.

Your 18x24s turned out great! Where did you hide your misting system?


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

My vote is "5stars"!


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

@Rigel10 Thanks very much! Interesting you chose that one out of all of them. That was one of my older builds where I used silicone-covered expansion foam for the background. Like many of my top-opening tanks, I have a really hard time controlling the humidity in that one and it is way too wet in there. It would be half full by now if I didn't drill a drain into it. I have had a hard time figuring out the right number of Mist King nozzles in those. Anyway, thanks so much for your comments!

@port_plz Thanks to you as well, Nate! You are welcome to come by anytime  I hid the Mist King in the base of the stand on the tank to the right of the picture with the two chairs in it. Since my tanks are all over everything, it took some doing to get the tubing for the misting system to be hidden and yet get to all the places it needed to. I ended up drilling down into the basement and securing the tubing to the ceiling down there and coming back up in different places and then sometimes going along the top of the baseboards. My wife is happy with the solution, which we all know is the most important ;-)


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## SteppingStones (Dec 30, 2013)

I'm definitely loving the 90, probably a little too much lol. Limnophila species are some of my favorites, as well as downoi! More pics!!

Sam


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Yeah, I have always loved aromatica (not sure why they started calling it hippuroides, or is that a different species?). I have a single stem of it in my tank in case I want to grow it again  I have been growing Ludwigia repens var. cuba lately, though, and I really like it. Somewhat similar but grows in bigger tufts. I also like Pogostemon stellata which looks like Lymnophilia but is much more rigid and bigger tufts, too. I have recently added the stuff in the foreground of the initial picture (Staurogyne repens?) and it is going like gangbusters for me. The 90 is a bit deep so it is tough to get a lot of light down there to get a good foreground to grow. Staurogyne and Blyxa japonica (and aubertii in the back) do great for the foreground, though. The Staurogyne is even growing pretty well in my vivariums so far


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## SteppingStones (Dec 30, 2013)

Encyclia said:


> Yeah, I have always loved aromatica (not sure why they started calling it hippuroides, or is that a different species?). I have a single stem of it in my tank in case I want to grow it again  I have been growing Ludwigia repens var. cuba lately, though, and I really like it. Somewhat similar but grows in bigger tufts. I also like Pogostemon stellata which looks like Lymnophilia but is much more rigid and bigger tufts, too. I have recently added the stuff in the foreground of the initial picture (Staurogyne repens?) and it is going like gangbusters for me. The 90 is a bit deep so it is tough to get a lot of light down there to get a good foreground to grow. Staurogyne and Blyxa japonica (and aubertii in the back) do great for the foreground, though. The Staurogyne is even growing pretty well in my vivariums so far


They're two different species, I believe. I'm growing Ludwigia sp red and Ludwigia x lacrustris, and I love them. And if you ever get a chance to grow Pogostemon quadrifolius, I highly recommend it. Its one of my favorites right now. And thanks for the idea with the Staurogyne! I'll have to try that!


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## tardis101 (Apr 11, 2012)

chillplants said:


> I am jealous of your beautiful tanks.


Me too! Very nice.


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## pdfCrazy (Feb 28, 2012)

Everything coming together really well Mark! Looks great.


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## Anthony Jackson (Jul 16, 2004)

Looks good, and always nice to have another Colorado frogger.


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## rigel10 (Jun 1, 2012)

The large viv and the three vivs below it have a beautiful visual effect, in addition they are well-structured. Some fans can help a lot with condensation. I also would reduce misting.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

I appreciate you saying so, rigel. I think it just ended up that way  I actually planned the lower ones to have a sort of "hill" in them that peaked in the middle and trailed off on the right and left so that it looked like all of the tanks were part of the same visual statement, just had dividers between them. As is usually the case, once the tanks grew in, it wasn't as obvious what I set out to do. The frogs seem happy in there, though 

As for the condensation, I agree completely. Having so many tanks has made it difficult to keep them all at the correct humidity level. Specifically, my top-opening tanks have too much water in them (WAY too much). I have decided to bypass the center set of two nozzles and just go with the singles on each side. That should reduce the problem significantly. If it is too dry, I can put a single nozzle in the middle of each of those tanks. Like I said, still getting it dialed in 

Mark


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Very cool setups! How many species of frogs would you say you have?


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Thanks, Cam! I would say I have 16 species, but in the interest of full disclosure, I had to take my shoes off to count that high.

Mark


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Haha very cool... You're a one man conservation project. Keep up the good work.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

I appreciate it, but I am under no illusions that I am keeping these animals with the goal of contributing to conservation (at least not directly). I have been thinking lately that there comes a time when having more species is actually a detriment. I think I am getting close to what I can comfortably do with this number of species/tanks. The animals deserve a certain level of care from me and I have to be able to give that to them or I shouldn't have them. If I had too many more tanks/species in my collection, I think care would suffer. 

This bring me to...

++++++SITIHV#2 "More is not always better."
More animals means that our time and resources are stretched thinner. I think all of us need to decide on the level of care we believe is best for our animals and make sure that we are able to provide that level of care throughout the time these frogs live with us. I also think that, through research, we should always be revising our opinion about what that level of care is and modify our husbandry practices (hopefully upward...) to fit what we learn. I have torn down several tanks before because I learned a better way to take care of the frogs. I still have a ton to learn, though, and that's why I spend quite a bit of time on these boards. I would encourage everyone to have lofty goals for the quality of care they provide for their animals and to have no more than the number of animals that they can afford (time and/or money) to give this quality of care to.


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Yeah good point... This is actually why I don't have any frogs currently or a dog for that matter. 

I'm in the process of changing careers so until I get that all settled I don't think it would be fair for me to take up to many of these types of responsibilities to the detriment of any animals. 

I built and planted a viv but I'm not going to put any animals in it until I'm settled in and know my schedule.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

Probably wise, even though I am sure it is tough seeing that empty viv!


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## cam1941 (Jan 16, 2014)

Haha you know it is! Its still fun watching the plants progress and the micro fauna grow in population... In the long run the end result will be much better. 

This helps me be patient when I don't want to be


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## Pumilo (Sep 4, 2010)

Looks great Mark! I'm glad I was able to help. I might have to get out that way sometime, and see what you've done with my glass.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

You are welcome anytime, Doug. Thanks again for all the great advice!

Mark


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

There have been quite a few changes since this thread was posted originally. I moved some tanks out and a replaced a few with different ones. My favorites have been a new Skyscraper and a 36x18x36 that I made in the last year or so. My favorite tank right now is the 36x18x36. I posted a current picture in a lighting thread recently but I thought I would post it here, too, with a little bit of background.










I knew I wanted a tank that was tall and I was really looking forward to dealing with the height from a design perspective. It started with some really nice, large cypress knees I bought from a Dendroboard member in Florida. These allowed me to use them as attachment sites for plants as well as being there to take up the negative space. I put a few Manzanita branches into the remaining space. The residents, a pair of bulls-eye histrionicus, really love the place. I almost NEVER see them on the ground in the tank, which I see as a good thing. They just love hanging out up in the bromeliads and on the tops of the knees and Manzanita. The tank has a cork mosaic background that is holding up beautifully and plants love it.

The tank is lit, quite effectively, by a 36" Odyssea Snake Eyes Quad LED. It puts out a ton of light and I can grow anything I have tried so far in that tank. The only places where plants don't do well is in the deep shade of each other. I also have a ton of different shinglers including a couple of kinds of Marcgravia, a couple kinds of Rhaphidophora, Ficus villosa, Blue Cebu, and a few things on the back wall that I don't know what they are 

I do still have snails in the tank, thanks to some poor quarantining on my part. It used to have slugs, too, but a CO2 bomb seems to have eliminated those. We shall see if they come back. Beer traps work pretty well, but are not a perfect solution.

All in all, I couldn't be happier with this tank. I like it better and better as it grows in. This is my favorite tank in my collection.

I also put in a Skyscraper (18x18x36 tall). This one has been a bigger challenge to design because, no matter what you do in a tank that shape, getting light to the bottom while still making good use of negative space is difficult. I have pictures of two different efforts at design of this tank. The first had its strengths but I ended up starting over because it was just too "full" of hardscape and I didn't like the way it grew in. Anyway, here are pictures of the two efforts.

First Round:









I felt like I put too much hardscape into this one and, when the plants grew in, it just blocked out the light to the bottom too much. I also chose broms that are large and fill a lot of space. I let it grow in for a year or more and just decided that I didn't like it very much. So, I started over...

Second Round:









I saved the background (cork mosaic, for the win!) and side coating (loose tree fern held with silicone) but I tore out most of the hardscape that was attached to the back wall. I also saved some of the smaller Manzanita branches that I had attached to the sides. I had some shingling starting, too (though how slow it was growing was a testimony to how the old design blocked the light). This time, I went with smaller brom species except for a bigger center-piece brom. As always, these were all just leftovers and cuttings from other tanks. I don't usually buy specific plants for new builds. I also really focused on using negative space, but trying hard not to block the light as much. So, I went with all smaller-diameter Manzanita as opposed to cork rounds which I used last time. You can see in the picture that much more of the leaf litter layer is visible and I have some plants growing all the way down on the bottom. I think I am going to like this design better, but I won't know until grows in a bit more.

Anyway, that's what's up in the Living Room. As always, I am happy to answer questions and am interested in constructive criticism.

Happy Froggin',

Mark


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## jarteta97 (Jun 13, 2014)

Wow, I'm really loving the 36x18x36. I especially love the way you created visual barriers with the cypress knees and sectioned off the tank. What species marcgravia is that on the left? It's huge! 

I think you did the right thing with the 18x18x36, because otherwise you might have bright, crispy (maybe too crispy) plants at the top, and then everything below just withers in the shadows. If you don't open up those visual barriers like you did, I feel like you would ultimately just have to have plants that could either handle high degrees of brightness or plants that only do well in shade. 

Keep us updated, I really want to see how these tanks grow in.


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## Encyclia (Aug 23, 2013)

jarteta97 said:


> Wow, I'm really loving the 36x18x36. I especially love the way you created visual barriers with the cypress knees and sectioned off the tank. What species marcgravia is that on the left? It's huge!
> 
> I think you did the right thing with the 18x18x36, because otherwise you might have bright, crispy (maybe too crispy) plants at the top, and then everything below just withers in the shadows. If you don't open up those visual barriers like you did, I feel like you would ultimately just have to have plants that could either handle high degrees of brightness or plants that only do well in shade.
> 
> Keep us updated, I really want to see how these tanks grow in.


That's sintenisii. It does get super huge and can take over if I don't keep it trimmed back  I also have a lot of sp. Round Leaf in there. That' what is attached to the main stump at bottom front.

Yeah, I wish I could take credit for the cypress knees segmenting the tank. It just kind of worked out that way because I liked the way it looked  

You hit the nail on the head with the 18x18x36. In the original design, it was pretty dry up toward the vent and wet/dark at the bottom. I didn't like the way it looked. The new design has more open space, some of which will be filled in by plants eventually and still be ok for the frogs. I am also always thinking about how to design the tank so that the frogs can use it effectively. If the frogs can't get to the top, what the point of having a tall tank? I don't have anybody in there right now, but I am looking forward to having frogs in there again after the plants (and frogs) have had time to grow up/in a bit 

Thanks for the comments,

Mark


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